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/sci/ - Science & Math

File: 22 KB, 680x350, accretion_disc.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Tue Sep 13 14:48:18 2016 No.8342905 [Reply] [Original]

What causes gravity?
So I'm undergrad in geology and we were talking about how planets form from accretion, which makes sense. Like, gravity attracts smaller masses to bigger masses, sure. But what makes it act this way? By extent, where do any of the 4 fundamental forces come from?

Help me /sci/, I haven't been this mindfucked since I first thought about the conception of the universe.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 14:50:46 2016 No.8342910 Mass

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 14:53:40 2016 No.8342912 File: 65 KB, 566x480, Read A Book.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Symmetries

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 14:57:35 2016 No.8342923 Gravitons, we haven't discovered them yet tho

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 14:59:01 2016 No.8342928 >>8342905 >What causes gravity? negative entropy

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 15:03:10 2016 No.8342940 >>8342905 hypotheses non fingo

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 15:17:26 2016 No.8342965 >>8342905 >What causes gravity? Your mother desu.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 15:19:09 2016 No.8342968 42

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 15:28:55 2016 No.8342984 File: 116 KB, 793x584, 1469880823062.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>8342905 i found this vid very helpful in understanding some of the concepts around this topic https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlTVIMOix3I

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 15:38:01 2016 No.8342998 But why does mass warp spacetime?

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 15:45:04 2016 No.8343006 File: 27 KB, 476x473, 1473587781564.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>8342998 because it's heavy ofc

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 15:46:38 2016 No.8343012 >>8342998 mass is a number

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 15:49:34 2016 No.8343017 >>8342905 You are being pushed to Earth, not pulled. Emptiness is what is pushing you.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 15:50:58 2016 No.8343018 >>8342905 Swamp gas

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 15:58:53 2016 No.8343027 >>8342905 electronegativity; they flocculate like a fine clay suspended in the water column anon !

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 16:02:02 2016 No.8343033 >>8342905 gravity comes from love

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 17:07:40 2016 No.8343181 >>8342984 >warping of spacetime So basically nothing that will be covered in a 100-level rock class. I do appreciate the serious answer tho

>>	None !niqjediPCA Tue Sep 13 18:10:57 2016 No.8343366 >>8342905 >What causes gravity? Dank Memes.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 18:19:10 2016 No.8343395 TU GFA

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 18:34:42 2016 No.8343445 >>8342998 Because that's how it is defined. Mass is the thing that makes space-time warp. And this warp gives it acceleration which we detect as weight.

Anonymous Tue Sep 13 18:39:27 2016 No.8343460

>>8342998
You know that physics is an obeservatory science. If you have found a mathematical modell that fits all known observations, your work is done.
At least until someone observes something that cannot be explained by the theory anymore.
By now Einstein's theory of general relativity (The universe can be represented by a curved Minkowski-Spacetime-Manifold) is the accepted theory to modellize the phenomenon we call gravity.
Of course this doesn't explain why gravity occurs in our universe, but that's not the job of a physicist, it's the job of a theologist (like all those why does it happen/exist - questions).

Although sometimes something magical happens in science, because sometimes some scientist accidentially develops a modell for something that also explains the existence of another thing.

When it comes to mass (actually the Energy-Stress-Tensor) and why it curves Spacetime, this magic never happend.

Therefore let's study STEM-fields and become wizards.

Anonymous Tue Sep 13 18:48:53 2016 No.8343484

>>8342984
here's something I don't get:

why is any visual model of the "warping" of spacetime show planets "siting" on top of a trampoline like surface, like shown in the video? why are the planets always on top? in what "direction" can we truly say it "warps"?

I only bring it up because any time I see a visual representation like that I know that its misleading but I can't really explain an alternative adequately...

it is "warped" and mass "warps" the "fabric" but in what way?

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 18:52:39 2016 No.8343495 >>8343484 >in what way how is that a question? If you want the actual answer open a book of general relativity.

Anonymous Tue Sep 13 18:55:41 2016 No.8343500

>>8343495
I meant that everything "clings" to the earth in a radial sense, wheras every visual demonstration looks like marbles sitting on the surface of a trampoline. I only wish there was a better visualization is all, one that more closely matches our actual 'experience'

Anonymous Tue Sep 13 19:03:29 2016 No.8343512

>>8343484
The sheet is a slice of spacetime. Spacetime engulfs the object and the same warping happens from any angle. Some guy drew it first so that the object "sits" on the slice and it became the norm. Slices can be drawn from any angle and reprezent the same things.

Anonymous Tue Sep 13 19:06:26 2016 No.8343516

>>8343500
This is a problem with dimensions. The visual demonstrations are all essentially 2D, with us being outside observers looking in. In real life though, everything is 3D including us. We aren't out-of-plane observers. If we were 4 dimensional we could make a better visualization.

Anonymous Tue Sep 13 19:07:16 2016 No.8343521

>>8343512

Like a marble inserted in Nutella. It warps and displaces the chocolate around it.
We know this happens with spacetime because we've measured it. IIRC signals sent from behind the Sun travel 50 kilometers more across this distortion. I actually think this example is in the Interstellar companion book written by Kip Thorne. It explains a lot of shit like this.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 19:42:11 2016 No.8343572 >>8343484 It's a shitty representation, but the warping occurs in all angles. A better analogy is a ball inside a piece of foam, similar to that used in a tempurpedic mattress.

Anonymous Tue Sep 13 21:03:23 2016 No.8343718
File: 62 KB, 670x369, gravity-well.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Something Also happening that never gets talked about is frame dragging.
Mass , twists and pulls space time.besides curving it.
Has weird effects,like making the weight of a bowling ball change, depending on it's travel direction,around the earth.

The idea behind frame dragging is that a spinning body—or, more specifically, any moving body—tends to have a gravitational effect that propagates through empty space (aka the vacuum) and drags things along with it. This is peculiar because if you put a gyroscope near the axis of a spinning body, it’ll tend to be pulled around in the direction of the spin. But if you place it outside the equator of the same body, then the moving mass drags the gyroscope around the other way.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 21:36:07 2016 No.8343790 >>8343460 Change theologist to philosopher

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 13 21:45:31 2016 No.8343807 File: 68 KB, 472x361, 1473793005578.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] gravity is false, pressure is reality.

Anonymous Wed Sep 14 01:40:44 2016 No.8344171
File: 109 KB, 650x582, bending2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>8343718
In frame dragging Time is also effected since space is being twisted.

Strong force
Frame dragging also has an effect that if one particle is next to another, they can both save energy if one is absorbing energy as the other one is emitting it. (This can also increase the mass of both particles, using Einstein's famous equation that energy is equal to a certain amount of mass). This would encourage particles to group together, which would explain what strong force (a force that holds protons and neutrons in an atom nucleus together) is.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 14 02:01:59 2016 No.8344206 it's caused by the physics engine they made for our plane of existence

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 14 02:58:28 2016 No.8344293 >>8343395 Pardon?

Anonymous Wed Sep 14 04:00:10 2016 No.8344332

Gravity works by gravitons spontaneously appearing in empty-ish space. These gravitons hit objects, but the universe is weird so instead of getting pushed backwards by the gravitons, they just get pushed towards them.

Or maybe it's the other way around.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 14 08:59:34 2016 No.8344610 >>8343033 yup, gravity is god's love

Anonymous Wed Sep 14 09:24:19 2016 No.8344640

>>8342905
>What causes gravity?
Suppose I were to answer your question. "Anon, clax-spurts interacting with weedle-farts in 7-dimensions causes what we observe to be gravity.".
But then you just say "But anon, what causes clax-spurts?".

Physics is descriptive. The universe simply IS, and scientists attempt to describe it as accurately as they can. We know objects with mass move towards one another. We can describe the paths they take when doing so, and other ways things the property of mass effects the patterns we see. But that's it.

Attaching meaning to facts is not the purview of science. Philosophy and religion has done so many times before, with varying degrees of success. I recommend you just find something that works for you, and doesn't hurt others.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 14 09:39:37 2016 No.8344660 >>8343484 just imagine how it must be to explain the thrid dimension to an two dimensional beeing. It's the same trying to explain the fourth dimension to an 3d entity. This is great https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWyTxCsIXE4

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 14 10:00:02 2016 No.8344683 >>8342905 I guess the answer is physics causes gravity.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 14 10:39:04 2016 No.8344732 OP - we just don't know. That's why we're smashing particles apart at CERN to figure out where properties like gravity reside.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 14 11:22:15 2016 No.8344799 >>8343033 >gravity comes from love someone watched Interstellar last night

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 14 15:57:47 2016 No.8345285 >>8343033 TARS

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 14 16:29:05 2016 No.8345351 >>8344293 Your mom in Spanish slang.

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