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/sci/ - Science & Math

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7471841 No.7471841 [Reply] [Original]

Why does schizophrenia cause such high unemployment rates? About 9/10 schizophrenics are unemployed.

It isn't like schizophrenia causes blindness, or missing limbs, or any other serious handicap. Is it because they're automatically granted disability money and not expected to work by the society?

>> No.7471844

>>7471841
Because everybody is out to get them

>> No.7471846

>It isn't like schizophrenia causes blindness, or missing limbs, or any other serious handicap.
But it does, you retard.

>> No.7471851

>>7471846
>implying you can't do hard, manual labor even if you hear voices or are delusional

>> No.7471872

bump

>> No.7471875

>>7471841

But it is a "serious handicap."

>> No.7471879

>>7471875
see
>>7471851

>> No.7471881

>>7471879

No, you can't do hard manual labor if you are
delusional.

>> No.7471884

>>7471841
>>7471851
>>7471879
>ITT people who have never seen people who have mental illnesses for more than 2 minutes

>> No.7471901

>>7471884
because I don't want the fire-medic who is saving my life to have a psychotic break whilst they're performing life-saving techniques on me... say... suddenly seeing insects all up inside my wounds that aren't there
protip that's why my ex is my ex and isn't a fire medic anymore

>> No.7471902

>>7471901
you know I'm on your side right ?

>> No.7471922

>>7471881
You can. Even people with Down's can.

>> No.7472164

>>7471922
Downs syndrome has no (or almost negligible) similarities with schizophrenia.

Are you clinically retarded?

>> No.7472175

>>7471844
nice

>> No.7472177

>>7471841
because schizophrenics are bigger problems occupying their minds other than "i need a job"

>> No.7472180

>>7472164
It's more an outpatient type of retardation, if you must know.

>> No.7472420

because capitalism isn't built around helping people with "mental illness" it has to alienate some people.

>> No.7472426

>>7471841
I have mild schizophrenia. I am able to function normally, but some of the people I have met are realllllllly fucked up.

>> No.7472432

>>7471841
Most people who have that are also stupid as fuck. They can't understand that being completely alone in a room means the voices they're hearing in their heads aren't fucking real and should be ignored. They let their delusions control them.

>> No.7472435

>Why does schizophrenia cause such high unemployment rates? About 9/10 schizophrenics are unemployed.

If you were hiring someone for a job would you hire a normal person or the unstable person?

Also of note, nobody else is going to want to work everyday with people with mental illnesses (unless that is their job of course).

>> No.7472438

>>7471841
I've met several schizophrenics. A few seem totally normal until you get to know them and the craziness just pours out. Others are downright scary to be around because of the fucked up shit they've done for totally irrational reasons.

>> No.7472442

>>7472438
I didn't finish my post. I meant to add that I feel fortunate that so many of them are not in the work place and you should too, OP.

>> No.7473914

>>7472438
Be more specific or I call bs.

>> No.7473918

>>7471841

see: the thread

that's about 50% of the schizo population

the other half experiences no paranoia or aggression, just loss of gray matter and catatonia.

>> No.7473923

That's not the real question. The real question is how the other 10% function.

>> No.7473933

>>7472438
>because of the fucked up shit they've done for totally irrational reasons
What about ignoring this, how are they then?

>> No.7473936

>>7472438
>A few seem totally normal until you get to know them and the craziness just pours out
Like what...

>> No.7473940
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7473940

How would you feel about working with Terry?

>> No.7473943

>>7471841
There's a shitload of jobs that would seem practically impossible with voices constantly speaking in your head. There's a video somewhere online of Anderson Cooper trying to do work with a schizo-simulator on, and it was practically impossible for him.

>> No.7473945

>>7471841
Because it's like classic crazy. Really bad rep. They should rename it tbh.

>> No.7473949

>>7473918
Could be image problem. Schizophrenics are associated with murdering psychopaths because of TV.

You know people still hire completely incompetent people based on first impression and good looks even in the tech sector.

>> No.7473954

>>7473949
>Schizophrenics are associated with murdering psychopaths because of TV.

Wrongly so, actually. Relatively speaking, schizophreniacs are shown to be more violent than people without schizophrenia, but the absolute increase in violence isn't that significant.

>> No.7473957

>>7473954
But is that lack of significance because there are relatively few schizophreniacs or what?

>> No.7473962

http://www.madinamerica.com/2012/05/anti-authoritarians-and-schizophrenia-do-rebels-who-defy-treatment-do-better/
Interesting point about anti-authoritarians.
My brother is schizo so I have experience, but he does things no rational person would ever do, like hitting back at a police officer because of perceived injustice, most of us would just suffer it because it'll blow over but he didn't. Definitely seems anti-authoritarian to me.

>> No.7473981

>>7473962
Bah, coercing people into taking medication they don't need. It's worse than making people feel bad about themselves because <insert religious dogma here>.

>> No.7473987

>>7473981
Yeah like, <you're killing the planet by using that car, haven't you heard about global warming>

>> No.7473998

>>7473987
No, more like <you were born from the ashes of evil, you goddamn no good demon spawn piece of shit, now pray to god for salvation and dont forget to donate>

>> No.7474004

>>7473998
Not seeing much difference.
But anyway...
Given that we both find ourselves in this wretched forum in what is a degenerate world of decaying morals and common decency, is it possible we should pray to god for salvation.

>> No.7474005

>>7471841
Could schizophrenia be considered a psychological disorder that can be fixed with cognitive behavioral therapy?

People say "it's physically observable" but so is literally anything else about our thoughts. Can schizophrenic thoughts be likened to intrusive thoughts and anxiety?

>> No.7474006

>>7471841
this is pseudo science, but i've heard that schizophrenic people give off weird close proximity smells that cause people to avoid them.

>> No.7474007

>>7472426
what does exactly mild schizophrenia consist of?

do you get hallucinations?

>> No.7474010

>>7474007
It's about 1000 scovilles

>> No.7474013

>>7474004
>Not seeing much difference.
Yeah, maybe not.. I was thinking a person can live with that if some random person disses your car. Much harder if you are being institutionalized by an oppressive system... but I suppose science can be used as such too.

>Given that we both find ourselves in this wretched forum in what is a degenerate world of decaying morals and common decency, is it possible we should pray to god for salvation.

I'm not sure that I have reached the point where I feel compelled to give up on the world and place my only bit of hope left in an invisible force... no, I have not, I think..

>> No.7474023

>>7473987
>le anti science meme

>> No.7474027

>>7474005
>Could schizophrenia be considered a psychological disorder that can be fixed with cognitive behavioral therapy?

No, that's never been successful.

>> No.7474031

>>7471841
You obviously never met people with real schizophrenia (not only schizoid behavior)

they simply don't live in the same world as ours.

>> No.7474041

>>7474010
har har

>> No.7474261

>>7474027
Doesn't the article in >>7473962 prove that in fact it IS possible treating schizophrenia without any medication? Implying that it is a psychological condition afterall?

I'm not really well read about the subject but what exactly sets schizophrenia apart from other psychological conditions?

>> No.7474303

They're probably not trying to get a job because they're freaking the fuck out about their schizophrenic delusions.

>> No.7474306

This process will cure any mental disability from autism to anxiety, depression, schizophrenia, depression, apathy, delusion etc.

1)Smoke weed to get rid of weak brain cells and create new ones via neurogenesis

2)Exercise to jump start the neurogenesis

3)Increase vocabulary and learn proper grammatical syntax to eradicate speech salad

4)Get fit (healthy body=healthy mind, + new neuron connections + speech therapy = rid of implosive thought process)

XXXX)Last step
Take Mdma once to rewire your brain towards empathy and happiness, and unlock mind taping that was gone because negative emotions stirred up negative chemicals in your head which causes a lack of brain taping i.e. lack of recollection, positive emotion, motor abilities, comprehension of emotional context, comprehension of time)

So stay fit, smoke weed, work out, work on your speech, and take mdma to rewire your brain towards the light.

Your welcome,
God

>> No.7474475

Look at 4chan. Most people have little knowledge of schizophrenia which leads to huge misconceptions. It's not surprising to see this mirrored in the real world.

>> No.7474490

>>7474306
dude you're on some righteous Prometheus rising John Lilly shit

have you even been in a deprivation tank yet?

>> No.7475208

bump

>> No.7475364

>>7474306
smoking weed is the last thing on earth you should do if you suspect you might have schizophrenia, trust me

>> No.7475701

>>7471841
Ive read that methamphetamine psychosis is indistinguishable from paranoid schizophrenia. Granted, that's only one form of the disorder, but yeah.

>> No.7475739

>>7471841
Why did being a witch make you unemployable? Why did being a heretic make you unemployable?

Alienation. Unwanted people being alienated from society. Causing them to be unemployable.

>> No.7475752

Schizophrenic here. I completely lost my mind a few years ago (age 22) trying to juggle school and work at the same time. When I was just working I was a happy, albeit schizophrenic, person who just seemed a little off to most people. Now that I'm only attending school and medicated I am a happy student who gets mostly A's. I'd like to mention that I receive no welfare or disability and have been told by doctors, lawyers, and others that I shouldn't expect any unless I completely lose touch with reality (in which case I don't see how I'll be able to expect any welfare anyways). After I graduate I will begin working again.

>> No.7475764

>>7475739
Religion was the old thing. "Posessed by demons."

Science is the new thing. "Sick in the head."

Same shit different name.

What it means is : Something unwanted. Alienation.

Fuck with someone until no one (not even themselves) beleive in them.

>> No.7475789

>>7475752
are you sure you're actually schizophrenic?

>> No.7475808

No, sorry about that I just checked all my medical paperwork and am schizoaffective and bi-polar. I am on a regimen of anti-psychotics and anti-depressants.

>> No.7475815

>>7474306
lol ok if you were like less than 13 years or older. Mental illness usually starts developing as the brain matures into a an adult brain.

try harder.

>> No.7475843

>>7471841

Imagine trying to work when you have a voice yelling at you all of the time egging you on to do things/not trust people.

The best way I could describe is if you had /pol/ thoughts all of the time.

>> No.7475847

>>7471922
no. you can't. nobody would let them.

>> No.7475853

>>7474306
>new neuron connections
in your cerebrum, y'no the part of the brain that controls motor skills.

>> No.7475861

my best friend ever started going crazy at about 21. really crazy. classical schizophrenia, hearing voices, seeing people. he think he can speak latin and italian and french, and does so by making random noises. he thinks that life is a war between the gay mafia and the italian mafia, (which he has been appointed to a position of judge in). he goes on long dialogues about cutting peoples dicks off, and sometimes would try to sell me on the idea, like a salesman, saying it just feels like its in warm water, etcetera. also a thing about boiling homosexuals faces in a pot of boiling water and then cutting their dick off and giving them hydrocodone. its really weird, and its like my best friend ever is gone inside. the only job he's been able to hold is working a register for a pickle seller at the farmers market for like 10 bucks a day.

i think that its a 'decision' based illness, even if it could technically be cured once it got to that point, you'd have to want to cure it, its a sickness of motivation leading one into delusional disassociation from reality. i don't even think they actually see the things or hear the voices, i think they just think they do... i mean, we all hear dialogue in our head all the time, we don't actually say that "i heard someone say for you like it was real" when we see the words "big guy".

it bothers me when i see people thinking that schizos are on some higher plane or something. that's fucking retarded.

incidentally we had been doing lots of E the summer he started losing it. i was fine and learned a lot about myself from taking Ecstasy, he went insane. who knows what makes the difference in people.

>> No.7475872

>>7475861
Do you consider a schizo thought process to be similar to that of a normal's pérson in a dream

>> No.7475892

>>7475872
maybe a little? i have schizotypal characteristics according to the shrinks i saw in highschool, and, i've felt 'it' tugging at me when i was super high on adderal, its paranoia, seeing everything connect and have meaning all at once automatically - whether its true or not. i think that for the most part schizophrenic thought processes are exactly like normal thought processes, but wrong and done badly, and i think you kinda have to not have some sort of basal moral underpinning in the importance of truth to let it happen to you.

i was raised as an insane christian fanatic and even had 'visions' of jesus as a child and stuff. but as i got older, the same 'demand for truth' that i was trained in that worked for christian faith, started working against it, and i've never feared for my sanity because the most important thing in my mind is always and automatically, 'what is true?'. nick (my friend) was raised in a seemingly more sane household with more money, but, his parents totally didn't give a fuck and were morally exhausted, and he was taught NOTHING at all, and i think that was more damaging then insane religious zealotry i was trained in.

thats just my perspective as someone who was close friends, like, the best friends you can imagine, hung out all day every day, went on crazy adventures, nobody understands each other like we do, closer then brother kinds of friends, with a person who slowly went insane. we're still friends but he's not all there, i never stopped hanging out or anything but the constant bullshit gets on your nerves. and the mindgames. so i learned to 'speak schizo' i guess, and decipher what he was getting at while talking about stuff that had nothing to do with what he was getting at...

just my 2 cents.

>> No.7476757

>>7475872
I remember we went over the similarities between dream logic and schizophrenic logic in psych class. Magical thinking, I think?

>> No.7476797

>>7471841
>It isn't like schizophrenia causes blindness, or missing limbs, or any other serious handicap. Is it because they're automatically granted disability money and not expected to work by the society?

Because they can't follow simple instructions or work well with management or their fellow employees.

>> No.7476851

>>7476797
Prove this.

>> No.7476887

>>7476851
you're a fucking idiot.

if you want to know if its true or not, go volunteer at a loony bin for a while or something, there's no fucking equation that proves schizos are useless you mongoloid

i'm not sure people know what proof is anymore.

>> No.7476893

because despite of all the scientific evidence, charities, awareness movements, protests, advertisements, leaflets, billboards, most of society still believe mental illness = laziness

>> No.7476895

>>7476893
it does equal laziness, or, even worse, undirectable, because they simply don't fucking get it, and do something that's not what you wanted or go off on some weird tangent.

people with full blown schizophrenia are essentially already dead.

>> No.7477070

>>7476887
A little more details would have been sufficient. You yourself sound like a fucking idiot when you make sweeping statements like that without at least giving examples. It makes it seem as if you think people should believe the things you say instantly because you say them.

>> No.7477074

>>7477070
prove this.

>> No.7477077

>>7477074
>using my defense after you just invalidated it
kek

>> No.7477079

>>7477077
thank you for admitting your defense was invalid. that is what i was trying to get you to do.

also, do you ask people to prove the earth isn't flat to you?

just shut up. your opinion that 'hurr schizophenics r just liek normal people that can work with others and be effective and useful for a wage" is laughable to anyone that has experience with them.

>> No.7477082

>>7477079
I doubt that. Just read up a bit, you'll see some examples of people that function fine iirc

>> No.7477087

>>7477082
and there's a mexican with no arm that works with me at the cabinet shop. that doesn't mean "People missing limbs function fine'. and schizophrenia is far worse then 'a missing limb' intensity of symptoms and treatability vary, but the truth remains that people with schizophrenia are by and large unemployable.

>> No.7477095

>>7477087
All I asked is that you back up that last claim you just made, instead you just want to pull it out of your ass again.

>> No.7477102

>>7477095
>>literally flat earther tier debate

ok, why don't you back up the claim that schizophrenic people are employable? since that's extraordinary, and you obviously have no experience with them. i do.

>> No.7477107

>>7474261
He didn't say anything about medication, he said CBT doesn't work. CBT is bullshit.

>> No.7477112

>>7474010
That's a spicy meatball!

>> No.7477113

>>7475843
Only thoughts? How about /pol/ living with you in the same room. Sitting on the chair in front of you: Nigger this, nigger that. Fuck this shit.

>> No.7477131

>>7477102
>them
>experience: 1 guy who had schizophrenia

>> No.7477134

>>7477113
I just imagined for a moment that my brain was filled with the posters in /pol/ and all my thoughts were OP in each thread.

That's one chilling mother fucking mind fuck.

>> No.7477159

>>7477102
It's not like that. I'm not claiming anything, I'm only critical of your groundless statement. Considering OP originally asked why many schizophreniacs are unemployed and considering we're in /sci you might want to consider that you should be ready to back these things up when somebody calls you out on it. Otherwise the only thing I can do is conclude that you are suffering from some kind of bias. If you want people to accept your popular opinion without question you should consider to gtfo.

>> No.7477160

Have you ever seen someone with schizophrenia?
>>7471851
>Schizophrenia is only hearing voicing
No stupid. They are mentally unable to do most tasks. Hearing voices is only one small part of it.

>> No.7477197

>>7471841

You're an idiot. Try going to work after taking a bunch of LSD or ketamine. That's what it's like to have a psychotic disorder. One long bad trip that never ends.

>> No.7478256

>>7471841
>>7476851
Are you that fucking retarded?

My fucking sister developed schizophrenia when I was 7 and I STILL have to fucking deal with it today (I'm 18 and a senior in high school.)

Hell, she destroyed my room today and I saw the aftermath when I fucking got home because the door to my room is broken.

Do you know what else she did?

We got kicked out of a pizza place because she ran in yelling and attacking people and the police were called.

A while ago, she dumped a bunch of things into a sewer outside of our house.

She thought she was a bird at one point.

She literally sits on the couch the whole day talking to herself and no matter what new medicine she gets put on, IT NEVER FUCKING WORKS!

You obviously NEVER met someone with schizophrenia, LET ALONE LIVE WITH ONE ALMOST YOUR WHOLE GODDAMN FUCKING LIFE!! I'M AT A FUCKING MCDONALD'S RIGHT NOW TO GET AWAY FROM HER AND THIS IS NOTHING FUCKING NEW!!! AND YOU'RE TELLING ME SHE NEEDS TO GET A JOB?? SHE DOESN'T EVEN KNOW WHO SHE FUCKING IS AND IS IN A CONSTANT C O N S T A N T STATE OF PSYCHOSIS!!! YEAH, GIVE HER A JOB!!!

>> No.7478367

>>7475872
It's beyond that. It's like they're in a dream.

And their thought process is worse.

>> No.7478398

lol, I forgot about this thread.

>>7473914

>One guy thought people were conspiring against him. He broke a bunch of his stuff and some other friend's stuff because he was convinced it was bugged.
>Another guy was my friend's brother. This one would steal a bunch of money and stuff (and then do god knows what with it), show up and leave randomly, always talk crazy stuff that wasn't quite word salad but it never made sense (as if you just walked in during the middle of a conversation with no context). They also had him institutionalized but he escaped so much and caused so much trouble that the place wouldn't take him anymore or something.

>>7473936
I had a nice female coworker once who was deeply religious. I noticed she would stare at me often but seemed otherwise normal so we became friends. As I got to know her better I found out that
>She was a prophet for her religion and it had gotten her kicked out of her church.
>Lucifer visited her in her room at night and had convinced her that he was a good guy who'd fallen on the wrong side of history.
>She married Lucifer in her room one of these nights.
>She was interested in me because apparently I looked like this "Lucifer".
When she told me the last piece is when I started distancing myself because I was afraid of what might come next. Her sister also explained that she was undergoing some treatment for schizophrenia. She was really nice and all but I honestly felt a little scared after that last revelation.

>> No.7478426

>>7473933
I have no idea what you're asking.

>> No.7478450
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7478450

>>7478398
>She was a prophet for her religion and it had gotten her kicked out of her church.
>Lucifer visited her in her room at night and had convinced her that he was a good guy who'd fallen on the wrong side of history.
>She married Lucifer in her room one of these nights.
>She was interested in me because apparently I looked like this "Lucifer".

i think this is my fetish

>> No.7478461

>>7478256
sweet jesus i feel for you. i feel like i have my hands full just because the women in my family all have manic depression and cry and wail at the top of their lungs every night from 9-11PM. at least they can go to work.

>> No.7478469

>>7475892
I'd stay off of drugs if i were you.

>> No.7478483

>>7473957
There are literally shitloads of schizophrenics

>> No.7478814

I do not have schizo, but I have a bipolar disorder with a story of psychotic depression.
I have a work and a gf.
Yet everyday is a total struggle to me, and often I don't even want to get out of bed.
I can't imagine how's living with schizo.
You are a stupid person op.

>> No.7478848

No one is a useful employee or worker under the effects of PCP or LSD,etc. People who do such drugs work while sober or face being fired as a liability to their employer, and a potential danger to themselves and others.

Schizophrenics, depending on the severity, have no off switch. No way for it to leave their system. And more insidiously, the brain frequently mixes both fantastic hallucinations and delusions with real input.

>> No.7478906

>>7478256
I'm sorry you have to go through that, actually I have an uncle who is schizophrenic. He's the crazy type like your sister but I don't see him much he lives very far away so I don't know all the details of his condition. I think he's also in a constant state of psychosis though.

Here is different case though and apparently she's not the only one: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elyn_Saks
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/27/opinion/sunday/schizophrenic-not-stupid.html?_r=0