/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.7466644]

How does my brain know where my hand is?

[Anonymous No.7466653]

>>7466644
http://www.hse.ru/data/2013/10/09/1280379806/Fundamental%20Neuroscience%20(3rd%20edition)%202008.pdf

[Anonymous No.7466668]

>>7466644
I loled at this sudden question.

[Anonymous No.7466674]

>>7466644
golgi tendon organs?
proprioreceptors?

[Anonymous No.7466693]

>>7466644
and how does it know where the words are

[Anonymous No.7466772]

>>7466644
your brain is a neural network that learned to figure it out with the inputs it gets (strains on certain muscles in your arm). why do you ask how such a relatively simple ability of your brain came into existence compared to much much complicated things like how does your brain turn lightwaves that hit your retina into a model of physical reality in your inner conciousness, or turn airpressurewaves that hit your eardrum into a model of sound that helps you distinguish noise from information

[Anonymous No.7466784]

Pain

[Anonymous No.7466790]

>>7466772
>how does your brain turn lightwaves that hit your retina into a model of physical reality in your inner conciousness
I guess with a inverted GPU
>turn airpressurewaves that hit your eardrum into a model of sound that helps you distinguish noise from information
A regular mic with a pattern recognition system

Proprioception is still a harder thing to talk about tbh

[Anonymous No.7466802]

>>7466790
this guy must either be a troll or seriously stupid
i will not point out the fundamental flaws in his arguments since theyre too obvious and anyone not getting it should either leave this board or consider reading some scientific literature about logic and neurology

[Anonymous No.7466806]

>>7466790
>inverted GPU
loled

[Anonymous No.7466807]

>>7466644
When will sex with robot chicks become a reality?

[Anonymous No.7466810]

>>7466802
Tell us how you would build a robot with human level proprioreception

[Anonymous No.7466811]

>>7466644
Proprioception.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proprioception

[Anonymous No.7466816]

>>7466810
building a robot and the question how the human brain does it are two completely separate things.
a robot could very easily calculatethe position of its hand by knowing the length and angles of its arm and hand

[Anonymous No.7466817]

>>7466811
Well, you fell on your ass there.

[Anonymous No.7466824]

>>7466816
>a robot could very easily calculatethe position of its hand by knowing the length and angles of its arm and hand
Not enough data there. I can see who is the retard projecting his bullshit now.

[Anonymous No.7466830]

>>7466824
Seems like that would be enough data to me. Explain.

[Anonymous No.7466831]

>>7466824
oh no i didnt mention all the necessary variables now the idiot couldnt figure it out by himself and calls bullshit. fact is all the necessary variables can be known by the robot.
hand upper and lower arm can be treated as vectors in 3d space

[Anonymous No.7466837]

>>7466830
>>7466831
Let's say I break the robot's arm, or just bend it.

[Anonymous No.7466840]

>>7466837
then the robot is broken, lets say i break your arm or rip it off, tell me where your hand is

[Anonymous No.7466841]

>>7466816
then how do you know the angle ? you're just avoiding the question. The answer for a robot is with an encoder or with an estimation.
The answer for a human is proprioception.

[Anonymous No.7466842]

>>7466837
Wow, what a useless thought.
You really had to go that far to justify the result of your broken ego?

[Anonymous No.7466843]

>>7466840
If I break your arm you still know your hands position
>then the robot is broken
Did you just forget what we are talking about

[Anonymous No.7466848]

>>7466840
>then the robot is broken
Fuck I am laughing hard on this

[Anonymous No.7466850]

>>7466841
holy crap, you have absolutely no idea what youre talking about, everyone who ever built and programmed a fucking robot built it so it knows by how many degrees it moves its limbs

[Anonymous No.7466857]

>>7466772
>implying there is a difference between noise and information

[Anonymous No.7466860]

>>7466843
when your arm is broken and bent, your eyes see it and your and help your brain correct that error when finding your hand, trying to fix the same problem with a robot would require a reassertion of the arms position by adding a correction vector which is determined by a camera

[Anonymous No.7466862]

>>7466860
If I break a blind man's arm he still knows his hands position. Admit it, you are now pulling shit out of your ass.

[Anonymous No.7466867]

>>7466862
he can correct the same thing by feeling

[Anonymous No.7466868]

>>7466862
also what proof do you have a blind man knows where his hand is when his arm is broken?

[Anonymous No.7467468]

>>7466831
Yep position could be mathematically calculated from sensor data. It would then be geometry.

[Anonymous No.7467469]

>>7467468
its called telemetry fuckwit

[Anonymous No.7467473]

>>7467469
You didn't need to be rude about it. Your autism is showing.

[Anonymous No.7467488]

Since my spinal cord injury without seeing the position of my leg i have no idea where it is. If i close my eyes and someone moves my leg and ill try to touch it 90% of time im wrong.

[Anonymous No.7467506]

>>7466644
Isn't that proprioception?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proprioception

[Anonymous No.7468461]

>>7466644
Because you can feel it on your dick.

[Anonymous No.7469501]

>>7466644
>How does my brain know where my hand is?
It doesn't, it guesses where it is and assumes the guess is correct. Usually this is adequate.

[Anonymous No.7469522]

"Proprioception" is a vague explanation. More precisely, intrafusal nerves residing in your muscle fibers detect the tension generated by your movements and send the information to the brain, specifically the secondary motor area located in the precentral gyrus of the cortex. The primary motor area commands the movement, the secondary motor area associates the movements with other cortical functions such as somatokinetic memory.

[Anonymous No.7470257]

>>7469522
>intrafusal nerves
My bad, it's actually intrafusal muscle fibers innervated by specialized neurons.

[Anonymous No.7470330]

>>7466862
Phantom limbs. How do you know where your hand is when you have no hand?

[Anonymous No.7470347]

>>7470330
Nerve damage.

[Anonymous No.7470357]

>>7467473
i really didn't, did it?

i apologize.

that was out of line.

[Anonymous No.7470359]

Because its got a LAN connection right to it.

[Anonymous No.7470686]

>>7469501
Wait...

Then how do we know that we have brains?

[Anonymous No.7470730]

>>7470686
We have brains because...Erm...MY PICTURE EXPLAINS!

[Anonymous No.7470767]

>>7470686
You guess

[Anonymous No.7470808]

>on a camp
>sleep on the same room with friends
>wake up
>where the fuck is my arm
>can't feel it
>can't find it
>"GUYS WHERE IS MY ARM?!?!"
>"OKAY FOUND IT!!"
>it was next to my head
pls

[Anonymous No.7470868]

>>7466772
you are a fag

[Anonymous No.7470964]

>>7470808
You woke up because your arm's nerves were not getting enough blood. You can't receive information this way.

[Anonymous No.7471046]

>>7466807
Already a thing, you can buy a masturbator that hooks up to your pc and mimics the actions of the actress on screen.

The technology just hasn't advanced to the point that the robots are convincingly human. However, virgin neckbeards rejoice; I bet we'll see sex bots in our lifetime.

[Anonymous No.7471300]

>>7471046
Link pls

[Anonymous No.7471332]

>>7466857
im a fag.

[Anonymous No.7471375]

how do you know you can do anything faggot?

because you've done it before

[Anonymous No.7471450]

>>7466644

Cerebellum.

[Anonymous No.7471818]

>>7470359
underrated post.