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/sci/ - Science & Math

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6329015 No.6329015 [Reply] [Original]

When does "life" begin? Is it at birth or what?

>> No.6329022

is this about abortion? it's about abortion, isn't it.

>> No.6329019

4billion years ago.

>> No.6329023

>>6329015
>When does "life" begin?

Approximately 3.5 billion years ago. All life on Earth is part of that same self-sustaining chemical reaction. There are no other beginnings.

>> No.6329026

>>6329015
Abiogenesis

>> No.6329033

>>6329023
/thread

>> No.6329036

This is still a question volatile to conversations in my school's religion class. As I am one of the more rationally active pupils in my class I have come up with a logical solution to this question. "Life" starts as soon as the chemical substances of atoms collide to form a fetus.
There are no other options. My answer is absolute.

>> No.6329039

>>6329036

idiot

>> No.6329045
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6329045

>>6329039
you have been.... trapped

XDDDDD

>> No.6329049

>>6329015
>"When does 'life' begin?"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life#Definitions
Basically this

>> No.6329056

>>6329049
>using wikipedia as a reliable source
Wikipedia can be edited by anyone.. it's not reliable at all. That's what my teacher tells me at least.

>> No.6329058

>>6329023
>>6329033
retards thinking they're clever
protip: read OPs question again, focusing on the 'does' part

personally, i think life begins the moment a single sperm cell enters the egg. the egg alone is alive, so are all the sperm cells, but they count as parts of their hosts, as soon as they connect, you can think of it as an independent organism that's pretty alive - replicating and shit

>> No.6329063

I usually consider the fetus an individual as soon as it's viable for life, at earliest around 6 months. Before that it's just a parasite.

>> No.6329066

>>6329058
is a sperm considered life? I mean it can swims right? I can't swim

>> No.6329070
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6329070

>>6329058
when does julius caesar die?

>that would be ides of march 44BC

hurr durr NO you retards think you are smart, read again, it said "does"!!!

>> No.6329071

>>6329019
>>6329023

This

>> No.6329079

>>6329058
>focusing on the 'does' part

wut

>> No.6329081

>>6329058
>you can think of it

You can think of it however you want, but that has no bearing on reality. >>6329023 is the talking about reality.

>> No.6329115

>>6329058
No arguments here against the zygote being alive, but life alone necessitates neither higher consciousness nor the capability to psychologically respond to or even experience pain, both of which should be considered prerequisites for valuable life. We don't give a shit about the livestock we kill for meat, for example.

>> No.6329430

A cell is a form of life. If physicists found a cell on let's say mars then they would categorize it as "life".

I'm still prochoice regardless. Stats show that the fast majority of abortions come from single parent families and nigglets. There's already too many borderline retarded nigglets around, it's better to not fuck up the gene pool more than it already is.

>> No.6329432

test

>> No.6329540
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6329540

>>6329015
If we go by the adage "life is pain", you might say it's somewhere between 24 and 30 weeks after conception.

>> No.6330317

AAAHHHHH, metaphysics. I know all about that. Metaphysics is not something you learn about through experiments or degrees, it is something you learn about through sheer thought. Listen to my theory and tell me what you think about it:

So everything and all groups of things have a consciousness. In a bag of marbles, each marble has its own consciousness. At the same time, you could group any number or variety of marbles together and that group would have its own consciousness, such as how our group of brain cells has its own consciousness. Each molecule and particle within these marbles has its own consciousness, and so on. As I said, each individual thing and all groups of things all have their own consciousnesses. Once your consciousness reaches a level of complexity, you are "alive". Even further than that, you can achieve sentience by having the ability to process the information that you are existent. So here is the big part. When you die, what happens to you? If your molecules are reassembled and put back together, but they are the same molecules, will you be the same person? And what if your molecules are scattered, and a 100% exact copy of you is made from DIFFERENT molecules. What then? The answer is complex. So you die and are reborn infinite number of times each second because the only consciousness you can have is the "now" kind. Once your consciousness is in the past it is different. So yes, your younger self, even by a few seconds, or nanoseconds, or any increment of time, is a different person with a different consciousness. And here is the even bigger part. If all groups of things have their own consciousness, the entire universe must have one consciousness. Does this mean it can think, feel emotions, or have any of the characteristics that a sentient being would have? No. It is simply the sum of all things happening in the universe. It might be able to think, it might not. But your senses limit your consciousness. When you die, cont.

>> No.6330318

>>6329079
as opposed to "did," you burning bundle of sticks

>> No.6330321

>>6330317
basically what I was going to say is that when you die you become a part of the universal consciousness which means you are at the same time every thing, and ONLY that thing, but at the same time everything else. The only other way to reach this is to have infinite perception, which is the same as zero perception, thus forming the wheel of life.

Think about this legitimately, and give me feedback

>> No.6330325
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6330325

>>6329056

>> No.6330327
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6330327

Life begins when phlogiston starts to circulate in and out cells.

>> No.6330360

>>6330321
yea whenever I stop and honestly think about what seems to be .. well .. ya know what's ... going on, I guess? I mean how often do you guys try to strip everything cultural and societal away from your examining of existence and think about the raw truth of how this shit probably goes. I always gravitate exactly toward these specific concepts>>6330325

>> No.6330374

>>6330321
I never really voice this because I understand even with MY certainty, I can't know for sure. but do you ever feel like you just have the correct kind of common sense?i mean for existential stuff like this. it's probably not exact but I feel as if this theory is atleast pointing in the right direction of the truth

>> No.6330392
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6330392

>>6329015
life never begins. life is just a state. a fetus begins to grow a brain, a baby develops said brain, a child continues development, brain becomes self aware, depressed and browses 4chan. brain ceased to function after brain decides to destroy itself after watching scat/furry/gurro and its mom finds out.

>> No.6330419

Life is a continuous chemical reaction, the most complex of them all.

>> No.6330431

>>6329058
> i think life begins the moment a single sperm cell enters the egg
Then bacteria are not alive, plants are not alive, any cell that's not a zygote is alive.

>> No.6331068

>>6330327
lol

>> No.6331074
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6331074

>>6330392

>> No.6331075

>>6330321
If were thinking about this in terms of physical phenomena then you technically could not be part of a 'universal consciousness' because you would have to wait an arbitrarily long time for any physical remnants of your consciousness to propagate outwards through the universe. Perhaps you become part of a consciousness that began when humans first became sentient and thus the reach of that consciousness would be (age of sentience)*c=r of 'sphere of influence'
but this is probably complete bullshit

>> No.6331097

life begins when resources are spent on acquiring resources to not end

>> No.6331128

>>6329015
If I get what you're asking, a new person comes to life when the zygote is formed since a DNA different from the father's and the mother's is "created" at that point.

>> No.6331130

>>6331128
I forgot a "I think that"

>> No.6331137

>>6329015

When its exited the womb.

>> No.6331139

>>6329015
>When does "life" begin?

When the zygote is formed.

The US law actually recognizes an unborn child as a victim in cases of murder of pregnant mothers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unborn_Victims_of_Violence_Act

But for some fucked up feminist reason, abortion is legal and mothers who kill their own children are not charged with manslaughter.

>> No.6331147

>>6329063
>implying parasites can't be alive

>> No.6331160

I am a separate individual from my parents.
When does one become an individual?
When does a clump of cells become human?

>> No.6331167

>>6331139

>>>/x/

>> No.6331172

>>6331128

Nothing is created, it's just combining pre-existing DNA. The egg and sperm have the same DNA as the zygote.

>> No.6331178

>>6331160
>When does one become an individual?
>When does a clump of cells become human?

These are, of course, not scientific questions.

>> No.6331181

>>6331139

bait

>> No.6331194

>>6331172
You have the number 6, that is 2*3, and the number 35, that is 5*7. If you take one prime factor from each of them and multiply them you can get 2*5=10, 2*7=14, 3*5=15, 3*7=21. Are 10, 14, 15 and 21 the same as 6 and 35? They are just combination of pre-existing prime factors.

>> No.6331221

>>6331194

what a muddled, pointless analogy

>> No.6331222

>>6331194

There is a sperm that is "2" and an egg that is "5." So I ask, is 2*5 the same thing as 10?

>> No.6331245

>>6331172
That's why he used quotation marks, I think he means that the concept known as a new person is created, not that new DNA is created.

>> No.6331278
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6331278

At the Big Bang.

>> No.6331282

I honestly think you should have the option to abort 6 months old babies.

>> No.6331306

>>6331245
>the concept known as a new person is created

Concepts exist in our minds, not in physical reality. When you DECIDE to consider it a new person is not a science question.

>> No.6331307

>>6329015
Life is really poorly defined, OP. Even at the single cell level.

>> No.6331318

>>6331282


So does Peter Singer, except he takes it as far as children being 2 years old. The argument being "being human" requires a vast set of qualities that including being able to function independently in the world - not relying on other people for fundamental decision making. Being human, according to Singer, means being rationally capable of performing the actions of a human.

>> No.6331332

Well life technically never begins since both the sperm and egg are living organisms and when the meet you still have a living organism.

But assuming this is some masked abortion question a woman should have a right to decide what to do with the mass of cells acting as a parasite on her body.

The whole debate is a moral one anyway so I dont get why people cant just compromise and say something like when the brain is formed or when the heart starts pumping blood is the cutoff for abortion. earth is overpopulated as fuck and the average population is just getting stupider. no need to shit it up with more little retards

>> No.6331372

>>6331332
Why don't people for and against the death penalty compromise and say something like when a person has killed a number of people greater than the number of his/her offspring is the cutoff for death penalty?
People don't like to compromise when talking about life and death.

>> No.6331413
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6331413

>>6331278
>Multiverse doesn't exist

>> No.6331426

>>6329036
>rational
>colliding atoms form fetus
no
the fetus is formed by several substances consisting of atoms.so what you are saying is substance1+substance2 = substance = "life"
what means the substances in the first case also contained life, so basically what youre saying is life is infinite

>> No.6331435

>>6329023
>>6329019
This does not take into account a possible panspermia theory.

>> No.6331440

life begins as soon as child develop awareness of self and others....about 2 months after bird

>> No.6331446

>>6331440
How do you know when that happens?

>> No.6331447

>>6331440
I have read some stupid shit in those board but this...

>> No.6331448

>>6331440
but no empathy.

>> No.6331457

>>6331446
i just read it in my stem cell and cloning textbook,but it says that self awareness develops in first couple of months

>> No.6331464

>>6331440
Babies are pre-programed.

>> No.6331510

Life as you said, begins when the molecules of something start moving, those things are germs, or bacteria, and with the process of millions maybe every century, transformation changes everything and that's for all.