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/sci/ - Science & Math

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6169797 No.6169797 [Reply] [Original]

ignore the pic but in a couple years the sun will go out. couldn't we hypothetically throw some of the moons into Jupiter to reach the mass required to start Jupiter as our new sun?

>> No.6169821

>>6169797
Yeah, just pick up the moon and toss it over there. Should be fine.

>> No.6169827

if we threw the sun into jupiter we'd have more than enough mass for a new sun!

>> No.6169829

>>6169821
Jupiter has plenty of moons. Titan is nearly mercury sized.

>> No.6169844

>>6169797
Jupiter is roughly 80x lighter than the lightest star that undergoes fusion. So it would need to have accumulated 80 times what it already has in order to be a "real star."

None of its moons have enough mass for Jupiter to undergo fusion.

>> No.6169851

>>6169797

> a couple years

Jupiter needs much more mass than just its moons in order to become "like a sun". Even then, it's not really a sun and would be much further away from the Earth than our current Sun is. In fact, there's probably not even enough mass in our solar system in order to make this change occur in Jupiter, and even if you did, you wouldn't want to.

>> No.6169918

You cant use moons, man those are made of rock. You need hydrogen. But yes, you are correct.

>> No.6169962

If you throw a couple of Jupiters into Jupiters then yes.

>> No.6170077

>>6169829
Titan is Saturn's Moon.
And no, all the mass of all the planets, moons, asteroids, and comets in our solar system combined would still not be enough to start sustained fusion. Even more, those bodies are made of metals. Stars run on hydrogen fuel, so dropping in a few planets wouldn't help a star form.

>> No.6170318

>>6169962

Well fuck then, its simple. Saturn is pretty big. So are Uranus and Neptune. There's a couple more Jupiter amongst those three. Hell, you could even add Venus and Mars into the mess if you wanted to add a bit more rock to the mix.

Go out and staple rockets onto them and guide them into a collision course with Jupiter. HEY PRESTO! INSTANT STAR!

Hear that Sun? FUCK YOU SUN! We make our own star now!

>> No.6170359

>>6169797
No. The minimum mass for a ball of gas to undergo fusion is only 1/80th of the mass of Jupiter. Even if we threw the whole rest of the Solar System into Jupiter (besides the Sun, obviously), it wouldn't even be close to ignition.

>> No.6170363

>>6170318
Sorry, doesn't work. The resulting ball of gas is still far too small to undergo fusion.

>> No.6170426

Would you rather fight one sun size marine or 100 marine sized suns?

>> No.6170432

>>6170426
Definitely the second.

Especially since, given the Sun's power density, each marine would be putting out less energy than a lightbulb.

>> No.6170447
File: 19 KB, 320x308, 1334358698146.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6170447

>>6170318
There's big, and then there's big.

>> No.6170448

>>6169797
>in a couple years the sun will go out.
AHAHAHAHAHHAHAH
AHAHAH
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>> No.6170458
File: 666 KB, 400x400, 1382419542774.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6170458

>>6170447
THAT FUCKING PICTURE>..tahnk you so much

>> No.6170475

>>6170447
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pareto_principle

>> No.6170617

is Jupiter core liquid?

>> No.6170666

>>6170617
We're not exactly sure what Jupiter's core is made of

>> No.6170703

>>6169797
>ignore the pic but in a couple years the sun will go out.
Try a couple weeks NASA just said this.

>> No.6170710

>>6170703

what? source plox

>> No.6170734

http://abyss.uoregon.edu/~js/ast122/lectures/lec13.html

"[T]he star must have a minimum mass: about 75 times the mass of the planet Jupiter, or about 8 percent of the mass of our sun."

So is there enough mass to spare outside of Sol in our system to ignite another system star?

http://www.space.com/58-the-sun-formation-facts-and-characteristics.html

"[The sun] holds 99.8 percent of the solar system's mass[.]"

Some further googling shows:

sun 99.86%
jupiter 0.097%
everything else 0.043%

Since all system mass (possibly excluding dark matter) outside the sun is only 0.14%, then we need 57 times more free mass. There's only one place to get it: The sun itself.

But is the sun "went out" when how will trying to carve out 8% its mass form an ignitable mass?

You can't just re-ignite Sol with some extra mass when it becomes a White Dwarf, since that forms a Type Ia supernova. In fact, there's no means whatsoever of re-igniting a collapsed star, unless you prefer a supernova tan.

Question: How could you "store" the 10^44-10^46 Joules of energy coming out of a supernova? Note most of that energy comes out in neutrinos, which are notoriously hard to capture.

>> No.6170738

>>6170703

um what? sauce

>> No.6170920

>>6170703
6/10 Made me check

>> No.6170949

>>6170734
"Sol" is a rotation of a planet, what we call a "day" here on Earth. The English name of our star is the Sun. Sol is purely poetic and used in sci-fi.

>> No.6170967

>>6170447

saved one and posted none. stop me.

>> No.6170970

>>6170666

the hardest metal

>> No.6170979

what if we jsut wrap a megastructure around jupiter the basic functionality of which is to act as a magnetic vice that increases the core density of jupiter by a factor of 75 at which point ignition will occur. use the resulting power to continue powering the rig.

I call it the "planetcruncher". patent pending.

>> No.6170981

>>6169797
>but in a couple years the sun will go out
>couple years the sun will go out
>couple years

Do you mean a couple billion?

>> No.6170985

>>6170981
semantics

>> No.6170992

>>6170363
We can make fusion happen on earth. The other planets combined are bigger than earth ergo the super planet can perform fusion.

QED

>> No.6171004

>>6170077
Stars run on anything in the periodic table until Fe

>> No.6171009

>>6171004
sure...for about .0001% of their lives they do. For the other 99.999% of the time they run on hydrogen then helium.

>> No.6172504

I tried to do that once as a boy but I got a No response, something about two starts too close together.
Then again you say ITT insufficient mass for

>> No.6172549

>>6170981

OP is god and he was thinking of cool ways to keep the sun going.

Years for him are different than ours.

>> No.6172555

>>6170992
You can't say QED unless you actually prove something. You didn't prove anything, you just said a thing.

>> No.6172599

>>6169797
No you fucking retard. You fucking retard. Oh my god.

>> No.6172607

>>6170703
ISON=ICE=FROZEN (WATER)
SUN=FIRE
WATER+FIRE=BAD
>critical thinking involved in the formulation of this question.

>> No.6172655

>>6169797
the 100 marines would win

>> No.6172694

>>6169797
>a couple years the sun will go out
Nothing a candle light vigil won't solve.

>> No.6172695

>throw a moon

>> No.6172697

>>6169797
You know what, jupiter is really light and floats so maybe we can put it in a tub, put some wires to it, give it a nice spin and use it for free electricity...

>> No.6172715

>>6172655
Not if they're fighting in Faluja.

>> No.6172718

Do the marines have a sun made of ice in their arsenal?

>> No.6172740

>>6170703

the sun isn't even remotely CLOSE to the end of it's current phase. We've got at LEAST 5 billion more years before shit gets real.

Not that humans will live to see it.

>> No.6172753

>>6169797
Holy crap guys, I just figured out something!

You know how sometimes people have these weird things called "hypothetical situations?" (I only just found out myself!)

Well - and this is maybe a long shot, but just bear with me here - what if instead of being stupid enough to literally believe the sun was about to go out, the OP was postulating one of these "hypothetical situations" or so-called "what-ifs" intended to spur our thinking?

>> No.6172764

>>6172753

Yeah! Thats right!

OP is cool guy not afraid nutthin'!

Like if you cool guy and "hypotamused" what would happen if everyone on Earth all farted and burped at the same time?

Would the resulting pressure wave wipe out all life on Earth?

Would it blow the sun out?

Mind bogglingly stuff! Makes my dick hard thinkin' about it!

>> No.6172790
File: 28 KB, 300x295, ninos_de_retardo_mental_524014_t0.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6172790

>>6172753

Holy crap, OP!

You're retarded!

you might want to see your gp about that

>> No.6173139

>>6172790
that wasn't even me but he is right. instead of discussing the actual matter autistic sperglords like you just drool over irrelevant semantics.

>> No.6173526

>>6170318
I lol'd

>> No.6173573

>>6173139
We already did all the discussion on the matter earlier in the thread. The answer was "no."

>> No.6174887

>>6172764

You dumb fuck, dont you know that burping and farting at the same time can kill you? It creates a pressure imbalance inside you. Your internal organs then rupture and you die horribly as a result of internal bleeding.

>> No.6174932

'scuse me.
Real short: the sun has infuckingcredible power.
We harness a wee fraction of it. Wee tiny iota teensy amount.
The sun if harnessed could make us immortal. Power beyond imagination.
Now go to bed so your fragile mind can take it's 33% off cycle, only to die in a cosmic second.

>> No.6175142

>>6174932
WE ARE MADE OF STAR POWDER GUYS, WHY DON'T WE HAVE POWERS?!

>> No.6175143

So you're telling me in 2015 the sun will go out?

>> No.6175146

>>6174887
>pressure imbalance

>> No.6175176

Physicist here.

Generally speaking, all problems can be solved if we throw enough moons at them.

Get educated then we'll talk.

>> No.6175224

>>6169797

What if we collide Saturn and Jupiter?

>> No.6175226

>>6175176
>Generally speaking, all problems can be solved if we throw enough moons at them.

Prove it and you can collect your Nobel Prize.

>> No.6175234

no1 explained how we r gonna throw a moon

>> No.6175244

It's an interesting thought, but the biggest problem I think would be the change in orbits of the entire solar system. The tidal forces on earth alone would probably be sufficient to kill everybody here and maybe rip the planet apart.

Instead of creating a new sun though we could always just feed our existing big guy with more mass. Of course then we face the possibility of a supernova in the suns future.

>> No.6175246

i think the sun would beat 100 marines maybe

>> No.6175247

Or instead of killing ourselves by ruining our solar system, we could just burrow deep enough in the earth to keep warm. Bring alot of freezedried food and a lamp though.

>> No.6175284

The sun loses 9.13*10^-14 solar masses per year. A quick Google search tells us that the Marines can be said to have been formed in 1775 with a strength of ~300 men. Nowadays, there are roughly 200k Marines, resulting in an annual growth of 839 Marines. Assuming that each Marine weighs around 80kg, that's 6.71*10^4 kg of Marines per year, or a growth of roughly 3.4*10^-24 solar masses per year.

Starting with a total Marine mass of 100*80 kg and a current solar mass of 2*10^30 kg:
100*80 kg+t*3.4*10^-24 kg =2*10^30 kg - t*9.13*10^-14 kg
t = 2.19058x10^43
Unless my math is off, the marines literally outweigh the sun in a measly 2.19058x10^43 years. We're winning this war of attrition, gentlemen.

>> No.6175428

>>6169797
Ha. Haha. Hahahaha. HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAA.

I... I can't... There are so many things wrong with your post that you can't be Human. You're a cat who has recently walked across a keyboard.

Yeah... That must be it.

>> No.6175461

>>6169797
>in a couple year
5 billion years, we won't survive until there.

>> No.6175496

HEY GUISE
I got it, hear m- hear me out

What if to make a moon from an apple you have to invent a pie?

>> No.6175515

>>6175226
that's easy. let me give you some examples:
you want achieve world peace:
throw a moon at earth and everyone is at peace
sarah is hungry:
throw a moon at sarah and she isn't hungry anymore

q.e.d.

>> No.6175532

>>6175515
black holes are sucking in everything

solve this with a moon

>> No.6175536

>attack at night

>> No.6175538

>>6175428
Shut the fuck up, turbonerd.

>> No.6175541

>>6175536
THE SUN IS GOING TO EXPLODE.
What will we do then?

>> No.6175558
File: 58 KB, 580x679, 1370029663143.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6175558

>>6175532

Make a "heavy-wall" dyson sphere of moons surrounding the black hole from all directions. With sufficient bodies you should be able to turn the blackhole inside out and save the universe.

>> No.6175597
File: 45 KB, 217x278, 1369995969422.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6175597

>>6175558

This will actually work

>> No.6175695

>>6169844
Brown dwarfs start around 13 jupiter masses. (guesstimated mass required to fuse deuterium)

But jupiter emits more heat than it absorbs. Most gas giants are expected to do the same. There is no definitive distinct line between gas giant and a brown dwarf, the bigger they are the hotter they seem to be.

>> No.6175698

>>6175695
If Earth was out where Jupiter was, it'd emit more heat than it absorbed too. Does that imply that Earth is undergoing fusion?

(Hint: The answer is "no")

>> No.6175705

>>6175698
Earth emits more heat than it absorbs right where it is.

Uranium, thorium, and potassium decay and release energy.

>> No.6175715

>>6170979
how do you power planetcruncher before jupiter ignites? #rekt

>> No.6175759

>>6170970
Well, actually there are diamonds in Jupiter. So the joke's on you.

>> No.6175811

>>6175759
liquid carbon =/= diamonds regardless of what you read on popsci

>> No.6175815

>>6175811
what about liquid diamonds?

>> No.6175851

>>6169829
>Titan is nearly mercury sized.
Exactly, do you know how much energy it would take to de-orbit Titan?

>> No.6175879

>>6175815
You mean tequila?
http://phys.org/news145255770.html

>> No.6176049

>>6175879
so, jupiter will be the place to be to party and get all the free booze you ever wished for?

>> No.6176498

>>6175284

Sorry to shit on your calculations, but you did not factor in the rate of marines undergoing male to female transition, which seems to increase every year.

Given that in the not too distant future that artificial womb implants will soon be a feature of MtF gender reassignment surgery, umm, I forgot where this was all leading but I am sure it was important...okay, I will shut up now....maybe.

>> No.6176593

So is no one going to consider the problem that the AU between Earth and Jupiter is such that even if Jupiter could be forced into fusion, Earth would still freeze?

Or is it understood that the remaining population be transported to a toasty distance from Jupiter on a fabricated world?

I'm going under the assumption that Titan has already been "tossed" into Jupiter.

>> No.6176605

I read this thread and I can't believe some people felt the need to explain that the sun wasn't going to go out.

Also I think it's best to target Uranus first. Throwing Jupiters as well as all kinds of moons and rocks into Uranus would greatly increase its mass without it being too close to us (Uranus is much farther away than Jupiter, fortunately, we probably couldn't resist the gas emissions otherwise).

>> No.6176635
File: 307 KB, 1158x1226, 1376656217839.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6176635

>>6170970