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/sci/ - Science & Math

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6022695 No.6022695 [Reply] [Original]

Trivia:

0 isn't an even number.

>> No.6022700

>>6022695
Pink isn't even a color.

>> No.6022706

grapes aren't even fruit

>> No.6022709

>>6022695
i isn't an odd number

>> No.6022711

>>6022706
tomatoes are not fruit

>> No.6022712

Hydrogen is a metal when solid

>> No.6022715

>>6022695
vegetable/fruit diffrentionation is a social construct

>> No.6022718

>>6022715
math is human construct

>> No.6022725

>>6022712
diamond is an even metal

most metals (like aspartame and antigone) are odd metals or "so called" metalloids.

transition metals are transitioning from true metals to wood-like elements

halogens are naughty

>> No.6022730

>>6022725
no it isn't.
way to be a combo breaker asshole

>> No.6022736

>>6022695
0 is an even number.
it lands between two odd numbers
it can be divided by two and remain whole
zero plus an even number is even

>> No.6022743

>>6022730
combo was broken when even/odd wasn't mentioned faget

>> No.6022774

First, 0 is 'nothing'. not a number.
therefore 0 is neither even nor odd.

>> No.6022813

zero is a point you witless plebs. It's the generic point of the curve Spec(Z). So much math fail on this underage b& shit hole.

>> No.6022833

>>6022774
>0 is 'nothing'. not a number.
0 is a natural number. Defining a model of the natural numbers requires there be a single natural number that is not the successor of any other natural number. That number is 0.

Evenness is a property of integers, which are constructed as ordered pairs of natural numbers. The integer 0 is the pair (0, 0) and it is even. 0 = 2*0.

>> No.6022894

>>6022774

Zero is something, just like the empty set isn't nothing.

But you're a troll, you already knew that.

>> No.6022900

>>6022695
if it's not a number than explain the following sequence.

0+1+1+2+3+5+8

pro tip : you can't

>> No.6022908

>>6022900

Go away Fibonacci...

>> No.6022906

>>6022900
>0+1+1+2+3+5+8
-8,5,-3,2,-1,1,0,1,1,2,3,5,8

>> No.6022937

There are a few days to define even numbers, all of which I know, zero satisfies.

>> No.6022947

>>6022712
Salt is formed by an alkali metal and a halogen
Halogens need one more electron before completing their valence shell. Hydrogen does too, so it is a halogen.
Alkali metals have 1 valence electron. Therefore Hydrogen is an alkali metal.
H2 is therefore a salt.

>> No.6022973
File: 15 KB, 615x561, log_phase_diagram08.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6022973

You are making too many assumptions (and apparently so was I).

>> No.6023448

>>6022973

Further proof that diamond is the hardest metal

>> No.6023454

>>6022709
Yes you is, nigga.

>> No.6023467

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8t1TC-5OLdM

>> No.6023478

>>6022813
Isn't that usually called (0), as it is the zero ideal?

>> No.6023730

I have a phd in math and this whole thread is

>whothefuckcares.bat

>> No.6025318

>>6022894
The empty set IS nothing.

>> No.6025324

>>6025318

But it's not nothing. It 'contains nothing' but itself is something.

>> No.6025347

You are all wrong. Zero is an operator.
POV

>> No.6025367

>>6022695
>number
>A number is a mathematical object used to count, label, and measure. According to Wikipedia

try harder

>> No.6025369

>>6022813

It depends on who is interpreting the data and for what purpose.

>> No.6025374

0 isn't even a number.

>> No.6025385

Most people don't know that you can not know nothin.

>> No.6025389

>>6022709

i doesn't exist, it's just something mathematicians created to blow their own minds.

>> No.6025390

>>6022833

Defined by who? Autistic mathematicians too "smart" to be bothered by reality, that's who.

>> No.6026091

Trivia:

Einstein failed math at elemtary school but still invented the laws of gravity

#followyourdreams

>> No.6026121

>>6022695
isnumeric(0) == true

>> No.6026181

>>6022833
The natural numbers start at 1. It's the whole numbers that start at 0.

Keep your sets straight.

>> No.6026187

>>6026181
Not for computer "scientists".

>> No.6026203

>>6026181
There is no universal agreement about whether to include zero in the set of natural numbers

>> No.6026201

>>6026187
yes even for computer scientists however depending on the programming lanuage zero might be a number or just a reference for null

>> No.6026430

metaphysical statement: metaphysics exists
metaphysical statement: metaphysics doesnt exist

numerical statement: numbers represent something
numerical statement: 0 represents nothing

It's a number representing nothing.
/thread

>> No.6026452

>0 isn't even a number

>> No.6026493

>>6022695
that's because 0 isn't a number.

>> No.6026501

>>6022695
0 meets all the requirements of an even number. It can be assumed to be even. But I'm sure this was a joke thread anyways

>> No.6026506

>>6026493
>>6026493
yes it is. In fact I'd almost consider it more of a number then pi considering pi doesn't actually have an exact value that we can quantify. Only symbolically using C/D

>> No.6026531

>>6026506
or just <span class="math"> \pi [/spoiler]
math is symbolic, so use symbols

>> No.6026549
File: 16 KB, 654x132, Screen Shot 2013-09-13 at 9.46.56 PM.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6026549

>> No.6026940

>>6026549
>bing
what

>> No.6027076

>>6026091
urban legend.

Created for dumb students with poor grades. "mmh, I must be the new Einstein, no problem"

Just look on google, there are his grades when he was a student, he scored perfectly in "hard science". (scan from the original)

>> No.6027095

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parity_of_zero#Why_zero_is_even

>> No.6027271

>>6026181
>>6026203
Every axiomatic definition of the naturals ever has included 0. I don't think it's even possible to coherently axiomatize "all the numbers with the properties of the naturals but not 0". 0 is the basis of the naturals, it is the natural which is not the successor of any other natural. You need it in there to describe what it means to be a natural number, that we're talking about an infinite series of successor numbers that is only infinite in one direction.

>> No.6028933

>>6027076
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein
>He failed to reach the required standard in several subjects

Can you please stop spreading nonsense?

>> No.6028947 [DELETED] 

>>6028933
>He failed to reach the required standard in several subjects, mainly in French, but obtained exceptional grades in physics and mathematics
>but obtained exceptional grades in physics and mathematics
>obtained exceptional grades in mathematics

also

>French
>hard science

can you please learn to read?

>> No.6028949

>>6028933
>He failed to reach the required standard in several subjects, mainly in French, but obtained exceptional grades in physics and mathematics
>but obtained exceptional grades in physics and mathematics
>obtained exceptional grades in mathematics

also

>French
>hard science

can you please learn to read mr bumpspammer?

>> No.6028992
File: 309 KB, 1030x1214, Einstein.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6028992

>>6028949
Einstein himself admitted being a failure at math.

>> No.6028998 [DELETED] 

>>6028992
>using Zeidler
top top top top top top top lel

>> No.6029110

>>6028933
>He failed to reach the required standard in several subjects
"several subjects" -> Maybe, but I was replying to

>>6026091
>Einstein failed math at elementary school
which is the urban legend.
Pic related. 6 was the best grade.
Tell me more. I fear that quoting a small piece of a wiki page is not sufficient...


>>6028949
Yes, we say "hard science". The "soft science" people don't like it :).
>muh "economic science", "sociological and social science" --> nope. "flabby science", at most.

>>6028992
Uh... yes, he defined himself as a physician, not as a mathematician (he wasn't). Math was more a tool for him. That's doesn't make him a total retard/failure.

"He frequently needing to solicit the aid of mathematicians to double check his work, as well as to help him formalize his theoretical ideas into the language of mathematics."

"This, however, had nothing to do with being poor at mathematics; he simply wasn’t a mathematician and was often dealing with very advanced topics in mathematics that only mathematicians were generally proficient at."

"Even in these cases though, he typically picked up what he needed to know very quickly from the mathematicians who helped him."

--> extract from a small paper written by a journalist who contacted his colleagues after his death.

>> No.6029114
File: 1.27 MB, 1479x2419, g.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6029114

>>6029110
My bad.

>> No.6029189

>>6029110

I guarantee he never described himself as a physician.

>> No.6029211

>>6027271
you can just define 1 as the number, that has no fiber under the succesor map

>> No.6029224

>>6022695
You're an odd one.

>> No.6029487

>>6029189
>I guarantee
you're his grand-son ? :D

His nobel prize was an award for the "best cooker" or what ?
His papers were related to physics (theoretical), not to math. Maybe he didn't considered himself as a physicist (I never read a biography of him), but that's the most important field he contributed to.

I think that's what he meant. (>>6029110)

>> No.6029538

>>6025389
>saying imaginary numbers don't exist
>implying any number exists

>> No.6029561

>>6022774
> Saying "first" when you only have one point

>> No.6029568

Oranges, lime and lemons are genetically identical and only differ in ripeness; they are all fruits of the citrus tree.

>> No.6030506

>>6028998
>recognizing a pop sci book

Shame on you.

>> No.6031409

>>6029568
Thank you; I didn't know that.

>> No.6032350

>>6029110
>intentionally confusing physician and physicist

troll/10

>> No.6032391

Doing mathematics without a 0 is like programming without a return key.

>> No.6032392
File: 5 KB, 182x195, 1372180979755.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6032392

>>6022706
>>6022711

LEAVE THE FRUITS ALONE

>> No.6032411

>>6022715
Biologically; anything that comes from a plant with pulp and seed(s) inside of it is a fruit.
Culinary; Cucumbers, Squashes, Tomatoes, Peppers and such are Vegetables.

>> No.6032488

If nothing is a concept and concepts are something then nothing is not nothing. And if nothing is not nothing then what is the thing that is nothing? We have a shortage of one nothing! Who took our nothing? We must track them down and make them pay!

>> No.6032560
File: 47 KB, 480x371, converse high tops.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6032560

0 is not a number it is that against which numbers (and every other man conceived construct) reflects. If you stand with your nose against a tree, you cannot claim to see a tree... But if you stand back a little you see the tree... You have to be not the tree in order to account for the tree. Similarly, there must be no-thing or nothing or 0 for you to take note of any number. 0 is not a number, it is infinitely more important... It is that against which all things reflect and can therefore be recognized... It is god.... In a human beings advanced mind it is what we call consciousness.

>> No.6032608

Hard but doable?

>> No.6032680

>>6029189
Of course not, he was a physicist not a doctor.

>> No.6032911

>>6032350
no, french/10

I didn't know there was a difference.
Maybe it created un-wanted confusions.

>> No.6032915

>>6032911
mmmh, OK.
Thanks to this wonderful google translate, I must admit I wrote a pretty dumb thing :)

>> No.6032962

>>6029211
but you need the 0 identity in order to prove shit like cancellation and subtraction

>> No.6034068

>>6032391
Unless you're using a shitty language like python, you can write all your code in one line; only seperates by semicolons;

>> No.6034110

OP, you should tell wikipedia about this. They think it's a number.

>> No.6034126
File: 335 KB, 600x338, zero.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6034126

Zero is an ideal.

>> No.6035102

>>6034126
No, it's an operator.

>> No.6035103

>>6034110
that isn't what he said lol

>> No.6035809

>>6034110
Actually they say zero is both a number and a numerical digit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero

>> No.6036918

>>6029487
>His nobel prize was an award for the "best cooker" or what ?

His noble prize was awarded for photoelectric effect and not for relativity.

>> No.6036927

>>6027095
/thread

>> No.6037760

>>6035809
I ain't never seen no numerical digit that wasn't a number.

>> No.6038304

>>6036918
who said the contrary ?
both subjects are physics subjects.

there was a confusion between physician/physicists made by a non-native speaker, that's all.

>> No.6039560

>>6037760
In higher maths such an object exists.

>> No.6039849

>>6039560
But is it a real object or a transcendental object?

>> No.6040898

>>6034126
Zero is an idea.

>> No.6040917

>People misreading "0 isn't an even number." as "0 isn't even a number."

Are you all retarded, or am I missing out on the latest epik joke?

>> No.6041284

>>6040917
We're just having a little fun replying to the silly statement.

10-1=9
therefore
0=9
and nine is an even number.
Because you can divide it evenly into two 4½s. QED

>> No.6041341
File: 65 KB, 500x375, fascinating.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6041341

>>6039560
Please explain

>> No.6042539

>>6039849
What is the difference?

>> No.6043565

>>6041284
>therefore
>0=9

Dafuq am I reading?

>> No.6044844

>>6041341
You wouldn't understand; it involves higher quantum maths.

>> No.6045387

>>6039849
It is an "imaginary" object.

>> No.6045418
File: 23 KB, 480x340, kinghyrulesigh.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6045418

>>6022813
>Spec(Z)
>curve

Grothendieck pls go

>> No.6045487

>>6029114
what subject is 5?

>> No.6045489

-2 even -1 odd 0 even 1 odd 2 even

myth busted

>> No.6046687

>>6045487
There are many subjects in which he only scored 5.

>> No.6046735

>>6046687
I think he means number five, which is geschichte. Which translates to history.

>> No.6047404

>>6046735
Geschichte is a six.

>> No.6049170

>>6047404
And Geographie is a four.

>> No.6050362

>>6049170
And he only scored 3 in french. Proof of him not being a genius.

>> No.6050837

zero isn't even a number

>> No.6050838

thats odd

>> No.6050841

>>6022695
Definition of even:

An integer such that x = 2k

(Low level proof, I'm new to these)

Prove that the product of any two even numbers, is even.

proof:
Let M and N be any integer
Let M and N be even
Notice that M = 2L
Notice that N = 2F

Since M * N = 2L * 2F
Notice that M * N = 2(L*F)
Let (L*F) be T, then T is an integer because the product or sum of two integers is an integer.

Therfore M * N = 2T, which is even, as required.

New to proofs, don't be hatin

>> No.6050906 [DELETED] 

>>6050837
You did not prove that the product of any two numbers is a number.

>> No.6050909

>>6050841
You did not prove that the product of any two numbers is a number.

>> No.6052624

>>6050909
He was talking about integers and not numbers.

>> No.6053529

>>6052624
He is trying to prove that the product of any two even numbers is even. What I wrote is the first step.

>> No.6055072

>>6053529
He uses letters instead of numbers.

>> No.6055949

>>6026181
>>6026203
>>6027271
And this is why I use "nonnegative integers" (for including 0) and "positive integers" (for excluding 0) rather than "natural numbers".

Traditionally natural numbers start from 1, and most older theorems are based on this definition. 0 started to be defined as a natural number much more recently.

Also, 0 is an even number.

>> No.6056328

>>6055072
Excellent point. Another fatal flaw in the proof.

>> No.6056355
File: 32 KB, 200x161, .png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6056355

>>6022695
Trivia:

0 isn't even a number.

>> No.6057853

>>6022706
What about grapefruits?

>> No.6058800

>>6056355
Yes. That is what the OP wrote.

>> No.6059971

>>6057853
Grapefruit is a vegetable and not a fruit. Common misconception.

>> No.6059982

>>6059971
what about grapenuts? are they a nut or a legume like the humble peanut? or are they in fact a grape?

also, if olives grow on a vine, why isn't there olive wine?

>> No.6060827

>>6059982
Nuts are neither fruits nor vegetables.

>> No.6061748

>>6060827
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nut_%28fruit%29
>A nut is a fruit composed of a hard shell and a seed

>> No.6062924

>>6029538
Natural numbers exist in nature.

>> No.6064014

>>6062924
That's why they were given the name "natural".

>> No.6064903

>>6061748
Hard shells and seeds are not fruits.

>> No.6065952

>>6064903
They are.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fruit

>> No.6066007

Does 0 exist in nature?

>> No.6067276

>>6066007
The energy of empty space is exactly zero.

>> No.6067617

>>6067276
By the uncertainty principle its momentum must be infinite. But its mass is zero.

>p=m*v

So what is its velocity?

>> No.6067691

>>6067276
Scholar/non-scientific uni-attendant detected

>> No.6068684

>>6067691
How is it wrong?

>> No.6069588

>>6067617
Uncertainty is a measurement error and not a principle.

>> No.6069989

>>6069588
It's a measurement error so frustrating that it became principle.

>> No.6070104

>>6022736
Yet it is defined as NOT an even number.

>> No.6070243

>>6070104
Mathematicians are ignorant, man.

>> No.6070967

>>6069989
I hope some day we can overcome the uncertainty.

>> No.6070978

yes and no 0 is a number because it is the only thing that separates the odd #s from the Evens otherwize there would be no difference between the two, the no side of the arguement is that it has no value in numerical terms

>> No.6071008

>>6022695
math is made by humans, it could just have been something else entirely. you gotta think outside and realize this.

>> No.6071208

>>6062924
>>6029538
>>6025389

Gentlemen, please:

Mathematics is a catalog of mathematical objects and their properties.

There are many entries in that catalog: natural numbers, rational numbers, irrational numbers, real numbers, transcendental numbers, imaginary numbers, complex numbers, Cantorian transfinite cardinal numbers, and many others.

Every entry in that catalog "exists" just as much as any other entry.

Words such as "irrational" and "imaginary" are only technical mathematical jargon, and must never interpreted to have the meanings they have in everyday English.

The only difference between the various types of numbers is how useful they are for certain classes of problems. The non-negative integers are sufficient if all you need is to count the number of elements in finite sets. The IEEE 754 subset of the rational numbers is (usually) sufficient if you are implementing arithmetic in computer hardware. Complex numbers are sufficient if you are modeling impedance in AC electrical circuits. And so on.

From a pure math perspective, none of these number systems is any more or less "important" than any other. They are just used in different problem domains, and nobody needs to think of any of them as being "superior" or "inferior" in any way. They're just tools, nothing else.

God, I wish every high school student got this drilled into their heads. It would eliminate so much confusion. C'mon teachers, step up and explain all of this clearly and explicitly to your classes. It only takes like 5 minutes.

>> No.6071723

>>6071008
>math is made by humans
It is observed in Nature.

>> No.6072129

>>6068684
No such thing as empty space containing zero amount of energy. Either it exists and posses energy or it's just an abstract concept, which doesn't exist in nature.

>> No.6072131

>>6071208
> implying anyone gives a fuck about anything but one's profit
> this naive

>> No.6072176

>>6071723
pfft. where?

>> No.6072214

>>6072176
He means the magazine. Lots of smart symbols there, lemme tell ya.

>> No.6072701

>>6072129
How much energy is stored in empty space?

>> No.6073557

>>6072701
There is a dangerous amount.

>> No.6073773

>>6072701
About 73%. Quite a coincidence.

>> No.6074867

>>6073773
What about the other 26%?

>> No.6075837

>>6074867
Atoms. "Organic" atoms make 0.003%. Almost whole other 26% is hydrogen and helium. Hope you can logically induce how much make heavier atoms.

>> No.6076306

>>6075837
There are free particles.

>> No.6076333

>>6076306
Part of them are massless, part of them is manifested in even lower mass percentage, than 0.003.

>> No.6077382

>>6075837
What is an organic atom?

>> No.6077398

>>6077382
I think he's only talking about carbon.

>> No.6077482

>>6029110
lol imagine having Einstien ask you for maths help. They would have to rewrite physics in order to describe the size of my ego.

>> No.6077567

>>6077398
No, it's six (or so) basic elements organic compounds have the highest tendency to have. Carbon, Hydrogen, Oxygen, Nitrogen, Chlorine and the last one I always forget. It also may be other way around with Cl, if my list is from most common to least common.

>> No.6078528

>>6077567
Where do we have chlorine?

>> No.6078550

>>6023467
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVUs5Qq4_EE

>> No.6079653

Thank you. I didn't know this.

>> No.6080096

>>6078528
In the meds we're swallowing every day.

>> No.6081570

>>6077567
You forgot fluorine. It's in the water.

>> No.6082420

>>6077482
>lol imagine having Einstien ask you for maths help.

This is how Hilbert must have felt.

>> No.6082626

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/0_(number)#In_mathematics

But muh wikipedias

>> No.6082665

>>6022695
>>6070104
>>6070243
You're all fucking wrong, literally every mathematician on this planet agrees that 0 is an even number. The most common definition for the evens is {2k : k in Z}, of which 0 is very much a member.

>> No.6082724

>>6082665
k can't equal 2k.

>> No.6082741

>>6032411
What about Strawberries?

>> No.6082749

Next you'll say infinity isn't even

>> No.6083520

>>6082741
Strawberries are fruit too.

>> No.6083558

seriously how can O be a number....O is a letter DUH

>> No.6083560

NARUTO IS THE BEST VEGETABLE!!!!!!! :) :) :)

>> No.6083561

>>6083558
>pronouncing zero as oh
pls go

>> No.6084314

>>6083560
What is a "naruto"?

>> No.6085610

>>6082724
What if k=0?

>> No.6086807

>>6085610
k has to be an integer

>> No.6086822

>>6086807
0 is an integer

>> No.6088141

>>6086822
This depends on your definition of integers.

>> No.6089322

>>6086822
Did you not read OP? Zero isn't even a number.

>> No.6090277

>>6078550
That video was upsetting, offensive and not funny.

>> No.6091583

>>6090277
It should be taken down.

>> No.6092500

Of course it isn't a number. It's only a symbol _representing_ a number.

>> No.6093521

I did not know this.

>> No.6094590

>>6022900
That's not a sequence.

>> No.6095901

Trivia:

0 is an even number.

>> No.6097150

>>6095901
OP said the opposite.

>> No.6098055

>>6022700
It's a superposition of colors.

>> No.6098938

>>6022711
That's right. Tomatoes are vegetables.

>> No.6100405

>>6098938
Tomatoes are fruit AND vegetable.