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/sci/ - Science & Math


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5903065 No.5903065 [Reply] [Original]

A two part question to determine if you "think like a mathematician," from Prof. Eugene Luks, Bucknell University, circa 1979.

Part I: You're in a room that is empty except for a functioning stove and a tea kettle with tepid water in it sitting on the floor. How do you make hot water for tea?

Part II: Next, you're in another room that is empty except for a functioning stove and a tea kettle with tepid water in it sitting on a table. How do you make hot water for tea?

>> No.5903074

I- I put the kettle on the stove and turn it on.

II- I put the kettle on the stove, and turn it on.

I know what you're expecting, but a mathematician is smarter than playing your little games

>> No.5903083

>>5903074
Incorrect but good effort.

>> No.5903091

>>5903083
>incorrect
mathematicians don't know how to make tea

>> No.5903104

1. I put the kettle on the stove and turn it on.
2. I put the kettle on the floor. Then I apply step 1.

>> No.5903103

bump

>> No.5903106

>>5903104
Sorry but no.

What's wrong? I thought /sci/ had some smart folks on it?

>> No.5903108

>>5903106
>Retard walks into a college class
>Retard says "bwdgb wbsa"
>Nobody understands shit
>Retard gets offended

>> No.5903109

>>5903106
He's right though.

>> No.5903110

1. You don't
2. You don't.
The room is empty except for a table, a stove, and a tea kettle. There is no teabag, therefore you can only make hot water and not hot water for tea.

>> No.5903117

>>59031065
No source of electricity for stove?

>> No.5903121

>>5903065

Okay, well there has to be something significant between these two circumstances. The only difference is the table.

>functioning

I take that to mean that it needs no form of ignition

>a tea kettle with tepid water in it sitting on the floor.

Tea kettle on the floor, stove also on the floor

>sitting on the table.

both on the table.

Put kettle onto cooker and ignite in both instances

>> No.5903118

Here's the 4chanian way: gtfy
http://to-count-the-stars.blogspot.fr/2012/05/thinking-like-physicist.html

>> No.5903124

>>5903118
Also, OP is a douche for not accepting >>5903104
's answer since he had the idea.

>> No.5903126

>to determine if you "think like a mathematician,"

1)
>see kettle on the floor (wat)
>see stove
>think "fuck this is too easy, I need to use unnecessary rigour and make this more complicated than it actually is"
>let the stove be a compact metric space
>let the kettle be Reimann zeta function
<span class="math">\zeta (s) = \sum_{n=1}^{\infty } \frac{1}{n^s} ~ \forall s\in\mathbb{C}[/spoiler]
>prove that the real part of any non-trivial zero of the Riemann zeta function is 1/2.
>spend 30 years trying to solve the problem
>go insane and jump out the window

2)
>walk in the room
>jump out the window

>> No.5903129

>>5903110

but it doesn't say anything about having to have teabags

you put the kettle on the stove, and eventually it will be hot enough to make tea in. doesn't matter if you have the bag or not

>> No.5903132

>>5903124
Also, wikipedia's version is better: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teakettle_principle

>> No.5903140

>>5903083
Is the answer you want for step 2 "go sit on the table, now invoke step 1"?

>> No.5903146

A physicist, a biologist and a mathematician are sitting in a street café watching people entering and leaving the house on the other side of the street. First they see two people entering the house. Time passes. After a while they notice three people leaving the house. The physicist says, "The measurement wasn't accurate." The biologist says, "They must have reproduced." The mathematician says, "If one more person enters the house then it will be empty."

Explain plox

>> No.5903147

>>5903129
But "for tea" implies that the hot water will be used to make tea. You cannot make tea without a teabag and teabags seem to be lacking from this problem.

>> No.5903151

>>5903146
2 - 3 = -1
-1 + 1 = 0

>> No.5903159

>>5903147

no, it says you're making hot water for tea, not that you're making tea

>> No.5903155

>>5903147

2 people in 3 people out

that means there's - 1 person

+ 1 person - 1 person = 0 people

>> No.5903162

What is a 'tea kettle'?

If I put my kettle onto my stove it would melt and shit would get fucked up. Is yours one of those metal non-electrical pots that old people put on arguers?

>> No.5903165

>>5903159
Then what's the "for tea" for? Why didn't he just say "how do you make hot water" and leave it at that?

>> No.5903166

>>5903146
Do you not understand addition?

>> No.5903172

>>5903155
Negative numbers don't exist in reality. There are no negative people.

>> No.5903174

>>5903165

so people like you would fail the test.

tl:dr you don't think like a mathematician

>> No.5903177

>>5903174
Well obviously I think like a rational person instead.

>> No.5903181

>>5903177

no, because by your logic, the room is empty except for a tea kettle with water and a stove and you. there's no air, so you die of suffocation

>> No.5903188

>>5903172
that seems like a negative attitude.

>> No.5903190

>>5903155
What happens when a negative person made of lava collides with a positive person made of ice????????????????????????

>> No.5903195

You boil it

>> No.5903191
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5903191

>>5903172

>> No.5903194

>>5903181
Well there's another reason why this question is stupid. How can you call yourself a mathematician when you can't even define the room to be full of air at the beginning?
Too many variables 0/10 would not solve

>> No.5903205

The answer requires a bit of meta, mathematicians can never agree on the correct way to solve a problem.

>> No.5903221

>>5903205

mathematicians have to make assumptions in order to simplify real life to mathematical approximations

it's fine to say w/e you want as long as you justify it. anon's argument about my question being wrong because i'm assuming things is wrong because he's assuming things whereas i'm not

>> No.5903231

>>5903065
>
I cannot solve either problem as I do not have a temperature that you consider hot.

>> No.5903249

>>5903231

you're wrong, because you're assuming you need water to be hot to make tea

water doesn't need to be hot to make tea, but the problem specifically says it's hot enough to make tea. it doesn't matter if you know or not, just that it's possible to warm the tea sufficiently

>> No.5903451

>>5903231
Who said I am the judge of that?

>> No.5903485

Do I also have tea leaves? Otherwise making hot water is kind of a waste of time.

>> No.5903590

>>5903065
I. You heat up water
II. You heat up water

>> No.5903606

>>5903146
The house is empty. For 3 people to exit there must have already been 1 person in there.

>> No.5903612

>>5903065
1. there is no tea
2. there is no tea
fuck your flawed questions

>> No.5903774

>>5903249
No YOU are wrong it specifically says HOT tea but what temputure is hot?

>> No.5903779

It specifically states that there are only specific objects in the room, and then excludes you from said room.

>> No.5903798

>>5903126
I'm a maths Ph. D. student, and I can assure you that this man is correct.

>> No.5903812

>>5903612
Beat me to it.

>> No.5903814

I. Prove the existence of the stove, kettle, water, floor, and room.

II. Prove they are unique.

>> No.5903824

From the wikipedia:

> the mathematician will throw out the water – "reducing the problem to a previously solved problem".

HOLY SHIT

I literally do this EVERY SINGLE MORNING, my moms leaves the kettle with water in it but I always throw it out and put in new water!

Does this mean I can become a really good mathmatician. ( I am not even trolling _

>> No.5903825

>>5903065
>empty except [list of stuff that doesn't include air]
(I) There's no air. You suffocate.
(II) There's still no air. Too busy suffocating to make tea.

>> No.5903832
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5903832

>>5903065
So, the argument is you can't make hot water for tea if you don't have something to create the tea?

Tell me why this isn't on

>>>/phi/

Also, fuck it.

>take off shirt
>put in tea kettle
>make shirt tea

1/tea because fuck you OP.

>> No.5903866

>>5903832
>Poor Gary wants to be considered a genius only because he had an Exeggutor.

>> No.5903886

>>5903065
Throw out the water in the tea kettle the second time to reduce it to a previously solved problem