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/sci/ - Science & Math

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5765547 No.5765547 [Reply] [Original]

How would a circle look like if pi was exactly 3.

>> No.5765550

A Lotus. Welcome to the Bible.

>> No.5765551
File: 7 KB, 544x660, ok.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5765551

best I can do OP

>> No.5765559

>>5765547

a hexagon

>> No.5765560
File: 10 KB, 361x353, 34377.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5765560

broken

>> No.5765561

well... that's kinda disappointing. I didn't know what I expected.
Any other opinions on that?

>> No.5765568

>>5765547
curved surface anyone?

>> No.5765571

>>5765568

what is the general formula for circles drawn on the surface of a sphere?

>> No.5765572

>>5765550
lol
Solomonic Temple humor always gets me.

>> No.5765574

>>5765561
It doesn't really make sense to construct a circle which doesn't have pi as it's diameter. Pi is a measurement, so when you try to make a "circle" with pi = 3, you'll either get something that isn't a circle or you break the rules of V = pi*r^2 and C = 2pi*r

>> No.5765575
File: 14 KB, 356x356, 1316450348102.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5765575

>>5765574
>Pi as it's diameter.
Sorry, I meant the ratio of the circumference to the diameter.

>> No.5765576

>>5765574
What if I tell you not every circle hast pi as a diameter.
And the whole point of my question was to break those rules.

>> No.5765577

>>5765575
That was close :P

>> No.5765582

wats a Gommunist?

>> No.5765588

>>5765582

It's how jews pronounce communist.

>> No.5765591

>>5765588
Jews invented Communism. Therefor Communism confirmed for being pronounced as "Gommunism".

>> No.5765593

>>5765576
>not every circle hast pi as a diameter.
Then it would not be a circle, it would be oblong.

>> No.5765598

>>5765593
why would it be oblong? If the diameter of every circle was pi, then there would be only one size of circles that's all imho

>> No.5765602

>>5765598
pi is a ratio, not a measurement.

>> No.5765607

>>5765602
but the diameter has a measurement. So if you want it to be pi, you have to use pi with a unit of measurement.

>> No.5765605

In another universe where the laws of nature are different. It might look like a circle and work like a circle but when we measure it, the ratio between circumference and radius will come out as the value '3'.

If pi was equal to 3, then a circle would look like any old circle and (In our universe) would have a ratio between the radius and circumference of 3.1415926535... Which would most likely be denoted with another symbol.

In our universe, a 'circle' with a ratio between C and R of 3 would not be a circle. It's like asking what a square with five sides looked like; it's not a fucking square.

>> No.5765610

>>5765605
and that's the whole point. How would it look in our universe?

>> No.5765615

pi = circumference / radius

As the radius approaches infinity, the circumference approaches infinity.

infinity / infinity = 1

pi = 1

>> No.5765645

>>5765615
Actually it's pi = circumference / 2*radius and therefore p = 1/2

>> No.5765650

>>5765615
actually the circumference approaches infinity faster than the radius

>> No.5765658

>>5765610

It wouldn't be a circle. Anything else has an inconsistent radius. It wouldn't look like anything because it cannot exist.

>> No.5765661
File: 618 KB, 630x426, laughing wolf.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5765661

>>5765615
>he thinks infinity/infinity is 1!

>> No.5765668

>>5765615
>infinity / infinity = 1

false

>> No.5765672

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbier%27s_theorem

tl;dr

If something has constant diameter, the ratio of that diameter to its circumference is always pi.

A shape like you are suggesting OP cannot exist in the laws of mathematics, unless it were not a whole shape, or had a varying diameter.

>> No.5765675

The ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter can in fact be different from three in non-Euclidean geometry. For instance, on the surface of a sphere, the ratio can be anything from zero up to but excluding pi -- including 3.

>> No.5765677

>>5765615

infinity / infinity =/= 1

>> No.5765706

>>5765661
That isn't a wolf so your argument is invalid and thus he is right.

>> No.5765707

>>5765677
>>5765668
So ∞≠∞ thus 1≠1

Nice going, idiots.

>> No.5767179

It would look the same but we would no longer be counting in base 10. It would have to be some new base where 3 = ratio of diameter to circumference.

>> No.5767207

http://math.stackexchange.com/questions/254620/pi-in-arbitrary-metric-spaces/264312#264312
<span class="math">\pi[/spoiler] can't equal 3, but it CAN equal 4.

>> No.5767209

>>5765707

Infinity is not a number, numbskull. It's a limit.

>> No.5767211

Guys, <span class="math">\pi[/spoiler] can be 3.

It will just no longer be useful in describing circles and it's old value will simply be assigned to a new character.

/thread

>> No.5767213

>>5765607
You don't have to know it's measurement.

>> No.5767216
File: 46 KB, 574x574, pi-4.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5767216

how can pi equal 3 when it is already 4.

>> No.5767217

>>5767216

>area if the box is more than the area of the circle
>box =/= circle

Well, that was easy.

>> No.5767235

>>5767216
haven't seen that troll in a long time.

>> No.5767256

>>5767216
>diagonal and curved lines were created by the devil

>> No.5767261 [DELETED] 

>>5765547
Rephrasing the question so it makes sense.
What is the regular 2-dimension n-gon with maximal diameter 2 and perimeter 3?
Give n minimal if multiple such n-gons exists.

>> No.5767265 [DELETED] 

>>5767261
>What is the regular 2-dimension n-gon with maximal diameter less than 2 and perimeter 3?

Fixed that to ensure existence.
Of course now there will certainly be multiple such examples.

>> No.5767277

If you collapse a circle into a line then pi = 2

>> No.5767302

just draw it on a non-euclidean surface, jesus christ

>> No.5767311

>>5765615
WOW

>> No.5767348

>>5765615
>>5767216
Am I seeing a pattern here that using infinity to prove things is bad? Or just a coincidence?

>> No.5767363
File: 284 KB, 548x1178, 426-troll-math[1].png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5767363

>>5767348
Naive use of infinity is bad. If you carefully define what you're talking about first, it's not so much of a problem.

>> No.5767439
File: 11 KB, 548x511, wat.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5767439

Like a thing that gets folded and overlaps itself

I can't brain the concept

>> No.5767683

>>5767439
Sorry but that pic is utter shit. I think you've made a boo boo, because you've still got a circle with a radius r... Are you telling me that the base of a standard cone doesn't have circumference 2(pi)r?

>> No.5767927
File: 423 KB, 800x276, 800px-2pi-unrolled.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5767927

it would be broken

>> No.5768024 [DELETED] 

(sin((2pi/n)/2)*n)=3
solve for n, if you take a limit as n approaches inf you get pi.

n is the number of sides, solve for n and that is how many sides an ngon with a ratio of 3 has, not a circle tho.

>> No.5768037

If you changed the value of Pi to three then you just need to ajust the value of 1 to an irrational number near .955 and all the equations will continue to work out the same.

>> No.5768052

pi:=3
sin(6/n)=6/n
>solve for n
how?

>> No.5768056
File: 5 KB, 308x362, long_circle.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5768056

Here you go OP. It's a circle, just a tall circle.

>> No.5768059

>>5768056
its circumference is still relative to pi

>> No.5768153
File: 5 KB, 308x362, dDC.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5768153

>tall circle

d=?

>> No.5768216

>>5768153
d = 502537pi/1739450 or 0.907623988822357598980

>> No.5768236

It would look like a hexagon.

>> No.5768247
File: 20 KB, 834x520, Untitled.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5768247

>> No.5768289

>>5768247
How did you get that <span class="math">O=6a[/spoiler]?

>> No.5768309

>>5768289
am i being rused?

it's a hexagon

every little line inside it equals a

circumference = 6 lines = 6 a's

>> No.5768312
File: 65 KB, 682x335, maxtrolling.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5768312

pi varies if a circle is drawn on bent space time

>> No.5768319

>>5768312
We are already living in curved space-time, so pi not being equal to 3 is a result of the universe's curvature.

>> No.5768357

>>5767348

there's this careful handling of infinity that is teached in Calc I and function analysis. Basically, infinity/infinity is indeterminate for multiple reasons, one of them being that "which infinity is bigger?"

infinity over infinity is not necessarily = 1

However, we're not intimidated by infinity. There are procedures such that you can solve indeterminate forms such as (inf/inf), (1/0) and more.

>> No.5770270

>>5768247
never seen it like this. this actually makes sense

>> No.5770282

If Pi was equal to 3, that would mean that our space is more curved than it actually is.
I don't even know if life could develop in such a space.

>> No.5770306

>>5768357
n/Infinity brings the same results as
n/0
Discuss
If I'm right I should have kept on math because i guessed that when i was 13 or so

>> No.5770335

>>5768357
Infinity never actually appears in calculus, it's just shorthand for "there is no limit and the function grows (or decreases) as the input grows".

>> No.5770430

>>5770306
No, n/infinity is = 0 for all finite n
n/0 is undefined for all finite n.
the limit of some function h(x)= f(x)/g(x) as it approaches some c such that h(c) = infinity/infinity or 0/0 is equal to (if certain conditions are satistifed) f'(c)/g'(c).

>> No.5772589

>>5770306
>imagine a number that is infinitely small
Isn't that just nothing at all?

Ha, a rhyme.

Also, dividing is not a valid thing you may do to the number 0, by definition

>> No.5772595

>>5765547
Whatever it looked like, it wouldn't be able to exist in flat 2-d space.

>> No.5772659

ok there is some confusion here.

pi is always increasing due to the expansion of the universe. back when god created the universe pi was 3.. since it has expanded a little bit

>> No.5772662

>>5765547
Draw a circle on the side of a sphere. Goddamn.

>> No.5772664

>>5765551
a cake?

>> No.5772689

>>5765547
How would a circle look like if 1 = 2?

>> No.5772710

Could we bend space enough to make a circle where pi=3?

>> No.5772728

>>5772710
Bend what? We're talking about mathematics.

>> No.5772735

>>5772728
>niggas don't know about my 2D euclidean planes projected onto curved 3D spaces.

>> No.5772776

>>5772735
>bitches don't know about my Riemann sufaces

>> No.5772890

It depends on what else was changed to make it such. For instance, taxicab geometry has a circle that's also a square. I think it would make sense to at least be an equivalent to that for triangular and hexagonal grids as well, and expect the equivalent of pi is three for one of them, but I'm not sure which.

>> No.5772901

>>5767216
>>5767348
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2xYjiL8yyE&list=UUOGeU-1Fig3rrDjhm9Zs_wg&index=26

>> No.5772920

>>5772776
I got that bitch a Klein bottle. Bitches love Klein bottles.

>> No.5773240

so this couldn't exist in a 2D space?

>> No.5773340
File: 9 KB, 358x141, non-euclidian.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5773340

>>5765547
http://www.uic.edu/classes/phil/phil105nh/105lectures/105lecture09.html

>> No.5773359

You use pi to work out the circumference and area of a circle. So changing the value of pi would only change your value of your C and A. The shape of a circle, or in my head, is the equation of a circle (x+y)^2-r^2. So you'd need to change the formula of a circle to change the shape of a circle.

>> No.5773395

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicab_geometry

In this, a circle of radius 1 has a diameter of 8.

>> No.5773422
File: 7 KB, 700x553, pi=3.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
5773422

If π really equaled 3 wouldn't we just redefine a circle.

>> No.5773426

>>5773395
I only knew this as a heuristic function

>> No.5774877

>>5768247
That's wrong. The diameter is 2a only from corner to corner.

>> No.5774882

It would look like a fucking circle and the ratio between the circumference and the diameter would not be pi. We'd just use a different symbol for the number 3.1415926... Like theta.

It is literally not possible for a shape with a consistent radius to have a ratio of 3 between the diameter and the circumference. It is not possible to exist. In the same way it's not possible to have a square with five edges.

>> No.5774886

>>5774882

Please note that in this I was referring to euclidean geometry.

>> No.5774887

Assume pi=3.
Consider the statement: pi=3 => for all M subset of R^2 pi=M
We know pi>3.14 and thus pi!=3. Since the first statement in the implication is false, the implication is correct.
We also know pi=3. Since the first statment in the implication is true and the implication itself is correct, the second statement in the implication is correct.
Thus a circle looks however you want it to look.

That's the reason math falls apart immediately, if you find a single contradiction.

>> No.5774900

>>5774887
You're speaking nonsense. Equating line-coordinates with plane-coordinates is but one of your errors.

>> No.5774901

>>5774887

>Muh incompleteness theorem

>> No.5774906

>>5774900
Where am I speaking nonsense? The only mistake is that I accidently typed pi=M, where I meant for any circle C C=M.

>> No.5774949

>>5774887
>That's the reason math falls apart immediately, if you find a single contradiction.
Because we explicitly assume it will.

>> No.5775010

The circle would look like it was on the surface of a sphere, that way the radius (which is curved) could be longer than normal keeping a certain circumference. This can be generalized to any curved surface to get any pi.

>> No.5775012

>>5765547

not necessarily broken...

if you alter the topology of reality so that instead of being flat we are on the equivalent of a sphere we can increase the radius so that the circle is still closed at pi=3.

>> No.5775019

>>5775010

Nonsense. A circle on the surface of a sphere looks like a circle. You're trying to talk around curved space, which would still look like normal space to us if we were in it. So the circle would still look like a circle, and its C/D value would be 3.

>> No.5775033

>>5775019
how can it look like a normal circle if it's C/D value is 3, if you assume you are part of the curved space then you would already compensate for this and get the expected value of C/D=pi.