/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.5615063]

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/13/business/global/japan-says-it-is-first-to-tap-methane-hydrate-deposit.html

>Technology has put the total amount of methane hydrate in the waters surrounding Japan at more than 7 trillion cubic meters, or what researchers have long said is closer to 100 years’ worth of Japan’s natural gas needs.

So is japan going to be to the next energy supplier or are they going to fuck us over with by accidentally releasing a shitload of methane in the atmosphere?

[Anonymous No.5615108]

>Are they going to fuck us over with by accidentally releasing a shitload of methane in the atmosphere?

They used to be one of the leading consumers of nuclear energy (clean energy). Whether it's methane or carbon they're putting into the atmosphere, it's disgusting to watch them go back to carbon fuels.

China and India are going nuclear while Japan is being pressured backwards by shitty regulation, old technology, and an ignorant public. I'm less fearful of the short-term environmental effects and more afraid of the socioeconomic effects. I live in California and there is a movement to shut down our nuclear generators citing the Fukushima incident as reasoning. While in China, they're designing new nuclear plants with the emergency pumping water located ON TOP of the plant so that any worker with a pair of arms can turn a valve and flood the system, saving the day.

TL;DR: We're fucked.

[Nuka-Cola; Beta Ray Blue-rasbe(...) No.5615357]

>>5615108
i don't trust china to build anything safe. pressurized water reactors are fine as long as they're built right. built wrong it's just asking for trouble.

worst part is, china will have a meltdown or two and then fission will basically be a dead energy source, china will ruining for everyone else and it sucks

[Anonymous No.5615370]

>>5615357
Here in germany it is already fucked. We have some of the safest reactors but after fukushima they legislated the phase-out. Feels backwards man.

[Anonymous No.5615395]

Possibly retarded question here.
Consider the methane in the permafrost in places like Russia. If this methane is going to be released anyway due to warming (assuming here that we will not be able to slow warming considerably anytime soon), would it not be better from an environmental perspective to preemptively collect this methane, then use it as fuel if the products are only CO2 and water? If I recall, methane causes more warming than CO2 does.

[Anonymous No.5615573]

>>5615395
IIRC after a certain temperature the methane in ground/sea will violently rise up into the atmosphere. Using this or not using the methane will still cause this to happen. The way I see it we would need to dramatically reduce the CO2 in the atmosphere even before considering this to be an option.

So are those CO2 capturing artificial trees out on the market yet?

[Anonymous No.5615600]

>So is japan going to be to the next energy supplier

You mean Area 11?

JIBUN WOOOOO, SEKAI SAE MO

[Anonymous No.5615980]

>>5615063
>So is japan going to be to the next energy supplier?

I highly doubt it. From what I can gather these fuels require different infrastructure than coal/oil power plants. I doubt they will be able to pitch it to more than a few countries. But domestic, it'll be big.

>>5615370
>Feels backwards man.
/thread

>>5615600
KAETE SHIMAISOU NA! SHUUNKAN WA ITSUMO SUGU SOBA NIIIIIIIIIII!~

[Anonymous No.5616030]

>>5615600
>>5615980
I lol'd. Thanks, gaiz.
ALL HAIL BRITANNIA!!

[Anonymous No.5616065]

Cheap natural gas from shale is going to kill that technology pretty quickly, especially since LNG technology is making it easier to ship.

[Anonymous No.5616079]

>>5615063
It doesn't matter how much gas there is in the waters around Japan, it matters how quickly and cheaply they can extract and process it. If it can't keep up with their energy demand, either in quantity or at price, then it's going to be a stopgap measure at best.

Methane releases and carbon fuel emissions are the least of their worries until this program gets off the ground.

[Anonymous No.5616157]

>>5615370
I feel you brah, I wouldn't want my country to be that stupid

[Anonymous No.5616161]

So we're finally harvesting methane hydrate from the deep? And minerals too recently, and there's those farms in Hawaii. We Seaquest now

[Anonymous No.5616170]

>>5616161

[Anonymous No.5616175]

What is the extraction efficiency?
How much is lost during the extraction?
How much energy output is produced for each unit of energy input?

[Anonymous No.5616183]

1 trillion cubic metres of clathrate can power 100 million households for a decade, and japan has at least 50 trillion litres of methane hydrate clathrate reserves.

interestingly, catastrophic methane release is thought to have led to the permian extinction. CH4 replaces most of the O2 in the oceans and the surface of the planet gets covered in a combustible gas mixture 50 metres thick (for a relatively small eruption). Methane release is so far the best explanation for carbon 12-carbon 13 fluctuations in rocks from the end-Permian period.
cite: http://pangea.stanford.edu/research/Oceans/GES205/methaneGeology.pdf
http://palaeo.gly.bris.ac.uk/Essays/wipeout/default.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clathrate_gun_hypothesis
And for the ITS HAPPENING crowd:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/vast-methane-plumes-seen-in-arctic-ocean-as-sea-ice-retreats-6276278.html

enjoy

[Anonymous No.5616203]

>>5615600

I KNOW THAT DICK!