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/sci/ - Science & Math

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3923363 No.3923363 [Reply] [Original]

Is /sci/ environmentally conscious?
vegan and thus moral?
interested in sustainability and our future?

>> No.3923367
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3923367

fuck that shit
carnivores ftw

>> No.3923369

>>3923363

>implying meat isn't GOAT food group

>> No.3923373
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3923373

Think.

>> No.3923374

that chick is fucking hot

>> No.3923377

we didn't spend the last few billion years fighting our way to the top of the food chain to start being vegan.

I never did understand the whole being vegan is moral BS, plants are just as alive as animals. At least people have the morality to kill and cook the animal.

>> No.3923379

Nope, and I don't give a fuck either.

>> No.3923380

>>3923373

citation need for baseless supposition

and mammals > bugs > plants

deal with it

>> No.3923385

>>3923377

plants don't suffer in any coherent way we can detect or even imagine...

animals do suffer in obvious ways, so the difference is a matter of observation

have you seen any peta videos?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YFkOhlpSy4

>> No.3923393

#1 meat is unhealthy, increase heart disease, intestinal issues, etc.

#2 its inefficient to farm, it pollutes

#3 animals are treated like shit, they're covered in tumors and boils and fed antibiotics and hormones, kept in the dark, never get to move out of their cages...beaten and killed inhumanely

why wouldn't you go vegan in 2011 when we know so much

>> No.3923396

>>3923385
Is your only argument the amount of suffering the animal goes through? I will continue eating meat then.

>> No.3923403

>>3923373
am i completely off here or is that final graph the opposite point of the argument? and that the higher 'consciousness to meat ratio' is what you want to save, and be unethical to eat? or am i reading this shit wrong.

and yes, i am scared shitless about our environmental problems, but no, i am not vegan and will not be.

>> No.3923410
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3923410

>>3923385
I suffer in obvious ways when I hunger for meat.

There is a harmonic balance between things that eat and things that are eaten. Humans happen to have fallen, as probably everything that ever will rise to our level, on the eat things side. We never would have developed our large brains without diets high in fat.

>> No.3923413

>>3923396

well unless your a psychopath your position will be inconsistent, morally

since most people are biased towards pets and if they see someone hurt an animal on the street they freak out and call the cops and make videos on youtube and call anyone who hurts animals a monster...then they go eat burgers like nothing happened

im sure you, and most people here suffer from this type of irrational cognitive dissonance and you dont realize it...

only a very small number of you are actual psychopaths who don't understand suffering and dont care about life due to some neurological defect, etc

and there are other reasons, environment, and your own health

so if you value your well-being then you wouldn't eat meat, nothing factory farmed anyway...

>> No.3923418

>>3923403
ah never mind, i just saw that its assuming that those cute animals are 'stupider' than others for some reason not given. dumb comic.

>> No.3923426

>>3923403
The vegan lifestyle will inevitably kill *some* form of conscious animal, therefore they want to maximize the ratio of meat to consciousness.

>> No.3923429

>>3923410
talking about a harmonic balance in nature is a sure sign of environmental ignorance.
just so you know.

>> No.3923432

>>3923403

the graph is moral worth in terms of suffering

mammals have higher worth than insects and insects higher than plants and plants higher than bacteria, etc...

we can directly see and understand the suffering of animals, bugs are harder and plants i dont understand how they can suffer--its only hypothetical in a very baseless way

they exhibit non of the behavior we associate with suffering and they lack the structure we know gives rise to pain/pleasure (CNS)...etc

>> No.3923434

>>3923413
locavore ftw.

>> No.3923435

>>3923413
stick with the environmental, science-based arguments, please.
no wants to argue philosophy

>> No.3923437

>>3923413
That sure was wordy for someone ignoring the fact that most farms don't slaughter animals in an inhumane way. I am completely against the suffering of animals. There's no inconsistency. I will oppose any farm that is cruel to an animal when slaughtering or raising it.

>> No.3923438
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3923438

>>3923429
alright then hot shit, enlighten the world with your secrets.

>> No.3923446

Nope! I don't give a shit about the environment, suffering of the animals and the future sustainability of our species.
When I am dead, the world has ended for me. I live for my own personal enjoyment and entertainment, and I won't sacrifice or let go of anything for any living being. I will continue to eat meat, even if the animals were purposefully tortured for extra bit of flavor, because they taste GOOD, and my own enjoyment will always overweight the suffering of others.

Deal with it, hippie.

>> No.3923448

>>3923437

slaughter is itself inhumane.
you are depriving the animal of their life..

theres no such thing as a humane factory farm, the animals get no exercise, dont go outside, they can barely move in their cages....

if your was forced to live in a factory farm, im sure youd be pissed

>> No.3923451

>>3923438
flux of nature, not balance of nature.
equilibrium steady state theories are long out of fashion. everything is in constant change.

that being said, humans are fucking up the system and huge quantitatively measurable ways that call into question the possibility for continued life in any semblance to what we have seen historically

>> No.3923452

also consider, none of the animals we slaughter would share the same compassion if they needed to feed a species.

>> No.3923454

>>3923446

if you care about yourself then you should care about your body since its the machine that carries your stupid mind and lets you experience the world

factory meat, red meat, saturated fats are unhealthy, tons of science showing this

so even a dumbass like you has reason to avoid meat for purely selfish reasons.

>> No.3923456

>>3923393
Fucktard! Learn to anatomy/biochemistry/physiology/environment/history..

1. Plant source foods are toxic, increase cardiovascular diseases, obesity, diabetes, cancers, etc, etc.

2. Plant based agriculture is wasteful of area, degrades land, pollutes (pesticides, fetilizers, etc) top soil erosion, etc.

3. Humans are treated like shit and people like you couldn't give a fuck because - hurp dem poor chickens never got a chance to live a full life durp.
Personally I don't care if a bird never got to live out its hope and dreams ... I want it to taste tender and delicious.

>> No.3923459

>>3923452
what a shitty argument.

>> No.3923460

>>3923448
Sure is cool of you to cite those peta videos as the status quo for raising animals. That's not how it works.

Why should I care about the life of an animal? They're delicious.

>> No.3923461

>>3923448
Yeah, it's so much better how they'd naturally die. Like starvation, or being eaten alive by a predator. but yeah, we're the immoral bastards giving it an instant death.

>> No.3923463

>>3923452

good thing we dont need to feed our species on animals, and in fact we are hurting our future generations with factory farms they pollute much more than farming fruits/veggies and waste tons of grain feeding animals

overall a waste of calories and efficiency, increased pollution, and increased health problems for our species

no good argument for farming animals

>> No.3923464

>>3923448

We bred those animals for that purpose. They are no longer the wild buffalo of the fields, but our own twisted creation.

Their lives have no purpose but to satisfy our needs. It's either eat them or exterminate them altogether. There is no other way.

>> No.3923466
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3923466

>>3923367
I love this picture so much

>> No.3923470

>>3923448

Well life isn't fair.
Tough shit.
As long as the animals taste good, thy will be killed for our food. Humans are the masters of this planet, and animals are our slaves.
If you have a problem with that then al I got to say to you is:
ABLOO, BLOOO, BLOO!
Go cry me a river, build a bridge over it and jump in to the stream of your delicious greenfag tears.

>> No.3923472

>>3923456
Im agreeing with the first dude on 1 and 2.
eating meat is horribly inefficient. if the whole world was to eat the diet of americans (of which one third is meat) we would need 1.5 earths to produce the necessary biomass.

and in general vegetarians are much healthier, but i dont give a fuck about that. im no vegetarian.

and moral arguments have no place on this board.

>> No.3923473

>>3923461

factory farmed animals wouldn't be here naturally, so they wouldn't suffer in the first place

and yes, animals die in nature, thats how the world works, but we dont need to add to their suffering and magnify it 10x and ruin their lives

a boar that dies by the teeth of a lion at least had freedom in life and could move and reproduce naturally...we artifically inseminate all our animals and keep them trapped and hidden in the dark, only to be tortured and killed like trash

>> No.3923474

>>3923456

Obesity and diabetes are mainly caused by sugar, which is plant based.

Suck a dick, fag.

>> No.3923478

>vegan
I'm vegan because I fucking hate plants and I'm doing my part to destroy their existence and/or turning them into poo.

>> No.3923483

>>3923464
>. It's either eat them or exterminate them altogether. There is no other way.

how about we dont force breed them with artificial insemination into hell holes ?

then there would be no problem...

>> No.3923487

>>3923463
Raising cows is the only way for humans to eat fields of grass. Not to mention humans need meat for a balanced diet.

Also if you knew anything about agriculture raising crops for a modern society is very inefficient. Something like 30-40% of produce that makes it to the store will be eaten. The rest is thrown away or fed to animals that will later be eaten.

>> No.3923488

>>3923473

Maybe they should have thought about that before they failed to master fire.

>> No.3923493

>>3923474
Wrong.

Dietary fat has long been implicated as a driver of insulin resistance. Studies on animals observed significant insulin resistance in rats after just 3 weeks on a high-fat diet.[7] Large quantities of saturated, monounsaturated, and polyunsaturated (omega-6) fats all appear to be harmful to rats to some degree, compared to high-starch chow, but saturated fat appears to be the most effective at producing IR.[8] -wikipedia, learn it

Show me studies that show plants and fruits cause diabetes or promote Insulin resistance....

high fructose corn syrup isn't a natural plant or fruit lol...

no studies support what you imagine

>> No.3923497

>>3923487
animals, on average, convert about 5-10% of what they eat into biomass. there is no fucking way you can argue that eating meat is more efficient.

>> No.3923498

>>3923483
>then there would be no problem...
well... you'd have to find something else to complain about

>> No.3923499

>>3923473
That's not true. You can't say that all animals in factories wouldn't be here, maybe not as many, but there would still be cows/chickens/etc in the wild.

You try and pretend like animals are humans. Cows are some of the most retarded animals around. They have no concept of freedom, they just walk around, try not to get hurt, and eat some grass.

Also don't buy into all that peta bullshit. They make it out like all farms torture and painfully kill the animals when it isn't the case. You let them grow out in a field, gather them up, then go smash their brains in. I live near tons of fields full of cows, they seem perfectly fine and I doubt feel any less that they aren't allowed to cross some fence as long as they're given all the food and water they need.

>> No.3923502

>>3923483

Why bother?

They're already a toy species that can't survive on its own. We may as well exploit them.

>> No.3923503

>>3923454

I don\t care if eating meat is going to cause me to die a few years earlier, I live for ENJOYMENT, it doesn't really matter if few of my senior year will be cut out, as at that point I would be slowly dying anyways.

Meat tastes good, and generally plant food tastes like shit, thus I'll eat meat. I am a hedonistic self obsessed carnivore, and there is nothing you envirofacists can do to stop me.

>> No.3923505

>>3923487

except its a fact that meat farming is much more ineffecient than farming grains, plants, fruits...

you have to feed a cow a shit ton of grains and you only get a small amount of meat calories out of it...

all farming has inefficiencies at every stage..the problem is meat farming is #1 the worst

>> No.3923507

>vegan
>moral
>science

uh... what the fuck?

>> No.3923508

>>3923499

and whats wrong with letting wild chickens do what they want instead of breeding them into hell holes?

its unhealthy for people, its bad for the environment, and it produces life forms that just suffer indiscriminately ....

its retarded overall why are you even typing words against me?

>> No.3923509

Not against eating animals, I am against meat companies destroying the environment and torturing animals though.
I am environmentally conscious, and am interested in sustainability. But eating meat isn't immoral in my eyes.

>> No.3923517

>>3923497
I didn't say it was.

>>3923493
Eating an all fruit diet will kill you, eating an all meat diet wont. Assuming the subject isn't a fat lazy retard.

>> No.3923518

>>3923499
>then go smash their brains in

They actually stun them and slit their throat, which is less violent.

>> No.3923519

>>3923493

High fructose corn syrup is a plant source, lol.

If you want to compare healthy plants to the shit Americans pass for meat you're being intellectually dishonest. But then again we established that when you said you were a vegan.

The fact that sugar causes you to be a fatass is not controversial. Consider the Atkins diet. From wikipedia:
>The widespread availability of nutritional guidelines[71] has done little to address the problems of overeating and poor dietary choice.[72] From 1971 to 2000, obesity rates in the United States increased from 14.5% to 30.9%.[73] During the same period, an increase occurred in the average amount of food energy consumed. For women, the average increase was 335 calories per day (1,542 calories in 1971 and 1,877 calories in 2004), while for men the average increase was 168 calories per day (2,450 calories in 1971 and 2,618 calories in 2004). Most of this extra food energy came from an increase in carbohydrate consumption rather than fat consumption

What are the main causes of diabetes?
>So far, a diet high in calories, being overweight, and an inactive lifestyle are the main risk factors for Type 2 diabetes.
Ie being a fatass. What is the main cause of being a fatass?

Carbohydrates. Do carbohydrates come from cows?

Not in terribly large quantities, I assure you.

>> No.3923525

>>3923508
Because you're making false statements... Meat isn't unhealthy and is part of a healthy diet. Overeating meat, and eating fatty meat is bad. Although fish and chicken is great meat to eat.

Animals aren't tortured like peta makes it out to be. They get a life that honestly isn't worse than what they'd get out in the wild, so I don't feel some need to set them free and never eat meat again.

You have to kill stuff to live. Deal with it.

>> No.3923527
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3923527

The problem with factory farms (CAFOS) is not that they are immoral. It is that they are environmentally dangerous. We pump those animals full of antibiotics, which leak into the surrounding environment, and they still have a 30-70% rate of documented dangerous strains of e coli and other harmful diseases, which also have been found to leak into the environment, including the crops that make it back to our stores.

additionally, the scale of their waste is monumental. vast trenches are dug out for their poo. this shit is toxic, and also leaks into the water we use and raise crops with.

i like meat just as much as the next guy, but factory farms are a very very bad idea.

>> No.3923533

The problem with factory farms (CAFOS) is not that they are immoral. It is that they are environmentally dangerous. We pump those animals full of antibiotics, which leak into the surrounding environment, and the animals still have a 30-70% rate of documented dangerous strains of e coli and other harmful diseases, which also have been found to leak into the environment, including the crops that make it back to our stores.

additionally, the scale of their waste is monumental. vast trenches are dug out for their poo. this shit is toxic, and also leaks into the water we use and raise crops with.

i like meat just as much as the next guy, but factory farms are a very very bad idea.

>> No.3923534

>>3923483


What would happen to cows if we stopped eating them?

No, seriously. Someone answer this. If we banned eating them what do you want to happen? Let them graze freely on national parks? They wouldn't even survive that. At their current numbers almost all of them would die out without our intervention.

So then? Intervene and preserve them? Have not farms but "zoos" or "conservations" where chickens, cows, and pigs are raised in captivity just so they could live and die in a controlled existence?

>> No.3923543

>>3923505
No, you feed a cow a shit ton of grass, grass which is already growing on a grassland and does not need to be plowed, planted, fertilized, pesticided, harvested,. etc. They then take the cows to a feed lot where they are fattened up with grain. Overall a rather small amount of grain is used.

>> No.3923552

What would happen to cows if we stopped eating them?

No, seriously. Someone answer this. If we banned eating them what do you want to happen? Let them graze freely on national parks? They wouldn't even survive that. At their current numbers almost all of them would die out without our intervention.

So then? Intervene and preserve them? Have not farms but "zoos" or "conservations" where chickens, cows, and pigs are raised in captivity just so they could live and die in a controlled existence?

>> No.3923554

>>3923363
I'm interested in sustainability and and future thus support nuclear power.

I don't try to deny my biological ancestry because of some loosely defined abstract bullshit that is mostly self-contradictory, therefore I'm omnivorous.

>> No.3923556

Truth: it has never been about what you eat (unless your diet is imbalanced to the point of causing a vitamin deficiency somewhere), but always about how much you eat.

Input-output ratio is FAR more important to physical health than input content.

>> No.3923563

>>3923552
youre being an ignorant fuck. stop it.

>> No.3923564

>>3923454
>factory meat, red meat, saturated fats are unhealthy, tons of science showing this

No, no, NO, and completely wrong! There is absolutely no evidence at all to those statements. The only tenuous "evidence" comes from diet questionnaires given out to old/middle aged people in which they need to recall their entire dietary habits for between 5 to 10 years passed. They researchers then statistically manipulate the "data" to show anything they want. WTF!

Check the diets of pre-agricultural man. isotopic bone analysis show a diet heavy on animals. Individuals in such societies lived long and healthy. However after the agro revolution human remains show a whole host of dificency diseases and they live far shorter lives. Studies in the 20th of hunter-gatherer societies show that these people had EXTREMELY low rates of heart and cardiovascular diseases, no obesity, no diabetes . . . and even more to boot, they suffered from no deficiencies ... not even vit C (scurvy).

>> No.3923566

>vegan and thus moral?
Have you figured out a diet that doesn't involve eating plants or fungi? If not, you're as much a murderer as any meat eater. But hey, at least you found a way to feel superior to other people because you eat things that aren't as easily anthropomorphized, right?

>> No.3923576

>>3923566
youre out of your element. get the fuck out of this thread.

>> No.3923581

>>3923576

Why do you hate plants?

Plants are highly developed biological organisms. They react to injury not only of themselves, but of other plants in the vicinity. They can communicate and act to maximise their odds of survival. Yet you think it's acceptable to eat them just because they don't have puppy dog eyes to bat at you.

>> No.3923586

>>3923563

Didn't mean to double post, but I really enjoy your response. Very substantial and informative.

Explain yourself. Or do not. But if you do not tell me your position on this don't expect me to agree with you.

>> No.3923587

>Is /sci/ environmentally conscious?
I sure as hell am, and frightened to death at the state of our environment and where it will be soon
>vegan and thus moral?
stop trolling motherfucker. get morality arguments off this board. although it is better for the environment, i do enjoy some meat on occasion.
>interested in sustainability and our future
very much so. i am getting my graduate degree in envronmental policy, although all i have really learned so far is how utterly hopeless our future is.

>> No.3923593

>>3923586
no one is arguing about the fate of cows, or if eating cows was made illegal. and no one ever will argue about that because that is not the fucking issue, and trying to frame a pro-meat argument in those terms degrades anyone who wants to intellectually argue the merits of eating meat into illinformed obstinant child.
so please shut the fuck up.

>> No.3923596

>>3923505
No, you feed a cow a shit ton of grass, grass which is already growing on a grassland and does not need to be plowed, planted, fertilized, pesticided, harvested,. etc. These lands that can produce meat are very often marginal as far as cereal crops are concerned. They then take the cows to a feed lot where they are fattened up with grain. Overall a rather small amount of grain is used.

>> No.3923597

>>3923581

Yea and they has been studies that show that plants actually react to sounds in positive ways...so get your vegan hippy shit out of sci and back to /lit/ where all those vegan hippies hang out...I'm from /x/ btw...

>> No.3923601

>>3923581
the instrinic and equal value of all life has long since been set aside for more practical considerations (see Rolston 1988)

>> No.3923610
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3923610

>>3923601
>morality
>practical

>> No.3923622

>>3923610
When moral issues get in the way of effective policy, you need a practical framework to deal with them. To say that all life is equal at any and all levels puts everything in rather impractical terms, does it not?

but yes, this is /sci/ can we quite with the moral arguments unless absolutely necesary?

>> No.3923625

>>3923601

Then why save cows? They're not people.

>> No.3923630

>>3923625
if the choice is betweena cow and a person, the person is chosen; a cow and a snake, the cow; the snake and some bacteria, the snake. there is a hierarchy.

also, saving cows is not the issue!

>> No.3923643

>>3923630

The OP read
>vegan and thus moral?

This entire thread is about saving cows. Considerations of efficiency are only secondary.

>> No.3923652

>>3923643
The OP is also a faggot. A vegan faggot at that.
If we are to talk sustainability, and include eating meat in the discussion, talk science and disregard op.

>> No.3923654
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3923654

So how's science going with creating artificial meat?

>> No.3923657

>>3923654
you think that shit in your taco bell is natural?!

>> No.3923658

Why are cows always the #1 discussion in vegitarian vs meat eater threads?
Chickens get it the worst.

>> No.3923665

>>3923657
Ehem...that was the joke.

>> No.3923667

>>3923593

I am not trying to frame any argument as anything. This isn't even an argument, I'm merely trying to elicit yours (if you have one on this).

Assuming that:
1) Vegan is good
2) Everyone is now vegan
3) Farms have no purpose

What should be done about all of these species whose populations are completely artificial?

Either give a suggestion or advocate that everyone go vegan without considering the implications.

>> No.3923670

>>3923654
I like the idea of meatshrooms.

As soon as we can figure out a way to grow steaks from fungus, I'm going to suggest we add mouths, lungs and vocal chords to the meatshrooms, along with a rudimentary brain and pain receptors.

>> No.3923681

>>3923667
Well I guess they could live on the land that was once used as slaughter factories/farms, since they're no longer in use.
Nature was there before it, so it can remain nature after it.

>> No.3923691

>>3923667
what an impractical scenario. for the record my opinion is only that we get rid of factory farms, keep cows in the fields where they belong. nothing wrong there.
if we were to ever reach that point where the entire globe has stopped eating meat, what to do with the leftover species is really the least of our worries.

>> No.3923702

>>3923667
We'll we kind of dug ourselves into a hole, we bred these animals on mass, and if we were to stop killing them we'd have too many.
If they lived in the wild i'd have no problem with them being hunted, but the fact that they're on such high demand that we have to purposely force them to breed at ridiculous rates is the problem.
If meat companies and factory farms were banned, we'd still have to kill alot of them.
But once that cow holocaust is over, the ones that remain can be free.

>> No.3923703

>>3923667

Well that does require taking private property from individuals.

What about predators? Should we eliminate fencing or maintain it to help prevent roadkill? If their populations start to decline should we try to conserve their numbers?

>> No.3923722 [DELETED] 

Yeah, lets care about animals because they look more like us.

I bet you niggers would zap a fly or swat a mosquito the second you saw one.
OH NO ITS A SPIDER KILL IT QUICK IT SCARES ME

You keep playing pretend, just don't tell other people what to do.

And fyi, a plant is just as much alive as a dog or a cat.

>> No.3923724

>>3923691
>>3923702

It seems as if both of you view the role of vegetarian/vegan as a valuable niche in society rather than something that would be good for _everyone_ to adopt.

Or, if we do let go of the farming industry and sacrifice most of the farm animal population to start a "natural" equilibrium: I have only one question left; are you in favour of intervening to save those species from extinction if they cannot survive this new venture?

>> No.3923730

>>3923517

>Eating an all fruit diet will kill you, eating an all meat diet wont.

Whut? Who thrives on an all meat diet for prolonged periods of time? And don't say Eskimos, because even they consume some seaweed and other plants.

>> No.3923758

>>3923724
im a hell of lot more worried about humanity's fate than i am about cows, lets put it that way.

>> No.3923767

I'm not vegan but I avoid eating meat. Buy ecological products and travel by train. Not convinced that humans are causing global warming but 100% sure that we should stick to the precautionary principle. A lot of the changes we can do now will have to be done sooner or later anyway so what the heck. I love animals and oppose fur and zoos as entertainment parks.

Too bad most green political parties are fucking stupid as shit. Like germany, dismantling their nuclear energy just so they can be dependant on russian gas instead. Jerk-offs.

>> No.3923779

>>3923730

It's called the Keto diet and some bodybuilders claim it's great for losing bodyweight fast

Studies indicate otherwise because it's more about calories, protein and fiber intake than it is about what you specifically eat.

All fruit diet would contain very little protein from what I can tell and probably would kill you in the long run, depending on what you eat of course. If there are high protein fruits, please do tell me because I'm looking for them.

>> No.3923785

>>3923722

Actually I save all the spiders I can and chase flies out of the window or when they won't leave, I kill them and feed them to my garden spiders.

As for mosquito's, they're disease spreaders and they add NOTHING to the world so I don't feel like letting them live.

I do like plants though, but I have absolutely zero qualms about killing stuff in order to eat it. I can't stand throwing food out. Environmentally friendly? Probably not very, but the minute vitro-meat is safe and in stores I'm switching.

>> No.3923787

>>3923767
agree with all of that, except for the global warming part. it is happening now, and humans are the cause. the time to act was about 20 years ago.

>> No.3923790

>>3923785
mosquitoes feed many other insects that feed spiders, and birds.

>> No.3923796

>>3923787
I just think that the whole debate is so infected and riddled with political side interests. Even the scientific community have been compromised and I'm having trouble trusting either sides. But still, it's not that important because gambling about it would be so insanely irresponsible. Even without global warming a sustainable way of life is desired and should be a goal to strive for. I think our planet and those who inhibit it deserves more respect than we give it.

>> No.3923802

>>3923363
>interested in sustainability and our future?
LFTR FTW!

>> No.3923810

>>3923796
goddamn right! although it ought not really be that conflicted of an issue. 'climategate' was not really a scandal at all, the scientific community universally accepts that climate change is real and human-induced. popular media and the wider society just arent quite paying attention.
depressing shit really.

>> No.3923817
File: 7 KB, 200x201, wink.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3923817

>>3923810
I'd love to take your word for it, but you know, you might have an agenda...

>> No.3923822

>>3923363
I'd eat a good bug burger any day.

>> No.3923830

>>3923802
>2011
>still believing technology can save us

>> No.3923872

>>3923830
>using a shit meme to try to be funny

>> No.3923887

This, this is the reason why humanity is declining.

People are turning into fucking idiots, religiously supporting their point of view with no care for any sort of evidence stating that they are wrong.

You Vegans and Vegetarians or whatever are fucktards because you follow your religion and believe that you are superior, more intelligent, and generally better humans than the rest of us retarded meat eaters.

Go fuck yourselves up your morally tightened anus then.

>> No.3923898

>>3923887
shit here i was thinking that humanity was declining because of over-reliance on industry such as the meat industry but instead i find out it's these "alternative" types who want to have nothing to do with the suffering of others, including animals.

/sci/ has explained the world to me once again.

>> No.3923912

>>3923779

Yes, and you cannot live off ketones indefinitely, while you can on a plant-based diet, even though such diet may be less adequate than a balanced omnivorous one. I don't know about high-protein fruits, but why would you want to eat only fruit anyway? There are plenty of veggies that can cover our protein demands quite well.

>> No.3923936

>>3923898
is right

Historically, meat has always been a luxury product.
In the decennia following WWII, due to technology like fertilization and irrigation, we have been able to produce massive quantities of vegetables (mostly grains).

The excess edible plants were not divided into high and low quality to create lower price markets so it was affordable for developing countries to buy, instead countries kept their trade barriers and used the excess food to ridiculous amounts of livestock*, and the consumers were glad to buy now that due to supply the price was affordable to the middle class.

(*now you understand why methane from livestock is always mentioned on highschool global warming pictures?)

tl;dr If you wanna become vegetarian, do so because its inefficient to eat meat. All the resources that needed to create 1kg of beef (includes 15000 kg of water) could be used to feed many more than what they are feeding now.

Vegan is just stupid.

also, pic is aimed at OP