POLITICAL SCIENCE THREAD

[Anonymous No.3813037]

Karl Marx was right

we are seeing the self destruction of capitalism

deal with it

[Anonymous No.3813045]

What? I don't see the apocalypse, what are you getting at?

[Anonymous No.3813056]

Solution is to tinker with the it more

[Anonymous No.3813065]

I'm okay with this.
People should share wealth and profits for the good of the society as a whole anyways.

As soon as we move away from this whole 'Me me me me I I I " bullshit, and start helping each other, the sooner we can stop worrying about basic shit and advance our civilization further.

[Anonymous No.3813075]

Actually, from what I can tell, capitalism is doing better than it has for decades.

If anything, we are witnessing the collapse of socialism. The government has spent itself into bankruptcy on entitlement programs, and the poor still still suffer as much as ever.

People are losing faith in centralized authority and collectivism. They are returning more and more to the belief that they can only trust themselves. Seems like a win for us capitalists to me.

[Anonymous No.3813086]

>>3813065
Exactly, our long term goals should be to merge into one consciousness. In order to improve the efficacy of the being that comes after we should encourage everyone to partake collectively

[Anonymous No.3813087]

>>3813075
>The government has spent itself into bankruptcy on bailouts

ftfy

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813091]

Getting rid of luxuries would improve output. Getting rid of competition wouldn't.

[Anonymous No.3813092]

>>3813075

lol an austrian economics believer. don't buy into the false dichotomy dude. just because stimulus & gov programs are failing doesn't mean everything would be great if the government just dissolved all social programs and regulations. the result of that would be wide spread poverty & economic depression and eventually violent revolution. just like marx said.

[Anonymous No.3813095]

>>3813075

>People are losing faith in centralized authority and collectivism

That's a contradiction.

We are moving away from centralised decision making. But it's because we moving towards a more democratic collective form of politics

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813109]

>>3813075
Hell no. The middle class is dissapearing still. The more the wealth pools at the top the more socialist the world will become.

[Anonymous No.3813111]

>>3813037
if karl marx was right, how can it then be, that evolution proofed him wrong?

check and mate commies

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813116]

>>3813111
Can't tell if trolling or meta-arguing.

[Anonymous No.3813121]

>complaining about wealth gap

Here's how capitalism works:
Both poor and rich get richer. Except that rich get a lot more richer, so the poor end up looking badly when compared to the extremely rich. But that doesn't make their situation any worse. Compare that to socialist systems where the wealth gap is a lot smaller, but everyone is poorer. It's far, far, far better to be a poor person in a capitalist country than a poor person in a socialist country. The entire idea of wealth gap being something that makes capitalism inherently negative is retarded.

[Anonymous No.3813127]

>>3813095
Wait, you're not American are you?

Because getting to choose between two nearly identical political parties is far from democratic. This country is becoming increasingly undemocratic, and moving away from an emphasis on the collective good.

[Anonymous No.3813133]

The wealth gap is irrelevant. The poor are better off than at any previous point in history.

When you have a flat-screen TV, high speed internet, a car, a cell phone, etc. you have no right to bitch about inequality. A hundred years ago, someone in your position would be lucky to eat on a daily basis, let alone have access to free time and luxury goods.

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813135]

>>3813127
The strength of democracy isn't choice. The strength of democracy is the belief in choice. So long as everyone can influence the government in some way the release valve of social unrest remains.

And political parties have the policies they do because WE want it that way. They do what they do because that is the best way to get votes. The government isn't doing anything wrong, it's us... and there is nothing we can do to stop ourselves because large numbers of people don't make make decisions. Large numbers of people are more a force of nature than a consciousness entity.

[Anonymous No.3813138]

>>3813133

Greece.

[Anonymous No.3813143]

>>3813116
both actually

thats the reason why darwin evolution was forbidden in the USSR

[Anonymous No.3813142]

>>3813138
Why do I care about Greece? They're government has been in default on its debts for 50 of the last 100 years, and hasn't had a prolonged period of peace... ever.

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813144]

>>3813133
>the wealth gap is irrelevant
It is always relevant. There will always be unrest when there is a large gap. In the future, the poor may be living as the super rich do today, but if the super rich of the future are immortal and living in palaces of diamond then there will be unrest.

>The poor are better off than at any previous point in history.
No. Don't imply the poor are fine when there are a billion people starving.

[Anonymous No.3813161]

Let's try technocracy.

[Anonymous No.3813170]

>>3813144

You could break a palace of diamond with an aluminum baseball bat.

[Anonymous No.3813171]

>>3813161
>technocracy
>form of government
>capitalism/communism
>economic policies
Hey guys, let's try making a GUI interface to track all the bananas.

[Anonymous No.3813176]

>>3813092
There is truth in what you say, welfare programs are simply sedatives which keep the beast that is the populous from arousing.

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813182]

>>3813170
>diamond
>broken w/ aluminum baseball bat
What drugs are you on?

[Anonymous No.3813187]

>>3813121
Total wealth is a result of technological level that is applied. Distribution of that wealth is economics.

So to argue that Ca is 'overall richer' while Co is 'overall poorer' remains to be seen. That's also ignoring that rich and poor have different meanings in Ca or Co.

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813217]

>>3813187
Distribution is everything. Infrastructure improves production, and when billions of people lack the money to give themselves proper education and infrastructure then production is being held back.

It's like a factory where one fork lift is given gold rims before 9 other fork lifts are even given spark plugs.

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813231]

>>3813171

[Anonymous No.3813234]

>>3813182

The harder something is, the harder it is to cut, the easier it is to break.

Diamond is more brittle than a dry twig.

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813238]

>>3813234
>Diamond is more brittle than a dry twig.
LMAO! Keep 'em coming. I love it, no lie.

[Anonymous No.3813241]

>>3813144
>No. Don't imply the poor are fine when there are a billion people starving.

None are starving in capitalist countries.

[Anonymous No.3813247]

Capitalism will be transcended by the technologies it helped come to fruition.

We're all on the cusp of the second Renaissance.

[Anonymous No.3813248]

>>3813234
Bar of steel vs bar of soap, I think not.

[Inurdaes !V1sPhobos. No.3813249]

>>3813247
Forgot my trip

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813252]

>>3813241
>implying rich nations become socialisms and THEN become poor
Socialism is a reaction to poverty, not the cause.

[Anonymous No.3813255]

>>3813037

Capitalism works exactly like it should. The people at the top remain there and everyone else is an economic slave working for the people at the top. Some live better than others, but in the end everybody is working for the same small group of people.

[Anonymous No.3813263]

>>3813252
The beginning stage of every civilization is poverty. capitalism inherited poverty and transformed the western civilization, communist countries tried to do it the other way, and failed.

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813271]

>>3813263
>implying communism wasn't a reaction to capitalism
Do the words proletariat and bourgeoisie mean anything to you?

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813275]

For the record everyone, I'm a pro-socialism capitalist. I often argue for both sides. :P

[Liberty !!nQrIRh+JHbs No.3813294]

>>3813037

Where?

[Liberty !!nQrIRh+JHbs No.3813302]

>>3813255

> defines socialism
> calls it capitalism

[Liberty !!nQrIRh+JHbs No.3813307]

>>3813252

There is only poverty in socialism. Well, in practice, theory, and truth.

>>3813217

Nothing you said is an argument for socialism.

>>3813144

There is indeed anger by those that refuse to be in demand. You know, like factory workers, shitty teachers, public employees, etc.

[Anonymous No.3813308]

>>3813294

all i see is fascism everywhere... or worse.

[Anonymous No.3813311]

Capitalism is self destructing later than socialism did.

Free market 1 Communism 0

[Liberty !!nQrIRh+JHbs No.3813313]

>>3813308

Fascism and mixed economy welfare states describe every country in the world right now, yes.

[Anonymous No.3813317]

Death to Leftists of every sort.

[Anonymous No.3813319]

>>3813311

where do you see a free market?

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813320]

>>3813317
Even the left-handed?

[Anonymous No.3813326]

>>3813317

if you are a social conservative, fuck you very much, too

[Anonymous No.3813327]

>>3813311
>implying communism has ever been implemented.

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813328]

>>3813307
>There is only poverty in socialism. Well, in practice, theory, and truth.
This is not a response because I don't believe your post warrants a response. This post is simply to tell you that your post doesn't warrant a response.

[Anonymous No.3813334]

Karl Marx was a dimwitted jackass. If he's so smart how come he didn't see the rise of these guys and their utter domination of the world?

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813339]

>>3813327
No true Scotsman?

[Anonymous No.3813344]

>>3813320
Of course, they're evil.

[Liberty !!nQrIRh+JHbs No.3813351]

>>3813328

I am well aware you cannot debate.

>>3813344

[fizx !d75etXAowg No.3813364]

>>3813351
Wut?

[Anonymous No.3813371]

Google "falling rate of profits". It's the self-destruction of capitalist hypothesis which was accepted by both Adam Smith and Karl Marx, and which was elaborated by Karl Marx to a great extent. He used it to explain the capitalist crisis as well. There are some useful equations which explain it well as well.

[Anonymous No.3813380]

The beauty of spontaneously created systems is its ability to be spontaneously destroyed.

[Liberty !!nQrIRh+JHbs No.3813431]

>>3813364

> I am well aware you cannot debate.

What part is hard for you to understand?

[Anonymous No.3813443]

>political science
Fuck off.

[Anonymous No.3813466]

I'm the guy who brought socialism to this board. No one knew what socialism really was here, and they believed it from it's misconceptions.

The OP is one of the fruits which keeps on giving - he now makes almost the identical types of threads as I do.

I named my first socialistic threads on /sci/ "POLITICAL SCIENCE" or "SOCIAL SCIENCE", and listed arguments against capitalism, and explained what socialism is, and how many types of socialism there are. I also explained that there are lots of types of socialism, ranging from slow Soviet central planning to fast real-time decentralized planning sensitive to the consumer demand. I also explained that socialism can even be free-market based, with no government ownership in the means of production at all (Ricardian socialism - Google it. I don't really like it, though, since it's unstable and crisis-ridden like capitalism, since it's market based.).

[Anonymous No.3813473]

>>3813443

I agree, except this is not even "science". Saged and reported.

[Anonymous No.3813513]

>>3813473

Would be more reasonable to sage cause liberty posted

[Anonymous No.3813557]

>>3813443
>>3813473
>>3813513
So samefaggy.

[Liberty !!nQrIRh+JHbs No.3813575]

>>3813513

> sage thread where somebody supports socialism

My plan is working perfectly.

[Anonymous No.3813580]

Political Science isn't a Real Science

[Anonymous No.3813591]

>>3813580
moar of the girl

[Anonymous No.3813596]

Am I the only one who actually wants a crisis to happen because it's exciting?

[Anonymous No.3813610]

>>3813596

No, /k/ wants the whole SHTF inna woods thing too.

captcha is : nearcum, guess they're excited too.

[Anonymous No.3813612]

>>3813591
It's not a girl. It has a penis.

[Anonymous No.3813620]

>>3813596
I want one to happen so that it wakes everybody up.
The bailout kept the pitchforks and torches from hitting the streets, I want an economic disaster so massive it sends the western world back to the stone age.

[Anonymous No.3813635]

>>3813620
Same here. Lenin referred to those as revolutionary situations. He, as well as some people before him, got their party in the position of power during the Russian Revolution by waiting for the right time.

[Anonymous No.3813659]

karl marx dabbled in trading stocks

true story, look it up

[Anonymous No.3813665]

If politics was really science, this world would be a better place.

sage for no science.

[Anonymous No.3813668]

OP is right. How many banks operate in your neighborhood? How many hardware stores that aren't part of the same chain? How many grocery stores? What's that? Ginormous corporate duopolies everywhere you look? Damned right. And they're buying and selling legislators from both major parties. The competition that conservatives get weepy-eyed over is finished. We have our winners. And they fucking own you and run this country like the mob.

[Anonymous No.3813674]

>>3813037
Political science != using /sci/ to discuss politics.

>>>/b/
>>>/b/
>>>/b/
>>>/b/
>>>/b/

[Liberty !!nQrIRh+JHbs No.3813680]

>>3813659

Do you think his inability to invest smartly led to his hate of investing?

[Anonymous No.3813684]

Marx said that less and less companies will be able to pay for the increasing capital costs and production costs, and that it will lead to the market being more and more monopolized.

[Anonymous No.3813690]

>be american billionaire capitalists
>holy shit karl marx is right! we better do something about this
>put out propaganda & persecute people who are even suspected of communist sympathies
>put an embargo on cuba fucking up their economy & then claim that communism is to blame for their problems
>soviet union collapses & cia operatives have successfully killed the democratic movements towards communism in south america and abroad
>dial back propaganda
>2011
>unpropagandized generation can think clearly and knows...
>karl marx was still right

[Anonymous No.3813702]

>>3813680

i think he was relatively successful and thought of it as depriving the enemy of its wealth

[Anonymous No.3813703]

Falling rate of profit, competition and production output increase is the reason why capitalism is destroying itself.

We already see the falling rate of profit manifesting so much that most of the commodity markets are already hugely monopolized.

[Anonymous No.3813707]

whatever dude

[Anonymous No.3813716]

>>3813707

Karl Marx:

The need of a constantly expanding market for its products chases the bourgeoisie over the entire surface of the globe. It must nestle everywhere, settle everywhere, establish connexions everywhere.

The bourgeoisie has through its exploitation of the world market given a cosmopolitan character to production and consumption in every country. To the great chagrin of Reactionists, it has drawn from under the feet of industry the national ground on which it stood. All old-established national industries have been destroyed or are daily being destroyed. They are dislodged by new industries, whose introduction becomes a life and death question for all civilised nations, by industries that no longer work up indigenous raw material, but raw material drawn from the remotest zones; industries whose products are consumed, not only at home, but in every quarter of the globe. In place of the old wants, satisfied by the production of the country, we find new wants, requiring for their satisfaction the products of distant lands and climes. In place of the old local and national seclusion and self-sufficiency, we have intercourse in every direction, universal inter-dependence of nations. And as in material, so also in intellectual production. The intellectual creations of individual nations become common property. National one-sidedness and narrow-mindedness become more and more impossible, and from the numerous national and local literatures, there arises a world literature.

[Anonymous No.3813719]

The bourgeoisie keeps more and more doing away with the scattered state of the population, of the means of production, and of property. It has agglomerated population, centralised the means of production, and has concentrated property in a few hands. The necessary consequence of this was political centralisation. Independent, or but loosely connected provinces, with separate interests, laws, governments, and systems of taxation, became lumped together into one nation, with one government, one code of laws, one national class-interest, one frontier, and one customs-tariff.

[Anonymous No.3813724]

Capitalism IS anarchy in a secluded medium.

It parallels anarchy in that if you have More, you have Power. This system gives power to Average men whose intentions are molded by capitalistic society driving them gain more using what they already have by exercising their power over the weaker peoples.

Not only does this inequality promote MORE inequality, but it also degrades society. The brittle laws that keep our civilization from being totally anarchic are being contorted and "loop-holed" by bought politicians.

Capitalism has promoted a new face of anarchy.

[Anonymous No.3813725]

It is always painful to read economy threads on /sci/. So many dumb commie kids sprouting the same nonsense again and again.

I am doing myself a favor and staying out of this one.

[Anonymous No.3813728]

The Communist Manifesto cartoon:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbTIJ9_bLP4

[Anonymous No.3813732]

It's funny to see some dumb 15 year old gun-obsessed American kids defending capitalism because it's "WHAT AMURRICA IS".

[Anonymous No.3813784]

>>3813732

America has been Merchantilist since at least 1829

[Anonymous No.3813796]

>>3813732
0/10. Too obviously posting from Nebraska.

[Anonymous No.3814114]

>>3813334
he did. he predicted that capitalism will be dominated by monopolies, which is exactly what GS is.

[Anonymous No.3814170]

>>3813716
That's just not logical, generally accepted accounting principles are not implicit elements of capitalism, they can change to adapt to a stagnant economy if necessary.

[Anonymous No.3814172]

>people quoting communists
>think if shtf they could implement it
>implying anyone would let teenagers and arts professors lead a revolution

[Anonymous No.3814183]

>>3814172
this is exactly the reason communism always ends in dictatorships

[Anonymous No.3814185]

>>3813690
>unpropagandized generation can think clearly and knows...
>karl marx was still right

[Anonymous No.3814197]

There is a reason the Scandinavian countries are getting more neoliberal again.
Sweden is a free market succes not a socialist.

[Anonymous No.3814237]

>We just spent our first semester at college. Our professors opened our eyes. The government is using its corporate ties to make you sell magazines so they can get rich.

[Anonymous No.3814252]

OP payed money for his Karl Marx book.

[JamesBond !!JAU/DZkp95n No.3814263]

>>3814252
OP's parents paid for a faulty condom in soviet union.

[Anonymous No.3814275]

>>3814263
OP is typing his bullshit on a network of computer systems provided to him through a capitalist system.

[Anonymous No.3814282]

>>3814275

you mean Arpanet?

Thank you. ----Al Gore.

[Anonymous No.3814290]

>>3814252
>>3814275
I know right, and the funny thing is capitalism does this with people's consent, while the state has to monopolize everything so there are no alternatives or use force to make people use their services.

I realize the state is a necessary evil in some cases, this doesn't mean that it is necessary in every case. That's a continuum fallacy right there.

[Anonymous No.3814296]

>>3814275
OP is sitting on a chair provided to him through a capitalist system.

[Anonymous No.3814309]

OP births brown children into a porcelain bowl provided to him through a capitalist system and drowns them in water in the same way.

[op No.3814324]

fuck all of you i am sitting in the woods using a computer i constructed myself from raw materials and connecting to the internet using a satellite signaling device i also constructed and stealing verizons network

[Anonymous No.3814328]

>implying if russia was capitalist & the united states was communist then the united states would have collapsed & the USSR would have prospered

lol at parroting your dads dinner speeches (that he read in a corporate propaganda newspaper) about how communism doesn't work. think for yourselves. africa is capitalist. hows that working out? ya fucking niggers.

[Anonymous No.3814332]

Reagan was a funny guy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mN3z3eSVG7A

But he wasn't a capitalist.far from it.

[Anonymous No.3814336]

>>3814324
Did you distribute those raw materials equally amongst all of human kind? Because if not you're a traitor to your cause.

[Anonymous No.3814339]

>>3814328
>Africa
>capitalist
Depends which part.
Also it's hard to compete with rich american farmers that get subsidies and are protected by tarrifs.

[Anonymous No.3814346]

>>3814328
Your dad does dinner speeches? Your family sound rich, how about practising what you preach and distributing some of that wealth to your "fellow" proles.

[op No.3814353]

>>3814339
Especially when you are 16 and have 5 kids and 1 acre of farmland and a donkey.

[Anonymous No.3814362]

>>3814353
>16 and have 5 kids and 1 acre of farmland and a donkey

A: Should have kept it in his pants
B: An acre is loads of land

[Anonymous No.3814414]

Historically political liberalization is synonymous with wealth, the only reason ancient Greece had democracy was because it was the premier mediterannean trade center.

People get confused when they see capitalists buying minerals and oil and shit from evil African dictators, they don't realize that this economic activity is a lifeline for millions of Africans who would otherwise be facing the most decrepid poverty and oppression. The dictator does spend some of that money on weapons and palaces, but he also spends some of it on roads, ports, dams, investments in light industry, sanitation and electricity, he knows that he needs a skilled educated and peaceful labor force in order to keep his palaces and gunships, eventually the country will develop economically and the dictator will stand down like Suharto, or if not get beat down like Gaddafi. Either way it's for the greater good.

Maybe we should try to better use our economic ties to speed up liberalization or ease the transition, I don't know. I'm just stating facts, call me a gun toting hick or whatever, I care not.

[Anonymous No.3814450]

What I don't like about capitalism is that it doesn't favour quality.
What I dislike about socialism is that it slows development due to lack of competition.

[Anonymous No.3814535]

>>3814332

Ronald Reagan.. Used to work for General Electric., telling people that GE could do their work better without all all that Government Interference. And of course, General Electric was making a shitload of money off Government Contracts at the time.