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/sci/ - Science & Math

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[ERROR] No.3787315 [Reply] [Original]

OFFICIAL NEUTRINO THREAD.

THIS IS THE OFFICIAL NEUTRINO THREAD; IF YOU FIND ANOTHER THREAD, REDIRECT THEM HERE!

If there are multiple threads, the older thread should ideally become the 'go to' thread, unless another thread is more active.)

Everyspeed equal. Everyspeed Loved. You don’t have to be a speed limit to be physical constant, it’s just for fun.

Due to complaints, the links have been removed from the OP copypasta, but a brotino will always be ready to help anytino who asks!

Accuracy, Precision, Repeatability, and Speed are the most important things a /sci/trino can have, let’s spread some joy and post some neutrinos!

>> No.3787359

When I heard that neutrinos had angular momentum, I knew straightaway that this was clear proof that they had mass. But it would be a year or two before everyone was sure. Not me. I was already sure. Without the math.
Neutrinos are evidently some sort of natural pain in the ass to anyone trying to study them, I guess.

>> No.3787370

>>3787359
>sure without math to back it up
thats not how science works

>> No.3787376
File: 29 KB, 700x564, 2008-10-09-beartato-truthordare2.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
[ERROR]

What mass do Neutrinos have, exactly?

>> No.3787381

>>3787376
Nobody knows. We only know it's very small. Actually we don't even know if it's Dirac or Majorana mass.

>> No.3787388

>>3787359
>Neutrinos are evidently some sort of natural pain in the ass to anyone trying to study them, I guess.
yes, they fuck everything up, not them specifically, but the weak force, you have a favorite conservation law/symmetry. well the weak force and neutrinos breaks it. but not so spectacularly that you can easily notice, o no, it does it only a little, just a liiittle fucking error in you calculations. FUCK THEM AND FUCK THE WEAK FORCE.

>> No.3787389

I was thinking, The news say that we could travel in time but i read a article that said that protons couldn't travel faster than time. So we could never travel in time.

Also Could somebody explain what a Neutrino is?
Wikipedia isn't helping much.

>> No.3787391
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[ERROR]

>>3787381

Is it possible they have some sort of absurd negative-mass?

>> No.3787396

>pony template
>official

hurdurdurhuuurrrr

>> No.3787398

>>3787370
Did I say that was how science worked? NO.

I'm just sayin that "angular momentum" sure seemed like a pretty clear indication of mass. Call me a nut if you like, that's just how I roll.

>> No.3787399

>>3787398
Photons have angular momentum, but they have no mass. What now?

>> No.3787401

>>3787391
it is posable to have imaginary mass, but that would mean it needs to travel faster than the speed of light.

>> No.3787403

>>3787389

A neutrino is a very tiny-ass particle that is not part of an atom like a quark.

They're like electrons not bound to an atom, but they don't carry electrical charges, ergo [neutri]no.

They're so tiny, and so neutral, that they pass through space completely uninhibited, and it takes a gargantuan wave of neutrinos to even hit an atom with a few, because they pass through matter without interacting with it.

>> No.3787407

>>3787399

Photons have mass, they just have no REST mass.

Photons, being waveparticles, have no rest.

>> No.3787409

>>3787403
Thanks for the comment.

>> No.3787411

>>3787407
>Photons have mass

And here come the idiots of the photon mass club.

>> No.3787419

>>3787403

jesus, how do they even manage to study/discover/theorize this stuff, it always amazes me

>> No.3787420
File: 18 KB, 249x211, 1316708236472.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
[ERROR]

Everyone gonna watch the thing in bout an hour?

http://indico.cern.ch/conferenceDisplay.py?confId=155620

>> No.3787422
File: 41 KB, 740x232, neutrinos.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
[ERROR]

>> No.3787424

>>3787419
bunsen burners and plastic goggles

>> No.3787428

Hey /sci/
CERN makes a Webcast about Neutrino properties at 16:00-18:00 (Switzerland/Zürich) (in 1.5 h).
You can view it online on:
http://webcast.cern.ch/
I guess we will know more then.

>> No.3787429

I believe its gravity thats missing in the picture. Photons are affected by gravity. But It is known experimentally that neutrinos interact with other types of matter only at very short distances -- of the order of the size of atomic nuclei and smaller. But gravity is a long range force interacting with matter over very large distances. So maybe neutrinos are less affected by gravity than photons, causing the difference in speed.

>> No.3787431

>>3787419
Neutrinos were historically postulated to exist in order to satisfy the dynamics and energy conservation in beta decay.

>> No.3787433

>>3787403

That, or maybe neutrinos simply don't interact with conventional matter, which would imply that atoms have a very small portion of them which consists of matter which can interact with neutrinos.

The possibilities are endless. But first, we need to understand why neutrinos can move faster than the speed of light. A possibility is that they have a negative mass, which would not only be all sorts of mind fucks.

Also note that gravity is known to travel faster than the speed of light, though gravity is barely understood anyway.

>> No.3787438

>>3787428
The stream is lame.

>> No.3787436
File: 25 KB, 402x600, 1315645442816.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
[ERROR]

>>3787420
Of course, mods should sticky this link

http://webcast.cern.ch/

>> No.3787443

How do you accelerate a neutrino?

>> No.3787446

>>3787438
It hasn't even started you hurp

>> No.3787447

Perhaps the "non-rest" mass of photons is merely a derivative of some other factor, such as the way they inhibit the expansion of space, i.e. gravity?
Or maybe it is just a wave collapse function that does essentially the same thing as mass?
hmm.

>> No.3787449

>>3787403
however there are special circumstances where neutrinos have a noticeable effect on their surrounding

the physics behind a supernova can only be explained by neutrinopressure causing the outer layers to be blown away

but other then those extreme circumstances you'll have a lot of issues even detecting them

>> No.3787456

>>3787443
it has extremely little mass so it would be rather easy

>> No.3787455

>>3787438
right now, it's about something else, it starts on 16:00 CEST

>> No.3787451

>>3787433
>That, or maybe neutrinos simply don't interact with conventional matter, which would imply that atoms have a very small portion of them which consists of matter which can interact with neutrinos.

Wrong, take for example a bunch of beta-unstable nuclei, all of them will eventually decay. Not just a few of them.

>> No.3787452

>>3787443
magnets

>> No.3787457

>>3787456
It doesn't interact with the EM force, so it would be impossible.

>> No.3787459

>>3787452

Neutrinos don't have charge.

>> No.3787461

>>3787419
well we study neutrinos by building massive water basins under a damn mountain and then looking if something gets in

if it does it can only be one thing

>> No.3787464 [DELETED] 

>>3787446
La chaîne de streaming est en fonctionnement actuellement mais ce que vous voyez est une réunion concernant l'assurance maladie.
Nous vous donnons rendez-vous dans deux heures pour la séance qui traitera des nouveaux résultats d'OPERA.
Merci de votre compréhension.

>> No.3787480

typical /sci/ physics undergrad

JSDFIOHJSODJIOSHJDOSJDJDLJSDKLSJD

STOP IT AINT PROVEN FUCK YOU EXCITING DISCOVERIES ARE FOR MONKIES IM SEXUALY FRUSTRATED RAHAHAHAHAHA

>> No.3787483

>>3787451

That we know of. Let's put it this way: We have a particle that is not affected by magnetism, the weak force, the strong force, gravity or in any way possible with matter as we know it.

How would we know it exists? The sole reason we know about neutrinos is because we're literally bathing in them and yet we're barely capable of detecting a few once in a while. If that's the case, then what are the odds that we would know about such a particle if it occurs at a rate of 1 to 10^36 atoms? As in for every 10^36 atoms without said particle, there was one with it?

This is the problem when working with this, you have to take into account that there are probably many things which we can't perceive or detect in any way at this moment in time.

>> No.3787489

>>3787464
ce n'est rien

>> No.3787491

>>3787483
we don't know if they interact with gravity or not

same goes for the strong force

>> No.3787500

>>3787491

I was talking about a hypothetical particle which wouldn't interact with any of the known forces as a thought exercise to help explain why the explanation as to why they can move faster than the speed of light is going to be hard to come up with.

>> No.3787507

>>3787491
And what about the force ?

>> No.3787509

>>3787483
>>3787483
thats like longitudinally (i think) polarized photons, it can exist mathematically but it decouples from everything sothat it cant be observed, so we dont know if it exists or not.

>> No.3787510

Since FTL is possible, does this mean there is a light boom akin to a sonic boom when traveling faster than sound?

>> No.3787511 [DELETED] 
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[ERROR]

>yfw they messed up their experiments
>mfw delicious tears from ruined careers

>> No.3787514

>>3787511

They checked it 15000 times.

>> No.3787513

>>3787509

Pretty much. However, until we find something it can interact with in a meaningful way, it's nothing but a modern epicycle. We do however have to keep an open mind about this.

Oh, and inb4 we finally realize neutrinos and gravitons are one and the same. That would be so fucking funny.

>> No.3787516
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[ERROR]

>>3787510
>doesnt know about cherenkov radiation

>> No.3787517

>asks if neutrinos have mass
>incorrectly told 'they don't'

even though they pass through matter at (now, ALLEGEDLY!!!1!1!!!one) more than the speed of light, neutrinos are generally thought to be about 1 yoctometer

1 yoctometer = 0.000000000000000000000001 meters.
10(-24)X1 meters

IN DIAMETERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

>> No.3787519 [DELETED] 

>Yfw people who spent many years in university studying Einsteins theory will have to accept that everything they were taught is a lie.

>> No.3787522

>>3787514
testing does never prove correctness.

>> No.3787524

>>3787510

...

That made no sense whatsoever. What the fuck is wrong with you?

>> No.3787525

>>3787522

Drown in the void of solipsism.

>> No.3787528

>>3787511

If it turns out to be wrong, I will literally laugh for 12 hours straight.

>> No.3787527

Neutrinos are thought by some to directly affect the decay of particles.
Wouldn't this affect the expected rates of decay and give the occasional inaccurate result when radiocarbondating stuff? Or checking for the ratios of decayed particles.
If we can get "space-weather" in terms of neutrinos, what do we do about that?

>> No.3787534

>>3787428
Now I feel sad... my network here lags a little bit and I can't get the stream to work flawlessly. Also, conference on health care? WTH?

>> No.3787540

limelight faggotry....?! You better believe it

>> No.3787542
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[ERROR]

>>3787510

pfffft

>> No.3787544

>>3787540
Explaination?

>> No.3787655

>>3787534
>health care

fuck FTL, its just another working day at CERN

>internet connection

alt sources for webcast are

http://indico.cern.ch/conferenceDisplay.py?confId=155620
and
http://www.elmundo.es/especiales/2011/09/ciencia/cern/index.html

>> No.3787672

>>3787544
there were tons of better threads about this yesterday and maybe there still are (didn't look passed page 1). This thread is just made to get all the post for the sake of posts.

>> No.3787723

any other live webcasts around?

>> No.3787729
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[ERROR]

WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW
WE FTL NOW
>WE FTL NOW