/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.3589340]

[Anonymous No.3589350]

hope is not the same as belief

[Anonymous No.3589351]

There's quite a difference between believing that something does exist and believing that something is physically capable of existing.

[Anonymous No.3589358]

>implying that believing in alien isn't logical
> especially when the way that life was created on earth could easily have happened on one of the other BILLIONS of planets in our universe

[cy No.3589356]

Ancient aliens lol

[Anonymous No.3589357]

Aliens are just life that evolved independently on another planet.

We know it can happen because it happened here. That's what we are. The only assumption we make is that it happened more than once in the universe, which seems like a reasonable assumption to make.

[Anonymous No.3589360]

>>3589351
There's a difference between an idiot and someone who has all the qualities that define an idiot.

[Anonymous No.3589366]

>>3589358
it's still a hope that there could be some, not a belief that there is definitely aliens

you people suck

[Anonymous No.3589373]

>theists feel insecure because they hold beliefs that they know are untenable
>So they go looking for beliefs atheists hold that are similarly difficult to justify
>Seize upon the aliens issue because they need something to drag atheists down to their level even though privately they also consider it probable that life has arisen on more than one planet in the universe
>Huge hypocrites, as usual.

[Anonymous No.3589376]

>>3589360
faggot

[Anonymous No.3589381]

THere's also a difference between believing in alien life on far distant worlds and beliving that little grey people are covertly probing rednecks in the butt for no reason whatsoever.

[Anonymous No.3589389]

>>3589381
yeah there is.

The second one is my fetish.

[Anonymous No.3589391]

>>3589376
breeder

[Anonymous No.3589398]

>aliens
completely plausible although unlikely

>god
completely implausible and violates everything we know about the universe

there's a big difference

[Anonymous No.3589402]

>>3589373
>>3589373
>>3589373
>>3589373
>be an atheist with cognitive dissonance about aliens
>dodge hard issues
>change the subject incessantly

stay classy

>also strawman and imply I (OP) am a theist
>yfw I'm actually an atheist who finds "aliens exist logic" as repugnant as theist logic

[Anonymous No.3589414]

>>3589398
>completely implausible and violates everything we know about the universe

Pray tell, what exactly does the concept of an all-powerful being (not Christian or Muslim God, just the mere concept) run in contradiction to in science? Seriously, I'd like to hear.

[Anonymous No.3589429]

>>3589402
The "aliens exist logic" is based on nothing more than sheer probability. The universe is fucking huge bro, most likely our solar system is run-of-the-mill, one could even go as far as to say carbon based life is too. You probably haven't wrapped your head around it yet. Read an entry level Hawking book or something.

[Anonymous No.3589436]

>>3589414
>>3589414
Matter cannot be created or destroyed.

[Science !!V9NwDn3l+KQ No.3589433]

>>3589340
>Atheists believing in communism
>Atheists believing in libertarianism

Y U NO LOGICALLY CONSISTENT

[Anonymous No.3589447]

>>3589414
Even if there is a god he can't do shit. The laws of physics can't change. So there's no point in worrying about it. I think we all know that conventional religions are bullshit.

[Anonymous No.3589456]

>>3589436
Not the guy you were talking to (I'm atheist), but I'd say that the fact that He is omnipotent -- combined with the fact that theists believe He invented the laws of the universe -- mean that he can do literally anything he wants.

Paradoxes galore, I know; but I expect this is what the theists will want you to believe.

[Anonymous No.3589466]

>>3589414

>not Christian or Muslim God, just the mere concept

You don't get to do that. Nobody worships that god, you only ever bring it out for arguments because it's easier to defend, and that's horseshit.

You're acting like the concept of god is independent from religion. It's not. Gods are characters in religious holy books. You cannot treat god as implicitly real apart from the foundational text of whatever religion we're discussing as that makes a presumption that you're trying to obligate me to go along with.

Pick a specific god of a specific religion and stand by it if we're going to have this argument.

[Anonymous No.3589474]

>>3589456
>combined with the fact that theists believe He invented the laws of the universe

yep

>Paradoxes galore, I know; but I expect this is what the theists will want you to believe.

pretty much

[Sage No.3589475]

If God exists, so fucking what? Okay, he's there. He hasn't done anything, and he isn't even necessary to explain the fucking universe, retards.

Then again, better not burn in a pit of hell. OOOH

[Anonymous No.3589479]

>>3589340
well, at least it stays consistent with the law's of nature.
When we atheists say we don't believe in a god, we mean that people don't perform magic that contradict the laws of nature, or directly default to a super natural being when we don't have the answer to a question.

When we say, "aliens exist," We say there is a strong chance sentient or non-sentient life forms are living out their lives based on the laws of nature, just as well as you and me.

[Anonymous No.3589481]

>>3589466
This

God doesn't exist without religion. God only exists in our minds as far as physics go.

[Anonymous No.3589516]

>>3589340

>Implying believing Aliens are God means you are Atheist!

[Anonymous No.3589531]

>>3589481
>>3589479
>>3589475
>>3589474
>>3589466
>>3589456
>>3589447
>>3589436
>>3589433
>>3589429
strong logic is strong

creationtroll

status: told

[Anonymous No.3589540]

>>3589429
>The "aliens exist logic" is based on nothing more than sheer probability.

So is the argument that William Lane Craig uses for theism. He and other apologists use pseudo-probability as well.

>The universe is fucking huge bro
Theist counterpart: "The universe is so complex, bro. Must be an intelligent designer."

>You probably haven't wrapped your head around it yet. Read an entry level Hawking book or something.
Theist counterpart: You are just too blind to see God. Read our Holy Bible, or an entry-level version as a "Children's Illustrated Bible."

Seriously? You're telling me to read a fucking pop science book as some sort of vindictive proof of your flawed position.
>mfw

[Anonymous No.3589572]

PROOOOOOOOOOTIP: If God did not exist, something like him would have evolved.

At our early stage in societal evolution we're already dabbling in mechanical augmentation of our bodies, our brains, and our consciousness. A machine has been developed that can partially interpret electrical brain signals, which accurately rendered shapes test subjects were visualizing. At the exponential rate at which technology is advancing and the gently increasing rate that power consumption is lowering, it's possible that a precursor to a technowave singularity would be around within the next couple millenniums.

The likelihood of life having existed elsewhere is almost 100%, and the likelihood of some of those lifeforms being comparably intelligent to us is also staggeringly high. Let's conservatively assume that in the universe's entire history even beyond the observable universe, there have only been 1,000,000 planets that support life.

Let's assume only 10% of those have intelligent life. That leaves us with 100,000 intelligent civilizations. Now, let's assume that .1% of those civilizations reach the state of a technological singularity, comparable to some mythical god. That leaves us with 100 technological god entities.

Let's say only 1% of them would be conservatively interested in us. You can do the math on that yourselves.

[Anonymous No.3589580]

>>3589540
>So is the argument that William Lane Craig uses for theism. He and other apologists use pseudo-probability as well.

Except the probability I'm referring to is actually based in mathematics.

>"The universe is so complex, bro. Must be an intelligent designer."

A shitty rebuttal for my shitty argument

>Theist counterpart: You are just too blind to see God. Read our Holy Bible, or an entry-level version as a "Children's Illustrated Bible."

The difference being the books I recommended are based in what is regarded as fact, where as the religious books are akin to fairy tales.


apples to oranges

[Anonymous No.3589625]

I never really looked into the issue before, but does anyone have any articles they can link me on the probability of alien life?

I was thinking the other day... It took something like 3.5 billion years for life on Earth to evolve to what it is now, and about 2 billion of those years to go from single cellular to multi-cellular organisms. There's a long period of time where we're extremely defenseless and prone to extinction by ecosystem change or meteor bombardment. And then there's the conditions required to form a life-sustaining planet. From my understanding, even with such a large universe that's 14 billion years old, life should be extremely extremely rare.

[Anonymous No.3589634]

>>3589625
google the drake equation and get back to me

[Anonymous No.3589637]

>>3589540

Well said, Scientists don't know about religion, they know a lot of idiots seem to like it, and that is as far as it goes.

I have actually read the bible, not by choice mind you. My father was Catholic and Mother was protestant. I grew up on a corner with three Churches surrounding my block. A Baptist, prespetarian and methodist. Fucking hell!

i went through the works man, then I was stricken with scoliosis at 14, I cursed God and immediately gave into to the idea that he simply was not there.

As someone who has gone from Christ fag, to Atheist to Agnostic, to Gnostic...

I feel that the Ancient Astronaut theory does entertain the idea that there really is an explanation for all this commotion.

However if even that is this case, that would mean God left us. We are not important anymore.

This would make a true believer in ancient astronaut theory both atheist and theist!

Polytheistic and Monotheistic.

And a close second to a Gnostic.

But thats irrelevant.

My point is you cannot dismiss the ancient astronaut theory without first have reading the bible and many other books of religion.

[Anonymous No.3589657]

>>3589634
>2011
>having faith in some arbitrary "equation" that has no basis in empirical observation
>mfw laymen and science fans treat it as though it were something *real* like F=ma

[Anonymous No.3589671]

Believing in aliens is more like deism.

Believing in alien visitation is like theism.

[Anonymous No.3589695]

>>3589634
Cool, thanks for that. A brief look at the Wikip page says the estimates range from 10 other civilizations in our galaxy from 1961 to about 2.31 other civilizations very recently. Pretty cool stuff.

[Science !!V9NwDn3l+KQ No.3589716]

>>3589531
Does this mean Libertarianism isn't mysticism?

[Anonymous No.3589809]

>>3589657
>One reply to such criticisms[28] is that even though the Drake equation currently involves speculation about unmeasured parameters, it was not meant to be science, but intended as a way to stimulate dialogue on these topics. Then the focus becomes how to proceed experimentally. Indeed, Drake originally formulated the equation merely as an agenda for discussion at the Green Bank conference.[29]

>not knowing how to read
>2011

[Anonymous No.3589824]

>>3589572
YOURE FULL OF SHIT THERE IS NO GOD NOTHING LIKE GOD THERE IS NO FUCKING EVIDENCE, LOGICAL OR OTHERWISE, THAT SUGGESTS ALIEN LIFE EXISTS

[Anonymous No.3589826]

if aliens were all around us it would be very obvious.

[Anonymous No.3589827]

>>3589809
>Drake originally formulated the equation merely as an agenda

>2011
>not knowing how to read

[Anonymous No.3589834]

Almost all of the parameters of the Drake equation are either impossible to determine or have massive error bars.

[Anonymous No.3589837]

>>3589826
>1600s

LAWKS IF "ATOMMES" DOTH AROUNDE ALLE SEEMETH SUCH WOULDE REEDILIE EVIDAUNCE

[Anonymous No.3589845]

>>3589809
>Alien believers
>Having and agenda

>indistinguishable from mysticism and atheism.

[Anonymous No.3589847]

>>3589824
OP obviously a troll, but you seem to believe him.
YOU are proof that aliens probably exist.
if you can't at least understand that point, you're not worth talking to.

[Anonymous No.3589851]

>>3589572

And the second we have anything beyond someones say-so, it will be reasonable to seriously think about it.

Until then, we can stow it with the idea that we are all living in a simulated universe. IE, logically consistent, and maybe even rational, but without a shred of evidence for it.

[Anonymous No.3589854]

>>3589847
What's troll about it? His logic is sound.

[Anonymous No.3589876]

>>3589827
>an agenda

AN AGENDA TO STIMULATE CONVERSATION ON THE TOPIC

FUCKING TROLLS

[Anonymous No.3589886]

>>3589854
you're probably trolling too, but for the hell of it.

The same process that began life on earth could happen elsewhere too. Nothing special about earth. We don't know how life starts, but it is arrogant to assume it could only start on earth.

[Anonymous No.3589901]

>>3589834
>>3589837
>>3589845
>>3589847
>>3589851
>>3589854
>>3589358
>>3589360
>>3589366
>>3589373
>>3589376
>>3589381
>>3589389
>>3589391
>>3589398
>>3589402
>>3589414
>>3589429
>>3589433
>>3589436
>>3589447
>>3589456
>>3589466
>>3589474
>>3589475
>>3589479
>>3589516
>>3589531
>>3589540
>>3589572
>>3589580
>>3589625
>>3589634
>>3589637
>>3589657
>>3589671
>>3589695
>>3589716
>>3589809
>>3589824
>>3589826
>>3589827
>>3589340
>>3589350
>>3589351
>>3589356
>>3589357
checkmate athiests

[Anonymous No.3589906]

>The Vatican
God is real, give us money to talk to Him

>SETI
Aliens are real, give us money to talk to them

[Anonymous No.3589912]

>>3589886
And I suppose the Aliens are trolling us by not existing, too.

[Anonymous No.3589923]

>>3589906
10/10

[Anonymous No.3589943]

OP trolled to bring up a topic you can't really bring up in "real life". I wouldn't imagine there NOT being any other species of lifeforms. i'll just end what i'm going to say by posting a song, Galaxy song - Monty Python

[Painful Elegy No.3589973]

>>3589906

>The Vatican
God is real, give us money to talk to Him

>SETI
Aliens may be real, give us money to try to talk to them, and we'll also do some analysis of the areas we examine and add to the astrological community even if we are not finding results on our primary goal.


FTFY

[Anonymous No.3589974]

http://gizmodo.com/5829026/everyone-on-earth-has-alien-parts
http://gizmodo.com/5829026/everyone-on-earth-has-alien-parts
http://gizmodo.com/5829026/everyone-on-earth-has-alien-parts
http://gizmodo.com/5829026/everyone-on-earth-has-alien-parts
http://gizmodo.com/5829026/everyone-on-earth-has-alien-parts
http://gizmodo.com/5829026/everyone-on-earth-has-alien-parts
http://gizmodo.com/5829026/everyone-on-earth-has-alien-parts
http://gizmodo.com/5829026/everyone-on-earth-has-alien-parts
http://gizmodo.com/5829026/everyone-on-earth-has-alien-parts

[Painful Elegy No.3589991]

>>3589974

>Implying asteroids were the only places adenine and guanine could be synthesized.
>Not implying that the experiment was looking at replications of certain early earth environments

[Anonymous No.3590012]

>>3589991
Oh fuck you, don't rain on my parade. It's still relevant to the OP

[Anonymous No.3590013]

>>3589886
Oh, I thought you were talking about >>3589572
since I can't see how he'd be trolling.

[Anonymous No.3590034]

>>3589973
>astrological

[Painful Elegy No.3590035]

>>3590012

Yeah, it's relevant, but it's adding extra complexity to a hypothesis without solving anything the simpler explanation can't.

Essentially it fails the test of occam's razor.

[Painful Elegy No.3590046]

>>3590034

yeah, I probably used the wrong word there, but the point still stands that seti is still providing value to fields of astronomy.