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/sci/ - Science & Math

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3387683 No.3387683 [Reply] [Original]

ITT: Science as America's savior.

>Only citizens with degrees in Math and Science can vote. Granted, isn't hard to receive a bachelor's degree in any field in the group, but it also keeps a lot of idiots from voting.
>Citizens with math and science degrees receive some type of governmental incentive (tax deductions, loans, etc.).
>Take money out of Social Security and Defense and put them in scientific organizations.
>News stations required to appropriate a given amount of time to scientific discovery. This is as opposed to hours of political bullshit, public interest stories, or news about how some athlete or actor fucked a stripper.
>College level Calculus, college level Chemistry, college level Physics, and college level Biology all mandatory for high school graduation. I'm tired of extremely low standards.

Give me one reason why any of these would not be good. This of course would be good for any other country, with specifics relative to each country's social order.

>> No.3387704

>>3387683
this pic absolutely beautiful

>> No.3387711

>>3387683

>dat moon

>> No.3387746

>News stations required to appropriate a given amount of time to scientific discovery
Freedom of the press says fuck you.

>College level Calculus, college level Chemistry, college level Physics, and college level Biology all mandatory for high school graduation.
All that's going to do is drastically increase the dropout rate.

>Only citizens with degrees in Math and Science can vote. Granted, isn't hard to receive a bachelor's degree in any field in the group, but it also keeps a lot of idiots from voting.
This is the worst one. College is fucking expensive, and some people, even if they could fund it, can't afford to stop working, or can't do college and a job on top of it. They deserve to vote.

>Take money out of Social Security and Defense and put them in scientific organizations.
Defense, yes. Social Security, no. Safety nets are too important for our society.

So the only one I really agree with is your second point. A degree in science should get you a tax deduction.

>> No.3387754

That first one is stupid and you know it.

The whole point of everyone voting is that everyone has a say.

Saying only certain groups can vote has horrible social implications and is a callback to times of extreme sexism and racism.

>> No.3387758

>Citizens with degrees

Subtle racism, it'll get you every time.

>> No.3387761

I would rather not live in a dictatorship, however scientific it may be.

>> No.3387780
File: 96 KB, 400x400, 1269313522553.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3387780

>People with history, political science and philosophies degrees not allowed to vote.
>Effective "poll tax"

>> No.3387791

>>3387746
>Freedom of the press says fuck you.
Really? Thirty minutes of required time to talk about science is REALLY going to fuck all of our freedom of the press rights? Who gives a fuck?

>All that's going to do is drastically increase the dropout rate.
Good.

>This is the worst one. College is fucking expensive, and some people, even if they could fund it, can't afford to stop working, or can't do college and a job on top of it. They deserve to vote.

Hahaha. Oh wow. I grew up in the shittiest town in the world, and I had to work my ass off. But I managed to get a fucking scholarship. Hell, I could have just gone to a community college and got a degree there. It's not hard, and it's not that expensive.. There are no limitations to knowledge--just excuses.

>Defense, yes. Social Security, no. Safety nets are too important for our society.
Do you have an idea how much money we shit away yearly for it?

Everyone else:
Seriously? You're going to bitch about prejudice when it comes to... intelligence and work ethic? Hell, those are actually good to have. If I'm going to judge ANYONE, I'm going to judge them on that.

>> No.3387803

there's a very very good reason why science doesn't rule any government. in fact i'm sure there are a few very very good reasons.

but my reason is that scientists can into ethics. >>3387761

basically what he said.

>> No.3387816

>suggesting not everyone should be allowed to vote.

Wow, you fail at democracy. That's why I say that no matter how scientifically literate someone is, they can still be morons in regards to politics and human rights.

>> No.3387821

Dude, you should seriously consider informing yourself regarding resource based economy, Venus Project and the Zeitgeist Movement, they have all that covered.

>> No.3387822

Also: MORE PHYSICAL EXERCISE to increase performance in all fields.

The mind is part of the brain; part of the body.

Read views on exercise. It greatly reduces risk of depression, mental illness, and others destroying the pharmaceutical company. MORE ON SCIENCE.

Raise kids with general interest in science.

Study pedagogy and epistemology-child development.

Hurr durr lets dichotomize everything so a bunch of fucking aspies can rule the world and not broaden their horizens and therefore have no true value because the source of their incentives do not come from other studeis such as history, politics, or economics and lets have no idea on how to educate

>> No.3387825

You would effectively deny 95% of women voting rights.

>> No.3387826

OP, you sound like a bigoted, resentful, prick, who instead of hating someone for their skin, or habits, you hate someone for their intelligence. You want to design a system that goes out of their to fuck people who aren't riding with you on your high horse.

Yeah, it would be nice if stupid people couldn't vote, and if scientists got more slack. But to fuck over people's social security to get it done?

And news stations can air whatever the fuck they want. If you want to create a science news network, do it, but once again you're trampling over people's rights.

And yes, calculus, college level chem, and bio should and can be taught in high schools. Physics however is a whole other beast.

>> No.3387835

ITT: what if japan was the entire human race

P.S. /v/ sends it's love

>> No.3387847

>Hey guys, let's move even further toward a dictatorial society! It's okay because it will be for science!
No. We're too far in that direction already. Go fuck yourself.

>> No.3387851

>>3387826
Yeah, I bet you have never cursed someone for their stupidity or incompetence.

Oh, wait. We do that. All the time. You are just too much of a pussy to admit it.

>> No.3387859

>>3387851

You're a fucking idiot.

>> No.3387860

>>3387851
Indeed I have and I do.

But saying it is one thing, I'll be damned if I take someone's well being away because of it.

>> No.3387867

>>3387847
You cannot, in any way, be trying to imply that science is actually a GROWING part in today's society. It is stagnant as it always was. Science plays little to no part right now.

Just watch the news for 30 minutes and tell me that's what you would rather have.

>> No.3387872

>>3387683
there are SOOOOO many things wrong with this.

>Only citizens with degrees in Math and Science can vote. Granted, isn't hard to receive a bachelor's degree in any field in the group, but it also keeps a lot of idiots from voting.
Wtf are we even voting for now anyways? a Scientific based democracy? What kind of candidates do we have? There are so many important jobs that don't relate to science degree idk where to start.

*all apprenticeship jobs
well thats a good start.

>Citizens with math and science degrees receive some type of governmental incentive (tax deductions, loans, etc.).
Love this though.

>Take money out of Social Security and Defense and put them in scientific organizations.
Why do we need scientific organizations, our government should just handle all of it. That's not how money works.

>News stations required to appropriate a given amount of time to scientific discovery. This is as opposed to hours of political bullshit, public interest stories, or news about how some athlete or actor fucked a stripper.

Starting to sound more and more like North Korea now.

>>College level Calculus, college level Chemistry, college level Physics, and college level Biology all mandatory for high school graduation. I'm tired of extremely low standards.

Gone completely socialistic here. If anything a scientific government should have different schools for different fields of study so that each school's goal is the mastery of that field.

Also political science has some very interesting reads "politcal bullshit" is bullshit. Learn2life

>> No.3387873

>>3387867
Since is stagnant yes.

But plays little part? THE FUCK ARE YOU SMOKING.

>> No.3387874

>>3387867
>Claims to be on science's side.
>Suggests anedoctal evidence.

You're doing it wrong.

>> No.3387881

Let's fucking start Operation Technocracy, get part of Tasmania and fuck the police.

>> No.3387885

>>3387867
You misread his comment. He wasn't saying society was becoming more dictatorial, not more scientific.

And as I said earlier I know I would always prefer the less dictatorial state, even if it was the less scientifically involved one.

>> No.3387886

>>3387867

>Lungs stay the same size from birth, no matter how much you grow.

Proportions, asshat.

>> No.3387895

>only people with degrees can vote
>implying degrees are a sign of intelligence
>poor people don't go to college
>poor people can't vote
>it's like it's really 18th century Europe

>> No.3387898

>>3387895
I think that's basically what everyone was getting at. PIP PIP, LONG LIVE THE KING *IN* PRUSSIA.

>> No.3387901

>>3387881
Fucking stupid idea not going through legal channels. Enjoy being raped by Australia.

>> No.3387915
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3387915

God, you all are such pussies.

>Durr hurr we shouldn't force people to work hard in things that are useful.
>Durr hurr we should be free to be stupid and worthless.
>Durr hurr I'm OK with incompetence because I want to vote for stupid politicians with their stupid politics.
>Durr hurr I would rather the news talk about some bitch killing her child than scientists killing cancer.
>Durr hurr any rules equates to instant dictatorship.

Fucking buck up. You want greatness? You have to want it. I'm gone. You guys suck.

>> No.3387922

>>3387915

>leaving when you get told

I guess you don't want it, afterall.

>> No.3387936

>>3387915
Hopefully now you will realize that /sci/ is not the place for your bunk politics.

>> No.3387940

>>3387683
Oh, let the ignorance reign fire and destruction upon those who would assume words to be invariant to reality.

>> No.3387942

>>3387915
>Durr hurr we shouldn't force people to work hard in things that are useful.
We shouldn't strip them of their rights to accomplish that asshat. There are safe and prosperous ways to accomplish this instead of being Stalin.
>Durr hurr we should be free to be stupid and worthless.
Yes. You are free to do that. However, if you want change you'll need to do more than just teach science.
>Durr hurr I'm OK with incompetence because I want to vote for stupid politicians with their stupid politics.
No. I think you'll find that most people here don't even think a two party system even works.
>Durr hurr I would rather the news talk about some bitch killing her child than scientists killing cancer.
I doubt most of watch the news. I myself prefer the paper.
>Durr hurr any rules equates to instant dictatorship.
Nope. But rules that enforce a class based system is getting there.

>> No.3387949

Comrades, join the communist party and together we can work for the great, industrial scientific tomorrow.

Socialism allows people to have a voice, encourages people to go to university by not having them pay, and thus creates and more highly educated scientific population.

It's the natural next step.

>> No.3387966

>>3387949
I just so happen to live in a country with a merit-based college entrance system. You do a test, and depending on your score, you get into college. All real colleges are state-maintained. Guess how many Nobel prize we've won?

>> No.3387968

Reading through this thread I am actually really surprised how quickly /sci/ defended social freedom. Some of the points are kind of outrageous, but the general idea--that is, if I assume correctly--is good. I would like to see society embrace science much more, but unfortunately, as a person who loves liberty as much as myself, I cannot advocate having the government force it on anyone.

Perhaps there are other ways to achieve this without government control?

I commend you on your heart when it comes to the matter, but please learn to be a little bit more respectful to freedom.

>> No.3387972

>>3387915
Go to college and take a real ethics course youngfag and you'll see why this idea is totally bunk.

You are the pussy for not being able to admit that a world different from the one we live that makes you happier and everyone else feeling like shit is the worse case scenario. You want to be great but you will never be cause in history the general public would look down on such a person who puts knowledge before well being

you are thinking completely destructively, civilizations build from working together. Look at the scientific growth in the middle east where all races and nationalities came to discuss science, politics, philosophy, etc. It lead to many great things because there was TRUE freedom there.


seriously take some history courses or just watch connections by james burke on youtube. it will all piece together

>> No.3387978

>Only citizens with degrees in Math and Science can vote. Granted, isn't hard to receive a bachelor's degree in any field in the group, but it also keeps a lot of idiots from voting.

This is fucking retarded. Not everyone is interested in science and math.

>Citizens with math and science degrees receive some type of governmental incentive (tax deductions, loans, etc.).
>Take money out of Social Security and Defense and put them in scientific organizations.

Agreed.

>News stations required to appropriate a given amount of time to scientific discovery. This is as opposed to hours of political bullshit, public interest stories, or news about how some athlete or actor fucked a stripper.

Not this way. People will feel like it's propaganda or somthing. You need to get people interested in science, not shove it down their throats.

>College level Calculus, college level Chemistry, college level Physics, and college level Biology all mandatory for high school graduation. I'm tired of extremely low standards.

This is retarded. Not everyone is interested in science/math, just like before. You need to be tolerant and accept that other people are interested in other fields.

>> No.3387984

>>3387968
0.

>> No.3387991

>>3387978
>College level Calculus, college level Chemistry, college level Physics, and college level Biology all mandatory for high school graduation. I'm tired of extremely low standards.
>This is retarded. Not everyone is interested in science/math, just like before. You need to be tolerant and accept that other people are interested in other fields.

Not OP, but this isn't exactly retarded. We should be figuring out how kids learn best, and we should be stuffing more concepts into classes and cutting down the time learning basics like calculus. It's possible, and not at all difficult. Kids should be learning algebra in elementary school, and calculus in high school, and actual mind bending ideas in college, don't you agree?

>> No.3387992

>>3387966

Shut up. If you actually think that people from the upper class are biologically smarter than people from the working class, you are fucking retarded.

Socialism allows scientific research to progress for the good of humanity, and allows learning for the sake of understanding. The Soviet Union achieved great scientific feats which were not military-aimed, unlike the USA.

First man in space, motherfuckers.

>> No.3387994

OP why would you want smart people in our country? The less smart people there are, the more demand there is for the people with degrees in science and math related subjects, so better job prospects

>> No.3387997

>>3387992
You've got some things right, other things horribly wrong.

Let's all just use social democracy and call it a day.

>> No.3387998

>>3387915
Get back to us when you can find a way to do it right. Your ends are nice, but your means are terrible.

>> No.3387999

>>3387992
If you use the Soviet Union as a basis for your argument you're turning more people off than you are on.

>> No.3388002

>>3387992
And democracy put the first man on the moon.

>> No.3388003

>>3387992
Dude I was agreeing with you.

>> No.3388010

>>3387968

scientific growth is credited to the people who had personal interest in the growth of particular fields of science.

That's why social freedom is so so fucking important.

>> No.3388013

>>3387683
>Only citizens with degrees in Math and Science can vote. Granted, isn't hard to receive a bachelor's degree in any field in the group, but it also keeps a lot of idiots from voting.

Can this be changed to just a degree period? Not everyone loves math and science. Other fields are helpful to society. At the same time, I agree getting a degree is easy. Hell, a few years in the military, and you get paid to go to college.

>Citizens with math and science degrees receive some type of governmental incentive (tax deductions, loans, etc.).

Yes.

>Take money out of Social Security and Defense and put them in scientific organizations.

YES. Fucking liberals and their social security.

>News stations required to appropriate a given amount of time to scientific discovery. This is as opposed to hours of political bullshit, public interest stories, or news about how some athlete or actor fucked a stripper.

No, just no. First Amendment. Enough said.

>College level Calculus, college level Chemistry, college level Physics, and college level Biology all mandatory for high school graduation. I'm tired of extremely low standards.

I'm OK with this at some levels but.. for high school? So many kids would not pass.

>> No.3388018

>>3387997

Social Democracy is fundamentally flawed, rather than solve the class contradictions inherent in society, it attempts to cover them up. Social Democracy simply does not work, as class tensions will always bubble to the surface sooner or later.

>> No.3388027

>>3388018
What do you mean it does not work?
I mean it functions as a government and it has outlived you ideal state the Soviet Union.

>> No.3388033

>>3388027
*your

>> No.3388037
File: 128 KB, 460x621, holocaust.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3388037

What happens when you allow science in a dictatorship with no moral restraints.

>> No.3388043

>>3388013
>So many kids would not pass.

That's the point. The standard of education has been lowered just to let people pass who otherwise are too dumb to. If we keep the curriculum low, sure more people pass, but we're also dumbing down the rest of the kids.

>> No.3388046

>>3388027

Social Democracies do not eliminate oppression and poverty, they only elevate it. Thus, on a logical basis, Socialism is preferable.

And when it comes to fundamental political values, the social democratic state will still, in the end, side with the capitalist when it comes time to break the strike with tear gas and guns rather than empty promises.

>> No.3388056

>>3388013
>So many kids would not pass.

That's the point. The standard of education has been lowered so much just to let people pass who are otherwise too dumb to. If we keep the curriculum low, more people pass, but doing so causes us to 'dumb down' the rest of the kids. Calculus is not difficult at that level, given the proper foundations.

While it could indeed drastically increase the dropout rate, it also inflates the value of actually *earning* your high school diploma, instead of having it handed to you with every other schmuck.

>> No.3388057

>>3387999
The soviets put the first men on your mom.
Besides, the USA landed on the moon in a childish attempt to show they were better than the USSR. It had nothing to do with the US government desiring scientific progress.

>>3388002
I had no problem turning on your mom.
Just because the capitalist class and their media claim the Soviet Union was evil, does not, infact, make it so.

>>3388003
Sorry, bro.

>> No.3388062

>>3388046
>Social Democracies do not eliminate oppression and poverty, they only elevate it.
You can say the same for socialism. Again, referring to your Soviet Union example.

Replace the capitalist with the bureaucrat and you will have the same effect.

>> No.3388071

>>3388046
you can't eliminate poverty.

somebody has to be poor, doesn't mean they can't advance. poor kids get tons of more financial aid and scholarships if they can just do well in school.

you make it seem like there's no hope but you've just given up and accepted poverty because you don't have the will to believe that there are ways out.

in a communist state isn't everybody poor anyways?

>> No.3388077

>>3387991
They're not that crucial. I mean, it won't be useful if they don't intend on doing science/math in the future. However, I think it would be interesting to teach some formal logic, you know, how to prove/refute stuff, implication, equivalence, etc. It really changes the way you think, the way you criticize things.

About physics... You shouldn't expect people who aren't interested in science to know Maxwell's equations. However some basic understanding of physical phenomena would be very helpful. A lot of people are spouting bullshit about QM or whatever and that could be easily avoided if they were taught some basics.

>> No.3388079
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3388079

OP why would you want smart people in our country? The less smart people there are, the more demand there is for the people with degrees in science and math related subjects, so better job prospects.

>> No.3388086
File: 27 KB, 300x300, a.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3388086

>>3387992
>The Soviet Union achieved great scientific feats which were not military-aimed, unlike the USA.

Pic related. Me when I read your post.

>> No.3388088

>Only citizens with degrees in Math and Science can vote. Granted, isn't hard to receive a bachelor's degree in any field in the group, but it also keeps a lot of idiots from voting.
Fuck you, you myopic elitist cunt. If such a system were ever imposed, admission criteria would very quickly change under the various political pressures. Also, quit being a fucking elitist douche who thinks that only hard sciences matter. The farmer who provides your milk plays a critical part in society and might be a fucking genius who just happens to enjoy milking cows and reading. Wtf should he have to waste his time acquiring skills he'll never use in order to gain the right to vote. Stupid fucking fascist idea.

>Citizens with math and science degrees receive some type of governmental incentive (tax deductions, loans, etc.).
How about just providing tax incentives to those who somehow contribute to society? Oh right, you're a self-righteous adolescent faggot who thinks he's a scientist and that only those who are like him are worthy.

>Take money out of Social Security and Defense and put them in scientific organizations.
You had better fucking make sure that the money goes towards real research and doesn't end up getting drained into R&D corporations by proxy.


1/2

>> No.3388094

>News stations required to appropriate a given amount of time to scientific discovery. This is as opposed to hours of political bullshit, public interest stories, or news about how some athlete or actor fucked a stripper.
I'm ok with this.

>College level Calculus, college level Chemistry, college level Physics, and college level Biology all mandatory for high school graduation. I'm tired of extremely low standards.
Again with the elitist shit. You may as well throw in university micro and macro economics, mechanical engineering, computer science (with working knowledge of at least 4 processor architectures, and several programming languages including assembly and C), fluency in the top 5 spoken languages in the world (Mandarin Chinese, Russian, maybe Japanese, standard Arabic, and Spanish?), hmmm, detailed world history since the industrial revolution in order to make people aware of repeating patterns in societal trends, blah blah blah.

What next? A nice eugenics programming to weed out the invalids who can't learn all of this basic stuff?

Of course we need to improve science education. The fact that nearly half the population believes in imaginary friends and disregards science is fucking scary. Standards are falling so more retards can pass and make politicians look good on paper, and the USA is becoming dependent on foreign graduates for it's top tier research, but your proposals are just typical teenage faggotry.


2/2

>> No.3388101
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3388101

>>3388071

You can eliminate classes. This is the end goal of Communism. This was achieved on some level in the Soviet Union. In the Soviet Union, things switched around so the poor majority was oppressing the rich minority, rather than in capitalism, where the rich minority oppresses the poor majority.

In the Soviet Union, the state provided for everyone, and the people democratically reconstituted the land, so that land which was formerly owned by rich kulaks, was given to labourers and small farmers. The workers took over the factories. Capital as it is known in Capitalist societies was eliminated for most purposes.

You can end poverty if you end money.

>> No.3388107

>>3388094
>programming
>BASIC

faggot

>> No.3388114

>>3387992

>The Soviet Union achieved great scientific feats which were not military-aimed, unlike the USA.

The soviet space race WAS a military aim program.
Unlike the soviet program, most technological feats achieved by the US's space program were transferred to the civilian market.

And most early soviet experiments were hardly safe and most were rushed for demonstration and propaganda purposes with the fuck ups hidden under a black iron curtain.

I'm not an ameribro but.

>First man in the moon
>U MAD ?

Also Socialism is a failed political and administrative system.
The Soviet Union fell over its own weight.

>> No.3388119

>>3387683

Good cause, but in the wrong direction

What youäre implying is a society run by science through force and dictatorship.

What we need to do is remake everything and base the world not on advertisment and consuming but on humans natural will to learn and give their gift to the world.

Television would focus much more on science since everyone would be more interested in science rather than mindless entertainment programs.

>> No.3388120

>>3387826

>Implying OP we even get voting right to begin with under this system

>> No.3388126

>>3388056
so what if a bunch kids get H.S. diplomas?
What truly matters coming out of high school are your grades which reflect on your work ethic in school and partially among your intelligence (Honors and AP programs).

>You don't want to do school work
well fuck you then you fail these classes and/or get bad grades and its recorded somewhere and stamped onto your name
>You do the minimum to pass high school
well fuck you then good luck getting into a good college

>you do every single piece of school work and do your best (hopefully doing well) on each test... almost 4.0 gpa

Well fuck me then i'll suck your D if you come to my school? Hell i'll pay your full tuition for a year or so too!

that's why america's school system is alright.

sure it does suck when you look at it but you'd realize these things if you stopped to think about it.

shit we have the best schools of higher learning in the world

cept for FIT

>> No.3388133

>>3388107
wtf does BASIC have to do with anything? are you an illiterate faggot who thought the post said something about BASIC? or are you some kind of fucking retard who thinks BASIC should still be taught?

in either case, you clearly fucking missed that absurdity of the argument

>> No.3388134

>>3388114


The Soviet Union collapsed because of complex internal political conditions, because of the purposeful dismantlement of khruschev and gorbachev, and because of the extreme pressure, economically and militarily, that the west exerted on the USSR.

The Soviet Union was going fine until Khruschev took power, Khruschev made the USSR a social democratic state, and by the time Gorbachev took over, the USSR was already capitalist.

It was partly an internal plot on behalf of capitalists who had infiltrated the party. KHruschev's capitalistic reforms were initially defeated by great comrade Molotov in the politburo, but he forced the issue.

The USSR's messy end is no indictment on the quality of socialism as an economic inevitability. Most people in former socialist states want a return to Socialism. They were lied to by capitalist states, and were disillusioned by the foolishness of Gorbachev and the malevolence of Khruschev.

LONG LIVE LENIN.
LONG LIVE STALIN.
LONG LIVE THE MARXIST-LENINIST REVOLUTION!

>> No.3388161

>>3388101

That is why the bureaucrats on the Kremlin where starving and working on gulags and the peasants and workers were having caviar and enjoying western movies under the soviet government .

Oh wait.

You have no idea how much the soviet union sucked for everyone who wasn't in higher echelons of both army the the state.

Go read the Animal Farm.

>> No.3388167

>>3388126
sucks to be lazy hehe
>good habits
300k here i come!

>> No.3388187

>>3388161

I've read Animal Farm. Do you know that George Orwell never fucking stepped one foot in the Soviet Union in his entire fucking life?

It's a propaganda piece by an english trotskyist who knew nothing about the USSR but the biased version he got from Trotsky's books.

>> No.3388191

>>3388133
Oh boy you are STEAMING.

>> No.3388193

>>3388126
>its recorded somewhere and stamped onto your name

Yeah, because making sure that someone is fucked for life because they didn't have their shit together before they finished high school is a great way to help society.

Your whole fucking attitude seems to be that everyone has to work their asses off and jump through arbitrary hoops in order to improve society. Keep the standards up but make sure that there's always a re-entry point for those who fuck up in case they get it together later.

Or get ready for discontented wage-slave masses and civil unrest, which is what your elitist autocracy will create.

>> No.3388194

>>3388161
>communism
>same starting as everyone else
>same job as everyone else

when do i get to be edgy?

>> No.3388199

>>3388161

Apart from the horrifying stalinist dictatorship the soviet union did provide education, healthcare, housing, food, and work to every single citizen.

It was a vast improvement from Tsarist rule in basically every way except political freedom.

>> No.3388203

>>3388134

It is getting really hard to tell if you:

Are a troll
Really believe what you're saying
Are deluded with your obsession with the socialist to the transition to a communist regime and a deep hatred for capitalism.

>> No.3388215

>>3388191
iaintevenmadtho.jpg

but nice try to deflect your own obvious failure through more failure

>> No.3388220
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3388220

HEY GUYS I'M OP!
>I want a society where only the wealthy and privileged can vote
>a civilization where matters of the downtrodden are decided by those who have never been in their place.
>poor people? retirees? veterans? FUCK 'EM!
>you want freedom of the press? TOO bad you report what I tell is acceptable to report
Finally the will of the rich and powerful will be heard!

>> No.3388225

>>3388215
>he still can't program in a real language
>has to use the same language 12 year olds learn in middle school
>yet he stills try to make an argument

LOL i'd probably kill myself if i were in your situation

>> No.3388230
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3388230

>>3388203
You'll find I fully and sincerely believe everything I have said. I am right, and you are wrong. You will find there are still many people like me, and the movement has recovered and is rebuilding momentum. The red flag will fly over ever country in the world by the end of the century.

The capitalists have only seen round one. There will be a round two, and if we give our blood in vain again, there will be a round three, and so on. As in V for Vendetta, you cannot kill ideas, and this idea is an inevitable historical imperative, and it will recur and recur and recur until the capitalists can no longer hold back the wheel of history and will be smashed.

>> No.3388235

>Only citizens with degrees in Math and Science can vote.

It would be better if only citizens with liberal arts degrees could vote. And I'm not even trolling.

>> No.3388238

>>3388193
funny you should say that would you like to hear my story?

i came to the US with just my mom and brother when i was 9. we've been poor our whole life and i spent nights from 8th grade to my senior year working just so we could live. This made me very lazy when it came to school work and I didn't think I needed to do any outside of school cause i thought it was "stupid"
graduated with 1.67
teachers were always so frustrated with me because i did so well on tests and quizzes but i never did projects or homework.

now i'm 18 and realized how retarded I was in high school not to do such easy things because they were so easy. I've redeemed myself my freshman year at a community college with 3.7gpa (thats not how its graded in my school but just so you can see the difference) and i'm taking summer classes right now while i still work full time.

how was my last post elitist at all, lazy niggers are lazy.

and i think you are just butthurt cause you still dont have your shit together

>> No.3388241

It would ruin science for one. Putting science on a golden petestle would bring more fakes and technocrats into the fields. Just look at string theory or dark matter, the two silliest things ever just because math and physics is now a profession rather than a passion.

Also some decisions must be based on emotions, which mathematical geniuses struggle with.

>> No.3388243

>>3388134
My god, what a fantastic discovery! An actual Soviet Union apologist! I thought your species went extinct after the second coming of logic, but it seems you have managed to survive!

>> No.3388251

>>3388235
I'm not sure about that. I agree that as it is now, liberal art majors are voting for the good guys, but if they had the whole system to themselves, there would be a lot more bullshit salesmen running for prez.

>> No.3388252

>>3388241
see here
>>3388010
>>3388010

>> No.3388255

>Only citizens with degrees in Math and Science can vote
Stopped reading there.

>I believe that a scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy.
> Richard Feynman

>> No.3388257

>>3388225
You don't seem to know how trolling works. When you say completely non-sequitur shit, it's too obvious.

0/10, try again

>> No.3388264

>>3388255
stop being an asshole.

you know he meant "looking at scientific problems in a scientific way"

it was >implied.

>> No.3388265

>>3388243

70% of Romanians would support the return of Communism.

You'll find we were never even in danger of extinction.

It seems the western world is heading towards implosion at a startling rate. I'm afraid the same can't be said for capitalism.

>> No.3388269

I'm a communist, but I'm far from a Soviet Union apologist.

>> No.3388270

>>3388199

And still had a great disparity between those who had more influence and those who didn't.

The socialist regime did make improvements over their pre-existing condition, but it wasn't able to extinguish poverty and disparity as it promised and the roles of capitalist oppressor and exploited worker were just re-branded rather.

Compared to the capitalist western equivalents in Europe and North America the improvement in life under the soviet union was bleak.

This could be easily seen when the Berlin wall fell and the disparity shown between the much more qualified and effective western worker and the bureaucratic eastern worker.

Progress comes faster from competition, USSR had the USA and Europe to compete with, USA and Europe had USSR as a competitor but US and Europe along Japan also competed with each other not just the governments but corporations and citizens too.

>> No.3388272

>>3388265
i'd rather biologically implode then be a poorfag

>> No.3388273

>>3388252
I'm sorry are you agreeing with me?

>> No.3388278

>>3388265
>70% of Romanians would support the return of Communism.
[Citation Needed]

>> No.3388287

>>3388270

>capitalist oppressor and exploited worker were just re-branded rather.

Than remove the problem.

Fuck I didn't finish the sentence.

>> No.3388289

Because not allowing anyone but a small group to vote destroys the foundation of our liberal society.

The men who hand-built science and the philosophy of logical positivism it's built on disagreed with you.

How come so many young, intelligent males in western society hate the very principles that gave them everything they enjoy in life? Why do so many of them advocate totalitarianism, elitism, and gross discrimination against anyone they don't like?

>> No.3388302

Has anyone here actually been in a physics or math class? It is filled with mostly morons, who get great grades, just like any other class.

>> No.3388307

>>3388265

"Whoever does not miss the Soviet Union has no heart. Whoever wants it back has no brain."

-Vladimir 'fucking' Putin

Bear in mind this comes from someone who was privileged during the soviet times.

>> No.3388313

>>3388257
Clearly not, because you are STEAMED as fuck

>> No.3388314
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3388314

>>3387791
>All that's going to do is drastically increase the dropout rate.
>Good.

>> No.3388323

>>3388307

that is a misquote. Either you are a moron or expert troll i'm mad.

>> No.3388334

>>3388307
Reminds me of this quote.

"Any man who is under 30, and is not a liberal, has not heart; and any man who is over 30, and is not a conservative, has no brains."

Winston Churchill

>> No.3388337

>>3388289

Most adolescents undergo a general identity crisis in which they seek out some in-group with which to associate themselves and then attempt to strengthen it by attacking all out-groups. Usually this means that they band together around common mass-produced subcultures such as emo, hip-hop, etc (while ironically believing that they are rebelling against society by doing so, when in fact they are conforming).

In OP's case, he's ascribed value to science and he is seeking to elevate its value in order to increase his own sense of self-worth. The fact that his propositions would destroy the foundations of science in modern society is lost on him. This isn't about logic. It's about ego-stroking.

>> No.3388338

>>3388334
I've heard dozens of versions of this shit. Direct source or it's apocryphal, all of these.

Can't we make a point without a famous person saying it?

>> No.3388360
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3388360

>>3388337
exactly which is why the moment i saw the thread i came to ego-block like a girl best friend

but thanks for the detailed explanation resident /sci/chologist

>> No.3388368

>>3388338
yeah the jews fucking suck

>> No.3388371

>>3388338
Misattributed

* If you're not a liberal when you're 25, you have no heart. If you're not a conservative by the time you're 35, you have no brain.
o According to research by Mark T. Shirey, citing Nice Guys Finish Seventh: False Phrases, Spurious Sayings, and Familiar Misquotations by Ralph Keyes, 1992, this quote was first uttered by mid-nineteenth century historian and statesman François Guizot when he observed, Not to be a republican at 20 is proof of want of heart; to be one at 30 is proof of want of head. (N'être pas républicain à vingt ans est preuve d'un manque de cœur ; l'être après trente ans est preuve d'un manque de tête.) This quote has been attributed variously to George Bernard Shaw, Benjamin Disraeli, Otto von Bismarck, and others.

>> No.3388374

>>3388313
2/10

much more subtle, but there's still a lot of room for improvement, plus you're pursuing it after having been called on it, which usually doesn't work

better luck next time, bro

>> No.3388764

In OPs utopia big business still wins because it owns all you patents

government falls becuase votes dont matter, becomes even more of an autocracy except this time the rebellion is quelled through difficult calculus problems and stupid logic puzzles.

seriously the only thing a scientific society should be considering is burning down the patent office.

>> No.3388770

Also: This!

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/b/bruce_lee.html

Read it. See how incompatible this is in a world of "science". Its the SAME IN LESSON but in OUR SOCIETY AND THIS CONSTRUCT, it is ALIENATIVE!

>> No.3388787

I'm so fucking glad nobody here is ever going to become the next President.

>> No.3388797

>Only citizens with degrees in Math and Science can vote.

You need some decent options to choose from before you can even joke about voting saving America

>> No.3388812

>>3388764
nah, in reality, any limits to freedom in the white market will be made up for in the black market.

So really, you're just broadening the term scientist until it's meaningless.