Pax Americana and the Weaponisation of Space

[Anonymous No.3324516]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aMxOdkjmWg&NR=1

What does /sci/ think about the current weaponization of space by America?
Seems as though the American military has taken upon themselves to become the self-proclaimed morally superior world police. It depresses me a little how trillions are spent to fund these childish fantasies of war obsessed Generals.

Weaponry to police what exactly? The impending global conquest by China? Or is it just to ensure that no other country ever gets a foothold in space?

We will soon have weapons in space just as powerful as nuclear warheads aimed at any and every country America deems 'potentially hostile' - 'just in case'...
Paranoia breeds contempt and America certainly has a lot of the former.

What really bugs me is what they mentioned at the end of that segment, about the potential for the orbiting debris field to one day make it impossible to launch space-crafts at our will.
Can these advances in military technology, for 'policing', really be justified when even one conflict between nations in space has the potential to create so much debris that it would impair future space travel.

Seems fucking ridiculous to me. Explore the stars? What if we literally cannot fucking get off of Earth?

[Anonymous No.3324564]

bump

[Anonymous No.3324581]

Depending on where the debris field is, it would absolutely fuck up everything in its orbit.

If its in GEO, oh ha ha, bye bye modern communications society.

[Anonymous No.3324635]

> What if we literally cannot fucking get off of Earth?

If we become sufficiently advanced and dramatically change our concept of what it "means," too be human (self and all that) and get ridiculously advanced nanotechnology working, we could use that debris and upload (copy-paste) our minds into temporary shells made from it. Then after some time of derbris conversion and/or removal, continue in organic bodies. Or we could always wait longer on earth while software handles the debris cleaning if we are too fixed on our current concept of humanity.

[Anonymous No.3324650]

>What does /sci/ think about the current weaponization of space by America?
Russia and China started it.
>Seems as though the American military has taken upon themselves to become the self-proclaimed morally superior world police. It depresses me a little how trillions are spent to fund these childish fantasies of war obsessed Generals.
Baww more, faggot. We wouldn't even have a space program if it weren't for the arms race.
>Weaponry to police what exactly?
If you're referring to Prompt Global Strike, it's for high-priority targets such as international terrorists.
>The impending global conquest by China?
Our ABM development is mainly as a defensive measure against recent North Korean threats that have arisen. ASAT capability goes hand-in-hand with it; it's most certainly not our intended use for it though (unlike CHINA STRONG, causing the single biggest orbital debris field to date).
>We will soon have weapons in space just as powerful as nuclear warheads
You are poorly, POORLY misinformed. Stop reading sci-fi and equating every kinetic impactor to a WTFhuge weapon of mass destruction. Nothing we're putting up exceeds the yield of a large precision bomb.

[Anonymous No.3324664]

>>3324650
>2011
>still thinks cave-dwelling camel-fuckers are a threat

[Anonymous No.3324678]

>>3324650
>Baww more, faggot. We wouldn't even have a space program if it weren't for the arms race.

I'm afraid I don't quite see the arms race here. America has long since won the space weapons arms race, it is now singularly building weapons platforms to police your so called "international terrorists" and to assert their dominance over everyone else.

Why the fuck spend trillions funding bullshit weapons programs, aimed at Earth, instead of something useful to do with space?

[Anonymous No.3324718]

>>3324678
>America has long since won the space weapons arms race
Have we? For someone making such claims, you sure don't seem to know terribly much about the weapons in question.

[Anonymous No.3324751]

>>3324718
Ok, then who are you arms racing against? Who has the capability to challenge you?

[Anonymous No.3324769]

>>3324718
Pretty sure bro. Russia and China have long since pleaded with America to cease in its relentless conquest of space from a purely militaristic viewpoint, THEY are trying frivolously now just to keep up in this pointless game.

Image is a representation of statistical info from:
http://www.ucsusa.org/nuclear_weapons_and_global_security/space_weapons/technical_issues/ucs-satelli
te-database.html

[Anonymous No.3324796]

>>3324769
>Russia and China have long since pleaded with America to cease in its relentless conquest of space from a purely militaristic viewpoint
>conquest of space from a purely militaristic viewpoint
HOW is that even REMOTELY the case?

Sheesh, it's like I'm arguing with a soccer-mom here. "They're putting weapons in space, clearly they're planning to kill all the other astronauts and invade the Moon!"

We're developing ABMs to protect our allies from very real threats. We're developing PGS (which, by the way, I think IS in fact a mostly pointless project) as a rapid way to eliminate high-value targets. This "conquest" is all in your head.

[Anonymous No.3324830]

>>3324751
Russia is following us lock-in-step.
As for those who are actually daring to push ahead, China is most guilty (see their DF-21D ASBM and their 2007 ASAT test [also based on a DF-21 variant] that produced the largest space debris cloud to date), and both North Korea and Iran are being quite provocative with their ballistic missile programs (warranting ABM funding to protect civilian centers in South Korea and Israel from what would most likely be indiscriminate strategic attacks).

[Anonymous No.3324837]

>>3324796
And how exactly do you explain the United States refusal to agree on the strengthening of the 'Prevention of an Arms Race in Outer Space' treaty?

So let me get this straight, despite the fact that all other participants of the United Nations agree that full fledged weapons platforms in outer space is a bad fucking idea, the United States is completely justified in doing so because it is 'protecting its allies'? The same allies who oppose what they are doing?

Oh okay, i get it now. Thanks.

[Anonymous No.3324841]

>>3324516
>Weaponry to police what exactly?
>mfw OP doesn't understand that the government now knows of intelligent life elsewhere in the universe, but they don't want to inform the general public.

They are protecting this planet from invasions.

[Anonymous No.3324856]

>>3324841
Exactly. We all know that millions of aliens live in space. Also Jesus, and we need protection from these guys.

[Anonymous No.3324861]

>>3324856
>Jesus

[Anonymous No.3324871]

>>3324796
>>3324830
I'm not saying America is building all of these weapons because it wants to take over the world or destroy every other country.
But think of it from another countries point of view, one that resents the United States for whatever reason.
The US keep developing incredibly sophisticated weapons systems in outer space, despite knowing they are leaps and bounds ahead of everyone else.
Do you, not being an ally of the US, sit idly by and watch as they take control? No of course you try and fucking keep up. Shit is never going to fucking end, I don't understand how you can continue to think what we are doing is a good idea.

Races are good, they spur innovation and development, but there is only one thing that can come from creating a layer of orbiting weapons in space and you fucking know it.

[Anonymous No.3324924]

>>3324841
This.

[Anonymous No.3324938]

>>3324837
>And how exactly do you explain the United States refusal to agree on the strengthening of the 'Prevention of an Arms Race in Outer Space' treaty?
Honestly hadn't even heard of it until you mentioned it, but 30 seconds of google gave me that:
>no country has yet signed the Treaty
so..... yeah.
>The same allies who oppose what they are doing?
Wrong again, compadre. South Korea, Japan, the UK, and several other countries - even GERMANY, for fuck's sake - have invested in our ABM systems, and I believe Israel is currently under some form of tech-sharing agreement. The only major opposition to the missile shield systems has come from Russia (only because our network defending against Iranian launches could potentially offer coverage against Russian launches), and of course from the very chest-pounding countries that everyone is trying to shield themselves against.
>>3324871
>a layer of orbiting weapons
Your ignorance is still showing, pal. The only orbital platform even remotely on the table is one of three proposals for PGS (proposed merely as an alternative that was less-likely to cause a nuclear scare than a fully-ballistic system), and even that is already falling out of favor now that DARPA's semiballistic hypersonic gliders are showing promise.

[Anonymous No.3324981]

>>3324871
>The US keep developing incredibly sophisticated weapons systems in outer space, despite knowing they are leaps and bounds ahead of everyone else. Do you, not being an ally of the US, sit idly by and watch as they take control? No of course you try and fucking keep up

Actually, what you do is think outside the box. What use are space weapons against "terrorist" attacks? How will a $100 billion space laser stop a man with a chunky suitcase sitting on a bench in Washington from pressing a button on its side and vaporising the city? How will any of these expensive toys stop someone walking through manhattan with a backpack quietly spraying everyone around him with ebola zaire, or putting a bomb in a substation and causing a power cascade that shuts down the grid?

Wasting money on these projects when half the world is starving breeds resentment and desperate, angry young men, and as Stanley Baldwin said, although not in the way he thought, the bomber always gets through

[Anonymous No.3324986]

>>3324981
Exactly. This technology can't stop terrorism that occurs inside the planet. That's why I said that it will be used to prevent incoming invasions:
>>3324841

[Anonymous No.3325027]

>>3324981
>How will a $100 billion space laser stop a man with a chunky suitcase sitting on a bench in Washington from pressing a button on its side and vaporising the city?
It will kill (just as soon as intel allows) the charismatic motherfucker that convinced that hapless imbecile to perform his terrible deed in the first place.

And, as a side note, it's a precision-guided kinetic warhead designed to minimize collateral damage, not a laser.

>and as Stanley Baldwin said, although not in the way he thought, the bomber always gets through
Funny you should quote him, seeing how he was advocating destroying the source of the problem (i.e. leadership and resources of the enemy) rather than the symptom (i.e. the poor, impressionable pawns who find themselves fodder for the head honchos).

[Anonymous No.3325035]

>>3324841
this this this.

Anyone who can't see this by now is either retarded or closed-minded... if there is even a difference between the two.

[Anonymous No.3325188]

>>3324938
>no country has yet signed the treaty
-----
On October 29, 2008 the UN General Assembly’s First Committee approved the draft resolution on Prevention of an arms race in outer space (document A/C.1/63/L.4) by a vote of 166 in favour to 1 against, with 1 abstention:

In favour: Afghanistan, Algeria, Andorra, Angola, Antigua and Barbuda, Argentina, Armenia, Australia, Austria, Azerbaijan, Bahamas, Bahrain, Bangladesh, Barbados, Belarus, Belgium, Belize, Benin, Bhutan, Bolivia, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Botswana, Brazil, Brunei Darussalam, Bulgaria, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cambodia, Cameroon, Canada, Chile, China, Colombia, Congo, Costa Rica, Côte d’Ivoire, Croatia, Cuba, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Democratic People’s Republic of Korea, Denmark, Djibouti, Dominican Republic, Ecuador, Egypt, El Salvador, Eritrea, Estonia, Ethiopia, Fiji, Finland, France, Georgia, Germany, Ghana, Greece, Grenada, Guatemala, Guinea, Guyana, Haiti, Honduras, Hungary, Iceland, India, Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, Ireland, Italy, Jamaica, Japan, Jordan, Kazakhstan, Kenya, Kuwait, Kyrgyzstan, Lao People’s Democratic Republic, Latvia, Lebanon, Liberia, Libya, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Madagascar, Malawi, Malaysia, Maldives, Mali, Malta, Marshall Islands, Mauritania, Mauritius, Mexico, Micronesia (Federated States of), Monaco, Mongolia, Montenegro, Morocco, Mozambique, Myanmar, Namibia, Nepal, Netherlands, New Zealand, Nicaragua, Niger, Nigeria, Norway, Oman, Pakistan, Panama, Papua New Guinea, Paraguay, Peru, Philippines, Poland, Portugal, Qatar, Republic of Korea, Republic of Moldova, Romania, Russian Federation, Saint Kitts and Nevis, Saint Lucia, Saint Vincent and the Grenadines...[ to see all countried in favour: http://rescommunis.wordpress.com/2008/10/30/first-committee-approves-resolution-on-the-prevention-of
-an-arms-race-in-outer-space/]

Against: United States.

Abstain: Israel.

[Anonymous No.3325199]

>>3325188
However, on that note:

>Through resolutions and discussions within the United Nations, a general agreement has developed that an arms race in outer space should be prevented. However, due to the structure of the international legal regime and to the objection of a (very) few states, a treaty has not yet been negotiated to comprehensively prevent the deployment of weapons in space or to prevent an arms race in outer space. The United States systematically argues that an arms race in outer space does not yet exist, and it is therefore unnecessary to take action on the issue. The rest of the international community agrees that, because there is not yet an arms race, now is the time to prevent weaponization of space.

[Anonymous No.3325337]

>>3324938
Here is an overview for you:

>Prevention of an Arms Race in Outer Space(PAROS) is put forward/
US consistently refuses on claim that there is no space race and so there is nothing to control or prevent.

>Prevention of the Placement of Weapons in Outer Space, the Threat or Use of Force against Outer Space Objects (PPWT) is put forward by Russia-China, changing the language of PAROS so to circumvent the US' argument against PAROS/
US refuses on the grounds that it is “a diplomatic ploy by the two nations to gain a military advantage”.
Their actual response:
>“Washington rejects the [draft treaty] because it feels it is only directed at U.S. military technology and allows China and Russia to fire ground-based missiles into space or use satellites as weapons of war.”
This statement exemplifies the spin put on issues that challenge US military dominance—the draft treaty would prohibit the use of space-based weapons by all states parties, not just the United States, and does not limit any state party’s use of ground-based missiles, not even the United States’.


Here's the source, http://www.reachingcriticalwill.org/legal/paros/ostreaty.html#negotiations..
Read up on all of the negotiations for yourself.

[Anonymous No.3326164]

America is shit. Controlled by Jews and Zionists. The country was supposed to be a utopia of values and freedom, but it's a pile of shit, fast food restraunts and bribery and corruption in politics to make Jews richer, non-jews poorer, and I'd literally give my life to destroy America. I'd give my life to destroy 1% of it.

[Anonymous No.3326198]

>>implying ICBM's aren't nuclear weapons flying through space already and 12 nations besides the U.S. havn't had them.
>>implying GPS is only for military uses (full hard on retard)
>>implying Russia and China don't militarize the fuck out of space already
>>implying the USSR didn't have a working ASAT weapon before the U.S.
>>implying China didn't test an ASAT weapon in 2007
>>implying missile defenses against crazies (North Korea) are space weapons
>>implying anything the U.S. has Russia or China don't (ICBMs, Sats, vehicles)
>>implying all of our space technology didn't come from a NUCLEAR ARMS RACE
>>implying if the U.S. doesn't militarize space China or Russia won't gain a huge advantage and exploit to to buttfuck civil liberties in the world.
>>implying a bunch of liberal college fags on /sci/ know shit about anything.

[Anonymous No.3326208]

>>implying the USSR didn't have a working ICBM before evil America
>>implying China doesn't fill NEO with Space Junk to assrape the International Space Station that you faggots in Europe spent $50 billion USD on.
>>implying China doesn't try blinding US/ European communications satellites with lasers.
>>implying that the U.S. Space Command mission to monitor space junk is "WEAPONIZATION"
>>implying that the U.S. Space Command mission to protect satellites doesn't help keep the fucking interntet on so we can have retarded ass convo's like this one.
>>implying all the nations signing the U.N. treaty aren't either jealous or lying and jealous.
>>implying libtards in the U.S. who support this weren't taught in college by a bunch of marxist soviet plants from the Cold War.

[Anonymous No.3326231]

>>implying all of our science and technology didn't come from a military arms race that started in the 1950's
>>implying that satellites don't need to be protected
>>implying that spoiled Western cities filled with liberal faggots shouldn't be protected from North Korean/Iranian/other nuclear missiles.
>>implying that those same spoiled libfags don't want to live in completely undefended cities
>>implying that you can "UNINVENT" strategic weapons like nukes because a bunch of retards at the U.N. sign a piece of paper.
>>implying that North Korea wasn't made head of the Nuclear Disarmament committee by those same U.N. retards.
>>implying North Korea didn't withdraw from the Nuclear Non-Proliferation treaty before it detonated 2 nuclear weapons.
>>implying that all relevant science wasn't developed in arms races.
>>implying all of your favorite scientists weren't working for America in WWII developing the Nuclear Fucking Bomb
>>implying you aren't a bunch of spoiled little shits who live in a world defended by the very weapons you despise and that the scientists you worship didn't develope them.
>>implying you aren't so fucking stupid that maybe we should just get rid of these weapons and let China, Russia, Iran, North Korea rape your filthy fucking cities and pound millions of you little panzy ass pirates into dust.

[Anonymous No.3326267]

The Russians had the first working ICBM, that's why they got to space first. Your argument is tenuous at best OP.

[Anonymous No.3326312]

You are now entering the no spin zone.

Pic related

[Anonymous No.3326328]

Name one science fiction/space themed novel/show/movie from any country that was entirely peaceful OP.