[ 3 / biz / cgl / ck / diy / fa / ic / jp / lit / sci / vr / vt ] [ index / top / reports ] [ become a patron ] [ status ]
2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/sci/ - Science & Math

View post   
File: 8 KB, 160x120, Comjgvment Picture.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3309609 No.3309609 [Reply] [Original]

what are some bullshit arguments to bring up with people about math and science just for the sake of arguing. I've already argued 0/0=1 much to the dismay of my calc teacher

>> No.3309611

Try P=NP.

>> No.3309612

Can I see some arguments for 0/0 = 1 and P = NP, of course an explanation please.

>> No.3309614

if 17/17=1
and 4/4=1
and 3/3=1
then 0/0=1, prove me wrong
then i say if division is the opposite of multiplication then what times 0=0 the answer is any number so i say 0/0= any number and my calc teacher gets fucked off

>> No.3309618

0/0 = how many zeroes are there in zero, either zero or infinite amount

>> No.3309621

>>3309618
>>3309614
>>3309612
Zero is not a well defined number.

>> No.3309623
File: 1.99 MB, 219x366, wtf man, wtf.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3309623

Try the one where you have a square (say 1x1) and you travel from one corner to the opposite corner in a stairstep fashion, traveling a total distance of 2, and then when you make the steps smaller, it's still 2. Then since you're in calculus, tell your teacher something like "as the step size approaches 0, the limit of the distance traveled remains 2, thus disproving the Pythagorean theorem using calculus unavailable to the ancient Greeks." Then get a really smug look on your face like that douchebag Harvard student in Good Will Hunting. You may want a taser or some mace in case he 10/10's.

pic unrelated, I just like sharing this awesome gif at every opportunity

>> No.3309625

>>3309614 fractions are pieces of a whole too

If I have 3/3 chairs I have one set of chairs, if I have 2/1 chairs I have 2 sets of chairs, and if I have zero chairs out of zero I have one set of... Wait, no I don't.

>> No.3309635

Also, if I were your calc teacher i'd put it on a test and lulz over you having to answer srs.

>> No.3309645

>>3309614
How many nothings do i have in nothing. Nice job, to bad you're a fucking retard and won't understand anything. No wonder you're the student and he is the teacher also you must be failing calc

>> No.3309653

>>3309645
Also to continue anything divided by zero is impossible.

>> No.3309784
File: 347 KB, 1125x1500, 1297581111206.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3309784

sorry you are wrong faggot. your calc teacher is simply lacking. do your research and stop trying to score points by showing up teach. you look like a pansy, seriously

>> No.3309791 [DELETED] 
File: 45 KB, 350x494, mathstroll.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3309791

>> No.3309794 [DELETED] 
File: 28 KB, 350x494, mathstroll2.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3309794

>> No.3309806

>>3309791
It's true. A perfect circle doesn't exist in nature. At the lowest scale, things are points, thus angular.
Pi is a mthematical aberration, the kind of stupidities that emerges when you try to apply approximation to reality. i can't end simply because a circle is an abstract .
Same goes with all the bullshit we hear about physics , QM etc . Can't describe reality if you chose to ignore that perfection and infinity aren't part of it.

>> No.3309856

>>3309806
A perfect measuring tape doesn't exist in nature either, but it pretty much cancels out. When you measure across a nearly perfect circle and then wrap your tape measure around a nearly perfect circle, you get nearly pi, not nearly four.

>> No.3309913

>>3309856
Pi is numerology.

>> No.3309919

>>3309913
Pi is a number.

>> No.3309928

>>3309919
i has no relevance in real world.
It is numerology, not science.

>> No.3309929

>>3309784
wanna fuck lil gurl?

>> No.3309931

>>3309919
Prove it.

Of course you can't prove something non-existing to exist.

>> No.3309935

>>3309928
What is science to you? Because as far as I see it's not math/physics.

>> No.3309943

You're a huge faggot OP.

Don't be a huge assburgers retard trying to show up your teacher. 0/0 =! 1.

>> No.3309958

>>3309935
Please, prove that Pi is a number. Write it down please.

>> No.3309966

>>3309958

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irrational_number

Fuck, I guess e isn't a number either. Neither is root 2.

>> No.3309973

Pi is a ratio. It is the ratio between the circumference and diameter of a circle. It can be expressed numerically.

OP, you are a fucking moron. Your teacher is actually trying to teach you and you are attempting to show him up. There's a really good reason why the future generation will suffer because graduates don't want to teach stuck up little fucks like you.

>> No.3309976

>>3309958

Oh, and wiki has a proof.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof_that_%CF%80_is_irrational

>> No.3309979

>>3309966
That's all nice and dandy but it doesn't explain anything in regard to reality.

>> No.3309985

>>3309976
>>3309966
>The number π (pi) has been studied since ancient times,

Smells like numerology to me.

>> No.3309991

>>3309979

>anything in regard to reality

Please kill yourself now. Maybe you should actually study math instead of being an edgy/deep teen.

>> No.3309997

>>3309958
>doesn't know about the set of irrationals
>laughinggirls.rar

>> No.3310001

HEY GUYS LETS CREATE AN IMPERFECT SYSTEM TO TRY AND DESCRIBE REALITY !! OH LOOK !! WE CREATED A NUMBER THAT SHOWS HOW RIDICULOUSLY VAGUE OUR SYSTEM ACTUALLY IS : PI LOL GUYS, LETS CALCULATE IT ENDLESSLY (BECAUSE OUR SYSTEM IS FUCKED) BECAUSE ITS FUN AND MAYBE WE'LL FIND GOD OR SOME SHIT IN THE END

>> No.3310009

>>3309991
I don't care if the system and its actors are constantly finding new ways of licking their own mutual balls in a orgy of semi-mysticism, disconnected from reality clusterfuck of abstractions....

Reality is the only thing that matters. If a system can't describe it accurately, if it has flaws, it doesn't deserve to be dimmed "perfect". If it's not "perfect" it can't be dimed "true".

Pi is a chimera, a mathematics aberration spruing from our inability to measure the samllest scale in reality.
Circles don't exist. Pi doesn't exist.

>> No.3310014

Well OP, there you go, an entire thread full of bullshit arguments to bring up with people about math and science just for the sake of arguing.

>> No.3310026

>>3309612

Idk about P = NP, but for the other one

lim x->0 x/x = 1

limits dont require definition at x.

>> No.3310036

>>3310009

You owe your fucking reality to pi and mathematics retard.

Without pi, you wouldn't have your shitty Linkin Park or your parents' trust fund.

>> No.3310037

do u guise know its pi day soon?

:3

>> No.3310038

>>3310009
Wow.
Can you name any perfect thing?

>> No.3310041

>>3310014
It is not for the sake of arguing, it is because I'm somehow convinced that using mathematics in a pure abstract world is misleading and one of the bigget mistake we make.
What I mean is mzerely that I can't accept conclusions that are proven to be 100% true only because of maths.
Maths aren't reliable as soon as we take them for granted as a perfect system .We are reaching the limits of this extraordinary tools, a world where we can almost make maths say anything we want them to say, disregarding any evidence and observational evidences (because of a lack of)

As long as Pi has no end, it is not real, only a loophole (of many) in an imperfect system..

>> No.3310043

You could say 1 is prime and offer a trivial proof of Goldbach's Conjecture.

>> No.3310044

>>3310041

>It is not for the sake of arguing, it is because I'm somehow convinced that using mathematics in a pure abstract world is misleading and one of the bigget mistake we make.
>one of the bigget mistake we make.
>one of the bigget mistake

I'm about to lose it. Fuck, why am I even wasting my time to an anonymous douche.

>> No.3310045

>>3310036
>we owe reality to Pi

Aaaaand.. Hello Theism !
"we owe our false view of relity to false concepts" would be more correct.

>>3310038
Yes.
Reality.

>> No.3310046

>>3310041
It's great that you have that opinion and all, but the scientific community frowns on such nonsense.
However, I invite you to go and rewrite all of physics without using mathematics.

>> No.3310049

>>3310045
You don't know if reality is perfect, you have absolutely no access to it. You only perceive reality through your flawed senses.

>> No.3310051

GUIS DIDUNT YOO HEAR MEH!

ITS PI DAY SOOEN

:3

>> No.3310052

>>3310041
1 cm square. Diagonal has a length of?

>> No.3310060

>>3310044
Why call me a douche ?
Take my side of this situation: I think things, I express them
now, your side : you think I'm ignorant of some fundamental facts thus leading me to false reasoning.

As you can't (for now) provide me with any satisfying answer, I stay on my side. Isn't that a sane behavior for me to adopt?

Why resort to name calling?
Aren't you aware that your flawed self-confidence pushes you to overcompensate by trying to humiliate me, dimming me an inferior (compared to you of course) person?

Calm down primate sibling, use your neo cortex, do not let your Ego dictate any single one of your reactions please especially when it will interefere with efficient communication of datas with other fellow human beings..
Thanks.

>> No.3310062

>>3310060
LA LA LA LA LA........

I wish I was 17 again.

>> No.3310067

>>3310049
Reality is perfect. Because reality is everything . Because imperfection means that an alternative exist. There is no alternative to reality. No matter how biased I perceive it : my perception doesn't have any influence on reality, my perception is part of this perfect system we call reality. Reality is all there is. So it is perfect
The major proof that reality is perfect is that it works.

I know, too deep for you.

>> No.3310073

>>3310060

>Does not understand basic grammar.

>Tries to disprove all of math.

Nope.exe

>> No.3310074

>>3310062
Dude... it was only a few months ago... that's no drama.

also: more ad hominem

You ren't exhibiting a shining example of intelligence right now primate.

>> No.3310080

>>3310074
>You ren't exhibiting a shining example of intelligence right now primate.
>You ren't exhibiting a shining example of intelligence
>You ren't exhibiting a shining example
>You ren't exhibiting
>You ren't
>ren't

Egos everywhere. Yay!

>> No.3310082

>>3310067

>Ambiguous logic that does nothing more than rambles.

> Calls it deep

Nope.py

>> No.3310079

>>3310073
>value shape of recipient instead of valuing content
>confused between unrelated things
>aspie detected

>> No.3310085

>>3310067
Reality is perfect because it is reality.
Hardly a definitive proof.

>> No.3310086

>>3310080
>Keyboard in Terminal Phase
>dealwithit.jpg

>> No.3310087
File: 3 KB, 223x176, 1300507945437.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3310087

>>3310067
>>3310067
huh
get the fuck out if /sci/

>> No.3310088

>>3310074
Objective: Make this guy reply to everything, because he can't help it.

I like spoons.

>> No.3310092

>>3310079

> Cannot evaluate content because content has flaws.

> Individual attempting to communicate tells me to value his content while over looking massive flaws in basic grammar and spelling.

>> No.3310093

>>3310085
Only if you're too lazy and/or egomaniac to think about it a few minutes.

>> No.3310094

>>3310086
Size 14 boots in terminal orifice.

>dealwithit.png

>> No.3310105

>>3310093
Circular reasoning is never acceptable as proof for anything.

>> No.3310107

>>3310093

Reality is perfect because reality is everything.

The only definition of perfection is created by humans who are flawed. Therefore since humans are flawed and thus the idea of perfection is flawed reality has to be flawed.

Simple logic error you cannot define reality as perfect because what is perfection other than an ideas created by the human mind.

>> No.3310108

>>3310092
The ideas behind are quite simple actually, you don't need Shakespear level english . Unless you're an aspie or only rely on grammar nazism to avoid conversation in order to keep your belief system intact.
You react like a theist.

>> No.3310114

>>3310107
>Simple logic error you cannot define reality as perfect because what is perfection other than an ideas created by the human mind.

Ideas created by the human mind could possibly be the only reality. How is this a logic error?

BRB, I'm going to kick a baby through a sunroff.

>> No.3310121

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opZCUT8AFE0

>> No.3310124

>>3310114
>Ideas created by the human mind could possibly be the only reality.
You mean like mathematics?

>> No.3310125

>>3310107
Not that simple.
IF something has to dimmed "perfect" then it can only be our universe, our reality, the whole system. Because it can't be compared to anything else, therefore it can't be proven "imperfect" .

If you just want to deny the concept of perfection : I'm totally ok with it.
IT will not change the fact that infinity and 0 are aberrations, obviously, as they are found nowhere except when artificaially created by a suit of approximations none as "numbers".
Numbers aren't real. They do not describe things accurately. Numbers as are accurate as our current level of knowledge of reality is. . Therefore they should be considered with a grain of salt.

>> No.3310126

>>3310124
Actually, I mathed like meanamatics.

>> No.3310129

By the way, is statement "OP is not a faggot" perfect?

>> No.3310132

>>3310125
So when I have one apple and take one apple away, I do not in fact have zero apples?
mind=blown

>> No.3310136

math works

>> No.3310137

OP you're a faggot, division by 0 is undefined

>> No.3310138
File: 28 KB, 707x493, 1304543775002.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3310138

>>3310125
>Therefore they should be considered with a grain of salt.
Something that any real smart and educated people will naturally do. Only, /sci/ is full of younglings who think they know it all . If you disagree with their favorite wikipedia article, then you are a retard.

>> No.3310142

>>3310138
Actually, the signs and symptoms of mental retardation are all behavioral, you FUCKING DUMBASS.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental_retardation

>> No.3310145

>>3310132
Does the apple magically disappears into oblivion ?
It is just relocated.
No zero.

Thanks for this perfect example of how mathematics are flawed by human limitations.

>> No.3310150

>>3310142
I guess being unable to avoid resorting to name calling is a behavioral symptom of social retardation, yes.
Thank you for helping me understand you.

>> No.3310152

>>3310145
But how many apples do I have?
What if I annihilate a proton with an antiproton, how many protons do I have?

>> No.3310153

>>3310108

> The ideas behind are quite simple actually, you don't need Shakespear level english . Unless you're an aspie or only rely on grammar nazism to avoid conversation in order to keep your belief system intact.
> You react like a theist.

The ideas behind are quite simple actually (Behind what? you have not defined a subject), you don't need Shakespear level english (Misspelled Shakespeare and for got to capitalize a proper noun)

Unless you're an aspie or only rely on grammar nazism to avoid conversation in order to keep your belief system intact.

I do not rely on "grammar nazism" to keep my belief system intact. Yet, when an individual says all of math is wrong based on nothing more than a personal option; I would disregard this person when their communication is ripe with flaws in communication and logic.

Simply put you do not have the authority (meaning enough knowledge to successfully refute math: before you continue calling me a theist) to change my belief in something.

>> No.3310157

>>3310150
You're welcome, dickhead! It's just my way of expressing myself.

Also, is not asheptable to kall me a retahd.

>> No.3310159

>>3310153
>appeal to authority
So how are you not a theist?

>> No.3310162

>>3310150

You didn't answer, so I ask again. Is statement "You're not a faggot" perfect?

>> No.3310164

>>3310152
If something turns to zero: it simply means that you base satement is erroneous.
Take this simple guideline and answer your own question yourself.

Nothing disappears. There is no zero. zero is an archaic approximations that helps us to build somewhat functionning mathematical systems.

You can't prove that zero exist.... sorry

>> No.3310175

>>3310152
>i have

lol
this thing "have" doesn't exist.

>> No.3310176

>>3310159

> The point of my post was to say I do not blindly believe someone who lacks knowledge to refute something (YOU!).

> Nothing to do with religion what so ever.

>> No.3310188

>>3310164
>If something turns to zero: it simply means that you base satement is erroneous.
Fascinating. So does annihilation not exist then? Do I just 0.00000001 protons instead of 0 protons? You should write a thesis on this.

>> No.3310191

>>3310153
>Simply put you do not have the authority (meaning enough knowledge to successfully refute math:

First: you don't know that.
Second: do you have authority to define the acceptable level of a person's authority ?
derp

>> No.3310192

>>3310152
The energy before and after the annihilation is conserved, though.
You haven't actually removed anything other than the words we use to describe the particles.

>> No.3310194

>>3310175
Of course it does. Having this is reality, and reality is perfect.

>> No.3310205

>>3310188
I don't know. Protons aren't protons maybe?
If anything turns to zero, it's wrong. No nedd in insisting submitting your false statement to me waiting for me to resolve it: it is false.

>> No.3310208

>>3310192
Energy conservation is not real, it's just numbers. It means the change in energy is zero, but zero doesn't exist.

>> No.3310212

>>3310205
Interesting, so now protons don't exist.
Tell me, what does exist?

>> No.3310219

>>3310191

First: you don't know that.

> A random poster on 4chan

Yes I do, unless you could refute me with your publications that are reviewed by others. Or you state your level of education and show me your proven thesis on how math is wrong.

Second: do you have authority to define the acceptable level of a person's authority ?
derp

Yes I do have the authority to define the acceptable level of a person's authority.

You lack authority on this issue to DISPROVE ALL OF MATH being a random poster.

>> No.3310224

>>3310192
Correct.

Zero is a fallacy.

>> No.3310237

>>3310224
What is the spin of a pion?

>> No.3310240

>>3310208
the thing we call "energy" doesn't need maths to exist.
Altough it may be an erronous concept too.

>> No.3310248

>>3310240
Define energy conservation without resorting to mathematics.

>> No.3310250

>>3310237
There's no spin. This is a place holder for something that we can't explain. articles are an hypothesis, do not forget that.

>> No.3310251

Nothing is acceptable. Everything is false.
Note, if a proton and an antiproton collide, wouldn't they release a large amount of energy, relatively speaking of course, and with that energy release, is the creation or destruction of some sort of bond not implied? I don't know alot about much of anything, i'm just a kid, but if someone would explain this, that'd be great. It's probably naive to say this, but what if an antiproton and proton collision is just seperating whatever makes up the proton and antiproton? Or maybe they're just bonding into a form of matter we can't detect? Just an idea... I'm probably wrong, but rather than insult my intelligence, just tell me i'm naive. Naivete =/= Stupidity. Thanks /sci/.

>> No.3310255

>>3309614
then your calc teacher is an idiot
since 0/0 = anything is the basis of what you are using except there is 'only 1 number' (simplified) that fits the case you have

>> No.3310258

>>3310250
You didn't answer, so I ask again. Is statement "You're not a faggot" perfect?

>> No.3310259
File: 12 KB, 388x296, 1279932893356.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3310259

>>3310240
Yes I agree zero is erronous as I am working on my paper to disprove e=mc^2 as it implies the use of human flawed numbers to describe an imperfect universe, you archaic primates. Try to use your neo cortex net time you do complex irrantional calculus.

>> No.3310261

>>3310248
I'm merely stating that we can't take maths results for perfect. I don't like how Maths is the new god.

>> No.3310265

>>3310250
But spin does exist. We measure a certain quantity, and we call it spin. It exists in reality. Since we can detect it. Unless reality isn't real?

>> No.3310273

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/list_of_paradoxes

knock yourself out, good sir.

>> No.3310274

>>3310261
But mathematics is perfect. It is a complete, logically consistent system based on a handful of axioms.
It's hardly mathematics' fault that the universe behaves mathematically.

>> No.3310275

>>3310261
Yes I agree. We can't trust maths as it is made by humans and can't accurately describe such a complex universe. Personally, I don't use maths everyday, and I refuse to say any number over ten.

>> No.3310288

>>3310261
math is perfect within your axioms, considering that some statements are true you can strart proving others

however, math is not the real world and will never be, numbers themselves are not real not 1 nor 0, they are abstractions

>> No.3310292
File: 65 KB, 560x420, The Wire.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3310292

>>3310038

>> No.3310303
File: 214 KB, 600x537, 1302785974183.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3310303

>>3310051

...I herd u

>> No.3310306

>>3310288
Wrong. The 'real world' is an abstraction of mathematics. Any discrepancy between reality and mathematics is a measuring error.

>> No.3310319

>>3310212
I didnt say particles dont exist. What i said said was that your example was not an example of 'zero' but was an example of things changing state and changing the name.
By the logic you used, breaking anything means you now have zero. I.e. if you snap a pencil in two, you now have 0 pencils. Which is semantically true but you still have the exact same 'stuff' you had before, just now you have to call it 2 halves of a pencil. You haven't actually demonstrated 'zero'.

I actually agree with you that zero does exist. Its just you didn't put forward a sound argument that proves it to the guy who thinks it doesn't.

>> No.3310335

>>3310319
I'm the one being semantic? You're arguing for a definition for zero that means 'complete and total absence of anything'. Numbers are relative, so is zero. Something is always zero relative to something else.

>> No.3310351

>>3310335
Out of the number of points in a line segment, and the number of points in a circle, which is zero relative to the other?

>> No.3310356

>>3310351
Whichever we define as such.

>> No.3310362

>>3310319
http://www.ehow.com/video_4977253_who-invented-number-zero.html

>>3310351
if the length of the circle is the same as the segment the difference is zero

>> No.3310370
File: 81 KB, 480x381, miss_south_carolina.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
3310370

>>3310356
> Whichever we define as such.
> And such as.

>> No.3310371

Look, dude, it's DEEMED. Not 'dimmed'.

For example:

I have deemed this monitor awesome

AND

I have dimmed this monitor

Comprende?

>> No.3310374

>>3310009
You didn't answer, so I ask again. Is statement "You're not a faggot" perfect?

>> No.3310414

>>3310371
Oh yeah thanks, my english is very approximative.

>> No.3310442

>>3310414
You're very welcome.

>> No.3310462

>>3310442
NO U !!

>> No.3310564

>>3309623

2 what? You forgot units.