Futurist Discussion

[Not your average -brainwashed- Joe No.3205072]

Hello People of /sci/, i'm hear to discuss the future with you guys.

First of all, I'm a huge admirer of the ideas of Jacque Fresco, Director of the Venus Project, and i am more than willing to contribute and spread his ideas, anyway it made me realise something in my life.

I'm Currently 20 years old, living in a 3rd world country (sand nigger as u call em) and i was planning for how to succeed in life as soon as i graduate from university, but then Jacque made me realised that this whole system (political and monetary systems) are actually destroying themselves, and at the rate that I am seeing, i barely believe we have more than 10 years before it completely collapses, and that makes me really worried about the type of chaotic transition.

So, i'm here to ask and discuss a few points, and here's the first one, has anyone did some extensive or in-depth research about this and predicted how much time do we REALLY have?

[Not your average -brainwashed- Joe No.3205190]

bump

[Anonymous No.3205217]

Son, make all this things in VP its easy... easy enough. The problem is the World Governments. They are against this idea. And, in the end, 10 years later from now, the world will collapse, But this governments will still on top constantly forcing the "rest of the world" to be their "slaves".

[Not your average -brainwashed- Joe No.3205271]

>>3205217

Yup, i know the governments are all corrupted with all the money they can create out of thin air.

But you know that they "normally" force us as their slaves with money, and that will change when the money they have becomes utterly uselss in value and in power. so they will be perished sort of speak.

What do you suggest for an individual to do before and after the collapse, i really think that lots of people will die (hundred of thousands if not millions) due to the cease of production of basic necessities of a normal life (water, food, energy industry which will shut down due to lack of value in currency and lack of purchasing power with the citizens)

[Anonymous No.3205433]

wut is vp?

[Anonymous No.3205450]

> i barely believe we have more than 10 years before it completely collapses

People have been saying this for almost 200 years. Guess what? It didn't happen. If capitalism didn't destroy the world in the 20th Century, it's not gonna.

Jacque Fresco is pretty interesting, but his ideas are horribly utopian. However, there's a reason that the word 'utopia' means 'not place' as well as 'good place'. They're things that do not and are unlikely to exist.

There's no way that his Venus Project will work; at least not for many centuries to come. Even then, I'm very doubtful.

[Anonymous No.3205480]

looks good

[Anonymous No.3205499]

>>3205433

VP = Venus Project ;-)

[Anonymous No.3205669]

>>3205450
we may have been saying that for the last hundred years even tho i never heard of such claims before, it seems that you didn't add the rising technological unemployment everywhere in the world, and not to mention the ever increasing earth population, so now we have LESS jobs and MORE and MORE people, there is many things i am not including in this equation like depleting resources, nation debts, shifting of wealth from all classes to the rich class.

but with technological unemployment + rising population alone in the equation, i can foresee a very huge problem in the future.

also, why do you consider Fresco's ideas as Utopian, and why would u point out it's vocabulary meaning from a dead civilization? even our language is very differential and problematic because i can say "i think you meant this" or "i think he meant that".
Humans have been saying "nah, his ideas wont work, not in a million years" for ages, and we've done it within a generation (electricity, computers, planes, space flights, moon landing, hologram projections, computers at the size of your palm, etc) and what does that tells you, absolutely nothing, don't just point out problems and shut up there, tell me what do you think will be better? do you want to sink into a chaotic world? do you want your CHILDREN to live in the midst of the collapse? i sure don't want to, that's why i want ideas how to prepare for such a global event, give me your ideas!

if it was all Utopian, how come he has made so much sketches and blueprints and he's willingly to build an experimental city just to test his hypothesis and theories?
All his "Utopian/Impossible" ideas are very much possible within our lifetime if given enough interest and resources to do it, but it cannot happen within the corrupted monetary systems. that needs to go first.

[Anonymous No.3205683]

>>3205271

Sincerely, if you wait for VP be done by Alfresco, this will never be done. I suggest to everyone interested in this ideas, to play a main role in this theatre :-)

Initially you need to buy a land somewhere distant from the biggest metropolis (they are cheap), in mountains perhaps. You can built a small scale VP in everywhere, focusing in build a complete autonomy system.

Of course, you will need money $___$ or find someone rich (interested in your ideas) to build a small scale autonomous and self-sufficient VP in (redundant) everything. But when you achieve your independence from the "System", you will achieve your real freedom.

FACTS:

You will need to be independent in terms of start of):

1 - Water
2 - Electricity (generate, store, etc)
3 - Food
4 - Machinery (including tools)
5 - Recycling (at fisrt organic matter)
6 - Fuels (stock produce, recycle, etc)
7 - Clothes (etc)
and so on...

[anaximander !eAfH.fMPtk No.3205695]

>we'll have robots to clean the toilets, then more robots to fix the robots, and more robots to fix those robots.
>turtles all the way down

[Anonymous No.3205707]

>>3205669

And I have better ideas then VP projects :)

But don't have time now to write all here, sorry :-(

[Anonymous No.3205735]

>>3205695

This is a wrong idea. You dont need to have robots, to fix robots, to fix robots, etc

You only need to have factories, and continue develop your robots (with IA, why not) to "think" by themselves, and build better robots (with the human final world, of course). But its yet a distant future. How about we try to think about crate an VP-like project using only the actual resources (and technology) available? :-)

[Anonymous No.3205768]

>>3205683
well, i think it would be inefficient to separate VP's into smaller lands or houses, since you need technology for certain needs if not all of em.

maybe a small community of 1000 population would be a great and cost effective idea to start off with, since it will have all the necessary needs and will have the ability to change it's own education system and separate it from the official one.
>>3205695
why not design a toilet cleaner that doesnt break down or atleast last pretty damn long to begin with?
>>3205707
let's discuss em later sometimes then =D (via email or another post here)

[anaximander !eAfH.fMPtk No.3205814]

ITT:
>Fundamental ignorance of how societies work.
why do you think you never see anyone smart talking about this? because very simple questions can bring down your whole logical framework.
who does the jobs people don't want to do?
inb4 robots

[Anonymous No.3205818]

OH! another question i just thought of right now, let's say we have build a somewhat small VP-like communities (3-4 per state maybe?) and the world is undergoing the monetary collapse, there will be obviously a huge spike in crimes because people don't have their basic needs met (because lack of -now useless- money to purchase with).

Question: How are those communities are going to be able to fend themselves against of those who want to leech on those communities?
My thoughts: It would be much better to use those people and the -now abundant- resources to increase the capacity of those communities and transform them gradually into a bigger self efficient city. I still don't know how to deal with those who have criminal intends (as i still try to avoid aggressive actions with negative retro-actions)

[anaximander !eAfH.fMPtk No.3205824]

>>3205814
thought of another one.
who cleans the dishes? and before you say robots think of how good (read:bad) your dishwasher is at washing dishes.
This is how every robotic approximation of a essentially human duty will be.

[Anonymous No.3205857]

>>3205768

I agree.

But the primary error in our society is to insist that you need to work only to have money, and trying to put in your mind (in the case of scientists) that you need to do science to make money and prestige, and not to help your own society.

Then, when people heard about a society that doesn't need money, they are not interested, or think that will never work, etc.

And how we can exchange e-mail contatcs here? xDDD (its dangerous..) xDDDDDDDDDDD

[Anonymous No.3205866]

>>3205814
It doesn't have to be a whole overly complicated robot to do that kind of job, you can do a durable attached mechanical arm for example that will wipe the toilet bowl before/during/after each flush.

I've seen something like this on a bigger scale in a cow farm where a mechanical arm slowly shoves all the cows shit into a chute where they get prepared for use as natural fertilizers.

bottom line is, no one wants to do dirty/repetitive/time consuming jobs, replace them with machines, robots or small mechanics or etc.

let those be more socially active, have quality time with their families or use them for something really productive/creative.

what's the problem with that logical framework?

I admit that i have very little knowledge on how society works compared to the whole actual thing, that doesn't automatically make my words invalid or idiotic just because it simply violates the "norms".

[Anonymous No.3205883]

>>3205818

Well... soon or later we will need to think about security, even if we need to create a small (and secret) army to defend yourselves. And maybe develop hi-spec (or better over-spec) defense system (army, armor, etc). But we need to stealth it from the eyes of the society, at last until the society's collapse. After, fuck the society and grant our security with all means.

[Anonymous No.3205892]

>>3205814

Yes! But if we build something like this apart from the actual society, will never hurt anyone ;-)

[Anonymous No.3205905]

>>3205857
Do you really think we are using the full potential of our technology? if so, then i believe you could use a little more information, we have the material to make tanks survive blasts of RPGs, weapons to last longer than an average human lifetime, and other specialized objects to never break at all.

the problem why we (citizens) aren't blesses with such equipment and technology? MONEY! like always.

the companies that produces both dish and dishwashers are designed to be very fragile and not very effective at whatever it does, to guarantee the sales of the -less- outdated technology of dishwashers. they don't give a dime about your well-being, they only care about the money that will goes into their bank accounts. that's the world we truly live in today, where human rights and values comes SECOND to the dollar bill.

i want to change that sick world and i am gonna need all the help i can get.

>>3205824

i don't give a shit about that, just add me [e-mail]

[Anonymous No.3205906]

>>3205824

I think we need to think to rebuilt the entire actual system/organization/society. How about we develop better kitchens, better bathroon (already connected to the recycle system, etc), and the actual entire structure?

How about we rethink about vehicles, transport, energy, etc? I think we can achieve better answers in no time, but only if we rethink all, allways trying to optimize, etc

[Anonymous No.3205930]

>>3205695
Who maintains humans? Other humans. Oh shit, how can that possibly be sustainable?

>>3205814
>who does the jobs people don't want to do?

Robots.

>>>3205824
>who cleans the dishes?

Robots. My dishwasher cleans dishes very well, thank you. And even if it didn't, that doesn't mean there's no room for improvement.

[Anonymous No.3205934]

The Venus Project is a bunch of bullshit.

The only way we will be able to have something like this given the current environment is to spawn eco villages. Small communities that work about 5 hours a day and are (nearly) completely self reliant.

If we disregarded all of the hippy bullshit, made some decent living conditions and utilized technology (which would make us dependent on the capitalist system) we could create a sustainable society as long as we are still generating some income. We would delegate the income in relation to our priorities like having renewable technologies and creating networks for us to communicate by. All off time could be used for your own desires as long as you don't negate from the well being of other conscious creatures (meaning it couldn't be completely decentralized.)

The only way this would work after we had some sustainability going is to have advancements spawned from the society to gain attention from the public eye as a viable way of living.

We would have ample time to learn and progress relative to our goals, but this is something that would be viable for the here and now, and is obviously not completely sustainable. It would however be a step in the right direction if you align your goals towards advancing the human race and increasing their well being.

Obviously extremely rudimentary version of it but that's the gist.

[Anonymous No.3205935]

You people are stupid. There have been way more troubling times on this planet that man himself is responsible for. We, most of you being 14-16, and the smarter ones being in the mid 20s, have never seen what real world problems are. Strife in some countries, OK. That's been going on longer than the U.S. was even a thought. It's just now we have fancy computers and cell phones that even retarded people can use and show the world what's going on. Want fear? Ask a 40 year old or someone as old as your parents about the Cold War and the Cuban Missile Crisis. Ask an old person about Hiroshima. Ask about the Great Depression. Those were some real troubling times. Even the Vietnam era was worst than this, socially.

Terror and war? That's been around since before humans had fire and language. It exists everywhere and everywhen, and it will never change.

Corruption? No one ITT and no one alive is pure. Plain and simple. Some moreso than other, but you can never stifle corruption, unless you were all robots.

Speaking of which, computation is advancing faster than physical robotic technology. It is more likely that we will become our own robots because people will easily take implants in their brains before letting robots rule their lives.

And when that happens, either utopia or dystopia will arise.

Utopia is when everyone lives in the perfect virtual world where money, fame, superpowers, god-like abilities, sex, rock and roll...etc. become reality.

Dystopia: is when everyone lives in the perfect virtual world where money, fame, superpowers, god-like abilities, sex, rock and roll...etc. become reality and its abused.

So it'll most likely be a dystopia.

[anaximander !eAfH.fMPtk No.3205941]

>>3205930
has never done dishes
and
humans have the advantage of being infinitely better designed than any robot ive ever heard of. show me a robot that can go 30 years without upkeep.

[Anonymous No.3205947]

>>3205935
correction to that post, it should be we'd become a hybrid of machine/human.

[Anonymous No.3205949]

>>3205935

So what you're saying is that when the waiter brings what you ordered at a restaurant, and it's complete shit, him saying "well it's way better than it was yesterday" is a perfectly good excuse?

[Anonymous No.3205950]

>>3205935
hurrr you're so edgy

[Anonymous No.3205957]

>>3205935
>I'm a virgin

[Anonymous No.3205952]

>>3205941
I do the dishes every day. I use a dishwasher. The dishes come out clean, and that is all I ask of the machine.

I can't show you a robot that is designed to operate continuously for decades without maintenance because no such robot exists, obviously. There is no robot that is capable of self-repair to such a degree as a human, and there is no fully-robotic infrastructure capable of automatically maintaining itself and other robots. The required technology has not yet been developed. But it is not impossible.

[Anonymous No.3205956]

>>3205941
>30 years without upkeep

show me a human that hasn't gone to the doctors in 30 years and I'll show you man in horrible condition.

[Anonymous No.3205961]

>>3205949
Because I have no idea what you meant by that statement, I'm not going to comment. And actually, yes it'd be a good excuse. Because if you're eating something terrible, but if it's better than it was yesterday, then that's an improvement. May not be very good, but still, an improvement just the same. And isn't that what science and mathematics seeks to achieve? Improvement?

>>3205950
No

>>3205957
No

[Anonymous No.3205982]

[Anonymous No.3205985]

I once read the FAQ page on the Venus Project. It was filled with willful ignorance and misconceptions. IF for the sake of argument someone gave Fresco the means to build everything he's envisioned, I predict total failure within a decade.

[Anonymous No.3205988]

>>3205866

I have an idea. All the manufacturing (processing, disposing, recycling, etc) will be made underground. I try to create something like VP (in paper only yet :-P) about 15 years. And I reach a conclusion that we need to build ICEBERG structures. This word means all. underground all is connected, all is stocking, all is processing, all is transporting, all is communicating, etc, etc. and above ground only the "houses", etc

[Anonymous No.3205995]

>>3205985

The guys a nut, on top of it he sells overpriced shit on his site(or at least use to). Counter-intuitive towards the cause, fucking scam. He's using technologies provided to him from a capitalist system.

My idea of semi self sustained technology driven eco villages is at least somewhat practical.

[Anonymous No.3206011]

>>3205988
Yeah, when I was a little kid I dreamed of building a clubhouse/fortress too.

[Anonymous No.3206012]

>Animals seem to possess inherited patterns of behavior such as nest building, defending their young, and feeding their offspring, but most of this behavior is based on imprinting and internal body chemistry. Animals with large adrenal glands and a large brain will tend to perpetuate those characteristics in their offspring. Bull dogs of several hundred years ago were very ferocious, which was thought to be inborn. Since then, most of that has been bred out of them by reducing the size of their adrenal glands, which lessened the violence of the animals. It was not the case that the violence was inherited, but rather that the size of the adrenal gland caused the aggressive behavior that characterized the species.

So the size of their adrenal glands had nothing to do with their genetic makeup? Why do people listen to this retard.

[Anonymous No.3206023]

>>3206012
> It was not the case that the violence was inherited, but rather that the size of the adrenal gland caused the aggressive behavior that characterized the species.
Holy shit.

[Anonymous No.3206027]

>>3205905

agree with you. I think we have enough technology to build an utopic society. The proble is, we don't have access to all this knowledge. And the gvernments for centuries, always try to trn our society in idiots, that ever know how to make fire, or worst, how to live in a world without its dependencies (electricity, etc).

But we can work together and collect all the necessary knowledge (and tech everyone in then) to build and preserve our future legacy.

Today, if we suffer another RESET we are gooners :-D Our society is over, and we will need to restart from scratch.

And based on this info, I leave a question: We probably already suffer many RESETS in our history, and why we continue suffering in hands of bad people, that love slavering everyone? Maybe, because, ever with RESETS, this "governments never dies?

[Anonymous No.3206031]

>>3206027
>And based on this info, I leave a question: We probably already suffer many RESETS in our history, and why we continue suffering in hands of bad people, that love slavering everyone? Maybe, because, ever with RESETS, this "governments never dies?
Your inability to understand should be your first clue that you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

[Anonymous No.3206039]

God DAMN this thread reeks of underageb&.

[Anonymous No.3206035]

>>3205930

How about we don't think about robots, but instead, automating systems? :-D Its better to think and help to structure a news society where automated systems is everywhere helping us to live a better life and give us time enough to think about an ever better future for us all?

[Anonymous No.3206043]

>>3206027
>Maybe, because, ever with RESETS, this "governments never dies?

OH IT'S A CONSPIRACY
GRAB YOUR TINFOIL HATS

[Anonymous No.3206041]

>>3206039
THANK YOU. Suffering is inevitable. Problems are inevitable. Just be smart enough to avoid it.

[Anonymous No.3206054]

>>3206035
Automation on many scales requires robotics. They are a part of the system.

[Anonymous No.3206064]

You guys ever read about the hippe communes in the 1970's? They where filled with individuals who wanted to create a society without a structured hierarchy. They had to talk out all their differences in a group. Needless to say the stronger and smarter members quickly got an upper-hand on the shy and timid members. Imagine that same project, but in a world filled with ruthless coercive individuals.

It wouldn't last long

[Anonymous No.3206067]

>>3206064
Also all the fun interactions between hippie communes and biker gangs. Fun times.

[Anonymous No.3206069]

Communist bullshit

[Anonymous No.3206073]

>>3206064
What gets me most of all is that the VP system is centralized control (through computers), with not special regulation or oversight, and they think that no one will abuse it. Really, guys?

[Anonymous No.3206078]

>>3205934

I agree! :-) VP its only a start. I know that VP have so many errors/problems. We can build a society that really works with the collaborating of others, with enough technology, ith the respect , etc.

We can create a better future for us, for all people that want to help. And a land distant form big cities its a good start. We only need to work seriously on this.

>>3205995

I Agree
>>3205995

[Anonymous No.3206086]

>>3206078
Start talking about how it will actually work, not just what you want things to be like in the end. Soviet Russia got started this way.

[Anonymous No.3206083]

The injustices and problems of society are not the result of greedy, evil men wringing their hands behind their desks in secret underground lairs. They, like you and I, are people with faults and prejudices operating inside of an established system bigger than themselves, and therein lies eventual corruption. There will never be a perfect human society because we are aren't perfect beings, and so long as we exist as individuals with separate consciousnesses, we can never achieve perfection as a race.

[Anonymous No.3206090]

>>3206083
I love your first half. And then,
>so long as we exist as individuals with separate consciousnesses, we can never achieve perfection as a race.
This is just ignoring the problem. You say that society will work when there IS no society at all.

[Anonymous No.3206091]

>>3206031

Some problems with my English? Sorry! :-) is not my main language.

What I trying to say is: why our society where always like this? (Suffering, slavering, etc.)

[Anonymous No.3206093]

For the VP system to work, you'd have to lobotomize everyone.

[Anonymous No.3206104]

>>3205683
>>3205905
>>3205934

Have you guys heard of this?

http://www.ted.com/talks/marcin_jakubowski.html
http://opensourceecology.org/

[Anonymous No.3206109]

>>3206091
>What I trying to say is: why our society where always like this? (Suffering, slavering, etc.)
Because people are short-sighted and usually self-interested. We're easily influenced and afraid to trust. Governments aren't generally evil people - just people. The same short-sighted and usually self-interested people you find everywhere else.

Now once in a while a true asshole gains power over a country. You should not support a social model that allows this - Stalin, Mao, Hitler, Kim Jong Il, Pol Pot... never give one man absolute power just because he makes beautiful promises.

[Anonymous No.3206119]

Oh damn it, i was hoping this thread would be mature enough to discuss, but nope, no avail.

Last of my posts: You may say that Fresco's a nutcase, you may say that VP is a scam and have loads of problems, but i'll say that THIS massive idea is a product of the life of a 94 year old man who has lived many events and faced all kinds of problems, and he's more than willing to pour all that experience and knowledge he gain to you FOR FREE. and for just that i am appreciate him alot. because most of all people will try to suck the money out of you to get any important piece of information.

your jobs shouldn't all be about dissing and reject ideas because they seem to be different than your value system, you should open yourselves to different ideas, analyze it, and test it if you can too. listen to what other has to say and let yourself change to something better, make your mind evolve, come up with new radical ideas and believe in what really should be done.

if we can do that, then we wont have to worry about any problems that will face us as humans in our lives.

[Anonymous No.3206122]

>>3206043

"Recently" :-D our society "experiences" a 1,000 years of "darkness. Did you remenber read this on your books? xDDDDD I can call that a RESET ;-)

Maybe, if we could avoid it in the past, we already live in the "Jetson"'s Era? xDDDD

[Anonymous No.3206124]

>>3206122
You sound amazingly dumb. I'm starting to think you MUST be trolling.

[Anonymous No.3206144]

>>3206119
>your jobs shouldn't all be about dissing and reject ideas
you have clearly never met a true scientist

[Anonymous No.3206146]

No.

[Anonymous No.3206270]

Didn't read the whole thread.

VPs ideas are unrealistic as a whole, he has naive understanding of humanity, and yes i have watched all three movies (the last two was about VP).
As a neuroscientist i know he's neglecting things about human nature, the idea of money will always exist, it has nothing to do with currency or politics but more about basic evolutionary traits of our genus, thus some inequality will exist (at least for many many years to come) not matter what.

But, poverty/theft/crime WILL decrease dramatically if we implement most of his ideas in a more realistic way.
There is no utopia, there will always be corruption.
So no, its not as good he thinks but its still BETTER than our current socio economics.

All the fuss about VP is the free energy, and everything else that comes with it.
Capitalism was always alive, in one form or another, having all this energy abundance will make capitalism to change form from its current one, it will make things easier.

[Anonymous No.3206365]

>>3205450
>If capitalism didn't destroy the world in the 20th Century, it's not gonna.

Take a look at America; the fat epidemic, while largely people's poor judgment, is also largely the result of companies taking advantage of instinctual cravings for what used to be rare nutritional resources.

The drug companies were quick to take opportunity of our health crisis which is at least partially the result of the business practices of our food industry.

Basically what this shows it that capitalism is a cascade system where bad things can be pushed on the population as a whole in order to extract profit from the population.

So even if the financial system doesn't collapse that does not mean that quality of life won't start sliding back down the hill.

[Anonymous No.3206372]

>>3206104
broken link

[Anonymous No.3206390]

>>3205695
>>3205735
Actually you could still have robots fixing robots however anything beyond the Fixer Robot is a hyperbole.

A1 may clean toilets and be fixed by B1 but B1 will be fixed by B2 not C2 (Tier C and up doesn't exist)

[Anonymous No.3206418]

>>3205814
>>3205824

Often the simplest questions are the most ignorant.

For your example, dishwashers work exceptionally well if given half a chance. People don't give them half a chance though they're designed to wash whole loads at once in order to be economical.

So people wait to fill the dishwasher while food crusted dishes sit in there for days such that it would take a direct blast of pressurized water to clean them (another thing modern dishwashers aren't designed for)

With that said the only other problem with them is water spots, which is really a matter of hurrdurr as anything which allows hard water to air dry from it's surface will get water spots.

[Anonymous No.3206465]

I'd say most people don't contemplate the constructs other men have made around them, though they do use them on a daily basis.

the current system wont fall because primate instinct wont allow it

[Anonymous No.3206511]

>>3206270
>and yes i have watched all three movies
>There is no utopia,

He specifically states that VP wouldn't be utopia (utopia is impossible), just that it would be a lot better than where we are now

[Anonymous No.3206550]

Peak oil appears to have been and gone already, so technically we're already on the downslope of the collapse. Get your advanced subject education now, while it still exists.

[Anonymous No.3206573]

>>3206418
The removal of phosphate from detergent didn't help either

[Anonymous No.3206625]

How does this dude address other kinds of scarcity? For instance, I want that plot of land next to the lake so I can build a cool lakefront house, but the lake edge can only allow for 200 plots of land while the people living around the lake area number up to 10000. What criteria decide who can live on the lakefront?

[Anonymous No.3206829]

>>3205814
What about people who find doing some sort of job no one wants to is fun? What about truly nice people out there?

>inb4 mad misanthropic pricks who take evolutionary psychology seriously

[Anonymous No.3206842]

Why help others who, if times were, desperate would do bad things to you?

[Anonymous No.3206857]

>>3206625
First come first serve? What other method is appropriate even within your vaunted capitalism?

[Anonymous No.3206859]

>>3205935
more proof that nature is evil

if evolution is the same on every planet in the universe, then we must destroy the universe! it is sadistic!

[Anonymous No.3206862]

>>3205935
>Terror and war? That's been around since before humans had fire and language. It exists everywhere and everywhen, and it will never change.
why?

Because the universe and its creation, nature, is sadistic.

[Anonymous No.3206872]

>>3206012
>>3206023
why is it that everything posted that /sci/ does not like they always post something be wrong about it?

[Anonymous No.3206892]

I don't understand why people want to help primates.

they are the reason we are like this

[Anonymous No.3207134]

>>3206857
what if I want it more than someone who came before me? perhaps he would like a hilltop house more so than a lake house, yet he was not able to be first in line for it and had to settle for the lake? what if I then initiate a series of trades with willing parties such that I ended up with claim to a hilltop plot which I could then trade with this lakefront gentleman? I then would have on my hands a rudimentary barter economy. the obvious next step would be to create a more efficient method of exchange -- perhaps we can call it money.