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2023-11: Warosu is now out of extended maintenance.

/sci/ - Science & Math

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2806524 No.2806524 [Reply] [Original]

>> No.2806525

Who said that exactly?

>> No.2806526

>>2806524
Source and context of quote?

captcha: musical notes

>> No.2806544
File: 2.24 MB, 881x1151, niccolo.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2806544

>>2806525
>>2806526

>> No.2806555

hey, it's machiavelli!

>> No.2806556

>>2806544
Uhhh, was this from The Prince? You know that it's commonly thought to be a work of satire, right?

>> No.2806558
File: 175 KB, 492x559, Couldnthavebeenchance.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2806558

"As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion:" - G. Washington.

This bitch has been decaying since its inception.

>> No.2806563

Machiavelli was himself a nonbeliever and only saw religion useful as an instrument of control.

>> No.2806564

>>2806558
Was still founded during a time when Christian values were the prevalent ones in western society.

>> No.2806567

>>2806564
like slavery and misogamy

>> No.2806581

>>2806567

who hated marriage?

>> No.2806584
File: 66 KB, 300x300, mfwstupid.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2806584

>>2806564

herp derp - The FUCKING FOUNDER JUST SAID IT WASNT BASED ON CHRISTIANITY. You want me to fucking write it in Chinese? German? French? Perhaps in Binary? what language does it need to be written in for it to go through that dense skull of yours?

>> No.2806592

>>2806581

Karl Marx (atheist, racist, and self-hating Jew) stated that the family had to be broken down to build the new society.

>> No.2806643

There is no surer sign of stagnation in a country than to see the study of science held in contempt

>> No.2806648

>>2806643
lols
~brofist~

>> No.2806653

>>2806643
*high five*

>> No.2806657

>>2806643

That's what happens the more atheistic and socialistic a nation becomes. Science is perverted and turned into a political weapon.

>> No.2806666

>>2806653
>>2806648
>>2806643

Samefag.

>> No.2806669

>>2806657

Or it's centralized.

>> No.2806674

>>2806666
Someone doesn't know how to detect samefag!

>> No.2806675

>>2806657

Food, water, shelter, transportation, communication, entertainment, etc.

Yep pretty perverted...

pro tip: Science doesn't have the capacity to be perverted. People, on the other hand, have the capacity to be complete morons.

>> No.2806688
File: 42 KB, 460x377, holocaust4.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2806688

Here's an example of science gone horribly wrong, ie. thinking you can make a new, better, scientifically-developed race of men.

>> No.2806695

>>2806688
There was nothing scientific about the holocaust. Trying to achieve an ends does not equal science.
Had Hitler set up a control group and systematically tried to work out the best people to run the world, that would have been science.

>> No.2806701

>>2806688

Yea, making better people was totally the reason behind killing off teh jews. 2/10 because you're probably seriously.

>> No.2806704
File: 10 KB, 200x279, Josef_Mengele_02.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2806704

>>2806675

>Science doesn't have the capacity to be perverted.

Really? You wanna tell that to this guy?

>> No.2806713

>>2806695

>There was nothing scientific about the holocaust.

It came out of the eugenics movement, which was mainstream scientific thought at one time.

>> No.2806718

>>2806704
People are perverted, science is not. Bit of a truism, but once it's preverted it's no longer science

>> No.2806724

>>2806695

>Had Hitler set up a control group and systematically tried to work out the best people to run the world, that would have been science.

Wouldn't work due to human nature. Besides, determining what the "best people" are is entirely subjective

>> No.2806729

>>2806701

That's what they believed. That Jews, Gypsies, and others were inferior cancer races that had to be exterminated to build a better world.

>> No.2806732

>>2806718

Then the Inquisition was just due to bad people and their religion was not at fault. Ok, gotcha.

>> No.2806734

>>2806713
>It came out of the eugenics movement, which was mainstream scientific thought at one time.

Here's my last protip for the night.

When someone calls something religion in "good faith", it is religion. The act of belief without evidence, aka faith, makes it religion.

When someone calls something science, that doesn't make it science.

Religion and faith is rule by democracy. Science is not. Scientific truths are not democratic. Science is based on objective evidence.

It is false that "the holocaust is scientific", whatever the fuck that means. It's not right, but it's not even wrong. To be wrong, you need some sort of system in place to determine wrongness.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Not_even_wrong

Now repeat after me: Science cannot answer moral questions. Science cannot give commandments, nor give reasons to do something. Science merely gives falsifiable predictions. If you choose to act on that knowledge, that chose is non-science. It is asinine to say that the holocaust is scientific. It's just nonsensical. People decided that they /wanted/ to "improve" the human race, which is not a matter of falsifiability, and thus not science.

>> No.2806737

>>2806734
>choice
fixed

>> No.2806769
File: 11 KB, 462x269, sam5qo9[2].jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2806769

>>2806734
> Science cannot answer moral questions

>> No.2806775

>>2806769
Yep Harris. You're wrong.

Sam Harris takes as implicit that human suffering is bad. I agree with that, but that is not a scientific claim.

It's also not a complete morality either. I sometimes prefer suffering to non-suffering. For example, if/when I get a gf, I would rather know if she cheated on me than if not. Also "Live free or die" is not a euphemism. There are plenty of examples where the naive definition of human suffering is the best possible outcome.

>> No.2806784

>>2806769

Is-ought problem. Science says what the world is. What it should be is not defined in science, just ethics.

>> No.2806818

>>2806704
>implying he did science and not just fulfill his fetish fantasies

>> No.2806854
File: 65 KB, 90x150, 1296860726506.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2806854

>>2806775

most scientific principles are derived from fundamental axioms.

I see no reason why we shouldn't use "human suffering is bad".

Really, if you wanted you could say that "Human suffering is perceived bad by 99% of humans", which is an object truth....

Either way, I don't see your beef.

>> No.2806861

>>2806854

Because that's not science, that's ethics. Unless you want to make ethics a science, which might be doable.

Remember just because something is based on axioms doesn't make it science. Mathematics is not science.

Furthermore, science is primarily empirical, not deductive.

>> No.2806867

eugenic is not science, it's a policy, it belongs to political science.

>> No.2806914

If nobody ever disrespected the rites of religion, then everyone in the world would hold whatever superstitions proto-humans had, animism or whatever, and we would probably still be hunter-gatherers, too.

But yes, from a Machievelian perspective, a religiously homogeneous and devout populace is certainly easier for a monarch to manipulate, and so has a kind of inherent stability in that sense.

>> No.2807036

>>2806544
oh shit
I had no idea galileo said that

>> No.2807053

>>2807036
not sure if troll or just stupid

>> No.2807123

>>2806558

That was said by John Adams, not Washington.

The point still stands, though.

>> No.2807822
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2807822

>>2806524
fix'd

>> No.2807841
File: 714 KB, 925x307, dsc001.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2807841

WHAT ATHEISM LEADS TO

>> No.2807904

>>2807123
True.

The Treaty of Tripoli (Treaty of Peace and Friendship between the United States of America and the Bey and Subjects of Tripoli of Barbary) was the first treaty concluded between the United States of America and Tripoli, signed at Tripoli on November 4, 1796 and at Algiers (for a third-party witness) on January 3, 1797. It was submitted to the Senate by President John Adams, receiving ratification unanimously from the U.S. Senate on June 7, 1797 and signed by Adams, taking effect as the law of the land on June 10, 1797.

"Now be it known, That I John Adams, President of the United States of America, having seen and considered the said Treaty do, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate, accept, ratify, and confirm the same, and every clause and article thereof"

>> No.2807946
File: 1.09 MB, 1944x2592, Kostnice_Sedlec.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2807946

>>2807841

it is funny, because you know where the right picture with the skulls on it is from?

"The Sedlec Ossuary (Czech: kostnice Sedlec) is a small Roman Catholic chapel, located beneath the Cemetery Church of All Saints (Czech: Hřbitovní kostel Všech Svatých) in Sedlec, a suburb of Kutná Hora in the Czech Republic. The ossuary is estimated to contain the skeletons of between 40,000 and 70,000 people, many of whom have had their bones artistically arranged to form decorations and furnishings for the chapel."

>> No.2807957
File: 56 KB, 514x418, PolPot.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2807957

>>2807946

Actually it was from...

>> No.2807973
File: 45 KB, 480x360, 1killing_fields_skulls.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2807973

>>2807946

BTW, here's another pic. Definitely from Cambodia.

>> No.2808004

>Then the Inquisition was just due to bad people and their religion was not at fault. Ok, gotcha.

Yes. Thats exactly right.

Well, to be fair religion is actually more of a democratic thing, so it could eventually become part of the religion, but the start of it was bad men misinterpreting the religions tenants.