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/sci/ - Science & Math

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2659651 No.2659651 [Reply] [Original]

Hey niggers.

Have an essay due in 3 days about whether or not we have free will or are our actions pre-determined. I've picked up a Philosophy module as an elective so every single nigger in my class is epic at writing this shit and I'm the retarded Physics nerd who can't spell.

Anyway, should I argue for or against this? I need to waffle 2500 words on it.

>> No.2659656

>>2659651
You can write an entire essay on how to even define free will...

>> No.2659661

>>2659656


think of it from a primitive point of view

>> No.2659663

Write a 2500 word essay on how you chose not to do the essay out of free will

>> No.2659666

As in, it's a level 1 module so nothing too complex.

>> No.2659668

>>2659661
That will inevitably lead to a shitty essay.

>> No.2659674
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2659674

>>2659668

Care to guide me then? I admit I'm a fucking idiot.

>> No.2659675

Wow, paradox, because he would then have done the essay... I bet you'd get a good grade if you did that, OP.

>> No.2659678

>>2659675
I don't know why 4chan is losing my "in-reply-to" numbers recently, but I was responding to this: >>2659663

>> No.2659682

>>2659663

This. You will genuinely achieve a good grade.

>> No.2659683
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2659683

>>2659675
that's the tweeest

>> No.2659691

Just tell me whether I should be for or against it please? What would you guys choose?

>> No.2659697

You can argue about free will in terms of quantum mechanics.

You can talk about the Heisenberg uncertainty principle. Since your conscious is nothing more than the sum of the all of the actions of the cells in your brain it would seem logical that at some point the inherent uncertainty at extremely small levels would give way to lots of randomness.
Hence, your will is neither free or pre-determined. It is completely random.

>> No.2659719

So should I argue against it then?

>> No.2659722

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laplace%27s_demon

>> No.2659727 [DELETED] 

>>2659697
>>2659674
Don't you have any independent thoughts?

It would be best to make a clear definition of what exactly you think is free will. Wiki if necessary. Being an experimentalists, I would choose to not take a standpoint because there is insufficient data to make a substantiated conclusion either way. Given that your class is philosophy however, I would argue it does not exist because you presume some superfluous entity not subject to mechanical laws of the universe to make a 'decision' (whatever that means).
>It is completely random.
It might still be probabilistic, which is not the same as random or predetermined..

>> No.2659725

Argue for pre-determined. Reasons are plentiful.

>> No.2659733

>>2659674
Don't you have any independent thoughts?

It would be best to make a clear definition of what exactly you think is free will. Wiki if necessary. Being an experimentalists, I would choose to not take a standpoint because there is insufficient data to make a substantiated conclusion either way. Given that your class is philosophy however, I would argue it does not exist because you presume some superfluous entity not subject to mechanical laws of the universe to make a 'decision' (whatever that means).
>>2659697
>It is completely random.
It might still be probabilistic, which is not the same as random or predetermined..

>> No.2659736

>>2659733
>It might still be probabilistic, which is not the same as random or predetermined..
Also, the uncertainty principle doesn't tell us anything about determinism. All it shows is that if the universe were in fact to operate in a deterministic fashion, we could never predict the future path of the universe if we were to know its exact state at one time.

>> No.2659741

>implying that free will exists

That essay should be easy if you are physics nerd. Just define free will and explain why there is none.

>> No.2659743

OP if you're a physics nerd check out some of Gerard t'Hooft's stuff he's got some really cool papers on this subject.

If I was you I'd argue from a deterministic point of view. Talk about what you know: physics, and argue that the macroscale nature of the brain gives rise to determinism. This should be relatively straightforward. Even the probabilistic nature of QM does not necessarily give rise to free will. People do this hand wavy bullshit with that, you could and spit a paragraph or two and strawman some of your rambly philosophy classmates using BS arguments, and illustrate with pretty basic QM that they're full of crap. Just some ideas.

Really this is a paper in a low level philosophy class from the sound of things man, I think you can get away with a lot of less that rigorous ideas and viewpoints, but you get a lot more wiggle room for opinion than a scientific paper.

>> No.2659746

>>2659663
This is gold. Do it OP, you faggot.

>> No.2659750

>>2659725

I don't really believe it's pre-determined though...but I'm willing to go for whatever is easier.

>> No.2659773

>>2659750
Well you should because there are no reason to assume that free will exists. Unless of course you count bible or something similar as evidence.

>> No.2660118

>>2659651
You should argue against free will.
Your argument is simple. Bring in a VHS tape of you saying
> "I'm going to flip a coin."
> Then you flip a coin.
> "I called heads last time but I have free will, so I'm going to... oh. I have to call heads."
> Look at coin.
> Hold it up. It's heads.
Then rewind the tape.
Say, "Now I have reset the entire universe and all its variables to the previous condition. Let's see if I do something different because of my free will."
Play the tape again. And again.

>> No.2660140

>>2659651

if the essay is about 'whether or not we have free will', it means its a shit philosophy class. just write a shit paper and you'll be fine;

>> No.2660227

>>2659651
We don't have free will even if our actions aren't predetermined.

If an action is deterministic then it is determined by what came before, and so you can not be said to have any control of said action.

If the action is not deterministic then it must be stochastic which means it is randomly determined, and so you can not be said to have any control of said action.

>> No.2660242

doesn't matter really unless you can find a way to access parallel dimensions

>> No.2660249

>>2659733
>It might still be probabilistic, which is not the same as random
Wat? You'll have to explain this one to me.

not op btw

>> No.2660294

My Essay on Free Will
by Anonymous
It is my contention that I do not have free will.
What is the definition of free will? The ability to choose between two different things and do either of them. This is clearly impossible, as can be demonstrated by simple thought experiment. You will not stop reading this essay right now and simply give me an A.


You will read this sentence, thus proving there is no free will, so I deserve the A for proving my statement.
You will be pissed off that I proved it this way instead of writing five pages or using philosophy, so you'll give me a B out of your personal bias instead of the A that I deserve.