So /sci/, what did you faggots think of the new Zeitgeist: Moving Forward? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Z9WVZddH9w pic unrelated.

File: 235 KB, 474x316, tumblr_l39tz9i1qa1qa2ns7o1_500.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Sat Jan 29 22:54:59 2011 No.2440618 [Reply] [Original]

So /sci/, what did you faggots think of the new Zeitgeist: Moving Forward?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Z9WVZddH9w

pic unrelated.

>>	Scientist Sat Jan 29 22:56:59 2011 No.2440630 >>2440618 Bullshit mixed with more bullshit.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 22:58:59 2011 No.2440638 >>2440630 Sounds about right.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:00:59 2011 No.2440650 Not a whole lot to be honest.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:01:59 2011 No.2440651 I know people who actually believe in this shit. How do I convince them that it's bullshit?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:05:24 2011 No.2440669 >>2440651 Well you have to specific, for one. What was bullshit? And what reliable facts do have to support your notion of what was bullshit? I'm watching it now for the first time....

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:06:59 2011 No.2440676 >>2440651 You are just as bad as the people taken in by the claims the movie makes without thinking about it. If you are so smart and know it's bullshit for sure, you should be able to tell them why without help.

Scientist Sat Jan 29 23:07:59 2011 No.2440679

>>2440651
Step 1: Ask them if they want people living in houses. If they do, then we need hammers, saws, nails, etc., and the only way that's happening is if we have specialization of labor.

So, how does the hammer maker get food?
1- He barters his hammers for food.
2- He sells his hammers for money, and buys food.
3- A ridiculously complex system whereby the state controls all aspects of the economy.

Proceed to ridicule 3 as unpracticable. Inform them that it's basically impossible to program a computer which could actually run the economy to any satisfactory degree.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:07:59 2011 No.2440680 >>2440651 Well you have to be specific, for one. What was bullshit? And what reliable facts do have to support your notion of what was bullshit? I'm watching it now for the first time, so I'll see I guess.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:09:59 2011 No.2440694 >>2440676 Why you saging my thread, negro?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:13:59 2011 No.2440716 Why is this thread posted twice a day!? Why was /new/ deleted, now all the tinfoil hatters come here. Saeg for pseudoscience.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:13:59 2011 No.2440724 The Venus Project sees clothes as something that they could easily do without. Seriously. While this could be appealing for the viewing of beautiful women, the majority of people have disgusting bodies.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:13:59 2011 No.2440726 >>2440716 Forgot my sage. (Yes, I realize sage is useless, I'm just that mad.)

i- !LoVeEKpnh2 Sat Jan 29 23:14:59 2011 No.2440728
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god damn it, why so many FUCKING ZEITGEIST THREADS.

fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread fuck this gay thread

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:15:59 2011 No.2440736 Basically, I thought this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pg5K07c72Tw

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:16:59 2011 No.2440739 no.

Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:19:59 2011 No.2440761

Tried watching it, but after about 15 mintutes the bullshit was too much.

At the very start they say that "one of the most dangerous notions is that behaviour is genetic". They use the word "dangerous" to try and end the debate.

Behaviour is almost 100 % genetic. I behave like a human because of my genetics.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:20:59 2011 No.2440770 File: 59 KB, 500x500, 1291950560840.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2440761

Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:22:59 2011 No.2440783

>>2440761
Apparently, that 's what they thought too, if you kept watching. Not that I don't blame you. One of my conspiracy friends on facebook posted an angry rant about that, that's the only reason I know. Apparently saying behavior is genetic is grounds to throw a fit on facebook, condemning a whole movement. The whole thing's silly either way.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:22:59 2011 No.2440784 >>2440761 I know I'm absolutely right and there is absolutely no way I'm wrong, so I ignore facts because my opinion trumps them.

Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:23:59 2011 No.2440788

>>2440761
>>2440761
I haven't watched it and personally think these threads don't belong here, buuuuut..
dude, behaviour is to an extremely large extent determined by cultural/social/parental contexts. Of course there are certain biological certainties, such as your "behaviour" of eating, breathing and wanting to fuck, but what you said is just stupid.

Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:24:59 2011 No.2440792

>>2440680

I'll bite. because the ARTIST that makes these movies openly admits he doesn't care about facts.

also go fuck yourself dipshit, there is no fucking burden of proof for people subjected to this inane speculative turd.

go buy some fucking land and start a commune and show an example of your bullshit theories if you believe them so much. then let some random criminals, idiots, pricks, and several other cultures in and see if it still works. too hard? do what you're really motivated to do and go die of old age working for a gas station bitching about the man. just shut the fuck up.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:25:59 2011 No.2440795 >>2440770 >>2440784 >contributing to the debate >derping choose one

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:27:59 2011 No.2440808 >>2440761 >>2440784 Not samefag.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:28:59 2011 No.2440814 >>2440792 >I'll bite. because the ARTIST that makes these movies openly admits he doesn't care about facts. That sentence alone would have been fine. I just wanted to know what parts of the movie to look out for, calm down bro.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:28:59 2011 No.2440813 > behavior is genetic Yea, my memory is genetic to. Assassin's creed isn't a video game, its an interactive documentary. The only thing supporting the genetic behavior theory is anecdotal circlejerking.

>>	Scientist Sat Jan 29 23:30:59 2011 No.2440824 >>2440813 And the many studies which all show that humans share a similar innate Kantian morality. Except well documented evidence like that.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:30:59 2011 No.2440832 >>2440736 Watched, good vid, don't exactly agree with him on everything but he knows econ

Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:33:59 2011 No.2440848

Speaking of cranky economics, anyone else here use Bitcoin? 1BTC=40 cents, which is pretty crazy for a completely made up currency. I'm putting all my video card's runtime into processing hashes of all pending transactions, earning shares in the additional bitcoins created as an incentive to do so.

1BqRfwmfiE9zxLgLsmcgdK94Rfbtj29QPJ

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:34:59 2011 No.2440853 >>2440824 >enact study to determine if morality is universal >don't account for the fact 99.9% of people will answer what they think you want to hear when present with moral dilemma. Divide by derp.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:34:59 2011 No.2440855 Behaviour is 100 % genetic. My genetics define my physical make-up, including my ability to sense and interact with the surrounding environment (it gives me ears and eyes and arms etc). Therefore without any senses I cannot behave. Problem /sci/?

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:34:59 2011 No.2440858 >>2440848 wait, what?

>>	Scientist Sat Jan 29 23:35:59 2011 No.2440861 >>2440853 >don't account for the fact 99.9% of people will answer what they think you want to hear when present with moral dilemma. Citations please. Oh wait, you're just pulling that out of your ass.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:36:59 2011 No.2440869 >>2440848 bitcoin kinda snuck into legitimacy by being one of the very few ways to move money anonymously.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:36:59 2011 No.2440866 >>2440855 Without genetics Andrew Wiles would never have been able to prove Fermat's last thm. Thus the proof Fermat's last thm is completely genetic. Also bicycles and condoms are genetic.

Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:40:59 2011 No.2440899

>>2440869
Yeah, there's one guy on the Bitcoin forum who's trying to take down the Chinese government by trading Yuan for bitcoins. He only has 500 yuan, and if you "buy" them he just keeps them at his house unless you come over to get them from him.

Not to say serious people don't use it and just stay a lot quieter than the nutters.

Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:46:59 2011 No.2440940

>>2440858
Basically it uses public key cryptography to "sign" any transactions you send out with your key and that of the recipient, so everyone can see that you've sent off money and the recipient can prove they're the ones who got it (because they have the private key for the public key they use to send out money). Everyone has a list of all transactions made so by adding it up you can see how much money is associated with which public key. Oh, and to encourage people to work on keeping this list of transactions current those who put their computer time to it get rewarded with bitcoins (which is how they get created in the first place). There's an upper limit on how many can exist in total, though.

>>	Anonymous Sat Jan 29 23:51:59 2011 No.2440973 >>2440792 Stop making yourself look like an asshat. >>2440814 Ditto, seriously.

Anonymous Sun Jan 30 03:38:59 2011 No.2442033

Well it's light years better than the original since it at least doesn't devolve into conspiracy nonsense. The ideas presented are interesting and probably could "work" on a smaller level. And by "work" I mean it could function as a system and not break down but wouldn't deliver to any major degree the utopian promises it claims the system would bring. Basically they are suggesting making the world one giant control system, which I suppose could be done in principle, but you'd need an army of engineers to pull something like that together, even at a smaller scale it would be very difficult. The Soviets had a similar system and they found it impossible to continue as the economy grew and diversified, plus it didn't work particularly well. I do think however that this sort of system could be used for some future Mars colony or a small test village for proof of concept. I'm not as dismissive as a lot of people about this honestly, though I don't think I'll be holding my breath on the inevitability of this system.

tldr; interesting idea, but probably impractical for the near term due to limitations in technology, though they should try it on a small scale, also won't deliver the bill of goods promised. No debunking needed either, not conspiracy crap.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 30 03:40:59 2011 No.2442043 Beast. My generation (generation X from 1990's) already thinks this way. Every child from my generation agrees with this. Cya dumb hick war generation of 1930

Anonymous Sun Jan 30 03:46:59 2011 No.2442060

>>2442033

Oh, I should also just mention as a way to expand on my comment that this isn't really a new idea per se. Lot's of these ideas grew out of Cybernetics, which has been around in one form or another for around a hundred years. Also the Chileans experimented with a tangentially related system called Project Cybersyn. Also many factories use enterprise resource planning systems with great success. Also the Soviets, though they were even more limited by technology. So yeah I think the potential is there, but the idea is embryonic at the moment.

Anonymous Sun Jan 30 03:53:59 2011 No.2442076

>>2442060

One final thought. I see the seeds for totalitarianism in the utopian vision of eliminating all violence, the 5% they were talking about wouldn't be changed by lack of social stratification etc. Reconfiguring entire societies to fit the needs of a tiny minority usually end up in tyranny. It's the old question of positive liberty vs. negative liberty. This is why lots of people bash liberals, they want everyone else to pick up the slack for or kowtow to some perceived oppressed minority. Also why identity politics are so corrosive, but that's another conversation entirely.

>>	Scientist Sun Jan 30 03:53:59 2011 No.2442078 >>2442043 My eye is twitching from someone quoting Beast from X-Men as a reliable source on scientific discussions... Please don't do that.

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 30 03:59:59 2011 No.2442098 i liked the idea of a fully mechanised labor force. I don't see any down side from it besides some stupid hicks losing there jobs and complaining

>>	Anonymous Sun Jan 30 04:20:59 2011 No.2442183 >>2442098 >zeitgeist starts talking about gpd and living standards >make sweeping and inaccurate generalizations >zeitgeist fails

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