/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.2280707]

What evidence is there to suggest a link between race and ability to perform in certain fields (whether it be mathematically, physically, etc.) for any given race? Basically, evidence to support racial superiority/inferiority.

Are races generally different just due to cultural, dietary and social differences or is there some genetic consistency that gives some races a (general) benefit over others?

inb4 racist shitstorm, take that elsewhere please.

[Anonymous No.2280730]

[Anonymous No.2280732]

The differences that exist are secondary to the conditions we have control over.

Same as with a racial propensity towards any given disease does not mean that they'd get it if given proper medical and nutritional attention.

[Anonymous No.2280734]

>>2280730
Hey, that isn't related to my thread you silly goose!

[Anonymous No.2280740]

>>2280732
>The differences that exist are secondary to the conditions we have control over.

But are there any studies that suggest there are differences to begin with, and if so to what extent they impact the development of an individual from one race over another?

[Anonymous No.2280742]

>>2280707
>superiority/inferiority
These are value judgments and can't be answered by science.

Generally speaking races are different due to cultural differences. Some physical differences do exist between races (more white muscles in African Americans compared to Asians and Caucasians for instance) that are partly genetic in origin, but differences in intelligence (higher IQ for Asians compared to Caucasians for instance) are not genetically determined.

[Anonymous No.2280787]

Race doesn't really exist. Ask a genetesist.

[Anonymous No.2280805]

>>2280787

this is another example of faulty reductionism

just cause something doesn't have a genetic basis does not mean it "doesn't exist" lol

seriously guys, how stupid can you get?

it's like saying wetness doesn't exist because individual atoms are not wet...

you are reducing too far, race is a higher order macro property...it exists just as much as any other sensory phenomena we perceive

[Anonymous No.2280812]

>>2280742
Yes they are

[Anonymous No.2280826]

Guns, Germs and Steel. Read it, then come back.

[Anonymous No.2280836]

>>2280812
Then you're parents must be pretty damned stupid.

[Anonymous No.2280841]

>>2280836
Due in no small part to them being black

[Anonymous No.2280843]

>>2280787

>>Race doesn't really exist. Ask a genetesist.

Yes it does:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2005/01/050128221025.htm

Given the morally questionable history of genetics, and hereditary studies before it had in justifying things like eugenics, no geneticist wants to say anything that will legitimize racism. As such they have found a very specific way of looking at genetics that permits them to say that, in a sense, race doesn't exist. It is, from their perspective, the only ethical thing to do given the history of their discipline.

But obviously race does exist, or forensic scientists would not be able to tell you the race of a suspect from a blood or semen sample for instance.

[Anonymous No.2280894]

>>2280843
>Stanford

You may as well be linking to faux news.

[Anonymous No.2280897]

>>2280843
>But obviously race does exist, or forensic scientists would not be able to tell you the race of a suspect from a blood or semen sample for instance.
What? Just because you can identify some physicat traits from those tests does not mean one can idenity a race. For example, both Africans and Australian Aboriginies usually have black hair, while they're not closely connected groups. And even fucking Iran has a large blue-eyed population.

[Anonymous No.2280898]

>>2280894

Are you fucking kidding me

[Anonymous No.2280903]

>>2280897
and please disregard my horrible typos, I'm wasted

[Anonymous No.2280905]

>>2280897

>>What? Just because you can identify some physicat traits from those tests does not mean one can idenity a race.

You didn't read the study. It was more than that. Stop skimming, looking for the first plausible reason you can find to casually dismiss my position and actually read the fucking study.

[Anonymous No.2280920]

>>2280898
>Pay more
>Lesser education to make room for more intra-school politics

[Anonymous No.2280937]

>What evidence is there to suggest a link between race and ability


A shit ton. No one likes to talk about it because tards think they are racist.

But it is a provable fact that niggers and sand niggers are not as intellegent as whites and chinks.

This guy studies the fuck out of this for decades: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufzI1dnd0Uw

I like his conclusion that niggers in Africa are not stupid because they are poor and live in shit. They can only build to the level of shit and their stupidity makes them poor.

Of course he is more tactful in his explinations.

[Anonymous No.2280978]

>>2280905
There is no study. That's a fucking news magazine. I might have read the original study, had you provided a link to it.

[Anonymous No.2281009]

>>2280937

Forgot the link to relaible scientific data explination for why niggers be so dumb.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwyjsJJrr2I&feature=player_embedded

[Anonymous No.2281036]

take a genetics class. Race doesn't exist. Skin color differences evolved extremely recently compared to the evolution of intelligence. Genetic variability of humans is so very very tiny, two humans on opposite ends of the globe have more in common than two monkeys in the same tribe.

However, differences in performance on IQ tests is real. The differences can be explained by environmental factors though. IQ is about 60% genetic and 40% environment, and considering the drastic differences in environment between blacks and whites, it's no surprise the average black IQ score is way less than the average white IQ score.

[Anonymous No.2281063]

>>2280937
>>2281009
I like how the people that seem the least intelligent and with the lowest education always think these sorts of things. Fucking youtube as a source. I'd laugh if it wasn't so fucking sad.

[Anonymous No.2281068]

>>2280978

>>There is no study. That's a fucking news magazine. I might have read the original study, had you provided a link to it.

The article is describing a study carried out at Stanford. The study is cited at the end of the article.

[Anonymous No.2281089]

>>2281036

>>take a genetics class. Race doesn't exist.

My prof told us it does.

>>Skin color differences evolved extremely recently compared to the evolution of intelligence. Genetic variability of humans is so very very tiny

Yes, and humans are 98% similar to chimps. But that 2% makes the difference between hurling shit and walking on the moon. It is not at all a stretch to suggest that a much smaller percentage makes the difference between selling crack and rocket science.

>> two humans on opposite ends of the globe have more in common than two monkeys in the same tribe.

This does not contradict the notion of race; it isn't gross genetic difference, it's the frequency of expression for specific traits definitive of each racial grouping across populations.

[Anonymous No.2281123]

blacks and whites have the SaME DNA. all people are EQUAL. stop being racistism itys not cool

[Anonymous No.2281145]

>>2281068
I know that dumbfuck. You need a provide a link to the original source (preferably in pdf from, although online is fine). This article is a second hand story of the study and shows no data. Didn't your teachers ever teach you not to cite secondary sources, like Wikipedia?

[Anonymous No.2281158]

>>2281145

>>I know that dumbfuck.

No you didn't, or you wouldn't have said "there is no study".

>>You need a provide a link to the original source (preferably in pdf from, although online is fine). This article is a second hand story of the study and shows no data. Didn't your teachers ever teach you not to cite secondary sources, like Wikipedia?

This isn't Wikipedia, idiot. When arguing on a fucking messageboard you don't link to PDFs of the original study because you'll get "tl;dr" as a reply. You link to an article because it's a comfortably formatted summary of the study's contents and conclusion.

The citation is RIGHT IN THE ARTICLE. Scroll down. It's at the bottom. Your complaint is invalid because of this.

[Anonymous No.2281358]

>>inb4 racist shitstorm, take that elsewhere please.
The problem began when you showed respect for someone's concept of race

[Anonymous No.2281405]

>>2281123
> blacks and whites have the SaME DNA. all people are EQUAL. stop being racistism itys not cool

First, no one except identical twins has "the same" DNA.
Second, being deserving of equal rights (which I totally support) is a completely different matter from how diverse the human genome is and how genetic difference cluster.

People with different traits, where the traits are genetically based, obviously have different DNA.

There is a lot more to this than skin color. It even affects health. Some genetic diseases are are much more common in some races than others. - for example Sickle-cell or Tay-Sachs.

Forensic pathologists can often determine the race of a victim from only skeletal remains - Asians generally have more curvature in the leg bones, etc.

[Anonymous No.2281851]

Race as it's commonly used, as an anthropological concept, is kind of a shite classification for humans anyway. It depends largely on appearance, very often specifically skin colour.

[Anonymous No.2281887]

>>2281405
Theres more genetic variation within races than between.

[Anonymous No.2281936]

>>2281887
That doesn't make any sense sillybuns.

[Anonymous No.2281957]

>>2280707

your question answered...

niggers pick the cotton.
white people make sure the cotton is picked.

any questions?

[Anonymous No.2282175]

>>2281068
>The article is describing a study carried out at Stanford.
Then fucking take one minute to actually cite it. Youtube is not a source, and we're only going to laugh at you if you suggest that it is.

[Anonymous No.2282253]

Two questions:

1) Is it possible for a serious study to be done into hereditary links between race and intelligence without it being compromised by political concerns? It seems to me quite unlikely that scientists (at least in Western countries) would ever get a fair hearing if they argued that whites are more intelligent than blacks. It would also risk career suicide to say anything too controversial.

2) Is the claim that IQ differences between races are environmental a falsifiable one? Since everyone is brought up in a different way and since racial stereotyping is deeply embedded into society, it seems that it would be impossible for any study to completely account for environmental differences when looking into IQ gaps between racial groups. But this means that it will be impossible to disprove claims that all racial differences are down to environment even if these claims are wrong.

[Anonymous No.2282294]

>>2282253
As regards point 2, the anthropological and scientific (biology, specifically) definitions are hopelessly confused, using the literal root meaning of the word. They're inextricable at this point, and any science that uses race as a parameter is intrinsically and subtly tainted by that con-fusion, mixing, blending of very different meanings. Concept validity is therefore very low.

I'll not comment on point 1, save to say that people who use concepts with low validity will often be ignored.

[Anonymous No.2282371]

>>2282253
1) Sadly, no. For some reason these sorts of studies would carry over the implication of racial discrimination, despite the fact that there obviously are outliers - and those outliers alone would be enough to justify giving everyone equal rights and basing them on their merits instead of race.

It's not like it's the difference between a cow and a man, it would just be a slight inclination at best. Hell, if the human race could get over this jump and go through with studies like these while not being racist dicks we might actually get some evidence to help cure certain diseases more prone to a specific race, etc. (or completely disprove racial differences altogether).

It's the dicks that are keeping races separate, not science.

[Anonymous No.2282408]

>Race doesn't exist
>He never watched the Olympics sprints

[Anonymous No.2284070]

I believe that a lot of time would be saved if we quit talking about "races".If the name bothers someone, os is scientificaly wrong, whatever(that reminded me of a joke..)..we all know what we are talking about.We know we are talking about afrodescendants, epicanthic fold people,white people and maybe native americans..If we call them "groups" instead of "races", I hope most nigg..I mean, trolls will lose their arguments

[Anonymous No.2284812]

>hurrduur IQ is 47.54614825% percent genetic

good god you faggots are retarded

genes are a seed, they provide POTENTIAL, nothing more

[Anonymous No.2285000]

There is no scientific basis for race. It is a human construction. There is more genetic variation within "races" than between them.

[Anonymous No.2285087]

1)Height has a high heritability
2)The Dutch are taller on average than The Japanese
3)Therefore: The Dutch must be genetically taller than the Japanese, right? WRONG

With obvious exceptions(i.e. Pygmies) genetic height does not vary notably between population groups. So why do we see such marked differences between groups?

BECAUSE IT IS TRIVIAL FOR ENVIRONMENT TO OVERWHELM GENETICS!

[Anonymous No.2285092]

The problem is that genetic similarity is a fairly even distribution where genetic similarity decreases as the distance between ancestral populations increases. There is no genetic cutoff between races and no scientific basis about the "homelands" of some races. The idea of a White race from a certain part of the world and a black race from a part of the world are false because theres no reason to place a particular location as a races homeland, any location for the homeland of a race is as valid as any other. Also, when people say there is more variation between members of a race than between races they mean there are more alleles for a particular gene. When studies such as the Stanford one find that people who identify as a race are more genetically similar they are looking at non-coding DNA.

[Anonymous No.2285098]

>>2285087
And just what environmental differences are there between the two people which account for the height difference? Height is known to be highly genetically heritable, don't just handwave it away without citing proper reasons.

[Anonymous No.2285108]

>>2284812
>implying genetic potential has no bearing on intelligence
What the fuck am I reading...You can be born a retard, not to mention another species.

[Anonymous No.2285119]

>>2280826
Did you miss the part where Jared Diamond says he thinks Aborigines are naturally more intelligent due to their harsh environment?

[Anonymous No.2285121]

Biostudentfag here.
idk man, iwouldnt say theres anything in particular OP buttttt in the same way that certain isolated humans (ie i think its ethiopian) have somehow develloped an immunity to hiv. be it acquired by exposure, or genes, or caused by simple gene mutation, it happened. who's to say it cant be the same way for intelligence aspects, or musical aspects?

[Anonymous No.2285127]

>>2285121
did not mean simple gene mutation. i mean more like simply (and "luckily") by gene mutation

[Anonymous No.2285468]

>>2285098
>hurrduurrr what environmental differences could possibly effect human grow

Diet & Disease(you moronic mongoloid motherfucker)

4" height difference between N. & S. Korea, 6" difference between nineteenth century Dutchmen and modern Dutchmen, and a 3-4" difference between early twentieth century Japanese men and modern Japanese Men

[Anonymous No.2285493]

>>2285108
>implying one can infer potential based on outcome

[Anonymous No.2285512]

>>2285468
The problem is that the Netherlands and Japan are both developed countries, meaning that neither are significant factors. The Japanese aren't exactly starving to death, and they are in fact the healthiest people in the world if you measure by life expectancy.

stop derpin'

[Anonymous No.2285537]

>>2285512
Not the guy you're responding too but there is in fact a dietary reason for why dutch people are tall. During the second world war there was an incredible shortage of food in the Netherlands which has resulted in epigenetic alterations of expression patterns of genes involved in regulating metabolism (note that epigenetic factors are non-genetic regulation mechanisms, so don't affect the genome). The first generation of children born after the second world war had higher incidences of obesity, and later generations decreased in fat but remained tall due to a faster metabolism inherited via epigenetic mechanisms.

[Anonymous No.2285547]

Biofag here. Although everyone knows what you are talking about, race is a scientifically wrong term. You are talking about phenotypic differences. A 'race' is something which has been bred artificially, i. e. a breed of dogs or cats or bunnies.

captcha: college's upshie

[Anonymous No.2285551]

>>2285121

It's Europeans, and it's due to the Black Plague

[Anonymous No.2285558]

>>2285493
there's such a thing as statistics which endeavors to solve that problem

[Anonymous No.2285561]

>>2285551

Wrong, it's actually due to smallpox and affects only 1% of the population.

[Anonymous No.2285566]

>>2285561

Ah, I stand corrected.

[Anonymous No.2285593]

>>2285512
>Dutch consumption of animal protein is 160% of japan
>no environmental differences

>>2285558
>Stats is magic!

[Anonymous No.2285713]

>>2285593
You just assume a prior Gaussian distribution and find the least error potential distribution using the data-defined outcome distribution conditioned on environmental variables

[Anonymous No.2285743]

Haha this thread is full of the, "we're all the same" type people.
Here's the definition of race:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_%28classification_of_humans%29

Now we are all humans - the same "race", however we are clearly not all the same type of human being genetically or in physical appearance.

I'm not suggesting one type - or color if you will, is better than the other. I'm merely telling the truth, that there ARE different types of people. Each group of people originated in different parts of the world and developed differently, so we have the same genetic material, but we are different in appearance, immunity, and other ways due to our geography and breeding.

[Anonymous No.2285760]

>>2285743
No shit sherlock. Did you really have to bump the thread with stating the obvious?

[Anonymous No.2285773]

Bump
Well now I do, "sherlock" :D

captcha: clonagrin enforce

[Anonymous No.2286331]

Anyone believe that there are any mental differences between men and women? If so, is any of it genetic?

[Anonymous No.2286747]

Lets start from the beginning what is the definition of "race"?

[Anonymous No.2286751]

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