/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.2123149]

How real is the threat of global warming and does CO2 really affect the heating of our planet.

We`ve recently discussed this topic in class, watched "An Inconvinient" truth just to have it more or less debunked afterwards.

tldr: is global warming real or just a way for the state to impose new taxes

[Anonymous No.2123152]

Global warming is happening but An Inconvenient Truth is a horrible movie by a man who wants to earn money by appeal to emotions.

[Anonymous No.2123159]

>>2123152
then how much of a threat is it?

[Anonymous No.2123163]

>mfw we are addicted to freedom and we won't be able to do anything about it unless we have a radically different society

[Anonymous No.2123162]

>>2123159
We are going to die at some point in the future

[Anonymous No.2123166]

very likely happening, likely man made, unknown how much it's happening.

very likely nothing will be done.

will probably affect niggers and mud people worst

[Anonymous No.2123170]

>>2123159
It's a threat mostly to our economy and most peoples' way of life, which is reason enough to be concerned about it. It's not going to be an Armageddon of some sort

[Nickmano No.2123169]

Please be trolling.

How much of a threat is the exponential increase of the planets average tempreture???

[Anonymous No.2123179]

>>2123159
Depends what you mean by "threat". It's not likely to kill us all, but it might do some things that are kinda sad.

For example, various Pacific island nations will have to evacuate, most of the world's coral will be destroyed along with a lot of fish species, and the weather will become more unpredictable.

[Anonymous No.2123185]

>>2123169
I'm aware of the fact that a massive climate shift usually causes mass extinction of species, what I want to know is how much CO2 has to do with it.

[Anonymous No.2123188]

>>2123170
>mfw the undersea hydrates evaporate out and we all die in a mass extinction event

[EK !D96TK2PSsI No.2123196]

the earth has regular ice ages.
we are about 3/4 through our interglacial period.
global warming will not be a problem...the ice age will be much more of a threat when it comes.
5000 years-ish...but i'll be long dead, so i dont give a fuck.

[Anonymous No.2123202]

the worst case scenario: Earth becomes Venus-like.

And we don't want that to happen, do we?

[Anonymous No.2123204]

NASA seems to think so.

Threat? Yes.

Flooding will rape the shit out of all the low lying east asian countries, and places like venice which are practically already sinking.

[Anonymous No.2123209]

>>2123196
So then it's not man made?
Or did you already calculate mankinds influence into your 5000ish year theory?

[Anonymous No.2123212]

>>2123204
>and places like venice which are practically already sinking.
forget "practically," it *is* already sinking

[Anonymous No.2123214]

>>2123159
3rd world countries and developing nations will be hit hardest (famine/drought).

1st world countries rely on those countries for cheap labor and food, so you can expect rationing. People refuse to ration gas, but will be forced to ration gas and food, its understandable though, we're very stubborn in terms of letting go of luxuries.

[Anonymous No.2123218]

>>2123202
>eh I don't care we'll just evolve to live on the surface

[Anonymous No.2123220]

>>2123149
i hope it wasnt your science class,
op, watch this video series.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52KLGqDSAjo
tl;dr global warming is real and inconvenient truth is politically charged bullshit that doesn't accurately reflect scientific understandings.

[Anonymous No.2123221]

>>2123188
elaborate

>>2123185
Don't worry, mass extinction events like Permian, Permian-Triassic, K-T (dino's end) need the contributions of many dramatical changes it's not just greenhouse gases and gradual average temperature changes.

CO2 it's just like the tip of the iceberg in the mass extinction event called Homo sapiens.

[Anonymous No.2123229]

>>2123202
Don't be a fag. You are feeding /new/ with "liberalist-alarmism" rhetorics.

[Anonymous No.2123231]

CO2 certainly causes warming.
Warming also releases more CO2.
Other things cause warming as well, most notably water vapor.
Water vapor is temperature dependent though, and can't cause a large increase in temperature on its own.
CO2 can be added to the atmosphere whether it's cold or hot, so it can start new warming.
Natural climate cycles exist.
We are near a peak hot time in the natural cycle.
We've chosen this time to dump huge amounts of CO2 into the air, making it even hotter.
We dump far more CO2 into the air than natural sources do at the moment.
Warming as small as 4 degrees C over 100 years will be catastrophic, anything above 8 degrees has historically killed most higher life on Earth.
We have currently produced ~1 degree of warming over 100 years, and are on track for much more.

Human emissions of CO2 have been and currently are adding to the current warming trend.

these facts are known and observed.

[Anonymous No.2123235]

>>2123220
Naw it wasn't science.


And that video looks just what I need, thank you good sir.

[Anonymous No.2123247]

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/11/god-global-warming-congressman-energy/

"I do believe in the Bible as the final word of God," Shimkus told Politico Wednesday. "And I do believe that God said the Earth would not be destroyed by a flood."

During a congressional hearing in March of 2009 on a proposed cap and trade bill, Shimkus quoted Genesis, saying, "Never again will I curse the ground because of man, even though all inclinations of his heart are evil from childhood and never again will I destroy all living creatures as I have done."

"I believe that's the infallible word of God, and that's the way it's going to be for his creation," he added. "The Earth will end only when God declares it's time to be over. Man will not destroy this Earth. This Earth will not be destroyed by a Flood. I do believe that God's word is infallible, unchanging, perfect."

[Anonymous No.2123250]

>>2123221
>>2123221

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clathrate_gun_hypothesis

brb methane rape

[Anonymous No.2123255]

>>2123231
>We dump far more CO2 into the air than natural sources do at the moment.
nope

we are just adding CO2 that can hardly be assimilated into the carbon circle

[EK !D96TK2PSsI No.2123256]

>>2123209
maybe global warming will slightly counter the effect of the ice age...and the ice age will be 'less bad' ...or might possibly be postponed...i'm not sure.
also, carbon dioxide, negligable effect on heating the earth.
keep in mind that the rate of solar fusion is slowly increasing, the sun is hotter now than it ever was.
...eventually, earths oceans boils... all life extinguished.
don't worry though...not for billions of years...but yeah, true story.
all life extinguished long before the sun goes all 'red giant' on our asses.

[Anonymous No.2123257]

Alrighty.

OP here, I can see this derailing into trolling already but I'll look into the promising looking video and might return with unanswered questions.

Thanks to all serious participants.

[Anonymous No.2123260]

>>2123221
>>2123221

If the temperature of the sea rises to much, the undersea methane hydrates will start to boil out, and cause more warming boil out more hydrates Etc.... Not necessarily Venus but would no t be good for earth.

[Anonymous No.2123263]

>>2123196
Thats a very simplistic view of the earth's climate.

There are many cyclic temperature trends when you look at different time periods, some based on solar output (years), periodic changes in atmospheric composition (thousands/millions of years), cataclysmic events (tens/hundreds of millions of years), human industrial output (last 50 years) etc.

You can't say any single one of these is responsible without taking them all into account, this is what climatologists do. They don't just plot co2 vs temperature and go "that shit goes up, I'm publishing it", thats what the news does because they don't have time/interest to explain all the other information, so this is all the information the public gets.

[EK !D96TK2PSsI No.2123265]

also, the carbon cycle dead ends itself when the carbon gets stuck in fossil fuels.

humans actually complete the cycle by burning fossil fuels.

[Anonymous No.2123267]

>>2123231
shitting brix here

[Anonymous No.2123272]

>>2123250
>>2123250
>Clathrate_gun_hypothesis
>hypothesis
You know... when you make a scientific geuss against Oil Lobbies' interests it is by default wrong.

So I would not worry. Those hypothesis are just a theory (a geuss) and hippie propaganda by communists that hate our freedom and want us to pay more taxes.

[EK !D96TK2PSsI No.2123274]

hey guise, pirates actually cause global warming!

...trollface.jpg.

[Anonymous No.2123281]

>>2123256
please, stop posting

[Anonymous No.2123285]

>5000 years
>mfw singularity within 100 years

[Anonymous No.2123293]

>>2123265
derp

[Anonymous No.2123297]

>>2123265
The problems start when we destroy carbon sinks in the cycle, making it more difficult for the earth to reabsorb the carbon from the atmosphere. Its like sticking toilet paper in a drain and turning the faucet on full.

Most notable natural carbon sinks: forests and oceans (algae).

[Anonymous No.2123298]

>>2123274
>cant read a graph

[Anonymous No.2123303]

>>2123274
no, we actually NEED more pirates to slow down GW.

Arrr

>mfw "Arrr" is made up but i still use it cause it sounds awesome

[Anonymous No.2123304]

>>2123297
>mfw the more ocean there is the more carbon gets sunk

[Anonymous No.2123305]

>>2123298
>>2123298
thats why women are dumb

[EK !D96TK2PSsI No.2123307]

>>2123281
hmm?
but i am correct.
>>2123293
problem?
fine... *"lack of pirates"
>>2123298

[Anonymous No.2123308]

>>2123255
Yes, I should have defined natural sources.

volcanoes, fires, erosion of rocks, coal fires, plant respiration.

If we add in marine outgassing we don't come close, but being temperature dependent, it's a bit tough to call whether that's natural or manmade.

Of course that's pretending there's a dichotomy of natural and anthropogenic.

[Anonymous No.2123316]

>>2123308
>Of course that's pretending there's a dichotomy of natural and anthropogenic.
yeah I think when the subject is if we have to take action on the it the distinction is rather clear, fuck semantiks

[Anonymous No.2123332]

>>2123316
agreed.

[Anonymous No.2123351]

ITS REAL
The reason why people are confused about it is because you assholes can't take a stance about it

[Anonymous No.2123362]

>>2123307
>but i am correct.
no

>keep in mind that the rate of solar fusion is slowly increasing, the sun is hotter now than it ever was
Theoritically correct, but guess what... the sun have been around for the last 6 billion years and will also be here for almost as much more, few hundreds years would mean no significant change to its energy output other than its periodical dozen-years circles of activity. I could be wrong since I don't into astronomy. State your sauce.

>carbon dioxide, negligable effect on heating the earth.
see
>>2123231
line 1-5, and I must add in favour of water it's counter-greenhouse albedo effect when in atmosphere (clouds)

>problem?
jokes on me, you were only pretending

now GET BACK TO /new/ AND MAKE ME A SAMMITCH WHILE AT IT, WOMAN!

[Anonymous No.2123373]

>>2123351
the relevant scientists have taken a stance.

there's a lot of reasons why that stance is overlooked or downplayed, uncertainty isn't really one of them.

[Anonymous No.2123371]

>>2123362
AND INB4:
>it's

DON'T YOU FUCKING DARE TALK ME BACK IN FRONT OF OTHERS!

[Anonymous No.2123381]

>>2123308
>Of course that's pretending there's a dichotomy of natural and anthropogenic.
I would like a word other than natural, it gives the impression that humans are like alien visitors on earth as opposed to having simply evolved and spread more effectively than other species.

I like to think of it as humanity having grown powerful enough that we must take on responsibility of the well being of the planet, at least for the sake of our own survival.

[Anonymous No.2123386]

it's all a lie and even if it's not
i don't care if a billon niggers die. if they come to my country to seek shelter, i'm gonna shoot them and have fun

[Anonymous No.2123391]

>>2123381
when all other denialist claims FAIL...

[Anonymous No.2123402]

>>2123386
I hope you don't live in New York, cause I have bad news for you.

[Anonymous No.2123409]

What's funny is when all those tiny ass asians countries will get flooded, guess where all the refugee will go?
If I was a conservative nut in the US I would scare my people with chink immigrants to help cut on global warming.

[EK !D96TK2PSsI No.2123417]

>>2123362
i wasn't pretending. but yeah, solar fusion is accelerating very slowly...so wont cause much difference.

...get back to /new/?
i never post on /new/...

[Anonymous No.2123418]

>>2123391
I'm not a denialist, I thought it was made clear by my last sentence.

[Anonymous No.2123458]

>>2123418
yes i kno my bad

[Anonymous No.2123483]

>>2123409
>he thinks the US will be the refule of the world

[Anonymous No.2123527]

>>2123483
>mfw alarmist estimations are actually very moderate and Himalayas will be the only refule

[Anonymous No.2123568]

Don't listen to all of the scientists spouting the "Climate Change" garbage! Soon enough, our savior, John Shimkus, will lead the House Committee of Energy and Commerce, and bring in end to all of the "reasoning" and "scientific evidence" and "statistics" hoopla.

[Anonymous No.2123594]

[Anonymous No.2123615]

climate wars by gwynn dyer. Thats the thread.

How likely is climate change? We don't understand the climate enough yet. theres tons of positive and negative feedbacks we havent discovered yet.

For arguments sake: lets say you have a 10% of a catastrophic event in your lifetime that would make you lose everything. how much insurance would you pay to hedge against that?

[Anonymous No.2123633]

>>2123615
>We don't understand the climate enough yet. theres tons of positive and negative feedbacks we havent discovered yet.

>I'm a poorly informed idiot but I can't imagine anyone else knows more than me.

fix'd

[Anonymous No.2123644]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3P0NREwyS40
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCLrxiJhu_U&feature=related

[Anonymous No.2123653]

>200 years later, runaway global warming has increased global temperature by a shattering 5 degrees celsius, it is now completely impractical to go to the beach without wearing at least a moderate amount of sunscreen

>mfw the remaining people are all posthuman demi-gods, having just begun their conquest of the galaxy

Global warming could turn the planet into venus over some ridiculous timespan, but I don't intend to be here when that happens and neither should you.

[Anonymous No.2123658]

[Anonymous No.2123660]

>>2123653
>thinks hes 1337 and the cock will never reach his ass
>laughingafricans.jpg

[Anonymous No.2123665]

>>2123633
nice assumption there shithead. I'm all for becoming carbon neutral in 25 years to stay below the 350ppm. My argument was for active climate policies. I do know shit tons about climate change. Probably more than your uneducated american ass ever will. That though does not make me delusional in thinking that we understand everything. Climate is a highly complex system we cannot hope to understand yet. So fuck off and read a book, stupid. or better yet, start to learn how to read.

[Anonymous No.2123667]

>>2123658
nice counterargument

if only we could replace contemporary fauna with trilobites and dinosaurs....

[Anonymous No.2123675]

The sky is falling, we're all going to die, acid rain, oh my god.

[Anonymous No.2123679]

http://www.youtube.com/user/potholer54#p/c/A4F0994AFB057BB8/0/52KLGqDSAjo

[Anonymous No.2123700]

>>2123658
see how the average temp skyrockets through Permian?

it's when great portion of photosynthetic algae went extinct due to tectonic events and CO2 started accumulating... also "coincidentally" it's when the chain of the greatest extinction events in the face of Earth occured resulting in the extinction of 70% of that eras' species and reduction of the biomass to less than half than before.

[Anonymous No.2123740]

>>2123665
I'm you're shithead, and yes I'm an American.

One of my few publications has been in paleoclimatology, oxygen isotopes study of the Kimmeridgian-Tithonian Morrison Formation.

While that certainly doesn't make me a climate expert or anything, I expect I can spot bullshit when you drop some here.

I spend a lot of time reading, often reading climate science. Sometimes I like to stop by the zoo and throw shit at the monkeys.

good monkey.

[Anonymous No.2123753]

>>2123740
are you responsible this:>>2123658?

[Anonymous No.2123763]

>>2123753
Nope, but I don't have a problem with it.

CO2 tracks temp nicely, deviations aren't unexpected especially beyond the point that current carbon proxies remain useful.

http://www.geocraft.com/WVFossils/Reference_Docs/Geocarb_III-Berner.pdf

[Anonymous No.2123775]

>>2123675

>>The sky is falling, we're all going to die, acid rain, oh my god.

Acid rain happened, though. The ozone hole was a legitimate problem. Now, decades later, we can look back and see that the legislation banning CFCs worked as expected.

[Charles !DARwiN.Ixs No.2123777]

i'll just keep posting this for you fags.

94% of scientists say climate change is real.
84% of scientists say climate change is anthropogenic.

97% of scientists say evolution is real.
87% of scientists say evolution is caused by unguided (atheistic) natural selection.

Scientists accept human caused climate change as much as they accept evolution by natural selection.

Pic related; it is for the climate change statistics.
My next pic will show the stats for evolution.

COMMONLY ASKED QUESTIONS AND TROLL STATEMENTS:

Q: This includes social scientists?
A: No. The survey only includes, biologists, chemists, geologists and physicists.

TS: Majority doesn't mean shit in science.
A: You sound like Kent Hovind.

TS: I think CC is real, but caused naturally.
A: Enjoy being in the scientific minority.

TS: How can you believe in evolution if it is just a theory (a geuss)?
A: Troll harder, nigger.

Source: http://people-press.org/report/?pageid=1550

[Charles !DARwiN.Ixs No.2123779]

>>2123777

Jelly at my trips?

Pic related, stats on evolution.

[Anonymous No.2123781]

>Climate is a highly complex system we cannot hope to understand yet.

Would a real scientist advocate ignorance over figuring shit out?

[Anonymous No.2123811]

>>2123763
So since you are a paleoclimatefag what this >>2123700
guy says is legit?

[Anonymous No.2123829]

>>2123811
He dumbed it down a bit for the board, but essentially yes.

there were a couple other factors at work (vulcanism causing dimming and then warming, exposure and erosion of a lot of carbonate rocks, anoxic oceans), but really the point wasn't an in-depth examination of all factors potentially contributing to the largest extinction event in the history of multicellular life ever.

It happened, and much as anon said.

[Anonymous No.2123868]

ITT: People don't know Ice Age is fast approaching

http://www.infiniteunknown.net/2010/09/14/life-on-this-earth-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current
-is-gone/

http://www.sott.net/articles/show/218245-Jet-Stream-Gone-Haywire-Significant-Snow-Falls-for-Europe-P
redicted-by-Mid-Week

[Anonymous No.2123894]

>>2123868
The next ice age is due to begin somewhere between 500 and 5000 years from now.

Once we hit sustained atmospheric CO2 above ~1200 ppmv there probably won't be anymore ice ages.... Which seems like a good thing, though we probably won't be around in great numbers to enjoy it.

[Anonymous No.2123899]

>>2123829
>anoxic oceans
well... isn't that caused by lack of photosynthetic algae too? or was it an indepedant factor?

one other anon once mentioned that one of the primary factors fucking up the climate/life during Permian was the formation of pangaea creating too much arid land, shortening coastlines (that were the primary ecosystems of that time) and pause of whatever oceanic currents that might have existed during the carboniferous

which of these are true?

[Anonymous No.2123960]

>>2123899
anoxia was probably warming related, warmer water holds less gas including oxygen, and warming probably disrupted convection currents that bring oxygen down from the surface.

The algae die-off is real, but I'm not certain it resulted in anoxia. What we do know is that immediately after the extinction event there was a huge bloom of photosynthetic cyanobacteria that thrived on the large amount of CO2 available.

The formation of Pangea resulting in warming is widely accepted, it is considered true. It isn't a matter of one thing being true and another false though, it was more like a perfect storm of catastrophes all around the same time.

How much each one contributed to the extinctions is debated, but the fact that the extinctions happened is known.

[Anonymous No.2123971]

>>2123781
A real scientist would perform experiments, rather than just making up arbitrary numbers and running simulations based on their made up numbers, and then reporting them to the media and governments, asking for new laws.

[Anonymous No.2123995]

>>2123868
>my face when it's three months later and the gulf stream is still there

[Anonymous No.2124003]

>>2123971
Feel free to submit your specific complaints about methodology to the journal of your choice.

Be prepared to be ignored, statistical analysis requires manipulating numbers to produce meaningful results, and your failure to understand science doesn't weaken science in the least.

Best of luck.

[Anonymous No.2124005]

>>2123971
0/10