/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.15769591]

> Soviet scientists and policymakers condemned the Aral Sea as “nature's mistake,” a body of water that had no business existing, or commented that the Aral should “die beautifully.”
Why are commies so retarded?

[Anonymous No.15769597]

>>15769591
Commies are loosers of evolution - The ugly, the low IQ, the poor etc.

[Anonymous No.15769599]

>>15769591
All river water should be used. It's wasteful to have it drain into the ocean or some lake in the middle of nowhere.

[Anonymous No.15769601]

The water that used to flow into the Aral Sea was used in agricultural pursuits, mainly cotton, which eventually generated massive wealth for the people who were stealing all of the proceeds from the businesses involved. Yuri Churbanov, Brezhnev's son-in-law, had a Deutsche Bank account worth $5 billion when the corruption came to light following the death of Brezhnev. No doubt the stream of income he was stealing was just passed on to one of Gorbachev's henchmen and eventually fell into the hands of the bosses of the various former Soviet states involved.

[Anonymous No.15770040]

>>15769601
The problem with communism it's really just an incredibly corrupt mafia, party member are made men
and it was designed that way

[Anonymous No.15770059]

>>15769601
the US is equally fucked up tho.

Apparently middle east countries that live in the desert but are extremely rich (not naming names) are buying land in US with no legal limits on the water they're allowed to use, and then wasting all that water on shit like hay, and then shipping it overseas.
But this is just one example.

[Anonymous No.15770123]

>>15770059
>the US is equally fucked up tho.
The Aral Sea was the 4th largest lake in the world
The Soviet's intentionally destroyed it
VS
Lake Mead, a man-made lake formed by the Hoover dam
Combination of drought and water demand is draining it
These are equal to you?

[Anonymous No.15770130]

>>15770123
What about the ogalala aquifer?

[Anonymous No.15770138]

>>15770130
>What about this water table that is 8% depleted and there are already steps being taken to reverse the damage
Damn... USA bad...

[Anonymous No.15770142]

>>15770123
Lake Mead is just a tiny part. The entire Colorado river basin is in crisis. Supposedly it's so bad it threatens operation of the Hoover dam, so the federal government gave the states an ultimatum get their houses in order and regulate their shit, or the fed will step in and do it for them. The time frame on that ultimatum has elapsed, but honestly I'm not sure if any regulating has been done yet or not.

>These are equal to you?
I don't want to get in a dick measuring contest with you. My point is simply regulating water ways is tricky business, even when people have the best intentions, which they don't, so it's all doubly fucked. It's not a "commies so retarded" kind of problem, but more of a "1st world problem" that's a legit threat to the 1st world.

[Anonymous No.15770144]

>>15769591
The soviets were autistic Redditors who hated nature and wanted every last square inch of the earth covered in concrete. If some stupid lake is getting in the way of the party's agenda, then they'll happily drain it.

[Anonymous No.15770146]

>>15770040
What else do you expect from a system imposed upon people by jews.

[Anonymous No.15770148]

>>15769591
These are the same retards that espouse pure democracy, not because they care about personal agency and believe that everyone deserves to have a say in the state of affairs, but because they think they’ll be calling the shots by influencing everyone and playing sophist

[Anonymous No.15770149]

>>15770142
>The entire Colorado river basin is in crisis
Source on this? All I can find is that there's a natural drought and they have to move water from one reservoir to another because of it
>I don't want to get in a dick measuring contest with you
You said the US is equally fucked, I assumed that meant you thought these were equal
>My point is simply regulating water ways is tricky business, even when people have the best intentions
The US seems pretty good at it, Soviets seemed pretty retarded

[Anonymous No.15770281]

>>15770149
>Uhh proof for that?
>I'm gonna need a source
>Yeah I need a source for that
>Yeah I need a credited source for that
>Yeah I need a professional who credited that source
>Yeah I need a credited professional who cites the credited source for that
>Yeah but are you a professional?
>Yeah but are you a professional in that field?
>Yeah but are you a credited professional in that field?
>Yeah but are you a credited professional in that field who has....
>Well I need a source for that.
>Gonna need a source.

[Anonymous No.15770290]

>>15770059
>>15770130
>whatabout
Every time

[Anonymous No.15770693]

>>15769591
Lovely demonstration for why using government intervention to stop climate change will not work.

[Anonymous No.15770695]

>>15770142
I think a very simple and effective start to solving the Colorado basin water shortage would be to remove all subsidies on water prices.

If water is scarce and the demand for it is high, the price of water will rise. In response, the users of water will reduce their demand for that water.
Through forces of supply and demand, usage of water will be reduced.

Nobody will do this because it does not gain them votes.

[Anonymous No.15770704]

>>15770146

[Anonymous No.15771048]

>>15770695
>If water is scarce and the demand for it is high, the price of water will rise
Bad actors know this. There are quite a few land deeds with unlimited water usage baked into them. Those deeds get bought out by bad actors, who recklessly use as much water as possible.
See the more water that gets wasted, the higher the value of their unlimited water land becomes. It's in their best interest to fuck things up as much as possible for everyone else.

[Anonymous No.15771075]

>>15771048
>There are quite a few land deeds with unlimited water usage baked into them.
The solution is to deregulate the market. Allow all land to have access to it's water.
Doing so will nullify the incentive of increasing that land's price by wasting water, as everybody's land has that special tribute.

Syndrome was right, when everyone's super, no one will be. This is why corporations lobby for higher regulations; they know it reduces competition.
Consider how hard it is for a cactus seedling germinate and grow into an adult plant. An already mature cactus can resist the heat of the desert far better.
Corporations are like an adult cactus wishing for a hotter and harsher desert to make it harder for seedlings to compete with their access to sunlight.

[Anonymous No.15771142]

>>15771075
You still run into problems with this, because the wealthy can drill deeper wells. While ordinary working class families who can't afford super deep wells will see their wells dry up as the water levels drop from increased usage.

[Anonymous No.15771300]

>>15771142
>You still run into problems with this, because the wealthy can drill deeper wells.
Not for the problem you highlighted because people don't remain wealthy by pointlessly wasting water.

>While ordinary working class families
Bolshy buzzwords meant evoke pictures of the starving and needy, used by people trying to excuse higher taxes.
>who can't afford super deep wells will see their wells dry up as the water levels drop from increased usage.
They still have access to the rainfall on their land. At worst all that happens is people learn not to grow avocados in a desert.

As I said, the free market is the solution to the water shortages of the USA.

[Anonymous No.15771306]

>>15769591
>Why are commies so retarded?
Lack of nutrition in childhood will retard any population, as you can also observe nowadays.

[Anonymous No.15771324]

>>15769591
stop being russophobic

[Anonymous No.15771468]

>>15769591
Theres nothing bad or irreversible about it. Tje water is being used for the greater good growing crops.
To get the aral sea back you would have to destroy a lot of farming

[Anonymous No.15771470]

>>15771324
Brezhnev was Ukrainian

>>15771468
They use most of it for growing cotton, same reason the Nile no longer reaches the sea

[Anonymous No.15771473]

>>15771470
>They use most of it for growing cotton, same reason the Nile no longer reaches the sea
So? Thats an industry. You either get valuable cotton or misery but you get to look at a lake from space

[Anonymous No.15771494]

>>15769601
>Brezhnev's son-in-law, had a Deutsche Bank account worth $5 billion
CEOs of large companies are often billionaires, i dont see a problem with the CEO of global communism having a few billions stashed away

[Anonymous No.15771509]

>>15770695
>>15771048
>>15771075
>>15771142
This is part of it, but remember basically all water rights on the colorado river were sold off quite a while ago, about 100 years. Sure everybody's been reckless with water usage for the past 100 years, but in actuality the river and by extension lakes mead/powell are victims of climate change. Damming up the river worked when the planet was 1C cooler than it is now, but not anymore. So what really needs to happen is the hoover needs to come down, same thing with glen canyon.

This is the ugly truth nobody's willing to accept. The cheapest option for states dependent on the water is to drill out channels underneath the dams to keep up flow, which will STILL be incredibly fucking expensive. Without this Mead is pretty much destined to go below the safe level for electricity generation in the next decade, when that happens a fat portion of the southwest is just fucked, utilities will shut down, massive grid strain, outtages, fossil fuel use skyrockets, municipalities without power/water. There are already residential homes in Arizona who have had water deliveries cut off entirely due to the river crisis.

[Anonymous No.15771511]

>>15769591
Aral Sea is completely manmade. Mongols destroyed a bunch of irrigation canals and inadvertently created the "sea". Soviets simply restored those canals.

[Anonymous No.15771528]

>>15771509
Drill out channels below *the hoover dam. Glen canyon wont get channels. States are basically in a dilemma, they can either choose between water or electricity, and they're basically legally mandated by the government to choose electricity. As for what will happen when the states inevitably take the cheap out route and do nothing? Well a lot of lawsuits, and many government subsidies will evaporate.

[Anonymous No.15771561]

>>15770123
>The Soviet's intentionally destroyed it
Remind me when the Soviet Union ended

[Anonymous No.15771566]

>>15771473
What happened in the USSR was that the people in the regions that drain into the Aral Sea were mostly tribal nomadic herders and the communists didn't like that because it made them harder to keep track of, dominate and extract wealth from so in the 1950s they started making the nomads exchange their traditional family and community based lifestyle for something that the centralized government could take a cut from and thats what created the agriculture industry in that region, which is what ultimately lead to the disappearance of the Aral Sea, which was formerly a major employer and producer for fishermen in the region as well as being a popular tourism destination for the USSR. Of course now that its gone there is the possibility that previous untapped mineral wealth might lie below the former lake floor, so maybe that can replace the fishing and tourism the sea once supported. Eventually another ice age will come along an replenish the water that was once there.

[Anonymous No.15772000]

>>15770138
impressive, what was that fossil aquifer in saudi arabia they drained dry?

[Anonymous No.15772386]

>>15771509
>in actuality the river and by extension lakes mead/powell are victims of climate change
I really don't think it's climate change at fault, I think it's just that they're trying to farm in a desert. I'm sure rain patterns might've changed through the last century, but how do we know that's not just a long term cycle of that desert region. Removing subsidies on water will expose people to the true cost of water and so reduce their use.

>cheapest option for states dependent on the water is to drill out channels underneath the dams to keep up flow
What's the idea there? To install a new, lower water intake to feed the turbines?

>below the safe level for electricity generation in the next decade, when that happens a fat portion of the southwest is just fucked
Why would that be? Surely the market will just supply more power generation capabilities as the supply delivered by hydro drops.

>fossil fuel use skyrockets
Not that I think fossil fuels are a problem, but deregulating nuclear power would make it viable for private businesses to invest in it.

>Arizona who have had water deliveries cut off
Remove laws prohibiting water collection to allow people to have their own systems, thus being more resistant to such problems.

[Anonymous No.15772388]

>>15771528
>the states inevitably take the cheap out route and do nothing
This is why it is important to not have the government responsible for many things. If the private sector manages it, there will be many competitors all trying to solve the solution, chances are that a few of them will get a good one. Better yet they don't need taxes to run.

[Anonymous No.15772625]

>>15772388
Until they begin colluding with each other or governments. Which at best gets you the current inaction, at worst gives you a China style nightmare. But really the issue isn't Corp VS Government but effective oversight.

[Anonymous No.15773219]

>>15772386
>I really don't think it's climate change at fault
Then you are absolutely wrong. People have been abusing the Colorado river for a long time, but overall water usage from the river has pretty much stagnated for the past 30 years, but you don't see a crisis ocurring 20 years ago, or 10 years ago. This isn't a problem which just builds up over time like with the Ogallala aquifer, there's new river water every year. The problem is chiefly because the reservoirs are incurring massive evaporative losses now from heating of the planet. You can see in the image the overall trend for baseline water availability for the past 100 years or so has been going down, that's literally stereotypical effects of climate change.

[Anonymous No.15773413]

>>15771566
>so maybe that can replace the fishing and tourism the sea once supported.
That would be the cotton farming, that replaced fishing and its much more valuable
>tourism
Lmao tourism in some central asian desert. Soviets went go to Crimea or Sochi for vacations or to some forest dacha

[Anonymous No.15773419]

>>15773219
Total rain on earth has to stay constant because the sun is still shining on the ocean, as water evaporates it must rain. Only question is where the rain falls.
Some say that parched regions of the world like north india are getting more rain now, you cant climate-change a universal drought

[Anonymous No.15773440]

>>15773219
>Increase the temperature by one degree and every body of water on the earth will dry up, goyim. All that evaporated water will then vanish into another dimension or something.
KYS, retard.

[Anonymous No.15773688]

>>15773419
Well yeah I guess, but it's kind of useless for humans if it rains somewhere like on the open ocean vs on cropland.

>>15773440
The point is just that Colorado river availability is going down, not that it'll completely deadflow (though if we keep up the dams then yeah, it'll deadflow).

[Anonymous No.15773983]

>>15773219
I'd say the change in water supply is inclusive. It's clearly extremely variable. The demand for water however is a clear steady rise over time, with a reversal around 2000.

Your own graph proves my point. These "droughts" have fuck all to do with climate change, and everything to do with people farming in a desert. If you stopped subsidizing people's water bills, they'd treat it as the scarce and expensive resource it is.

[gre/nouille No.15773989]

>>15769591
>Soviet scientists and policymakers condemned the Aral Sea as “nature's mistake,” a body of water that had no business existing, or commented that the Aral should “die beautifully.”
What scientists and policymakers are you quoting ?

[Anonymous No.15774203]

>>15773688
>but it's kind of useless for humans if it rains somewhere like on the open ocean
Whos even saying that climate change will cause all the rain to fall on the ocean? Stop making shit up