/sfg/ - Space Flight General

[Anonymous No.15549863]

atmospheric layers edition

previous: >>15546811

[Anonymous No.15549867]

>>15549586

[Anonymous No.15549878]

>>15549863

[Anonymous No.15549888]

[Anonymous No.15549895]

[Anonymous No.15549896]

https://arstechnica.com/space/2023/07/in-space-manufacturing-startup-aces-pharma-experiment-in-orbit/

[Anonymous No.15549898]

https://spacenews.com/plasmos-pivots-from-rocket-engines-to-vc/

reposting from end of previous thread >>15549834

[Anonymous No.15549900]

>>15549888

[Anonymous No.15549905]

https://www.space.com/spacex-faa-seek-dismiss-starship-lawsuit

[Anonymous No.15549909]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=740TF0k1V1E

[Anonymous No.15549931]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6GJVvwUEGk

[Anonymous No.15549942]

reminder that rockets are empty shells

[Anonymous No.15549944]

>>15549905

[Anonymous No.15549951]

>>15549942
They’re really just overengineered water towers.

[Anonymous No.15549955]

>>15549942
that's just the fuel tank
show the engines

[Anonymous No.15549965]

>>15549955

[Anonymous No.15549968]

Does anyone think the reason why SpaceX doesn't seem to give a shit about "certifying" Ship 25 because they realized it's stupid to worry over until they can reliably get to stage separation?

[Anonymous No.15549977]

>Ariane 6
>not reusable
>Vulcan
>not reusable

To what purpose?

[Anonymous No.15549978]

>>15549863
The earth is flat and stationary with a dome. They are never ever leaving this enclosed plane alive, and neither are you sciencegoys.
CGI is all you get in this life and if you are vaxxed, I know many of you here are well boosted, then the Mars landings will be livestreamed straight into your vaxxed brain.
Also with the latest Neurolink brain processor you'll be able to watch multiple landings at the same time, with the same bitrate and no loss in quality experience.

[Anonymous No.15549989]

>>15549978
>Also with the latest Neurolink brain processor you'll be able to watch multiple landings at the same time, with the same bitrate and no loss in quality experience.
sign me up

[Anonymous No.15549992]

>>15549968
what do you mean by certifying?

[Anonymous No.15550007]

>>15549977
they're afraid of taking risks

[Anonymous No.15550026]

>>15549989
I'd rather actually be there.

[Anonymous No.15550031]

>>15549977
reusable rockets are the antithesis of gov launch programs. Having a rocket launch multiple times cuts costs and labour, both of which need to be as high as possible.

[Anonymous No.15550034]

>>15549977
They will never make it

[Anonymous No.15550042]

How well would Propane (C3H8) and NO2 serve as a storable propellant for a small lift rocket?

[Anonymous No.15550044]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6PXHqOErvs

[Anonymous No.15550051]

What's happening with 2nd tower, have they stopped building it?

[Anonymous No.15550077]

>>15550042
Cringe leddit tier meme. Only fags like doge shit

[Anonymous No.15550080]

>>15550077
silence, vatnik

[Anonymous No.15550083]

>>15550080
you have to go back

[Anonymous No.15550084]

>>15549992
For launch.

[Anonymous No.15550086]

>>15550051
Not before the first one is allowed to fly.

[Anonymous No.15550089]

Today I did some calculation and I realised that Long March 2-3-4 series indeed have half-decent mass fraction (at least on the Hypergolic stages, the , the myth of shit Chinese mass fractions is indeed kind of a myth, or at least it doesn't compare badly with Proton and Ariane 4

based on the User guide http://www.cgwic.com/LaunchServices/Download/manual/LM-3A%20Series%20Launch%20Vehicles%20User's%20Manual%20Issue%202011.pdfp

and picrel from a South Korean space agency presentation from last month

When running these numbers the chinks officially give with silverbird and on my own I do get coherent results with what they advertise (and what has been flight-proven), If I adjust the ISP they give for S1/booster (Sea level) to the average over their trajectory I can get equally coherent results with slightly worse mass fractions (1-3% heavier)... but it's never bad, just at worse a bit heavier than Proton.

Hypergolic stages can be lighter (kinda) compared to semi-cryo and cryo stages, but clearly the Chinese don't have an abnormaly heavy structure due to inferior technologies as is often repeated. Their hydrogen stages are still behind the americans no matter what in term of mass fraction.

--
The more I think about it the more it makes sense
In term of architecture their rocket is basically like an Ariane 44L, although with a bit more mass on S2/S3 and a bit less on S1, although with less efficient (10+ isp) engines
yet they manage to surpasse Ariane 44L in performances to both GTO and LEO by 10-20%

[Anonymous No.15550106]

even ground support equipment looks like something from dune

[Anonymous No.15550113]

Which country will have the next fully reusable rocket?
My bet is China then India. Since it seems like they're the only ones with a real goal in mind.

[Anonymous No.15550114]

[Anonymous No.15550116]

I want to work in aerospace but not for any defense contractor.What do

[Anonymous No.15550128]

>>15549942
you're so close, but they are balloons

[Anonymous No.15550129]

>>15550116
>What do
Don't work in aerospace.

[Anonymous No.15550137]

>>15550044
Amazing to see how much shit is happening there.

[Anonymous No.15550138]

Haven't kept up with SpaceX in a while, do we have an estimated date for the next Starship launch?

[Anonymous No.15550140]

>>15550138
Ask again when they finish the pad.

[Anonymous No.15550141]

>>15549965
engines are hollow as well

[Anonymous No.15550143]

>>15550140
Wait, they still haven't finished repairing it? Christ.

[Anonymous No.15550144]

>>15550143
It's not matter of repairing, but upgrading it.

[Anonymous No.15550148]

>>15550143
The upgrades could take till next year

[Anonymous No.15550150]

Is there a market for MLV? A non reusable Falcon 9 competitor seems like a shitty idea

[Anonymous No.15550152]

>>15550138
2 more months

[Anonymous No.15550155]

>>15549968
It's certified.
Sn15 plus Orbital test 1 is a lot of data.

[Anonymous No.15550161]

https://arstechnica.com/space/2023/07/in-space-manufacturing-startup-aces-pharma-experiment-in-orbit/

Varda rentry window later this month

[Anonymous No.15550163]

Fusion propulsion by 2027?
https://www.nextbigfuture.com/2023/07/pulsar-fusion-developing-2-megawatt-direct-fusion-drive-for-2027.html

[Anonymous No.15550166]

>>15550138
Optimistically middle-end of august or early September

[Anonymous No.15550168]

>>15550163
Based grifters

[Anonymous No.15550171]

https://www.sbir.gov/node/2274501
https://allvaralloys.com/what-is-negative-thermal-expansion/
>Negative Thermal Expansion
Scrolling thru sbir's when I saw this. Didn't know this stuff actually existed.

[Anonymous No.15550174]

>this is the opposition to spacex
i think i'lll stay over here.

[Anonymous No.15550183]

Good video on Dream Chaser

https://youtu.be/AqCHwg22tNU

[Anonymous No.15550199]

>>15550163
>nextbigfuture

[Anonymous No.15550213]

>>15549905
>>15549944
Government and business working together to build rockets and suppress Communist subversion sounds familiar.

[Anonymous No.15550216]

Seems like the US will run out of capacity to launch rockets, Vandenberg and the Cape are bursting at the seams. Where could a new NASA center be built? Australia, Japan, Korea?

[Anonymous No.15550223]

>>15550148
>the upgrades could take till next year
This is massive doomposting. Finishing the pad will take a a month at worst.

The real kick in the nutz will be proofing the hot-staging-modified booster and the tests of the water-cooled plate. This shit could literally take 2 months on its own and I think it is what will hold back OFT2 the most

[Anonymous No.15550228]

>>15550042
Storable first stage propellants are a fucking meme. NO2 oxidizing propane or ethane is an excellent combo for on-orbit propulsion for reusable spacecraft because you can use a solid catalyst to decompose the NO2 and spin the turbopump.

>>15550216
Virginia (Wallops), Kodiak, Kwajelein Atoll, Hawaii, Puerto Rico... first foreign launch besides Hobbitlab from Mahia will probably be someone building out Alcantara in Brazil for that 2° S latitude location.

[Anonymous No.15550232]

>>15550228
Most of those places have infrastructure for small launch only though, Hawaii is NIMMBY central and Puerto Rico is small and infrastructure doesn’t exist either

>Implying the US a would ever launch payloads from BRICSzil

[Anonymous No.15550245]

>>15550232
https://www.state.gov/brazil-19-1216.1

[Anonymous No.15550260]

Sierra plans to build a Pathfinder space station out of this LIFE module and Dreamchaser craft in 2026 before committing to Orbital Reef

https://spacenews.com/sierra-space-describes-long-term-plans-for-dream-chaser-and-inflatable-modules/

[Anonymous No.15550262]

>>15550228
So basically anywhere with terrible logistics

And Wallops. Whats the flaw in wallops? Some legal issues?

[Anonymous No.15550268]

>>15550262
Wallops is fine, it's just higher latitude than KSC so geosync is a bit harder.

[Anonymous No.15550270]

>>15550216
Retired nuclear aircraft carriers

[Anonymous No.15550279]

I keep getting stuck with tumblrface, I'm not used to drawing people. I can't make fun of that dork who draws BO rockets anymore kek

[Anonymous No.15550294]

>>15550216
NASA will never build a new launchpad again

[Anonymous No.15550299]

>>15550262
>Whats the flaw in wallops?
Wealthy and powerful people live around the Chesapeake Bay and will not put up with sound pollution from frequent launches of big rockets

[Anonymous No.15550301]

>>15550223
3 months is 2024

[Anonymous No.15550310]

>>15550299
Then they can leave.

[Anonymous No.15550313]

>>15550310
RICH BILLAIONRES FORCES THOUSANDS OFF LOCAL LAND TO LANCH HIS TOY ROCKET

[Anonymous No.15550314]

>>15550301
>3 months is 2024

[Anonymous No.15550317]

The launch center in Kodiak Alaska is so underrated. Yeah they only launch rockets that explode from VC backed startups but this place is beautiful, I wanna remove here

[Anonymous No.15550319]

>>15550313
I am okay with that.

[Anonymous No.15550341]

>>15550216
wallops is definitely next, then maybe texas. once we get to that point though we're going to be considering other places, including inland launch sites.

[Anonymous No.15550345]

>>15550341
Boca situation needs to be sorted out. The environment fundamentalists have a lawsuit right now to stop SpaceX.

[Anonymous No.15550352]

>>15550174
he has that tranny look going on

[Astranon No.15550354]

>>15550317
There were so many horror stories about winter launch attempts up there. The stupidest one was probably a water deluge line freezing solid forcing a scrub.

[Anonymous No.15550360]

>>15550341
Blue Origin had a chance to buy out the NIMBYs at Camden back in 2015 when they were planning where they were going to put their New Glenn launch complex. I wouldn't be surprised to see someone revisit the idea if Cape Canaveral and Wallops get too built up.

[Anonymous No.15550367]

>>15550341
I don't think we'll ever see a major Gulf spaceport because it would limit oil exploration sites.

[Anonymous No.15550368]

>>15550310
>they can leave
They own & operate the USG, anon. They're not moving.

[Anonymous No.15550373]

Tanegashima is the best place for American expansion

The infrastructure exists for heavy rockets, Japan is a good friend to the US and it is close to the equator for orbital launches

[Anonymous No.15550374]

>>15550174

[Anonymous No.15550381]

>>15550341
>inland launch sites
I think SpaceX is ready, given their launch and landing success rates. Plop one down in Arizona or Nevada; with a bit of risk tolerance and mandatory landings, you get all the important inclinations.

[Anonymous No.15550385]

>>15550174
remember when he was making anti-feminist videos?
I wonder if they are still up

[Anonymous No.15550392]

>>15550373
>what is a dogleg
You do realise that it's further away from the equator than the cape or boca chica?

Honestly america should just fund the local blacks in French guyana to stage a revolt then seize the spaceport, would make frogs seethe at the same time.

[Anonymous No.15550394]

>>15550150
For the most part, the market is Cygnus. NG needed a new engine for Antares, and if you have an engine, the rest of a basic new rocket isn't too hard from there. Even if it's not reusable, they can get the cost below that of Vulcan. If they can get it flying before Neutron, Terran, and regular Starship commercial service, then they get some of the other excess from Falcon. That'd give them buffer to make the first stage reusable.

[Anonymous No.15550395]

>>15550392
That would be stupid. Alcantara is already closer to the equator than Korou is.

[Anonymous No.15550398]

Duluth

[Anonymous No.15550400]

>>15550395
By only like 2-3 degrees, and it's barely got 1/10th of the infrastructure of Kourou, and lacks the local skills, and has 10 times more corruption.

Just decolonise french guyana bro, the world would thank you for it.

[Anonymous No.15550403]

>>15549977
Design mistakes made in 2010s means the engines aren't the right size for TSTO first stage reuse and it'll take them another decade to redesign it since all the supplier contracts have been signed.

[Anonymous No.15550429]

Neutron really is ridiculously good looking

[Anonymous No.15550432]

https://members.michman.org/press-releases/Details/michigan-ready-to-serve-as-mid-america-s-hypersonic-suborbital-test-range-132978

Da Yoop

[Anonymous No.15550433]

>>15550398
based

[Anonymous No.15550476]

wyoming would be a great overland launch site for starship

[Anonymous No.15550483]

Diego Garcia

[Anonymous No.15550519]

>>15550223
and after that we need to work on Raptors so they don't have a 1/4 chance of failing, and after that we need to work on the heat shield

[Anonymous No.15550524]

>>15550216
lol Cape could easily support 10 times the cadence. Ever been at an airport?

[Anonymous No.15550528]

>>15550279
good concept, unfortunate execution.
It would probably look better if you put less effort into it.

[Anonymous No.15550532]

>Imagine if he invented an ultra advanced AI with a working uterus to be his life partner. No human could match his intellect, but with her he finally found peace. A twin beautiful mind. Their children will be the cyborg hybrid demigods that rule Mars for all eternity.
https://twitter.com/elonconomy/status/1677394263406174213
most sane tier-1

[Anonymous No.15550590]

[Anonymous No.15550630]

>>15550590
wrong thread
wrong board
wrong website
wrong universe

[Anonymous No.15550638]

>>15550590
Woah!? What!?
HOW!????????

[Anonymous No.15550640]

>>15550113
Is india even talking about reusable rockets yet?
>>15550138
End of the year if we're lucky.

[Anonymous No.15550659]

[Anonymous No.15550665]

>>15550260
>Is someone trying to post a picture of a butt?
>Let's see...
I LIKE BIG BALLOONS AND I CAN NOT LIE
>hello boner...

[Anonymous No.15550677]

>>15549977
>To what purpose?

Both were designed before SpaceX started landing rockets, they were arrogant and used to not needing to try.

That said both will get some partial reuse, Vulcan's engine section with SMART and Ariane 6's future reusable liquid boosters.

[Anonymous No.15550678]

>>15550532
his followup reply outs him as a troll. disappointed

[Anonymous No.15550680]

Reusable Cygnus when?

[Anonymous No.15550682]

>>15550659
The fact that we haven't even encroached on the subject of self-replicating machines is mind boggling to me.

[Anonymous No.15550683]

>>15550677
SMART will eventually be operational, probably.
A6's LRB tho? Lol no, the technology will be demonstrated in Themis and Maia (Arianegroup side) and HTE (Avio side) , but there's no way at all the international political-industrial organisation of Ariane 6 will change to adapt to the LRB.

[Anonymous No.15550686]

>>15550682
ok paperclip man

[Anonymous No.15550688]

>Apollo 11 in 1969 was 66 years after the Wright Brothers first flight in 1903
>2035 is 66 years after Apollo 11

I’m guessing a Mars landing will happen in 2035 if God wills it?

[Anonymous No.15550694]

>>15550686
Paperclips are the future, anon.
Might as well start early.

[Anonymous No.15550697]

>>15550688
you will do a fly by in your cuckpod and you will be happy

[Anonymous No.15550707]

>>15550697
>SLS to mars

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

[Anonymous No.15550714]

>>15550042
Terrible. Cryogenics are not that scary, you should use liquid oxygen and propane instead due to the toxicity concerns of nitrous oxides (which at rocket temperatures are exclusively N2O4)

[Anonymous No.15550715]

>>15550694
Whoa maaan, it's almost like humans are the virus maaan

[Anonymous No.15550722]

>>15550106
where are the Jawas?

[Anonymous No.15550724]

>>15550715
You see a virus, I see oppertu- no actually I think you're right.

[Anonymous No.15550746]

>>15550694
There no grass and your house is practically touching the other one. Functionally this isn't any difference than living in an apartment.

[Anonymous No.15550749]

>>15550163
What's with the thots

[Anonymous No.15550765]

>>15550341
>>15550381
Screenshot this post, overland launches from Vandenberg

[Anonymous No.15550770]

>>15550746
Yeah, exactly. And who needs that much space anyway?
Might as well just live in a pod connected to a communal kitchen and bathroom.

[Anonymous No.15550812]

>>15550683
>but there's no way at all the international political-industrial organisation of Ariane 6 will change to adapt to the LRB.

It is Arianespace themselves saying they will use reusable methalox LRB.

[Anonymous No.15550826]

>>15550812
Arianespace spent a decade and a half talking about how they were totally serious about designing a liquid fly-back booster for the Ariane 5

[Anonymous No.15550831]

Seriously I can’t wait until the end of this decade when all the brics and antiwest tards have to cope with how far ahead our space program, NASA and commercial will be

Imagine where we will be with 10 years of starship operations?

[Anonymous No.15550834]

>>15550765
you're late

>That combination of reduced exclusion zones and improved vehicle track records, along with what Purdy described as a willingness to launch “with a couple boats in the water and perhaps a [general aviation] aircraft or two in the broad area,” could enable launches from Vandenberg on eastern trajectories.
https://spacenews.com/space-force-looks-at-options-for-relieving-cape-canaveral-launch-congestion/

[Anonymous No.15550838]

>>15550812
Let me guess, you also believed ADELINE was going to happen?

No Government/ESA funding = not happening, simple as.

[Anonymous No.15550839]

Behold, Changship

[Anonymous No.15550842]

>10 years until first flight (2033)
>17+ years before second stage reuse (2040s)

It was over from the beginning

[Anonymous No.15550844]

>>15550812
Let me guess, you also believed ADELINE was going to happen?

No Government/ESA funding = not happening, simple as.

Also Ariane 6 LRB wouldn't just be a change involving Arianegroup, it would also involve other companies, mainly Avio, and would radically change the industrial organisation of Ariane 6, Vega and Kourou. The geographic return would have to adapt, and unrelated components manufacturing would have to change countries to keep it balanced. Hundreds would be fired from SRB producing lines, Vega would suddenly become much more expensive.

[Anonymous No.15550847]

>>15550826
Arianespace isn't simply talking about reusable boosters for Ariane 6.

[Anonymous No.15550856]

>>15550839
>>15550842
Fully reusable models

[Anonymous No.15550864]

>>15550844
Arianegroup must realize that they have to get to a re-usable Ariane 7 or lose all commercial relevance.

[Anonymous No.15550866]

>>15550770
>So brain damaged from propaganda that thinks every apartment is a Russia tier commie block
From a material point of view you could more space from the same value if it were a properly built apartment. The problem being it's usually a jew that wants to build a commie block instead of an apartment building capable of handling families.

[Anonymous No.15550873]

>>15550864
Arianespace had to choose between commercial relevance and being a jobs program and they chose to be a jobs program. There's no real turning back at this point. The only reason they ever had commercial relevance was because they were competing against commercial shuttle flights and then against ULA.

[Anonymous No.15550874]

>>15550834
Baja overflights feel most likely in the short term, which could get you down to ISS inclination. SpaceX has already come close. Looking at a map though, it may be possible to thread the needle north of LA for a nearly due east trajectory, which would be damn cool.

[Anonymous No.15550875]

>>15550847
Basically

Prometheus
>An old 2000s Airbus (French side, some japanese collaboration) project to get heavy liquid propulsion independently from Safran, under the guise of a suborbital spaceplane, after the Airbus-Safran/Arianegroup Joint venture creation (~2015), got picked up by CNES then ESA as a technology program and got Europeanised (italian and german component production, final assembly in Vernon).

Themis
>Initially it was both CNES's national alternative to the slow and international (FR-DE-JP) Callisto, and a way to flight-test Prometheus, Arianegroup got effective control of it and gave it to a development team (Arianework), and managed to get ESA funding in 2020 for it. Still a mostly French technological research project (some belgian swiss swedish involvment).

Maiaspace:
>Basically Arianegroup repurposing Themis (which is largely government funded) for mainly 2 goals 1) competing with Avio, Isar, OHB-RFA... on the smaller launcher market to prevent them from growing up, 2) proving to ESA and other agencies that they have the technologies to make a RLV, thus positioning themselves in the post-Ariane 6 development programs (since A6 will inevitably quickly be criticised)

[Anonymous No.15550890]

>>15550875
This sounds like a bunch of inter-agency high school drama that's somehow supposed to create better rockets as a side hustle.

[Anonymous No.15550897]

>To capture energy from solar wind, a solar wind power satellite would rely on a long straight current-carrying copper wire directed toward the Sun. The current would create a magnetic field in concentric circles around the wire. That magnetic field would exert a force, known as a Lorentz force, on moving charged particles, which in turn would attract electrons toward a metal receiver situated on the wire. The channeling of electrons through the receiver would produce current, some of which would be transferred back to the copper wire to create a self-sustaining magnetic field. The remainder of the current would flow through a resistor on the wire and be transformed into a laser beam for long-distance transport to Earth. A large sail would help stabilize the satellite.
>Solar wind power satellite technology has the potential to generate a vast amount of power. Harrop claimed that a satellite with a wire 1 km (0.62 mile) in length and a sail 8,400 km (5,220 miles) in width would generate 100 billion times the power needed by humanity annually. In addition, the materials needed to construct the satellite would be relatively inexpensive, because the satellite would be made mostly of copper. Furthermore, while the magnetic field would attract electrons, it would repel positively charged particles, thereby protecting the satellite from other destructive particles that make up solar wind.
So do you think with Martian mining operations we could build a huge satellite and put it at Mars L1 to protect its atmosphere from solar wind and provide a fuckton of energy without worrying about it drifting out of orbit?

[Anonymous No.15550935]

>>15550890
Maiaspace is definitely going to be interesting if only because they have AG support and actually have access to testing facilities in Vernon, so they don't have to do cucked shit to test their engines and stages (see Latitude having to go to Scotland, RFA to swedent to tests, PLD being unable to test in summer because of forest fire dangers).

[Anonymous No.15550944]

>>15550897
8400km wide sail? yeah no problem chief

[Anonymous No.15550950]

>>15550935
Also fun fact
Maiaspace, a subsidiary of Arianegroup, will not sell its launches through Arianespace, another subsdiary of Arianegroup ;)

[Anonymous No.15550962]

>>15550228
>>15550714

How about a propane/LOX first stage and a propane/NO2 second stage?

Nitrogen dioxide is produced in enormous quantities for the fertilizer industry, so it will be cheap.

[Anonymous No.15550965]

if Russia fucking collapses tomorrow, what happens with ISS? We still can't operate without the Russian segments right? Or would we be able to take control - I assume we have the full plans in place for running them from Houston.

[Anonymous No.15550969]

>>15550965
If russia collapses, the russian segments are immediately ejected and deorbited, crew still onboard.

[Anonymous No.15550977]

>>15550844
I remember Aschenbacher, some CNES guy, or someone else high up talking about how the geographic return sucks and needs to be changed, but I have high doubts of that ever happening.

>>15550890
Welcome to European spaceflight, it's not like the engineers are completely clueless
Maybe one day they'll get their shit together or the newspace companies will outcompete them. I don't expect that day anytime soon, though, and there's still the chance that the incumbents just strangle yuro newspace in their death throes.

[Anonymous No.15550981]

who could make an orbital rocket on their own with government help in EU now? So no collaboration. France? England? Italy?

[Anonymous No.15550992]

>>15550981
*meaning a country's hypothetical independent space program, phased that weird

[Anonymous No.15550999]

>>15550873
Given the way the funding works, it was ESA and European governments that made the decisions.

It's been obvious to everyone with a scrap of sense for the past six years has understood that reusablity is key to remaining relevant.

[Anonymous No.15551010]

>>15550897
kys newfag

[Anonymous No.15551012]

>>15550977
There's really no ESA without geographic return, as long as you're working between different national agencies you can't avoid it, you can read up on ESRO and ELDO in the 60s, the exact same problems existed before ESA.

I'd also say that abolishing geographic return may make more sense now thanks to the newspace actors, but before the past decade, the geographic return did really result in skills and industries specialising in each countries, so say Ariane 6 couldn't have been conceived by much different companies even without geographic return.

Some alternative to geographic return can be considered, like barters (I build the launcher and in exchange I launch your satellites for free), indirect exchanges outside of the space industry, subsidied worker transfer between countries, but all of these seems ineficient, however while geographic return is in the ESA DNA, it's not a European union thing, so as EUSPA takes more importance, I could see new programs not following georeturn

[Anonymous No.15551032]

>>15550944
Plasma sails to the rescue

[Anonymous No.15551033]

>>15550981
It depends on what kind of a rocket you're talking about. Just about every European nation could develop their own smallsat-grade launcher if they really wanted to. Spain is far from what comes to mind when you think "major aerospace player" but they're still developing the Muira 5. France, Italy, or Germany could produce an Antares 230 / Falcon 9 1.0 class rocket if they could whistle up the necessary funding. England could have at one point but they probably don't have the expertise anymore and they absolutely don't have the political will to fund a project like that. I don't think Europe is capable of developing a rocket in the same weight class as the Ariane 6 without some form of collaboration between at least a few of the bigger players.

[Anonymous No.15551040]

>>15551032
How do you offset the thrust retard

[Anonymous No.15551073]

>>15551040
solar panels and QI drives

[Anonymous No.15551076]

Imagine
IMAGINE
the payload to obit MOGGING chart when starship is lobbing starlinks up

[Anonymous No.15551085]

>>15550174
does it come as a surprise to anybody that he's jewish?

[Anonymous No.15551115]

>>15551076
log scale mogging

[Anonymous No.15551133]

>>15550981
romania

[Anonymous No.15551135]

>>15551133
lol @ them trying to sneakily make nukes under the Russian's noses

[Anonymous No.15551138]

>>15551033
desu Spain doesn't have a negligeable Aerospace sector, they've got decades of experience and industry in military turboprop cargos frex.
but rocketry does tend to be more of a derivative of missile than aviation industry, one exemple is Brazil, whose VLS program was more of a derivative of their kinda-nich missile industry than their decently notable aviation sector.

France has all the technology and industrial capability for a national launcher, they [Arianegroup-France] make the M51, and various studies have shown M51 can basically be turned into a orbital launcher (1t to SSO) with a modified bus/warhead casing and a different S1 propellant loading. But 50 years of industrial consolidation and 20 years of CNES decline has mostly removed skills and facilities outside of Arianegroup. Latitude is struggling to impose itself; Germanysecure. in that way is more fertile, hence why there are 3 main launcher startups there, with both RFA and Isar being decently financially

In britain Skyrora is having problems, Orbex is much more advanced but their CEO just resigned... I'm relatively confident Orbex Prime will launch someday tho. I think Orbex would count as British-made.

[Anonymous No.15551140]

>>15551033

desu Spain doesn't have a negligible Aerospace sector, they've got decades of experience and industry in military turboprop cargos frex.
but rocketry does tend to be more of a derivative of missile than aviation industry, one exemple is Brazil, whose VLS program was more of a derivative of their kinda-nich missile industry than their decently notable aviation sector.

France has all the technology and industrial capability for a national launcher, they [Arianegroup-France] make the M51, and various studies have shown M51 can basically be turned into a orbital launcher (1t to SSO) with a modified bus/warhead casing and a different S1 propellant loading. But 50 years of industrial consolidation and 20 years of CNES decline has mostly removed skills and facilities outside of Arianegroup. Latitude is struggling to impose itself; Germany. in that way is more fertile, hence why there are 3 main launcher startups there, with both RFA and Isar being decently financially secure

In britain Skyrora is having problems, Orbex is much more advanced but their CEO just resigned... I'm relatively confident Orbex Prime will launch someday tho. I think Orbex would count as British-made.
Avio is basically trying to make a national launcher with their HTE program. Vega is still mostly italian, even if the P80 was actually conceived by CNES, and dependent on French and Belgian industries.

[Anonymous No.15551184]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bxjPRIiFL_c

You fags missed this one? Its from 3 weeks ago/ About Starbase energy production. Electricity and possible fueling operations.

[Anonymous No.15551189]

>>15550897
More effective to create a plasma torus using a facility based on Phobos, with a few booster stations in the same orbit.

[Anonymous No.15551258]

>>15550199
I just read it for the crypto shill posts.

[Anonymous No.15551259]

>>15550163
Nice targeted advertising anon.

[Anonymous No.15551272]

>>15550844
>No Government/ESA funding = not happening, simple as.

Where do you think the funding for the engine came from?

[Anonymous No.15551302]

>>15551272
An engine is not an operational system

[Anonymous No.15551312]

>>15551302
And a Merlin isn't an operational rocket either, but SpaceX still had to make them first.

[Anonymous No.15551323]

>>15551312
I’m just telling you it won’t happen
Or if it does it’ll be a weird Avio-Arianegroup hybrid booster as a compromise of both companies’ products, not what they advertise

[Anonymous No.15551354]

Do satellites travel fast enough that relativistic time dilation affects data transfer? if it does, how is it handled? just re-clocking the signal, or something more complicated?

[Anonymous No.15551361]

>>15551354
Their effects are likely so small that those adjustments aren’t needed, and I wonder if adjusting for them is practical if we can’t be as certain of our exact time/position in the first place as those effects begin to take hold.

[Anonymous No.15551362]

is there hope for me of getting an aerospace/general engineering job in Japan as a westerner? through the air force maybe?

[Anonymous No.15551372]

>>15551354
>Do satellites travel fast enough that relativistic time dilation affects data transfer?
a little, yeah
>if it does, how is it handled? just re-clocking the signal, or something more complicated?
IIRC it's mostly about being permissive with transmission lag and timing but strict with order, since the frame divergence isn't enough to cause events to appear out of intended sequence. If you're using a digital network protocol it's not so different from using airliner wifi to speak to servers on the ground.

[Anonymous No.15551381]

>>15551361
>>15551372
That makes sense, thanks.

[Anonymous No.15551384]

>>15551184
Starbase would be a perfect candidate for a small modular reactor. The closes power source is many miles away, and they will need much more than new lines to power the air-separation units.

[Anonymous No.15551386]

>>15551384
those don't exist and it takes 10-15 years to build a nuclear reactor these days

[Anonymous No.15551389]

>>15551384
Regulations

[Anonymous No.15551400]

a nuclear power plant would be a HUGE liability for spacex plus have you thought about the endangered wetland beetles

if they got a natty gas pipeline in or dredged a dock for lng tankers, they could use the lng for energy and filter it for methane

[Anonymous No.15551418]

>>15551400
At that point, why not just build a sewage plant as a bio digester and generate power on site from its own waste? Or incentivize local dairy farmers to do that and pipe in the biomethane?

[Anonymous No.15551425]

>>15551400
I know they tried using LNG for the power on site, CSI-SB stated it would take dozens of trucks to refill it. I never thought of the shipping lane and installing large gas tanks on site. It could work.

[Anonymous No.15551429]

>>15551400
Making a dock for LNG super tankers is about as bad in terms of environmental regulations as anything else. Really just needs the military to step in and give it exemptions as critical military infrastructure, which is objectively true.

[Anonymous No.15551438]

>>15551386
Build it first and tell the NRC to suck it.

[Anonymous No.15551440]

>>15551384
>getting into space industry, launching tons into space with massive rockets is easier than just boiling some fucking water with hot rocks
Nuclear really was pulled a game onto huh

[Anonymous No.15551449]

>>15551440
Boiling water with hot rocks and dumping the waste into abyssal seabed mud is so safe and clean that it renders most environiggery obsolete.

[Anonymous No.15551453]

Long March 10 was redesigned and it too, like Long March 9 will be a starship clone

>The 2 stage variant of Long March 10 has a name now: Long March 10A.
both crew & cargo missions
892t thrust by 7 YF-100K
740t liftoff mass
67m tall
1st stage reusable
landing guided by engine burns & grid fins
sea landing platform & string catching system

[Anonymous No.15551455]

>>15551453
Whoops never mind, it’s a reusable variant of Long March 10 called CZ-10A it’s not a redesign of CZ-10

[Anonymous No.15551514]

>>15550590
"No Child Left Behind" sure is leaving its mark.

[Anonymous No.15551537]

>>15551400

[Anonymous No.15551553]

>>15551537
oxigen

[Anonymous No.15551566]

>>15551384
You can't put a nuclear site that close to the Mexican border. Cartels don't give a fuck about an experimental rocket program. But a nuclear site is ripe of technology and material they can scavenge and then sell on the black market for massive amounts of cash. Something the US government does not want happening. So they'll never allow SpaceX to have such a reactor down at Boca Chica. EVER.

[Anonymous No.15551595]

Im working on a very realistic space simulator. Multiplayer. You can import your own controller algorithms.
Only already discovered physics allowed.
What do you want to see?

[Anonymous No.15551597]

>>15550715
that's what we want

[Anonymous No.15551598]

All I want at this point is to shoot hot cum deep inside an aerospace cutie pussy and just not look back bros

[Anonymous No.15551612]

>>15551537
>hydraulic TVC
that's a nice HPU you've got there, would be a shame if-

[Anonymous No.15551629]

>>15551566
let's just preemptively nuke Mexico

[Anonymous No.15551642]

>>15551612
Are electrical actuators replacing all hydraulics the endgame for spacecraft? Like okay, why don't we operate control surfaces with motors? Landing gear? Anything that moves? Why didn't the Shuttle do this?

[Anonymous No.15551647]

>>15551642
Artificial muscles will replace some hydraulic systems used in fast acting actuators. It’ll be cheaper and more reliable with less hydraulic lines

[Anonymous No.15551650]

>>15551629
it would be kinda funny to nuke a cartel stronghold. it wouldnt accomplish much but it would still be funny

[Anonymous No.15551670]

>>15551642
Overall progress has resulted in electromechanical actuators becoming feasible. Same thing you see in electric cars. We've had electric motors for a long time. We have never had power to weight ratios of the latest EV motors.

[Anonymous No.15551681]

>>15551670
Don't know if they yet pack enough punch for main control surfaces in all applications. F-35 uses electro hydraulic actuators which is a halfway step to electrification. They are smaller self contained hydraulic systems driven by an electric pump.

[Anonymous No.15551733]

>>15551595
roggs

[Anonymous No.15551749]

>>15551650
>it wouldnt accomplish much
I think starting a beaner insurgency inside the US would be an accomplishment

[Anonymous No.15551829]

does anyone in sfg actually work in the space industry?

[Anonymous No.15551830]

>200 posts in 24 hours
and a year back people were shilling for a space board

[Anonymous No.15551853]

>>15551830
5 years from now at the first starship launch, maybe

[Anonymous No.15551854]

>>15551830
>and a year back two people were shilling
ftfy

[Anonymous No.15551855]

>>15551650
It depends on how you look at it

[Anonymous No.15551857]

>>15551830
>and a year back two people were shilling for a space board

[Anonymous No.15551910]

>>15551857
i'll take the krystal pill and become krystal

[Anonymous No.15551913]

>>15550866
>every apartment is a Russia tier commie block
Every affordable one is.

[Anonymous No.15551916]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gz68jpPD_Eg
The shilling (and Astra's delusion) continues

[Anonymous No.15551934]

>>15551910
Furfags go in the pisslock.
Probably voluntarily too.

[Anonymous No.15551944]

>>15551830
This general rightfuly belongs in /n/ desu

[Anonymous No.15551957]

>>15551944
no
we're scientists till the day we die
I've been here since the pre-sfg days and I refuse to go anywhere

[Anonymous No.15551963]

>>15551944
>/n/once

[Anonymous No.15551964]

>>15551944
The day space flight is as common as hopping in the car, taking a bus or riding a train, it belong in /n/

[Anonymous No.15551969]

>>15551934
personally i hate the pisslock

[Anonymous No.15551988]

What are /sfg/'s thoughts on VLEO? I've read that it could open a new market for small sats, but I have my doubts. The only lasting benefits of VLEO are shaving off milliseconds off communications and new orbital lanes once LEO gets crowded. Both of which don't seem that much compared to the extra work of station keeping imo.

[Anonymous No.15551989]

>>15551354
Speaking of this, time is going faster on Earth compared to Mars at the rate of ~1s every ~6 years. It's probably not a big deal for most things, but there will probably be a few specialized things that need to correct for this and I sure as fuck don't want to be the one who codes this shit.

>>15551440
It's probably the kind of industry that's ripe for SpaceX-like disruption, nuclear reactors are so simple that some have occurred naturally (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_nuclear_fission_reactor).).
Yeah you have to do it safely, but it's engineering.

[Anonymous No.15551990]

>>15551988
just use a balloon nigga

[Anonymous No.15552013]

Chinaschlock kino is back, baby. Read the full plot on wikipedia it’s insane
https://youtu.be/7bUEV3fVaAM

[Anonymous No.15552014]

Should we bring life to mars?

[Anonymous No.15552017]

>>15552014
preferably humans

[Anonymous No.15552019]

>>15552014
After the astropaleontologists get a lookover.

[Anonymous No.15552023]

>>15552013
Wandering Earth is such a silly premise, a planet is way too massive to move around like that. I wonder if there are any feasible ways to change a planet's orbit even in million year timescales? Maybe some some sort of momentum transfer by shuttling asteroids between Jupiter and Earth using gravity assists?

[Anonymous No.15552025]

>>15551629
Then all of burgerland faggots will have to slave in the fields and clean toilets. Can't escape the shit jobs if there's no people to take them so that you can work the cushy ones.

[Anonymous No.15552026]

>>15552023
I mean, no more silly than Moonfall's premise. Building massive ion engines on the planet is definitely a way to move the Earth out of its orbit. Theoretically, it's plausible and the plausibility is the basis of the film.

[Anonymous No.15552029]

>>15551990
If it were that simple then why are there new companies based on developing new VLEO technologies and governments are working with them?

[Anonymous No.15552035]

>>15550128
Some are balloons while others are water towers, a common design is water tower first stage and balloon second stage.

[Anonymous No.15552036]

>>15551830
I don't understand why /sci/ needs a spinoff in the first place, the whole board only gets ~2000 posts a day and a new thread every hour or so. Even when the first crew dragon flight happened 3 years ago we only hit 11k posts that day, about as fast as /fit/ or /pw/

>>15551957
>I've been here since the pre-sfg days and I refuse to go anywhere
This. /sci/ is a shithole, but its our shithole.

>>15551853
I would say that starship flying isn't that far off, but given the change to hot staging this late in the development process that may actually be a realistic timeframe.

[Anonymous No.15552039]

>>15550150
What's it's GTO / GEO payloads? That's an area F9 kind of sucks.

[Anonymous No.15552046]

>>15551988
It makes sense for mircosats with short missions because you don't need to claim an orbit that could be used by something else.

[Anonymous No.15552071]

>>15549863
You are an astronaut. Which system would you feel more comfortable sitting in?

[Anonymous No.15552077]

>>15552071
The one with a solid fuel rocket.

[Anonymous No.15552088]

Fusion chads, we are rising up (in 2027)

https://techcrunch.com/2023/07/07/pulsar-fusion-interstellar-space-travel-a-reality/

[Anonymous No.15552095]

>>15552046
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmosphere-breathing_electric_propulsion
You can actually do very long duration missions at some pretty absurdly low altitudes if you can get air-breathing ion propulsion working

[Anonymous No.15552098]

>>15552071
Dragon. Both of them are fine on the safety front, but ergonomics have come a long way since the 1960s.

[Anonymous No.15552100]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grqeGIBaZ-c

[Anonymous No.15552120]

>>15552071
Both seem safe. If I had to pick, then the left simply because it's external to the spacecraft.

[Anonymous No.15552138]

>>15552025
>Can't escape the shit jobs
You can through automation or by paying higher wages that citizens would actually make a living working.
Fuck greedy boomers importing the entire third world so that they can have their lawn mowed cheaper

[Anonymous No.15552153]

When will the next NASA astronaut class be announced

[Anonymous No.15552157]

>>15552138
This makes me wonder how labor relations might change with space colonies. Importing labor might not be cost effective, and having a sizable population living in squalor in a sealed off habitat is a recipe for revolution.

[Anonymous No.15552160]

>>15552157
Fancy science PhDs will somehow learn to empty their own trash cans. It's tricky, but they'll manage.

[Anonymous No.15552163]

>>15552088
no
we are using fission
a dyson swarm of thermal breeder reactors generate uranium-233 from thorium

[Anonymous No.15552181]

>>15552163
Project Orion still makes the most sense, hell much more feasibly if Starship can throw up all the parts for in orbit assembly.

[Anonymous No.15552194]

>>15552157
humanoid robots nigga

[Anonymous No.15552196]

>>15552194
Once you have all the life support shit running, a random man is still going to be cheaper than an warehouse with specialist robot replacement parts.

[Anonymous No.15552210]

>>15552194
Robots are pretty bad at repair and cleaning.

[Anonymous No.15552255]

>>15552210
yes right now, a universal humanoid robot (like tesla is trying to do with optimus) should be able to do most manual labor

[Anonymous No.15552262]

>>15552071
Apollo CM, I'd trust my life with solids before hypergolics

[Anonymous No.15552273]

Just found out there are two Genesis modules from Bigelowe just floating around in space?? Apparently the avionics failed and they have been orbiting since late 2000s

Can they be saved?

[Anonymous No.15552290]

>>15552273
>sorry, no windows

[Anonymous No.15552310]

>>15552023
>using gravity assists
brainlet moment

[Anonymous No.15552337]

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1678098028849143809

>4chan doesn't support twitter embeds
>4chan doesn't support mp4s

[Anonymous No.15552347]

most flown f9 booster will fly today. #16

[Anonymous No.15552356]

>>15552347
Neat. I guess they passed the 15th flight verification and now are pushing for 20th flight record

[Anonymous No.15552390]

>>15552347
Preposterous! It's not economically feasible. Let us say we had twenty guaranteed launches per year and we had a rocket which we can use twenty times—we would build exactly one rocket per year. That makes no sense. You cannot tell those teams: 'Goodbye, see you next year!'

[Anonymous No.15552402]

>>15551642
>>15551670
Batteries and photovoltaics were also terrible until recently. The shuttle used chemical fuel cells because Skylab was such a fuckup.

[Anonymous No.15552447]

>>15552402
It would’ve worked better if they powered it with a CSP and stirling generator

[Anonymous No.15552457]

>>15549942
Lazy negros should learn do wet workshop in space

[Anonymous No.15552475]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDH5xBHlse0

[Anonymous No.15552481]

>>15552457
>wet workshop
we don't mention those, it sets off some spergs

[Anonymous No.15552489]

>>15552337
4chanx does

[Anonymous No.15552501]

>>15552457
B-but space is haaaaard! Give me 2 billion to develop an inflatable closet please please.

[Anonymous No.15552522]

[Anonymous No.15552527]

So september launch?

[Anonymous No.15552528]

>>15549931

[Anonymous No.15552529]

>>15552527
no
4/20/24
unfortunately

[Anonymous No.15552541]

https://twitter.com/mcrs987/status/1677040331634688000

Launchpad watercooling system fully 3d rendered

[Anonymous No.15552543]

>>15552528
Horizontal tests, I'm not really sure its possible to say just based on the time if raptor reliability is getting better (as they are not even testing that each time probably)

[Anonymous No.15552544]

>>15552541

[Anonymous No.15552545]

>>15552541
cool

[Anonymous No.15552554]

>>15552543

[Anonymous No.15552561]

Where they will be getting all that water from?

[Anonymous No.15552568]

>>15552561
alabama

[Anonymous No.15552584]

Ok /sfg/. I have a challenge for all of you. Let's kick life into this general.
IF you browse /sfg/ regularly - make at least ONE quality post each day. A question, a photo, anything. This includes all of you lurkers.

[Anonymous No.15552602]

>>15552561
steal it from the native indian tribes

[Anonymous No.15552615]

>>15552544
LC = launch complex? the different color is confusing me

[Anonymous No.15552651]

>NASA achieved a key milestone June 22, completing an initial certification test series designed to pave the way for production of new RS-25 engines to help power NASA’s SLS (Space Launch System) rocket on future Artemis missions to the Moon, beginning with Artemis V. Test engineers conducted a full-duration test of more than eight minutes (500 seconds) on an RS-25 certification engine manufactured by SLS engines lead contractor Aerojet Rocketdyne. The test duration is the same amount of time needed to help launch the SLS rocket and send astronauts aboard the Orion spacecraft into orbit. The hot fire on the Fred Haise Test Stand at NASA’s Stennis Space Center near Bay St. Louis, Mississippi, marked the 12th – and final – test in the current series, which featured a certification engine that incorporates dozens of improvements to make production more efficient and affordable while maintaining high performance and reliability. The stage is now set to conduct a follow-up hot fire series on a second certification engine this fall. Four RS-25 engines fire simultaneously to help launch each SLS rocket, producing up to 2 million pounds of combined thrust.
https://images.nasa.gov/details/SSC_2023-06-22_RS-25_Engine_Test

[Anonymous No.15552697]

>>15552651
Will those four Rs-25s cost more than 33 Raptors? Asking for a friend.

[Anonymous No.15552711]

New JWST image on Wednesday, what's the chance of it being a deep field?

[Anonymous No.15552781]

>>15552584
Wish I could up with a quality post, but it's unironically not that easy

[Anonymous No.15552792]

>>15552697
If the Raptor costs less than $12M each. No idea until SpaceX releases some solid financial numbers.

[Anonymous No.15552804]

>>15552792
Raptor has a long way

[Anonymous No.15552828]

>>15552804
Do they? Pretty sure in 2019 they said something about them costing $1M each to make. This obviously excludes R&D costs and is only focused on manufacturing, $1M in 2019 wouldn't have turned into $12M+ in 2023. If anything the engines have gotten simpler and easier to manufacture since they don't have as many sensors or test equipment rigged onto them like the Raptor 1s did.

[Anonymous No.15552834]

>>15552651
There's something so sad about how those sparkler arms slowly slink away with pathetic pace

[Anonymous No.15552839]

https://twitter.com/NASA_LSP/status/1678050591526776833?

[Anonymous No.15552841]

>>15552792
No way raptor costs anything close to $12 million lmao, that'd mean they'd have spent 5+ billions on making them alone

[Anonymous No.15552845]

>>15552828
I doubt that Raptor costs $1M each. That might be the goal, but the engine is still relatively young. On top of that, there seems to be alot of testing and fitting with the Raptor which adds to the costs.

[Anonymous No.15552847]

>>15552841
Pretty sure BO could make a 2 million engine if it had 25% failure rate

[Anonymous No.15552850]

>>15552845
They said it costs $1M each and the goal is $250k

[Anonymous No.15552932]

>>15552839
Can't wait for the new closeups. Go Psyche!

[Anonymous No.15552951]

>>15552839
Is it wrong that Ilook at all these probes and think 'if they were launched on a Starship they could get there in half the time or less'?

Same for sapce telescopes. make them as big as you want, put on Starsship, and find out how dark matter works.

[Anonymous No.15552958]

>>15552850
Those are still Elon numbers, he has a tendency to be very optimistic and just state materials costs while foregoing stuff like labour and other costs. That said I'd expect Raptor's cost to be much closer to $1M than $12M. Honestly a lot of the <$1M scepticism is just that comparable engines are so much more expensive that just one million seems far too good to be true while also being never-before-flown FFSC autism. But they've also built more than 200 of them so they pretty much can't cost much more than two or three million. At the same time, BE-4 is said to cost ULA around five or six million I think so it probably costs BO less than that and that means that Raptor definitely costs less than that.

>>15552951
I hope that science payloads quickly adapt to Starship once it's proven. I also hope SpaceX can come up with a payload separation mechanism that actually lets you use all that volume.

[Anonymous No.15552971]

>>15552958
>BE-4 is said to cost ULA around five or six million I think so it probably costs BO less than that and that means that Raptor definitely costs less than that.

BE-4 has to be compatible with Vulcan, that prevents quick inovation. I fully believe Raptor is cheaper than BE-4.

[Anonymous No.15552985]

>>15552792
>raptor cost $12 M each
>spacex throws away half a billion each test run
I don't think they'd do that.

[Anonymous No.15552986]

>>15552958
>Those are still Elon numbers, he has a tendency to be very optimistic
There are ~300 raptors built

There is zero possibility that its $12 million a piece. Thats nearly 4 billion dollars in raptors alone.

[Anonymous No.15552991]

>>15552985
The number $12M simply came from multiplying the cost of a single RS-25 by 4 then dividing by 33. It's not any real estimate of the Raptor's unit cost.

[Anonymous No.15553001]

>>15552971
I don't think lack of quick innovation is the only issue making BE-4 more expensive, more that BO tend to overdesign and spend much more work on their things so the other costs get much higher, but yes, that's what I said, Raptor should certainly be cheaper than BE-4.

>>15552986
Yes, that's exactly what I said in my post, did you even read further than what you quoted?

[Anonymous No.15553016]

>>15552958
The idea of having 150 ton probes, i.e. probes that can actually decelerate when tehy reach their destination, and stay in orbit for years without running out of fuel is just so fucking awesome.

[Anonymous No.15553024]

people say 'oh with starship you can have a 50 ton probe to [X].' But I'm more interested in 0.5-ton probes that get there FAST.

[Anonymous No.15553030]

>>15553024
or how bout a million .5 ton probes that get there slow

[Anonymous No.15553036]

>>15552839
>just dropped
no cap? fr fr?

[Anonymous No.15553046]

>>15553030
We don't have the DSN bandwidth for that.

[Anonymous No.15553048]

Is it possible to have instant communication between earth and say mars?

[Anonymous No.15553049]

>>15553024
>>15553030
Why not 1 kg probes that accelerate at 0.01% speed of light

[Anonymous No.15553052]

wow
one cubic ton of probes

[Anonymous No.15553055]

>>15553048
>lightspeed
we already do
>instant
not without FTL comms fuckery

[Anonymous No.15553073]

>>15553046
launch a million .5 ton lazor relays

[Anonymous No.15553074]

>>15553016
For me, it's Interstellar Probe. Yeet a Voyager-like as quickly out to interstellar space as possible. I think I read a bit into the proposal papers on this one and if I recall correctly they actually chose a slower speed than possible because they say that at some point extra speed hinders the science goals, to which I say fuck that I just want the fastest possible outward probe, but it's roughly what I want. It's currently baselined on SLS Block 2 (lol), I don't remember if they discussed Starship in the papers and I'm too dumb to run the numbers myself, but surely this could be accomplished with a refilled Starship as well? Maybe in that nosecone volume you could even stack multiple kickstages or funny stuff like that?

>>15553024
This. I want humongous probes as well, but Voyager has always been one of my favourite missions and a tiny probe that just gets the fuck out tickles my fancy just right.

[Anonymous No.15553076]

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1678205301349130240

[Anonymous No.15553081]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstellar_travel#Wait_calculation
relevant article

[Anonymous No.15553083]

>>15553076
Imagine trying to explain this photo to someone interested in space flight in circa 2015

[Anonymous No.15553088]

>>15553083
Space Shuttle engines
Except 300 times cheaper

[Anonymous No.15553092]

>>15553076
Whats that big pipe of the right for?

[Anonymous No.15553096]

>>15553092
CSI explained it a while ago, but I forgot the schematics. I think its a purge vent. Something thats obsolete in newer starship designs afaik.

[Anonymous No.15553102]

>>15553083
"Elon built his Mars rocket. Yeah it's fucking awesome, like the best parts of Saturn and Shuttle architectures without most of either one's flaws."

Explaining it to someone in 1995 would be way harder.

[Anonymous No.15553112]

>>15553092
I couldn't say myself, but the right-side image with the red hoses is on the quick disconnect interface side of the ship.

[Anonymous No.15553149]

>>15553102
Why? Both the shuttle and Saturn already existed by then

[Anonymous No.15553165]

Who has the sfg discord link?

[Anonymous No.15553168]

>>15552991
The fuck is nasa smoking, 100mil for each engine?

[Anonymous No.15553169]

>>15553165
i think it's in the pastebin but i could be wrong

[Anonymous No.15553170]

>>15553168
space

hard

going

[Anonymous No.15553175]

>>15553149
But SpaceX didn't.

[Anonymous No.15553197]

>>15553175
And?

[Anonymous No.15553217]

>>15553165
go to the hopper on the Minecraft map, it's posted on a sign there

-4200X 900Y

[Anonymous No.15553222]

>>15552845
>engine is still relatively young
No it isn't. You can't think about engines as "existed for x years;" it's a question of how MANY have been made, how many have been tested, and how many have been flown. At this point, by manufacturing and testing metrics, Raptor 2 is a mature engine. It's still young in terms of integrated flight - but even 1 successful SS+SH launch will change that. Booster 7 was using Raptor 2s from when it was *actually* a very new engine design, which is probably the main reason for the high failure rate. B9+ are using R2s with much more fleshed out design and it would be surprising to see more than 2-3 fail for IFT-2 (assuming the plate works). Raptor 3 is the current young engine and it'll be a while before SpaceX switches to it; R2 isn't getting much in the way of updates as the focus has shifted to R3.

[Anonymous No.15553227]

you are now remembering the San Pedro days

[Anonymous No.15553231]

>Listening to true crime youtuber
>He does an episode about an american college kid who was partying in South Padre beach area, then abducted by a mexican drug cartel/cult and tortured to death.
Who knew. Does South Padre still get a big spring break crowd?

[Anonymous No.15553232]

>>15553175
“So there’s this rich guy who runs a space company. Here’s a photo of their rocket that he published.”

[Anonymous No.15553233]

>>>/wsg/5176772
AAAAHHHHHH Clear is so cute!

[Anonymous No.15553235]

>>15553076
So this is the power of commercial space

[Anonymous No.15553252]

>ship 25, 26, 27, 28, and 29 have their 6-engine aft sections welded on

well, I guess ship 30 can have 9 engines since it doesn't have the aft installed yet

[Anonymous No.15553269]

>>15553231
>listening to true crime
post tits

[Anonymous No.15553294]

going for 16th reflight tonight, cross your fingers and pray for no structural failures boys

[Anonymous No.15553297]

[Anonymous No.15553302]

Max-Qute!

[Anonymous No.15553304]

>>15553297
Blessed launch cat

[Anonymous No.15553308]

>>15553294
9 fairing reflights as well. Is that also a record?

[Anonymous No.15553309]

give it up for flight 16

[Anonymous No.15553313]

And with almost no pomp or circumstance, boom, record broken

>>15553308
I'm not sure, I feel like there was one that has flown for ten times?

[Anonymous No.15553314]

Here’s to 16 more!

[They are terrified No.15553316]

16 entire rocket boosters that didnt have to be built from scratch... how the fuck are there still non reusable rockets in development

[Anonymous No.15553318]

In light of this new booster record, reminder that Dragon Endeavour has spent more time in space than any Shuttle.

[Anonymous No.15553320]

There’s no way this big bitch is gonna fly to the moon and land on it. It’s HUGE, size isn’t a problem??

[Anonymous No.15553325]

>>15553316
Most of them aren't. The remainder are propped up by government requirements for sourcing rockets at any cost.

[Anonymous No.15553326]

>>15553320
It’s small

[Anonymous No.15553334]

>>15553318
Well, Endeavour itself has certainly surpassed the endurance of any single shuttle mission. However, the record that they talked about being broken a couple weeks ago takes into account the entire cumulative flight time of the dragon 2 and compares it to the shuttle, which includes both crew and cargo and is a bit of a cop out if you ask me. That said, it is still incredible that a vehicle that has been flying for a fraction of the time of the space shuttle's career has already beaten it.

[Anonymous No.15553377]

kerolox

[Anonymous No.15553382]

>>15553096
>CSI
>afaik
No reddit for me thank you

[Anonymous No.15553384]

>>15553320
looks tiny next to those trucks

[Anonymous No.15553388]

>>15553377
That's just LOX. RP-1 is the Forbidden Fruit Punch.

[Anonymous No.15553390]

>>15553377

[Anonymous No.15553411]

>>15551362
RIKEN is quite literally your only hope, otherwise get a job at the University of Arizona and pray they launch more asteroid missions with international collaborators

[Anonymous No.15553418]

>>15553334
It is kind of cheating that it spends months at a time docked to the ISS not using its own consumables

[Train Spotter !HgCJ6rQJNA No.15553422]

>>15549863
daily nothing stream https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UytWKGvbIFs

[Anonymous No.15553426]

>>15553334
if the shuttle could have flown without astronauts, 60% of the missions would have been unmanned. It taking the record for vehicle with the most crewed time in space is mostly just cope as a byproduct of it being a retarded design.

[Anonymous No.15553427]

>>15551566
>ripe of technology and material they can scavenge and then sell on the black market for massive amounts of cash.
>implying chinks wouldn't pay out the ass to cartels if they could get even a scrap of a Raptor

[Anonymous No.15553438]

"Looks like we can increase Raptor thrust by ~20% to reach 9000 tons (20 million lbs) of force at sea level"

[Anonymous No.15553445]

>>15553438
At this point I think they're literally extracting demons from hell and chaining one up inside every Raptor, and those demons are under contract to make THROOOOOST

[Anonymous No.15553446]

>>15553438

[Anonymous No.15553447]

>>15553446
Holy shit.

[Anonymous No.15553449]

>>15552337
wwwww

[Anonymous No.15553450]

>>15553446
why does he want to live in a pressure vessel so bad

[Anonymous No.15553451]

>>15553446
over 200 now? I remember the old days of 100, 150

[Anonymous No.15553453]

>>15553446
delusional

[Anonymous No.15553458]

>>15553453
didn't he just fire his chief engineer

[Anonymous No.15553460]

15 flights a day. You might as well just make single-starship sized 200 ton Starlink satellites no?

[Anonymous No.15553462]

>>15553451
It was 150t officially. 100 minimum and 200+ expended.

Now with 200 full reusability, it means 300+t expendable

[Anonymous No.15553464]

>>15553450
He gets to say who's allowed in with him.

[Anonymous No.15553465]

>>15553458
> When the third chamber cracked, Musk flew the hardware back to California, took it to the factory floor, and, with the help of some engineers, started to fill the chambers with an epoxy to see if it would seal them.
uh oh

[Anonymous No.15553469]

>>15553460
15 flights / 3 launch towers = 5 flights per day from launch towers. If we increase it to 5 launch towers, then we get 3 launch per day per tower.

[Anonymous No.15553475]

wow. Imagine how big of a boulder you can bring back on HLS now.
does someone have the numbers for how much mass (moon rocks) Orion can take back? as comparison.

[Anonymous No.15553482]

STOP USING METRIC TONS!!!!
USE MEGAGRAMS!!!!!!!!
FUCK

[Anonymous No.15553484]

>>15553482
Sorry but the SI base unit is kilogram.
You should use kilokilograms instead.

[Anonymous No.15553485]

k^2g

[Anonymous No.15553486]

>saw the same spaceplane poster somewhere else
>Still arguing for the same infeasible concept
>Doesn't appreciate the kind of strict mass ratios required for SSTO.

[Anonymous No.15553493]

>>15553451
ITS was 300 tons fully reusable. we're almost fucking there bros

[Anonymous No.15553495]

>>15553475
HLS doesn't have TPS. Orion is still the limiting factor.

[Anonymous No.15553496]

>>15553475
you cant bring anything back because orion cant carry more than a few kilograms of moon rock (or you die on reentry)

[Anonymous No.15553498]

>>15553482
a megagram, or 1024*1024 grams ^_^

[Anonymous No.15553499]

>>15553493
Big Leg is back in town.

[Anonymous No.15553500]

>>15553482
i only measure in mass-energy in electron volts

[Anonymous No.15553509]

>increasingly desperate lies
>product still hasn't materialized

next thing you know, the cybertruck will double as a boat

[Anonymous No.15553511]

>20% more thrust
>33% more payload
ermm...

[Anonymous No.15553513]

>>15553498
that's a mebigram

[Anonymous No.15553514]

>>15553446
That is, frankly batshit on a 6000 ton vehicle.

[Anonymous No.15553516]

>>15553511
The faster you get into orbit, the lower the gravity losses.

[Anonymous No.15553520]

>>15553500
eV is redundant. It's just a fancy joule.

[Anonymous No.15553521]

>>15553513
why did comp sci choose 1024 and not 256 or 65536 as their base

[Anonymous No.15553524]

>>15553513
I think I'm the second person ever to write the word mebigram, after this guy who uses it incorrectly (in his example it should be mebikilogram)
https://twitter.com/talkytoaster/status/1020676436414386177
kinda cool

[Anonymous No.15553527]

>>15553524
nah - I can tell you googled it. there are others -
https://www.reddit.com/r/Showerthoughts/comments/afo5lj/if_1024_kilobytes_is_a_megabyte_1024_kilograms_is/ee08c6i/

https://prephole.com/they-did-it-they-have-begun-to-pont00n-queue-the-artillery-strikes-306970/

https://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/03/28/1217224/new-speed-record-set-for-wind-powered-vehicles

found with DDG. Google in 2023 sucks mate, don't use it.

[Anonymous No.15553529]

>>15553521
they chose 8, but since people like powers of 10 the ones that are close to 1000 (so 1024) became widely used, and then a disambugation was needed to make it clear that KB is 1000B, not 1024B, so KiB (Kibibyte) was born

[Anonymous No.15553532]

>>15553527
wow google really sucks jesus how does it fuck up an exact word search

I came up with it independently though if that's what you're insinuating by >I can tell you googled it.

[Anonymous No.15553533]

>>15553532
I mean you googled it to find other places people used it - google only returns that tweet

[Anonymous No.15553535]

>>15553529
i mean since they broke the 1000 rule anyway it would have made more sense to go with 2^8. Kibibyte -> 256 Mebibyte -> 65536 etc

[Anonymous No.15553537]

>>15553529
disambugation lol I meant disambiguation obviously
>>15553533
oh yeah that makes more sense sorry I will go to bed now

[Anonymous No.15553545]

cubib kilometer

[Anonymous No.15553548]

>>15553535
the point is that it was widely used before it even had a name, so they needed to create one to make the difference between a "true" kilobyte, (1000B) and a "kinda" kilobyte (1024B) clear. Before the kibibyte was named kilobyte could mean both 1000B and 1024B which caused confusion (still does)

[Anonymous No.15553557]

>>15553511
Its a reminder that thrust is just as if not more important than ISP for first stages.

[Anonymous No.15553568]

a whole cubic kilogram

[Anonymous No.15553595]

>>15553450
No niggers in my pressure vessel boy

[Anonymous No.15553599]

>>15553532
>wow google really sucks jesus how does it fuck up an exact word search


It's an advertising mechanism, not a search engine you stupid newfag. Try going to page 83 of the 999999999 results claimed.

[Anonymous No.15553621]

>>15553231
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Mark_Kilroy

https://cbsaustin.com/news/local/fatal-kidnapping-of-americans-in-matamoros-triggers-tragic-1989-murder-of-a-spring-breaker

> Kilroy was killed with a machete blow and then had his brain removed and boiled in a pot

[Anonymous No.15553623]

>>15553509
teslas basically already do that

[Anonymous No.15553624]

>>15553231
Spring break and summer peak times are basically the only reason that town continues to exist

[Anonymous No.15553635]

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1678217556455301122

[Anonymous No.15553639]

>>15553465
Uh ohhhh a thunderfag is seething guys
>>15553635
Kys offtopic nigger

[Anonymous No.15553642]

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1678244906119184384

[Anonymous No.15553649]

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1678257085123817474

[Anonymous No.15553650]

https://twitter.com/SpaceX/status/1678254865833930752

[Anonymous No.15553653]

>>15553635
>>15553642
>>15553649
>>15553650
Samenigger

[Anonymous No.15553658]

>>15553446
100 to 150 to 200
in the end does it really matter for mass to orbit?
its going to make it somewhat cheaper which is always good, but 100 with full reusability was already paradigm breaking
this will enable more massive single satellites I guess, but aren't most payloads going to be volume limited anyway?
good for bulk stuff like flat packed starlinks and propellant for depots

[Anonymous No.15553660]

>>15553658
>in the end does it really matter for mass to orbit?

Uh yes are you braindead

[Anonymous No.15553663]

>>15552544
Texas bolt counters...we are so back

[Anonymous No.15553664]

>>15553458
source?
missed that completely

[Anonymous No.15553667]

Business idea: Private prisons, but in space.

[Anonymous No.15553670]

>>15553664
>source
His ass, I think.

[Anonymous No.15553671]

>>15553660
I mean from cost perspective
going from 2000 to 200 vs 100 is not going to change much in the grand scheme of things
also the max mass payload isn't going to be used every flight due to being volume limited

[Anonymous No.15553674]

>>15553667
No, either the crime is bad enough to hang them for or it isn't. If it's not then you just give then a corporal punishment bad enough for their crime and send them packing.

[Anonymous No.15553678]

>>15553671
If one assumes that activities in space become limited by fuel availability, the 200 tons to orbit at $2 million a flight turns the shipping cost of any liquid to $10 a kilogram to LEO.

[Anonymous No.15553682]

>>15553674
Thank you for reply muzzie bro. But I don't think so.

[Anonymous No.15553684]

>>15553682
Yeah dude the prison industrial complex is just such a successful model for "rehabilitation". Now pay up those tax dollars goy.

[Anonymous No.15553689]

Water recycling efficiency is a surprisingly limiting factor. The recovery rate for water filtration on the ISS is 93.5%: at half the nominal consumption rate of water in America, that leaves a wastage factor of about 2.7 gallons per day. That's $102 in launch capacity being consumed per person, per day if you live with efficient showers and flush toilets.

[Anonymous No.15553690]

>>15553678
I wonder if this is close to the chemical rocket efficiency asymptote
perhaps with a bigger rocket you could get a bit better, but the fixed costs would be slightly larger
rotating detonation engines would increase efficiency by 25% theoretically or something , not sure to how much more payload that would translate to though
the next big step needs to come from new propulsion or some fixed megaproject

[Anonymous No.15553692]

>>15553689
>The recovery rate for water filtration on the ISS is 93.5%: at half the nominal consumption rate of water in America, that leaves a wastage factor of about 2.7 gallons per day

Holy fuck how much water are you fat cunts using every day.

[Anonymous No.15553693]

>>15553689
is this some fixed thing or does it depend on scale?

[Anonymous No.15553695]

>>15553693
>>15553692
It's hard to say for sure what's going on because the estimates seem wildly out of whack. For example, 30% of that estimated value is, on average, lawn watering. If we revise these numbers to eliminate lawns entirely and double the systematic efficiency of household water use, the waste factor drops to 1.87 gallons per day, or 7.06 kilograms, or $70.6 in lost water per day.

[Anonymous No.15553699]

>>15553689
>2L drinking water
>2-3L for cooking and cleaning (generous)
>10-15L for shower
>2L misc

Is my estimated usage. What are Americans doing for that much wastage. Americans are never going to Mars LOL put down the bug macs fuck me.

[Anonymous No.15553703]

>>15553689
>The recovery rate for water filtration on the ISS is 93.5%

The rest of the water goes... where?...

[Anonymous No.15553704]

>>15553703
Discarded as briny waste, I think. Probably dumped to reenter.

[Anonymous No.15553705]

its been dead for weeks now

[Anonymous No.15553706]

>>15553704
>briny waste

So they don't have a evaporation/distillation mechanism? Yeah that checks out for NASA cucks. Good thing we will be bringing one of those so we don't throw salty water into the vacuum.

[Anonymous No.15553710]

>>15553706
The most efficient form of water recovery in an energy constrained environment is reverse osmosis at 93.5%. Dissolved solids in evaporator systems will crystallize on the surfaces of the system, reducing its efficiency and ultimately clogging it up. They can't run forever.

[Anonymous No.15553712]

>>15552475

[Anonymous No.15553713]

>>15553710
>Dissolved solids in evaporator systems will crystallize on the surfaces of the system, reducing its efficiency and ultimately clogging it up

Cool, I'm sure we can find someone to take the plates out and give them a scrape you NASA cuck faggot.

[Anonymous No.15553714]

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-07-09/elon-musk-starlink-interfering-in-scientific-work/102575480

[Anonymous No.15553715]

Says here that with the new Brine Processor the overall efficiency is 98%
https://www.nasa.gov/feature/new-brine-processor-increases-water-recycling-on-international-space-station
>“With this new brine processor assembly, we’ll recover additional water from the urine brine produced by the Urine Processor, such that the overall water recovery is closer to 98%”, says Carter.

>Stored or Russian Urine

[Anonymous No.15553719]

>>15553705
>like a dozen replies when someone mentions water
/sfg/ - sewage filtration general

[Anonymous No.15553721]

>>15553713
Whatever you say,

[Anonymous No.15553725]

>>15553715
so there is still concentrated brine left with some water
wouldn't the water be able to be recovered that with heating?

[Anonymous No.15553727]

>>15553715
Look at this government abomination. Here, let me privatise this clusterfuck

>waste water (all kinds) > hot environment (spin if you are in NASA 0g cuckpod) > Cool and collect pure evaporation

Wow so hard, can I have a job now.

>>15553721
No argument found, rope yourself Shelby spave is hard cocksucker.

[Anonymous No.15553728]

>>15553712
yet another starfactory render

[Anonymous No.15553729]

>>15553715
That's a significant improvement, then. That should make it pretty easy to have sub-$20 per person per day in water waste while having in-space extravagances like showers and flush toilets.

[Anonymous No.15553733]

>>15553727
>Wow so hard, can I have a job now.
Go ahead and try for it, then. The only person stopping you is you.

[Anonymous No.15553736]

>>15553733
>The only person stopping you is you

Yes, because that's all you need to do to get contracts with corrupt government faggots, just work hard.

[Anonymous No.15553737]

>>15553736
>I am so smart
>I can't get in though because the system is against me
Go work out the kinks from your fragile, inflated ego

[Anonymous No.15553739]

>>15553728
render of the water tank system for the steel plate

[Anonymous No.15553741]

>>15553737
Ad hominem, argument not found. Go back to lebbit to seethe about incels and rightoids or whatever.

[Anonymous No.15553744]

>>15553741
You slipped into that ad-hominem fallacy mess like four posts ago and don't have a single leg to stand on.

[Anonymous No.15553747]

>>15553744
Cope NASA reddit bootlicker

[Anonymous No.15553753]

>>15553667
Why?

[Anonymous No.15553759]

>>15553753
would be pretty difficult to escape

[Anonymous No.15553762]

>>15553710
>Dissolved solids in evaporator systems will crystallize on the surfaces of the system
can't they just flush the surfaces or something

[Anonymous No.15553765]

>>15553762
Water recycling is hard

[Anonymous No.15553766]

>>15553762
Yes, but whatever you used to flush it is now waste.

[Anonymous No.15553768]

>>15553765
How does nature do it?

[Anonymous No.15553771]

>>15553768
Metric fuckloads of briny saltwater compared to fresh water.

[Anonymous No.15553773]

>>15553766
>recycle into brine system

Difficult stuff

[Anonymous No.15553774]

>>15553773
Which still has all the shit you need to get rid of in it.

[Anonymous No.15553777]

>>15553446

https://twitter.com/peterrhague/status/1678333731050778624

> Back in April I made an estimate based on the current trajectory, given public statements by SpaceX and the exponential rate at which Falcon 9 mass-to-orbit is increasing (about 40% per year). The assumption is that this rate would become something of a self-fulfilling prophecy as Moore's law has. What Musk is saying here indicates an ambition for an even faster growth rate.

https://planetocracy.substack.com/p/mass-value-report-for-april-2023

[Anonymous No.15553780]

>>15553774
Cool except no cares since you just keep flushing. Once it reaches a solubility point just throw it in a dish a scrape out all the nasty shit after it evaporates.

[Anonymous No.15553783]

>>15553774
That's why you just store the brine until you get to Mars and then use it in a saltwater based biorecycling system involving seagrass, plankton, crustaceans, and bottom feeding fish. The crop growing hydroponics system will be a separate freshwater loop.

[Anonymous No.15553786]

>>15553780
Getting all of the water out of the solids becomes more and more difficult and energy intensive and time consuming as the water quantity goes down. Even in molten lava, there's water locked into the rock, and these kinds of waste products are no different.

[Anonymous No.15553788]

reminder a million tons is nothing. that's about a dozen cargo ships worth of freight.

[Anonymous No.15553793]

>>15553788
It only took a few Conestoga wagons to bootstrap a town on the frontier in the 1800s. That's the magic of ISRU.

[Anonymous No.15553798]

>>15553786
OK so just find the point at which there are too many solids and distill out your flush solution from there. Sailing ships in the 1700s were distilling saltwater into drinking water but I guess space is hard huh.

>muh energy

Hey grandpa this isn't the 1990s, we are going to be throwing up solar panels by the megawatt.

[Anonymous No.15553807]

>>15553798
>Hey grandpa this isn't the 1990s, we are going to be throwing up solar panels by the megawatt.
And a portion of water remains unrecoverable without a different methodology. It's always possible that the existing approaches are ass-backwards, but the bandied about solar-evaporator ideas are not better.

[Anonymous No.15553820]

>>15553807
>And a portion of water remains unrecoverable without a different methodology

Sorry, could you clarify what this percentage is? Because in every evaporative chamber it is effectively 100%. You don't lose water in evaporation chambers except for some microscopic amount that binds with some other other chemicals to form solids.

[Anonymous No.15553831]

>>15553820
Apparently it's lower than I think in zero liquid discharge systems. Took me a lot longer than I like to actually find literature on this stuff.

[Anonymous No.15553834]

>>15553793
>a town on the frontier in the 1800
they had air and water immediately available you doofus

[Anonymous No.15553835]

Daily reminder Von Braun wanted to make the Saturn V (and his future Mars rocket) 100% hypergolic. What a chad.

[Anonymous No.15553837]

>>15553834
It's cool how on Mars there is both water and oxygen in exchange for a little electricity.

[Anonymous No.15553839]

>>15553667

[Anonymous No.15553843]

>>15553835
>Hydrazine and red fuming nitric acid
I see he was still using the Peenemunde expendable slave labor model at this point.

[Anonymous No.15553844]

i'll literally shit big fuck in mars but how will there be toilet? i will shit all over

[Anonymous No.15553848]

>>15553835
Von Braun had some "old space" mentalities. No one is perfect.

http://heroicrelics.org/info/all-up/reflections-mueller.html

>Bergen: You were the one responsible for deciding on the all-up testing procedure.
>Mueller: Correct.
>Bergen: Can you tell us a little bit about how you came to that decision?
>Mueller: Oh, it was easy. You just looked at the schedule, and you could see that if you went through the test program that Marshall [Space Flight Center] had laid out for the launch vehicle, that you weren't going to be landing on the moon in the decade. I don't think that anyone really who had been involved in the program disagreed with that. I don't know that that time they were all that convinced that we they were going to be able to land on the moon in the decade.
>Bergen: Did you convince Dr. von Braun and his associates that that was a good idea?
>Mueller: That was an interesting move, I must say, and it was also necessary to convince Bob Gilruth and his associates that it was a reasonable idea, because they weren't used to doing that either. But Werner probably had the more vocal opposition.

[Anonymous No.15553852]

Pulling my head out of my ass and assuming a more reasonable implementation of a 70% purification by reverse osmosis filtration and 30% by evaporate distillation, effectively perfect reuse can be realized with a rather modest 44 kilowatt hours (times systematic inefficiencies) of heating per person per day.

[Anonymous No.15553854]

>>15553835
Vom Braun is cool but his Mars rocket is doshit. Muh gorillion tonnes of hypergolics.

[Anonymous No.15553869]

>>15552584
It's not that easy in postery

[Anonymous No.15553873]

>>15552958
You're a 5

[Anonymous No.15553892]

would they have already launched again if they didnt have to rebuild stage 0

[Anonymous No.15553906]

>>15553835
Cryogenics literally did not exist back then.

[Anonymous No.15553921]

>>15553892
SHUT UP SHUT UP SHUT UP SHUT UP SHUT UP

[Anonymous No.15553935]

>>15553892
The new deluge system was on the To-Do list for launch 2. If they'd built it for Launch 1, the first flight would not have happened yet, nevermind the second.

[Anonymous No.15553940]

>>15552584
Each OP should have a thread question like other generals.

[Anonymous No.15553961]

>>15553892
Maybe.
But
>>15553935
is correct, they already had their steel palte/deluge system more or less ready to be installed.
And they're clearly not as far along with the Booster and Sarship for the next launch that they could simply roll them out, do the last tests and launch, at least partly due to the FTS changes.

Also, there are a bunch of legal questions. I have no clue how serious the environmental 'concers' and 'ancestral religious whatevers' are and if tehy'll just get laughed out of court in Brownsville.
Probably just chaff thrown up by luddites, but itS' there and has to be cleared because I'm pretty sure the FAA wil want all Ts dotted.

[Anonymous No.15553967]

>>15553854
Very glushko-esque

[Anonymous No.15553971]

>>15553961
the tribal dorks claiming ancestral land shit never filed their legal paperwork on time/properly

[Anonymous No.15553973]

>>15552584
>This includes all of you lurkers.
This is my post for the day.
Not my problem if you deem it to be not up to standard.

[Anonymous No.15553987]

>>15553446
Kek imagine working at ULA or BO and having to see semi-annual announcements about how the gap is only growing

[Anonymous No.15553993]

>>15553446

[Anonymous No.15554010]

>>15553635
turbokek
>>15553639
rockets being confused for dicks is very /sfg/

[Anonymous No.15554020]

spacex launching from french guiana when?

[Anonymous No.15554026]

how much longer until the concrete cures

[Anonymous No.15554047]

[Anonymous No.15554058]

>>15553377
>COPVs in the cryo tank
yeah that's crazy. they didn't do that with ship nor booster

[Anonymous No.15554059]

>>15554026
two decades

[Anonymous No.15554069]

>>15554047

[Anonymous No.15554070]

>>15553710
>energy constrained environment
luckily we need 5 billion jiggawatts for propellant production so this is not a concern.

[Anonymous No.15554081]

>>15551354
It affects GPS systems since they rely on precisely timed signals

[Anonymous No.15554086]

>>15554081
More specifically, it's not the satellite speed that causes the time dilation, but the difference in gravitational field strength between ground level receivers and the GPS sats in orbit.

Article discussing relativity effects on GPS systems-
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5253894/

[Anonymous No.15554093]

>>15551354
For the actual transfer it doesn't matter. Satellites without atomic clocks have variance in their signal generator that is much greater than the speedup effect of special + general relativity.

[Anonymous No.15554094]

>>15554086
Isn’t the core of the earth 2 years younger than the crust because of the affects of mass

[Anonymous No.15554098]

>>15554086
>Figure Figure22 shows the net fractional frequency offset of an atomic clock in a circular orbit, which is essentially the left side of Eq. (35) plotted as a function of orbit radius a, with a change of sign. Five sources of relativistic effects contribute in Figure Figure2.2. The effects are emphasized for several different orbit radii of particular interest. For a low earth orbiter such as the Space Shuttle, the velocity is so great that slowing due to time dilation is the dominant effect, while for a GPS satellite clock, the gravitational blueshift is greater. The effects cancel at a ≈ 9545 km. The Global Navigation Satellite System GALILEO, which is currently being designed under the auspices of the European Space Agency, will have orbital radii of approximately 30,000 k

[Anonymous No.15554100]

>>15554093
But there are many applications that require precise timing of data.

[Anonymous No.15554114]

>>15551354
Uppity martian fuckers should learn to feed themself first before trying to invent new time standards.

Besides, its not like earth scientists are not working on pulsar based clocks that's universal or anything. Some martian fart huffer has to figure it all out, how will we advance otherwise. I say nuke them all

[Anonymous No.15554136]

>>15553710
>Dissolved solids in evaporator systems will crystallize on the surfaces of the system
>crystallize
We won bros

[Anonymous No.15554152]

>>15553294
by my count, Falcon 9 has now exceeded Tsyklon with 236 launches. Next target: Thor and Atlas at 274 launches each. At that point, Falcon 9 will be the most launched American orbital vehicle in history.

[Anonymous No.15554162]

>>15554114
>Uppity martian fuckers should learn to feed themself first
Said the dirt dauber faggot who gets all his food from autonomous combine harvesters. You haven’t seen a real plant in 5 years bug eater

[Anonymous No.15554166]

>europe grew extremely wealthy and powerful from having colonies
>countries still refuse to colonize space
countries dont have ambition anymore

[Anonymous No.15554172]

>>15554166
There was the promise of huge profits in the age of empires
Meanwhile there’s no economy of any kind established past low earth orbit

[Anonymous No.15554176]

>>15554162
>hits post
>waits 40 minute to fill captcha
>fill captcha
>wait 40 minutes
>captcha expired

[Anonymous No.15554190]

>>15553712
been out of the loop, so is the megabay about the same size as the widebay except it's built differently?

[Anonymous No.15554191]

>>15554172
There are huge profits to be made from space, we just don’t know where they are. Tobacco was what saved the first North American colonies and that was an incidental discovery. Later on, vast mineral and timber wealth was found and exploited to fund further growth.
Nowadays, the head honchos that control most of the economy of the planet have anything they could ever think of having with a few phone calls away, their next desire is with control of people’s information and thoughts given that they can’t just go to war with each other for prestige they crave like the monarchs and merchants before

[Anonymous No.15554197]

>>15554176
>Lasblasts your comm network with laser communication array
>Forcibly hack your daily Amazon Blacked broadcasts with shitposts through your astroonamy network

[Anonymous No.15554208]

>>15553446
I'm assuming this is Raptor 3

[Anonymous No.15554214]

I hate page 9!
I hate page 9!
I hate page 9!
I hate page 9!
I hate page 9!

[Anonymous No.15554220]

>>15554191
I know I know. There’s huge potential money, but it isn’t exactly “show up and lat claim to your bounty”
I guess it’s true for real estate (i.e. show up and plant a flag and claim it’s your “area” for a future human colony) but in terms of actually generating money? Lots of massive upfront development costs.

[Anonymous No.15554248]

>>15553892
>implying they didn't know that it would dig out the space needed for the deluge system
They were always planning on putting a deluge system in. They figured they could let superheavy do it for them instead.
Delightfully counterintuitive

[Anonymous No.15554250]

>>15554136
Based chatGPT

[Anonymous No.15554281]

>>15554250
>chatgpt, deepfakes, and other recent ai have dramatically reshaped almost every industry on earth except for spaceflight
what went wrong?

[Anonymous No.15554282]

>>15554190
It fits twice the amount of vehicles.
It's ultrawide

[Anonymous No.15554287]

>>15554281
>>chatgpt, deepfakes, and other recent ai have dramatically reshaped almost every industry on earth except for spaceflight
take your meds. this never happened.
its all promises of years in the future assuming things continue to progress at a rapid rate.

[Anonymous No.15554291]

>>15554282
>wide
or deep or idk

[Anonymous No.15554299]

>>15554281
chatgpt only works well on existing knowledge and language patterns and absolutely shits the bed on truly unique output

[Anonymous No.15554304]

this >>15554287 is true
yet this >>15554299 is still a giga midwit take

[Anonymous No.15554306]

>>15554287
i see it all the time in games, music, tv, movies, etc. its everywhere.

[Anonymous No.15554310]

>>15554306
citation needed. the news talking about something doesn't make it real

[Anonymous No.15554312]

>>15554281
They haven't reshaped shit.

[Anonymous No.15554318]

>>15554310
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbuEkMYY8uk
https://www.twitch.tv/watchmeforever
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secret_Invasion_(TV_series)#Title_sequence
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQq8M88s3BU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNGeTCPPrMA

[Anonymous No.15554324]

>>15554304
>noooooo it's responses are so unique bro
>that wasnt in the training data bro
Who's the midwit now?

[Anonymous No.15554328]

>>15554324
you simply don't even understand the point.
crazy midwittery.
>15554318
you MUST go back. also this is bait

[Anonymous No.15554335]

>>15554328
you are a robot dinosaur retard and it oozes through every inch of your post

[Anonymous No.15554340]

>you are a robot dinosaur retard

[Anonymous No.15554351]

>>15554340
Lmao that's a funny image. here's mine

[Anonymous No.15554384]

Page 9 taking shape nicely it seems

[Anonymous No.15554387]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dhh-kgWPT7s

[Anonymous No.15554394]

>>15554220
That's why Starlink exists.

[Anonymous No.15554397]

https://twitter.com/Ringwatchers/status/1678461788377980938

Deeper thread on the Starship engine skirt photo from Musk.

[Anonymous No.15554403]

LIFTOFF
>>15554401
>>15554401
>>15554401
>>15554401

[Anonymous No.15554419]

>>15554387
cute girl

[Anonymous No.15554435]

>>15554387
I quit NSF and WAI for news on Starbase. Every video is stuffed with filler for time, "why is the ship running methalox?" "what does full re-usability mean?" CSI Starbase and RGV AP are much more to the point, and almost no merch/sponser shilling.

[Anonymous No.15554527]

>>15553642
why wouldn't this dumb nigger rotate the inner engines 30 degrees for clearance

[Anonymous No.15554559]

>>15553892
but we did eat breakfast yesterday

[Anonymous No.15554625]

>>15554419
>girl