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/sci/ - Science & Math


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15200993 No.15200993 [Reply] [Original]

how harmful is wind power? should it be illegal?

>> No.15201000

Still cleaner and safer than nuclear

>> No.15201056

need some sauce for those numbers, and a witness for these >>15201000 trips

>> No.15201153

I personally believe wind power is underwhelming but ...isn't carbon sequestration a good thing?

>> No.15201165

>>15200993
It's just another "green" scam that the rich elite are pushing to launder more money into their pockets.
Nobody benefits but the rich 1% elite.

>> No.15201190

They call it "meatgrinder". Kills literal tons of birds and insects.

>> No.15201283

>>15200993
very and yes

>> No.15201291

>>15200993
"Clean" energy is a scam. All of them require polluting the environment to either build or maintain.

>> No.15201303

>>15200993
they seem kinda useless

>> No.15201321

>>15201291
the entirety of planet earth is dirty. the whole planet is covered in dirt. animals shit all over it. i pissed on parts of several different continents.
lmao at the cucks who want to clean that up, just lmao. go clean up piss and shit for your whole life, cuck, the day after you're buried animals will shit on your grave. maybe i'll come by and piss on it too

>> No.15201403

>>15200993
we can calculate the output of a windmill and I've read that it should provide "positive roi" in terms of energy.

170 tons of coal is not even that much compared to a behemoth that spins all 24/7/365 (mostly) if you place it where there's winds.

iirc it should be net zero after a year or so of operation(15 months I think, but I'm not necesarily sure)

>> No.15201548

>>15200993
Why dont they melt the carbon fiber to get petroleum?

>> No.15201705

>>15201403
>mostly
Big problem stuffed into a very small word.

>> No.15201762

>>15201403
Missing the load following part. You need to combine windmills with storage or build out an obscenely large amount to ensure you have enough electricity to supply at any given time. If you read studies on the EROI on wind, it varies a ton, usually hovering around either 4x and 40x, depending on if they include storage or not. There are different proposals for energy storage, each with their own upsides and downsides. Chemical batteries are the obvious one, but highly expensive and you'd run into lithium shortages before you could do it worldwide. Gravity storage seems moderately promising (lifting concrete with a winch to store energy as gravity potential energy, releasing it to spin a turbine for electrical energy). EROI isn't the only parameter to design around: financial ROI, product lifecycle, ecological impacts (not just birds, ut also fish for offshore wind), etc. also matter. In short, there are only trade-offs in engineering. We just need to determine which to take

>> No.15201913

>uh-oh!!
>greentards destroyed the environment "by accident" again
>now the government is going to have to pay to fix it
>that means we're going to have to raise you're taxes again goy,
>nobody else can pay, greentards don't work, they just laze around campus drinking soi lattes
>pay up goy, greentards are too irresponsible to cover their own debts

>> No.15201946

>>15201913
When did Greenies destroy the environment?

>> No.15201954

>>15201946
See
>>15200993

>> No.15201959
File: 40 KB, 843x565, 1664059404766.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15201959

>>15200993
Coking coal (wet basis) 29.9 MJ/kg
Capacity factor 25% (very conservative)
= 106 days

>> No.15201967
File: 249 KB, 2619x1410, 1655837393459.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15201967

>>15201000
Nope

>> No.15201968
File: 20 KB, 717x344, deaths-per-billion-kWh-produced-Source-Updated.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15201968

>>15201000
>safer than nuclear

>> No.15201969

>>15201946
>When did Greenies destroy the environment?
They've been doing it constantly, for decades. A cursoty look at the history of major greentard movements reveal that they have always been funded by industry polluters, especially Big Oil. It's peak clown world.

>> No.15201976

>>15201000
Bullshit of the century
Nuclear the the greenest shit we'll see until we get cheap safe antimatter or some space magitech

>> No.15202008

>>15201968
>Coal
>Coal - China

>> No.15202011

>>15201969
>no examples
opinion discarded

>> No.15202012

>>15202011
A cursoty look at the history of major greentard movements reveal that they have always been funded by industry polluters, especially Big Oil. It's peak clown world. That's the fact of the matter. If you came to discuss your corporate-assigned "opinions", take it elsewhere. You and other reddit migrants are undesirables and your green scam is universally ridiculed.

>> No.15202014

>>15202008
Yes, and ?

>> No.15202021

>>15202012
I like how you misspelled cursory twice.

>> No.15202027

>>15202012
>>15201969
Nice bot, thanks heartland institute

>> No.15202041

>>15202021
>>15202027
If you're not a shill, how come the entities you align yourself with are funded by the people you complain about?

>> No.15202049

Do we just dump the 260 tons of steel into the ocean when we're done with the windmill? Oh wait, we recycle it and use it for something else.

>> No.15202068

>>15202021
misspellings don't trigger me the way they do with you, i enjoy seeing them, reminds me that there are still people who aren't so routinely intellectually lazy and cowardly that they rely on spell checkers. plus a lot of spellcheckers these days are thinly disguised key loggers, so you're a gay retard to fall into that trap. imagine being a faggot with a spellchecker and then thinking you're somehow winning by calling out the people who have enough confidence in their own inellect that they don't rely on midwit software helpers. if thats the best you got then you ain't got much.

>> No.15202084

>>15202041
which entity?

>> No.15202134

>>15202041
?
>>15202068
Sorry I hurt your feelings.

>> No.15202228

>>15202008
>Coal
:/
>Coal - China
:O

>> No.15202233

>>15200993
pfft it's fine
just kidding, keep using oil like a good goy!

>> No.15202235

>>15201153
the carbon was already sequestered just fine before it was mined

>> No.15202255

>>15202134
you're only hurting yourself by using the sissy spell checker, vocabulary is tightly connected to iq and being able to spell the words correctly is tightly linked to vocabulary retention. why are you so insistent on leading a low iq lifestyle?

>> No.15202256

>>15202255
I said I'm sorry I hurt your feelings, you don't need to have the last word to assert some kind of dominance lol.

>> No.15202260

>>15202256
low iq spell checker sissy, barely literate.

>> No.15202262

>>15202260
I knew you'd reply.

>> No.15202431
File: 114 KB, 2560x1109, usa-bird-mortality.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15202431

>>15201190
not really

>> No.15202468

>>15202431
shh anon, you're not supposed to use data here! wind power is EVIL, end of story!

>> No.15202555
File: 206 KB, 1204x1336, wind power did the slave trade.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15202555

>>15202468
Wind power is RACIST and also ABLEIST and FATPHOBIC

>> No.15202563

>>15202431
Let's not forget the 6 gorillion birds that capitalism kills every year!

>> No.15202572

>>15202555
>wind racist because slave boats
Jesus Christ. It's unreal how many people there are who should just jump off a cliff.

>> No.15202575

>>15202555
Electricity in general is literally just slavery of electrons. White people couldn't oppress blacks anymore, so they moved on to enslaving elementary particles.
I can't imagine how many black people struggle every day with being forced to propagate slavery in this world.

>> No.15202595

>carbon fiber never degrades
It does in landfills. Material that typically would almost last forever if buried in normal enviroments such as PVC which could last literally millions of years in normal enviroments dont in landfills. They are harsh areas and lots of microbs and moisture. Carbon fiber breaks down when exposed to moisture for longer periods of time. Its also why they need to throw the blades away after a while. The stress plus moisture causes cracking ie breaks down the chemical bonds in the carbon fiber.

>> No.15202655

>>15202049
Mhhhm delicious salt-water and hydraulic fluid steel. Needs no reprocessing. Best quality, buy here now.

>> No.15202760

>>15200993
>harmful
to who?

>> No.15203076

>>15202760
non jews, those are the only people worth caring about

>> No.15203165

>>15202008
slavery please understand

>> No.15203173

>>15203165
and then Coal - US just to further drive in the point

>> No.15203216

>>15200993
Birds are going extinct because of these things. Wind turbines should be illegal.

>> No.15203222

>>15201548
>the carbon fiber
It's fiberglass, aka glass fibers bound up in a matrix of thermoset plastic. The thermoset plastic cannot be recycled.

>> No.15203358

>>15202555
This dudes tweets are like a collage of /sci/ threads.

>> No.15203531

>>15201000
FPBP trips of truth

>> No.15203541
File: 76 KB, 347x420, disgust3.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15203541

>>15201000
>cleaner and safer than nuclear

>> No.15203569

>>15202555
>1.
Uhhh... pretty sure that was Jews who made it possible?

>> No.15203737

>>15202595
Have you seen the research surrounding PETase found in Japan?

I was following research on new enzymes found for biodegradation of PET plastics for a bit (mostly via catalytic triad reactions which may potentially be aided by suspension of the material in ionic liquids or higher temperatures), but am not sure how much research has been done into the biodegradation of carbon fiber materials.

>> No.15203745

>>15202431
post the non-log chart to really drive the point home

>> No.15203792
File: 640 KB, 1400x932, tar_sands.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15203792

>>15201190
Yes, I'm sure no birds or insects are killed in oil extraction/refining/transport though!

>> No.15203798

>>15203792
Do you think that natural tar sands are healthy and productive environments for animals?

>> No.15203812

>>15203798
The oil sands in that photo at least naturally occur under a fairly deep layer of capstone, soil and boreal forest and would have been perfectly healthy habitat for animals
In fact, you can see a patch of said forest in the photo is you look carefully.

>> No.15203841

>>15203216
fucking retard

>> No.15203852

>>15203841
BIRD LIVES MATTER

>> No.15203929

>>15201959
Hot rolled steel takes 2.2MJ/metric ton. (coking coal included in the process. )

>> No.15203931

>>15200993
Excellent post. Remind of what waste product of wind power needs to buried 1km underground for a million years.

>> No.15203933

>>15203931
Fiberglass. Unless you want everyone to get silicosis I guess.

>> No.15203968

>>15200993
Causes droughts, its some monkey-level geoengineering tech.
Did you think the elites told you the truth when they said its for electricity?

>> No.15203992

>>15203216
*butterflies

>> No.15203997

>>15203173
>>15203165
>>15202008
china's major population centres, which also host their factories, are powered almost entirely by nearby coal power plants. usually in other countries coal power plants aren't nearby. smog in chinese cities is primarily from these power plants and it causes huge mortality though it is hard to measure exactly. estimates likely far undershoot.

>> No.15204000

>>15201291
yes it's just to justify giving public money and privileges to companies. yet another means of doing this. it's all corrupt and not based on research, has no basis in environmental or economic viability.

>> No.15204007

>>15201946
anti-nuclear is not based on anything yet greenies for generations militantly oppose and shut down any and all discussion of nuclear much less beginning projects

>> No.15204011

>>15202008
Sulphur dioxide, fly ash and NOx scrubbers are more of a suggestion in China

>> No.15204012

>>15201968
fukushima didn't kill anyone drowning in the tsunami is the sole cause of death

>> No.15204182

>>15201000
Tell that to a bird

>> No.15204319

>>15201946
Look the fucking OP image you tard. Tell me what those blades are made of.

>> No.15204751

>>15202431
Thanks, I'll know not to use this as an argument against wind, but it's not an argument for it.

>> No.15205092
File: 298 KB, 380x379, jews did this.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15205092

>>15201946
because they fucking love science

>> No.15205370
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15205370

>>15201000
>>15202011
>>15202233
>>15202255
>>15202555
>>15202655
>>15203222
>>15203933
>>15204000
>>15204011

All have been witnessed
I may leave now as my work here is done

>> No.15205392
File: 2.12 MB, 1020x1015, 1663561716968.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15205392

>>15205370
thank you for your service

>> No.15205408

>>15200993
I've always wonder about what the effect of windpower is on the weather.


The energy has to come from somewhere, so it is basically slowing the wind down by colliding with the props and imparting some momentum. I wonder how many of these you would have to build to change the weather.

>> No.15205409

>>15201969
Energy companies will fund any new energy technology to an extent. They want to know its capabilities and get their finger in the pie if it takes off. Like so many retards, you're turning something unremarkable into muh conspiracy. The real problem with wind and other renewables is that coal etc. remain cheaper and better from the point of view of energy companies.

>> No.15205410

>>15200993
>should it be illegal?
Nothing should be illegal, but wind power is mostly a meme.

>> No.15206306 [DELETED] 
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15206306

>> No.15206932
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15206932

>>15202431
>>15203745
>>15204751
>>15203841
>muh migratory and birds of prey are dying from windmills at the same rates as birds that can be killed by house cats
This is such a brainlet argument.
What matters is the type of birds that are being killed, not the quantity in comparison to delicate little R-selected finches that outnumber bald eagles 10,000 to 1
If we start making birds of prey go extinct it will have permanent consequences at the continent level due to trophic cascading

>> No.15206938

>>15205409
"People" like you are seriously mentally ill. You shouldn't be on the internet without supervision.

>> No.15207143

>>15206932
skinning cats needs to come back in fashion

>> No.15207222
File: 26 KB, 128x128, 1648561192663.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15207222

>>15206938
>you're mentally ill if you don't believe my schizo shit

>> No.15207231

>>15207222
you and your trips should know better than to respond to bots anon

>> No.15207238

>>15204319
I dont see how a picture of some blades buried implies environmental destruction. Yes you bury garbage, how does that destroy anything?

>> No.15207439

>>15207238
Yeah, they just picked those blades off the windmill blade tree and buried them when they were done. Maybe they should reduce, reuse, recycle though.

>> No.15207448

>>15201946
If it wasn't for greenies we would have had nuclear (actual reliable and clean base load power) than this shit.

>> No.15207460
File: 1.51 MB, 640x640, 1675603669945905.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
15207460

>>15200993
I don't have a dog in this fight. I just have this webm.

>> No.15207464

>>15207439
I still dont understand what is allegedly destructive about burying these blades. Also your sarcasm is unfunny and tedious.

>> No.15207584

>>15201056
You haven't gotten sources and you won't, much is garbage.

>>15201190
>They call it "meatgrinder".
Ah yes, "they". "They" just so happen to be nameless or NIMBYs.
>Kills literal tons of birds and insects.
Excessive literally detected.

>>15203222
>The thermoset plastic cannot be recycled.
That was last year.
https://www.vestas.com/en/media/company-news/2023/vestas-unveils-circularity-solution-to-end-landfill-for-c3710818

>> No.15207616

>>15207460
Those horses knew what was up.

>> No.15207618

>>15207584
>press release for a process that "when mature" will allow...
vaporware

>> No.15207619

>>15207464
Their production was destructive and now they are just being buried instead of being recycled or reused.

>> No.15207632

>>15207619
But that has nothing to do with burying them. Why are you complaining about manufacture practices while posting a picture of a garbage dump? Why not post pictures of turbine blade factories instead?
>not being recycled
Whats so bad about not being recycled? There's plenty of underground to bury these blades, if you say its about manufacture then explain why manufacture is bad

>> No.15207939

>>15201548
>Why dont they melt the carbon fiber to get petroleum?
do you melt wood too you fucking retard? carbon turbine blades are a "glassy" material, the only way to recycle is to shred them and use the shredded material as filler in some kind of composite structure, it literally doesn't have another use

>> No.15207982

>>15200993
Do you still beat your wife, and would you rather we cut off your dick or your balls?

>> No.15208032

>>15207939
Carbon fibers are pure carbon and the binders are just resins so organic compounds. It can all be burned with little ash remaining. Fiber glass can also be burned but it leaves a mass of slag. I dont see a problem in just burying them tho.

>> No.15208033

>>15207632
>Whats so bad about not being recycled?
Environmentalists claim we should sequester carbon by dumping logs into the Mariana trench. Why not old wind turbine blades then?

>> No.15208040

>>15208033
Yes, why not. Its literal carbon capture at least when the blades are carbon fiber, amirite?

>> No.15208929

>>15208040
Also the resin is carbon based.

>> No.15208975

>>15207632
>Whats so bad about not being recycled? There's plenty of underground to bury these blades
Weird how all of a sudden there isn't plenty of underground when talk comes to burying the alleged vast amounts of waste nuclear produces.