Super Earths and Homo Sapiens' Colonization of Space

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Super Earths and Homo Sapiens' Colonization of Space Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:19:45 2010 No.1494604 [Reply] [Original]

>In our research, for example, we have modeled planets with a composition similar to Earth's. We found that such planets, even when they are substantially more massive than our world, should be geophysically active and have atmospheres and climates that might be friendly to life. In fact, we have learned that Earth's mass may be at the lower extreme of the range needed for a planet to be habitable. In other words, had Earth been any smaller, it might have turned out to be as lifeless as Mars and Venus seem to be.
Dimitar D. Sasselov and Diana Valencia, "Planets We Could Call Home", Scientific American, August 2010

Here is a thought. Perhaps we aren't the first intelligent species to evolve in our galaxy, but all previous species have evolved on worlds too large to escape its gravity and colonize space. Perhaps it was just too costly for them and they were wiped out before they got around to putting in sufficient resources.

Humanity, thanks to our relatively small home planet, might end up being the first species to colonize the galaxy.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:21:45 2010 No.1494620 this would be pleasant. Let's go probe some aliens.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:23:45 2010 No.1494631 >>1494620 OP here, did you just sage a science thread?

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:24:45 2010 No.1494638 >>1494620 >saging a legit science thread >probably doesnt sage religion threads What the fuck man?

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:25:45 2010 No.1494649 Who is up for genetically altering humans to live on high g worlds? Hands?

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:27:45 2010 No.1494656 >>1494649 hand Also bumping for great justice.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:29:45 2010 No.1494669 File: 44 KB, 288x306, 1270501180847.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >Colonize the galaxy

Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:29:45 2010 No.1494670
File: 23 KB, 420x626, Last_and_First_Men.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1494649
>>1494656
Reminds me of Last and First Men when humans genetically engineered themselves to live on Neptune, then thought to be terrestrial. It's a book worth a skim.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:29:45 2010 No.1494671 >>1494631 must be a habit. excuse me, and accept this bump as an apology.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:29:45 2010 No.1494676 >August 2010 They're from the future, they should know

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:30:45 2010 No.1494680 >>1494670 >Reminds me of Last and First Men It does.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:30:45 2010 No.1494681 >>1494676 Monthly magazines can come out before the months they represent arrive.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:32:45 2010 No.1494690 >>1494669 Bitches don't know about my generation ships. I like Dyson's perspective on colonizing other stars. It might be slow, but it doesn't rely on magic like most sci-fi enthusiasts' predictions do.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:36:45 2010 No.1494716 File: 15 KB, 378x300, face42.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1494671 I hope that wasn't what I think it was.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:41:45 2010 No.1494753 Why do the good threads have to die young?

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:42:45 2010 No.1494770 How big can a planet be with a composition like Earth's be? After a certain mass doesn't it just become like a gas giant? Whatever that size is how much more power would it take to reach escape velocity compared to Earth.

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:45:45 2010 No.1494790 >Humanity, thanks to our relatively small home planet, might end up being the first species to colonize the galaxy. >might end up being the first species to colonize the galaxy. >might speculative statement is speculative

>>	Anonymous Mon Jul 26 22:46:45 2010 No.1494802 >>1494716 god, i love Mrs. Swann

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 01:55:45 2010 No.1495952 >>1494790 Do you want me to say I have absolute certainty?

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:14:45 2010 No.1496041

Your theory is dumb, OP. First of all, we may be late evolvers, we have no reason to think we are the first based on something like size of homeworld

there are probably billions of civilizations out there, all at different points of evolution and tech.

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:17:45 2010 No.1496060

What if aliens are us from the future who've come back in time?

Huh?

What if we end up having sex and all our races blend into a grey colored skin race? Huh?

What if because we use our brain and fingers a lot, they become elongated? Huh?

What if we rely more on our eyes than our ears and our eyes become bigger and ears smaller? Huh?

What if we lose our hair because it's fucking useless? Huh?

Think about it, faggots. We're the aliens.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:21:45 2010 No.1496082 >>1496060 I'm an alien visiting the past to experience 4chon.

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:22:45 2010 No.1496086

Well think about it like this, larger planets have a larger radius R. As R increases surface area increases as a square function, and volume increases as a cubed function, and Force of gravity decreases as 1/R. If population size is a function of surface area, and resource wealth is a function of internal volume, then a population on a larger planet would have a larger resource per capita, and in addition proportionally weaker force from gravity. So having a larger planet would give the population more minerals while have proportionally less gravity. Sounds like the larger planet is the winrar here broseph

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:27:45 2010 No.1496103 >>1496086 Larger planets have smaller gravity? What?

>>	Inurdaes !lolol6yVHg Tue Jul 27 02:29:45 2010 No.1496115 File: 18 KB, 366x380, 1272207603755.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1496086 >larger plants have less gravity

>>	almostphysicist Tue Jul 27 02:29:45 2010 No.1496114 >>1496086 Yeah, because Jupiter has less gravity than the moon. And the sun orbits mercury.

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:29:45 2010 No.1496113

>>1496086
>Well think about it like this, larger planets have a larger radius R.

Ok

>As R increases surface area increases as a square function, and volume increases as a cubed function,

Ok, keep going...

>and Force of gravity decreases as 1/R

Stop right there, criminal scum.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:31:45 2010 No.1496125 File: 148 KB, 631x481, IJ2IZ2SNVHEKCZZIJGFK5QMWGTLZKBRU.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1496086 >a larger planet would give the population more minerals while have proportionally less gravity

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:32:45 2010 No.1496129 File: 29 KB, 396x400, That's wrong.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1496086

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:32:45 2010 No.1496133 >>1496041 >First of all, we may be late evolvers, we have no reason to think we are the first based on something like size of homeworld. If aliens had colonized the entire galaxy then we would have heard them. I thought that went without saying.

almostphysicist Tue Jul 27 02:34:45 2010 No.1496148

>>1496133
Do you know how many stars comprise of "the entire galaxy"

Do you understand how far away we are from even the closest stars

Do you understand how easy and probable it is that an alien race would have overlooked us even if they'd colonized many, even most stars in the solar system

>>	almostphysicist Tue Jul 27 02:35:45 2010 No.1496153 >>1496148 Its early in the morning, I don't think I needed the of after comprise.

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:38:45 2010 No.1496171

>>1496148

>Do you understand how easy and probable it is that an alien race would have overlooked us even if they'd colonized many, even most stars in the solar system

>an alien race would have overlooked us even if they'd colonized many, even most stars in the solar system

>many, even most stars in the solar system

>most stars

>in the solar system

derp

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:39:45 2010 No.1496178

Interesting idea OP.

But my first thoughts are that life on a larger planet, may also be proportionally larger compared to ourselves? And so, any rockets or other forms of transport capable of reaching space, may also be scaled up in size, allowing for a greater amount of fuel to be burnt and hence allowing the ship to escape the gravity regardless of the extra pull. A larger planet also implies a larger number of resources.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:39:45 2010 No.1496179 >>1496148 Actually, converging to zero. Exponential growth is a bitch, brah. There is no species substantially more advanced than man in our galaxy.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:41:45 2010 No.1496190 >>1496178 They'd be smaller if anything. For the same reason a mouse can survive a fall from two metres but a horse may well break its legs.

>>	almostphysicist Tue Jul 27 02:43:45 2010 No.1496201 >>1496171 Lol I think I need to go to bed >>1496179 Your post is confusing. Please explain.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:47:45 2010 No.1496220 >>1494604 how are you so sure no "one" else has ever colonized the galaxy?

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:50:45 2010 No.1496234

>>1496201

Let's say aliens develop space faring technology using all the resources of a single planet. They fly to the nearest star and found a colony. A few generation down the line they've doubled their resources. Now they can send two ships out. Colonise another two planets. It won't stop. They'll overrun every corner of the milky way like humans overran every corner of the Earth.

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 02:56:45 2010 No.1496267

>>1496148
The chance is obviously there, but the fact still remains alien civilizations have had billions of years to colonize everything worth colonizing throughout the entire galaxy and yet we hear nothing. They should be noisy sum'bitches. Hell, we shouldn't even be here. If alien civilizations were around there is little reason why they wouldn't take advantage of a lush planet like Earth whether they colonize it, strip mine it, or use it as a zoo.

inb4"teh Vulcans dont want to come hear until we haz the warp travel"
If you want to make that argument please do, but to me it is nothing more than an apologists attempt to work around the fact that there is no evidence of galactic civilizations when there should be.

almostphysicist Tue Jul 27 02:57:45 2010 No.1496272

>>1496234
That's fine, except stars are separated by lightyears. The probability only approaches zero if we allow for enough time for the aliens to colonize many systems. We cannot say at which point the aliens are.

Also, it isn't far fetched to assume that aliens are only looking for particular planets to inhabit. They may have long examined and forgotten our planet from afar, determined that it was unsuitable for use and moved on.

almostphysicist Tue Jul 27 03:01:45 2010 No.1496293

>>1496267
1) You're assuming that complex intelligent beings have been around for billions of years. This is an invalid assumption. Consider for example that the universe is only 4.5 billion years old and complex life took billions of years to evolve on earth

2) A tiny rocky planet like earth would be small time for spacebound aliens. There are much bigger planets with larger reserves of useful elements. I doubt an advanced interstellar civilization would have any use for oil, assuming it even has some knowledge of its existence and/or properties.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:01:45 2010 No.1496297 I, for one, enjoy the prospect. All those delicious minerals. Imagine the shitstorm if they found oil. Proof of ET life.

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:02:45 2010 No.1496300

>>1496190
what >>1496178 is trying to say is, that even on a larger planet, the materials would have the same properties. Think about concrete for example: the properties wouldn't change but the potential large-planet race would have to built the same buildings as us. This would result in lower buildings. The same goes for carbon-based organic live: same properties, more stress on the structure. This should result in smaller, more squat humanoids. If though, because it evolves better on a high-gravity planet, life based on different elements would evolve, we can only speculate.

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:04:45 2010 No.1496306

>>1496293
the universe is 14 billion years old. Life on earth is 4.5 billion years old.
The 9.5 intermediate billion years is when all elements were forged in stars as the big bang only created hydrogen and lithium and it's isolates.
Therefore your point stands.

>>	снайпер Tue Jul 27 03:04:45 2010 No.1496310 >>1496297 Titan is full of oil

OP Tue Jul 27 03:07:45 2010 No.1496319

>>1496272
>The probability only approaches zero if we allow for enough time for the aliens to colonize many systems.
The galaxy has existed for billions of years. That is more than enough time for an alien civilization to develop.

Let's say once an intelligent species evolves it takes 100 million years to colonize the entire galaxy (it would probably take less once a civilization reaches its stride). The chances of not a single alien civilization coming around for ten billion years and then just appearing in the last 100 million is unlikely. More likely than not there is something holding alien civilizations from reaching space at all... like too much gravity on their homeworld among other reasons.

It is my opinion that alien civilizations have to race against time to reach space. If they take too long they will either blow themselves back to the stone age, never to retain their past glory, or they will deplete their resources too quickly. If Earth is indeed on the smaller end of the list of life bearing planets then the increased gravity of other worlds might hold back alien civilizations just enough to keep them from ever reaching space.

>>	almostphysicist Tue Jul 27 03:08:45 2010 No.1496323 >>1496306 >>1496306 Right, sorry, I meant that the age of the earth is 4.5 billion years. However I do believe that life on the planet took around a billion years to appear. I'm not sure right now though.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:09:45 2010 No.1496327 >>1496310 Methane, good sir. It's full of methane.

>>	almostphysicist Tue Jul 27 03:10:45 2010 No.1496332 >>1496319 There is too much to argue in your post, its 3:00 AM, I'm just going to say this and go to bed If this post gets doubles, you are wrong. Goodnight.

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:10:45 2010 No.1496331

>>1496310
Was all :O

Then
>>1496327

Would not make sense for a moon to be full of a substance created by decaying organic material. Only way for it to get there would be for someone to pump it in as some kind of reserve.

Shit I hope we don't end up trampling on someone's drilling rights.

OP Tue Jul 27 03:12:45 2010 No.1496336

>>1496293
>You're assuming that complex intelligent beings have been around for billions of years. This is an invalid assumption. Consider for example that the universe is only 4.5 billion years old and complex life took billions of years to evolve on earth
I'm sorry, but I can't discuss this subject who doesn't have the basic facts. The universe is approximately 13.7 billion years old and the Milky Way Galaxy has been around for most of that time. The first stars were massive and died quickly providing the heavier elements for life early on in the universe. That means terrestrial worlds and therefore life has been appearing for maybe 10 billion years. That is more than enough time for a single planet out of at least a trillion in our galaxy to produce one alien civilization.

Good night, and please spend a few more hours a day watching science programming on the Discovery Channel. I raised myself on the stuff.

>>	almostphysicist Tue Jul 27 03:14:45 2010 No.1496342 >>1496336 See >>1496306 and >>1496323

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:14:45 2010 No.1496344 >>1496336 Discovery Channel doesn't do science anymore. It's all ghost-hunters and survivor-man.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:17:45 2010 No.1496350 >>1496344 true QQ

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:17:45 2010 No.1496351 File: 23 KB, 638x344, ghost-in-the-shell-21.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1494649 I'd rather go full prosthetic and roam the galaxy exchanging my memes with other sentient nomads. I have a boner just thinking about it.

OP Tue Jul 27 03:18:45 2010 No.1496355

>>1496344
;_;
I know.

I miss watching stuff about alien biology and star development during the day and watching cheetahs run down gazelles at night.

Discovery Channel, you have fallen so far. The Science Channel has picked up some of the slack, but not enough. That last Steven Hawking program was a glint of the glory days and the ones narrated by Morgan Freeman aren't half bad either. I made a point of making sure my little brother watched both.

>>	OP Tue Jul 27 03:19:45 2010 No.1496362 >>1496351 In the year 2000, there will be no distinction between organic and inorganic, between technology and life. We and our creations will look like something in between.

>>	Second Doctor Tue Jul 27 03:22:45 2010 No.1496373 File: 13 KB, 314x234, dr2_21.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Perhaps a significantly advanced race, say, a million or a billion years ahead, might be among you right now but you silly humans just aren't observant enough to notice, hm?

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:22:45 2010 No.1496371

>>1496293
>>1496293

This is my biggest pet-peeve with speculative science fiction.

The idea that an alien civilization is going to develop technologies to let them roam galaxies, before they perfect nanotechnologies to the point that they can take any hunk of mass in close proximity and rearrange its atoms into any resource they need.

If aliens are out exploring galaxies or solar systems I doubt they are just looking for resources.

nb4 annunaki

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:23:45 2010 No.1496378 >>1496362 And robo-aids will be the challenge of the century.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:27:45 2010 No.1496398 >>1496371 >If aliens are out exploring galaxies or solar systems I doubt they are just looking for resources. There is no other reason to explore the galaxy. Plus no matter how efficiently you use matter you still need more to use more.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:28:45 2010 No.1496404 >>1496398 No other reason? I feel sorry for you, mr. die-hard capitalist.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:29:45 2010 No.1496407 >>1496378 Viruses aren't even alive. They are like self-replicating asbestos. They already walk the line between life and technology in a way. So robo-AIDS already kind of exists... it's called AIDS.

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:33:45 2010 No.1496422

>>1496404
You are now aware that the Americas were discovered for resources. You are now aware that the Apollo program was a glorified ICBM research program and propaganda. I'm all for hopes and dreams of exploring the cosmos, but no one funds hopes and dreams.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:39:45 2010 No.1496456 File: 20 KB, 477x246, Imperial_eagle.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Time to set out on a interstellar crusade in the name of the Emperor.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 03:41:45 2010 No.1496466 File: 1.30 MB, 1014x2405, Warhammer_40K_Emperor_moot.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1496456

Anonymous Tue Jul 27 04:43:45 2010 No.1496728

>>1496371

They won't need resources. They'll need habitats. And nanotechnology will have to go a long way indeed before it becomes more economical to maintain artificial living conditions in space than simply sterilise Sol-3 and move in the alien baby boomers.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 04:51:45 2010 No.1496769 File: 93 KB, 677x335, max.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1496086

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 04:58:45 2010 No.1496820 If and when aliens more technologically advanced than us find the earth, humans will inevitably be destroyed or enslaved. Think about what happened when white people with guns went to africa.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:01:45 2010 No.1496840 >PhD in mathematics >any jon i want >30k africa

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:01:45 2010 No.1496834 File: 5 KB, 400x400, fuck you.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1496086 I raged/laughed/cried all at the same time

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:04:45 2010 No.1496852 >>Implying we'd want to meet other alien faggots

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:06:45 2010 No.1496862 life on bigger planets=life with ripped bodys holy shit, no fat intelliegent life!

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:09:45 2010 No.1496869 >>1496852 >implying we wouldn't

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:10:45 2010 No.1496876 >>1496869 >>Implying the people who own the world's resources give two shits about space.

>>	sage sage Tue Jul 27 05:14:45 2010 No.1496888 its not auguts

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:19:45 2010 No.1496903 >my face when we are all eaten alive by Jupiter's trillions and trillions of BEES

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:20:45 2010 No.1496911 >>1496351 untill you get pulled into a giant planet that lost orbit and floated out into space and is unseeable, then pulls you in and crushes you

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:22:45 2010 No.1496921 >>1496876 >implying meeting other alien faggots would have the owners of world's resources have control over it

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:24:45 2010 No.1496928 >>1496148 If an alien race ever took to space, they would have homed right onto us thanks to the gravity well that is your mother.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:29:45 2010 No.1496947 >>1496928 mother nature. PROBLEM though, jupiter's mother nature is much much stronger

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 05:32:45 2010 No.1496962 >>1496888 >its not auguts >auguts herp herp cause this magazine article that was written in the last 3 days is going to go into the July edition that came out a month ago (in June)

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 07:15:45 2010 No.1497392 >>1494802 I didn't recognize her at first. Holy shit.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 07:17:45 2010 No.1497395 >>1494604 >Implying they wouldn't just use a metric fuck ton of fuel on their rockets to escape their gravity.

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 07:19:45 2010 No.1497399 File: 3 KB, 175x93, ...what!.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1496148 >Most stars in the solar system. Wait what, that ain't right. no no no!!! THIS DOESN'T ADD UP AT ALL!!

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 07:21:45 2010 No.1497404 >>1494604 The size of our solar system alone is of souch a tremendous size, that unless we succeed in somehow bending spacetime, we will never be able to pass the astereoid belts circling around it

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 07:23:45 2010 No.1497412 >>1497404 >Mofo doesn't know bout mah Valkyrie

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 07:23:45 2010 No.1497413 >>1497395 glad to see the metric system being adopted by /sci/

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 07:30:45 2010 No.1497432 >>1497399 lols

>>	Anonymous Tue Jul 27 07:39:45 2010 No.1497457 >>1497404 dangerously close to derp, there

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