Sibling Inbreeding

[Anonymous No.14791705]

is it really wise to go against the sibling inbreeding?
considering the fact that we can prevent the deleterious alleles from expressing themselves and genetic purging will help its offspring's to have much more healthier genes
https://www.nature.com/articles/hdy201325
>Our findings provide empirical support that human inbreeding depression for some fitness components might be purged by selection within consanguineous populations.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4814235/
>As shown here, we need to account for purging upon the inbreeding load caused by both lethal and non-lethal deleterious alleles in order to determine the minimum effective size required to preserve populations that, even been actually endangered, can eventually recover from inbreeding depression. On the basis of present evidence, this effective size will often be closer to 50 than to 100.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21333536/
>Thus, rather than posing a barrier to invasion as often assumed, bottlenecks, by purging deleterious alleles, can enable the evolution of invaders that maintain high fitness even when inbred.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6005545/
>We find that inbred males spent more than twice as much time ‘peeping’ at the female than outbred males, suggesting that inbreeding indeed causes different behavioural responses to an apparent mating opportunity.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15807418/
>We experimentally mated females of Xylosandrus germanus to brothers and unrelated males and measured offspring fitness. Inbred matings did not produce offspring with reduced fitness in any of the examined life-history traits.
>In contrast, outcrossed offspring suffered from reduced hatching rates. Reduction in inbreeding depression is usually attributed to purging of deleterious alleles, and the absence of inbreeding depression in X.
plus why racemixing is allowed?

[Anonymous No.14791898]

>>14791705
OK so you want to fuck your sister, got it.
Also just move to the UK.

[Anonymous No.14792024]

Sibling incest is too close. If you want to optimize proximity vs inbreeding risk, 2nd or 3rd cousin territory is where it peaks.

[Anonymous No.14792074]

>>14792024
vitro fertilization should be able prevent the deleterious recessive genes from expressing themselves

[Anonymous No.14792146]

>>14792074
And since siblings are more likely to have a smaller pool of shared negative recessives to select against, it means incest is actually beneficial in attempts to clean up the genome.
A bit of an artificial genetic purge, as seen in nature. By screening and pre-selecting 100% against negative alleles they are treated as deadly recessives and can thus be purged out just like the genetic purges in nature where periods of incest right themselves toward a healthier population.

[Anonymous No.14792243]

>>14792146
yes!
and we can achieve it within 2 generations of sibling inbreeding
only barrier I can see is the monetary problems

[Anonymous No.14793916]

>>14791898
In UK it's illegal though. Should move to a Romance country (except Romania), Russia, or the Baltic states. It is legal there.

[Anonymous No.14794539]

>>14792146
You need to have real pressure to remove unfit alleles. And multiple lineages as most of them will be wiped out in some generations by the best. Inbreed is higher risk evolution.

The middle easterns and african tribes are full of genetic disorders and mental retardation because cumulative inbreeding.

[Anonymous No.14794584]

>>14793916
No laws against incest in France. In Sweden you can marry your half sister with a judge's approval. In about 1/3 of Africa there's no laws against outright marrying family members at all. Go nuts.

3 significant cases in Japan make it almost but not quite possible to marry a sibling. One, a woman wanted to marry her uncle but the law prevented them from marrying so they lived as a common law couple until he died in 2005. She sued to get his pension and won the case, the judge said that because incest is illegal in Japan a route must be left open for incestuous couples and therefore common law marriages must be allowed for incestuous couples who can't otherwise marry. A second case where a boy wanted to marry his high school girlfriend even after they discovered that she was the daughter of his father from an affair he had while married to his mother. Because no father was listed on her birth certificate the judge ruled in their favor that the marriage was valid. He even suggested that siblings who are adopted by different families could marry under the same conditions because the law only covers legal family ties and not blood ones. A third where after a boy attempted to marry his sister was blocked, the judge suggested that although you could not register your marriage with the state there is no law against religious weddings between siblings and all that would need to do, since their last names were already the same is the brother would need to adopt his own children after they were born giving them effectively all the benefits of marriage and therefore there was no need to update the law.

Good luck marrying your sister dude.

[Anonymous No.14794631]

>>14791705
>tfw no hot sister to breed with
my parents failed me

[Anonymous No.14794661]

>>14794539
shit genes being shit
imagine my shock

[Anonymous No.14794664]

>>14794584
>3 significant cases in Japan make it almost but not quite possible to marry a sibling. One, a woman wanted to marry her uncle but the law prevented them from marrying so they lived as a common law couple until he died in 2005. She sued to get his pension and won the case, the judge said that because incest is illegal in Japan a route must be left open for incestuous couples and therefore common law marriages must be allowed for incestuous couples who can't otherwise marry. A second case where a boy wanted to marry his high school girlfriend even after they discovered that she was the daughter of his father from an affair he had while married to his mother. Because no father was listed on her birth certificate the judge ruled in their favor that the marriage was valid. He even suggested that siblings who are adopted by different families could marry under the same conditions because the law only covers legal family ties and not blood ones. A third where after a boy attempted to marry his sister was blocked, the judge suggested that although you could not register your marriage with the state there is no law against religious weddings between siblings and all that would need to do, since their last names were already the same is the brother would need to adopt his own children after they were born giving them effectively all the benefits of marriage and therefore there was no need to update the law.
holy shit thanks for the info

[Anonymous No.14796457]

>>14794631
I lust after my sister and its hell in earth.
she caught me sniffing her panties and just sat on the bed crying while I slunk away.
I spent two days laying in bed in a state of panic, waiting for parents to knock on the door.
finally, she came in and hugged me and told me if I ever needed to talk to her that was ok but I couldn't do stuff like that.
its hell. I love her so much

[Anonymous No.14796506]

>>14794631
>tfw have older sister but she's not attractive and borderline an asshole
>tfw no attractive relatives either

[Anonymous No.14796578]

>>14792074
>>14792146
>You were born too late, you'll never be arranged to marry your attractive younger cousin to keep wealth and lands tied to your bloodline.
>You were born too early, you'll never be arranged to marry your attractive younger sister to produce superior babies through technological eugenics.
Feels bad man.

[Anonymous No.14796805]

>>14796578
I just wish I was an Alexandrian Greek that enjoyed the wealth of the Nile with his sister-wife while lording over the native peasants. You'd also have the best /sci/entific texts of the age available at the Library of Alexandria. Couldn't ask for a better place to be born at that time.

[Anonymous No.14796813]

>>14796457
not sure if this is bait but if it's true please kill yourself, you are an awful person.

[Anonymous No.14797067]

>>14796813
fuck off. I cant help the way I feel. shes beautiful in every way. I sniffed her panties a few times and got caught. she forgave me

[Anonymous No.14797683]

>>14796813
there is nothing wrong with sniffing your sister's panties

[Anonymous No.14797692]

>>14794631
true true
>>14796457
try to cuddle with her

[Anonymous No.14797788]

>>14797683
she was upset so I'll never do it again.

>>14797692
she cuddles with my little sister , who's 9 and my little bro who's 6. also w/ my mom.
not me or my dad. we both get hugs tho.
when my granddad died she kind of cuddled with me as I was the only one home but I'm not that low, it was still amazing but torturous

[Anonymous No.14797859]

>>14797788
nice digits bro
maybe you should just try to spend more time with her, watching movies or cooking idk
gone with the wind told me that woman would be more likely to fall for you if they are dependent on you

[Anonymous No.14797941]

>>14797859
I picked her up from school for a wedding last April. My dad wanted her to drive, I didnt turn 18 until May, shes 21 in sep.
anyway, she was so staggeringly beautiful, her hair had these spirals too it and was all done up otherwise, massive cleavage, no panty lines when she got in and out, and a slit that showed so much thigh for the 1.5 hour ride. just so beautiful.
even better her and her gf were in a fight so he was out of the picture.
I love her.

[Anonymous No.14797949]

>>14797941
*bf. this shitty samsung had an esl autocorrect

[Anonymous No.14798499]

>>14797941
>>14797788
>>14797067
>>14796457
What does she look like? More details please...

Does she look like anyone famous?

[Anonymous No.14799075]

>>14798499
shes 5'0" tall, long dirty blonde hair, very thicc. this is the closest famous person I've seen but we are not jewish and this is not a perfect approximation. we are Lebanese, German and Portuguese. we live in Rhode island tho, not Brazil.

[frenanon No.14799377]

>>14794539
>The middle easterns and african tribes are full of genetic disorders and mental retardation because cumulative inbreeding.
I'm guessing you're going to say that's why White people must breed with them, right? To promote their "Genetic Diversity"....

#StopWhiteGenocide

[Anonymous No.14800503]

>>14791705
I mean once there's standard gene editing the argument against it rather falls apart. I think it would be societally detrimental, but not genetically.

In theory I suspect you can already sort this out, if some of the lab claims of being able to genetically interrogate then pair egg and sperm (selection rather than modification) are true you could potentially select out negative mutations already.

[Anonymous No.14800745]

>>14799075
>Rhode island
isn't that one of those legal incest states right
but ohio is way more based

[Anonymous No.14801140]

>>14800503
we have a data on roman Egypt that can pretty much says that sibling inbreeding does not cause social unrest or breakdown of a family unit
>>14797941
based, I hope you can win her bro

[Anonymous No.14801196]

4chan is one of the most racist yet one of the most pro-sibling incest site...

cool

[Anonymous No.14802039]

>>14800745
it is legal in RI. She spends most of her time in NY, at Fordham. she gets too upset, she says 'I know you think I'm pretty and I feel like I wasn't a good big sister too you, to make you feel this way.'
She cries if it comes up and I cant stand it. She caught me with her panties back during covid, I guess this was Oct 2020 and since then she keeps her door locked and when she hugs me she keeps her distance so her boobs don't squish. she doesn't even hug my dad that way and my mom squishes hers against me. At this time my little bro was still burying his face in her bunda if he got shy or whatever and my mom wasn't around, which was often. my little sister got to do that too.
I have a pic of her ass. I cropped it tho.
its huge, she sends pics to her bf, hes at princeton. hes a good guy. caboverdean, but almost white, and was outraged by BLM. was pro Kyle Rittenhouse. he always tells us to speak English and he has guarded her chastity. I love how beautiful she is. the jew above is not as close as I'd like, but for some reason she reminds me of her, idk what it is

[Anonymous No.14802066]

>>14801140
it would take a miracle. it's bad too. someone on /b/ told me to break the toilet so when she went to flush it wouldnt work. absolute degeneracy but I considered it. she has gone to great, lengths to forbid me any kind of intimacy. she is too loving and kind to not show affection tho but she is able to temper it. her femininity seems like a superpower and it drives me crazy.
our mother was very businesslike and so she was like the little mom/wife of the house. my father, if he knew, would flip and probably kick me out but she has not said anything.

[Anonymous No.14802110]

>>14802039
so where did you get the picture from

[Anonymous No.14802262]

>>14794584
>A second case where a boy wanted to marry his high school girlfriend even after they discovered that she was the daughter of his father from an affair he had while married to his mother.
just like my anime's

[Anonymous No.14802274]

>>14797692
>pic
I've reread it three times but I don't see where the dude admits to being gay, is Thelma retarded?

[Anonymous No.14802278]

Another thread that convinces me a lot of people should not exist.

[Anonymous No.14802363]

>>14796457
spend some time with her like as a date but not too on the nose

[Anonymous No.14802867]

>>14800503
The genetic argument is already very weak since you can easily test for congenital defects between any given coupling. Laws built around it would then mandate gene testing to sort out who's likely to pass on deleterious genes onto their future children in pairs that will express themselves vs those who aren't, and only concern themselves with the former. At least until technology renders that unnecessary as well when either screening individual gametes as you mentioned or gene editing them becomes widespread and easily available.
But whether incest should be allowed is primarily an issue of morals as it always was. Most people who oppose it won't change their position even if 100% of children are guaranteed to come out healthy.

[Anonymous No.14803203]

>>14802110
her phone. broke into it sep 2020
>>14802274
no, he must be tho, lol.
>>14802278
>girls can rim guys and chug jizz and suck miles of dick but loving one like a sister is wrong
YOU shouldn't exist.
>>14802363
I try too all the time, but she is resistant and one of the reasons I love her is that I respect her.

[Anonymous No.14803914]

>>14802274
that one is fake
here is the real one
>>14802278
true, we need kill off all the racemixers and minorities
sibling inbreeding will help us to cleanse our blood and we will be pure as Noah
>>14803203
when did you got interested in her?

[Anonymous No.14804215]

>>14803914
I think I was 8-9. the celebration looks more like her, but we're white. I always thought stormfront kind of resembled her and the haircut was off but that's not so.
she reminds me of abella danger sometimes, but not now, older vids. wish I could find a celeb. we're white Brazilians.

[Anonymous No.14804221]

>>14804215
*this celeb, not celebration

[Anonymous No.14806486]

breh.. Keep us updated.

Also, does she look like Xochitl, Aya Cash or Abella Danger?

[Anonymous No.14806575]

>>14806486
more like xochitl, but she is white. we have some jap in us I think, on the order of 1/16 maybe. maybe Amazon. her jaw is much more feminine than the Jews. her voice reminds me of stormfronts. her body is like abella, but she has huge boobs. I texted her at 11 and she told me to go to bed.
her person is much different than I can express. jn fact my mom was trying to embody her today, she was trying to cook a quick dinner and wanted to emulate my sister. but my sister always just made hamburger helper, she was what, 14-15-16? so my mom ordered sushi and Chinese and was apologizing for not giving a homemade meal.
this girl looks similar maybe

[Anonymous No.14806597]

>>14802867
I dont understand this, I love my sister. I love her femininity. I dont care about her persona or any other woman's. I wish to see the full flowering of her and I want her to turn to me, open for me.
what does it matter that were related. i gave our family bible and brothers married sisters up until abraham. seems like this was Gods preferred pairing. why did it change? 'love is love' except when its not.
the stigma is killing me.

[Anonymous No.14806621]

>>14806597
>>14803914
Sometimes I want to cash out my inheritance and move back to Lebanon. Just take my sister back to baalbek.
even mina's Gervais is better than here. America is too perverse and they accuse genuine, real love as perverse. they treat women like faggots and have them suck cock at hookups and fuck men with strapons or whatever. absolute evil and perversion and they call real love perverse and sick.
my mother grew up in Lebanon and then Brazil. my youngest sister has split her time between here and Montevideo (better than america)
corruption is rampant. love is a misnomer. genital twitching and social contracts

[Anonymous No.14806807]

>>14806575
>>14806597
>>14806621
Holy shit, bro, I think I know your sister. Her BF is Alcindo? He goes to Princeton?
I saw her all summer. I know him and she comes into the Wawa I work at.
She always gets a Nutella pack, a sugar-free Red Bull and a sub. Mayo, spinach, pepperoni, pickles and hot peppers.

Dude, I know your sister. She's a normal QT.

Get help, bro. She's never gonna end up with you

[Anonymous No.14806842]

>>14806575
>>14806621
>>14806597
so when did she got aware of your feeling
>>14806807
no way Jose! how do you remember costumers you have served? I don't even remember some of my classmates

[Anonymous No.14806852]

>>14802039
Pic is some onlyfans whore, retard thought you can't reverse search it if it's cropped. Nice LARP though.

[Anonymous No.14806917]

>>14806807
fuck off
>>14806842
I've known since I was 8-9
>>14806852
whatever

[Anonymous No.14806950]

>>14796457
Younger or older?

[Anonymous No.14806996]

>>14806950
shes older. turns 21 in september

[Anonymous No.14807008]

>>14796457
You will be over this at like 20 or 21 latest I swear to you. It's raging hormones that are making you think like this and you just need to find some other girl to hold u over while you wait a couple years to calm down and then you can truly love a girl

[Anonymous No.14807109]

>>14807008
I doubt it

[Anonymous No.14807347]

>>14807008
i have a gf. i love my sister more and cant imagine loving another woman more

[Anonymous No.14807522]

>>14796457
Hey, somebody pointed me this thread, I'm this poster >>>/adv/27199165
I guess I could give my opinion on your thing if have questions or something.

[Anonymous No.14807548]

>It's another incest fetish bait thread
Hard no on incest being good. The thing is that in inbreeding is good when establishing a brand new population or recovering from a bottleneck, sure, but long term inbreeding will cause positive selection on deleterious genes. Inbreeding eliminates highly deleterious genes associated with major diseases sure, but causes an increase in frequency of weakly deleterious variants. This is called "genetic load". These weakly deleterious genes are much harder for evolution to eliminate because their effect is comparatively smaller (yet still negative ofc).

[Anonymous No.14807578]

>>14807522
My sister knows how I feel and has repeatedly told me no, it wont happen. she says I love her because we are foreign here (we're lebanese/brazilian) and I find modern, western girls intimidating.
thing is, I have a gf. I still obsess over her

[Anonymous No.14807609]

>>14791705
>>14807548
>https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27038113/
Neanderthals inbred for hundreds of thousands of years constantly. Many fossils we have of neanderthals were offspring between uncles and their nieces, or other relationships which make the family tree look more like a ladder.

When neanderthals gave some genes to humans, we're still working on eliminating the genetic load those genes have even 40k years later.

[frenanon No.14807629]

>>14800503
>I mean once there's standard gene editing
They don't have "crazy sci-fi gene editors".
They've spent the last century running MASSIVE global Human Experimentation Studies through promoting/forcing cross-breeding among different races, as well as wildly immoral/illegal Epigenetics by directly injecting poisons, and dosing people with all sorts of different chemicals in the food/water supply to study the effects.

"We" pay 'Them' $Trillions/year just so they can noncensually poison, stalk, harass, gaslight, and any other sort of passive/active engagement some unelected, unaccountable, """experts""" do with unlimited resources and power.

[frenanon No.14807640]

>>14802867
>Laws built around it would then mandate gene testing to sort out who's likely to pass on deleterious genes onto their future children in pairs that will express themselves vs those who aren't
Yes, I too agree that absolute midwits should be in charge of deciding who gets to breed, and who doesn't.
I think we can all agree they've been doing an outstanding job thus far.
>At least until technology renders that unnecessary as well when either screening individual gametes as you mentioned or gene editing them becomes widespread and easily available.
Yes, in a few years-decade some (((scientists))) are going to announce that they can suddenly test your ""baby"" within a week of conception, and they can tell you exactly how your baby will turn out through manipulative and deceitful bullshit.

[frenanon No.14807654]

>>14807609
>Many fossils we have of neanderthals were offspring between uncles and their nieces
>we're still working on eliminating the genetic load those genes have even 40k years later.
They lie about that shit like you wouldn't believe.
This is why it's impossible to have an honest conversation with ((them)). Because they refuse to have any sort of discussion in good faith, and would rather die than simply admitting "2+2=4".

But to be fair, most people should probably not be trying to "Clone" themselves, as they're already tainting the gene-pool by sheer existence.

[Anonymous No.14808606]

>>14807548
>hurr durr muh genetic load
your racemixing will more likely to result that shit
plus standard of living is increasing and as long it doesn't cause one's intelligence to sink
but yeah, some people just shouldn't breed

[Anonymous No.14809551]

>>14800503
Your thinking is all over the place.
>it
What are you referring to? Modern Medicine as it stands, or Modern Medicine after gene editing therapy has been invented?

>select out negative mutations already
For whom, people alive at the moment, which is what Modern Medicine claims to serve, or people who haven't been born yet?

[Anonymous No.14811027]

>>14807522
>>14807578
just saw this. could've had at least this if not for the pantysniffing incident.

[Anonymous No.14812276]

>>14807548
>Population size and levels of inbreeding correlate with genetic load
>Within species differences in genetic load are often estimated as the total number of putative deleterious alleles per genome (11, 17).
>However, when comparing different species, obtaining unbiased estimates of genetic load that are based on sums becomes challenging, as species differ from each other in genome size, mutation rate and generation time and these factors lead to differences in the number of variable sites independent of genetic load.
its all comes down to genetic diversity
here we are pretty much arguing for the case white sibling inbreeding
so argument presented here actually stands correct while yours fails

[Anonymous No.14812283]

>>14807629
>Human Experimentation Studies through promoting/forcing cross-breeding among different races
dunno man, as far as I know they are anti-racemixing

[Anonymous No.14812468]

>>14812276
You don't have to have children. So much of the stigma comes from fear of inbreeding.
You can just adopt or have a surrogate have your son and artificial insemination give you a daughter.

[Anonymous No.14812493]

>>14812468
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/696831v2.full
nah siblings should have their own children
plus vitro can make it happen

[Anonymous No.14812507]

>>14797859
>picrel
How about all those things are degenerate?

[Anonymous No.14812536]

>>14812507
because they are degeneration and great offence to both morally and scientifically

[Anonymous No.14812550]

>>14812493
Awesome. Much better than my post. Not as good as all natural but at least she's pregnant with both your child
>>14812536
There is no purer a love. You have no idea what you're talking about

[Anonymous No.14812556]

>>14812550
>There is no purer a love. You have no idea what you're talking about
maybe you got it wrong. To me sibling love(not the homo one) is one of the most beautiful thing and I am all in for it
what I meant is that racemixing, homosexuality, and other degeneration will always be a horrible thing, the worst of the worst

[Anonymous No.14812559]

>>14812556
>what I meant is that racemixing, homosexuality, and other degeneration will always be a horrible thing, the worst of the worst
Says who? Worst for what?

[Anonymous No.14812575]

>>14812559
Race mixing will create lots of health problems. And they are violent as hell.
Homos are just aids and they don’t breed
Also racemixers and homos are responsible for most of the stds

[Anonymous No.14812578]

>>14812556
sorry, reaponse meant for the anon above you
>>14812559
Male homosexuality is the single greatest perversion there is. And the source of all other perversions.

[Anonymous No.14812609]

>>14812578
Nah race mixing is way worse
It’s the ultimate Disassortative mating

[Anonymous No.14812671]

>>14812609
No. I couldn't disagree more. Male homosexuality is a sin worse than murder, it's 'strange flesh', Sodom & Gomorrah; it crushes the spirit and denies the soul

[Anonymous No.14812710]

>>14812671
Nu uh
God literally flooded the earth because of race mixing
It’s the ultimate degeneration

[Anonymous No.14812718]

>>14812609
And yet 'merica is leading tge way with muh diversity. Wait til you see whst tgis country will look like in the coming decades. Its not going to get better

[Anonymous No.14812734]

>>14812718
Nah conservative white fertility rate is bigger than the nigger fertility rate
Country is not lost yet

[Anonymous No.14812828]

>>14812710
not to get too literal but it was always about perversion happening with the Woman. whatever. I just think that's silly /pol/ narcissism. extra pathetic too, because its extrapolated. usually to a race they dont even belong too.
btw, the above perversion was not treating women the way you'd treat your own sister

[Anonymous No.14814084]

>>14812828
racemixing literally creates an abomination before god. A wretched creature that don't even belong to anything other than the fake concept of "Humanity"
its very existence itself is a crime against the God and his Nature
And the people who commits it are absolute beast of a beast for they have betrayed their own blood and chosen the flesh of others.

[Anonymous No.14814470]

>>14791705
>Sibling Inbreeding
Farmers and livestock herders have been doing it
for thousands of years, with dramatic, positive results.
>inbred males spent more than twice as much time ‘peeping’ at the female
ohh noes

[Anonymous No.14814474]

>>14792024
>is too close

[Anonymous No.14814499]

Just fuck your cousin.

[Anonymous No.14814844]

>>14814499
holy shit! Is that a fucking anectode? HOLY SHIT SIBLING BROS WE LOST! EVEN THOUGH WE HAVE OVERWHELMING EVIDENCES BUT THIS ANON'S ANECDOTE LITERALLY BTFO'S US EVEN THOUGH THAT ANECTODE ACTUALLY STRENGHTENS OUR POINTS

[Anonymous No.14814922]

>>14791705
I've been thinking on it casually for a while but the higher failure and miscarriage rate of inbreeding possibly offers a mechanism to expunge deleterious recessive from a population.

I'm not sure how exactly one would test this theory.

[Anonymous No.14814928]

>>14791705
I don't like how this thread devolved into personal anecdotes, especially when OP wants to discuss the genetic possibilities.
Is this what royalty and jewish banking families have practiced since 1000s of years?
Is this why they have a 'royal' aura to them as one would describe it?

[Anonymous No.14814929]

>>14794539
>You need to have real pressure to remove unfit alleles
How much pressure can be exerted through miscarriage or implantation failures?

Wouldn't these inbred populations arguably have higher fitness when outbred due to the selective pressure imposed that expels many of these deleterious genes? Outbreeding populations are potentially accumulating countless deleterious mutations as mutational load that this would disguise an overall decline in fitness but when they inbreed the costs would be higher?

[Anonymous No.14814938]

>>14814928
The Hawaiians forbade the commoners from practising incestuous marriage because they saw it as a way to accumulate "Mana" though I don't know much more about how this worked and I think there system was more half sibling based.
But sacred and royal incest is quite a common practice throughout history for many elite groups since it retains wealth and power intergenerationally in spite of the potential costs.

[Anonymous No.14814946]

>>14814938
in lines like the Hapsburgs and the Windsors, do you think the current generations appear any different to the masses?
Do they still show signs of leftovers of the long-lasting successful(?) inbreeding in them?

[Anonymous No.14814954]

>>14791705
If you're abo you have special genetics powers that protect you from inbreeding

[Anonymous No.14814968]

This is a somewhat unique thread so I'll ask here perhaps one of you will know how to track down a copy.
I'm looking for this paper
>Shunichi Kubo, “Researches on Incest in Japan,” Hiroshima Journal of Medical Science 8(1959): 99-159.

I came across it after trying to check the references made in this document of which I was initially sceptical but wanted to investigate further.
https://psychohistory.com/articles/the-universality-of-incest/

The problem is that I've not been able to find a copy, at least not an online one, only references to it from other papers.

Do any of you professional researchers have access to or know how I might get ahold of a copy?

[Anonymous No.14814973]

>>14814968
*The claims made by it to incestuous marriages in rural areas of japan contemporary to the writing of the paper in the 1950s and the historical practice under feudal times piqued my interest.

[Anonymous No.14814979]

>>14807609
>we're still working on eliminating the genetic load those genes have even 40k years later.
Not actually true, I've read papers that investigated this claim and found no real evidence for this purging continuing.

[Anonymous No.14814982]

>>14791705
>xylosandrus germanus
>literal insects
Bugs have innate purge systems for incest. Their genetics rectify these things with ease. Mammalians are a different story. Much more complicated code.

[Anonymous No.14815021]

>>14814982
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/696831v2.full
here

[Anonymous No.14815024]

Inbreeding penalises genes associated with heterozygote advantage.
Take the gene associated with cystic fibrosis as an example, as a recessive heterozygote it offers some level of resistance against tuberculosis. I don't know the actual code but for this example I'll simply use "Cc" with two heterozygous parents and their 4 potential offspring while initially assuming an environment where they are subject to selective pressure from TB
>cc dies young from CF
>cC and Cc do not die from CF and are somewhat resistant to TB both are more likely to be able to reproduce
>CC does not die from CF but is vulnerable to TB reducing their chance of reproduction

While the threat from TB remains, those most likely to leave young will be Cc types.
If the threat posed by TB is reduced or disappears then CC types will be able to propagate and Cc types slowly reduce in number until the cost of 1/4 guaranteed mortality dwindles due to the low chance of two recessives meeting.
Under an inbreeding population (assuming no continuous TB pressure) however these these recessives will regularly rise to the surface facilitating their purging now your inbred population is almost exclusively made up of CC types when the population is again exposed to TB most of them will now likely die. while the non inbreeding population will be able to rapidly repopulate with Cc types.
Of course this won't apply under harsh TB pressure since the Cc type will still be maintained.

That was likely a redundant and simplified example but I hope it made my points clear enough.

[Anonymous No.14815025]

>>14814946
I read one research about habsburgs
the paper said that Habsburgs were successful in genetic purging

[Anonymous No.14815028]

>>14815025
Oh I read a paper like that before too, I've not been able to refind it again, do you happen to have a link?

[Anonymous No.14815030]

>>14815028
https://www.nature.com/articles/hdy201325
here you go

[Anonymous No.14815039]

>>14815030
interesting
>https://www.nature.com/articles/hdy201325
>Royal dynasties as human inbreeding laboratories: the Habsburgs (2013)
The European royal dynasties of the Early Modern Age provide a useful framework for human inbreeding research. In this article, consanguineous marriage, inbreeding depression and the purging of deleterious alleles within a consanguineous population are investigated in the Habsburgs, a royal dynasty with a long history of consanguinity over generations. Genealogical information from a number of historical sources was used to compute kinship and inbreeding coefficients for the Habsburgs. The marriages contracted by the Habsburgs from 1450 to 1750 presented an extremely high mean kinship (0.0628±0.009), which was the result of the matrimonial policy conducted by the dynasty to establish political alliances through marriage. A strong inbreeding depression for both infant and child survival was detected in the progeny of 71 Habsburg marriages in the period 1450–1800. The inbreeding load for child survival experienced a pronounced decrease from 3.98±0.87 in the period 1450–1600 to 0.93±0.62 in the period 1600–1800, but temporal changes in the inbreeding depression for infant survival were not detected. Such a reduction of inbreeding depression for child survival in a relatively small number of generations could be caused by elimination of deleterious alleles of a large effect according with predictions from purging models. The differential purging of the infant and child inbreeding loads suggest that the genetic basis of inbreeding depression was probably very different for infant and child survival in the Habsburg lineage. Our findings provide empirical support that human inbreeding depression for some fitness components might be purged by selection within consanguineous populations.
>---
What did this part mean?
>but temporal changes in the inbreeding depression for infant survival were not detected.

[Anonymous No.14815041]

>>14791705
jews couldn't control the urge to sleep with sisters.
that's why they pass along a large number genetic diseases.

You pass your DNA to your kids, half from you, half from a mother. Your negative DNA that your sister likely also carry will likely to multiply in your children (both DNAs will have it), while when you marry non-relative those trait are likely to go away.
you may get lucky or not. sister is too close, consider more distant cousins.

[Anonymous No.14815050]

>>14815039
>>but temporal changes in the inbreeding depression for infant survival were not detected.
probably meant that infant survival was normal

[Anonymous No.14815058]

>>14815050
As in there was no observed reduction in the inbreeding depression over time?
>Mortality data were classified into two categories: infant deaths (deaths in the first year of life, excluding miscarriages and stillbirths) and child deaths (deaths between years 1–10). Only deaths attributable to natural causes were considered for the analysis.
This would tend to suggest at least from my interpretation that the level of care infants received stabilised their survival rates but as soon as they reached an age where they were able to affect their own survival their survivability declined, but that might only be part of it.

[Anonymous No.14815082]

>>14807522
Every day we draw further from god...
What exactly was the ultimate goal of the promotion of incest porn? from a sociological perspective can we consider it an attempt to undermine the platonic family?

[Anonymous No.14815160]

>>14815082
Oy vey wanting to impregnate your white sister? Consume more interracial porn and introduce her to a nice somali goyim.

[Anonymous No.14815200]

>>14815082
Incest porn is probably way more organic than some of the other sex-related trends in the sense of responding to demand rather than being pushed due to some ulterior motives. That's why it's mostly limited to pornographic material and you don't see it being promoted elsewhere.

[Anonymous No.14815257]

>>14815200
Back in my day, the studs in MILF porn were like 28 and the "MILFs" were like 25-32. Now, the studs at literally barely legal, and look like they're 15, while the MILFs are like 45+. Who wants that? Women hate anything boyish, men hate post-wall women. This can't be organic.

[Anonymous No.14815273]

>>14815257
>Women hate anything boyish
That's not exactly true. looking at preference studies older women prefer hairy men, there's a reason k-pop boybands with their effeminate singers are popular among young women

[Anonymous No.14815335]

>>14815257
Dunno, never searched for MILF porn in my entire life. Not unprecedent for definitions to evolve. Maybe the "M" in MILF gradually got redefined to represent an older cohort of women more resembling the kind of mother a young male would have instead of simply meaning any woman with a child of her own. While most people aren't attracted to women approaching menopause, there's always a significant enough amount to be able to carve out a niche for it, and possibly even drive enough demand that would result in more porn featuring such women. It's not like there's a shortage of videos of women in their late twenties getting fucked after all, but I guess if the emphasis on their matronly aspect is needed to get off, it would kind of suck.

Another reason I believe that incest porn isn't being pushed is that a lot of porn makers and sites still tiptoe around incest by employing the "step" trope as much as possible, which sort of pushes the idea that fucking your sister isn't bad only if she's not related by blood, and most people have only blood relatives. You'd think they'd go all out if they wanted more people to fuck their family members for whatever reason.

[Anonymous No.14816251]

>>14792024
Ah I never found out if other research agreed with Helgason's 2008 paper on birthrates in Iceland. Do you know any?
His figures based on 200 years of Icelandic birth and marriage records showing highest fertility among couples of relatedness around 3rd cousin

[Anonymous No.14816258]

>>14816251
I always find the drop off after 4th cousin quite surprising

[Anonymous No.14816456]

>>14815257
Following anon's previous criteria: are zoomers pushed to idealize old hags and/or fat whales outside porn? The answer is yes, hence it's ulterior like interracial shit. Incest on the other hand is haram and an anti-rural-white stereotype propagated by inner city liberal types, hence it directly goes against the programming but they still produce porn while keeping it out of any more respected mediums in an attempt to keep natural human desires boxed into the category of taboo fetish. (((They))) always play both sides.

[Anonymous No.14816490]

>>14816456
What about the incest in GOT?

[Anonymous No.14816603]

>>14815024
>larp gets over a dozen replies
>this gets none
Such is life

[Anonymous No.14816744]

>>14816490
GOT is edgy by design.

[Anonymous No.14816755]

>>14816603
It's nothing but cherrypicking. One example of heterozygote good =/= heterozygote always good. There are good and bad recessive genes, there are also good and bad heterozygotes.

Also it's inherently disingenuous to claim that recessive genes become harmless in heterozygous pairs. Your Cc can pass down CF to his children, CC never will. Genetic risk factors are precisely comprised of recessive genetic problems that still get passed down by asymptomatic hosts. The only way to completely eliminate these recessive genetic risk factors is through a combination of inbreeding and eugenics, active or passive through natural selection.

[Anonymous No.14816759]

>>14791705
>plus why racemixing is allowed?
Because they want to purge the world of beneficial alleles to create a slave underclass that can be easily controlled

[Anonymous No.14816779]

>>14816755
>It's nothing but cherrypicking
It's literally just one simplified example of a potential weakness from inbreeding, it's a branching point offering room for further discussion.

[Anonymous No.14816786]

>>14816759
Purging beneficial alleles is the new racemixing,
the original racemixers were trying to collect all possible good alleles for their tribes.

[Anonymous No.14816791]

>>14816786
woo bioleninism woo, dysgenic selection on steroids

[Anonymous No.14816798]

>>14816779
Then you can consider the discussion branched. There being theoretical benefits to heterozygotes (hell there's another even without that, higher versatility thus more rapid adaptation to changing conditions) doesn't negate the fact that there are accompanying downsides. In practical terms this still isn't a conclusive reason for the current radical anti-incest stance of the mainstream americanized west, because it at best argues for a moderate approach.

[Anonymous No.14816816]

>>14816786
It's the original racemixing. Dissolving clan-based lineage into a chaotic peasantry soup via public unisex schooling came before telling all americans to become 44% sub-saharan as quickly as possible.

[Anonymous No.14816964]

>>14802262
>half-bro I'm stuck

[Anonymous No.14816971]

>>14812468
>You don't have to have children.
Then what would be the point? I want to blast my sister's ovaries with our shared genetic matter so she bears genetic supermen forged in our shared likeness

[Anonymous No.14817240]

I found an interesting paper on wolf conservation, there was an isolated highly inbred and purged rare wolf group, an unrelated wolf from a large outbred population was able to find them and bred with them. But because of higher level of mutational load this wolf carried the small group was forced to purge again which the population was too small to sustain and killed the group within a few generations.
I'll see if I can find it again.

[Anonymous No.14817269]

Ancient Egypt carried out sibling inbreeding for centuries including among the commoners.
We even have census records from the first 2 centuries during the Roman occupation era that prove it was as common as 20-40%.

So it has been an experienced reality in some parts of the world.

[Anonymous No.14817303]

>>14815024
yeah, the thing is that in the wild that cc will never reproduce and in doing so they pretty much kills off those genes. Then also thanks to inbreeding we might get the beneficial aa gene that cannot be expressed under the normal breeding
its just matter of expression and if the bad ones getting expressed this means that we can purge those genes. And if the good ones got expressed we can do purifying selection and do much effective purification of the genetic pool
but hey! for a human we can prevent those deleterious alleles from expressing themselves by gene therapy, vitro fertilization etc
>>14815058
might be, I crtl+f'd it and it from what I understand it seems that infant survival rate was pretty much normal for the time it seems
>The inbreeding load for child survival experienced a pronounced decrease from 3.98±0.87 in the period 1450–1600 to 0.93±0.62 in the period 1600–1800, but temporal changes in the inbreeding depression for infant survival were not detected.
and it seems that children far off better
>>14816251
from what I know, scientific community is pretty divided on the issue of "genetic rescue vs genetic purging"
genetic rescue is pretty much introduces a new blood in order to save the species while heavily arguing against the effects of inbreeding. They are like super anti-inbreeding and pretty old schooled people
genetic purging was common knowledge but it wasn't really that big idea because of genetic rescue. But thanks to computer simulations and molecular genetics the new field started to question the credibility of genetic rescue on the survivalism of the species. Because molecular genetics and computer simulations pretty much found and concluded that genetic purging had much more positive impact on the preservation of the species than the genetic rescue
But from what I see genetic rescue will die out slowly while the genetic purging will be victorious, its just matter of time

[Anonymous No.14817315]

The best study I know on the topic of human inbreeding rates is based on the UK Biobank data that analysed the native english population collected genomes for indicator patterns in the runs of homozygosity associated with inbreeding including a method to distinguish between the offspring of parent-child and sibling-sibling.

I've not read the paper in quite a while but the rates of close inbreeding were somewhere around 1/4000 but they suspected this is lower than than actual figure since the sample would self select for better health however they did compile some data on estimated fitness traits and found a down shift in these average values compared to the norm

>Extreme inbreeding in a European ancestry sample from the contemporary UK population
>Loic Yengo, Naomi R. Wray & Peter M. Visscher
>Nature Communications volume 10, Article number: 3719 (2019)

split link below but also attached because 4chan still borks at nature urls...
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-019-11
724-6

[Anonymous No.14817322]

>>14817303
sry english is my second language
>>14816759
kek, and all those genetic loads that makes weak
>>14817240
thats sounds like a nice paper
>an unrelated wolf from a large outbred population was able to find them and bred with them. But because of higher level of mutational load this wolf carried the small group was forced to purge again which the population was too small to sustain and killed the group within a few generations.
God I hate genetic rescue
>>14817269
and most of the people who did was greeks, an europeans
>>14817315
cool, those guys should totally fuck their relative if they don't have an opposite sex sibling

[Anonymous No.14817324]

>>14817303
My point was that the CC was also getting selected against due to TB pressure.
I remember a better actual example that analysed rats.
There was some lethal recessive linked to the blood that conferred some resistance against a rat poison possibly warfarin. If they were homozygous for the recessive they died young, if they were homozygous for the dominant trait they were vulnerable to poisoning so only the heterozgotes were found.

[Anonymous No.14817369]

>>14817324
but the thing is that CC and Cc is same thing
its probably a co-dominance but my knowledge on that kinda limited right now

[Anonymous No.14817382]

>>14817322
>God I hate genetic rescue
heh

I swear I had a jpg about this failed attempt to reintroduce some ibex or mountain goat species where for some inexplicable reason they though it a good idea to introduce some genes from a related population for "added genetic diversity" but it completely failed because these genes and the population also collapsed