/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.12532427]

Why does light travel slower in water and other mediums? This makes zero sense. It's not like it's bouncing around and making its path longer, it still travels in a straight line. So what's the matter? Is water actually a time slowing device?

[Anonymous No.12532435]

>>12532427
Electrons from water molecules and other mediums absorb light to rise their energy state and than release them again. This process takes time, hence the speed is slowed down

[Anonymous No.12532436]

How come a man can move faster on than than in water?

[Anonymous No.12533081]

>>12532427
If you think this is strange consider that light has different speeds in the same medium depending on its polarization and wavelength.

[Anonymous No.12533098]

>>12533081
The shorter wavelength is, the higher probability of interacting with a particle. Polarization is just the angle of electromagnetic field. Different mediums have particle configurations of different angles, and the more this angle aligns with the polarization, the slower will light propagate.

[Anonymous No.12533124]

>>12533098
>The shorter wavelength is, the higher probability of interacting with a particle.
I was referring to dispersion. And wouldn't interaction with matter depend on multiple things like resonance with vibrational and rotational modes, electron orbital energy levels etc which are quantum in nature i.e. there will be discreet bands of interaction with matter rather than a probabilistic continuum with increasing photon energy? Not arguing, just asking..

>Polarization is just the angle of electromagnetic field
How can a field have an angle? Vectors have angles, in this case the electric vector is what we are talking about. In this case I was referring to birefringence.

[Anonymous No.12533150]

>>12532427
because of quantum gravity

[Anonymous No.12533164]

>>12532427
the water is denser so the light has to go around more atoms.
opaque substances only block light because they are so dense it would take the photon longer than the universe will last to make it through

[Anonymous No.12533600]

>>12532427
>Why does light travel slower in water and other mediums?
*media
Also, it doesn't. It appears to do so because it interacts with the media, not by bouncing around, but rather absorption and reemission, stuff like that. The group velocity is always c, phase velocity is what changes due to the interactions.

[Anonymous No.12533603]

>>12532435
>water molecules and other mediums
Do you also say "mainstream mediums"? What the fuck is wrong with US-citizens?

[Anonymous No.12533607]

>>12533124
Electron orbital energy is important aswell since it dictates the amount of energy absorbed and reemited by the atom.
Honestly, i thought about it as more of a probabilistic continuum, but it probably was a generalized approach. Could you elaborate on how would those bands of interaction form and what effects would they cause?

If field can not have an angle, a part of the field also cannot. But yeah, i wrongly recalled an image of polarization in my head and interpreted it as an angle rather than a direction of oscillation, my bad.

[Anonymous No.12533621]

>>12533603
Nah im polish and i sometimes dont know how to spell things

[Anonymous No.12533731]

>>12533621
You should be better than US subhumans, brother.

[Anonymous No.12533839]

>>12532427
>It's not like it's bouncing around and making its path longer
That basically is what's happening

[Anonymous No.12534217]

>>12532435
>This process takes time
why?

[Anonymous No.12534222]

>>12532427
The photons that you see coming out are not the same ones coming in.

>photon with energy absorbed
>energy goes into some particle, which then loses that energy
>same quanta of energy comes out again but a bit later

[Anonymous No.12534235]

>>12533603
>>12533731
Absolutely obsessed.

[Anonymous No.12535541]

>>12534217
This process takes time because its not instantaneous.
Electrons which energy states were risen stay in them for a little bit of time. Then, they release this energy in the form of a photon.

[Anonymous No.12535587]

>>12534235
With preserving culture, yes. I see it taken from us every day. You don't?

[Anonymous No.12535622]

>>12532427
The absorbed light transition electrons into higher excited states. This energy can be dissipated in the molecule via vibrational relaxat. The time is dependent on molecular struc/absorbitivity, it takes time because the energy turns into heat wherein it will vibrationally relax(think physically stretching) the molecule until it reaches the ground state.

It's also the reason why UV-vis graphs aren't just straight lines with just simply exciting the electrons. Rotational and vibrational relaxations with multiple molecules at different states make up the widening graph

[Anonymous No.12536236]

>>12532435
>absorb light to rise their energy state and than release them again.
That's wrong.
The real answer is light is an electromagnetic wave, it shakes electrons and protons in matter it passes through and that shaking makes another EM wave that interferes with the first. Resultant wave moves slower through the medium and refracts at specific angles when it enters and exits the medium which is not explained by absorption/emission.

[Anonymous No.12536256]

>>12532435
When it absorbs the light, pauses, and then sputs it back out, how is the direction conserved? Why doesn't this scatter the light?

[Anonymous No.12536273]

>>12533124
>>12533607
The bands of interaction are why everything seen through water is bluish I bet

[Anonymous No.12536283]

>>12536236
Yes, none of the other answers explain why the same thing wouldn't happen with concrete.

[Anonymous No.12536319]

>>12536236
When the interference is created, that requires moving an electron, so that is the wave equivalent of "absorbing the photon."
The first electron movement creates an interference wave that cancels out the first wave.
And then electric and magnetic fields created by the electron movements as a group pull the electrons back into position, creating a mirror image of the original wave, a tiny but later in time than it would have been?
In effect, the changing electric field ->changinh magnetic field -> changing electric field loop that creates light, is slowed down as it passes through a medium that ties electrical and magnetic fields changes to mass, which has inertia, with protons and electrons

[Anonymous No.12537963]

>>12536319
Bump. Someone tell me if my idea is retarded

[Anonymous No.12538043]

>>12532427
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mICTVow3-3I

[Anonymous No.12538075]

>>12532427
why are all explanations using quantum mechanics while a lattice of randomly oriented dipoles already has a higher electric permibility in classical electrodynamics???

The classical answer is time delayed interference, with the time delay being associated with the inertia (both mass and inductance) of the dipoles. Larger dipole = larger inductance during acceleration = slower response = larger permittivity. Think later chapters of Griffiths effectively cover this.

[Anonymous No.12538107]

>>12532427
It sort of merges with the electrons as it travels through since it is mediated by the EM field. This gives it mass, slowing it.

[Anonymous No.12538117]

>>12532427
So how do you like high school?

[Anonymous No.12538166]

>>12532427
interference
>>12532435
this is not the explanation (this is correct: >>12536236)

[Anonymous No.12538195]

>>12537963
yes your idea is wrong, thats not how it works
look up group velocity and phase velocity

[Anonymous No.12538216]

>>12532427
Interactions cause photon to get effective mass.

[Anonymous No.12538452]

>>12532427
It's harder to move through something than it is to move through nothing.

[Anonymous No.12538471]

Mass replies should be eligible for free durable ropes.

[Anonymous No.12538496]

>>12532427
Study ionization , it lies in CHI->Greek of electron,
Check out electron photon scatering.

Ioniziation liquids.

Polarized solvents.

Speed of light.

Don't delete me while you timetravel. Make only time capsule that is opened after you travel, otherwise it's very dangerous to existance is selve.

[Anonymous No.12538499]

Please consider ending psychiatry, it had problem with me studying this.

[Anonymous No.12538501]

>>12532427
Light travels in spirals, if it traveled that speed faster it would be faster straight.

Relativistic by einstein is to be recounted prior to travel, it can tear you apart.

[Anonymous No.12538810]

>>12532427
picrel might help

[Anonymous No.12538815]

>>12538410
TRUE! XD!

[Anonymous No.12538915]

>>12532427
It is claimed that light travels at its true speed in a a vacuum, but if a true vacuum is not actually empty, is the theoretical speed of light greater than the actual speed of light capable within the universe?

[Anonymous No.12539684]

>>12533600
This

/thread

[Anonymous No.12540886]

>>12538915
>but if a true vacuum is not actually empty
Then it is not a true vacuum