Is the lockdown legitimated by science

[Anonymous No.12317834]

Is a lockdown, or partial lockdown, legitimate?

Does it really help? Or it helps only during the lockdown and then the virus comes back the moment ot ends?

Are mask useful? Should people be mandated to wear them? Are you a danger to others if you go around in restaurants or hang out with people because even if you say "ok it's my responsibility, I take the risk and if i get the virus tough shit" you can still infect other people regardless of if you want or not, so there are a lot externalities.

[Anonymous No.12317865]

>>12317834
Lockdowns reduce spread rate but it's a retarded solution for a disease that already have community spread.

Masks are mostly virtue signaling unless you go all in on N95 masks all day until your face bleeds.

The end result from lockdowns will be untold economic devastation. What we're doing right now is soaking everything In fuel and pretending we live on a future without sparks.

[Anonymous No.12317879]

>>12317834
>Masks are mostly virtue signaling unless you go all in on N95 masks all day until your face bleeds.

Not true at all, there have been studies done with COVID and especially with flu that show masks (plain old cotton masks) help tremendously in many regards.

Will a cotton mask help you if someone with COVID walks up into your face and sneezes/coughs directly at you? Probably not... Since there will be billions of particles in an incredibly small space, the mask won't block much of it and you will inhale a lot of it.

Will it help if you walk through an area that someone with COVID sneezed/coughed in like ten minutes ago? Absolutely, because by the time you get there, most of the particles from that incident have settled/dispersed, with only a few (relatively speaking) particles highly dispersed in the air remaining. You mask won't stop all of them, but there are few enough that it can block enough of them that you take such a low dose that your immune system prevents you from ever even getting infected... Or, if you do get infected, the viral load is so low that it is a very mild sickness, in many cases people don't even notice being sick (which is one of the reasons it spreads so well).

[Anonymous No.12317892]

>>12317879
There's also studies done that show cloth masks increase influenza like illness rate 600% and lab verified influenza by 100% compared to single use surgical masks.

Stop scisplaining

[Anonymous No.12317901]

Politics has more control than science.
Information degrades. What one reads affects the thoughts of most tremendously.
Blindly following what an article or politician says what scientists say is not the best idea.
Today anyone can publish a paper with bad statistics or shitty methodology, most scientists to exist in the world are alive today, maybe something as high as 80%.
Science is still a good empirical method.
We do not know everything about covid, it is dangerous to old and unhealthy people but not very much to the healthy and relatively young in its current state however.
A mask lowers the percentage of transmission, this is true now and in the beginning of February/March when it was said in media that masks did nothing but there is a lot of hysteria and mania surrounding the act of wearing a mask in the West which makes the illiterate on both sides lose their minds over it.
Is a lockdown legitimate in a pandemic? Yes, is it a good solution in regards to covid? Who knows.
Look don't trust everything you read. If someone says something is true that is false, it does not make the opposition automatically true either.
The western internet is open and so many people speak English around the world, you have no idea who is trying to affect your thinking.
Don't get paranoid, just stay calm and do what you can like getting good at something, exercising and eating healthy. Don't stare to long into the death machine (youtube, twitter, netflix) etc. Stare at a terminal or a paper and pen instead.

[Anonymous No.12317914]

>>12317865
Why do you say masks are ineffective?

[Anonymous No.12317937]

>>12317865
>until your face bleeds
If wearing a mask makes your face bleed, you're either wearing an old Russian or Eastern European gas mask or your doing it wrong, like, completely.

>untold economic devastation
Yeah, having a big chunk of your population unable to work, some even permanently, would be much better.

[Anonymous No.12317976]

>>12317937
>Yeah, having a big chunk of your population unable to work, some even permanently, would be much better.
long term complications have been overhyped by the media, sweden doesn't have "a big chunk" of its population unable to work

[Anonymous No.12318084]

>>12317834

Yes.

[Anonymous No.12318112]

>>12317834
>Is a lockdown, or partial lockdown, legitimate?
In a perfect world a lockdown is unnecessary because if ALL people were trusting in science and followed recommendations the virus would never get a chance to spread as much as it did. In the real world, where every other person is a dumb-as-a-bag-of-bricks anti-masker, it is about the only sure way to stop the virus.

>Does it really help?
Yes, just look at the statistics of every lockdown that occurred where people were actually obeying it.

>Or it helps only during the lockdown and then the virus comes back the moment it ends?
If the lockdown is long enough, it can be wiped out, however no lockdown will be as long as it needs to be. After the lockdown virus spread can be mitigated by hand-washing, mask-wearing and physical distancing. No virus is truly "gone" until persistent mass vaccination occurs.

>Are mask useful?
Yes, even a partially effective mask brings benefit. More about this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y47t9qLc9I4

>Should people be mandated to wear them?
In a perfect world people would wise-up to the benefits of wearing a mask themselves without say-so of the government and therefore there would be no need to mandate them. In the real world, a mandate enforced by fines is about the only way to make sure mask bring the benefit they can bring.

>Are you a danger to others if you go around in restaurants or hang out with people because even if you say "ok it's my responsibility, I take the risk and if i get the virus tough shit" you can still infect other people regardless of if you want or not, so there are a lot externalities.
Yes, you are not only a danger to yourself, but also to others, because a portion of the population can have weak symptoms yes still spread the virus.

[Anonymous No.12318143]

>>12317976
>long term complications have been overhyped by the media,
It's rarely talked about in the media. At least where I live it's not mentioned at all. There were two documentaries though which showed how fucked people are if long-term damage happens and it's not just ground glass.
>sweden doesn't have "a big chunk" of its population unable to work
Yet. Also, how long do people with covid-19 stay at home to recover in Sweden?

[Anonymous No.12318147]

>>12317834
No.

[Anonymous No.12318160]

>>12317937
>Yeah, having a big chunk of your population unable to work, some even permanently, would be much better.

More people in the 0-65 age group will or have already died or become unfit for work due to addiction, suicide, missed routine medical diagnosis(cardiac, cancer, strokes). Due to the lockdowns than from covid itself. The snake oil cure is worse than the disease.

The result from the economic implosion will amplify these effects tenfold.

t. MD

[Anonymous No.12318166]

>>12317834

no, it doesn't help. none of it helps. it doesn't matter. it's the flu. this is nothing more than a cooked up hoax to justify extreme oppression in the first world.

[Anonymous No.12318232]

>>12318160
>More people in the 0-65 age group will or have already died or become unfit for work due to addiction, suicide, missed routine medical diagnosis(cardiac, cancer, strokes).
Whataboutism.
>The result from the economic implosion will amplify these effects tenfold.
Still waiting for the collapse.

>t. MD
I find that hard to believe when you argue that we shouldn't get rid of a disease that impairs millions for weeks and months, some for life, on the basis that there are people dying anyway.

[Anonymous No.12318237]

if biden wins it means china will go for world domination under an AI system you will all be cattle 1984 matrix style
there are chinese spies all over the world, you should know all the chinese in your colleges etc
trump wouldve bankrupted CCP and make it fail but biden has deals with them and supports them. the usa has been the last big block in their way.
if biden wins CCP chinese communist party will go for world domination under an AI system with drones, machines, robots, facial recognition, skeleton recognition, the way you move, your gaze, organ detection, skin detection, your biodigitalelectricfield-data, voice recognition
forced vaccinations with nano implants making you unable to resist the AI system under 5G, 6G systems connecting you to AI brain with quantum technology
your own thoughts will not be your own

all the tech has been given to them. it isnt such a smart idea after all to move all industry of the world to one single country just so greedy 'entrepreneurs' save some shekels.

you are already a cyborg, you and your smartphone form a symbiotic relationship. your smartphone and computer interconnects with your nervesystem and neurosysteme. it downloads all your information, you can literally be offed and cloned and nobody would know. some humans arent human anymore

CCP plans to surveille, control, scan every human being on the planet

[Anonymous No.12318246]

>>12318232
It's not whataboutism, because he's arguing these effects are directly caused by the intervention.

The efficacy of a treatment should be measured by comparing how well the treatment group is compared to the control. We lack a good control for COVID, but the "treatment" group (quarantining) is suffering from higher mortality rates due to addiction, suicides, and missed diagnoses. It remains to be seen if the increased mortality from quarantine is equal to the increased mortality expected from unfettered COVID spread

[Anonymous No.12318262]

>>12318246
>It's not whataboutism, because he's arguing these effects are directly caused by the intervention.
Addiction? Suicide? Routine medical diagnostic? It's bullshit. Some people miss surgeries and stroke treatments due to a substantial number of beds reserved for covid patients, but not the cases he mentioned.
the "treatment" group (quarantining) is suffering from higher mortality rates due to addiction, suicides, and missed diagnoses.
Source?
> It remains to be seen if the increased mortality from quarantine is equal to the increased mortality expected from unfettered COVID spread
IF there is increased mortality due to quarantine, true. I highly doubt it.

[Anonymous No.12318266]

>>12318232
>we shouldn't get rid of a disease that impairs millions for weeks and months

Lockdowns don't cure covid, it's just burning resources that could be more effectively used for other public health measures while degrading the mental health of the entire population, resulting in second order effects that eat up more quality adjusted life years than doing business as usual.

[Anonymous No.12318270]

>>12318237
>biden has deals with them and supports them
That's my main point why Biden was the shittiest choice the dems could have made.
>CCP chinese communist party will go for world domination under an AI system with drones, machines, robots, facial recognition, skeleton recognition, the way you move, your gaze, organ detection, skin detection, your biodigitalelectricfield-data, voice recognition
Chill bro, that's not going to happen. Not like that. It's not going to be obvious.
>forced vaccinations with nano implants
Oh okay, I've been baited...

[Anonymous No.12318277]

>>12318266
>Lockdowns don't cure covid
True, but they help in getting rid of the virus for good and stopping the spread so we can get back to a normal life as soon as possible.
The problem is, we're not doing a lockdown. Look at China. Less than one month of real lockdown, and it's gone. Rest is handled via heavy testing and contact tracing. There was one case of a teenager who tesred positive a few weeks ago. They tested 4 million people in two days, results came back the third day. All 17 or so people who contracted covid were quarantined, the rest could go on with their lives.

[Anonymous No.12318284]

>>12318160
>More people in the 0-65 age group will or have already died or become unfit for work due to addiction, suicide, missed routine medical diagnosis(cardiac, cancer, strokes). Due to the lockdowns than from covid itself.
I guess it's just magic that Germany isn't experiencing those issues despite taking more severe measures than many countries.

[Anonymous No.12318292]

>>12318166
Why would governments want oppression in the first world?

[Anonymous No.12318294]

>>12318292
Rising populism against the elites.

[Anonymous No.12318295]

>>12318262
Okay well it's almost certainly true at some level. First, google "excess mortality covid" and you will see that death rates are higher in 2020 than in 2019 in many areas ravaged by COVID. Now, obviously some of this is due to COVID killing people, but you will see that the excess mortality is not simply equal to the mortality rate of 2019 + mortality rate due to COVID.

This implies something else is killing those people or they are dying from COVID but not being reported. Logically, at least some people are dying from quarantine. If you expect x% of non-emergency doctors appointments end up saving somebody's life by catching something like cancer early, then because non-emergency doctor's appointments are banned in many areas, then you would expect x% increase in mortality.

[Anonymous No.12318296]

>>12318112
>thread

[Anonymous No.12318300]

>>12317892
Yeah I'm not a fan of the cloth masks but the disposable ones look like diapers.

The truth is the Democrats and even some Republicans have been exaggerating their ability to control it. It is already out there already mutating already a long list of viruses and they didn't bother at all to take into account all the people who would rather not wear a mask on the off chance they're safe.

In a situation like this the best possible solution may have been to socially distance and overstaff the hospitals and just let the virus take its victims

[Anonymous No.12318302]

>>12318277
>True, but they help in getting rid of the virus for good and stopping the spread so we can get back to a normal life as soon as possible.
You are a retard.
Lockdowns can slow but not reverse the spread, based on how severe the lockdown measures are. But once the measures stop, the infection rate picks up again. Meaning that lockdowns result in a PROLONGATION of the pandemic

[Anonymous No.12318305]

>>12318284
Numbers please or stfu

[Anonymous No.12318307]

Lockdowns slow the spread. To what extent benefits outweight the cons under normalish circumstances is debatable, but if your hospitals are at the risk of collapse from covid patient numbers, there is no other option.

Masks definitely help, they have almost no downsides and even if they are not perfect, they can decrease the transmission rate.

[Anonymous No.12318313]

>>12318302

>Meaning that lockdowns result in a PROLONGATION of the pandemic

Yes, but thats the goal. Lower the curve, remember? So the medical system is not overwhelmed at once.

Ideally we would lower the infection rate to as low as possible until vaccine is developed. But that might not be feasible due to economic considerations. Its a compromise.

[Anonymous No.12318324]

>>12318305
https://www.euromomo.eu/graphs-and-maps

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.10.21.20187419v1

No excess deaths in Germany from suicides and missed medical diagnoses, in fact suicide rates are down. Now please provide numbers proving a substantial amount of the 0-65 group is becoming unfit for work and dying.

[Anonymous No.12318344]

>>12318313
Moving goalposts.
>until vaccine is developed
You'll be disappointed when you see the real world effects of a vaccine. Working age populations will be slow to get vaccinated, because covid is not a danger to them. The elderly at-risk patients will get vaccinated, but due to their frailty and badly working immunity a vaccine is less effective in this population group.

The end result is that there's a vaccine but still comparable numbers of infections and deaths. Screencap this. Print it. Hang it on your wall and then come back and prove me wrong.

[Anonymous No.12318360]

>>12318344

>The elderly at-risk patients will get vaccinated, but due to their frailty and badly working immunity a vaccine is less effective in this population group.

Is there any evidence that significant number of at-risk patients are getting reinfected and dying from it? I thought once you have immunity reinfections are extremely rare, even among at-risk groups.

[Anonymous No.12318375]

>>12317834
ITT:

[Anonymous No.12318392]

>>12318324
>in fact suicide rates are down.
Were down during the period when the gov liberally handed out free money during spring and early summer, data doesn't go past June.

Free gibs are less prevalent during autumn lockdown.

Your other graphs also show excess mortality in younger age groups, those that have virtually no risk to die from covid. Where do you think that excess mortality came from?

[Anonymous No.12318402]

>>12318344
Prohibit anyone from being able buy or sell anything until they have vaccine and are marked with a tattoo as proof of vaccination. That will ensure compliance.

[Anonymous No.12318406]

>>12318295
>Logically, at least some people are dying from quarantine.
No. It could be anything. Saying quarantine kills people is ridiculous. You probably mean the "lockdown" and if we had a real lockdown, I'd concur. But we don't. People are free to go outside and do whatever. Just some businesses are closed.

https://www.destatis.de/EN/Themes/Cross-Section/Corona/Society/population_death.html
In Germany, it was a heat wave causing non-covid excess deaths.

[Anonymous No.12318412]

>>12318302
>Lockdowns can slow but not reverse the spread
Well, I never claimed they could "reverse" it.
>You are a retard.
Seems like you're the retard here.

[Anonymous No.12318420]

>>12318344
>Working age populations will be slow to get vaccinated, because covid is not a danger to them.
kek, sure, being sick for six weeks is like nothing bro. No employer will mind.

[Anonymous No.12318451]

>>12318406
>People are free to go outside and do whatever.
You do know that you needed a permit paper in Belgium to be outside, and that police harassment for papers please was actually a thing and not just theory.

[Anonymous No.12318456]

>>12318420
>being sick for six weeks is like nothing bro
pulling numbers out of your ass doesn't make you right, it makes you a retard.

[Anonymous No.12318461]

>>12317834
yes...? You can't meet the virus if you don't go outside.

[Anonymous No.12318464]

>>12318392
>Your other graphs also show excess mortality in younger age groups
In Europe as a whole (with certain countries being the primary contributors), and primarily in those over 45, who still have some risk due to COVID-19, just like they'd have some risk with the flu (and coincidentally, that's why expected deaths rise in the winter among all age groups).

Where's your evidence for the original statement? If you're the person who made it, then you should back up your claims, and if you're the person asking me for evidence, then why aren't you asking for the other anon's claims to be supported?

[Anonymous No.12318471]

>>12318451
>n = 1
Most countries didn't.

[Anonymous No.12318477]

>>12318456
https://www.who.int/docs/default-source/coronaviruse/who-china-joint-mission-on-covid-19-final-report.pdf
>Using available preliminary data, the median time from onset to clinical recovery for mild cases is approximately 2 weeks and is 3-6 weeks for patients with severe or critical disease.

Not educating yourself and calling others retard makes you the real retard.

[Anonymous No.12318497]

>>12318477
Even many mild cases are now being shown to cause lingering symptoms beyond two months. The person may be functional, but they're still not where they were before getting sick.

[Anonymous No.12318515]

>>12318497

This. Long covid is worrying. This is why I would prefer a vaccine (but a well developed one, not greatly rushed).

[Anonymous No.12318544]

>>12317937
>Yeah, having a big chunk of your population unable to work,
I mean they are because the economy is crippled and businesses have had to close permanently, I thought smart people were supposed to post here?

[Anonymous No.12318558]

>>12318477
6 weeks for severe cases. That means old and dying folks. Not young working age people.
Thanks for declaring yourself retarded retard

[Anonymous No.12318565]

>>12318497
Yeah I know. That's what I'm arguing. Those cases have the potential to fuck up the economy for a much longer time than a month or two of "lockdown".
>>12318558
>That means old and dying folks. Not young working age people.
Wrong. Are you so afraid of covid or why are you closing your eyes in front of the numbers?
>retarded retard
The master of reasoning has spoken.

[Anonymous No.12318570]

>>12318544
/Sci/ is by far the most retarded board on 4chan. It consists of redditards and edgy ifl fans with perpetually open mouths

[Anonymous No.12318577]

>>12318544
There's a difference between closing a business and not being able to work. The difference is that the closed business can reopen later and its employees work elsewhere.
>>12318570
Yeah agree, that Anon is pretty retarded.

[Anonymous No.12318581]

>>12318577
>The difference is that the closed business can reopen later
wow you make it sound so easy

[Anonymous No.12318583]

>>12318565
>Wrong
Your own source declared you retarded and you try to handwave it away? You're quadretarded, a legend among tards. The absolute zero if IQ. We need to drag a poet out of /lit/ to give justice to how you're the antithesis of intelligence.

[Anonymous No.12318595]

>>12318558
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.09.25.20201343v2.full

>Phone interviews and follow-ups were completed with 112 mostly mild COVID-19 RT-PCR-positive adult patients, over a six-months period.

>Completed questionnaires were obtained from 112 COVID-19 positive patients. The median age of the respondents was 35 ± 12 years (mean ± SD), 72 men. 6 patients were hospitalized (received respiratory support during their hospitalization and / or were hospitalized in the intensive care unit) and the remaining 106 were classified as ambulatory patients.

>More than one symptom at disease onset was experienced by ∼70% of the patients. About 40% of the patients experienced fever, dry cough, headache, or muscle ache as the first symptom. Fatigue, if reported, usually was the first to appear. Smell and taste changes were experienced 3.9 ± 5.4 and 4.6 ± 5.7 days (mean ± SD) after disease onset and emerged as first symptom in 15% and 18% of patients, respectively. Fever had the shortest duration (5.8 ± 8.6 days), and taste and smell changes were the longest-lasting symptoms (17.2 ± 17.6 and 18.9 ± 19.7 days, durations censored at 60 days). Longer smell recovery correlated with smell change severity. Cough, taste change and smell change persisted after negative RT-PCR tests (in 20%, 26% and 29% of the patients in total). At six-months follow-up, 46% of the patients had at least one unresolved symptom, most commonly fatigue (21%), chemosensory changes (14%) or breath difficulty (9%).

Average age of 35, with 46% reporting unresolved symptoms at the six-month follow-up.

[Anonymous No.12318596]

>>12318583
/lit/ here, here's my haiku as a tribute to his legendary stupidity.

>A supermassive moron
>A ring system of laughing frogs
>Stellar comedy

[Anonymous No.12318600]

>>12318581
>ignoring that all employees, including the business owners, can easily find other jobs.

[Anonymous No.12318617]

>>12318595
>112 patients recruited during first wave testing in march-may
>aka patients selected to have strong overt symptoms including hospitalizations because the mass testing hadn't begun yet.

I can recruit 112 patients from a covid morgue and 100% of them will turn out to be dead. Doesn't generalize very well though.

[Anonymous No.12318659]

>>12318583
>Your own source declared you retarded
Nope it doesn't. How do you misunderstand
>even in mild and asymptomatic cases
and
>even in young people
? See also
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/long-term-effects.html
>young adults with COVID-19, including athletes, can also suffer from myocarditis.Severe heart damage has occurred in young, healthy people
Among many other easily findable sources. But I get it, it's easier to stay ignorant and cuss.

>>12318596
Appreciate the effort, but reject the premise. See above.

[Anonymous No.12318668]

>>12318659
>young adults with the flu, including athletes, can also suffer from myocarditis.Severe heart damage has occurred in young, healthy people
What are we so scared about now again?

[Anonymous No.12318671]

>>12318600
yeah it's gonna be even "easier" once Biden starts lockdown 2.0 you naive fuck.

[Anonymous No.12318674]

>>12318668
Was that goalpost heavy, or did you put wheels underneath?

[Anonymous No.12318675]

What happened to the dozen or so vaccines that Israel announced about once a week during the early months of the pandemic? Did they keep them for themselves?

[Anonymous No.12318678]

>>12318671
Biden will do a lockdown for show, declare victory over the virus, and then prohibit anyone in the government from every mentioning it again except in connection with Trump.

[Anonymous No.12318679]

>>12318671
There never was a lockdown. I wish he'd do a lockdown so we can finally get rid of this and so I don't have to read ridiculously retarded posts like yours anymore.

[Anonymous No.12318689]

>>12318596
>>12318583
>declare victory
>hope nobody will notice its complete bullshit
>le epic Trump-style
You are a blistering faggot.

[Anonymous No.12318698]

>>12318679
If you wish for another lockdown, then it will be harder for people to find jobs. Why are you dodging this fact?

[Anonymous No.12318706]

>>12318698
Not that guy. But the point is that unemployment from lockdown is temporary.

[Anonymous No.12318711]

>that much effort to attempt to save 0.1% of the population and avert a "ICU collapse" that could only happen within a extremely flawed and unvalidated simulation from the early 2000's

If it was people were first predicting, there would have been about 100 million deaths by now, not just 1.2 million. About 55 million people die every year, and it has been an entire year since this "pandemic" began. Where are the piles of dead bodies? Wait until 70% of the population is above 60 years old and you'll see them.

[Anonymous No.12318719]

thanks to this severe overreaction, people aren't going to take an actually dangerous virus seriously, a la boy who cried wolf.

[Anonymous No.12318730]

>>12318706

[Anonymous No.12318731]

>>12318617
>112 patients recruited during first wave testing in march-may
My apologies, I didn't realize you had a time machine, but those of us without that technology can only evaluate patients at the 6-month mark who were infected as recently as May. 106 of the 112 patients met the criteria for a mild case (no supplemental oxygen), so I don't think it's wise to dismiss them.

[Anonymous No.12318746]

>>12318730
Compelling argument, but my opinion that you're a blistering faggot is set in stone now.

[Anonymous No.12318747]

>>12318679
Just like Europe, only had to do one lockdown and covid was beaten forever. Fucking retard.
>>12318706
>Small business bankruptcy is only temporary

[Anonymous No.12318762]

>>12318731
>I don't think it's wise to dismiss them.
>No objective testing was performed, and the information was self-reported by the participants.

I think dismissing their purely subjective oral accounts(anecdotes) is exactly what is the appropriate line of action here.

[Anonymous No.12318765]

>>12318746

[Anonymous No.12318769]

>>12318747
Doesn't seem to have worked, sweaty

[Anonymous No.12318793]

>>12318747
>Just like Europe, only had to do one lockdown and covid was beaten forever.
There was no lockdown in Europe. Closing a few businesses isn't a lockdown.
You may argue France had one for a short time.
>Fucking retard.
Whew lad. We have the bright ones today in this thread.

[Anonymous No.12318799]

>>12317892
So where did the flu go lol

[Anonymous No.12318803]

>>12318747
>>Small business bankruptcy is only temporary
That's not what I said. Learn to read.

[Anonymous No.12318805]

>>12317892
Can you link a study so I can spread it when people are "duh flu disappeared because distancing and masks"
Like...why wouldn't coronachan also do the same then

[Anonymous No.12318812]

>>12318769
>sweaty
I honestly don't know at this point if that spelling has become a meme, or if people really don't know how to spell the word.

[Anonymous No.12318819]

>>12318805
>Like...why wouldn't coronachan also do the same then
Because it's a hell of a lot more contagious?

[Anonymous No.12318823]

>>12318793
A real lockdown has never been tried

[Anonymous No.12318829]

>>12317834
We have long passed the point when it would actually do anything. A lockdown should have taken place seven or so months ago, that is when it would have actually done anything. Now it would only serve to infringe on people's human rights and be an abuse of emergency powers because it would do fuck-all to stop it from spreading.

[Anonymous No.12318836]

>>12318762
>no objective testing
I'd love to know what you recommend. Without baseline measures, how do you expect to measure lung capacity, cough rate, fatigue, and loss of smell?

[Anonymous No.12318843]

>>12318823
Asia. And it worked.

[Anonymous No.12318848]

>>12318823
Thank you for making me enlightened.
I now understand the mechanisms of these threads. The CO in covid actually stands for COMMUNISM and the argument is purely ideological. And the common theme is that the final solution to the CO-problem isn't printed on a paper.

[Anonymous No.12318860]

>>12318843
Maybe they're just not as genetically predisposed to the bad outcomes as euros are

[Anonymous No.12318863]

>>12318843
Interesting to note that you don't mention which part of Asia. Is there any particular reason for that?

[Anonymous No.12318874]

>>12318863
Yes, because multiple countries in Asia had a strict lockdown.
>>12318860
They're more predisposed, since ACE2 receptors are more abundant in Asians.

[Anonymous No.12318888]

>>12318874
>Yes, because multiple countries in Asia had a strict lockdown.
Such as China?

[Anonymous No.12318950]

>>12318888
Yes, such as China. What's your point?

[Anonymous No.12319007]

>>12318874
Even India's death rate is lower than Germany's. 1.6% vs 3-4%. Maybe they're genetically different, you know? They sure as hell aren't intubating people left and right.

[Anonymous No.12319020]

>>12319007
>Maybe they're genetically different, you know?
Yeah that's what I said.
I wouldn't consider Indians to be Asians. They're kinda their own kind.

[Anonymous No.12319032]

>>12319007
It's 2% vs 3%. That's quite literally the same rate statistically speaking.

[Anonymous No.12319043]

>>12319032
>That's quite literally the same rate statistically speaking.
Touching up the numbers is ok when yuros do it :)

[Anonymous No.12319084]

>>12319007
We have no idea what India's death rate really is.

[Anonymous No.12319139]

>>12319084
Because "Pajeets" can't be better than you at anything you do, right?

[Anonymous No.12319160]

>>12318112
https://youtu.be/6IRDOjziESc
https://youtu.be/BteadcgQod0

[Anonymous No.12319169]

>>12318793
We had a "real" lockdown in Austria, Germany and France. Stop talking about things you know nothing about, we blasted away billions for this scam only to get another one now. And we'll have another one in spring and then another and another one just until people are finally content with being prisoners without rights. Eat at home, sleep at home, work at home, die at home welcome to the new world.

[Anonymous No.12319195]

>>12319139
No, because India can't even track all of the deaths in the country, much less deaths from a specific cause. They've already admitted it will likely take several years to gather all of that data. Plus they're massively under testing.

[Anonymous No.12319202]

>>12319195
Death rate refers to cases that are recorded from the beginning to the end. It has nothing to do with the retarded way euros were sticking a cotton swab into everyone's noses (what do they hope to achieve by doing that? only makes sense to a german).

[Anonymous No.12319207]

>>12319202
>Death rate refers to cases that are recorded from the beginning to the end.
And India isn't doing that.

[Anonymous No.12319212]

>>12319169
>We had a "real" lockdown in Austria, Germany and France.
I'm German and you're a fucking liar.
>Eat at home, sleep at home, work at home, die at home welcome to the new world.
That would be a lockdown. Nothing like this happened. Home office where possible, nothing else you fucking idiot.

[Anonymous No.12319216]

>>12319202
I'm beginning to think you are literally IRL retarded.

[Anonymous No.12319230]

>>12319169
And don't forget the mandatory COVID tests. In Germany if you are told by the government to do one, you either accept or you pay a fine of up to $30,000. If you are coming from an area they consider high risk, you are expected to do one. If they don't ask you to do a test upon entering, you can do it within ten days of entering, but if they ask if you want to do one at the airport: either you accept or you hand over 30 grand. And the interesting part is that they label countries with lower rates of infected than them to ALSO count as high risk.
Of course, they won't close the border or even bother inspecting anyone coming in, what kind of a sick and demented tyrant are you to impose such draconian restrictions on people? But they will fine you into bankrupcy in these prosperous times of great financial and political stability.

[Anonymous No.12319232]

>>12319207
>And India isn't doing that.
And how can anyone know you're doing it? You thought that it was going to be 2 weeks of "lockdown" and it would all be over, just like that.

[Anonymous No.12319255]

>>12319232
>And how can anyone know you're doing it?
Because there's actual death certificates for the dead!?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-52435463
>Some 10 million people die in India every year. The Million Death Study found that some deaths were underestimated (India had only 100,000 premature HIV deaths in 2005, about a quarter of the total estimated by WHO) and some were overestimated (five times as many malaria deaths as the WHO had estimated.) Also, according to the government's own admission, only 22% of deaths in India are medically certified.

>Around 80% of deaths in India still happen at home, including deaths from infections like malaria and pneumonia. Maternal deaths, and deaths from sudden coronary attacks and accidents are more often reported from hospitals. "A lot of people get some medical attention over time, return and die at home in India," says Dr Jha.

>Trying to get a count from funerals at crematoria and burial grounds would be equally tricky. Many of India's dead are cremated in the open in large swathes of the countryside. Funeral services cater only to a small sliver of the population.

https://science.thewire.in/health/covid-19-mortality-india-civil-registration-deaths/
>In countries like India, where death registration itself is incomplete and where most deaths are not assigned a cause of death by a trained medical professional, the CFR is very unreliable. Although it has improved, one in five deaths in India in 2017 was not registered in any kind of vital statistics database. Deaths where a cause was identified were an even smaller fraction of total deaths – less than one out of five.

How can you possibly believe India has any clue what the true death toll from COVID-19 is when they can't even keep track of who actually died?

[Anonymous No.12319261]

>>12319230
>either you accept or you hand over 30 grand
And by this I mean immediately accept or hand it over. It's not like the other option where they give you ten days to do whatever on your own. If they offer you a test then they will immediately enact this punishment upon refusal.

[Anonymous No.12319502]

>>12319230
>the interesting part is that they label countries with lower rates of infected than them to ALSO count as high risk
How is that interesting? Other countries can be high risk when you yourself are also high risk.
In accordance with the rest of your post, I'll conclude you're a massive brainlet.

[Anonymous No.12319542]

>>12319502
Those countries having a rate lower than yours would mean that them entering the country would make no difference whatsoever. Pouring a solution of lower concentration into the same solution but of higher concentration can only result in a reduction in the concentration of the latter. It's not like someone has some magic loophole if you were to allow it: once they have entered the area of higher risk, it goes without saying that going back to the lower one would be them carrying this heightened risk back to their country. If someone arrives by airplane, it's pretty obvious that they could only have come from whereever the plane was last.
>"b-but you can ALSO be high risk"
Well yeah, if you endlessly spend resources trying to do a dick measuring contest over how many more tests you do than everyone else instead of actually doing something, it is no surprise that the rates are higher than of the other country.

[Anonymous No.12319588]

>>12319212
Und jetzt bitte schön weiter Drostens Schwanz lutschen.

https://www.bundesregierung.de/breg-de/themen/coronavirus/besprechung-der-bundeskanzlerin-mit-den-regierungschefinnen-und-regierungschefs-der-laender-1733248

https://www.ris.bka.gv.at/Dokumente/BgblAuth/BGBLA_2020_II_98/BGBLA_2020_II_98.pdfsig

[Anonymous No.12319606]

>>12319230
>>12319261
You are right, that is an insane policy.
and by insane I mean insanely light and weak
I would just imprison anyone who refused to take a test in an isolation cell for 2 weeks.

[Anonymous No.12319630]

>>12319606
>"a-a-a-and if I w-was president, I-I would p-put aaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllllll the bad people in jail so they do not h-hurt people"
I'm proud of you, son. You did what noone else had the courage to do.

[Anonymous No.12319643]

>>12319630
And that's why the Asian countries have almost 0 corona now, while the West will be stuck with this shit and its fallout for at least a decade (only increasing our decay and collapse).

Our blind worship of The Individual Human And His Rights has doomed us

[Anonymous No.12319664]

>>12317834
Its ova now thankx to the WHO and there hard work.

[Anonymous No.12320606]

>>12317834
Somewhat legitimate but mostly political

[Anonymous No.12320915]

It helps, but that's not the reason why they're telling us to do it.

[Anonymous No.12320920]

>>12319643
back 2 the plebbit

[Anonymous No.12320924]

>>12319643
this is how institutions corral you into an identity that they define for you lmao
u have 2 unplug bro

[Anonymous No.12320947]

>>12319542
>them entering the country would make no difference whatsoever
Of course it makes a difference. First, every source of infection worsens the spread. Second, new strains are imported.
>Pouring a solution of lower concentration into the same solution but of higher concentration can only result in a reduction in the concentration of the latter
You have absolutely zero understanding of exponential growth. This comparison is unbelievably wrong.
>>"b-but you can ALSO be high risk"
>b-but
Oh God I'm speaking to a retard here.

[Anonymous No.12320958]

>>12319588
>Der Weg zur Arbeit, zur Notbetreuung, Einkäufe, Arztbesuche, Teilnahme an Sitzungen, erforderlichen Terminen und Prüfungen, Hilfe für andere oder individueller Sport und Bewegung an der frischen Luft sowie andere notwendige Tätigkeiten bleiben selbstverständlich weiter möglich.
Thanks for proving me right, I guess. Is this retardation running in your family, or are you just a special talent in that regard?

[Anonymous No.12320970]

>>12319643
I'm with you, but this has nothing to do with
>blind worship of the individual human
You sound like a commy.

[Anonymous No.12320982]

>>12320970
pay attention to how many times you hear these words put together "rugged individualism" and you will know right away who is parroting a script

[Anonymous No.12321100]

huh op you make a good point please do tell me more

[Anonymous No.12321887]

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