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/sci/ - Science & Math

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12177212 No.12177212 [Reply] [Original]

>every economics major says the entire undergraduate degree is useless outside of econometrics and game theory
>actual irl PhDs say that the only value of economics degrees to employers is in the statistics knowledge from econometrics
>the second year economics classes are carbon copies of the first year classes but with uni-variate calculus
>the value of econometrics is solely that it utilizes linear algebra and visualizing data with R
>employers don't care about any of the actual economic theory and you may as well choose statistics classes instead of economics

>> No.12177248

>>12177212
All theory is useless in industry it seems.only hard skillsets matter now

>> No.12177314

>>12177248
This. I was planning on majoring in finance, but it had too much theoretical shit, so I transferred over to Information Systems (same business college), and it has been far better for future job prospects because anything with a technical skillset is more in-demand than ever

>> No.12177550
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12177550

At least you can study economics
>was weak in math in freshman year so I went for an LLB instead thinking I could just switch later
>now looking to apply to econ master's programs or even finance
>the mathematics requirements will most likely get my application sent straight to the trash
>tfw I'm genuinely more interested in econ and can't see myself in a law career

>> No.12177553

>>12177248
>only hard skillsets
Like what?

>> No.12177574

>>12177550
Isn't that you being dumb though? Think you've only your self to blame

>> No.12177579

>>12177574
Yeah I'm a fucking retard but I'm deploring the fact that fucking up as a freshman means I'm now forced to follow a path that I don't care for.

>> No.12177602

>>12177579
You can always change to do what you want to do. It may seem like a wasted year now but look at it in the context of a 40 year career and it doesn't seem that bad.

>> No.12177606

>>12177602
I'm in my third year and already pretty old for a college student, I think I should just go with it at this point.

>> No.12177613

>>12177606
I dropped a chem engg degree after 3 years to switch to comp sci so I know the sitch. Life's too short to not do what you want and unless you wanna be super wealthy then a few wasted years isn't the worst thing in the world. Studying is more fun than working anyways. Unless you're in America and crippled by student loans in which case good luck.

>> No.12177618

>>12177613
At some point even academia starts asking what the fuck you're doing when you keep switching fields, doesn't that hurt your grad school prospects anyway?

>> No.12177620

>>12177553

Knowing any programming language, having knowledge of how databases work and being able to use (simple) SQL queries, basic API knowledge (JSON), etc.

These are "hard" skillsets that will make you stand out as a finance major in industry jobs. Especially when one of the programming languages is Python.

Nobody is interested in some economic masturbation model from some obscure professor which only "works" in ideal situation which never happens in the real world.

>> No.12177623

>>12177618
Switching once really isn't that big a deal and pretty sure uni's are money grubbing whores at this point that will let you do whatever if your grades are decent. At least here in Aus anyway can't speak to elsewhere.

>> No.12177625

>>12177623
European universities being free, they'll end up telling you to fuck off since if you just keep studying you're just wasting time and money.

>> No.12177629

>>12177625
Makes sense. Here the government just pays your fees straight to the university then you have to pay the government back once you start making a certain salary. That's why the unis try and cram in as many people as possible at the expense of their academic standards. They've recently changed it though to start limiting the loans to students that are failing multiple times though lol.

>> No.12177637

>>12177212
>economic theory
pick one

>> No.12178469

>>12177620
Similarly no one gives a fuck about what you can cheat your way out of programming using python. They much prefer someone who knows how to actually program than someone who quite literally spams libraries all day.

>> No.12178478

>>12177613
This. Except you can still make good money if you invest smart and are good at what you do.

>> No.12178605

>>12177212
I dropped my microeconomics class as soon as I learned this. they literally have trouble saying it isn't useless. It's pathetic.

>> No.12178726

>>12178469

You need to actually learn Python and not "cheat your way out" whatever the fuck that means. So basically not do what you would do.

>> No.12178738

>>12178726
> need to actually learn python

So not actually programming. Well done mate

>> No.12178771

>>12177212
All of this is true
t. Econ
The public sector cares but private not so much, if privates employed more economists lots of pain could be avoided
Look to LTCM for an example
>hire brilliant mathematicians to run an investment fund, it performs beautifully
>they fail to realize their own (well understood) cognitive biases
>it goes down in flames
The greatest value it offers is to the individual who studies it, to help you make better decisions, plan your finances sensibly, and because it's plain interesting
>but can't you do this with math/stats?
Yes but you'll need to teach yourself the applications
>>12177314
Finance is applied economics but actually

>> No.12178821

>>12178771
>to help you make better decisions, plan your finances sensibly,
You needed Econ to teach you common sense?

>> No.12178840

>>12178771
Well, if the mathematics is what makes it useful in the first place then you may as well choose mathematics and read an economics textbook on your own time and list that as a skill or knowledge on a resume.

>> No.12178841

>>12178821
Actually the opposite. Most econ majors are worse at predicting financial events than the lay public. THis is true for:
Predicting recessions
predicting stock outcomes
predicting national debt

so yeah, if you want common sense dont get Econ degree.

>> No.12179036

>>12178841
sure lmao

>> No.12179049

>>12179036
There are studies showing
>>12178841. Economists when asked elementary questions do not agree with each other AND are correct less often than the people who do not learn economics at all. It's insane. It's not a joke.

>> No.12179072

>>12177212
This is all true. Math and stats undergrads mog econ/fin PhDs. This is because economists chose to value mathematics more than anything in their own discipline.
The obvious consequence is that econ/fin degrees are not useless, but always less useful than math and stats undergrads.
Even economists know this. To get into good econ PhDs you need to have a math degree basically and zero econ classes. I'm not joking.

Economics is the single field in the most evident existential crisis, where having a degree at any level up to PhD is a just seen as a statement of inferiority towards any retard who manages to finish a math degree with mediocre grades.

t. econ/fin degrees, found out too late they are not only useless, but all the useful knowledge I gained came from other disciplines, in which I would have better majored to get a job in banks or whatever.

fuck my life but most importantly fuck all econ/depts. They should be burned to the ground. Economics/fin should become just a specialization choice in math PhDs.

>> No.12179077

>>12179036
t. economist
Should've learned the concept of opportunity cost before choosing econ so you could've gone into another field lol

>> No.12179097

>>12179072
>but all the useful knowledge I gained came from other disciplines, in which I would have better majored to get a job in banks or whatever
Basically maths? What would you suggest to a pharma fag trying get into finance? Get a maths bachelor or...?

>> No.12179104

The most valuable economic knowledge is to invest in the s&p 500 index.

>> No.12179107

>>12179104
lel

>> No.12179113

>>12179097
It depends.

If you want a Patrick Bateman job (anything IB, markets whatever, the highest paid) you need connections and high charisma + extraversion and an MBA in whatever, so zero technical knowledge except for basic accounting tricks. Middle school math. Get your personality evaluated thoroughly: there is zero room for intraversion in these roles. Mind these are requirements bigger than a degree.

If you want to get into academic financial economics, quant things, trading, get a math bachelor then a math masters with maybe one finance elective and you'll be top 1% of applicants for any role or PhD.

Please value this advice. I would have paid with my soul to know these things when applying to college in high school.

>> No.12179122

>>12179107
Vanguard and Fidelity s&p 500 index funds are the ones to invest into. You can basically put money into those every month and not look into them for 30 years and you'll be pretty wealthy (assuming an asteroid or super volcano doesn't hit America or other economic centres).

>> No.12179148

>>12179113
Note taken friend, thank you!
> connections and high charisma + extraversion
You unknowingly destroyed me in one phrase, kek

>> No.12179157

>>12179113
>>12179148
How is it that only charisma and extraversion are required in these positions? Wouldnt technical knowledge be more sound for making these high risk decisions?

>> No.12179216

>>12179157
Investment banking and markets roles that are not quant are basically glorified very high pressure sales jobs. This is a dire truth NO ONE is willing to admit. An elephant in the room. The technical knowledge you need is accounting basics that anyone barely smart can learn in 2-3 months. Any other 'technical' knowledge is taught on the job.

The unwillingness of these people to state the truth lead to pathological states in which connections and shiny MBAs or certifications become somehow required to signal your status. The truth is however evident when, for example, the cute girl from Oxbridge who majored in History gets into GS IB desks moving hundreds of millions. A classic.

Sales jobs are client centric and dependent on personality + charisma and even looks. This is then true for IB and markets roles. You are successful if you can sell and can talk to the client and squeeze out their money from them. Human psychology.

>> No.12179272

>>12179216
>the cute girl from Oxbridge who majored in History gets into GS IB desks moving hundreds of millions. A classic.
On this topic, I did a little research on linkedin one day trying to see the requirements to work in IB, I shit you not it was like they only hired hot girls in their 20s. Of course i am exaggerating a bit but is this a recurrent phenomenon or was it just me focusing only on those girls? How can these hotties get those jobs? pol taught me men were smarter kek

>> No.12179287

>>12179272
>Sales jobs are client centric and dependent on personality + charisma and even looks
Here is your answer. It's not your imagination. They really only get hotties, because clients love hotties.

>> No.12179557

>>12177212
>>12177637
>>12178605
>>12178771
>>12178821
>>12178840
>>12178841
>>12179049
>>12179072
>>12179077
>>12179113
>>12179216
>>12179287
Even a first-year microeconomics class is not useful? Surely you can apply it to your life.

>> No.12179963

>>12179272
You must be retarded. Any job in finance that has sales will be stacked with bimbos and guys who played sports or look athletic. This is true at all levels. I work for a low finance company and this is true. I imagine the only difference is that at places like GS they went to Harvard and not University of Indiana.

>> No.12180131

>>12177212
Economics is a way for political hacks to “prove” their shitty ideas

>> No.12180601

>>12179557
*crickets*

>> No.12180806

>>12178821
You must have been asleep in 2009?
>>12178841
And you as well

>> No.12180816

>>12180601
You replied to me for some reason even though I actually said economics was very useful. There is a reason why you need a basic econ course to graduate american high schools now.
Econ is just this board's favorite punching bag, every board has one, on /g/ it's iphones and /pol/ it's leftists.

>> No.12180872

>>12180816
I assume you are >>12178771. Could you elaborate?

>> No.12180885

>>12180816
Principles of economics courses don't even use mathematics. How could it be useful? It's not(especially macroeconomics).