Are IQ differences between white and black people caused by genetics or environmental conditions?

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Anonymous Wed Sep 23 09:31:38 2020 No.12152195 [Reply] [Original]

Are IQ differences between white and black people caused by genetics or environmental conditions?

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 09:34:49 2020 No.12152203 >>12152195 What's the general consensus among neuroscientists?

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 09:41:35 2020 No.12152216 File: 893 KB, 1012x970, 1596425915327.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12152195 >evolution is real >but it it resulted in no cognitive differences only physical ones

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 10:30:38 2020 No.12152312 >>12152195 Genetics are environmental conditions though. Imagine being a 200IQ autist and having to grow up around genetic niggers.

Anonymous Wed Sep 23 10:44:51 2020 No.12152356
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IQ is a meme. If I took an IQ test every day for a week I'd end up testing for 300 IQ, not because I would have become a genius but because I would have gotten better at the specific skills that are measured by IQ tests. They are not a measure of actual intelligence in any way.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 10:48:18 2020 No.12152367 >>12152356 >If I took an IQ test every day for a week I'd end up testing for 300 IQ No.

Anonymous Wed Sep 23 10:50:25 2020 No.12152371

>>12152356
>but because I would have gotten better at the specific skills that are measured by IQ tests
Spoken like a true moron.
There's a whole part of the test dedicated solely to seeing how you can adapt to problems you won't have done before. By taking the IQ test repeatedly, all you're doing is removing its ability to measure this, so your score goes up, but it's solely due to you intentionally destroying the integrity of the test.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 10:52:10 2020 No.12152379 File: 16 KB, 500x322, Pepe disgusted.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12152195 >Another IQ race thread.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 10:53:42 2020 No.12152388 >>12152371 There are other ways of getting better at those skills, though. The point I'm trying to make is that IQ isn't a measure of intelligence. It's a meme. It never had any integrity.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 10:55:04 2020 No.12152391 >>12152388 You're not making a point though, because it's a blatant misunderstanding of how IQ tests operate. I know this is repeated a lot on r*ddit and pop culture, but the test is a very good measure of intelligence for almost all people.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 10:57:27 2020 No.12152398 both /thread

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 10:58:46 2020 No.12152402 >>12152356 Yes, but only because you'd get a 300 IQ by adding all of your seven scores together.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 11:37:44 2020 No.12152496 >>12152195 both

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 11:56:35 2020 No.12152546 File: 243 KB, 570x587, LK8tOJC[1].png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12152195 Genetics (mostly)

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 12:06:24 2020 No.12152568 >>12152356 Based dunning-kreuger retard

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 18:08:59 2020 No.12153816 >>12152195 Evolution and genetics doesn't stop at the neck. >>12152203 They are not allowed to talk about it in public for fear of being cancelled. (IOW it's mostly genetic).

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 18:14:28 2020 No.12153843 Mostly genetics, but a little bit of environmental influence. Great thread btw, thanks for sharing your thoughts with us anon!

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 23 19:32:05 2020 No.12154177 >>12152195 Both.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 04:34:54 2020 No.12155416 >>12152195 Mostly genetics.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 04:41:12 2020 No.12155428

>>12152203
>>12153816
>They are not allowed to talk about it in public for fear of being cancelled
this
IQ is, to nobody's surprise, heavily genetic. Which is not to say that other factors aren't important, since nutrition and the like are obviously critical too. But IQ is very hereditary.
There's a weird attitude about it if you speak about this in the department, where everyone knows it, everyone agrees with the arguments made to support this conclusion as long as you don't name the IQ demon, but not many people want to say so too loudly. Most people like to ignore it or pretend it's unresolved, or that the problem just doesn't exist at all.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 04:42:51 2020 No.12155436
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>>12152203
It's all over the place. Overwhelming majority thinks it is genetic but there is no clear consensus on how much. The median estimate is 50%.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160289619301886

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 04:43:54 2020 No.12155439 >>12152379 I know, better post your pasta again.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 04:50:11 2020 No.12155452 >>12155436 >those peaks at 0% and 50% Those are uneducated guesses.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 04:55:30 2020 No.12155463

>>12155428
Purely socio-economic factors
No matter what you say and what graphs you link. Forever and ever socio-economic factors.

>>12155436
No. The overwhelming majority thinks its socio-economic factors and if they spout your neo nazi bullshit they will get fired. Remember what we did to watson.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 05:20:44 2020 No.12155509 >>12155463 Pretty sure you’re allowed to acknowledge the heritability of IQ so long as you treat the scores as practically meaningless. What function do IQ tests serve aside from diagnosing intellectual disabilities, anyway?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 05:24:35 2020 No.12155514 >>12155509 >What function do IQ tests serve aside from diagnosing intellectual disabilities, anyway? Starting a race war

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 05:58:03 2020 No.12155549

>>12155452
That brutal fall-off between 0 and 10 reveals that there is a large group of people that answer 0 driven by ideology and not hard data. How blind do you have to be to see NO influence of genetics on an IQ gap?

Conversely, the 80% position has some build-up to it, meaning the specific amount is a matter of debate amongst the community.

50% is the large majority that don't want to get in trouble and state a publicy acceptable number that is easy to remember, memeable in other words.

I'd be curious about the results of these ratings if they were given in private or anonymously.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 05:59:36 2020 No.12155551 >>12155509 IQ is one of the best predictors of life outcomes we have. I recall that even the army makes use of IQ tests to determine who to train as a tank gunner.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 06:02:28 2020 No.12155557 >>12152402 Kekw

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 06:10:40 2020 No.12155567

>>12155551
Are you sure it’s IQ score and not some IQ-like measurement of aptitude? Like, we know US police officers are meant to fall within a particular range of IQ; but their future is determined at the academy, not by a psychologist. It’s too soon to say for sure that intellectual capacity and IQ are fundamentally linked. There are obvious correlations, but the full story is still emerging. We’re just not there yet.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 06:34:53 2020 No.12155604

>>12155567
>Are you sure it’s IQ score and not some IQ-like measurement of aptitude?
Maybe, but IQ scores have a strong enough correlation to whatever the actual cause is, that IQ is a useful indicator.
Or otherwise we could expect to see a lot more noise in IQ distributions and test results. Yet IQ and say SAT scores line up pretty well.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 06:37:06 2020 No.12155607 >>12152195 absolutely genetic

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 06:38:23 2020 No.12155611

>>12152203
well, scientists can hardly agree on anything that controversial.

Do you know what a goddamned slog it was just to get the general consensus of 'tobacco use correlates with cancer' into the mainstream? That took fucking half a century WITH the governments of the world pushing it.

>>	NateHiggers Thu Sep 24 06:38:45 2020 No.12155612 >>12152379 Found the dumb negro

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 07:03:15 2020 No.12155637

>>12155611
>Governments of the world
...Excluding the US. Its rampant corporatism is what allowed the tobacco industry to run ads directly contradicting then-modern science. The government could have cracked down on them with little effort. Really makes you think.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 07:06:28 2020 No.12155640 As we know, IQ is dependent on both genetic and environmental factors, so it depends on both. Which of these factors is dominant is a different question altogether, and a quite difficult one

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 07:11:01 2020 No.12155649 >>12155640 One is stronger than the other!

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 07:15:19 2020 No.12155654

>>12155604
Not denying any of that, just pointing out that this whole debate might not be worth having, because IQ tests are only useful in uncommon circumstances. IQ is a very reliable metric, but the scope of its reliability is not known. I’m willing to bet there are aspects of intelligence not accounted for in IQ measurements.

Mike Tyson in his prime would likely end up squarely in the double-digit range, but he was still considered a genius by those who fought him. Not proof of anything, of course; but more research into these exotic forms of intelligence would help us understand the limitations of an IQ measurement’s applicability.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 07:18:22 2020 No.12155659 >>12155640 We know that dumb parents don’t end up with intellectually gifted children. Considering giftedness is unequivocally tied to IQ, there’s a logical conclusion to be drawn...

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 07:49:50 2020 No.12155712

>>12155654
Of course the debate is worth having. IQ isn't a perfect measure, nobody denies that. Yet it is still very useful in predicting certain outcomes. Those predictions can always be wrong on the individual level, but can be meaningful on the scale of populations.

Let's say IQ tests are only 30% accurate in predicting whether a specific person will succeed in studying physics. That's not good enough on an individual level, but when every applicant gets screened via IQ, that 30% increases the accuracy of the selection process by a large margin.

If we knew how much of the IQ gap is caused by genetics, we could better allocate resources to where the environment plays a big role or discuss means by which to overcome genetics or find another purpose for those that score low that plays to their strengths.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:02:43 2020 No.12155744 >>12155712 So are you advocating that people be provided paths in life based on IQ scores? Sounds a little dystopian ngl.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:08:19 2020 No.12155756 >>12155659 But that does happen sometimes though.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:11:34 2020 No.12155762 >>12155654 >hasn't read any literature on IQ >regurgitating 'problems' identified and dealth with in the 1940s this is the problem with /sci

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:15:57 2020 No.12155772 >>12155762 Mind elaborating on that?

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:19:59 2020 No.12155783

>>12155744
We're already doing that, though. A lot of schools and universities require something like an IQ test to enter. There simply are jobs and fields that are extremely difficult to enter if one does not score high enough in these kind of tests.
We need to become aware of genetic causes of performance differences and consider them when enacting policies. And we don't have to deny anyone a chance at any path in life. On an individual level, IQ scores can be useless, but we need to talk about populations.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:21:27 2020 No.12155789 >>12152195 both but the right will say it's just the former and the left will say it's just the latter >I filled out a captcha for this

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:25:00 2020 No.12155796 >>12155783 >Like an IQ test But not an IQ test - an aptitude test. IQ is correlated with aptitude in many areas, and aptitude in some areas requires high intelligence. This does not mean IQ and intelligence are one and the same.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:25:43 2020 No.12155801 File: 859 KB, 2970x2483, race-myths.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12152195

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:26:46 2020 No.12155803

>>12155744
The dystopian aspect is not worth thinking about since IQ and academic or economic achievement are already linked. So if it is a dystopia then we live in a dystopia eight now already and deciding based on IQ would just make it transparent.
No the reason to not decide based on IQ would be that it would make iq and life achievement studies self-fulfilling prophecies

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:26:48 2020 No.12155804 >>12152195 Combination of both.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:28:49 2020 No.12155811 >>12155803 I was replying under the premise that IQ scores are indeed purely genetic and interchangeable with intelligence. Some people like to do things they suck at, and should be allowed as long as they’re not putting anyone else in danger.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:32:21 2020 No.12155821

>>12155796
And? If you want to join a boxing school, you won't be tested on your math skills. If you want to become a physicist, nobody will test how many push-ups you can do. IQ tests don't have to test for every aptitude a person might have, just those that require the kind of cognitive talents that make you good at IQ tests. An indicator of future performance in intellectual fields can limit itself to intellectual tasks.

Also, there are simply some tasks that predict better the performance in other fields than other tasks. If you have X number of children and you have only two of their grades, maths and English, you can more precisely predict overall school grades by going by math scores than English scores.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 08:53:43 2020 No.12155856

>>12155821
>And?
And... nothing. I agree IQ tests are reliable and should occasionally be taken seriously. I just don’t think IQ can conclusively determine intelligence by any definition other than the one in the phrase “intelligence quotient”. Specialized aptitude tests provide more-precise information and are much easier to administer, so IQ tests per se aren’t particularly useful either. I also do believe IQ is genetically heritable, in case that wasn’t clear.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 09:01:32 2020 No.12155867 >>12155821 >If you want to become a physicist, nobody will test how many push-ups you can do. They should. Weak men are trash in any field.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 09:03:48 2020 No.12155872 >>12152195 100% nurture. stop listening to /pol/

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 09:05:44 2020 No.12155875 >>12155611 And still the average smoker believes it is conspiracy. Their reasoning? >most smokers don't get lung cancer >non-smokers can get it too

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 09:07:34 2020 No.12155881 >>12155637 anyone seen the movie "thank you for smoking?". >the marlboro man dying of cancer i think the movie was pretty hilarious.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 09:10:34 2020 No.12155889 >>12155872 I mean, practically every human characteristic has some degree of heritability. It's a bit disingenuous to say that IQ is completely unrelated to genetics.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 09:13:34 2020 No.12155901 >>12155889 But being able to learn stuff is not an intrinsic human characteristic unlike the skin color etc.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 09:15:16 2020 No.12155906

>>12155872
Is the fact that blacks are generally taller than Asians 100% nurture as well?
Keep in mind this holds true even for impoverished blacks and wealthy Asians.
How nice that evolution stopped working from the shoulders up. That would be racist.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 09:18:27 2020 No.12155917 >>12155901 Yes, the capability is intrinsic, but the differences in proficiency of learning is what is usually referred to as intelligence. That is determined both by genetic and environmental factors.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 10:13:49 2020 No.12156016

>>12155654
>this whole debate might not be worth having

The consequences of not having this debate are quite serious. (see below)

>>12155744
>So are you advocating that people be provided paths in life based on IQ scores? Sounds a little dystopian ngl.

You never find professors in STEM with double digit IQs. Yet universities are punishing themselves for failing to find Black candidates and are damaging academia by putting ethnic considerations ahead of academic considerations. This is well known but can't be spoken of, so long as universities remain under the iron grip of a tyrannical ideology which brutally punishes any it sees as heretical.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 10:59:48 2020 No.12156104 >>12155901 >being able to learn stuff is not an intrinsic human characteristic Yes, it is. Humans are by nature capable to learn, the degree of that varies from individual to individual like any other characteristic.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 11:06:11 2020 No.12156114 >>12152195 both and it's difficult to measure how much is from genetics and how much from environment, because there is no objective measure for intelligence

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 11:06:51 2020 No.12156117

>>12152195
>genetics or environmental conditions?
those two are tightly related. one can say that during and post renaissance european civ selected for intelligence while african civs just started doing that the last 50 years or so. a good part of it is genetic but not necessarily that skin color IS thee determining factor behind intelligence.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 11:07:55 2020 No.12156122 >>12155901 >being able to learn stuff is not an intrinsic human characteristic lol what?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 11:09:17 2020 No.12156125 >>12156114 >there is no objective measure for intelligence You can measure the difference between two groups in subjective categories perfectly fine as long as the definition of the categorie is the same in both groups.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 11:11:31 2020 No.12156136

>>12156125
yes but since all humans share genetics to a degree it becomes very difficult to relate them to intelligence, especially when epigenetics is a thing
if we had some sort of objective measure for intelligence we could then directly link increases or decreases to intelligence to specific genetics, right now it's mostly estimations, which makes it difficult to determine the specifics

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 11:16:56 2020 No.12156149 there's some interesting research regarding siblings and IQ tests typically first born has higher IQ as parents spend more time reading and engaging with them from a young age so there's definitely an environmental effect on IQ

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 11:19:19 2020 No.12156158

>>12156136
Sorry, but an objective definition for intelligence is not at all necessary to decide how much of racial gabs in IQ scores are down to genetics or environment.
We only need an objective definition to measure IQ, which we have. Well, to a very high degree of precision, since we are talking about the result of biological functions here. We can then compare the genetics and environment with the test results and find out quite well from the aggregate of tests and studies how much of an IQ gab is most likely genetic. That's because IQ is a human category and can naturally exclude things that can't be easily measured with IQ tests. Doesn't mean the IQ gabs are nonexistant.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 11:20:56 2020 No.12156160 >>12156158 From the predictive validity IQ scores have on all kinds of things, we can then make a very good estimate to how precise IQ scores inform us about intelligence.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 11:21:01 2020 No.12156161 >>12156158 >Doesn't mean the IQ gabs are nonexistant did i say that?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 11:22:59 2020 No.12156171 >>12156161 You definitely implied that we can't really measure gabs in intelligence. But IQ correlates very closely with intelligence.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 12:58:38 2020 No.12156492 File: 512 KB, 828x832, image0-3__01.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12152216 If one black person is smarter than any white person it btfos all /pol/ fags

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 13:01:32 2020 No.12156502 File: 209 KB, 760x596, kibble.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12156492 If one Japanese man is taller than any black it btfos the NBA.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 13:05:19 2020 No.12156521 File: 49 KB, 500x603, 1596075050809.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12156502 I agree

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 13:07:09 2020 No.12156525 File: 746 KB, 3000x2000, I agree.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12156502

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 13:22:39 2020 No.12156567

>>12152203
>neuroscience
neuroscience doesn't accept a non physiological explanation for intelligence but it doesn't deny it. that's literally the difference between psychology and neuroscience. psychology keeps to psyche and the mind, neuroscience tries to explains these things with biology and chemistry etc.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 14:02:46 2020 No.12156680 They gave a gorilla 85 IQ but I still feel a third worlder can do arithmetic at a higher level even if the other IQ of that nation is in the 80s.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 14:05:48 2020 No.12156692 >>12152312 retard, short of severe malnutrition/trauma you would still grow up to be 200IQ,

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 14:13:25 2020 No.12156717 >>12156692 Both of those are not unlikely amongst nigger countries.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 14:48:06 2020 No.12156848 >>12156717 Not in the US though, so why is average African American intelligence so low?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 15:38:58 2020 No.12156995 >>12156848 Ahem Both of those are not unlikely amongst nigger hoods. Why? Because their low genetic IQ means their environmont also sucks. Parenting also benefits from high IQ.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 15:52:23 2020 No.12157032 >>12156848 A tendency to be born next to polluted blue collar environments, a tendency to have more 7/11s than Whole Foods in the community, and lead in the water.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 15:59:19 2020 No.12157055

>>12157032
The majority of working class whites also lived in those conditions once. Yet whites have managed to climb out of those harmful circumstances.

>more 7/11s than Whole Foods
If Whole Foods would sell well, the people would manage with what's available, too. It isn't difficult or pricey to have a good diet. It can be done on a shoestring budget, if one invests the mental effort to plan ahead and learn to cook with limited ingredients.

>lead in the water
I don't think that the lead concentration in US water anywhere is high enough to explain the kind of gabs we're seeing.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:25:33 2020 No.12157134 >>12156117 >post renaissance european civ selected for intelligence Pre renaissance too : during the middle ages nobility tended to have more children than peasants.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:27:34 2020 No.12157141 >>12156525 Chinese people aren't as small as koreans and japanese.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:41:21 2020 No.12157190 >>12155772 he won't, because >this is the problem with /sci

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:44:05 2020 No.12157199 >>12155901 well to homo SAPIENS it is :)

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:45:09 2020 No.12157204 >>12152195 both. that being said, is racism caused by genetics or environmental conditions?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:48:25 2020 No.12157214 >>12152195 Why limit it to IQ. All differences (and similarities) are partly genetic. If you didn't have genes you wouldn't have an organism. If the environments are the same, its all genetic. In america, the environments are very similar.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:52:14 2020 No.12157224 >>12152216 no one is saying that.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:54:11 2020 No.12157233 >>12157204 first one, then the other.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:55:25 2020 No.12157238 >>12157224 there are a shitload of people saying that. there are people who call doctors racists for matching ethnic donors to ethnic recipients and that's established science..

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:58:04 2020 No.12157247 >>12157141 that's because asians are historically short and slim due to their diets of rice and fish leading to deficiencies. they plump up and get taller when they grow up on western foods.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 16:59:29 2020 No.12157253 >>12157238 >there are a shitload of people saying that. are these people here with us?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:07:04 2020 No.12157288 >>12155872 >>12155901 >>12157253

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:11:07 2020 No.12157301 >>12157134 the nobility also tended to have family circles instead of family trees and they believed in all sorts of superstition

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:15:31 2020 No.12157311 >>12157247 Chinese people are taller than japanese because of western food?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:19:02 2020 No.12157320 >>12152216 that's a non argument.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:19:54 2020 No.12157322 >>12152195 They’re caused by the OP being a frog posting faggot.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:31:27 2020 No.12157353

>>12152216
>t. have zero knowledge about basic genetics
physical differences when you look at genes are just a superficial tiny shit. Humans are too close to each other genetically to have significant cognitive differences. And if there are any, blacks are probably slightly more intelligent for historical reasons. Because if you were white you could have been dumb and spread your genes relatively easy in agricultural society while in Africa, intelligence mattered to your survival more. White people also had more epidemics that were dabbing on people with no relation to their intelligence. But that said, those would've been small things anyway.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:32:35 2020 No.12157356 >>12157311 They eat a shitload of red meat, japs eat mostly fish and carbs.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:35:36 2020 No.12157360 File: 2.70 MB, 569x320, ethniccleansing.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12157301 Nothing has changed in that regard. Except maybe the rate of inbreeding. >>12157322 I need to post more frogs then.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:45:44 2020 No.12157381 >>12157353 Imagine being this assured of such a blatantly wrong opinion.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:53:46 2020 No.12157402 >>12157381 >YOU WRONG YOU WRONG YOU WRONG. YOU SO WRONG I CAN'T EVEN yikes

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:55:22 2020 No.12157406 >>12157381 I don't see your argument

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:56:04 2020 No.12157409 >>12157353 Right... that's why African's have the most advanced space and medical programs. Spot on Anon.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:56:47 2020 No.12157411

>>12155917
>referred to as intelligence
Intelligence is a subjective term. I am sure to the average /sci/ poster intelligence simply means the ability to solve IQ tests and be good at math lol.
Seriously though, different cultures mean different things by it. In many cultures it is mostly a social thing. It is about empathy, the ability to take on responsibility or even being successful in life. (Where success is also subjective). Think outside of STEM.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:57:27 2020 No.12157415

>>12157353
>Humans are too close to each other genetically to have significant cognitive differences.
False. Intelligence is likely dependant on thousands of genes. With how evolution of polygenic traits works, it's a given that a large amount of tiny changes amounts to a big difference in trait expression. We've already found hundreds of genes positively linked with cognitive ability whose rate of occurence varies between races.

>And if there are any, blacks are probably slightly more intelligent for historical reasons.
That's the opposite of what we're seeing in the world, though.

>Because if you were white you could have been dumb and spread your genes relatively easy in agricultural society while in Africa,
Agricultural society has been marked by increased population pressure and competition from outside tribes. People in agricultural societies had to fight and wage wars constantly just to keep their lands, not to mention the increased inner group competition. Furthermore, agricultural societies have a far larger amount of people that live by their cognitive abilities. Lawyers in Rome, architects, scribes, clerks, fine craftsmen, any and all job that was not directly involved with food production can qualify. These groups have been very succesful in breeding in agricultural societies.

If intelligence mattered more in Africa, then how come we don't see an increased intelligence amongst Africans? Colonialism? Then what about history? Where is their Athens, who was their Marc Aurel, where are their aqueducts?

>White people also had more epidemics that were dabbing on people with no relation to their intelligence.
Disease can also select for intelligence. There were a number of counter measures European societies instituted and attempted to deal with the plaque, for example. They ranged from isolation of the afflicted, flooding areas to block the spread of the disease to using vinegar in systems of trade to kill pathogens on coins.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 17:59:19 2020 No.12157422 >>12157415 Thats because you don't understand what intelligence means. To you autists it is all about IQ tests. To them, it is mostly social skills. Something that most posters here do not possess.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:01:12 2020 No.12157425

>>12157411
>intelligence is subjective
Yet the effects of "subjective" intelligence produce real world effects. If your people are more intelligent, they'll do better, given the same resources than less intelligent people. Don't assume that just because intelligence tests are not a perfect measure for individual success, that it isn't viable for large groups of people.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:05:26 2020 No.12157432

>>12157422
Ah, one post and you're already playing the definition game. I see.

You're wrong in any case, as intelligence is a general aptitude at cognitive tasks. Social skills are also influenced by intelligence, as well as artistic skills. To claim that people good at maths are bad at people skills is a cope that ignores the real world. The autists might stick out to you, but I guarantee you, high IQ people have also a higher chance to posess good people skills, while a lot of low IQ people are very bad with people.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:09:57 2020 No.12157441

>>12157432
>low IQ people are very bad with people.
Now you are talking straight of your ass, I see. Low IQ normies are the happiest bunch and they can interact with each other just fine. They make great politicians and all kinds of managers, etc. The definition of IQ has been made up by asocial autists. It is all relative.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:14:12 2020 No.12157452

>>12157409
non argument. There's plenty of factors that go into civilization development. No one goes to moon by himself.

>>12157415
>That's the opposite of what we're seeing in the world, though.
we see nothing.

>Disease can also select for intelligence.
you're grasping at straws, lad.

>If intelligence mattered more in Africa, then how come we don't see an increased intelligence amongst Africans?
actually we do. It shows in the accounts of travelers. You have stories about people remembering with ease complex paths, or memorizing gargantuic number of edible plants.

>Then what about history? Where is their Athens, who was their Marc Aurel, where are their aqueducts?

There's plenty of factors that go into civilization development. I can just repeat what i said. Read Guns, Germs and Steel. Everything is explained there in a way even you could understand it.

>Agricultural society has been marked by increased population pressure and competition from outside tribes. People in agricultural societies had to fight and wage wars constantly just to keep their lands, not to mention the increased inner group competition. Furthermore, agricultural societies have a far larger amount of people that live by their cognitive abilities. Lawyers in Rome, architects, scribes, clerks, fine craftsmen, any and all job that was not directly involved with food production can qualify. These groups have been very succesful in breeding in agricultural societies.

you're once again grasping at straws. Why are you so comically desperate?

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:16:12 2020 No.12157459

>>12157441
>Low IQ normies are the happiest bunch and they can interact with each other just fine
You limit your selection to normies. Think of all the criminals, drug abusers, morbidly obese and otherwise dysfunctional people. It's a fact that rates of alcoholism and domestic abuse are higher amongst low IQ people then amongst high IQ people.
Social interactions follow patterns and IQ tests try to asses how good a person is at recognizing patterns. It's invalid to claim that high IQ does allow a person to quicker learn patterns in math, but not social ones.

>They make great politicians and all kinds of managers,
Those aren't low IQ people. You know that 50% of the population has an IQ lower than 100? Extremely few of those are in leadership positions.

It seems that it is you who does not understand what intelligence is, if you think being a normie alone makes you low intelligence.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:23:25 2020 No.12157480

>>12157459
>makes you low intelligence.
Lol you are still missing my point. I am saying the definition of intelligence is subjective. Not that someone is not intelligent. You measure intelligence according to a certain definition prevalent among certain type of people. Forget about the normies. Replace them with Africans. My point still stands.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:24:05 2020 No.12157484

>>12157452
>we see nothing.
Stop lying, we have enough data to positively ascertain a black/white IQ gab. IQ gabs between any race, for that matter.

>straws
No, seriously, look it up. What do you think the religious edicts on cleanliness in Abrahamic religions are about? Those are social rules invented to deal with parasites and pathogens. Those that managed to remember and apply those rules were selected for in the past.

>You have stories about people remembering with ease complex paths, or memorizing gargantuic number of edible plants.
Knowledge is not intelligence. Europeans have memorized complex paths and large numbers of facts about plants and animals alike, yet also managed to create advanced civilizations.

>Read Guns, Germs and Steel.
Book's been debunked by the research that came out after GGS was published.
Also, answer me this, if environmental factors have caused these differences, why haven't they also caused genetic ones? Isn't the environment a source for natural selection?

>straws again
"Against the Grain" James C. Scott. Or just pick up any history book.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:26:49 2020 No.12157490

>>12157480
Your definition game is tyring. You unwanted sextoy can only close your eyes to the high rate of low social functionality amongst low IQ people. Tell me why domestic abuse is more common amongst low IQ people.
Intelligence helps at any task that requires brain power and social skills do.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:37:32 2020 No.12157520

>>12157490
>domestic abuse is more common amongst low IQ people.
Wow are you playing dumb or what? It is exactly the opposite. You confuse the cause and the effect. It is a well known fact that children subjected to abuse or even children of abused mothers may have lower IQ. Which has nothing to do with their "intelligence" however you define it.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:44:43 2020 No.12157541

>>12157520
Genes create their own environment and the mother shares most of her genes with the child. So any low IQ genes in the child should also be present in the parents providing the low quality environment.
If you doubt this, you'd argue against genetic causes for -individual- IQ differences. Which we know for a fact exist, as that's how human intelligence evolved from early hominids.

I take it you have conceded the other points.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:48:36 2020 No.12157551 >>12157541 Nothing is conceded, no. It was just a rabbit hole. You still deny that the definition of intelligence is the key starting point but you claim I play the definition games?

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:50:46 2020 No.12157554 >>12157551 Then give a definition of intelligence that invalidates a genetic cause for a racial IQ gab.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:55:26 2020 No.12157567 >>12157554 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_intelligence

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 18:57:57 2020 No.12157575 Genetics and environment are inextricably linked. Contrary to popular belief, genes react differently in different environments.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 19:05:29 2020 No.12157597 >>12157567 >Human intelligence is the intellectual capability of humans, which is marked by complex cognitive feats and high levels of motivation and self-awareness. Cool, so Anons in this thread have used intelligence correctly.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 19:15:21 2020 No.12157621 >>12157575 That's why Jesus invented twin studies.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 20:29:31 2020 No.12157807

>>12157597
Nice cherry picking. The whole point of this article is to explain to you that
>Psychologists have shown that the definition of human intelligence is unique to the culture that one is studying
for example
>intelligent people should have a social conscience, accept others for who they are, and be able to give advice or wisdom
but it is not surprising that autists on this board don't get that

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 20:47:25 2020 No.12157862

>>12157353
>blacks are probably slightly more intelligent for historical reasons
Like what?
>in Africa, intelligence mattered to your survival more
Savagery mattered more, you only need basic intelligence to spear chuck the guy who studied intricate pottery.

Anonymous Thu Sep 24 21:07:44 2020 No.12157908
File: 50 KB, 640x462, ea4v2c53lyc41.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>12156567
>>12152312
>>12155607
>>12156117
>>12157415
Absolute brainlets on this board. I've came visiting first time in a couple of months and this is the standard?

There's no big differences between IQ and race. If you adjust for the bias there's no significant difference. The more years you're schooled in mathematics in a western school the higher your IQ gets. IQ is a psychological construct made to test certain abilities which education enhances. An IQ score is only what is the result of an IQ test. It is hereditary though.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 22:54:55 2020 No.12158124 >>12157415 Waaaaah thats racist

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 24 22:56:40 2020 No.12158127 >>12157908 >There's no big differences between IQ and race. Why is sci so retarded? Seriously. You commies live in an alternate reality

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 00:13:12 2020 No.12158290 >>12156492 an out lier doesn't dis-prove an average,tard,cuck,jew.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 00:44:06 2020 No.12158334

>>12157353
>physical differences when you look at genes are just a superficial tiny shit.
http://www1.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/30years/Rushton-Jensen30years.pdf

IQ test scores 85
Cranial capacity (cm3) 1,267
Cortical neurons (millions) 13,185

Gestation time Shorter
Skeletal development Earlier
Motor development Earlier
Dental development Earlier

Myopia (nearsightedness) is positively correlated with IQ and may be caused
by extra myelinization in the eye and so possibly linked to brain size (Miller,
1994). The relationship appears to be pleiotropic (Cohn, Cohn, & Jensen, 1988);
that is, a gene affecting one trait also has some effect on one or more others. There
are significant racial and ethnic differences in the frequency of myopia, with the
highest rates found in East Asians, the lowest rates among Blacks, with Whites
intermediate.

Mean Black–White–East Asian IQ
differences associated with mean
differences in brain size.

Mean Black–White IQ differences
show regression toward predicted
race means. Best evidence comes
from well-controlled sibling
studies.

: Mean Black–White differences in
IQ and brain size reflected in
studies of racial admixture.
Children wrongly believed by
adoptive parents to have two
Black biological parents had the
same IQs as children correctly
classified as of mixed race.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 00:47:27 2020 No.12158340
File: 360 KB, 750x713, 1572730298784.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>12158127

>Why is sci so retarded? Seriously. You commies live in an alternate reality

Not even him but the entire debate is full blown nonsensical and everyone involved deserves a gut punch. The fact is race in on itself does NOT intristically determine IQ, HOWEVER population dynamics between the races over long periods of time have caused IQ average differences to occur. So the IQ differences among races is REAL but not exclusive to them because of race. Thus there is nothing stopping any race from having their averages change, be nearly the same or be wildly different. Given that the population dynamics involving said race changes to a different paradigm.

Why this is so hard to accept is beyond me. Are there IQ differences? Yes! Can those differences be changed? Yes! Does Genes and Environment both affect those differences? Yes! Should we focus on optimizing every race to have high IQ through all available avenues instead of running around in circles debating muh superiority/inferiority? Yes!

The end. Plain and Simple. Next fucking topic.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 01:36:14 2020 No.12158399 >>12158340 I'm with you but here's some thoughts I have. Do the differences really matter in the scale of things? What can constituent a meaningful change in IQ? Is optimization even a thing to care about?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 01:38:49 2020 No.12158401 >>12158399 >Do the differences really matter in the scale of things? Yes, because misgenation lowers IQ, and the niggers keep mixing with other races, lowering their IQ's as well.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 01:43:30 2020 No.12158409 >>12152203 IQ is related to psychology, not a scientific field.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 02:35:19 2020 No.12158495

>>12157807
Ok normie, then provide some data that blacks make up for in social compassion and acceptance of others what they lack in what common IQ tests matter. Because, that's necessary to arrive at an overall equal average level of intelligence.

Take a look at the data in almost any field. You'll find that high IQ people of all races will do better in those metrics as well and that the rate of occurence of high IQ people varies between races.

>give advice
Imagine thinking that this isn't a skill highly dependant on IQ.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 02:40:26 2020 No.12158503

>>12158340
Are you advocating that Europeans should take control of Africa, install strict measures over African breeding and select only high IQ people to breed for however centuries needed until black IQ has risen to the European level?
Or that Europeans should mass breed with African women to endow the African people with as many high IQ genes as possible?

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 02:52:44 2020 No.12158528

>>12158399

>Do the differences really matter in the scale of things?

In truth, no not really. What's important is humans are where they are now. Not how or who got them there. No one knows who specifically created the first spear/bow, built the first shelter, tamed the first fire, sew the first pair of insulating clothes, planted the first seeds, befriended the first canine or caused the first war. What matters is that the knowledge passed down to others, enough people cared to remember/ build upon it and we manage to survive the ensuing fallout from it. The current races and populations will all disappear to make new ones. The human species will yield something beyond itself to continue moving forward in our stead.

>What can constituent a meaningful change in IQ?

Betterment of prenatal/children diets, reduce stress/management of cortisol hormones in prenatal women, widespread education, increase complexity of languages, eugenics, genetic engineering, polygenic selection of healthy vs unhealthy genes, population bottlenecks due to extreme separation or dying off, reducing exposure to harmful chemicals/minerals. All of these result in a meaningful changes in IQ. How one views any particular action is a different story.

>Is optimization even a thing to care about?

Entirely depends on the goals. In terms of basic survival, no. Because simple tribal organization is more than enough. Most animals on earth can't even fend of a wooden spear. For advance survival (say expanding beyond earth) then yes, optimization is important to create and sharpen the necessary biological tools to propel us into space. Optimization among everyone also helps because it humbles one's ego to understand it is not special and others outside self do and can matter when given resources to.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 03:07:57 2020 No.12158555

>>12158503

You are the one projecting the advocation of those actions anon not me. The knowledge of what causes differences in IQ have been documented and people around the world including those in Africa can be made aware of it. How and at what pace they implement that knowledge is up to them. Although there's nothing stopping someone from forcing their will onto them. But one must be prepared for the tables to eventually turn as it's only fair with a "might makes right" attitude. I suppose in this instance it would be Europeans take over Africa. But the Chinese turn Europeans into slaves for cheap consumer products.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 04:32:04 2020 No.12158689 >>12157411 Who care what different cultures think?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 04:33:06 2020 No.12158693 >>12155901 knowledge =/= intelligence

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 04:37:59 2020 No.12158705 >>12157353 The brain is physical, Tyrone.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 04:41:41 2020 No.12158713 File: 116 KB, 768x960, 1591048134277.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12157520 this is your brain on leftist logic. >"nuh-uh its the other way around"

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 04:43:48 2020 No.12158719 >>12158713 Not him but your pic is autistic.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 04:45:40 2020 No.12158722

>>12157908
>There's no big differences between IQ and race. If you adjust for the bias there's no significant difference. The more years you're schooled in mathematics in a western school the higher your IQ gets

god stop ridiculing yourself, first of all,, those are quite the bol claims to make without a source, second of all even AFTER correcting for ALL reevant factors, wealth, nurture, culture, blacks still score half to an entire standard deviation worse than their white counterparts, fcanßt you just fucking take the L? No one says blacks are worth less for being less intelligent as a population.(inb4 blacks arent monolithic, yeah so are whites)

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 04:48:04 2020 No.12158727 File: 2.85 MB, 398x714, 1569781006453.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12158719 Do you know what autism is?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 04:48:43 2020 No.12158730 >>12158409 Ironically its probably the most scientific thing psychology has ever created.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 04:50:13 2020 No.12158737 >>12158719 Its a provocative pic with some truth behind it. I took the first somewhat related picture I had, what is so autistic about it? Did you misspell artistic :)?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 05:02:33 2020 No.12158764 >>12158737 Nah because Africans developed music too, but as a meme it's fine I guess.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 05:09:46 2020 No.12158780 >>12158764 Africans also developed medicine, yet nobody claims they did it as well as Europeans (and Asians).

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 05:11:39 2020 No.12158785 >>12158780 Yeah you have a point, I just wanted to say that.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 05:38:46 2020 No.12158836

>>12158764
>muh polyrythms
Symphonies are magnitudes more sophisticated than polyrythms, and I don't know alot about classical music but I'm sure they had polyrythms too, notably Bach. Inb4 bach was blach kek

Open to discussion, as I mentioned I don't know alot about music, but the polyrythms seem to be the thing that is highly praised by westerners when talking about african cultures.
I'd much rather praise solidarity an kindness in some of the african cultures than polyrythms but it's something that also occurs in latin countries, ironically both these cultures produce also the most brutal and cold hearted savage murders.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 09:15:51 2020 No.12159296 >>12152195 Genetics are caused by environmental differences

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 09:16:58 2020 No.12159300 >>12152216 The only people who believe there's no differences between races are the retards who think that human evolution suddenly stopped forever 50,000 years ago

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 09:39:54 2020 No.12159351 >>12158713 this picture is very relevant btw. the average white boy is a big fan of rap and doesn't know anything about mozart.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 09:44:30 2020 No.12159366 >>12158764 Yeah sure Jazz, Blues, HipHop, Rap. All memes invented by blacks and appropriated by white boys not capable of creating their own music. Jazz is extremely complex btw if you know anything about music.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 09:48:04 2020 No.12159374 if you need some kind of test to show you nigs on average are dumb, guess what you are dumb too

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 09:49:53 2020 No.12159378 >>12159366 >white people can't create music hop hop literally started out as sampling white music and saying words over it. taking isn't music you mindless ape, what they were talking over, that was the music.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 10:26:24 2020 No.12159460 >>12159378 yeah keep coping. white people listen to black music. period. go on youtube and check the number of views. you were saying something about intelligence? who is your favorite black dj?

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:02:01 2020 No.12160102

>>12159300
I know a guy that believes that civilization stopped evolution. He claimed that splints made it useless to evolve the legs, for example.

That guy is showing a depressing lack of critical thinking in all he argues for. Also some character traits of his he seems to share with environmentalist posters on /sci/. Why do they all attack the definition of intelligence and bring up irrelevant facts instead of arguing against the hereditarian position on the basis of data?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:03:10 2020 No.12160108 >>12159460 >number of views on a global website >less white people than brown people in the world >less white people with internet than brown people with internet. Anon...

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:05:22 2020 No.12160117

>>12156114
>it's difficult to measure how much is from genetics and how much from environment

No it isn't. The definitive work on this was done 30 years ago, you're just not familiar with the literature.
1) Babies given up for adoption at birth.
2) Placed in perfect two parent families and given every advantage (adoption in those days was very difficult).
3) The child's IQ (and numerous other data) were measured regularly.
4) For the first 4 years the child's IQ resembles the adopted parents.
5) The older the child gets the less it resembles the adopted parents.
6) By 18 the correlation between the child's IQ and the adopted parents is the same as that between any 2 unrelated people.
7) In contrast by 18 the child's IQ correlates with the biological parents exactly as if they had been raised by them all along - despite never having seen them.

Conclusion environment makes a big difference only in the early years when the brain is still relatively 'plastic'. Eventually genes will always win out.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:24:10 2020 No.12160215 >>12160108 massive cope black artists fill huge stadiums in europe

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:33:18 2020 No.12160249

>>12156848
>>12156995
>>12157032
>>12157055

It's worth pointing to an number of studies of cases where starvation occurred. In particular one well studied group are WW2 'Dutch famine babies'. The are children born during the Dutch Hunger Winter, 1944–1945 when the Germans restricted food supplies for six months. Many expectant mothers survived on between 400 and 800 calories a day, an estimated 20,000 people died from malnutrition.

At age 18 those born during the 'hunger winter' were tested - there was no effect on IQ. Only in their late 50s did they begin to show slight signs of more rapid brain ageing.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3857581/

Similar studies have also been done for the Siege of Leningrad, 1941–1944, China 1959–1961 (the Great Leap Forward economic and social plan) etc.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:34:37 2020 No.12160254 File: 9 KB, 194x259, download (1).png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12152195

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:39:15 2020 No.12160268 >>12159351 what about the average black boy then?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:42:16 2020 No.12160276 >>12160117 study pls, I need it.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:45:12 2020 No.12160291

>>12152195
When you look at the state of black people the world over and throughout history, it is painfully obvious the differences are natural and genetic.
It is only environmental to the same extent their dark skin, wooly hair, protruding jawbone is "environmental".

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 14:45:32 2020 No.12160295 >>12160268 same so you concede that there is no difference between races and their intelligence?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:00:36 2020 No.12160371 >>12160215 So do white artists. The black artists that do fill massive stadiums in Europe are also not gangsta rappers. They're people like Beyonce, who have teams of song writers and composers. A far cry removed from black music.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:02:06 2020 No.12160378 >>12160295 Not at all. A liking for classical music is correlated with high IQ. Take a guess what the audience for orchesters is like. Pasty and gooky.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:03:06 2020 No.12160382 >>12160378 >correlated with high IQ and high IQ is not correlated with a broader definition of intelligence which has been my point all along

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:15:29 2020 No.12160445 >>12160382 No one takes g seriously.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:16:59 2020 No.12160455 >>12160382 It is, though. High IQ correlates strongly with g and whatever tasks you want ot include into the definition of intelligence are varyingly g loaded, too. Name me some tasks that can measure intelligence that don't benefit from a high IQ.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 15:18:44 2020 No.12160462 >>12160382 what is the broader defintion of intelligence then, and does it have a metric? Im sorry but g seems to be the best thing we have found until now.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:05:13 2020 No.12160719

>>12160445
>>12160455
>>12160462
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G_factor_(psychometrics)#g_(or_c)_in_human_groups
>differences appear to have diminished significantly over time,[121] and to be attributable to environmental (rather than genetic) causes.
>gaps are attributed to g-loading
> despite the increasing g loading of IQ test batteries over time, the performance gap between racial groups continues to diminish
>Americans of East Asian descent generally slightly outscore white Americans.
>by the same margin white Americans outscore African Americans

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_intelligence
> Modern scholarship regards race as a social construct, and intelligence has no agreed-upon definition
>the validity of IQ tests as a metric for general intelligence is itself disputed.
>The majority of anthropologists today consider race to be a sociopolitical phenomenon rather than a biological one

and finally
>Claims that there are innate differences in intelligence between racial and ethnic groups—which go back at least to the 19th century—have been criticized both for relying on specious assumptions and research methods and for serving as an ideological framework for discrimination and racism.
bingo, racists

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:18:35 2020 No.12160772

>>12160276
Google "Plomin adoption studies" that will find a lot of them.

BTW the whole series by Norwegian TV is just a mass of red pills on every taboo subject you can think of (link below).
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLd9_g7lAICxtlGbxh4_z8ik178o8CDPnv

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:20:30 2020 No.12160787

>>12160719
Wikipedia isn't a source in politically contentious matters. Western academics put their careers in danger if they try to research race. We're living through a time of cancel culture.

Read this
https://www1.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/30years/Rushton-Jensen30years.pdf

Then consider that race can be a useful category.
https://www.nature.com/articles/ng1435

Lastly, read up on twin studies. We know that there is a (strong) genetic component to racial IQ gaps.

>claims have been critizised for serving as an ideological framework for discrimination and racism.
So, the research is being critizised for hurting feelings. That should tell you a lot.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:21:15 2020 No.12160794 >>12160445 No one except the hundreds of psychologists and psychometricians who study this.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:27:32 2020 No.12160830 >>12160772 Didn't that guy get the SJW funding in Norway cut with this documentary?

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:30:02 2020 No.12160838

>>12160719
>>differences appear to have diminished significantly over time,[121] and to be attributable to environmental (rather than genetic) causes.
Of course, our beloved Wikipedia editors citing only what fits their narrative and ignoring all else. Racial IQ gaps are not diminishing.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0160289607000190

>> Modern scholarship regards race as a social construct, and intelligence has no agreed-upon definition
>the validity of IQ tests as a metric for general intelligence is itself disputed.
Not a single citation for this statement. I will try to hide my shock.

>>The majority of anthropologists today consider race to be a sociopolitical phenomenon rather than a biological one
This is true only for anthropologist in the West and even there about one third agrees that biological race exists. Which is still a significant proportion despite being a numerical minority. In China, Latin America, Eastern Europe, things are looking grim for race deniers.
https://archive.fo/gsNWg

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:32:35 2020 No.12160847 >>12160787 >Wikipedia isn't a source in politically contentious matters. Yup, psychology wikia is better because it presents the topic in much more honest way. https://psychology.wikia.org/wiki/Race_and_intelligence

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:37:14 2020 No.12160869 >>12152195 >Haiti-Dominican Republic frontier.jpg

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 16:59:59 2020 No.12160978

>>12152195
Richard Lynn is the source of literally all the studies /pol/ likes to pass around saying blacks and abos are inherently less intelligent than whites. He's a notorious white supremacist who's been caught red-handed manipulating, misrepresenting, and outright fabricating data, who fails to consider socioeconomic/cultural factors, whose reasoning is fallacious, whose conclusions are non-sequiturs, and whose presumptions, namely that IQ represents a comprehensive evaluation of a person's intelligence, are demonstrably false.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:01:36 2020 No.12160987

>>12160787
>contentious
/thread
everyone cherry picks from the available data according to their views on racism. both camps have plenty of data so you choose who to believe based on your personal preferences. you don;t link blacks? of course you will find plenty of sources to back up your bias. moreover, once you make a few searches on google, it will do a great job of steering you towards similar web sites that support similar points of view. it is an echo chamber. this thread is the proof btw. the only reason these threads keep circulating is because butthurt /pol/aks create them. otherwise you'd just move on with your lives.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:02:16 2020 No.12160990

>>12160978
Can you provide a source?

Especially for this part.
>whose presumptions, namely that IQ represents a comprehensive evaluation of a person's intelligence, are demonstrably false.

Again, IQ is highly correlated with g and g affects all types of intelligence if one were to work under one of the theories of multiple intelligences.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:05:13 2020 No.12161010

>>12160987
>once you make a few searches on google, it will do a great job of steering you towards similar web sites that support similar points of view
1. I don't use google.
2. Papers and studies are preferable to websites.
3. If there were no strong link between genetics and IQ and intelligence, we wouldn't see clear gaps along racial lines.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:05:18 2020 No.12161011 >>12160990 Flynn effect and the proven malleability of IQ.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:06:41 2020 No.12161020 >>12160987 You've given up arguing the results and are now trying to disrepute the whole discussion. The intellectual equivalent to pushing over the chess table.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:06:46 2020 No.12161022 >>12160978 nop, there is van halen and others as well stop spewing bullshit, they all come to the same conclusions and results.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:10:47 2020 No.12161034

>>12161011
That's not a source you double-nigger.

The Flynn effect describes a general rise of IQ scores, not by itself a closing of racial gaps. Neither does a malleability of IQ disprove such gaps since the malleability affects all races, yet gaps remain even in comparable environments.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:12:01 2020 No.12161043 >>12161034 Why don't you post your sources then.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:13:03 2020 No.12161045

>>12157415
>If intelligence mattered more in Africa, then how come we don't see an increased intelligence amongst Africans?
Because the average African has never taken a written test, cannot read, and has never done complex arithmetic, all of which is reflected in lower IQ scores since IQ exams test all of these skills extensively. That doesn't mean that they're less intelligent on a genetic level.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:14:22 2020 No.12161052

>>12152379
When the establishment is literally touting active discrimination measures against whites and Asians as an antidote to imaginary racism, it is necessary to endlessly shout the biological side of human inequality on the only platform that won’t aggressively censor it. If people who are using economic inequality between races as a justification to turn America into the Soviet Union go away, then these threads should to. But they aren’t going away and this is the only major platform on the internet that isn’t braying lysenkoism and stirring up Bolshevik violence.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:16:15 2020 No.12161069

>>12161052
>it is necessary to endlessly shout the biological side of human inequality on the only platform that won’t aggressively censor it.
But you don't have a single valid piece of evidence for your retarded claims. All the people you cite have been laughed out of academia for their highly unscientific methodologies and faulty reasoning.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:17:09 2020 No.12161072

>>12161043
I'll throw you a paper on a single gene out of pity.

Gene mutation occurred ~6k years ago and can't therefore be equally spread over the races. It's involved in brain size and therefore intelligence. Considered to be beneficial and one of the numerous hints we have that "the human brain is still undergoing rapid adaptive evolution."

https://ui.adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/2005Sci...309.1720M/abstract

Good luck showing that this gene does not contribute to the high IQ scores of whites and asians compared to blacks.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:20:16 2020 No.12161085 >>12161072 >It's involved in brain size and therefore intelligence. False premise, there is no definitive proof of this.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:20:33 2020 No.12161088

>>12161045
>Because the average African has never taken a written test, cannot read, and has never done complex arithmetic,
Well, genes do shape their own environments, nigga. Just assume for a moment that there is a racial IQ gap. How would the world like? Pretty close to today. While if there wasn't a racial IQ gap, we'd see some outlyers of African nations that did manage to develop or some African tier European nations

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:22:27 2020 No.12161099 >>12161085 There is no definitive proof that the environment affects intelligence either, if that is your standard.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:27:48 2020 No.12161115

>>12161088
>Just assume for a moment that there is a racial IQ gap. How would the world like? Pretty close to today. While if there wasn't a racial IQ gap, we'd see some outlyers of African nations that did manage to develop or some African tier European nations

Faulty reasoning. All the things that foster civilization, namely technological innovation and writing, arise from agriculture, to which Africa is exceptionally ill-suited. The animals in Africa are also notoriously resistant to domestication, so that rules out domesticating the Zebra or something meaning transportation is effectively limited to physically walking everywhere.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:28:50 2020 No.12161122 >>12161099 The Flynn effect is literally direct evidence that environmental conditions correlate directly with IQ. Go back to /pol/ retard.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:34:29 2020 No.12161158

>>12161115
>agriculture, to which Africa is exceptionally ill-suited
Africa has some of the most fertile land on the planet with a rich eco-system. One advantage of Africa over Europe in farming for example is that Europe suffers winters.

>The animals in Africa are also notoriously resistant to domestication
Zebras can be captured and bred in captivity just fine. It's also quite possible to take them from the wild and get them used to be ridden. You compare wild animals in Africa today to modern, domesticated ones in Europe and Asia. The wild ancestors of European domesticates were ferocious as well.

>transportation is effectively limited to physically walking everywhere.
Zebras can be domesticated. Elephants have been used for transportation and Africans have had contact with people that did have domesticated animals for millennia before Greece or Rome rose.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:35:51 2020 No.12161170 >>12161122 Yeah, well, nobody disputes that. You however claim that we have no evidence that genes influence IQ, which is bullshit. I've already linked you a paper that shows just that using a gene that directly affects brain size.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:38:48 2020 No.12161189 >>12161115 >The animals in Africa are also notoriously resistant to domestication Because they are the only continent whose peoples didn't drive the megafauna to extinction - why might that be?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:40:11 2020 No.12161195 >>12161122 Flynn effect isn't real.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:42:53 2020 No.12161212
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>>12161189
That proves that Africans have a higher IQ than Europeans, since they preserved their environment. There isn't just mathematical intelligence, but also environmental intelligence.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:45:40 2020 No.12161224

>>12161189
>Because they are the only continent whose peoples didn't drive the megafauna to extinction - why might that be?
Any number of reasons? If you want to convince me it's because they're inherently less intelligent you'll have to provide some actual evidence.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:47:23 2020 No.12161233 >>12161158 >The wild ancestors of European domesticates were ferocious as well. I don't think there were hippos, alligators, lions, cheetahs, elephants, and hyenas in Europe.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:47:52 2020 No.12161235 >>12161224 How about you provide some evidence that the gap in scores seen here >>12161212 is environmental?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:49:47 2020 No.12161242 >>12161233 Are you saying that lions ate any African that tried to domesticate the Zebra? I specified domesticates for a reason.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:50:33 2020 No.12161249

>>12161235
I already mentioned it earlier, the Flynn effect which has seen IQs increase in countries all around the world in direct proportion to the improved living conditions and availability of education.

The general malleability of IQ which can jump 5-10 points from drilling for IQ tests, learning a foreign language, playing an instrument, you name it. IQ is demonstrably not fixed.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:50:41 2020 No.12161250 >>12161212 >can't deplete the soil because they can't grow yams on a large scale >can't drive megafauna to extinction because they can't hunt them efficiently >environmental intelligence Actually, starving for millennia means you're smart.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:52:14 2020 No.12161258 >>12161224 What is, "actual evidence?"

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:52:16 2020 No.12161259

>>12161242
No you retard, my point was that the presence of those vicious animals put selective pressure on Zebras to become more flighty, mistrustful, and aggressive than European equids. You really are retarded for not understanding the point immediately.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:53:18 2020 No.12161267 >>12161258 Do you speak English? "Actual evidence" i.e. evidence that decisively proves your claim that Africans were unable to kill their local megafauna due to lower intellect.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:54:08 2020 No.12161272 >>12161267 "Decisive," in whose judgment?

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:55:07 2020 No.12161281

>>12161259
Europe and Asia in the time when horses were domesticated had tigers, bears and wolves. You make baseless claims without sources and expect us to believe you.
Can you show any hard data on this supposed increased mistrust of Zebras? Why can they be domesticated today if these predators still exist?

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:59:39 2020 No.12161299

>>12160978
>Richard Lynn is the source of literally all the studies /pol/ likes to pass around saying blacks and abos are inherently less intelligent than whites.
No he literally isn't. Race differences in IQ have been known long before Lynn and they would be known without him too. I get he is your boogieman but try staying in reality.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 17:59:43 2020 No.12161300

>>12161281
Even European horse trainers have failed for two centuries to domesticate the Zebra because they're aggressive and unpredictable as shit.

Also the only indigenous tiger to Europe, the Caspian tiger, did not overlap at all with the horse which was domesticated by the Indo-Europeans in Ukraine. Wolves and bears do not pose a significant risk to horses. Everything you're saying isn't true and you don't even realize it.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:00:46 2020 No.12161303 >>12161299 >Race differences in IQ have been known long before Lynn and they would be known without him too. Whose theories were abandoned halfway through the 20th century when they were proven to be false.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:02:12 2020 No.12161309

>>12161122
Funny you love Flynn effect so much because it was the notorious Richard Lynn who was among the first who took notice of rising IQ scores and he wrote about it quite extensively. But that doesn't fit your narrative of evil white supremacist, does it?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:04:16 2020 No.12161317 >>12161309 What? Just because Lynn was one of the first to acknowledge the phenomena doesn't mean his other conclusions aren't fallacious and baseless.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:04:55 2020 No.12161321

>>12161303
Except not at all. Here is meta-analysis from 2001 which demonstrated beyond a doubt a 15 point IQ between whites and blacks. Nobody denies existence of IQ gaps.Not even hacks like Gould or Lewontin.
https://home.ubalt.edu/tmitch/645/articles/roth%20et%20al%20ethnic%20grp%20diff%20in%20cog%20abil%20ppsych%202001.pdf

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:06:31 2020 No.12161330 File: 18 KB, 678x102, file.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12161122 And Flynn himself acknowledges that racial IQ gaps are unrelated to Flynn effect gains.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:07:28 2020 No.12161334 >>12161321 Did you even read the paper? Nowhere is a genetic or racial component even mentioned.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:08:29 2020 No.12161340 >>12161330 Yes, those are explained by the factors I cited above >>12161045

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:09:00 2020 No.12161342 >>12161334 Where have I said anything about "racial component" I just said there is a difference.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:09:51 2020 No.12161347
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>>12161069
Some black people are intellgience and educated, therefore racial differences in IQ don't exist.
Also some smokers never develop lung cancer, therefore cigarette don't increase your risk of lung cancer.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:09:53 2020 No.12161348 >>12161342 The entire thread is about whether or not there is a genetic component to race IQ differences.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:10:14 2020 No.12161350 >>12161340 Average black in America did take a written test, can read and whatever other excuses you made up and they still score 15 points lower.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:11:17 2020 No.12161355 >>12161348 I was responding only to one comment, not the entire thread.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:11:34 2020 No.12161357 >>12161350 Does the average black in America grow up with the same amenities and in the same environment as the average white?

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:11:45 2020 No.12161358
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>>12161300
>Even European horse trainers have failed for two centuries to domesticate the Zebra because they're aggressive and unpredictable as shit.
https://archive.org/details/pointsofhorsefam00hayerich/page/n5/mode/2up
This guy did it just fine and made no mention of any special difficulties.

> the only indigenous tiger to Europe, the Caspian tiger, did not overlap at all with the horse which was domesticated by the Indo-Europeans in Ukraine
Ok, cool, but https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0015311

Also, please provide a source on your claim that wolves and bears can't pose a threat to horses.

>everything I'm saying isn't true
It would look like that to somebody uninformed.

Now provide some actual sources.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:12:26 2020 No.12161360 >>12161357 Irrelevant. Those that do grow up, still score 15 points lower.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:15:00 2020 No.12161371

>>12161357
There are millions of blacks in America. There is enough data to compare blacks and whites of equivalent income levels with each other. There are also twin studies that corroborate these results. It's up to you to show some actual data on how even adopted blacks have been held back by their environment.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:21:04 2020 No.12161390

>>12157411
>>12155901
First of all you clearly have no idea what you are talking about. "Learnability" is a major topic is neuroscience, anthropology, cognitive science, and linguistics and it has been for years. Whether or not something is "learnable" is biological programmed and the basis of many concepts in neuroscience, for example the concept of "universal grammar" (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_grammar).).
You clearly don't have any background in STEM or the behavioral sciences and I'm guessing you haven't even graduated college yet, because you fundamentally misunderstand these issues. For instance, you fail to have realized that if learnability were purely environmental. that would entail that non-human animals have the capacity to learn the same thing as humans, provided they are exposed to the right environment.

Secondly you are conflating two questions: (1) how the concept of "intelligence" is defined in different contexts and societies, and (2) whether a PARTICULAR definition of intelligence is determined by genetic or environmental factors.
In reality, any biological trait or agential capacity is determined by a mix of environmental and genetic factors, but I digress. Regard (1) this argument is irrelevant. First of all what you are saying isn't entirely true. "Intelligence" doesn't mean different things in different languages. A concept bcan't have two different "meanings" in different languages because if you translate an idea into a different language and it "means" something different, then you haven't actually translated it, you've just found a vaguely reminiscent concept. That being said, I think what you mean to say is that different cultures and different society place more emphasis on different components of intelligence, but that it still irrelevant because any word in any language has a certain degree of ambiguity.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:30:42 2020 No.12161416

>>12157411
>>12155901
Cont. from >>12155901

But even if we grant that the concept of "intelligence" is ambiguous, in the natural sciences we don't spend time arguing over definitions. What you do is "operationalize" your terminology and fix a particular definition that is suitable for the task at hand. This is all very basic stuff, and anyone who has studied the behavioral science knows what I'm talking about, so I won't go to deep into this point.
Basically you would fix a definition of intelligence by looking at cognitive performance within a particular domain, for example object recognition, pattern detection, or logical deduction.
If you do that, what you will find is that pretty much any human capacity is influenced by both genetic and environmental traits.
even if what you claim is true - namely that 'intelligence hasn't "different meanings" in different cultures - that is irrelevant to discussion because that is a linguistic issue rather than an empirical issue. This is another point I would expect you to understand if you actually knew shit about the behavioral sciences, because students are generally taught the important of distinguishing between linguistic facts and empirical facts (see, for example, the analytic-sythetic distinction). Whether or not the word "intelligence" is ambiguous is completely unrelated to whether intelligence is heritable, because even if the word is ambiguous, all that entails is that you have to fix a particular definition and then you would empirically determine whether the capacities captured by that definition are heritable.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:37:32 2020 No.12161438

>>12161358
>This guy did it just fine and made no mention of any special difficulties.
Where specifically does it mention that?

>Ok, cool, but https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0015311
Did you even read this? What are trying to prove with this?

>Also, please provide a source on your claim that wolves and bears can't pose a threat to horses.

Can you read? I didn't say they CAN'T post a threat to horses, I said they GENERALLY do not. Bears are opportunists that mainly eat plants, fish, and dead animals. "During peak use in early June, the amount of ungulates in diets was much greater in the foothills (49%) than in mountains (20%). Although scat analyses did not distinguish species of ungulates, site investigations revealed that moose were most common (83%), particularly neonates (54%), with white-tailed and mule deer (16%) and elk (1%) more minor in composition."

https://academic.oup.com/jmammal/article/87/6/1112/885332

This study also elaborates specifically on the interactions between wolves and horses, concluding that while wolves do occasionally hunt horses, they do not generally prey upon them unless environmental conditions are especially poor.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/282813990_Horses_and_Wolves_A_Contribution_to_Coexistence

"Ungulates like roe deer, red deer, and wild boar constitute the main part of their diet, although they also prey on fallow deer and mou-flons (Wagner 2011)... Horses in particular are rather unattractive because they are dangerous in self-defence while the less dangerous deer are easily available."

>Now provide some actual sources.
Literally neither of the sources you cited were relevant in any way to this discussion so why don't you take some of your own medicine.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 18:39:33 2020 No.12161443

>>12161360
>Those that do grow up, still score 15 points lower.
Because they grow up and go on to live in significantly worse environments than white people. Are you stupid or do you just not understand this?

>>12161371
>There are millions of blacks in America. There is enough data to compare blacks and whites of equivalent income levels with each other. There are also twin studies that corroborate these results. It's up to you to show some actual data on how even adopted blacks have been held back by their environment.
See above.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:03:14 2020 No.12161516

>>12161438
>Where specifically does it mention that?
Page 310. His verdict is that with his instructions, the residents should have no problems breaking in any Zebra they have in captivity.
I also posted a picture of Germans making use of Zebras for the military. That was perfectly possible.

>Did you even read this? What are trying to prove with this?
Yes, I did. Multiple domestication events of the horse. So your claim about Indo-Arians may be true, but doesn't prove anything.

>bears and wolves
Okay, suppose that's true. It doesn't matter, since you still need to show that Zebras have been especially distrustful to humans thanks to lions and how Zebras today can be domesticated even though lions are still around.

>none of my sources were relevant.
You're supposed to read them.

>>12161443
>Because they grow up and go on to live in significantly worse environments than white people.
Adoption studies and comparisons between people of equivalent income levels level the environmental factors. Choose if you want to be called stupid or unable to understand this.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:16:21 2020 No.12161537 >>12161516 Slight correction, page 310 is the start of the parts about various Zebra types. An interesting read for anybody that is curious about domesticability of these animals.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 19:58:33 2020 No.12161636

>>12161069
James Watson wasn’t “laughed out of academia,” he was targeted, betrayed, and excommunicated by his cowardly colleagues. The most famous geneticist of all time off handedly remarked that intelligence is genetic and was torn down and guillotined. If a scientist that prominent, the most prominent, can’t speak freely without fear, much “smaller” scientists in the herd will no doubt remain silent and succumb to thuggish intimidation tactics by race denier Bolsheviks.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:03:12 2020 No.12161650 File: 444 KB, 662x5691, guns germs and steel.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12152195

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:04:23 2020 No.12161651
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>>12161115
You do realize Japan is more inhospitable to farming than Zimbabwe right? And your real brave pulling “we can’t farm” out of your aids ridden baboon monkey ass seeing how whites managed it very successfully until mugabe stole all their land and plunged his worthless nog Reich into permanent starvation.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:04:30 2020 No.12161652 File: 72 KB, 500x397, NAXALT.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12156492 Retard

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:06:02 2020 No.12161656 File: 526 KB, 1200x942, zebra.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12161115 >so that rules out domesticating the Zebra

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 20:58:31 2020 No.12161820 >>12161390 >different languages No, no, not in different languages. In different cultures. I linked the wiki on human intelligence and race and intelligence. According to these articles there is no single "accepted" definition of intelligence.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 21:01:56 2020 No.12161837

>>12161416
>cognitive performance
that's just one particular aspect of intelligence. you are narrowing it down to a specific definition. the wiki articles are based on link to scientific source. refute them not me. one thing you are right about is i haven't finished college yet but is called strawman and ad hominem i think.

Anonymous Fri Sep 25 21:04:33 2020 No.12161846

>>12161416
>that is a linguistic issue rather than an empirical issue.
why do you keep confusing linguistics with semantics? there are different definitions of it in english. it doesn't matter what they call them in different languages. your posts are so strange. there is a certain level of maturity that is mixed with some kiddie stuff like talking about linguistics. where did you get that idea from that it has anything to do with linguistics?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 25 21:05:25 2020 No.12161849 >>12161115 >The animals in Africa are also notoriously resistant to domestication Nigger it can take tens of thousands of years to domesticate a wild species. African animals aren't magically resistant, Africans just never even got started.

Humans are savage. Fri Sep 25 21:15:21 2020 No.12161894

Both but mostly genetic. Why is it hard for people to understand d and accept that evolution is real. There is about 50,000 difference between white and blacks. A lot of cha he's can happen in 50,000 years. I 100 percent think they are more violent for example because of all the wild animals in Africa. How many eild animals do Europeans or asians or the natives deal with. Nothing compared to Africans.

I'm not saying we should genocide other people just leave them alone on the continent of Africa and let them work it out. That's all. I wouldn't mind sharing technology with the responsible African nations either.

But he's, humans have evolved under different selection pressure and over thousands of years results in differences. It's always proven blacks have thicker bones which is why they struggle with swimming but that trait really helps in fights.

We are different, sorry. I'm sure we are all equal in heaven or hell but not here on earth. Leave them alone to evolve on their own.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 03:46:03 2020 No.12162927 >>12161443 >Because they grow up and go on to live in significantly worse environments than white people. No, Their IQs were measured while they still lived in the same households as their white siblings and they still scored 15 points lower.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 04:14:59 2020 No.12162991

>>12161820
>>12161837
>>12161846
You keep harping on about definitions and intelligence in different cultures, yet never explain what is wrong about the definitions we do use.
Let's say that IQ doesn't measure the whole of human intelligence. Then it still measures large parts of it and shows racial gaps in those fields.
To arrive at an equal average of full intelligence you have to show that what Africans lack in pattern recognition, they make up for in social intelligence, for example. But we don't see any of that. At least not along racial lines or in the strength needed to cover a gap elsewhere.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 05:04:49 2020 No.12163093 >>12155428 Wouldn't acknowledging that lead to better outcomes in the future?

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 05:17:48 2020 No.12163124 >>12155867 Based?

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 15:59:10 2020 No.12164918 >>12152195 what causes white iq to be second lowest just above blacks?

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 16:03:25 2020 No.12164932 >>12164918 Are Hispanics and Indians black or white in your world?

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 16:05:41 2020 No.12164939 File: 8 KB, 416x224, file.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>12164918 You are forgetting quite a few people there, bud

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 16:16:35 2020 No.12164988 >>12164939 t. askhenazi

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 18:40:15 2020 No.12165338

The primary cause for IQ discrepancy is a mixture of things, but it's best to ask the question "how do we measure intelligence, and what is the origin of need for intelligence".

What one groups needs for survival and progress is not universal for everyone.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 18:54:23 2020 No.12165375

>>12165338
>What one groups needs for survival and progress is not universal for everyone.
That's a truism. But an intelligent people can learn what the less intelligent people are able to do just fine. But the reverse is not true. Therefore intelligence opens up the possibility to reach higher strata of civilization.
Whether you believe Uncle Ted was right or wrong is a philosophical question. Yet even on a primitive, purely subsistence based form of existence, having more intelligence as a people is still beneficial, since high IQ (and g) reduces negative social behaviour.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 19:52:55 2020 No.12165494 >>12161443 >>12161357 This is such a weaselly argument. If blacks are genetically less intelligent, then it stands to reason they will live in a worse environment which will always leave that as an excuse for anyone denying evolution.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 19:55:09 2020 No.12165502 >>12155901 Oh cool, so dogs and cats can learn stuff at the same level as humans, right?

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 21:07:23 2020 No.12165629 [DELETED]

functionally all meaningful early human civilizations existed within these black bounding boxes. the second wave of human civilizations, like the holy roman empire, were the result of the influence of the first civilizations like the greco-romans. it's pretty obvious to see that eurasian civilization sprung up thanks to specific environmental conditions within a specific latitude, during the specific period of time 2000-3000 years ago when civs started popping up in tandem around the world.

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 21:09:21 2020 No.12165633
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functionally, all meaningful early human civilizations existed within these black bounding boxes. the second wave of human civilizations, like the holy roman empire, were the result of the influence of the first civilizations like the greco-romans. it's pretty obvious to see that eurasian civilization sprung up thanks to specific environmental conditions within a specific latitude, during the specific period of time 2000-3000 years ago when civs started popping up in tandem around the world.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 21:25:39 2020 No.12165670 >>12152312 >>12162599

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 26 21:27:49 2020 No.12165678 >>12152195 Bad question. Environmental conditions cause evolution, Factor G is preserved trough genetics >>12152216 this

Anonymous Sat Sep 26 22:47:43 2020 No.12165862

>>12165633
>it's pretty obvious to see that eurasian civilization sprung up thanks to specific environmental conditions within a specific latitude, during the specific period of time 2000-3000 years ago when civs started popping up in tandem around the world.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 04:09:34 2020 No.12166646 >>12165633 You must be trolling. Civilization is farcolder than 3 thousand years. The switch to agrarianism happened around 12k B.C. and took a couple thousand years. And agrarianism =/= civilization.

Anonymous Sun Sep 27 04:32:15 2020 No.12166694

>>12152388
you can get better at the skills yes, but what iq measures is the ability to get batter at skills ie: the speed and the complexity of the skill. this is why brain games dont work because you only train for the games themselves and not a general ability to learn which iq is measuring hence you devalue the test if you just train to get high scores in iq tests.

Anonymous Sun Sep 27 04:37:07 2020 No.12166707

>>12152195
its genetic and literally nobody in the field wants to say so because they will get fired, before sjw shit reached the point it is now and still somewhat the general consensus is at minimum its 50% genetic and 50% environment but that is the bare minimum. this video on bitchute goes deep into how vaush spouts this bullshit he learned about iq and science that is completely wrong and how he avoid providing actual evidence and barely understands the scientific method, its the same stuff the social constructionists spout when it comes to this debate
https://www.bitchute.com/video/tI1rbIYwK4A/

Anonymous Sun Sep 27 04:54:47 2020 No.12166747

>>12166707
I wonder how far Alt Hypes reach actually is. His videos don't get that many views, but how many people are really interested in an hour long in-depth analysis of genetic factors?
It seems a reasonable assumption that a large part of his viewers are more intelligent and either strongly interested or outright in the field of genetics. If that is so and if viewers on youtube are generally younger, this could mean that he's strongly influencing the next generation of geneticists in the west.

Anonymous Sun Sep 27 04:57:54 2020 No.12166758

>>12166747
i disagree, with the current state of university's in the western sphere and the political climate in general i dont think people who agree with any of these point will be getting positions of authority in science related to biology at all. id argue his videos actually deter people from it.

Anonymous Sun Sep 27 05:03:28 2020 No.12166772

>>12166758
The current state, yes, but there can be a lot of sleepers in the field. In fact, the theory that those in the field know, but don't want to say it, supports that.
Then again, knowing the truth needs to be hidden can also drive away a lot of people.

Oh well, once the Chinese produce far superior results to western science thanks to this, that will change.

Anonymous Sun Sep 27 05:09:38 2020 No.12166785

>>12166772
quite honestly im pretty cynical about the whole situation, i honestly believe that our society is being driven into a dystopian nanny state especially with the amount of influence the powers that be have and the weird merging monopolies and government have at this point. the current situation with the protestors being literally funded by sores is very freaky given what they are doing to housing prices, government legislation and the government just letting it happen. a big redpill is the medias ties with technology companies and their collective agenda to destroy western ideals

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 05:54:17 2020 No.12166851 >>12152356 Yes iq, measures your ability to respond to the iq test and that's it. It's mostly a business, have you ever looked at how much tests cost?

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 06:06:54 2020 No.12166878 >>12166851 How good you are at solving IQ tests tells a lot about how good you are at solving other cognitive tasks. Why do you people never understand this? Is it because disreputing IQ tests is easier than living with a double digit IQ?

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 06:45:39 2020 No.12166967 >>12152195 A good chunk of brain development in children happens outside of the womb throughout their growth, go figure.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 06:48:52 2020 No.12166971 >>12166967 What does that mean?

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 08:07:01 2020 No.12167090 >>12152195 GENETICS E N E T I C S

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 08:08:19 2020 No.12167094 >>12166971 They substitute empirical scientific truth for jewmerican globohomo egaliarian ideology.

Anonymous Sun Sep 27 08:35:08 2020 No.12167126

>>12158409
>IQ is related to psychology, not a scientific field.
IQ is an objective measure since it's results can be replicated with good accuracy.
of you want a meme, go to your gender studies and social sciences were experiments can't be replicated almost never (kek, even in biological domains it's similar)

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 09:41:24 2020 No.12167244 >>12167094 I agree, but would still like to know what the reasoning behind that post is. Doesn't every child mostly develop outside of the womb?

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 12:54:18 2020 No.12167829 >>12160830 Yes, it caused a great deal of embarrassment in Norway at the time.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 12:58:09 2020 No.12167847 >>12160978 >notorious white supremacist When you have to lie, it like you've already admitted you've lost the argument.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 13:01:00 2020 No.12167853 >>12161011 Are you not aware that the Flynn effect has been going in REVERSE for the last 20 years? Look it up, plenty of academic studies on this.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 13:03:15 2020 No.12167862 >>12166971 That it's the environment.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 13:16:39 2020 No.12167899 >>12157360 how

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 13:18:21 2020 No.12167902 >>12157411 no, chimp, intelligence is your ability to quickly and accurately process new information and solve complex problems.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 13:27:31 2020 No.12167935 >>12167862 Well, then, height is also environmental if that is your standard. What is it with you people and these senseless statements?

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 13:32:41 2020 No.12167955 File: 805 KB, 338x209, why-not-both-animated-gif-7.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] don't limit yourself anon

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 27 13:42:44 2020 No.12167987 >>12152195 The IQ gap between Europeans and Pure African is too high for it to be caused by environment.

Anonymous Sun Sep 27 13:44:06 2020 No.12167992

>>12160978
Regardless of your feelings, the actual academic performance of average blacks suggests most blacks both American and African are mentally impaired. The blacks in universities are genetic outliers they dont even count, but the wild animals in the public schools do count since they represent the genetic bulk of young blacks.

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/sci/ - Science & Math