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/sci/ - Science & Math

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11673587 No.11673587 [Reply] [Original]

Multiverse theory is a coping mechanism for people who are basically into hardcore nihilism without even knowing it. The most pathetic series of thoughts comes from those kinds of people:

>maybe my other self in a parallel universe didn't have it so hard
>maybe I'm rich in that other universe
>maybe I'm not a faggot tranny in that universe
>maybe I'm the boss in that other universe

Newsflash: you might as well believe in God or any religions for that matter, because organized faith is offering basically the same comfort without the useless pretentiousness pop sci offers.

>> No.11674233

>>11673587
The truth is that there is no randomness to be found on the macroscale. If MWI theory is true, then that universe is an exact copy of ours.

>> No.11674242

>mixing up multiverse with mwi
>again
when will /sci/ stop doing this?

>> No.11674283
File: 153 KB, 1125x930, goy vs soy.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11674283

>> No.11674335

We're all fucking monkeys
None us know shit
Its all made up bullshit lmao
We all have reality tunnels

>> No.11674344

>>11673587
*tips fedora*

>> No.11674537

>>11673587
multiverse is a provable fact, OP is a semen guzzling retard, probably math major

>> No.11674581

>>11673587
Except the scientific explanation has more backing than any of the religious ones which have zero. Sure, popsci is usually trash and the real shit is far more complex, but some people like Feynman or even Heisenberg have great writings that can simplify these concepts in an easy way. You just need to find people who are actual scientists and not some "philosophy of science" blowhards like Paul Feyerabend who just spew shit everywhere. Read the writings of scientists who have an actual backing in science.

>> No.11674629

>>11673587
multiverse =/= many-worlds

>> No.11674756

>>11673587
The only popsci retard here is you. Multiverse is not the same as many worlds.

But most importantly, the inflation theory also leads to many universes, you dumb fuck. This is why people say whether you believe MWI or not is mostly a matter of "flavor".

BOTH THEORIES LEAD TO MANY UNIVERSES YOU STUPID FUCK

>> No.11674791

>>11673587
>implying there is anything wrong with believing in God
>implying there is anything wrong with organized faith
cringe

>> No.11674823

>>11674581
>more backing than any of the religious ones which have zero
That's just your assertion which has zero (0) backing :^)

>> No.11674906

>>11674283
https://www.reddit.com/r/wojak

>> No.11675171

>>11674581
Empiricism has been btfo multiple times throughout history. The scientific methods only use is to create technology, it has no way of finding the truth. Most actual scientists know that, only retarded popsci wannabes actualy think physics will come close to finding the truth.

>> No.11675288

>>11673587
>>11674233
>>11674283
You are a fucking retard

>> No.11675423

>>11673587
You are looking at only one half of the coin. In some universes, you are living in a post apocalyptic wasteland. Hell, some universes aren't even human.

>> No.11675523

>>11675288
Nah, you're the retard who thinks because a quark spins another direction, that leads to the Maya colonizing Europe or the dinosaurs never being wiped out or you not transitioning.

>> No.11675532

>>11675523
Lmfao you're a fucking retard with no concept of chaos theory
I don't believe in many worlds. But there is no such thing as the "macroworld"

>> No.11675542

>>11675532
Chaos Theory is fucking retarded, you worthless fucking faggot. It's not fucking possible to deviate from causality. There is only one way things can turn out. Kill yourself.

>> No.11675544

>>11675542
>wahhh wahhh determinism must be true wahhh wahhh
You're actually pathetic

>> No.11675549

>>11673587
Reminder that this dumfuck believes that you should try to quantize space. HA!

>> No.11675551

>>11673587
multiverse theory isn't even a theory.

it's the most natural interpretation of quantum mechanics, without any additional assumptions of wave collapse.

those assumptions are humans clinging onto their classical view of reality.

>> No.11675554

>>11675549
"should try to?"

we obviously have to. it's just that no one can do it (yet).

>> No.11675557

>>11675544
>>11675542
>>11675532
>>11675523
You are both fucking retards.

Believing in determinism as a religion is retarded.
But Chaos is deterministic as well, you fucking ignorant. Stochastic =/= Chaotic.

>> No.11675561

>>11675544
Everything is mathematics and there are no variables in the closed system. There is only one way you could have responded to my post. One exact wording. Not any way else. You could never respond to it with "You're wrong because of XYZ" or "You know what, you are completely right!" Accept that you have no free will and everything is predetermined.

>> No.11675563

>>11675554
No, you don't have to quantize space.
It has been very well proven since the 30's that you cannot discretize time without fucking up everything about physics. Why the fuck would space be discretizable and time not? Shut the fuck up.

>> No.11675566

>>11675523
this is just quoting out of context. the interesting point is that we're made of stars. not the dust part.

this meme just shows that you replace logical thinking with ... meme

>> No.11675567

>>11675561
You are wrong because Quantum Mechanics is true.

>muh hidden variables
proven wrong decades ago

>> No.11675571

>>11675567
Then why didn't you word it different, shithead?

>> No.11675576

>>11675563
oh, I thought you meant quantize spacetime, as in finding a theory of quantum gravity

as far as space and time themselves existing in a discrete form, who knows

>> No.11675582

>>11675571
I'm not him, I'm just another guy who got angry at your posts.

>>11675576
discretizing spacetime means discretizing time

>> No.11675587

>>11673587
I feel no sense of nihilism and still believe it is possible and even likely that multiple universes exist simply for the fact that number repeats endlessly and accounting for other scenarios makes it difficult to imagine 1 without everything > than 1.
Still, it has yet to be proven obviously.

>> No.11675588

>>11675582
>discretizing spacetime means discretizing time

isn't that different than just "quantizing" spacetime and its metric? in any case, we need a theory that includes both quantization and bending spacetime/gravity

>> No.11675590

>>11675557
You dumbfuck retard, the point is that stochastic initial variables fed into a deterministic chaotic system will still output fundamentally stochastic results with respect to the initial conditions.
That is, even if the "macroscale" is deterministic and chaotic, the fact that the fundamental particles are random means the total evolution of the universe is stochastic.

>> No.11675597

>>11675561
Free will is not dependent on non-determinism you absolute fucking idiot.
There is no determinism and there is no free will

>> No.11675601

>>11675597
>There is no determinism
There is
>there is no free will
Right. There isn't any.

>> No.11675605

>>11675588


>>11675590
You're the dumb one, did I ever said that wasn't the case, in my post?
And actually, you're partially wrong, depending on the type of system. There are chaotic whose phase asymptotically always approaches specific points, regardless of initial conditions, what changes is the path taken. You can definitely make a system with stochastic initial conditions that isn't very stochastic in results.

But the universe is stochastic, as far as what my opinion is.

>> No.11675606

>>11675601
why do you think there's determinism?

he's right that there can be no determinism or free will

>> No.11675607

>>11673587
>I don't understand something
>therefore nobody else does either
lol

>> No.11675609

>>11675551
i want someone to agree with my post

>> No.11675610

>>11675588
Forgot to answer.
Smolin and other burned heads actually believe in discretizing SPACETIME not the values of the norm of the metric tensor.

>> No.11675615

>>11675610
>Smolin and other burned
right I think we're on the same page now. I didn't know the guy or what he believed until now. but that is definitely out there

>> No.11675620

>>11675601
>There is
There has literally never been a single example of determinism ever recorded in any experiment or any experience that any human has ever had.
Determinism is accepted a priori, but has never been actually proven. Quite the opposite, stochastic has been recorded in every single experiment ever conducted in every single field of science.
From here the determinist says "it's just margins of error based on inexact equipment" but this is cope. We have incredible refined equipment and we can set up experiments that should have different results had they been actually deterministic, and it doesn't work.
Particles are random. There is stochasticism. Stop fucking coping.

>> No.11675630

>>11675171
retard

>> No.11675631

>>11675620
>"it's just margins of error based on inexact equipment" but this is cope
meh, hard to say it's cope since it's just an expected effect if the universe is deterministic. also, math makes it a little more precise. even if people are behind on the math until we need it, like with Bell's theorem

>> No.11675636

>>11675631
>copes in exactly the predicted way
>n-no it’s n-not cope
based retard

>> No.11675774

>>11675636
You could almost say they were determined to do just that...

>> No.11676129

>>11675601
((determinism)) is emergent, randomness is fundamental

>> No.11676173

>>11675609
No one agrees because it's fucking stupid. Multiverse idiots should be shot on sight.

>> No.11676766
File: 192 KB, 960x956, 1583807857971.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11676766

>>11674581

>> No.11676849
File: 79 KB, 500x485, the-i-have-a-superior-intellect-starter-pack-new-edition-34125094.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11676849

>>11674537
>>11674581
>>11674629
>>11674756
>>11675288
>>11675423
>>11675549
>>11675551
>>11675587
>>11675607

I insist, you should just join you local church if you are looking for mind comfort, because the things you believe in are EQUALLY RETARDED.

>> No.11678421

>>11676173
>>11676849
can either of you even write the Schrodinger equation and explain how it's used?

if not, just trust that, the multiverse interpretation isn't even something that needs to be made up. it's just the Occam's razor view of physics as we know it

>> No.11678451

>>11673587
>Multiverse

Which one? There are at least 9 fundamentally different meanings of the word.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse#Brian_Greene's_nine_types

>> No.11678474

>>11676766
how did Dawkins fall so far? The Selfish Gene and Extended Phenotype are essentially philosophy of science that radically changed the way a lot of people view evolution, yet he's against any questioning of the interpretation of physics.

>> No.11679264

>>11678421
i think you agree then. as we know it is the scientific safety net for being wrong or having to update. itd be nice if this stuff was not sold as popsci but as "this is what we have so far and we dont know what could come next."

>> No.11679271

>>11678474
>yet he's against any questioning of the interpretation of physics.
no he’s not you just can't read

>> No.11679276

>>11678421
>the multiverse interpretation isn't even something that needs to be made up. it's just the Occam's razor view of physics as we know it
>>>/x/

>> No.11679305

>>11673587
multiverse is at least testable in principle, unlike any god hypothesis.

Also, what’s your take on the universe? If you don’t think multiverse is possible on any level, inflation doesn’t hold, the Schrödinger equation isn’t universal and our universe isn’t an arbitrary (mathematical) structure. And do you think we can describe the universe in a way so fine-tuning isn’t a thing? Because here the cosmological principle appeals to me, that is our universe is fine tuned for organisms to be able to evolve because we wouldn’t exist otherwise.

>> No.11679315

>>11674283
>religion
>without afterlife
the central point of pic is flawed.

>> No.11679324

>>11675171
define “truth”

>> No.11679333

>>11675542
>Chaos Theory is fucking retarded
you should look up stuff before being convinced it sucks.
You seem to have no idea what chaos means in physics.

>> No.11679334

>>11676849
t. popsci pseud

>> No.11679345

>>11675609
I agree, MWI is the most elegant interpretation, in my opinion. But we know something is wrong with QM and/or GR, so it doesn’t really matter what interpretations we come up with for now.

>> No.11679353

>>11675567
how does randomness have anything to do with free will?

>> No.11679442

>>11679305
>multiverse is at least testable in principle, unlike any god hypothesis.
several flavors of it aren’t testable at all even in principle

>> No.11679447

>>11679345
>>>/x/

>> No.11679549

>>11679447
Okay, explain why perturbation theory diverges, where vacuum energy comes from, why there are density singularities and why cp-symmetry can be broken only using QM and GR. And these are just from the top of my head.

>> No.11679557

>>11679442
true, but they follow logically from assumptions we can test, except MWI.

>> No.11679583
File: 1.18 MB, 2400x1800, multiverse membranes concept1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11679583

>>11678451
For me it's the membrane multiverse

Even better if each individual universe contains its own fundamental constants, laws of physics, etc, which differ from ours, leading to universes vastly different from anything we can even conceive of

Which would also do away with problematic anthropocentric views like simulation hypothesis/religion by nature of us only being able to exist in the universe in which the fundamental constants/physical laws, etc.. are as they are now

Also from a scifi point of view the idea of invading other universes, having space battles within multiverse space, entering and exploring other universes with different fundamental constants, etc... is something really fucking cool

>> No.11679686

>>11673587
[A]n entire ensemble is often much simpler than one of its members. This principle can be stated more formally using the notion of algorithmic information content. The algorithmic information content in a number is, roughly speaking, the length of the shortest computer program that will produce that number as output. For example, consider the set of all integers. Which is simpler, the whole set or just one number? Naively, you might think that a single number is simpler, but the entire set can be generated by quite a trivial computer program, whereas a single number can be hugely long. Therefore, the whole set is actually simpler... (Similarly), the higher-level multiverses are simpler. Going from our universe to the Level I multiverse eliminates the need to specify initial conditions, upgrading to Level II eliminates the need to specify physical constants, and the Level IV multiverse eliminates the need to specify anything at all... A common feature of all four multiverse levels is that the simplest and arguably most elegant theory involves parallel universes by default. To deny the existence of those universes, one needs to complicate the theory by adding experimentally unsupported processes and ad hoc postulates: finite space, wave function collapse and ontological asymmetry. Our judgment therefore comes down to which we find more wasteful and inelegant: many worlds or many words. Perhaps we will gradually get used to the weird ways of our cosmos and find its strangeness to be part of its charm.[55][69]

—Max Tegmark

>> No.11679695

>>11679305
>testable in principle

I dare you to describe a single experimental setup for your multiverse theory that isn't 100% schizophrenic. I'll wait.

>> No.11679704

>>11679686
I didn't read a single testable thing in that whole wall of word vomit.

Next time try to provide a single test and prediction for your theory because that's how science works.

>> No.11679716

>>11679549
ignore that dumbfuck. all he does is post "go to x" and "schizo" whenever someone more intelligent than him says something he doesn't like

>> No.11679746

>>11674233
Probability is not randomness.
In randomness exact copies are possible.
So the universe is not random.

>> No.11679759

>>11674756
Think of a cloud of gas on the other side of the planet.
Just because there is another gas cloud doesn't mean its in another universe.

>> No.11679784

>>11675557
Determine means it's already happened, as the past has been determined.
The future is not determined nor has the universe been ordained.
Its like saying a fire is controlled when you have no idea how it started or where it is.
Chaos doesn't exist as that would mean randomness exists.When there is no proof of either.

>> No.11679802

>>11675620
The lack of any proof of randomness or determinalism is proof both are lies and falsehoods to undermine thought.
Its an act of confusion and deception.
To force this one or the other is to exclude observations and science.

>> No.11679824

>>11679695
D-branes from string theory would interact gravitationally, so collide some black holes and analyze the echo.

>> No.11679833
File: 179 KB, 1600x1150, 5abef91be9b555.36332524_original.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11679833

>>11679824
fucking kek my sides

>> No.11679850

>>11679716
t. schizo

>> No.11679872

>>11679850
You're a brainlet.

>> No.11679893
File: 24 KB, 355x480, 2048x2774_c72977bc-acfb-409f-84b3-3a541fe72e1a_large.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11679893

>>11673587
>Not believing in God and that he set the universe and all the laws as they are.
Cringe

>> No.11679920

>>11674233
This. Everything happens because it's caused to happen. Multiverse/"probabilities" bullshit is pseudoscience. Probabilities only exist from our perspective because we're not Laplace's demon.

>>11675544
>>11675557
Determinism is true and i can't believe there are people to doubt that unironically. The real debate should be determinism vs predeterminism.

>> No.11679941

>>11679893
Godfags should just try to develop time travel technology, if we can make a bootstrap paradox happen it would be proof that the universe is a design and as such was designed by someone (predeterminism)
It wouldn't be an anthropomorphic god (unless it's like Haruhi and the "goal" of the universe is for one fucker among us to have fun), and not necessarily a living being as we define them, but at least it'd be proof that reality has some kind of designer

>> No.11679984

>>11679920
Completely wrong, you’re mentally stuck in the 19th century and will never escape

>> No.11679987

>>11679872
wrong

>> No.11679992

>>11679984
Last time i heard that it was from a tranny.
Your so-called "debunks" of determinism are fucking nothing, just because you can't find the cause of something doesn't means it has no cause. Something that has no cause doesn't happen. Because why the fuck would it happen? By definition, it doesn't.

>> No.11679999

>>11679987
Right

>> No.11680008

>>11679920
causality and determinism are not the same thing

>> No.11680013

>>11679992
>Your so-called "debunks" of determinism are fucking nothing
All of physics since 1900 disproves determinism. You are a lost soul

>> No.11680015

>>11679999
“wrong” is right, right

>> No.11680016

>>11680008
Strict, invariable causality pretty much implies determinism

>>11680013
It really doesn't.

>> No.11680023

>>11680016
Yes it does.

>> No.11680024

>>11680023
How?

>> No.11680025

>>11680016
>Strict, invariable causality
doesn't exist

>> No.11680028

>>11680025
Yes.

>> No.11680029

>>11680015
"Your intelligence is low" is right
I bet you've never even gone to university

>> No.11680031

>>11680024
Bell’s inequalities (and other equivalent results) btfo local hidden variables and relativity btfos non local hidden variables. There’s no room in QM for anything deterministic

>> No.11680035

>>11680031
>Bell’s inequalities (and other equivalent results) btfo local hidden variables
No they don't retard, you can't prove the negative, there will always potentially be loopholes

>> No.11680036

>>11680029
wrong

>> No.11680039

>>11680035
Wrong. Learn what you’re talking about before you speak.

>> No.11680045

>>11680039
Even the people who conducted those tests admitted it brainlet. Bell tests can potentially prove the existence of a local hidden variable, but they can't prove there isn't one, simply because it's impossible to cover every single possibility with them

>> No.11680047

>>11680045
>Even the people who conducted those tests admitted it
Prove it.

>> No.11680051

>>11680024
>>11680035
>>11680045
We can set up experiments where we shoot electrons through silver plated glass that splits their movement along seperate paths, and we can set the paths up such that if it we're "secretly deterministic but we don't know" then 10% of the time it should go down path A and 90% of the time it should go down path B. We wouldn't know which path it will go down until afterwards, but when we run the experiment 10,000 times we would get ~1,000 electrons shoot down path A and ~9,000 electrons shoot down path B, IFF it were "underlying deterministic" and not truly random.

But that is not what happens. What actually happens is that it is 50/50. It is ALWAYS, ALWAYS 50/50. There are quite literally hundreds of variations of experiments that physicists have performed over the past hundred years and it's ALWAYS 50/50 even when it shouldn't be if it were "secretly deterministic and we just don't have the means of knowing".

It's not deterministc, anon. It straight up, full stop, is not deterministic. Watch through this lecture series:
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLUl4u3cNGP61-9PEhRognw5vryrSEVLPr

>> No.11680055
File: 118 KB, 468x454, 1310726787688.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11680055

>>11679893
>Not believing in God and that he set the universe and all the laws as they are.

>> No.11680058

>>11678474
He figured he could make more money of fedora books and arguing with retards.

>> No.11680060

>>11680047
https://physics.aps.org/articles/v8/123
>Yet no experiment, as ideal as it is, can be said to be totally loophole-free.

>>11680051
>There are quite literally hundreds of variations of experiments
>Finite number
Your point?

>> No.11680061

>>11680060
>Your point?
My point is that you don't even need hundreds of variations, even just the one is enough to immediately disprove determinism, and yet we have even hundreds more.
Determinism has been falsified. Only fringe physicists still hold on to the hope that there will be determinism.

>> No.11680068

>>11680055
>Implying a designer would necessarily care about humanity
>Implying they'd necessarily have a perception of time, let alone the same as ours
When you design something what matters is the output anon. People don't give a shit about what's going on between them inputing something and their shit outputing something. If there's a designer the only thing that matters to them is where the universe is supposed to lead, which might be completely unrelated to humanity.

>>11680061
>even just the one is enough to immediately disprove determinism
It isn't you fucking retard. You're talking as if you could know for sure that you made 2 particle strictly equal to each other, that nothing could make a difference between them. There's no way to know that. That's why the whole concept of loophole, and multiple versions of Bell tests, exist. People are trying to find out what is causing the change. Maybe one day we will, maybe we never will, but in any case proving the negative is impossible.

>> No.11680074

>>11680068
>You're talking as if you could know for sure that you made 2 particle strictly equal to each other, that nothing could make a difference between them.
This is correct.

>> No.11680077

>>11680060
>Far-fetched as it is
lol cope

>> No.11680081

>>11680074
Oh nevermind anon i thought you had at least the first idea of what you're talking about (jk i didn't)

>>11680077
What is your point?

>> No.11680084

>>11680068
But IF it were actually deterministic, then the paths of the particles would be different from what they are. Even though we wouldn't be able to predict it before hand, we would still have different outcomes in terms of the probability that the electrons go down path A vs path B. but that is NOT what happens. It is still completely random no matter how we establish the experiment.

We set up these mirros and silver electron splitters in such a way that IF IT WERE ACTUALLY DETERMINISTIC, 10% of the time it would go down this path and 90% of the time it would go down the other path. But it's still 50 50.

If the path were 10/90, then it would be deterministic.
The path is not 10/90.
Therefore, it is not deterministic.

>> No.11680087

>>11680084
>But IF it were actually deterministic, then the paths of the particles would be different from what they are
Not necessarily. Maybe none of the elements we tried to manipulate was actually relevant to this effect.

>> No.11680089

>>11680081
Don’t worry, I never thought you did either

>> No.11680094

>>11680081
is it possible to prove that the earth isn’t flat?

>> No.11680095

>>11680036
You've never gone to college and your IQ is about ~102

>> No.11680098

>>11680094
It's possible to prove that it is round.
By the way, this analogy outs you as someone with under 120 IQ by default. Not that i'm surprised.

>> No.11680099

>>11680095
wrong on both counts

>> No.11680102

>>11680087
Your cope is actually rediculous. No, we set these things up in thousands of variations with various ways to split the electrons and with photons and electrosn and entire atoms and even molecules consisting of hundreds of atoms and with hundreds of different materials and thousands and thousands of different variations of the experiments and it is ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS 50/50.
That's the part that's the most astounding, is that it's ALWAYS 50/50 regardless of what you do.

>> No.11680103

>>11680098
>It's possible to prove that it is round.
Nope, you could've forgotten to account for some elements

>> No.11680112

>>11679833
great point you’re bringing up here, now suck a dick and bounce, /pol/ is the other way.

>> No.11680115

>>11680102
Yes. And? That just means the cause is beyond our capacity to analyze or manipulate.

>>11680103
Anon, stop embarrassing yourself.

>> No.11680120

>>11680115
>stop embarrassing yourself.
Concession accepted.

>> No.11680123

>>11680120
>Concession accepted.
Concession accepted.

>> No.11680126

>>11680123
>>Concession accepted.
>Concession accepted.
Concession accepted.

>> No.11680134

>>11680126
Very mature anon. I wonder how many posts we could keep going like this just because you want to have the last reply, which to your primitive mind is equal to "winning", whatever that brings you.
I'm not gonna reply beyond this so enjoy getting it since you want it so much, i have better things to do with my time.

>> No.11680135

>>11680115
You're the only one embarrassing yourself by denying the litany of experiments that falsify determinism. It's literally just denying the consequent.

If quantum mechanics were actually deterministic, then the particle would go down path A 10% of the time and path B 90% of the time.
The paricle does not go down path A 10% of the time and path B 90% of the time, rather it is 50/50.
Therefore, Quantum Mechanics is not deterministic.

We perform this experiment and this logic in hundreds of variations of experiment with various particles and means of splitting particles and such, and it's ALWAYS 50/50 and NEVER the differing probabilities that underlying determinism would have.

>> No.11680139

>>11680135
>litany of experiments that falsify determinism
Even the people who conducted those experiments disagree with you. Even they admit it's impossible for a test to be fully loophole-free. Simply because human perspective is limited.
>If quantum mechanics were actually deterministic, then the particle would go down path A 10% of the time and path B 90% of the time.
If you manipulate the right factor(s), yes.

>> No.11680143

>>11680134
>I have better things to do with my time.
We both know this isn't true.

>> No.11680144

>>11680139
>Even the people who conducted those experiments disagree with you.
NO THEY DONT. That's the point. Non-determinism is the consensus. I don't know what you're talking about.
>If you manipulate the right factor(s), yes.
NO, you fucking idiot, that's the fucking point. NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO, IT'S ALWAYS 50/50. When it SHOULD be some other difference, it never is. Why are you having such a difficult time understanding this.

>> No.11680151

>>11680144
>I don't know what you're talking about
See >>11680060

>When it SHOULD be some other difference, it never is.
You don't decide when it should be some other difference. Only the factor does. If you can manipulate it then you get to decide.

>> No.11680176

>>11673587
This thread is so simple-minded I cannot believe it has so many responses.

>> No.11680181

>>11680176
First day? Simple minded threads are the only ones that get responses,

>> No.11680182

>>11680151
You are lost

>> No.11680209

>>11680182
Sure thing retard. You better hope humanity will stay in the wrong for at least your entire life span, before we manage to indentify and manipulate the hidden variable.

>> No.11680214

>>11680209
>jesus will come back any day now, just you wait!

>> No.11680218

>>11680214
I'm not saying it will happen, i'm saying you better hope it doesn't.

>> No.11680241

>>11680218
>i'm not saying jesus is coming back, i'm just saying he'll send you to hell when he does

>> No.11680247

>>11679345
thanks :3 and true, the interpretations are behind the math

>> No.11680251

>>11680209
Even if it existed and we could find it, I doubt we could manipulate it as by definition it would not be local.
Also I'm not idealogically invested in this beyond acceptance of current evidence. If it turns out that there is a hidden variable and it is deterministic then I'll have egg on my face for being wrong but I will accept it. Why would I hope against humanity learning things?

>> No.11680252

>>11680099
ok but why are you literally on the comp for hours insulting random people over nothing and a topic that you don't know about?

>> No.11680259

>>11680252
That anon is on here all the time going "go to x" or calling other anons "schizo" whenever they say something he doesn't like.
There are a lot of schizos on the board (electric universe dumbfucks are the main ones) but he/she calls literally anyone who disagrees with him about anything a schizo. He's very stupid

>> No.11680266

>>11680252
>and a topic that you don't know about?
wrong
>>11680259
>That anon is on here all the time
t. schizo

>> No.11680280

>>11680266
>literally proves me right in this post
Brainlet

>> No.11680287

>>11680280
wrong

>> No.11680292

>>11680287
You are a projecting brainlet schizo.

>> No.11680294

>>11680292
wrong

>> No.11680295

>>11680294
>Wrong
Prove it

>> No.11680296

>>11680294
even if he's wrong, you're the one that everyone hates in this thread now

>> No.11680302

>>11680296
wrong

>> No.11680305

>>11673587
There’s nothing wrong with believing in stuff. Fuck off edgy atheist.

>> No.11680309

>>11680296
I'm not wrong he's literally a brainlet
>>11680302
>wrong
Prove it

>> No.11680310

>>11680309
>I'm not wrong he's literally a brainlet
wrong

>> No.11680311

>>11675171
>Empiricism has been btfo multiple times throughout history

Never happened.

> it has no way of finding the truth.

Truth doesn’t matter. Only practical application matters.

>> No.11680313

>>11680310
>wrong
Prove it

>> No.11680319

>>11680311
>Never happened
Yes it has
Define "practical application"

>> No.11680325

>>11680319
>Yes it has

Name one time.

> Define "practical application"

Increases resource production capacity or benefits human health.

>> No.11680332

>>11680325
Prove empirically that "only practical applications matter"
Define "benefit"
Define "production"
Define "health"
Prove empirically that "improving" "production" and "human heath" is desirable.

>> No.11680346

>>11680332
>Prove empirically that "only practical applications matter"

That’s my personal value judgment. You’re free to disagree with it and instead value mumbo jumbo that has no effect on our lives.

>> No.11680361

>>11680346
Prove empirically that your personal value judgement is a practical application (because only empirically derived practical applications matter).
Prove empirically what it means for something to "matter"
Prove empirically what a value judgement is.
Prove empirically that I value mumbo jumbo
Prove empirically that mumbo jumpo has no effect on lives
Prove empirically what an "effect" is

>> No.11680364

>>11680361
>Doesn’t know what value judgements are

Lol

>> No.11680367

>>11680364
So you can't do it.

>> No.11680377

>>11680367
>So you can't do it.

Nah. I’m just neglecting to engage with a bad-faith actor.

>> No.11680643

>>11680377
I'm not arguing in bad faith nor am I an actor.
You just can't do it because the position you hold is retarded but you don't want to have to admit that.

>> No.11680664

wrong

>> No.11681830

>>11679893
based

>> No.11681851

>>11674906
maybe it's time to burn my meme folder
...again

>> No.11682011

>>11680309
>I'm not wrong he's literally a brainlet
i know you aren't. i was just saying, "even if"

>> No.11682046

is there literally any actual proof whatsoever in alternate universes? like actual proof, not literal unproovable mumbo jumbo

>> No.11682098

>>11680051

It's always 50/50 sounds like determinism to me. Seems like the experiment isn't having an effect on electrons and perhaps all electrons aren't the same.

It would be like trying to bend two types of metal that we think are the same. One is malleable; the other isn't. There are equal amounts of both metals. We put various types of pressure on them and it always turns out 50% of them bend.

>> No.11683679

>>11682046
No.

>> No.11684148

If anything in the past could have happened any other way then why didn't it? Checkmate MWI faggots. Stop pretending that existence is malleable.

>> No.11684189

>>11684148
It did, in different branchings of the multiverse

>> No.11684210

>>11673587
Does anyone actually think that? And if so, how is that a form of coping? Those other versions of you aren't you.

>> No.11684211

>>11684189
>>>/x/

>> No.11684213

>>11684211
>The Schrodinger Equation is >>>/x/

>> No.11684221

>>11684213
your schizo “””interpretation””” of it is >>>/x/

>> No.11684229

>>11673587
Popsci normies would be wearing 'I fucking love alchemy' t-shirts if they were born 100 years ago. Science is real magic to them; magic that is allowed to exist. These same people are too enlightened to believe anything that can't be experimented on and watched in a youtube video. These people vote.

>> No.11684233

>>11684229
>alchemy
>100 years ago
STEMoids are so retarded holy fuck

>> No.11684257

>>11679695
>schizophrenic
Psychology is quackery. Get the fuck out.

>> No.11684278

>>11675542
>he thinks chaos theory negates causailty
Oh boy you really are fucking retarded aren't you.

>> No.11684289
File: 95 KB, 546x790, simulation.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11684289

>>11674283

>> No.11684293

The absolute retardation of the psueds I'm thread that haven't idea what they are talking about is why this board is a shithole. Literal autists who shit post in place of actually doing any work to know what they are talking. You are all pathetic cretins that should die from Corona for the betterment of humanity because you are all worthless sacks of shit

>> No.11684297

>>11684211
>>11684221
>>/nigger/

>> No.11684307
File: 1.64 MB, 1241x1754, CONINTELPRO.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11684307

>>11684211
>>11684221
Why don't the mods ban this fucking moron, all he does on this board is post /x/ and schizo in literally every thread. If that isn't underage and troll posting I don't know what is. Maybe he really is too stupid to do anything else because he doesn't understand any of the topics here in which case it is low quality posting and dragging the overall quality of the board down. He should be banned and why aren't you fucking morons reporting him for doing it?

>> No.11684353

>>11673587
Your an idiot
You live in a magical universe here and now - your entire life is a fanciful unfolding of idiosyncratic events all of which create a narrative that explains your evolution - the entire universe is evolving similarly - the universe wants you to reach a higher plane - it nudges you or pushes you, a word, a person, an event, an experience, a saddening, a joy - you are given opportunities to take advantage of, to evolve - 10 times a day paradoxical things arise before you that are preloaded with custom intent, “ just for you.” To deny them is to be ignorant. Keep sleeping or wake up?

That’s the red pill

>> No.11684435

>>11684307
>noooooo stop calling me a retard you must be shilling for the heckin cia nooo
>>>/x/

>> No.11684699

>>11676849
rofl I started the r/Iamverysmart meme you fucking pseud faggot you can't even come up with an original insult

>> No.11684703
File: 1.86 MB, 340x204, joker.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11684703

>>11684435
>minimum wage to troll an anime forum

>> No.11684706

>>11684435
ok but you might actually be banned soon

>> No.11684714

this is the most degen thread I have seen on sci in months, sage in all fields kids

>> No.11684743

>>11679824
You misspelled 'brain,' fagget.

>> No.11684762

>>11684229
actually you are the popsci normie that has no idea wtf alchemy even is. Surprise you were the retard all along!

>> No.11684850
File: 39 KB, 750x679, 1589578129477.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11684850

>> No.11684874
File: 210 KB, 300x436, magic.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11684874

>>11684353

>> No.11684882

>>11684353
https://videos.utahgunexchange.com/watch/the-oath-of-the-black-sun_ODwmleZ4ppdxK8M.html

>> No.11685850

>>11684189
No they didn't. It's impossible for them to be different because this isn't bargain bin sci-fi work, this is the real world

>> No.11685860

>>11684703
>>>/x/
>>11684706
>d-daddy will come and save me from your mean words j-just you wait
cope

>> No.11686829

>>11684213
To be fair Schrodinger was a fucking schizo who believed in quantum mysticism (among other pseudoscience bullshit), thought humanity was God and is mostly remembered now for saying an animal can be both alive and dead at the same time (because according to him the universe only exists because we're observing it, again, humanity is God according to that guy). So yeah, he'd most definitely love /x/. They do love Serial Experiments Lain there, and it just so happens that this show runs on everything Schrodinger ever believed and stood for.

>> No.11686860

>>11673587
Bernie Sanders looking motherfucker

>> No.11686864

>>11685850
Shut the fuck up you dumb fucking retard.
The real world has an infinite multiverse where all possibilities take place in. You're just in one of them.

>> No.11686871

>>11686864
>The real world has an infinite multiverse where all possibilities take place in
>>>/x/

>> No.11686875

>>11686871
>the Schrodinger equation is >>>/x/

>> No.11686878

>>11686864
There's only one possible world. The world we are living in. Any thoughts of other (yous) living out remixes of your dull life is hogwash garbage or other worlds out there that are different from ours and I wish everyone who genuinely believed in suck infantile fucking faggotry would drown.

>> No.11686883

>>11686875
your schizo “””interpretation””” of it is >>>/x/

>> No.11686890

>>11686883
It's not an "interpretation", its just the Schrodinger equation

>> No.11686897

>>11686878
You're a dumb faggot who undoubtedly has never even gone through a QM class in university.

>> No.11686902

>>11686890
wrong

>> No.11686910

>>11686902
Cope

>> No.11686911

>>11686910
wrong

>> No.11686915

>>11686897
And you're a fucking retard for whom Rick and Morty and Star Trek are truth. Go back to /x/. Just get it through your fucking head that the number of "possibilities" is nonexistent. Fuck you I am tired of this fucking pretentious "le anything and everything is happening! there's a timeline where I don't suck horsecock for a living! Yayyyy!!!!" garbage polluting QM and other scientific discussions. Go fuck yourself with a hot knife you fucking faggot.

>> No.11686918

>>11686911
>>11686915
Cope

>> No.11686925

>>11686918
Seethe, MWIgger

>> No.11686927

>>11686925
Cope

>> No.11686930

>>11686927
>>11686918
wrong

>> No.11686939

>>11686930
cope

>> No.11686941

>>11686939
wrong

>> No.11686946

>>11686941
>the Schrodinger equation is wrong
cope

>> No.11686953

>>11686946
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is wrong

>> No.11686956

>>11686953
wrong

>> No.11686962

>>11686956
cope

>> No.11686965

>>11686962
>the schrodinger equation is cope
wrong

>> No.11686967

>>11686965
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11686969

>>11686967
>the schrodinger equation is cope
wrong

>> No.11686974

>>11686969
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11686983

>>11686974
>the schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11686985
File: 23 KB, 474x474, gaiygh.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11686985

>>11674233
>get machine that measures quantum states
>decide that I'll go to McDonalds for lunch if I get one outcome, Wendy's for another
>look at outcome and do it
>quantum randomness has now effected the macro scale

>> No.11686988

>>11686985
that retard is a shit for brains retard, he will not understand this

>> No.11687002

>>11686983
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687012

>>11687002
>the Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687021

>>11687012
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687026

>>11687021
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687027

It's like we're living in the pre-copernican era as regards universes. One day all you nay-sayers will be made to eat your words. How could you think that what we can see is all that there is? This is myopic thinking.

>> No.11687031

>>11686985
There can only be one outcome. It doesn't split. And even if it did nothing changes, you eat fucking fast food like the American faggot you are.

>> No.11687037

>>11687026
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687039

>>11687031
>There can only be one outcome
wrong
> if it did nothing changes
wrong

>> No.11687044

>>11687031
>There can only be one outcome
right
> if it did nothing changes
right

>> No.11687047

>>11687027
>>>/x/

>> No.11687050

>>11687037
>the Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong
>>11687044
Wrong

>> No.11687054

>>11687050
>>>/x/

>> No.11687056

>>11687050
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687058

>>11687047
Existence is infinite. Sorry. You may not like it, but that's what peak existence looks like.

>> No.11687062

What is even the word "cope" even meant to denote? I guess I'm just not up on my zoomer lingo.

>> No.11687064

>>11687054
>The Schrodinger equation is >>>/x/
wrong
>>11687056
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
wrong

>> No.11687067

>>11679893
The more that I learn science, the more that it is points to the existence of Chad

>> No.11687070

>>11687054
>le everything is x
what is the point of talking about science topics here if everything is sent to x

>> No.11687073

>>11687027
Even if every second there are other (yous) being made that are out there doing things other than suck dick, we will never be able to interact with them. They might as well not exist at all. So let's not get up in arms talking about this popsci faggotry.

>> No.11687075

>>11687064
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope and >>>/x/

>> No.11687082

>>11687070
not everything is /x/ but schizo shit like MWI is

>> No.11687086

>>11687075
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687089

>>11687073
I'm not even talking about other yous. For all we know the other universes don't have life in them at all. Their constants probably don't allow for life, like ours does by pure chance. What universe could you find yourself in? The one that allows for you to exist, of course.
>it's le popsci faggotry
This term is so overused now that it doesn't mean anything.

>> No.11687092

>>11687073
>If you can't interact with something it doesnt exist
wrong

>> No.11687093

>>11687082
Multiverse has nothing to do with MWI. I hate MWI as much as the next guy. Multiverse has nothing to do with it.

>> No.11687100

>>11687086
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687104

>>11687089
>>11687092
Cope.

>> No.11687105

>>11687100
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687107

>>11687093
one of the flavors of multiverse that schizos argue for is the ensemble of worlds in MWI

>> No.11687111

SCHIZO COPE
SCHIZO COPE
EVERYTHING IS SCHIZO COPE

>> No.11687112

>>11687105
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687114

>>11687104
>if you can't interact with something it doesn't exist
wrong

>> No.11687116

>>11687112
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687118

>>11687107
No. You're wrong. These are completely different ideas.

>> No.11687119

>>11687116
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687121

>>11687114
You parsed the words carelessly. I said it might as well not exist, not that it doesn't exist.

>> No.11687124

>>11687119
You know. I think people who spend all their time posting the word "schizo" on the internet are the real schizos.

>> No.11687126

>>11687119
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687128

>>11687124
Not him but there's a ton of blatant schizos, largely /pol/tards doing nothing but spamming about jews/trannies all day

>> No.11687130

>>11687126
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687135

>>11687124
Right
>>11687130
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687139

>>11687128
I think you're probably right. The scary thing is that they are infecting the general population with their schizophrenia.

>> No.11687144

>>11687135
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687151

Can someone explain what cope is?

>> No.11687152

>>11687144
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687154

>>11687152
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687156

>>11687152
I mean I like that you told him that he's wrong, because he's wrong, but what does "cope" mean?

>> No.11687159

>>11687156
wrong

>> No.11687160

>>11687154
Saying the same thing over and over again is the definition of schizophrenia, according to Albert Einstein.

>> No.11687170

>>11687154
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong
>>11687156
It means that reality is a way that is different from what he wants, so he tries to psychologically "cope" with it by denying reality and posting wrong things on internet forums.

>> No.11687175

>>11687170
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687177

>>11687175
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687182

>>11687170
>It means that reality is a way that is different from what he wants, so he tries to psychologically "cope" with it by denying reality and posting wrong things on internet forums.
Very accurate assessment of MWi retards actually
>WOWZA real life is just like Rick and Morty! In another universe maybe I'm not a virgin!

>> No.11687184

>>11687177
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687187

>>11687182
You have never studied any math or physics in a university
>>11687184
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687198

>>11687187
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687203

>>11687187
>You have never studied any math or physics in a university
Incorrect

>> No.11687214

>>11687198
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong
>>11687203
prealgebra doesnt count

>> No.11687220

>>11679315
You know, most religions in human history had no concept of an afterlife. That's a very recent phenomenon of western religions influenced by greek thought. Easter religions have reincarnation, but the goal there is generally to escape existence and stop living permanently. Only modern intersection with western thought tinged "escape from existence" with "escape to heaven".

>> No.11687229

>>11687214
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687231

>>11687229
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687234

>>11687214
>noooooo you can't disagree with my delusional fantasies and be good at math
Not only is this literally a cope, but understanding the math of QM and thinking about it for a few minutes is enough to refute the insane delusion of MWI

>> No.11687242

>>11687234
If the wave function follows the Schrodinger equation, then that immediately implies many worlds.
Denying this means you deny that the wave function follows the Schrodinger equation (in which case you're a schizo) or you dont realize WHY the wave function following the Schrodinger equation immediately and irrefutably implies many worlds (in which case you're a retard).
You don't understand math or QM

>> No.11687290

>>11687242
>If the wave function follows the Schrodinger equation, then that immediately implies many worlds.
No, it doesn't. The wavefunction isn't an observable.

>> No.11687318

>>11687231
your schizo """interpretation""" of it is cope

>> No.11687338

>>11679941
I wish it was like haruhi and i get to meet her.
I'll play kyon, and be tsundere about it.

>> No.11687476

>>11687290
>No, it doesn't.
Wrong
>>11687318
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11687564

>>11687476
cope
>>>/x/

>> No.11688642

>>11674233
Retard

>> No.11688713

>>11687564
>The Schrodinger equation is cope
Wrong

>> No.11688824

>>11688642
Cope

>> No.11688827

>>11688824
>quantum mechanics is deterministic
Wrong

>> No.11688830

>>11688827
>MWI is undeterministic
Factually wrong. Fuck your popscifi garbage.

>> No.11688838

>>11688713
>>>/x/

>> No.11688849

>>11673587
explain fine-tuning then

>> No.11688864

>>11688838
>The Schrodinger equation is >>>/x/
Wrong

>> No.11688866

>>11688864
your schizo “””interpretation””” of it is >>>/x/

>> No.11688868

>>11688866
>The Schrodinger equation is >>>/x/
Wrong

>> No.11688878

>>11688868
your schizo “””interpretation””” of it is >>>/x/

>> No.11688882

>>11688878
>The Schrodinger equation is >>>/x/
Wrong

>> No.11688886

>>11688882
your schizo “””interpretation””” of it is >>>/x/

>> No.11688888

>>11688886
>The Schrodinger equation is >>>/x/
Wrong

>> No.11688891

>>11688888
your schizo “””interpretation””” of it is >>>/x/

>> No.11688893

>>11688891
>The Schrodinger equation is >>>/x/
Wrong

>> No.11688910

>>11688893
your schizo “””interpretation””” of it is >>>/x/

>> No.11688930

>>11688910
>The Schrodinger equation is >>>/x/
Wrong

>> No.11688934

>>11688930
your schizo “””interpretation””” of it is >>>/x/

>> No.11688943 [DELETED] 

>>11688934
>The Schrodinger equation is >>>/x/
Wrong

>> No.11689110 [DELETED] 

>>11688943
your schizo “””interpretation””” of it is >>>/x/

>> No.11689341
File: 2.31 MB, 4000x2768, visual-summary-darkmode-4k.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
11689341

We're all living in a giant graph.

>> No.11689367

>>11689110
>The Schrodinger equation is >>>/x/
Wrong

>> No.11689544

>>11689341
We live in a straight line, faggot.

>> No.11689544,1 [INTERNAL] 

>you can't prove the negative unless you rephrase it
Well I know better now than to engage with the retard.