Math is the only field where we can be sure of anything. Every other field is jut "trust me bro, i know what I'm talking about"

File: 32 KB, 740x308, purity.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Sun Sep 29 17:49:52 2019 No.11018140 [Reply] [Original]

Math is the only field where we can be sure of anything.
Every other field is jut "trust me bro, i know what I'm talking about"

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 17:51:41 2019 No.11018142 >>11018140 Not true. Not even math is something we can be sure of (Godel). The only thing we can be sure of is that something exists (Descartes)

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 17:53:31 2019 No.11018145 File: 106 KB, 765x638, 20120620_-_dapres_xkcd_435.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 17:54:37 2019 No.11018148 >>11018145 My professional philosopher dad tells me this all the time.

Anonymous Sun Sep 29 18:03:25 2019 No.11018166

>>11018142
Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but Gördel doesn't state that we're uncertain about everything , just some things.
>>11018145
Math is both wider and more effective than philosophy because philosophy strives to uncover truths about texistence the world. Math goes beyond that , in that you choose the rule set and you couldn't talk about stuff that doesn't even exist in our world

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 18:53:52 2019 No.11018294 >>11018145 based

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 19:02:14 2019 No.11018313 >>11018140 Wrong every person that I've met that's graduated with a math degree is a moron who can't explain anything to anyone. Engineering is the only true science field. Keep being peasants

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 19:02:30 2019 No.11018314 >>11018166 math is literally applied philosophy

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 19:05:04 2019 No.11018319 File: 15 KB, 220x269, 220px-Frans_Hals_-_Portret_van_René_Descartes.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Lol, ok.

Anonymous Sun Sep 29 19:18:04 2019 No.11018345

>>11018145
bro what kind of job would I get as a philosopher? I don't care about shit loads of cash, just enough to breath air.
Also I consider math a philosophical art.
>>11018314
math is extremely formalized. I'd call it the formal philosophy of spaces, numbers, and measures (plus the extra).

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 19:48:15 2019 No.11018409 >>11018345 >what kind of job would I get as a philosopher? lawyer, professor, author, journalist, or politician

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 19:59:03 2019 No.11018441 >>11018140 math's internal consistency with itself is useless until you apply it to reality, however, so in practice it's even worse about that than most fields

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 20:05:53 2019 No.11018461 >>11018140 >>11018145 Define "purity"

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 21:33:37 2019 No.11018704 >>11018461 Closer to God

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 21:37:42 2019 No.11018721 >>11018145 What does thinking outside of the box even mean?

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 21:43:19 2019 No.11018742 >>11018721 As a philosopher, I don't understand it myself. Mathematicians are definitely outside the box. The idea that math caters to descriptions of the box (the physical universe) is not true.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 21:45:04 2019 No.11018746 >>11018140 >implying you aren't trusting mathematical proofs to not contain errors >implying things like Shinichi Mochizuki's flawed proof of the ABC conjecture don't exist

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 21:45:24 2019 No.11018748 >>11018721 >>11018742 the box is always relative, you can pretty much always make a bigger box and a smaller box than any thing you think about

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 29 23:20:55 2019 No.11018955 >>11018142 >The only thing we can be sure of is that something exists (Descartes) You can be sure that the statement "Assuming ZFC, then Zorn's Lemma is true" will always be true.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 00:34:21 2019 No.11019072 >>11018148 What does a professional philosopher do for a living?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 00:39:57 2019 No.11019082 >>11018140 Chemistry? A reaction either works or it doesn’t.

>>	Solivagus (Polynomial Philosop(...) Mon Sep 30 02:38:24 2019 No.11019226 >>11018345 Creator, God, Data entry

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 02:48:19 2019 No.11019235 >>11018140 Chemistry and physics are super intertwined imo

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 02:53:14 2019 No.11019241 >>11019072 Proffessiinal phylosophy

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 02:54:46 2019 No.11019244 >>11019082 Not a chemist, but isn't this guy totally correct?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 02:55:57 2019 No.11019247 >>11019241 I give you one final chance to answer me properly and avoid bringing dishonor to your father and his profession.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 02:57:02 2019 No.11019249 >>11019247 philosophy for money

Anonymous Mon Sep 30 03:04:23 2019 No.11019260

>>11018140
People asking about Philosophy jobs. My uncle has a PhD in it and he has worked for political think tanks, served on non-profit boards, consulted for a marketing group as well as television and been a lecturer at a university as his main gig. He also writes and publishes papers and has 2 books

Anonymous Mon Sep 30 03:12:13 2019 No.11019266

>>11019249
THAT'S IT, SWINE!
Let it be known that Anon, on this day of our Lord, hath shown a devilish contention towards reason, and spake in a way to undermine his own family's reputation. His mother and father, being whore and scoundrel, and he himself, the product of such a lowly union, prefer brutishness and mischievous lifestyles, and align themselves grossly to live in a way that is opposite civility.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 03:21:00 2019 No.11019281 >>11018142 imagine misinterpreting philosophy this hard

Anonymous Mon Sep 30 03:25:12 2019 No.11019288

>>11018742
I agree. Math extrapolates logical axioms to an extreme with no intentional/initial bearing on reality. Those who wish to logically model the physical world shape mathematics to their needs, but mathematics as purely conceptual as philosophy.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 03:55:59 2019 No.11019312 File: 104 KB, 800x600, Radical Kondoism.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>11018140 Maths and aesthetic sensibility are the only forms of knowledge we can have absolute certainity in.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 05:21:19 2019 No.11019384 >>11019312 Yellow fever fag

Anonymous Mon Sep 30 05:33:33 2019 No.11019398

>>11018140
Yes, because you make the rules yourself in math. Math only does deduction. You write your little axioms and then write theorems. But said theorems teach you nothing new, everything was already encoded within the axioms. It's boring and safe. Mathematicians are thoroughly afraid to try new things and perhaps be wrong.

The natural sciences are brave, they do not limit themselves to deduction and so they are actually capable of finding new things. Things like this, hypothesizing, experimenting, trying to figure out the truth from limited information, they make the mathfag extremely anxious.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 05:36:14 2019 No.11019399 >>11018140 The only field where we can sure of everything is engineering. When you walk over that bridge it doesn't collapse, that's because engineers know how to build a bridge that won't collapse.

Solivagus (Polynomial Philosop(...) Mon Sep 30 05:42:49 2019 No.11019408

>>11019266
Oh no! As ifeth these words and speaketh'eth had ever mattered! Like some fag who believes that writing in the fashion from teh Bible, or what they have experienced through stories of others, would somehow confer or convey the power that I wield which others obey!

>>11019398
= means 'maps to'
+ = give/add
- = take/sub
* = merge/function
÷ = sort/group

Anonymous Mon Sep 30 05:48:11 2019 No.11019410

>>11018166
>>11018166
For those models/axiomatic sets strong enough to contain the naturals and operators upon them then yes there may exist somethings logical unprovable. So might as well give up studying maths now as it’s impossible to know everything with maths so why waste your time.

Solivagus (Polynomial Philosop(...) Mon Sep 30 05:51:44 2019 No.11019412

>>11019410
Agreed. Computers should take over ALL mathematics that doesn't have any true/natural language mapping.

The basic four parts of arithmetic are really all anyone needs but not with bullshit 'word' problems. The teachers should be trained in basic translation methodology so they can generate on-the-fly examples of these basic four operations with story, rhetoric, and respect.

>Exaggeration for 'negative infinity' examples from calculus
>Expression for 'approaching infinity' examples from calculus
>Emphasis for 'positive infinity' examples from calculus

Those would be the only 'three computational classes of construction'.

Anonymous Mon Sep 30 05:55:10 2019 No.11019415

>>11019226
well I don't want to be a fucking god that sounds boring as hell.
and I hate lawyers and politicians. maybe I just won't pursue it professionally.
>>11019412
>calculus
wow, Solivagus, You aren't as cool as I thought you were. extremely cringe.
also if computers took over trivial math then engineers would be out of a job. I mean I'm not complaining but that would probably kill themselves out of the depression of the falling in their money over everything life style.

Solivagus (Polynomial Philosop(...) Mon Sep 30 05:57:19 2019 No.11019416

>>11019415
God isn't actually that boring, when you are the gaming/story/translation/sex god. It just takes a while to sort of whittle down 'if I was an eternal robot, what kind would I want to be in order to be a unique entry in the database?'

>extremely cringe.
Why do people advertise this? Perhaps on 4chan I could only ever come across as a cringe God? I don't really mind, the judgement exists in 'their' psychology. It just seems like a surprising response to others because people believe still that their judgement carries some weight, usually only because they still use money.
>I don't. Why the fuck would I?

And, more importantly, who cares if 'group' is out of a 'fixed time cycle of contribution to society'? We have 'other' groups.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 07:56:11 2019 No.11019566 >>11019408 >t. Faggot Your father would not be pleased

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 09:46:18 2019 No.11019711 >>11019399 >When you walk over that bridge it doesn't collapse Perhaps you meant: When you walked over that bridge, it didn't collapse.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 10:43:52 2019 No.11019826 >>11019244 he's correct in the same sense as >biology? well, it's either alive or it isn't is

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 16:21:14 2019 No.11020576 >>11018142 Can you fucking popscifags read for once what the statments of Goedels theorems actually mean

Solivagus (Polynomial Philosop(...) Mon Sep 30 16:58:11 2019 No.11020678

>>11019566
I'm amazed that you care about pleasing 'any' father in existence whatsoever, let alone mine. I'm not 'teh gay'.

>>11020576
Yes, it means at some point you all have to stop sucking his dick on an eternal time scale.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:12:58 2019 No.11020735 >>11018721 put someone in a box and think outside of it

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:13:49 2019 No.11020737 >>11020735 actually.. made me laugh. thanks anon.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:15:50 2019 No.11020747 Can I see a manifold of topological structures? No. Can I see a protozoan under a microscope? Yes. Therefore biology/biophysics/chemistry is the supreme science.

>>	Solivagus (Polynomial Philosop(...) Mon Sep 30 17:16:22 2019 No.11020750 >>11020747 Correct! Show & Tell is teh beast!

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:19:58 2019 No.11020760 >>11020747 >Can I see a manifold of topological structures? brainlet lacking visual imagination

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:20:13 2019 No.11020761 >>11020750 Yes otherwise there is a theoretical drift, where arguments are being sustained on logic alone. It may turn out the natural word doesn’t conform to our understanding of logic. So science should be observation-centric.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:21:15 2019 No.11020764 >>11020760 That’s in the same category of mental activity as imagining a cartoon gumdrop world or imagining there is a god...

>>	Solivagus (Polynomial Philosop(...) Mon Sep 30 17:21:31 2019 No.11020765 >>11020761 I agree. Observation & physical experimentation. All other shit is just mental gymnastics for sapiosexuals. >>11020764 You rang?

Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:23:48 2019 No.11020771

>>11020765
Right. A lot of current physics is “this model or explanation is consistent with the observational data” that’s nice but a lot of things can be consistent with the data but still be inadequate. Consistency isn’t enough of a criterion to establish truths. We need to also predictively experiment and succeed. So observation and physical experimentation, that’s exactly it.

>>	Solivagus (Polynomial Philosop(...) Mon Sep 30 17:24:33 2019 No.11020773 >>11020771 Observation, experimentation, translation, and distribution methodologies then.

Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:27:18 2019 No.11020783

>>11020773
Well to distribute methodologies or models presents an additional burden for experimentation. It may turn out that a successful mode is only locally true and to establish it as true in wider contexts will require further research and experimentations.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:27:58 2019 No.11020787 >>11020764 Mental activity is the only realm that matters.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:28:21 2019 No.11020788 Successfully model*

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 17:29:42 2019 No.11020792 >>11020787 In a roundabout way maybe sure, but mental activity needs a basis in the world to function correctly. Otherwise it sort of untethers.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 19:26:05 2019 No.11021172 >>11019399 The engineers knew how to do that because of the math that describes the system, so it still just goes back to math.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 19:27:25 2019 No.11021181 >>11020747 Whether or not you can see something has literally no bearing on it's existence. When people hallucinate the see things that aren't real, and anytime anyone does any higher math they prove the existence of things we can't see.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 19:55:01 2019 No.11021242 >>11021181 math alone doesn't prove anything other than itself

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 30 20:35:39 2019 No.11021349 >>11019399 Nice b8

>>	Solivagus Mon Sep 30 20:38:15 2019 No.11021356 >>11021242 Correct. It is the original intellect trap for pre-homosexual gods. >I will never be gay or bi or even engage in homosexual/lesbian culture. Why? Because they are abusive individuals, no matter how happy they appear in public.

>>	Solivagus Mon Sep 30 20:54:19 2019 No.11021401 >>11021356 Unless they live together as 3 or more. It is the binary homosexual couple that is the ultimate mathematician.

>>	Solivagus Mon Sep 30 20:55:21 2019 No.11021410 >>11021401 >t.self+(You)+1 Laser 4chan tongue language

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/sci/ - Science & Math