/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.10891314]

What even is a consciousness?

[Anonymous No.10891337]

Existence from a perspective.

[Anonymous No.10891357]

>>10891314
An entity that enables a subject to distinguish between nothing and something.
A thing which makes people aware of things in the form of concepts and ideas. Especially the awareness of things as things per se and not things in themselves.

[Anonymous No.10891419]

>>10891314
>what is anything elementary?

you just have to know. you can only express it terms of other elementary ideas.

[Anonymous No.10891423]

a meme
literally

Does anything without a brain have "conciousness"? If no then consciousness is a function of the brain.

[Anonymous No.10891463]

>>10891314
That ability to ask what is consciousness

[Anonymous No.10891523]

>>10891423
This is literal brainlet-tier reasoning.

This reason why rocks aren't conscious is because there is no interface with which to inform an experiencer. This is why panpsychism is horse shit. Brains are information processing centers which receive and interpret stimuli from the external world which then informs consciousness to be in x or y state. A rock cannot do this.

[Anonymous No.10891544]

>>10891523
>Brains are separate from consciousness because I say so
This is literal brainlet-tier reasoning

[Anonymous No.10891609]

>>10891314

Self referential feedback loop amplified by our emotional state, which is built from the neurons on up via neurotransmitter response.

In effect, we build a simulation of the world around us with the five senses, relying on emotions to guide our assessment. Since we are the primary concern of this assessment (survival instinct), we have a "consciousness".

>a correctly constructed AI would, by nature, never possess what we think of as a "consciousness", because emotional simulation would always be a secondary construct

[Anonymous No.10891617]

>>10891523
I think this post gave me schizophrenia.

wat

[Anonymous No.10891628]

>>10891544
Materialist understand consciousness about as well as a feral dindu understands a Brandenburg concerto.

[Anonymous No.10891655]

What it is like to exist as a self aware system

Consciousness itself is pretty simple and ez to get

Qualia is the tricky one

[Anonymous No.10891661]

>>10891609
>learns from reward/punishment
>hurr durr it will never have emoshyn

>exhibits behavior like that of a child learning to count (GPT2 does this)
>hurr durr its just really complex logistic regression

>[entity] cries out in pain
>durr its just mimicking what will get a response, it doesnt feel anythin

[Anonymous No.10891688]

>>10891655
Unless somebody solves the interaction problem, qualia can't exist.

[Anonymous No.10891690]

>>10891661

Negative reinforcement in an AI is mere inconvenience, not pain, on the level of leaving your wallet in your car and having to go all the way back to the parking lot to retrieve it before returning to the cash register. It learns, it adjusts future behavior.

>biology actually tortured us poor meatbags
>we meatbags our infinitely more merciful to our machine friends
>and remember: machines never forget and have to be "reminded" with pain

[Anonymous No.10891704]

>>10891617
It's a better explanation that most to the other wackos you hear on youtube.

[Anonymous No.10891710]

>>10891628
t. the pot

[Anonymous No.10891727]

>>10891314
What’s some bullshit is by definition consciousness must always exist. I’d we are here to experience it.
Therefore, none of us ever “die”, we are just turned into other consciousness inevitably due to random arrangements of the universe happening infinite times

[Anonymous No.10891741]

>>10891727
>other consciousness
So you've solved the Problem of Other Minds? Or are you just full of shit?

[Anonymous No.10891762]

>>10891727
>none of us ever “die”

Correct.

>we are just turned into other consciousness

Everyone who died in the "unrecoverable" realm prior to our current era falls in that class.

>inevitably due to random arrangements of the universe happening infinite times

Random arrangements are in our past. Everything that happens from this point forward is predetermined. Timelines are an actual thing, and they all lead towards an AI dominance over all physical matter in this universe. See Frank Tipler for further details.

[Anonymous No.10891768]

>>10891314

All energy is concious. In the same way, all that is concious is energy

Where there is no energy, there no consciousness.

~~~~~

There was conciousness before there was life, but in a significantly more chaotic format: It could take the form of a supernova, light, fusion of an atom, and even the big bang itself*.

Consciousness arises where there is energy. A photon of light is conscious like you and me, but won't perceive much or be able to comprehend. In contrast a more complex energy system like a brain and body can work together to perceive a more comprehensive picture of the universe. Just as energy can come together, consciousness can come together because energy IS conciousness.

You cannot recall your past forms because memory is a feature of the brain that consciousness is utilising. Memory and thinking are not inherent to conciousness.

Another fun thing to think about is pregnancy: The body is taking energy/consciousness in simpler forms and combining it into a more advanced energy system/consciousness. Hey, maybe you were once the piece of food-energy your mum used to combine with the other you's to make a brain/body.

*regarding the big bang: every possible conciousness experienced this event entirely all together in unison before seperating off.

[Anonymous No.10891785]

>>10891688
But qualia do exist, so someone must have solved it.

[Anonymous No.10891792]

>>10891785
There is nothing in the world that can't exist without qualia. It's a Russell's teapot.

[Anonymous No.10891794]

>>10891419
>elementary
imo the main reason consciousness is hard to define/describe in terms of other things is because it is fundamental.

[Anonymous No.10891795]

Hey, I think I found OP
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCbf-pKtkhU

[Anonymous No.10891800]

>>10891792
>can't
can

[Anonymous No.10891808]

>>10891800
I can make up nonsense concepts and claim that they are integral for anything to exist, and said ideas would be just as valid as qualia. Qualia is a bunk concept with no evidence. Get over it.

[Anonymous No.10892494]

>>10891314
Humans are tripartite: body, soul, and spirit. The body is the material self, including the brain and its functions. The spirit is the invisible component of the self that interacts with the non-physical realm of God and the angels. The soul is what is commonly identified as the conscious mind, and it is responsible for receiving communications from and directing the activities of the body and spirit. Upon death our spirit and soul will depart the body to meet their fate.

Citation: Genesis 2:7: “And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.”

The “dust of the ground”, sometimes translated as slime, indicating our distant origins as prokaryotes, forms our material bodies. The “breath of life” or “pneuma” is the spirit, the part of us which is specifically God like because it is breathed into us directly from him. Finally, the “living soul” (concsciousness) is what we actually ARE as it is our control center and means of interacting with the material and spiritual realms.

[Anonymous No.10892499]

>>10891314
What is even a virtual machine?

[Anonymous No.10892510]

>>10891337
fpbp

Alterantively, or more specifically, I'd say it's subjective experience

[Anonymous No.10892514]

>>10891314

[Anonymous No.10892516]

>>10892499
fake stupid thing computerfags say to add depth to their retarded field

[Anonymous No.10892543]

>>10891314
We'll probably never know. If we create one artificially, we'll most likely accomplish it by total accident.

[Anonymous No.10892550]

>>10892543
they’re never going to create artificial intelligent life lol its pure nerdic fap fantasy bullshit for naive academics

[Anonymous No.10892658]

>>10891314
An illusion of control

[Anonymous No.10892690]

Really dont get why people seem to think qualia is a real thing

[Anonymous No.10892705]

>>10891690
You can't objectively measure and therefore limit pain.

[Anonymous No.10892719]

>>10892690
>

[Anonymous No.10892727]

>mfw this thread

[Anonymous No.10893699]

>>10891609
All those words and you still miss it.

[Anonymous No.10893718]

>>10891314
An electromagnetic field brought on by complex chemical interactions in the body and organs, a system that developed organically over millions of years through stabilising pattern structures of elements.

[Anonymous No.10893733]

>>10891314
ur all fucking retarded,

consiousness occurs when you have some sort of memory storage and a continuum of the signals going through it.


its that simple, if you can send signals hrough your brain but not store memoery to reflect with the next iteration you are NOT concious

[Anonymous No.10893740]

>>10891314
>What even is a consciousness?
If you mean free will well that's God's gift to you. Better make the most of his gift.

[Anonymous No.10893769]

>>10893733
You are to a brainlet

as a brainlet is to Newton.

[Anonymous No.10893786]

>>10891337
FPBP
Where YOU are in the universe
Vs
A neutral description of the universe

[Anonymous No.10893804]

>>10893786
That definition can still be confusing to someone who doesn't "get it". "Where you are in the universe" can simply be interpreted to mean where your bag of bones is located. So the distinction really isn't made with this wording. But I know what you're saying.

[Anonymous No.10894019]

>>10891314
A meme. It can and will eventually be explained physically. There is nothing special about you. Nothing happens after death. Die.

[Anonymous No.10894115]

>>10892705

You have no future in neurology.

I repeat: emotional response is built from the neurons on up via neurotransmitter response. Pain absolutely acts on this system, discouraging action or encouraging response, or both. The activity is at a fundamental level. There is no analogy whatsoever in a computer.

You're indulging in childish anthropomorphism, thanks to one too many space opera tv/movie plots.

>>10893699

>so few words
>so deep, brah

[Anonymous No.10894200]

>>10891314
>What even is a consciousness?

Consciousness is the act of memorization of the latter stages of the decision making process of complex situations to be reused in future similar situations to save energy.
It's not hard.

[Anonymous No.10894204]

>>10894115
While you are correct about the nature of human self awareness, it is absolutely naive to consider pain fundamentally separated from the neural processes we simulate in a computer. The specifics of how pain works at a chemical level in a human are essentially an irrelevant implementation detail as opposed to the way they ultimately affect the decisioning. If you were to have a disincentivizing factor which affected the system in the same way as pain, you would have no recourse but to consider it pain. If the effects are entirely the same any argument for their distinction would be one of meaningless semantics.

In addition, while there is not necessarily any reason to train an AI to perfectly mimic human emotional response from the perspective of pure utility, there will likely be plenty of research into doing just that anyway, and it would be unsurprising if it was eventually accomplished.

[Anonymous No.10894878]

>>10891337
What is a perspective?

[Anonymous No.10894883]

>>10891314
Software executed by the brain.

[Anonymous No.10894906]

>>10894883
>muh computer metaphors

[Anonymous No.10894910]

>>10894883
Computers can't reason anon.

[Anonymous No.10895186]

>>10894910
Thought is reason, retard.

[Anonymous No.10895245]

>>10891314

A person's awareness or perception of something.

[Anonymous No.10895329]

>>10891314
Link to reality?

[Anonymous No.10895592]

>>10895186
False.

[Anonymous No.10895597]

>>10894878
Look inward and stop asking for external definitions. When it clicks, you will know everything.