/sci/ - Science & Math

[Anonymous No.10442260]

What ever happened to Graphene? wasn't it supposed to change the world and why hasn't it been mass produced yet?

[Anonymous No.10442329]

They started making pencils with it.

[Anonymous No.10442735]

>>10442260
I think it's gonna take some more years until we see commercial use made out of it (other than pencils).
If you feed silkworms with graphene injected food, their silk becomes conducting which may be used for wearables (if the resistance is reduced lol)

[Anonymous No.10442772]

>>10442260
graphene was never good

[Anonymous No.10442858]

>>10442772
well yes as of today I agree, I'm just wondering when it will become good. Like fusion It has the potential to change everything and finally bring the future we always wanted.

[Anonymous No.10442867]

>>10442735
I will bet you $1000 that this will never become a viable technology

[Anonymous No.10442890]

>>10442260
they started making clothes with it. Just use google (or bing).

[Anonymous No.10442901]

>>10442260
The big application for graphene was microelectronics because electrons go fast in it. The problem is that graphene has practically no bandgap, so while graphene transistors can switch at THz speeds, because there's no bandgap they consume a lot of power when switched off.
>>mass produced
we literally can't mass produce it. It's the same problem with carbon nanotubes or mostly any other nanomaterial, making damn near atomically perfect materials is nigh impossible by just herding atoms around. And if its not atomically perfect it's a meme.
>>10442890
>>10442735
wow we mixed graphene oxide flakes with shit to make something that's marginally more conductive than if we used graphite powder. I mean at least nanotubes already find use as a lightweight electrical conductor for aerospace applications.

[Anonymous No.10442914]

>>10442260
>wasn't it supposed to change the world

No, it like many other things is just a grant chasing mechanism. Meaning, it is only good to get someone to pay you money to research it for a few decades to keep you in comfy money without much work. Then when it dries up you move to the next, "wonder material."

[Anonymous No.10442951]

>>10442858
>bring the future we always wanted
explain how graphine can make anime real right now

[Anonymous No.10443137]

>>10442901
>switched off
can hardly even call it even switching off, on-off ratio is typically like 10, while Si on off is 10^5

[Anonymous No.10443158]

>>10442951
brain computer interfaces become possible making full immersion VR viable, say good by to boring rl and hello to your favourite degenerate anime fantasies.

[Anonymous No.10443160]

>>10442901
>there's no bandgap they consume a lot of power when switched off.
explain this pls

[Anonymous No.10443161]

>>10442901
>practically no bandgap
>practically

[Anonymous No.10443173]

>>10442951
small vr google looking headsets can trasnfer enough data for insanely realistic games

[Anonymous No.10443174]

Head uses it in tennis racquets.

[Anonymous No.10443208]

>>10442260
that's how condensed matter research memes work, a lot of hot air that doesn't deliver anything substantial even after decades
>>10442914
also this

[Anonymous No.10443541]

>>10442867
>I will bet you $1000
No you won't. There is no wagering at 4chan, Grandpa.

[Anonymous No.10443701]

Graphene is a useless meme just like perovskites

This post made by III-V gang

[Anonymous No.10445269]

>>10443208

[Anonymous No.10446518]

>>10445269
graphene cucks SEETHING

[Anonymous No.10446646]

>>10443701
fuck you, I am doing my research about tandem silicon/perovskites solar cells.

[Anonymous No.10446727]

>>10443701
>Graphene is a useless
Yep
>just like perovskites
Actual III-V copelet

[Anonymous No.10446767]

>>10445269
haha XD, you got me good fren

[Anonymous No.10446863]

>>10442260
They can't produce the stuff in a quantity and quality needed.
There a study showing that all "Graphene" producers in North America were selling anything but. Also a lot of the stuff doesn't scale so straighforwardly as people believed.

[Anonymous No.10448098]

>>10442260

That's the problem. Mass production on a scale to be able to change the world is prohibitively expensive. Our current manufacturing process can't scale for shit with it.

That said though, it's a magic material with damn near limitless possibilities.

[Anonymous No.10449345]

>>10446646
>>10446727
enjoy unemployment once the perovskite bubble bursts

I'll be loving life in defense or telecom

[Anonymous No.10449987]

>>10442260
They're not done making the skin types. Koreans need more tissue samples to start finding skins, maiming them and then grinding them up for use in the machines so they can sell indivisibility. The koreans are at war because your lawful systems sent their powerful and willing to prison.

Like literally you'll hear about korean women popping open in water like its normal because they aren't keeping up with the doses and things like that and the tissues and things get picked up as anemones. It's disgusting shit so the whole thing has been put on hiatus until the degeneration of the effect isn't so scholastic as it is academic. The students aren't hurting the problem, they're terrible at it, but they aren't sizing down the issue with the directive of actually completing a task before getting on to be divisive about the problem. They are all wetbacks right now. Wetbacks with their wetback masters saying no! you cannot be a white slave like them. Go now and eat water butt. Also don't forget to brush!

[Anonymous No.10450051]

>>10442260
Don't know about graphed but I heard carbon-60 (buckyballs) was found to have respiratory irritant properties similar to asbestos.

[Anonymous No.10451153]

>>10442260
What do you mean what happened to it? I'm a 30 year old boomer and I've heard about graphene for 20 years now. The progress made is gradual but linear. You're too used to exponential growth that are in many other sectors but graphene production is hard to scale thus the prices won't come down and start an exponential production.

The production cost are already 100x cheaper than in the 1990s but it needs to be 100x cheaper again for it to be used in mainstream (but still luxury) products.

It's already used for military and very high tech processes like being catalysts in factory processes, Being used as a filter in ISS space station modules and with professional tour de france bikers they use carbon nanotube bikes peppered with graphene to make it a couple grams lighter than the competition for tens of thousands of dollars which could give them those couple seconds edge to win the race.

DARPA also already has made rudimentary graphene processors that work at the terrahertz scale and are shown to work at exahertz scale when combined with superconductors.

This means that graphene CPUs will give us a potentially trillion times faster CPU compared to the silicon we are using now which is already going to halt progressing in the next couple of decades.

Since this is /sci/ I'll delve a little deeper. We're at 7nm nodes for silicon transistors. The fundamental limit lies at 1.1nm which is the atom size of silicon and holds the absolute lowest we can go with silicon. This gives us 20 years of die shrinks before we reach the physics limit of silicon. Sure we could optimize the architecture. Code better and more efficient etc to squeeze out another 50-300% performance increase from that point but after that we'd basically be stuck. Graphene would immediately give trillion x increase in processing power. It would be like going from a 1949 (very fast) vacuum tube computer to a transistor based GPU. Don't underestimate Graphene.

[Anonymous No.10451716]

>>10451153
graphene bandgap is too low, gallium arsenide is the future

[Anonymous No.10452003]

>>10451716
>>10443701
I respect III-V and it's current uses, but I think for the consumer electronics industry, SiGe and Ge (group IV materials) won't be dethroned.

>>10451153
>Don't underestimate graphene.
Please explain to me, in detail, how you plan to solve the problems of:
>lack of charge density
>inability to produce defect-free graphene on non-Cu substrates
>low-defect, thermodynamically stable gate dielectric formation
>poor ON/OFF current ratio
>etc.

At least GaAs-anon >>10451716 has some footing, given GaAs (III-V)-based materials have already been in use for decades. GaAs, InGaAs, or GaN would see the light of day (in the consumer space) long before graphene would. Graphene has always been a funding gimmick.

As it stands, 7 nm will be sticking with Si FinFETs, 5 nm will introduce SiGe FinFETs, and 3 nm might introduce GeOI GAA stacked nanosheet FETs, if the short-channel effects can be surmounted in Ge. If negative capacitance FETs are feasible in volume, then 7 nm might be a good point to introduce them. Non-consumer markets are looking towards InGaAs, GaN, Ga2O3 and other alternatives, from what I've heard.

>>10446646
>perovskites
>stable
Pic related.

[Anonymous No.10452025]

>>10452003
5nm has been demonstrated by IBM with GAAFET pure Si.

[Anonymous No.10452054]

graphene can do anything except leaving the lab

xD

[Anonymous No.10452069]

>>10452025
Lab demonstrations and high-volume manufacture-for-sale are two different beasts. The problem with GAA FET technology is the associated cost increases due to the increased complexity during fabrication. SiGe is already well studied, in-production, and can easily (comparatively) be worked into existing FinFET process flows. I don't think industry will pull the trigger on GAA until it's absolutely necessary, at which point whether its SOI, GeOI, or SiGeOI, or a bulk substrate of those will likely depend on the short-channel behavior of the devices.

[Anonymous No.10452100]

>>10443541
this isn't 4chan

[Anonymous No.10452110]

TF ever happened with vacuum channel transistors

[Anonymous No.10452123]

>>10449987
I have questions.

[Anonymous No.10452137]

>>10449987
Based and schizo pilled

[Anonymous No.10452508]

>>10452003
Are you a grad student

[Anonymous No.10452575]

>>10452508
FBI, please.

[Anonymous No.10453010]

>>10452025
As a follow up to that thought, though, IMEC is also heavily-invested in the GAA nanowire FET demonstration race, with its recent demonstration of GAA Ge nanowire FETs this past year, and their previous demonstrations of InGaAs nanowire GAA FETs grown on Si. Pic related-ish.

I love both group IV and III-V materials and think they're all very interesting (read: fun) to work with, from a research perspective. I'm not biased to any one material system, but I think industry will always choose the path of least resistance and lowest cost to scale up.