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/sci/ - Science & Math


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10333175 No.10333175 [Reply] [Original]

Is it true that coding is gonna be blue collar work?

Personally, I would like to learn to code, but also go beyond that and become prodigious. I've never been good at math though, but I'm an introvert, who can do research on his own. What is the easiest way to starting learning computer science without a degree? I don't want to be a code monkey, I want to actually understand why certain things work the way they do.
t. ex-chemfag who is now in sales

>> No.10333183

>>10333175

http://4chan-science.wikia.com/wiki/Computer_Science_and_Engineering

>> No.10333189

>>10333183
Thank you for the resource, will learning CS also automatically make me an IT wiz?

>> No.10333200

>>10333183
Also, how fast can I resonably learn all the things in the resource you gave me?

>> No.10333450

>>10333175
>Is it true that coding is gonna be blue collar work?
Very likely. Consider these:
1. Some European countries are already having coding as mandatory school subject. Other countries are will eventually follow the example.
2. There's a massive, coordinated push to get more and more people into CS every year. "More women to CS," "More diversity to CS," "Coal miners into coding" etc.
3. Programming languages and software libraries are getting easier and easier to use.
4. Traditionally there hasn't been so many coders because the general public has erroneously regarded CS as some difficult math-heavy subject for high-IQ people. Now they are slowly starting to realize that the any idiot could do that shit.

Personally I have master's degree in CS, and currently doubling down on my mistake by studying for a PhD to minimize the damage.

>> No.10333490

>>10333200
A business major once self studied the MIT CS curriculum in under a year.

>> No.10334817

>>10333450
Then what the fuck do I study if I dont want to die a poor loser

>> No.10334840

>>10334817
medicine/law

>> No.10334884

>>10333175
Computer science isn't coding my unemployed journalist friend.

All those things you read on the wiki won't help you if you just want to code.
What you want is web dev or some simple shit like that. Computer architecture won't really have much of a use there.
For that simply learn JavaScript, PHP,
Html, and other languages like those. Add in java or python for good measure and you're all set to go. Yes that will make you a code monkey but that's all it takes to have a decent job. For anything else it will be hard to be taken seriously without a degree.
>>10333189
IT isn't coding and learning some of those resources would overqualify you for IT. A simple associates is all it takes for a job in IT.

>> No.10334891

Coding is already blue collar work. Though it's slightly easier to jump into higher level white collar work (e.g. system architecture) than say a construction worker becoming an architect.

>> No.10334897

>>10333175
Simple programming, the sort that would become blue collar, is going to be taken over by machine learning (or so-called AI).
>https://willrobotstakemyjob.com/15-1131-computer-programmers
>https://www.v3.co.uk/v3-uk/news/3022589/ai-could-replace-coders-by-2040-say-academics

>> No.10334900
File: 55 KB, 574x839, typical cs degree.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10334900

>>10334884
>Computer science isn't coding my unemployed journalist friend.

With how much it's been watered down, it may as well be,

>> No.10334904

>>10334900
You can take your envy elsewhere my low IQ friend

>> No.10334906
File: 178 KB, 1068x1142, howto_into_cs.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10334906

>>10334900
Just because you attend a shit college doesn't mean the field itself is shit.
This is what a proper curriculum should look like.

>> No.10334909
File: 55 KB, 659x1078, 6_most_profitable_degrees.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10334909

>>10334900
>>10334906
As for pay.
>See picture.
And just in case you're too retarded to understand what entry-level means:
>An entry-level job is a job that is normally designed or designated for recent graduates of a given discipline and typically does not require prior experience in the field or profession. These roles may require some on-site training. Many entry-level jobs are part-time and do not include employee benefits. Recent graduates from high school or college usually take entry-level positions. Entry-level jobs targeted at college graduates often offer a higher salary than those targeted at high school graduates. These positions are more likely to require specific skills, knowledge, or experience.[1] Most entry-level jobs offered to college graduates are full-time permanent positions and some offer more extensive graduate training programs. While entry-level jobs traditionally required no experience, the Great Recession produced a surplus of college graduates on the job market and eliminated many entry level positions.[2][3]
Source:
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entry-level_job

>> No.10334911

>>10334904
>he doesn't get it

>> No.10334913

>>10334909
>CS
>Popular Jobs: Web Developer

Way to debunk your own point here >>10334884

>> No.10334918

>>10334911
>he thinks people will take him serious if he post memes

>> No.10334921

>>10334918
>He really doesn't get it

>> No.10334922
File: 109 KB, 600x588, guts_berserk.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10334922

>>10334913
Holy fucking shit, READ THE FUCKING POST, OR I'M GOING TO BASH YOU AGAINST A WALL!
>ENTRY-LEVEL
EXPLAINED HERE: >>10334909
LEARN, TO, FUCKING, READ!

>> No.10334929

>>10334922
Entry Level Web Developer is still a webdev pleb. You're not going to graduate from it and go into deep programming as nobody cares how good you are at css/html for actual programming jobs. Everyone sees you like this:
https://css-tricks.com/tales-of-a-non-unicorn-a-story-about-the-trouble-with-job-titles-and-descriptions/

>> No.10334934

>>10334929
You get experience in a work place, and then if you dislike the work (as you would if that wasn't why you studied computer science), it would be valuable insecuring yourself a different job, that wasn't entry-level.

>> No.10334939

>>10334921
>if I repeat it long enough I might be taken seriously

>> No.10334943

>>10333175
Is this the cs hate thread?

>> No.10334945

>>10334943
If you dare, I'll locate your IP address and spam yo with adverts for pasta!

>> No.10334949

>>10334913
>>10334922
Keep in mind a lot of these stats mix together BA and BS. BA tend to be more computer information systems and they often go to web dev. When you only factor in BS computer science the salary goes up much higher and web dev loses popularity.

>> No.10334952

>>10334949
>web dev loses popularity.
Sounds retarded cause I'm playing vidya.
Web dev isn't common among actual CS majors

>> No.10334954

>>10334906
>self teaching guide
>without taking classes

>This is what a proper curriculum should look like.

I agree, nobody should ever make the mistake of taking CS classes.

>> No.10334966

>>10334954
T-that's n-n-not what I m-mean!

>> No.10334969

>>10334949
Would the more accurate way to delineate would be to take a look at the likes of [http://www.salaryexplorer.com/]?

>> No.10334974
File: 25 KB, 600x600, sad.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10334974

>mfw I fell for the cs meme
I tought it's math+programming, but all I got was a bunch of pop-sci intros to the most popular buzzwords. I rarely attend any lectures and learn all the stuff I want at home. Have an an exam on wednesday and sit in front of 500+ ppt slides of stupid shit to memorize. I should have gone Applied Math.

>> No.10334982

>>10334949
>>10334969
Because then you've got the likes of:
>1) Biostatistician $300,000
>2) Data Quality Analyst $201,000
>3) Senior Software Engineer $194,250
>4) Chief Information Security Officer $169,667
>5) Cross Platform Security Manager $168,000
>6) SAS Programmer $147,000
>7) Chief Technology Officer $137,500
>8) Chief Information Technology Officer $130,140
>9) Graphical User Interface ( GUI ) Programmer $127,750
>10) IT Director $119,230
Et cetera.

>> No.10334991

>>10334974
What school do you go to?
>inb4 you don't respond cause you're a jelly math nerd making shit up

>> No.10334995

>>10334991
I'm seriously sick of all this CS bashing, whilst using things like 4chan and GNU/Linux which are the result of things they're bashing.

>> No.10335002

>>10334991
You wouldn't know.
I'm not saying cs is shit by default, but most schools apparently only want to shit out degrees.

>> No.10335006

>>10334995
They're just jelly. Ask them to post a school that actually has one of those shit degrees they talk about and they never respond.
If anything you should be happy for it. They'll trick idiots into majoring in math so it's less competition for you.

>> No.10335009

>>10335002
Okay post proof.
Post these various schools that shit out web dev and pop sci degrees.

>> No.10335011

>>10334840
These are also easily replaceable by AI

>> No.10335014

>>10335002
>I'm not saying cs is shit by default, but most schools apparently only want to shit out degrees.
Don't most? If you want to do a proper CS degree, go to a good school, ffs.

>>10335006
>They'll trick idiots into majoring in math so it's less competition for you.
Based. It just feels bad when people bash our field, that's all.

>> No.10335033

>>10333175
Lol laid off """""journalists""""" BTFO

>> No.10335036

>>10334817
>>10334840
This^
Or Finance

>> No.10335044

Substation automation tech here, blue collar coding is already here.

>> No.10335139

>>10335044
I got into CS simply because I wanted to code. Wtf
Is my education useless?

>> No.10335157
File: 236 KB, 691x625, 1548182014618.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10335157

>>10334840
>law
Check the project called Watson from IBM. Things are getting bad. Anon >>10335011 is right, even when he does not really know how things bad will be in the future.
The only things that's gonna be beneficial in the future society are engineered related stuff and psychologist, who will cure patients, who will be diagnosed with a shit ton of mental illnesses, coz humans were not evolved yet to handle such a power. Just look at teens now, social anxiety has became a social norm in every devoloped country..

>> No.10335520

>>10335044
OP here, what does it take to become an AI expert? Seems like that's gonna be the best field for the future.

>> No.10335525

>>10335520
Mathematics.

>> No.10335537

>>10335520
Very little. If you want to have actual "expertise" the bar is very low and you just need to keep up to date with new tools, approaches and working on new projects.

>> No.10335560

>>10335157
Law's not looking great in the states unless you're a top performer. God forbid you fail the bar the first time.

>> No.10335851

>>10334884
>For anything else it will be hard to be taken seriously without a degree.
What can you do with a CS degree besides code monkey shit?

>> No.10335853

>>10333175
coding? yes. Programming? no.

>> No.10335857

Apple and microsoft are already funding cheap degree-mills so they can create a labour surplus which will encourage new grads to work for less. That's their end goal. You ever see X company donates Y dollars to fund [some comp sci social development program]? You think they're doing that out of the goodness of their collective corporate heart?

>> No.10336029

>>10334995
>CS majors taking credit of what EE and CpE have done again.

>> No.10336107

>>10334952
>Web dev isn't common among actual CS majors
It and IT are very common. 99.5% of CS majors can't even fizzbuzz.

>> No.10336212

the joke here is that people actually think that CS is anything more that overblown convoluted ball of shit,corporations,and vintage concepts of computation.

>> No.10336265

>>10333450
I think you're wrong, most people don't know any math even know it's taught in every school and just because things are easier to use it doesn't mean the software will all get trivial at some point, if you have a complex programs it's gonna be hard to mantain and add features no matter what

>> No.10336347

>>10334900
>English
>History
>Fashion
what the fuck does any of this have to do with anything?
also, our cs undergrads take the first 2,5 years worth of the cs+math tags in the first semester.

>> No.10336506 [DELETED] 

I think this is a larp, another image of her it said she had a degree in romantic comedies. Obviously making fun of some stereotype I'm not aware of.

>> No.10336539

>>10334900
My program looked like this
Math:
Calc 1-3
Linear Algebra
Discrete Math
Diff Eq

CS:
Intro to CS taught in C
Object Oriented programming in C++
Data structures in C++
Programming Langauges
Theory Of Computing: Automata and formal languages
Operating Systems
Compilers
Software Engineering
3 electives

>> No.10336548

>>10336539
Forgot
CS:
Computer Organization (8086 and ARM)
Embedded System Design (mostly c)

>> No.10336555

>>10336539
>Object Oriented programming in C++
lmao

>> No.10336566

>>10336539
I only went up to calc 3, is that sufficient? Also, could you explain the basic purpose of each of those classes you took? Which ones would you say were the most useful?

>> No.10336573

>>10334900
This is actually true. Every course I’m taking refers to post modernism and feminism every topic.
History of computing? Btw here’s the feminist history of computing, homework is an essay on a non western computer scientist of your choice
Future of computing? Hmm biggest focus here is how to avoid continued inequity by ensuring Africa has better IT infrastructure, only way we can ensure that is through political activism, also the environment is important btw

>2 textbooks this semester were written by literal marxists
>also in intro to philosophy textbook everytime time a pronoun is used to refer to a hypothetical person it’s “she”
Kek

>> No.10336611

>>10334982
Can you show me a job posting/glassdoor company which pays biostatisticians 300k or data analysts 200k per year?

>> No.10336619

>>10336611
I've seen salaries nearly that high for postdoc positions, it depends what you're doing and what level you're doing it at.

>> No.10336620

>>10335857
those are mostly webdev since web developers pull 6 figures in the bay despite it being incredibly easy to learn, thus making webdev schools the best ROI for companies. AI is safe.

>> No.10336625

>>10336619
What? I though postdoc positions paid peanuts? Can you find one of them? Let's say I'm as qualified as I need to be, how do I find these positions in the first place?

>> No.10336629

>>10336573
anon I'm sorry to tell you but you're a muritard and don't actually do cs. it's like a sjw claiming she's a mathematician while doing "feminist mathematics" or some shit like that

>> No.10336632

>>10336625
A number of these are going to be around 100-150k Euros per annum.

>> No.10336636

>>10336632
https://www.glassdoor.co.uk/Job/france-biostatistics-jobs-SRCH_IL.0,6_IN86_KO7,20.htm

Forgot link.

>> No.10336642

>>10336636
>you have to earn a doctorate to earn the same money as a Semi-intelligent compsci undergrad
absolute kek

>> No.10336646

>>10336636
>first listing
>literally half of the requirements are compsci related
whoopsie

>> No.10336649

>>10336642
They're asking for PhDs that have run projects (so a very particular kind of PhD, though not so uncommon now), someone with only a compsci undergrad would be in the trash immediately. Also note that UG + doctorate in Europe is usually only 6 or 7 years.

>> No.10336652

>>10336636
>https://www.glassdoor.co.uk/Salary/Premier-Research-Salaries-E37452.htm
If you sort from high to low all the salaries the ones around ~150k in the us are all at the director level with a notable exception being clinical research associates who make 69-73 per hour. none of these are biostatistician roles.

>> No.10336654

>>10336649
I think he means that CS undergrads can earn the same amount (low 6 figures) not that they would get the exact same job.

>> No.10336655

>>10336642
>>10336646
Oh, the second one is the kind of thing I'm talking about, I obv didn't link properly. The Strasbourg one. The top one will likely be a good way into 6 figs too tho.

>> No.10336661

>>10336652
>69-73 per hour
That's like 140K isn't it? Clinical research/trials is a weird niche now, a lot of that is to do with the systems they use (usually stuff from Oracle), they usually have really tight routes to those jobs.

>> No.10336673

>>10336539
>Intro to CS taught in C
>Object Oriented programming in C++
Why didn't you just start in C++ and do it in one course.

>No Algorithm Design
>No Probability
>No Networking
>No Numerics
Shit.

>> No.10336677

>>10336107
>99.5% of CS major can't fizzbuzz
A highschooler can do that on a graphing calculator jackass, where are these convenient statistics from?

>> No.10336678

>>10336673
I forgot to include Algorithms in the original post. Probability is taught under a required stats class. Networking is an elective as is stuff like numerical analysis, web design, game design etc.

>> No.10336681

>>10336661
can you tell us more about what those routes are?

>> No.10336687

>>10336677
Have you ever spoken to your classmates?

>> No.10336693

>>10333450
>. There's a massive, coordinated push to get more and more people into CS every year. "More women to CS," "More diversity to CS,
yeah but that is with literally everithing. not coal miners though is they are white

>> No.10336696

>>10336107
Yeah, fuck off. Anyone who knows what a modulo is can fizzbuzz.

>> No.10336698

>>10336687
idk, I'm the guy in highschool doing this on a graphing calculator

>> No.10336724

>>10336698
http://www.kegel.com/academy/getting-hired.html

>> No.10336728

>>10336681
So chatting with some recruiters for Europe/mostly UK:
If you're not in a big corporate environment it's extremely difficult to move into a big corporate environment (companies like AstraZeneca won't take people from purely academic/state funded (e.g. NHS) positions so much anymore, although I do know some people that have made those moves. You have to somewhat make a choice about what route you're going down early on.)
A lot of this is a (somewhat unhealthy imo) obsession with having knowledge of their tools and "hitting the ground running", stuff like http://www.oracle.com/us/products/applications/health-sciences/e-clinical/clinical/index.html (there are qualifications you can take for these)
They're typically looking for "operations" minded people rather than "projects" people.
I can't remember if this is the right terminology exactly, but to become a Sr Data Manager requires no degree, it does require roughly 10-20 years experience, you can go I thing it's clinical data analyst/technician -> clinical data manager -> sr clinical data manager more or less. From what I understand there's very little lateral movement into these roles but I also know people who have done it (presumably rare).

>> No.10336745

>>10336728
So it's a siloed labor vertical due to company preference, that makes sense.it

>> No.10336758

>>10336745
Well, companies' preference, but yes. AstraZeneca is just the big guy in the UK so that's the typical example they were using. I've seen jobs from other companies use all sorts of other tools however, including fucking VB and Excel.

>> No.10336763
File: 96 KB, 1182x420, 1548613681152.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10336763

>>10333175

>> No.10336803

I made my sister get into a CS major so she could get a goddamn job.
Did I make a mistake?

>> No.10336809

>>10336803
no, although if she gets anywhere good she will regularly have to deal with people who got rejected complaining that she got her job just because she's a female.

>> No.10336823

>>10336803
Why would you try to get her a job she doesn't want it? Try introducing her to code and talking a bit to her about her. If she doesn't like it she will never be good at it

>> No.10336847

>>10336809
>she will regularly have to deal with people who got rejected
Why? You don't deal with people who got rejected. You never see them.

>>10336823
It's been a while so she knows more coding than me and she's surviving but it's filled with nerds and there's no girls so she doesn't enjoy it very much. If CS really gets no jobs, then I should tell her so she can try for med school.

>> No.10336879

>>10336847
Ok, but if she doesn't like it very much why would she consider pursuing a career in it? If what you like doesn't pay, you gotta either pick the money or the area

>> No.10336896

>>10336879
Because I thought it was the best thing there was. And that a job was guaranteed.

>> No.10336910

>>10336803
STEM majors can get any CS major job.

>> No.10336949

>>10336910
I have a degree in chemistry, you're saying I can get a job in comp sci despite knowing nothing about coding?

>> No.10336988

>>10336949
What you think he's saying obviously isn't' true. I think he was referring to the fact that you can self-teach yourself programming and *then* get a programming job.
>>10336847
not just people who get rejected but possibly even coworkers (just look at /g/), although this does get less blatant the better the company is.

>> No.10336995

>>10336949
A degree doesn't guarantee that know how to code, not even cs.

>> No.10337069

>>10334900

This is obviously fake

>> No.10337088

Not hating on CS or anything, but are there any CS grads here working in software engineering? I'm really curious as to what you actually do in this field. A friend of my mine from college was one at Raytheon. He was making a bit under 100k in a low COL area, and he said his job consisted of making sure code was written correctly. He also said it was extremely mind numbingly boring.

>> No.10337120
File: 155 KB, 1440x810, c++anime.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10337120

>>10333175
>I believe there is a special, dedicated section of Hell just for people with anime twitter avatars who tell laid-off journalists to “learn to code"

Learn to code


>>10334900 >>10337069
>Dealing with obesity for diabetics
> the art of hiding early male pattern baldness.
Kek

>>10336879 >>10336896
There is still high demmand now.

>>10336949 >>10336995 >>10336988
At least you know calculus, but you will need to "learn to code".

>> No.10337123

>>10337120
>There is still high demmand now
Good thanks. There's so many doomsayers ITT.

>> No.10337130
File: 127 KB, 889x779, Smug Kizuna Ai.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10337130

>>10333175 >>10333189
>section of Hell just for people with anime twitter avatars who tell laid-off journalists to “learn to code"

Learn to code Jornalists
*Smug_Anime_Face.jpg*

(Kizuna) AI will take your Job
https://youtu.be/EBM2n-pE4Fo

>> No.10337139
File: 69 KB, 500x391, took our jerbs.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10337139

>>10333175
(((They))) took our JERBS

https://youtu.be/DEiWU1MbBfk

>> No.10337146

>>10335139
yes

t. bs and ms in cs and unemployed

>> No.10337173
File: 123 KB, 1440x1397, meme state uni pepe.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10337173

>>10337146
>Meme State University

>> No.10337332
File: 203 KB, 647x1558, IMG_2311.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10337332

>>10333175

>> No.10337401

>>10336347
>what the fuck does any of this have to do with anything?

Every American university requires English 101 and a couple of social science and humanities electives.

>also, our cs undergrads take the first [2.5] years worth of the cs+math tags in the first semester.

This is America, 40-50% of students place into remedial math and English. CS majors even more so. See >>10334809

>>10337069
Duh, obviously the humanities electives aren't pre-selected but they're representative of the kind of classes CS majors sign up for.

>> No.10337500

>>10337088
Not me but my mate is. He does back end shit at a mostly web dev company. Straight out of college and making like $70k ish. He enjoys it.

I'm going into Analytics, to avoid the bore of software desu

>> No.10337526

>>10336573
This didn't happen.

>> No.10337690

>>10337088
BS in CS here. Right now I'm a JavaScript developer and I'm desperately trying to get out. Everybody I work with is an H-1B or diversity hire that doesn't know shit about CS. It's easy as hell since my coworkers have set expectations for developers so low that I can browse the internet for most of the work day and still get more done than them but it's just so insanely boring

>> No.10337703

>>10333175
coding is like the plumber of the imaginary electron much like doctors are the plumbers of the human body

>> No.10337719
File: 57 KB, 594x534, code obama.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10337719

>>10337703 >>10337690 >>10337526 >>10337500 >>10337401 >>10337332

Obama : "Learn to Code Nigga"
https://youtu.be/6XvmhE1J9PY

>> No.10337818

>>10333175

"Coding" is not Computer Science
"Web Dev" is not Computer Science

It is true that STEM majors can get CS jobs.

I've worked in the Aerospace industry for a major corp for 30 years as an IT professional (think Boeing). We have engineers and math majors that become developers. They can do it, but they are not good at it. They end up writing Matlab crap that breaks after a few years and we have to fix it. Anyone can code an app and run it off their D:/ drive for a year or so. But try scaling up to global infrastructure, or designing a system that upgrades seamlessly across multiple technologies. Try integrating your system with an ERP or PDM or EDM system. Heck, just try deploying it in a real production environment via change control instead of hard-coding it to work on your laptop.

Non-STEM majors try to develop and once their GUI builder can't do it they quit. Or maybe become managers. Fine by me.

I've got a CS degree from an major state Engineering Univ. It's an Engineering degree, not an IT or MIS or even liberal arts CS degree. I know more Math than most Math majors. I've got 2 masters degrees from top 20 CS Universities (not Stamford but close to that level).

I make $200K a year, more than most CIO's. And I get stock options. I work from home 4 days a week and basically do what I want, because no one else understands the systems we have. The boring crap I send to India.

Yeah, sometimes the engineers look down on us. They think they could do what I do but I can't do what they do. They may be right - but that doesn't mean they would be better.

It's like everyone thinking they can write their own fantasy novel. Of course you COULD. But WILL you?

But your PoS will end up in the bargain bin.

Me? I'm J.R.R. Tolkien, bitches. Out.

>> No.10337852

>>10337088
CS grad school is a lot of fun. In theory you get to work on a lot of pure math problems, but it doesn't take a long time to motivate them; that is, they're pretty useful results even when they're not studied in the context of being useful. Highly recommend. I found a really good niche where I get to do lots of analysis and nontraditional computation (e.g. natural computation and computability) and still get a lot of funding, research hits, and general buzz.

Word of advice: if you're serious about CS grad school, double major in math and CS. Since the field is so wide, it's impossible to talk about all the mathematics you need to work on top of (and actually work on in the case of theory), so you should do yourself a favor and double major. You'll do way more work than most people, you'll learn a fuckton, and you'll get what I consider a "complete" CS degree. Keep your knowledge spread out and focus on fundamentals: take 2 semesters of analysis, 2 of algebra, one geometry course (differential comes to mind), topology, complex analysis, higher linear algebra, and higher probability theory/stochastic processes and then whatever else you want. Take graph theory and combinatorics as well. Take all the heavy systems (architecture, OS, network protocol and engineering) classes and heavy theory (theory of computation, complexity theory, computational geometry, algorithmic game theory, etc). You'll be equipped to do whatever the fuck you want in grad school in whatever the fuck topic you want too. Oh and make sure to take basic mechanics and E&M. I went further and took more physics classes, but you can always self study.

>> No.10337892

>>10334991
>>10335009
>ask people to post uni's that have meme tier coursework
>no one responds
top kek so this is the power of the anti CS kiddies. When asked to face reality they shut up and hide.

>> No.10337897

>>10336539
>Programming Langauges
This shit is an elective where I go, is this a meme tier class or something actually useful and worth taking?

>> No.10337909

>>10337897
PL doesn‘t even exist here. I can‘t imagine you‘ll get anything but a surface level understanding out of a semester studying ‚programing languages‘ as a whole.

>> No.10337956

>>10337909
Honestly it sounds like a meme tier class and I can't really see much use for it.

>> No.10337962

>>10337892
Every american cs program is a meme.

>> No.10337964

>>10337962
Give proof then, kid.

>> No.10338011
File: 114 KB, 359x1176, CS program (that's not shit).png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10338011

>>10337964
None of them look like this

>> No.10338027
File: 119 KB, 1081x876, 20C85200-0FB5-45E5-9C48-02D5F23CC5E4.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10338027

>>10334900
Who fucking goes to these schools? You guys know you can look at the schedule and school material before you go there right?

>> No.10338070

>>10338011
okay kid come back when you have something of substance to say instead of repeating /sci/ memes

>> No.10338071

>>10338070
>people on /sci/ are /sci/

lel, go back to your >>>/g/hetto

>> No.10338074
File: 156 KB, 887x1128, Curriculum 68 Recommendations for academic programs in computer science a report of the ACM curriculum committee on computer science.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10338074

>>10338070
CS used to be much better, now it's shit.

>> No.10338176

>>10338071
>its okay to be retarded because of the board I'm on
Literal brainlet.
>>10338074
What evidence is there that it used to be better? Why is it shit now?
Give proof kid.

>> No.10338179

>>10338027
Those schools do not exist. Ask them to name a school with that curriculum and watch them go silent.
Also you're most likely trolling because that shit is obviously fake.

>> No.10338204

>>10338074
literally all of this shit is incorporated in my curriculum in one way or another. now fuck off coping mathfag

>> No.10338294

Csfag grad here. Working as a research scientist for one of the big boys straight out of finishing my Msc.
>Dev jobs are plentiful but often mind numbing and tedious. Beats IT support and has better career progression by a mile though. Best bet to avoid offing yourself is data science or machine learning and trying to get in the doors of one of the big boys. If you're not determined enough though prepare to become a statistic.
>Networking is an underrated subject area with high demand and usually far less applicants per position. Personally I find network engineering less depressing than software engineering, but YMMV. Career progression is about the same.
>Research is by design more interesting I feel. Most companies operate on a proof of concept framework where you get to test new technologies to determine their feasibility. Multinational corps in Europe also typically operate with EU research grants meaning ideas can be more flexible and travel to other countries to work with research partners happens often (if you're into that). Career progression is fantastic with it usually being the most direct path to the CTO tree. While most positions advertise an Msc minimum and PhD preferred, the application rates are often low and if you already live locally it puts you at a major advantage if you have the skills required.

My biased 2c. Just don't do game dev whatever you do sweet jesus.

>> No.10338297

>>10338294
>Just don't do game dev whatever you do sweet jesus.
Why not? I'm not planning to do that I just wanna know why not

>> No.10338302

>>10338297
it's being the coalminer of the dev world but without all of the recent benefits

>> No.10338319

>>10338297
There are too cs/game dev grads than there are positions available, a fact that game dev companies take full advantage of. Lowest pay vs. most other dev jobs and you don't see a single penny of the profits. Google rockstar games working conditions during crunch time. Hope you like 16 hours shifts for 8 hours pay and no stock or profit sharing. Being an indie dev is akin to playing the lottery and a good game in modern times usually requires a level of creativity and design a single dev can't realistically achieve making it that much harder. If you're studying Cs and you don't absolutely love vidya you're far better off looking elsewhere.

>> No.10338330

>>10333450
Doubt it. Most people learning coding are learning front-end shit like javascript, not any sort of complex back end shit. Just because somebody can figure out how to stick "hello world" on a fancy UI doesn't mean they can write a complex neural net. Our jobs aren't going anywhere anytime soon.

>> No.10338373

>>10333490
He took some great fucking liberties with that experiment. + he was pretty gifted academically

>> No.10338445

>>10337818
Liked, shared and subscribed

>> No.10338607

>>10338330
>Most people learning coding are learning front-end shit like javascript, not any sort of complex back end shit.
You have no idea what you're talking about, sonny.
1. Back-end development is not necessarily any more difficult than front-end development. I have done both.
2. Nowadays back-ends, too, are often developed in Javascript.

>doesn't mean they can write a complex neural net
Neural networks were invented by statisticians. Next to nothing to do with CS. And the people who do machine learning research today are overwhelmingly math/stats majors. Most CS majors haven't ever even heard the word "Jacobian".

>Our jobs aren't going anywhere anytime soon.
Correct, because they are already in India.

>> No.10338658

>>10338294
Is the AI meme a good field?
(in Academia &or Industry)

>> No.10338666
File: 20 KB, 691x653, 1507714976056.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10338666

>>10333175
>literally the only cute and wholesome girl in the department is a senior
>I'm a freshman

>> No.10338680

>>10337500
you mean data analytics?
>>10337690
learn better programming and go work for a better company
>>10337818
what's your position? How did you get to your position (in terms of your job's perks)?

>> No.10338917

>>10337956
It depends on what you want to do. I like understanding programming language implementations and writing interpreters and messing around with writing DSLs for scheme. If you don't care about any of that then it's mostly a meme language, although a surface understanding of it is helpful, nothing that you can't learn from reading the first few chapters of something like Essences of Programming Languages.

>> No.10338935

>>10336809
You av to go back

>> No.10338993

>>10338935
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XwIivDg1BlY
better luck next time

>> No.10339082

>>10336803
>Not helping arrange a political marriage for your sister, but instead pushing her to get a job like a peasant.
Not gonna make it.

>> No.10339369
File: 39 KB, 644x500, brainlet.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10339369

>>10333490
Marketing schema for his self help study like superfast book. Basically he was just a lying shill.

>> No.10339470
File: 48 KB, 750x512, asdasd.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10339470

>>10336539
Mine

Math:
Calc 1-3
Linear Algebra 1-2
Mathematical logic and proofs
Algebra
Automata theory
Combinatorics
Stats and probabillity
Markov Processes

CS:
Intro CS
Functional programing(Haskell)
Algorithms and data structures 1-2
Imperative and object oriented programing methods(C & Java)
Operating Systems
Concurrency Programing
Computer architecture
Compilers
Databases
Computer communication

4 electives.

>> No.10339487

>>10339470
>Intro CS
>Functional programing(Haskell)
>Imperative and object oriented programing methods(C & Java)
Shit.

>No complexity theory
>No PL theory
>No optimization
>No ML
>No numerics
Shit.

>> No.10339490

>>10339369
Dude, anyone can learn CS in under a year. The classes move as slow as molasses.

>> No.10339498

>>10339487
He said CS, not a degree in applied math.

>> No.10339632

>>10333450
>1. Some European countries are already having coding as mandatory school subject
Yeah, and most pupils who code in school show their disinterest in the subject and their incompetence to even learn basic syntax.

>> No.10339648

Everyone is coding so it's all over for the rest of us.

>> No.10339779
File: 21 KB, 391x400, black programmer.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10339779

>>10339498
If you want to learn a trade, go to trade school.

>> No.10339785

>>10338607
>Neural networks were invented by statisticians. Next to nothing to do with CS.
my god, undergrads should be banned from this board

>> No.10340193

>>10336809
lmao and if she doesn't get the job 4chan will say its cuz she was a female.

Can't win.

>> No.10340195

So I'm going to be taking computer networks as an elective.
Is mobile wireless networks also worth taking to enhance my knowledge or are they completely unrelated in a sense? Like can I do with just networks and wireless networks would be more in depth than I need?

>> No.10340199

>>10338011
literally who can handle those classes in one semester? Fucking no one. especially if you don't live with mommy and daddy. Faggot

>> No.10340404

>>10337964
>>10338070
I'm not them, but shut up. You blue light niggers need some sleep.
http://www.cs.virginia.edu/~robins/cs6160/slides/Theory_Slides_Lectures_v65_CS6160_set_1_Syllabus_Aristotle_Euclid_Archimedes_Eratosthenes.pdf
劉暁波 Liu Xiaobo 民主 言論 思想 反共 反革命 抗議 運動 騷亂 暴亂 騷擾 擾亂 抗暴 平反 維權 示威游行 李洪志 法輪大法 大法弟子 強制斷種 強制堕胎 民族淨化 人體實驗 肅清 胡耀邦 趙紫陽 魏京生 王丹 還政於民 和平演變 激流中國 北京之春 大紀元時報 九評論共産黨 獨裁 專制 壓制 統一 監視 鎮壓 迫害 侵略 掠奪 破壞 拷問 屠殺 活摘器官 誘拐 買賣人口 遊進 走私 毒品 賣淫 春畫 賭博 六合彩 天安門 天安门 法輪功 李洪志

>> No.10340463

>>10340199
It's a normal engineering course load.

CS majors are just brainlets that take 3 courses a semester.

>> No.10340497

>>10340404
Okay what the fuck is the point of those slides and how do they relate to anything you're replying to?
Also fuck off to China. No one is going to waste their time translating your shit language.

Is every anti CS kid this autistic?

>> No.10340502

>>10340463
Show me a engineering school where a course load that large is considered normal. Come on brainlet.

>> No.10340601

>>10340497
Learn to read you schitzo normalfag gaslighting bug-person. Those Chinese runes are designed to kill chinks who read view it, as their government censors it through force. The slides are a Virginia U computer science course syllabus filled with literal retard tier shit. I pulled it from another thread discussing the same thing, because unlike you I acknowledge that I'm semi retarded and that I don't have a lot of ground to stand on. You CS fags just use anger and gay greek disception to piss on arguments.

>> No.10340607

>>10333175
what is this and why are spamming it? Coding is already blue-collar work, basically a trade without the manliness. Worst of both worlds.

>> No.10340663

>>10334817
ecologist

>> No.10340748

>>10340601
So let me get this straight. You are judging an entire class on the syllabi power point, the power point that is introduced in the beginning of the semester to introduce students with a lighthearted introduction to the class? You are then of course judging every other professor and the rest of schools program on said powerpoint? You are then of course judging an entire academic field on an introductory power point that is meant to be lighthearted?

Can you not see how retarded you look? Just stop for a second and reflect how much of a retard you are. Also where the fuck was China discussed? Think for a second you schitzo.

>> No.10340777

>>10340748
>implying
That's a lot of protection anon. I was more so meming on slides like 44 where they say to use inductive proof as a last resort. Of course I can't judge an entire course or university or major on a syllabus, but that's not what I was trying to prove. Retards were making fun of a major and other autismos were asking for examples of stupid course layouts. I gave an example. In regards to China, I put a bit of that copy pasta in all of my first posts in every thread I'm in, because I'm anti-mainland chinese and think it's funny how a copy pasta can potentially kill someone. Have a little levity, you seem really angry. The high IQ powerplay is to do a double major of a pure math and CS anyway, so long as you don't mind sitting at a computer for most of the day.

>> No.10341036
File: 33 KB, 500x359, different.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10341036

>>10335520
You need the most powerful programming language ever invented

>> No.10341225

-Intro to Programming (Scheme)
-Calc 1
-Intro to Informatics (elective)
-French minor stuff

-OOP (Java)
-Calc 2
-Writing 101 (elective)
-Discrete Math
-French

-Systems Programming (C)
-Data Structures (Java)
-Calc 3 (Multivariable)
-Geology (elective)

-Computer Structures (C + ARM asm)
-Calc 4 (Vector)
-Linear Algebra
-Folklore (elective)
-Public Speaking (required for math major)

-Networks (C/Python but I wrote everything in C, plus some shell scripting)
-ODEs 1
-History of Scientific Revolution (Elective, required for math major)
-Astronomy (elective)

-Operating Systems (C)
-Computer Architecture (MIPS)
-ODEs 2
-Literature (elective)
-Physics of sound (elective)

-Digital Design 1
-Theory of Computation
-Analysis 1
-Numerical Analysis 1

-Digital Design 2
-Analysis 2
-Numerical Analysis 2
-Pharmacology (elective)

My only real complaint so far is so many fucking geneds. 12 CRs of science, 9 of social/historical, and 9 of history/art. Luckily a lot of electives knock out multiple categories and I took a few AP classes in high school.

>> No.10341387

>>10340777
>That's a lot of protection anon.
>calls someone a schizo while typing schizo shit about China
Learn to be self aware.
>I was more so meming on slides like 44
Knowing that you went through every slide, especially since you seem to hate the ppt, and expected me to do the same shows you truly are autistic. Also now that I had a look its extra credit questions. Its meant to be lax because its an introductory lesson.

I asked for someone to prove to me CS degrees are a meme and to give proof by showing course curriculums making the degree look like a joke. An introductory power point for one class doesn't prove shit. I could find the same for any subject if I was autistic enough. You failed to prove the point.

>> No.10341392

Maybe they shouldn't have tried to lay off hundreds of right wingers through their "journalism."

Btw coding is EZ

>> No.10341400

>>10341225
Those are some fucked up gen eds. Glsd my degree has 0 geneds. Granted im in quebec and we do a year of geneds alongside cal 1 2 3 and other shit in our pre colleges (CEGEPs) before uni so thats likely why.

>> No.10341409

>American bachelor is 4 years instead of 3
>they fill 1/4 of it with shit completely unrelated to the degree
>feel superior to europeans because their bachelor is longer, but in reality they just have one extra year of extended high school

>> No.10341437

>>10341409
Europeans have a 2 year masters. So a 5 year degree all in all.

>> No.10341472

Not a chance. I failed Java twice. That was the only class I have ever failed. I taught myself japanese, rubix cubes, I had a 3.8 GPA in college and 1300 Sat. It's legitimately difficult. You have to be very smart and dedicated to it. People tell journalists to learn to code because they know they have absolutely no chance of being able to do that. FYI I work in IT now. It might become blue collar. Hardware/networking can be taught pretty easily imo.

>> No.10341804

>>10334900
Is this true?

At my alma matter (University of Toronto) they compressed all of this into the first 2 years + included hardware design and complexity theory (because Stephen Cook is a prof here)

3rd year was software engineering, OS development, an exhaustive study of complexity (the prof would put unsolved problems on the assignments), and then elective after that.

I chose game theory, data mining, AI, computational linguistics, compilers, database development and this entrepreneur course where you end it by pitching your project to a VC firm.

>> No.10341881

Can I get into data science without a degree??

>> No.10341885

>>10335851
Nothing, you need at least a PhD to do anything interesting like crypto or ai research.

>> No.10341892

>>10341885
no you dont, thats the beauty of CS
all you need is a decent repo to point to

>> No.10341896

>>10341472

programming just comes down to writing a set of instructions/descriptions. anyone can do it, and it's the same every time. you're given a relatively abstract, informal description of the task and you apply a set of common patterns to map that into a concrete, formal description of the task. programmers are translators. it's sometimes fun when you're doing cool things and using a good language, but java is pure drudgery.

>> No.10341907

>>10341896
I agree that failing a java class is brainlet tier but this
>programming just comes down to writing a set of instructions/descriptions
is absolutely retarded and shows that you know nothing about CS. you spend like about 10% of your time actually writing code and 90% coming up with algorithms and architecture designs, unless you are the literal lowest tier codemonkey.

>> No.10341916

>>10341896
I am starting to think these posts shitting on cs are really cope-posts.

Recalling libraries is not how you create a computer program, most of the effort is design.

>> No.10341918

>>10341892
A CS BS lacks the math needed to do any of these topics.

>> No.10341928

>>10341918
You are a brainlet if you sincerely think that

>> No.10341965

>>10341928
>implying CS majors know anything about abstract algebra or signal analysis

>> No.10341988

>>10341965
yes? what uni do you go to retard. obviously you don't learn the entirety of it but the parts that you need

>> No.10342033

>>10341804
It's not, the worst CS programs I've seen require only two programming courses (usually an intro to programming and an OOP course) and a software engineering course, the rest is either TCS or systems, at the worst case courses like computability and complexity are electives but I've never seen a CS program that requires shit like web dev.

>> No.10342085

>>10336809
with the quotas today (explicit or not), it's a fair complaint

>> No.10342094

>>10337852
More math never hurts, but there's no way most CS grad students will need more than 1-2 of the math classes you listed.

>> No.10342101

Programmers who don't know R are retards who will go blue collar because R is filled with math.

>> No.10342160
File: 4 KB, 224x250, 1471038276718.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10342160

>>10341988
>Mathematics Requirements in Computer Science
>While nearly all undergraduate programs in computer science include mathematics courses in their curricula, the full set of such requirements varies broadly by institution due to a number of factors. For example, whether or not a CS program is housed in a School of Engineering can directly influence the requirements for courses on calculus and/or differential equations, even if such courses include far more material in these areas than is generally needed for most CS majors. As a result, CS2013 only specifies mathematical requirements that we believe are directly relevant for the large majority of all CS undergraduates (for example, elements of set theory, logic, and discrete probability, among others). These mathematics requirements are specified in the Body of Knowledge primarily in the Discrete Structures Knowledge Area.

>We recognize that general facility with mathematics is an important requirement for all CS students. Still, CS2013 distinguishes between the foundational mathematics that are likely to impact many parts of computer science—and are included in the CS2013 Body of Knowledge—from those that, while still important, may be most directly relevant to specific areas within computing. For example, an understanding of linear algebra plays a critical role in some areas of computing such as graphics and the analysis of graph algorithms. However, linear algebra would not necessarily be a requirement for all areas of computing (indeed, many high quality CS programs do not have an explicit linear algebra requirement). Similarly, while we do note a growing trend in the use of probability and statistics in computing and believe that this trend is likely to continue in the future, we still believe it is not necessary for all CS programs to require a full course in probability theory for all majors.
http://www.acm.org/education/curricula-recommendations

CS majors barely know precalculus.

>> No.10342176

>>10341885
OP here. My undergrad was in chemistry. With no knowledge of programming, and having gotten a B in Calc 3, how reasonably could I transition into computer science?

Also note, that math has ALWAYS been my weakest point. I'm gifted in the humanities, but always been a brainlet with math. Nonetheless, I struggled hard with calc, getting D's in calc 1 and 2, then failing calc 3. Retaking it I got a B.

Do you have to be mathematically talented to go master with comp sci?

>> No.10342189

>>10342160
>I pick out retarded murifat websites
anon stop coping, every cs here does the same amount of math as engineers. we literally take the same analysis and linear algebra class

>> No.10342219

>>10334900
it's not like this at ucl

>> No.10342222

>>10342176
>Do you have to be mathematically talented to go master with comp sci?

Yes, actual CS is mostly math, machine learning research (not the meme code monkey ML jobs), cryptography, complexity theory, computer graphics, advanced algorithms, etc all require you to be comfortable with math.

>> No.10342230

why does computer science cause such a huge amount of butthurt?

>> No.10342235

>>10342230
why do cs majors pretend they know math?

>> No.10342236

>>10342230
because it's the easiest fucking STEM major by far, every C"S" discovery ever has actually been by mathematicians and/or computer engineers, and I've never once talked to a C"S" student without him making me laugh my ass off, including now.

>> No.10342237

>>10335011
Not in our lifetimes they arent. Even if tomorrow someone created an AI that could do both better than any human. Professional organizations exist specifically to artificially control their labour and the number of certified individuals. Law is particularly bad for it since their job directly overlaps with legislation.

>> No.10342239

>>10342236
are you american?

>> No.10342252

>>10342176
You probably wouldn't be a good scientist with poor math skills, but you can still do well in Cs if you focus less on the quantitative aspects. Areas like computer security, computer networks, and software engineering are largely about understanding standards and making intelligent design decisions.

>> No.10342256

>>10342239
Yes. This is only true in America, dipshit.

>> No.10342263

>>10342256
fair enough. i shouldn't really complain about cs hate since it does sound dreadful in america plus this is an american website however most criticisms made in this thread are genuinely not the case at imperial

>> No.10342276

>>10342263
If your school isn't top 10 it's literally as shitty as and worthless as coding bootcamps. I'm a recruiter for this company (not gonna fucking say it here) and I literally throw away any application/resume without a top 10 school on it since I know it'd just be a waste of time.

>> No.10342283

>>10342276
>top 10
top 10 according to what? do you have a preference over any specific league tables?

>> No.10342305

>>10342283
He is larping and living out his fantasy life anonymously on the internet

>> No.10342307

>>10342305
Cope

>> No.10342308

>>10342283
https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities

>> No.10342310

>>10342305
i obviously suspected this (as is my default reaction to anything i read on this website) which is why i ask questions
>>10342307
answer question >>10342283

>> No.10342312

>>10342308
what about for international universities?

>> No.10342321

>>10342312
Top 10 internation is the same as top 10 US

>> No.10342324

This thread is ignoring the very real issue that only around 1/20 applicants to any given programming job can do fizz buzz on the spot

>> No.10342326

>>10342321
genuinely not the case

>> No.10342328

>>10342312
Any international uni is gonna be orders of magnitude superior to a sub-top10 US uni. At least for CS

>> No.10342370

>>10342324
[citation needed]

>> No.10342451

Noob question, but what's the problem with OOP courses?

>> No.10342494

>>10342451
Idk that there’s a problem with them beyond they often teach cargo-cult programming techniques that are useful in very specific cases but when used broadly bloat the code.

>> No.10342498

>>10333450
>coders
>CS
Hmmmm

>> No.10342765

>>10342498
While CS doesn't equal to coding, the reality is that most CS majors end up with coding jobs. And when those coding jobs start to get oversaturated, it's bad news for CS majors. There are CS jobs that are not code monkey stuff, but those usually require fair amount of math skills, something the average CS major simply does not have.

>> No.10342776

>>10342765
I think you don't understand what the difference between "coders" and "it systems engineers" is

>> No.10342789

>>10333175
Well as people that work in physical blue collar jobs are being increasingly replaced with robots that can do the job with no breaks and no pay, there's going to be a need for a class of jobs that can easily diagnose and repair and program the incoming robotic wave that's coming. The traditional definition of blue-collar usually meant something along the lines of menial, and physical work, but as traditional blue-collar jobs are phased out, blue-collar will become the definition for the next generation of menial jobs, such as coding and developing software for a world filled with computers everywhere you go.

>> No.10342793

>>10342765
Maybe for a year or two

CS degree from a good uni + a few years experience puts you in the 6 figures territory in the major labor markets (San Fran, Toronto, Boston, etc.)

>> No.10342802

>>10342789
The majority of people living on this planet are not intelligent enough to program computers. The majority of entrants to university for CS drop out or fail their first programming course.

>> No.10342810

>>10335139
You are literally a construction worker in a digital landscape

>> No.10342813

>>10342810
no, I'm both the architect and construction worker and inspector

>> No.10342814

>>10333175
As someone with a career in dev and architecture for the past 10 years... it's very hard to say. Coding requires a specific mindset, intellect and skill set, and also a lot of time invested (years minimum to become any good at it). While more and more regular white collars are enjoying the benefits of basic scripting, real coding has more or less stayed as something that needs to be a primary focus area for you to be any good at it. And blue collars have far less need of it than them.

Now it's true that newer generation development platforms make programming ever easier, but the problem there is that comparatively speaking those "easy to learn" software will still be far removed from actual coding. They will always be simple and restricted, relatively speaking. Until they're not. And when we reach the point when they're not, the reason for it will be because we've created sufficiently advanced AI and robotics software to do such coding for you. Which means, again, that the actual coding will be done by real programmers (though at this point the minimum skill and ability requirement will be much higher than before), while everyone else will just learn to use those robotics software instead of learning any actual coding.

tldr; I suspect that blue collar people will always be using some kind of a UI-backed software. The entrance level into actual coding is just too high for the industry to ever form around a need like that, so instead any kind of "programming" requirements will be handled by specialized software created specifically for that purpose.

>> No.10342818

Anyone else think that instead of UBI for all the retards who can't be productive with automation that we should just let them die off and leave humanity behind?

>> No.10342826

>>10342818
yes, especially when it becomes so advances that we can get rid of engineers and other applied science retards. only math and cs can stay for ai development

>> No.10342827

>>10342818
I'm productive. I just don't have a job. Create jobs

>> No.10342843

>>10342827
If there is nothing useful for you to do, you aren't productive.

>> No.10342846

>>10342818
The people who end up getting placed by automation were the only productive ones in the first place. Actors, athletes, models, good looking people in general, business executives, etc. are all worthless parasites. They’re also vastly outmanned by the people who would need UBI.

>> No.10342853

>>10342813
>Inspector
That'd be the head of your department or the debugging team if available
>Architect
The client asking for a specific program
>construction worker
You

>> No.10342859

>>10342853
>I'm retarded and don't understand anything about software development

>> No.10342861

>>10342846
Entertainment is a form of productivity

I think the result of the coming technocracy should resemble the late roman republic where the aristocrats owned people for their own personal convenience and pleasure

>> No.10342910

>>10342843
It's not my fault society can't find something for me to do. Watch your society collapse because of this.

>> No.10342933

>>10342910
>oh no, we don't have to feed, clothe, and entertain billions of people that contribute nothing to the economy

>> No.10343002

>>10337818
Thanks, I love free food. This pasta is great.

>> No.10343372

>>10342230
Because it causes pure envy. They then have to make up lies to act like the major is shit to justify their shitty life choices.

Take this guy right here >>10342236
Without providing proof he claims its the easiest major as if claiming so justifies him getting some other shit degree that made him unemployable. He also fails to understand the history behind the field and can't comprehend that under its infancy it was created by mathematicians. He's not that bright so what he doesn't understand is that back when Turing was around there was no actual field of computer science. This brainlet literally thinks Turing was competing with computer scientist when in reality Turing became the father of computer science through his discoveries. He then talks about computer engineering while failing to understand what the field even is.

Stop for a second to realize what kind of brainlet he is, how stupid someone has to be to fail to grasp basic history, and then realize the majority of people who bash CS are just as dumb.
Success breeds jealousy. And there is no more successful field then computer science.

>>10342263
You're retarded as fuck if you're dumb enough to believe any of these jelly fags.
Like seriously retarded. I feel embarrassed for you.

>> No.10343395

>>10343372
>calls someone a brainlet for not not understanding the history of CS
>calls Turing the father of CS without even mentioning Church
>CS majors don't even know their own field
kek

>> No.10343435
File: 352 KB, 1280x1707, 1548531501158.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10343435

>>10341965
Pure autism tbqh, why in the fuck would a CS major need to know abstract algebra? I'm a math major but this is just retarded, when is knowing what a ring is going to help a CS major? Unless the CS major wants to do theory then learning abstract algebra would make sense since a lot of crypto is done using finite fields.

>> No.10343441

>>10343395
>he thinks the term "father" is definitive
I'd call John von Neumann and many others father of CS as well. Turing was just the first to come to mind. The term is just to show the grand contribution certain individuals have had on an academic field.
Try harder brainlet.

>> No.10343446

Most great academics are interdisciplinary, idk how this category autism is even consuming the discussion.

>> No.10343453

>>10343395
No surprise there, most CS programs don't even teach lambda calculus anymore, this is the current sad state of CS education.

>> No.10343474

>>10341225
>-History of Scientific Revolution (Elective, required for math major)
Why is that required for the math major and not math history?
>-OOP (Java)
Shit.
>-Networks (C/Python but I wrote everything in C, plus some shell scripting)
>shell scripting
Pure Autism
>-Systems Programming (C)
Why not merge it with the networks class
>-Computer Structures (C + ARM asm)
Why is there any C at all? You already had a system programming course.
>-Computer Architecture (MIPS)
Why spread this out into 2 courses.
>-Calc 4 (Vector)
Are you on the quarter system?
>-Physics of sound (elective)
>-Astronomy (elective)
>-Geology (elective)
Why the fuck are you signing up for the easiest electives you can? If you're not there to learn, you should even go to university.
>math major
>never done modern algebra, modern geometry, complex variables, probability, or topology.
>cs major
>still hasn't done algorithm design and analysis after so many semesters
>no compilers, linear programming, nonlinear optimization, graphics, vision, nor ML
>no probability or statistics classes
What the fuck are you doing nigger?
>I took a few AP classes in high school
>didn't do AP Calculus
WTF?

>> No.10344516

>>10343435
He probably meant linear algebra.

>> No.10344794

>>10338011
https://www.mcgill.ca/mathstat/undergraduate/programs/b-sc/joint-honours-mathematics-and-computer-science-b-sc

>> No.10344843

>>10342814
> Coding requires a specific mindset, intellect and skill set, and also a lot of time invested (years minimum to become any good at it)

I can attest. One of the biggest skill sets is being able to juggle the many rules and best practices all at once while designing (and developing) your software. Just recently I was writing an application for a client that used TCP and I had forgotten that TCP only ensures reliable order, it does not ensure that one piece of data comes in a single packet rather than split among 2, 3 or 10 packets. Many developers would miss or would be completely oblivious to this, and their software solution would behave erroneous. Now extend that rule to the hundreds of other rules of varying aspect, and you quickly realize that good efficient software can only be developed by good efficient people.

>> No.10345044

>>10342802
>he actually thinks this.

Cope harder dude a minority fails. Out of 120 students maybe 26 or 27. More kids get b-a+ than fail

>> No.10345045

>>10342813
>im both ..
>proceeds to list 3 things when the term 'both' only refers to 2

>> No.10345068

>>10345044
Its closer to 1/3 than 1/6

https://cte-blog.uwaterloo.ca/?p=5153

>> No.10345870
File: 69 KB, 900x900, wpi.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10345870

>>10340502
not even top 100

>> No.10346979

>>10342802
That's what they said about literacy back in the 19th century.

>> No.10347051

>>10336539
Rate my CS degree, graduating this semester.

Core:
Software Analysis and Design I - III
Discrete Math
Computer Architecture I - II
Computer Theory
Operating Systems
Capstone Course (Basically a semester where we can make whatever project we like)

Math Core:
Calc I - II
Matrix Algebra
Applied Math

Electives:
Advanced Discrete Structures (Grad level)
Algorithms(Grad level)
Advanced Networks/Cloud
Practical Web Development

I also double majored in Econ.

>> No.10347060

>>10347051
Dude i had all of those math courses completed by senior year of high school

>> No.10347064

>>10342814
This is the only post in this thread worth a damn.

>> No.10347075

>>10347051
>Software Analysis and Design I - III
So programming, data structs, and algorithms?
>Discrete Math
Pleb tier
>Computer Architecture I - II
Doubt you did 2 semesters worth of content. Bet you wasted one learning c and flipflops.
>Calc I - II
No vector calculus?
>Applied Math
Nigger, you know damn well you need to expound on that.
>Advanced Discrete Structures (Grad level)
Huh? *googles* "A second shallow survey of set theory, combinatorics/graph theory, and high school level group theory."
What a fucking joke of a grad course.
>Advanced Networks/Cloud
>Practical Web Development
b8/88

>I also double majored in Econ.
>no probability, statistics, or stochastic processes in sight
>no linear programming (seriously, what the hell)
>no differential equations
>no real and complex analysis
>took an """Advanced""" Discrete Structures instead of any of the above

What the fuck are you doing nigger?

>> No.10347078

>>10342814
lua

>> No.10347110

>>10347075

Forgot to mention a course.
Functional Programming in oCaml

>So programming, data structs, and
algorithms?
Yeah, 3 semesters.

>Doubt you did 2 semesters worth of content.

Bet you wasted one learning c and flipflops.
Didn't learn C in that course. But flip flops were in the first one.

>No vector calculus?

Nah. Although I could have. But nah. We did some vector stuff in Matrix Algebra tho.

>Nigger, you know damn well you need to expound on that.

My bad m8 it's 2:40AM. Meant to type Applied Stats. I took both Econometrics as well as Econ Stats for my Econ major and they exempted me from taking the stat course. They basically teach the same stuff.

>Advanced Discrete comment

Here's some resources on similar courses.
https://www.cs.du.edu/~cdurso/comp3200/comp3200_info.html

This is basically the stuff we did.

>Network/Cloud and Practical Web Dev

N/C was a hard class. PWD was a class that was similar to capstone. We had a semester to create a project. We made a pretty cool app and I learned a bunch about backend stuff and AWS. Working with the frontend too.

>The comments about Econ

I didn't post my Econ major courses here dipshit. Read my post. CS major. For econ I took a pretty stat heavy course load. Probability was somewhere in there too haha.

Never took differential equations or real and complex analysis though. What applications do those courses have in the industry? Something with ML

>> No.10347115

>>10347060
Glad to hear it man :)

But I didn't mention the other math/stat courses I took. Only the bare reqs for the major.

>> No.10347122

>>10347110
>https://www.cs.du.edu/~cdurso/comp3200/comp3200_info.html
>Discrete Mathematics and Its Applications, ed. 7, Kenneth H. Rosen, ISBN 978-0-07-338309-5

It's even worse than the ones I looked at.

>> No.10347123

>>10347122
What's a good textbook? I'm always looking for new material :)

>> No.10347131
File: 63 KB, 669x794, Discrete math.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10347131

>>10347123

>> No.10347147

>>10338330
>write a complex neural net.
import tensorflow

model = tf.package.fancymodel
model.train(optimizer = whatever, count = 500000, dataset = dataset)

>> No.10347157

>>10347147
LOL true as fuck
look up "neural network in x lines" it is so easy to just input data in to an existing designed network and people seem to not equate that as a valid solution

just remember to pretend it will take your team 6 months to design and structure this ADVANCED IMAGE RECOGNITION SYSTEM so you stay paid

>> No.10347159

>>10347147
>how to spot a webshit in three seconds
are you one of those "today we will be doing retarded thing X with tensorflow" youtubers

>> No.10348040

>>10342853
>The client is the architect
"Dude yeah I just want a building and uhhh it's gotta have a pool, but like I don't want to have to deal with cleaning the pool, and it should be seven stories high, with a garage on the sixth floor, heres 50k make it happen."
Then a day before the deadline for the building
"Actually I need an extra floor on top to hide all my sex toys, shouldn't be that hard to implement right?"

>> No.10348546

What about if im studying cs, but i want to apply for a more medical in biological aplications but i don't just want to work in database in hospital,

what i can do or study for doing more about aplications un the medical field?

>> No.10350419

>>10342818
just lol @ this bugman reddit fantasy