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/sci/ - Science & Math

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10085922 No.10085922 [Reply] [Original]

Optical illusions exist, therefore consciousness is an illusion.

>In b4 trigniggered autisticals trying to fault this logic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjbWr3ODbAo

>> No.10085927

Where's the actual argument?

>> No.10085971

Dennett is a sophist. He just plays word games.

All of his arguments eventually boil down to some form of "I can't prove I'm right, but you can't prove I'm wrong".

Listen to his interview with Sam Harris. The entire interview is just Dennett changing the definitions of words as Sam hones in on trying to figure out what Dennett actually means.

>> No.10085984

>>10085927
it's a complete non sequitur and dennet frankly seems like an idiot

>> No.10086005

You'd have to be retarded to not believe consciousness is an illusion. Evolution creates nervous systems. At no point did it cross some magical threshold where the laws of physics were suddenly ignored. You aren't special, you're a meat robot. Get over it.

>> No.10086010
File: 8 KB, 636x773, 1539967684776.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10086010

>>10086005
>

>> No.10086015
File: 9 KB, 203x249, 43507945071357013.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10086015

>>10086010
What's funny is that your tiny /pol/ brain short-circuits when faced with realities you can't handle, so you post memes.

>comes from a board with an average IQ of literally 60 calling people NPCs
fucking christ

>> No.10086017

>>10086005
You’re an idiot. Stop trying to look smart. Get over it.

>> No.10086022

>>10086015
You're sitting there with a straight face claiming that you don't exist, and then you have the audacity to call other people tiny-brained. Do you understand how ridiculous the idea of a system claiming its non-existence is?

>> No.10086028

>>10086022
I think the retard confused “artificial” with “illusion”, which means something doesn’t actually exist. Even if consciousness doesn’t actually have free will and is just meat signals, it’s still there.

>> No.10086030

>>10086022
>chat bots aren't conscious, therefore they don't exist
You don't even understand the difference between existence and consciousness. If you believe consciousness exists, you are absolutely retarded.

>> No.10086034

>>10086030
Oh, so you don’t subjectively experience reality. You are a philosophical zombie, according to yourself. Fucking lmao

>> No.10086040

>>10085922
WHAT MAKES SOMETHING AN OPTICAL ILLUSION AND NOT AN OPTICAL ILLUSION YOU STUPID CUNT!?

>> No.10086044

>>10086028
Probably so, but that doesn't make him any less of a retard. Yeah, ultimately something external has to decide how consciousness works, but that's inevitable and doesn't really even make free will impossible unless you define the term "wrong". To me free will is simply the ability to feel the act of making decisions. We have ample free will as humans, no matter where the decisions about decisions come from.

>>10086030
So, you ARE a literal NPC. Who programmed you to respond negatively to NPC memes?

>> No.10086051

>>10086044
Free will and consciousness would mean independence from causality, which is a laughable impossibility. You're not intelligent enough to understand that if ants aren't free or conscious, then humans can't be either because the difference between them is only in degree. There is no fundamental property of physics that magically arises in more complex organisms. Believing in free will or consciousness are exactly akin to believing in ghosts and spirits, which are beliefs ubiquitous among the lowest humans, such as yourself. You are a typical example of the Dunning-Kruger effect. A failed abortion.

>> No.10086053

>>10086044
>To me free will is simply the ability to feel the act of making decisions.
This is the most retarded "definition" I've ever seen for anything in my life, jesus christ. You are actually from pol, those are the only "people" who are this dumb.

>> No.10086056

>>10086051
Who said ants weren’t conscious? I think they obviously are. They even pass the mirror test pseudoscience.

You are literally arguing that you are a mindless meat robot and it’s hilarious. You must be trolling.

>> No.10086057

>>10086051
>causality
You realise causality is logically impossible you thick cunt? It's an infinite regress.

>> No.10086058

>>10086053
>haha you disagree so you frum dis board I dun like

>> No.10086059

>>10086051
Who says ants aren't conscious?

>>10086053
How the fuck is /pol/ related to this conversation at all you idiot? Why do you keep bringing it up?

>> No.10086060

>>10086044
>To me free will is simply the ability to feel the act of making decisions.
To me irony is when everything is made of iron.

>> No.10086061

>>10086060
wtf is this thread getting infested by sub-80 brainlets? What else would free will be, infinite regress? >>10086057

>> No.10086062

>>10086056
I'm arguing that all living organisms are mindless meat robots, which they are. It's amazing how brainlets always try to make arguments about personal feelings. Your inner experience has no bearing on whether or not consciousness exists. That realization is a ledge a little too high for you to reach. You have the reasoning skills of a person with a very poorly developed brain. I bet you're far right.

>> No.10086063

>>10086061
I feel the act of stubbing my toe that doesn't mean I did it on fucking purpose.

>> No.10086064

>>10086063
Yes, and?

>> No.10086068

>>10086062
They obviously aren’t, since you and I are conscious. Aren’t you able to recall sounds you’ve heard in the past, or imagine new environments?

>> No.10086069

>>10086062
your inner experience doesn't exist -> you don't exist, only your body does, acting out its deterministic programming -> you're an NPC with no inner experience

>> No.10086070

>>10086064
Does stubbing my toe prove I have free will?

>> No.10086071

>>10086062
>Your inner experience has no bearing on whether or not consciousness exists.

Okay but that’s all consciousness is.

>> No.10086073

>>10086051
>>10086062
You are really not anywhere near as intelligent as you think you are and you have no understanding of any of these things.
It's pitiful desu. I will never understand why people are so ready to prove themselves foolish.

>> No.10086072

>>10086070
No, but you feeling the ability to make a decision about whether you wanna stub your toe or not proves you have fee will. You can make the decision. Doesn't matter that the decision was decided beforehand.

>> No.10086074

>>10086068
>memory is free will
>Imagination is free will
Nope

>> No.10086075

>>10086074
Never said anything about free will in that statement at all. Free will is irrelevant to awareness.

>> No.10086076

>>10086073
prime example of dunning-kruger

>> No.10086079

>>10086076
You're the only one exemplifying that effect.
Go back to school, if you ever went in the first place.

>> No.10086080

Science will eventually prove free will doesn't exist when processing power reaches the point where a program can predict a person's next thought or action with 100% accuracy via dynamic brain scanning. I can't wait for that day, when all the idiots who believe in magic are forced to face facts.

>> No.10086081

>>10086072
>You can make the decision. Doesn't matter that the decision was decided beforehand.
How do you know YOU made the decision then?

>> No.10086083

>>10086079
>>10086076
just making sure, I was referring to this brainlet >>10086062, not you

>> No.10086085

>>10086080
Literally will never happen.
Determinism isn't even real and has been Disproven for almost a hundred years now.
You virgins need to wake up and smell the coffee already.

>> No.10086086

>>10086081
I just decided to not stub my toe, that's how I know it. amazing, right? What else do you want? should I also be able to decide whether I decide to stub my toe? and perhaps decide deciding to decide stub my toe too?

>> No.10086091

>>10086085
Large scale structures are deterministic for all intents and purposes. Another imbecile who thinks quantum mechanics has positive implications for free will. Oh and it is already happening, it's been done.

>> No.10086095

>>10086085
Quantum physics only reinforced determinism.

>> No.10086099

>>10086091
I wasn't comparing QM to free will, or saying QM mean's there is free will.
>Large scale structures are deterministic for all intents and purposes.
No they aren't, we can't even predict 5 bodies and how they will behave in space. And no, this isn't because we don't have the processing power, it's because it is fundamentally stochastic and unpredictable.
>Oh and it is already happening, it's been done.
HAHAHAHAHA no it hasn't and it's no technology has ever come close
You're adorable. Go get laid, bro.

>> No.10086107

>>10086095
No it didn't
Determinism has been completely removed as a valid philosophy. Superdetermism is the last possiblility and that's nothing more than a reinvention of God.
It's over, it's been over for a hundred years and you morons refuse to accept it.

>> No.10086110

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/free-will-could-all-be-an-illusion-scientists-suggest-after-study-that-shows-choice-could-just-be-a7008181.html

>> No.10086170

>>10086107
No it hasn’t. It’s only been reinforced. We just have determinism with dice.

>> No.10086178

>>10086005
>its an illusion bro
God is real and you're going to burn in hell.

>> No.10086197

>>10086170
>No it hasn’t. It’s only been reinforced. We just have determinism with dice.
You're a fucking moron.

>> No.10086207
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10086207

>>10085922
Real enough for me. This whole universe could be just my brain hallucinating in a vat, yet this is where I live and these are my thoughts, so I'll play with the cards I've been dealt.

>> No.10087326

>>10085922
this is akin to "the moon landing can be replicated therefore the moon landing was fake"

>> No.10087333

>>10085922
I might agree with this.

>> No.10088451

>>10087333

NPC detected

>> No.10088504
File: 606 KB, 750x1011, 5B0BFC7B-4178-4A71-91E7-2A08EEE4833E.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10088504

>>10086005
/lit/ here to ruin your day

>> No.10088995

>>10085927
No idea. Dennett sure is a brainlet.

>> No.10089006

>>10088504
This only counters Dennett and not the post you are replying to.

>> No.10089040

>>10086005
/thread

>> No.10089063

>>10086005
Well, this is the most retarded thing I've read this year. I feel like I need a drink now.

>> No.10090034

>>10088504
I wonder how many straws where used to build this straw man

>> No.10090537
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10090537

>>10085922
>one object in the set A is b, therefore every object in A is b.
any undergrad who knows babby's first predicate logic could see the fault in this, c'mon

>>10087326 is another example of this fallacy

>In b4 trigniggered autisticals trying to fault this logic.
your post has no logic