>2018 >take flu vaccination >still get the flu Medicine is a fucking scam and fuck the scientists who promote this shit

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Anonymous Fri Sep 21 04:55:45 2018 No.10018949 [Reply] [Original]

>2018
>take flu vaccination
>still get the flu

Medicine is a fucking scam and fuck the scientists who promote this shit

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 21 05:06:06 2018 No.10018963 Yeah, medicine is pretty disappointing. Bazilion dollars spent over decades and no cure for cancer.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 21 05:13:43 2018 No.10018967 >>10018949 Scientists are not doctors.

Anonymous Fri Sep 21 06:26:45 2018 No.10019017

>>10018949
Why would you go out of your way to pay money for something that decreases the chance of you getting a minor sickness that you'll probably get anyway? I don't bother. Unless there's some insentive, like if I was going to another country with a dangerous contagious preventable disease.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 21 06:34:31 2018 No.10019023 >>10018949 How did you even get it? Healthy people who are not older than 65 don’t even get them

Anonymous Fri Sep 21 06:53:24 2018 No.10019048

>>10018949
Didn't you bother to read the damn flyer at your doctor's practice about the vaccine?
There are too many flu strains, they mutate every season and you sometimes get the flu anyway but with a milder course of disease if vaccinated.

>>10019023
Here you can get it anyway, but you have to pay like 20 eurodollars if you are not in the high-risk group.

Anonymous Fri Sep 21 11:42:15 2018 No.10019494

The effectiveness of the flu vaccine is 60-70%, but the vaccine itself carries no risk. So you're playing the odds, and getting the vaccine will always give you better odds than not getting it, even though you still have about a 1 in 3 chance of it not protecting you.

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 21 13:28:25 2018 No.10019706 >>10018949 >take <harmless disease> vaccination You got memed.

Anonymous Fri Sep 21 21:16:34 2018 No.10020679

It is literally a known fact that the flu vaccine won't prevent that you catch it, but will help avoiding serious complications, that's why not everyone should be vaccinated but only certain groups at risk (those with heart or respiratory conditions, the elderly, pregnant women and so on).

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 21 22:48:59 2018 No.10020881 >>10018949 Did you catch the big autism though?

>>	Anonymous Fri Sep 21 22:59:25 2018 No.10020900 >>10020881 many such cases

Anonymous Sat Sep 22 17:05:11 2018 No.10022415

Isn't the whole point of flu that it mutates all the time, so you can still catch the flu even if you developed an immunity to it by exposure because it's not the same flu as before?
I will accept being called a retard because biology isn't my strong suit.

Also
>getting vaccinated for flu
what are you, 60? or maybe 6? just take a few sick days and soldier through it, it's only flu.

>>	Anonymous Sat Sep 22 23:55:30 2018 No.10023054 saw a guy almost die of the flu last year > flu B (bad strain last year) > new onset diabetes (weakens immune system) > Ketoacidosis > Staph. pneumonia > on a respirator for a month, mostly sedated he survived but was in rough shape after.

Anonymous Sun Sep 23 00:01:33 2018 No.10023059

>>10018949
More like:
>take flu vaccine
>get flu because of it
The one time I decided to trust the machine and get a flu vaccine was when I was 16, I had flu symptoms shortly after, and it's the only time I've ever had the flu.

My great grandmother was 102 and got a flu vaccine. Developed pneumonia a week later, and was dead in 2. Had no previous indication of ill health.

It's a scam, like vaccination in general.

>>10018963
Cancer has been cured a number of times. research Hoxsey, Royal Rife, and another two who were doing the same thing as Rife at roughly the same time. One out of Harvard, and another in France. I'll dig up their names.

Anonymous Sun Sep 23 00:06:53 2018 No.10023064

>>10018949
Flu is a meme vaccine. Unlike mandatory vaccinations it has a common side effect: you actually get a mild flu from it.
Combine this with the 40-60% chance the vaccine will be worthless in a given season, and its pointless to get a flu shot unless you would die from a flu.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 06:06:55 2018 No.10023419 >>10023064 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_flu Do you know why these things do not happen anymore? The people who died were young and fit.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 06:08:42 2018 No.10023421 I dunno man >Got vaccinated >Didn't get the flu >Skipped vaccination >Got the flu Just my personal observation.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 08:37:13 2018 No.10023550 >>10018949 There's more than one strain of influenza, genius.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 08:45:59 2018 No.10023558 >>10018949 More like >take flu vaccination >get autism

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 09:07:29 2018 No.10023595 >>10023059 >shortly after It takes two or three weeks to build immunity from a vaccine

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 09:08:31 2018 No.10023600 >>10023059 Rife was a nut, his machine did literally nothing.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 09:12:29 2018 No.10023609 >>10018949 >vaccine is for one variant >OP gets another woah what a scam

Anonymous Sun Sep 23 09:14:34 2018 No.10023611

>>10019494
Nope, the effectiveness on average is ~40%.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/professionals/vaccination/effectiveness-studies.htm

In the last 15 years, 60% effectiveness was the maximum.

Also, the notion that the flu vaccine "carries" no risk is ridiculous. Vaccine related deaths happen every year.

Anonymous Sun Sep 23 09:14:59 2018 No.10023612

>>10023595
>Live 102 years
>Get a flu vaccine occasionally
>Live in a rural area with limited contact with other people
>Die shortly after the latest one in some number of years
Don't be ridiculous.

>>10023600
Absurd perspective with no reasonable backing. Do some research.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 09:25:26 2018 No.10023630 >>10023612 It's not ridiculous, its biology. No one that old gets live virus vaccines, and it takes time to build immunity.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 09:30:51 2018 No.10023641 >>10023612 I HAVE done the research. His "technology" was absurd and his claims never supported.

Anonymous Sun Sep 23 09:33:47 2018 No.10023644
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>>10023641
>I HAVE done the research
Milbank Johnson?
Arthur Kendall?
All the others in this photograph?
The La Jolla clinic?

What research have you really done?

>His "technology" was absurd
Elaborate.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 09:37:32 2018 No.10023647 File: 11 KB, 447x378, 1505924813187.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10018949 >take vaccine for one strain of virus with 250 different strains >catch one of the remaing 249 >WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOW

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 10:39:20 2018 No.10023731 >>10023644 Yep. And yes, its absurd. The principle makes no physical sense, he never produced tangible results, no one has ever replicated the results he claimed, and in the end all he did was put people in an early grave.

Anonymous Sun Sep 23 11:08:00 2018 No.10023784

>>10023731
I don't know what you've been reading, but I can guess. You can't really bother to argue with the type of ignorance that makes a post like this. Except:
>no one has ever replicated the results he claimed
https://www.livescience.com/7472-kill-viruses-shake-death.html
Much higher frequencies, but likely similar underlying principle. Rife attributed his results to a form of mutually amplifying "coordinated resonance". I have suspected he was acting on enzyme systems or ion channels, but it seems this really isn't the case.

The main issue is no one has his microscope to retrace his steps. The information provided by people who supposedly have surviving frequency generators provide a lot of information, but not at all like having the machine in front of you. Inferences made by looking at old photographs and video of his lab are relatively helpful. There's little funding or access to proper materials for someone who happens to build such a machine.

Unless you happen to be an Israeli backed company that can jump through the FDAs hoops and grease the wheels. Then you can make a shitty rife machine that only kind of works, so you can drag out your patient's death and probably make more money for the treatment on top of conventional drugs which fare no better than placebo while causing horrendous side effects.

Refer to novocure on pubmed or whatever. Electromagnetic medicine is an old field and their machine (low intensity 200KHz field, contact applied) does produce results. Just not optimal. Hopefully this foot in the door will secure further funding towards real treatments, but I doubt they'd be allowed to be used. Getting a device or drug FDA approved is very expensive.

It definitely happened. It's just a matter of finding accurate information.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 11:16:50 2018 No.10023797 >>10018949 >2018 >take flu vaccination >get the flu >get autism for free It's a win win situation

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 11:29:45 2018 No.10023825 >>10018949 >2018 >Having no fucking idea how flu vaccines work Protip: Google.com

Anonymous Sun Sep 23 11:32:01 2018 No.10023827

>>10022415
>just take a few sick days and soldier through it, it's only flu.

Unless of course you interact with old people, children or people with compromised immune systems at all.

And, of course, if Spanish Flu II Electric Boogaloo turns up again, being vaccinated may have been a good idea.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 11:34:57 2018 No.10023831 File: 45 KB, 388x296, 1393936529786.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10023059

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 11:35:59 2018 No.10023833 >>10023611 >Vaccine related deaths happen every year. So do flu related deaths, though.

Anonymous Sun Sep 23 13:37:58 2018 No.10024012
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>>10019494
I haven't been sick in 9 years. I'm basically the closest thing to a God compared to humanity .

Getting suck is brainlet retard shit for children or subhumans.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 13:42:56 2018 No.10024025 >>10018949 >Flu medicine. Americans sure do say the darndest things.

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 20:33:18 2018 No.10024878 >>10023784 >It happened if you find the "right" information This is some religious apologist tier shit

>>	Anonymous Sun Sep 23 20:36:25 2018 No.10024888 >>10024878 What are you so afraid of?

Anonymous Mon Sep 24 05:23:31 2018 No.10025755

ITT: /sci/ doesn't know about complications and how the flu vaccine works.

Thousands of people die from flu related pneumonia every year and the flu vaccine is advised for old and very young people, because they are at a higher risk of developing such complications. Healthy adults can get the vaccine if they want and if they get the flu eventually it passes way milder than the normal infection. Also flu strains mutate and have predictable evolution so every year vaccines are manufactured based on epidemiological data.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 08:33:08 2018 No.10025963 >>10025755 Thanks for saying something multiple people have already said.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 08:46:16 2018 No.10025980 >>10018949 Flu vaccination doesnt cover all tribes you dummy

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 08:52:15 2018 No.10025986 >>10018949 You know what the argument for modern medicine is? We both know noone that died from smallpox.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 11:04:24 2018 No.10026146 >>10025755 Not everyone is a mutt with hidden immunity incompatibilities.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 11:09:52 2018 No.10026153 >>10023054 literally only one of those things is the flu though

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 11:11:50 2018 No.10026158 >>10023419 >die in tens of millions from the flu what did people in the past mean by this?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 12:18:41 2018 No.10026240 >>10023054 how old was he?

Anonymous Mon Sep 24 13:38:32 2018 No.10026391

>>10023784
shooting a laser at a virion in vitro is a FAR cry from replicating rife's claim that electrical microcurrents applied to the body can destroy a virion. it's basically unrelated except in the very very broadest strokes

>so you can drag out your patient's death
not even that happens. rife machines do nothing. they prolong jack shit. patient outcomes aren't affected in the slightest

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 13:45:19 2018 No.10026399 flu shot from last year was less than 50% effective doesn't that make it less effective than a placebo?

Anonymous Mon Sep 24 13:53:31 2018 No.10026414

>>10026391
You didn't read my post.
-Rife's machine was tested in vitro, ex vivo, in vivo in animals, then in humans. It worked.

>not even that happens.
To restate so you get the connection, you didn't read my post. You saw a few keywords and felt the deep need to jump in with your premade conclusion and "set things right".

That part of my post was about Novocure and what are now called "Tumor treating fields". Their device is FDA approved and clinical trials have shown a statistically significant increase in patient survival time, with no real side effects.

Novocure's machine is a just a shitty version of Rife machines that have come before. To my knowledge no machine marketed as a "rife machine" actually works on Rife's original methods. I don't know what you're so afraid of.

Anonymous Mon Sep 24 14:04:29 2018 No.10026438

>>10026414
I absolutely did read it. You might not like my response but that doesn't make you right and it doesn't mean Rife was onto anything.

And sorry, Novocure looks like bullshit. I read the glioblastoma paper, I'm not convinced the effect is real (or, if real, worth giving a shit about).

Anonymous Mon Sep 24 14:11:25 2018 No.10026444

>>10026438
Why are you so afraid? Look at the cadence of your thoughts, and re-read you own responses. It's bizarre.

Rife wasn't some guy working in isolation, a lot of people were involved. There's no sense showing you historical documents because you'll claim they were faked by "quacks" (Morris Fishbein's word) and scam artists that are always lurking in the shadows, right outside the fire light. Trying to harm good and innocent people, pulling them away into the darkness forever more.

>I read the glioblastoma paper
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=%22Tumor+treating+fields%22

>I'm not convinced
People like you don't get convinced. You stay the way you are until you feel the winds changing, making broad jumps. You're a follower. Think about that for a while.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 15:02:48 2018 No.10026543 File: 2.17 MB, 1700x2800, scientific_genius_dies_1971-1.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10026444 Have a post-death writeup.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 15:04:46 2018 No.10026544 >>10026543 He thinks everything a newspaper writes is true...

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 15:06:31 2018 No.10026546 >>10026544 I've read quite a bit and found this piece to a be a concise and relatively accurate synopsis.

Anonymous Mon Sep 24 15:23:22 2018 No.10026583

>Hit my head at work on ceiling hatch petty hard
>Go to doctors to get it looked at
>They clean it and bandage it up
>Ok great time to gtfo
>Excuse me it says here you haven't had your flu shot this year
>Oh great here we go
>Sorry I just don't really feel like I need it, if I catch the flu I'll just deal with it
>DONT YOU CARE ABOUT YOUR LIFE?!?!
>How the fuck do I respond to this
>Decide not to, just get up, pay and leave

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 15:29:08 2018 No.10026592 >>10026583 He is probably sponsored by the company.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 15:40:10 2018 No.10026611 >>10026583 Education and brainwashing are relatives.

Anonymous Mon Sep 24 17:54:22 2018 No.10026925
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>>10018949
>mfw when another season of "Retarded Normalshits Conflate Viral Gastroenteritis with the Flu" is just around the corner

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 17:58:07 2018 No.10026938 >>10018949 I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but your immune system is extremely weak. You'll likely die within the next decade.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 17:59:15 2018 No.10026942 >>10024025 So, what country are you from that you see words that don't exist?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 21:04:36 2018 No.10027298 >>10018963 >cuba socialism is the way

Anonymous Mon Sep 24 21:38:17 2018 No.10027359

>>10026444
i also read the tumor treating fields meta-analysis. i hope you forgive me for not taking seriously a favorable meta-analysis written by people with an ownership stake in the technology the paper is studying.

>It's bizarre.
no, it's rational.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 21:40:08 2018 No.10027365 File: 55 KB, 862x855, 1529533716971.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10018963 >no cure >who cares about a tripled survival rate

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 21:41:15 2018 No.10027367 File: 175 KB, 680x463, 1536529932239.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10019048 Why cant you ever get a right strain? Why do you idiots even bother?

Anonymous Mon Sep 24 21:44:10 2018 No.10027373

>>10027367
it's difficult to predict because flu infections occur in a kind of annual wave that's constantly sweeping around the globe. epidemiologists have to predict which strain will be dominant when the wave hits the USA six to nine months down the road. you can imagine how tricky that is to get right.

Anonymous Mon Sep 24 21:45:56 2018 No.10027381

>>10027367
Since i'm a relatively healthy middle aged male I don't bother too much with getting the flu shot. But if you're in a high risk bracket, and there's a particularly nasty strain that year, you would usually get inoculated against that.
Personally I think we should just put children in space suits during cold and flu season since those little germ farms are the primary vector.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 21:46:48 2018 No.10027383 >>10027381 >Since i'm a relatively healthy middle aged male I don't bother too much with getting the flu shot i hope you dont ever come in close proximity to people who are young, old, immune compromised, or allergic to eggs

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 21:50:34 2018 No.10027391 >>10027383 I regularly nut in your mother's ass.

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 22:10:32 2018 No.10027445 File: 132 KB, 824x331, Grant Chasing.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10018949 Who do you think pays the scientists?

>>	Anonymous Mon Sep 24 22:18:57 2018 No.10027464 >trying to do my real analysis homework >get bronchitis fuck me I'm never gonna be ready for these tests

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 00:47:58 2018 No.10027731 File: 159 KB, 360x277, Miss_Cleo_at_The_Jenny_Jones_Show.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10027373 Pull a number out of your ass. Weather men are more reliable than you.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 02:42:57 2018 No.10027894

>he hasn't taken the hinduism pill
Also take cold showers

Ancient societies always saw disease as something wrong. But modern societies are treating disease as normal, because there is a whole industry that thrives on it.
>>10018963

https://isha.sadhguru.org/ca/en/wisdom/article/chronic-disease-cause

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 03:01:53 2018 No.10027908 File: 202 KB, 475x562, cab.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10018949 >>take flu vaccination >>still get the flu

>>	Miniature Spacecraft Tue Sep 25 03:03:14 2018 No.10027910 >>10018949 >Medicine is a fucking scam and fuck the scientists who promote this shit Medicine is not a science and not a single one scientist would promote it.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 03:29:17 2018 No.10027935 File: 16 KB, 362x276, 1533623405142.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10018949 >never get flu shots >haven't even had a cold in years Shame that I still got the autism though

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 04:27:33 2018 No.10027968 >>10027910 > medicine >n. >The science of diagnosing, treating, or preventing disease and other damage to the body or mind. Why are you people meme'ing (should be a word). At least vent your autism in right direction.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 05:38:16 2018 No.10028019 >>10024012 >I haven't been sick in 9 years. Define "sick". If you're talking about the flu, I went about 30 years without getting it and without any flu vaccines.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 06:18:37 2018 No.10028050 >>10023059 >2 anecdotes that are tangentially related to vaccines proves the entire field wrong >cancer has been cured >twice Are posters like this even real or just one big ironic meme?

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 06:28:33 2018 No.10028061

>>10027359
Hey kiddo, guess what? To get a device or treatment in active use it needs to go through a series of clinical trials and (unless the wheels have been strongly greased) demonstrate some clear indication of efficacy. Their little half baked Rife machine (operating at a similar frequency as the one Rife reported for the cancer virus, though with very different field characteristics. Rife said a deviation of +- ~5KHz was often tolerated) has gone through these trials, and was approved. As you can expect this created quite a lot of activity in the neurooncological field, many subsequent studies and reviews were published. They're now moving on to mechanistic research concerning the physical processes at work, largely wasting time and money rediscovering what was known in bioelectromagnetics in the 1980's. Why don't you try reading the actual literature.

>>10028050
I didn't even get into what the adjuvants and actual immune response do to you.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 07:33:33 2018 No.10028103 >>10023054 >saw a guy almost die of the flu last year Me too. He got the flu and a car ran him over in his way to the pharmacy.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 07:36:00 2018 No.10028107

>>10023059
It's nice that something he postulated about a century ago turned out to be nearly correct, but that doesn't mean "cancer was cured".
The papers you have followed up posting show it isn't some kind of magical cure and that it needs to be used in combination with some drugs.

Sorry about your grandma, but she got pneumonia, not the flu.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 07:38:25 2018 No.10028111 >>10028050 http://whale.to/vaccines.html inb4 >not a reliable source! never seen it before = must be fake news

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 07:43:21 2018 No.10028114 >>10028107 ...? I think you've misunderstood. He didn't postulate, he developed, and he did. It didn't nearly work, it did work. The modern equivalents only nearly work. No drugs were used. >but she got pneumonia After a flu shot.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 07:44:57 2018 No.10028115 >>10028050 A significant % of the population is 80 iq or lower.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 07:47:28 2018 No.10028120 >>10028111 This site goes into everything from trauma programming to EMFs. It's too far outside the official narrative for most people to even lightly engage with.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 07:47:40 2018 No.10028121

>>10023059
STOP THE PRESSES YOU EXPERIENCED SIDE EFFECTS CONSISTENT WITH THE MEDICATION.
>Cancer has been cured a number of times.
Just kidding you are a blatant troll, what is the point of having moderation on this shithole site if they dont remove shit like this?

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 07:51:53 2018 No.10028127

>>10028121
Unnecessary side effects from a worthless "prophylactic". How many times have you heard someone say "I got the flu vaccine this year, but I still got the flu soon after." Yes, people are that dim, they do fail to connect the shot and flu symptoms.

It's a scam. Everything is about money. Everything is about power. Welcome to the machine, kid.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 07:57:37 2018 No.10028136

>>10028127
> "I got the flu vaccine this year, but I still got the flu soon after."
Literally never in my entire life.
>they do fail to connect the shot and flu symptoms.
No they dont, its not a secret. The relevant information is force fed to you through multiple different mediums.
> Everything is about money. Everything is about power.
1) Stating existential non sense doesnt make you look smart, nor does it make you right
2) Everything is about sex, more specifically reproduciton
3) You are probably a 20yo HS dropout

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 07:58:04 2018 No.10028137 >>10028127 >How many times have you heard someone say "I got the flu vaccine this year, but I still got the flu soon after >people get the flu in flu season

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 08:08:43 2018 No.10028149

>>10028136
> Everything is about sex, more specifically reproduciton
At a low level comparable to "everything is about making your heart beat."

>No they dont, its not a secret.
I don't think you'd even know. It's normal to you, and you're apt to simply assume everyone thinks like you think they do. You have no ear for it.

>>10028137
Getting closer.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 08:18:22 2018 No.10028157 >>10028149 >Getting closer. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA You're one of those, huh?

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 08:21:55 2018 No.10028163 >>10028157 Right now.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 09:08:36 2018 No.10028208

>>10028114
>He didn't postulate, he developed, and he did. It didn't nearly work, it did work.
No.

>After a flu shot.
And she was in complete isolation in the week following the flu shot so there was nothing else that could have caused her to get pneumonia.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 13:21:07 2018 No.10028534

>>10028127
Then why did Salk practically give away his polio vaccine for free when he could've become a multi-millionaire with the patent? Could it be that doctors and medical scientists actually do what they do to help people?

And if you're going to talk about scams, why don't you take a look at the state of alt-medicine nowadays, which is willing to sell you pure water and sugar pills for double-digit figures?

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 13:25:49 2018 No.10028541 >>10018949 >2018 >take flu vaccination >gets a cold plz understand the diference the virus that the vaccine has is not the common cold, its much more deadly

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 13:33:54 2018 No.10028557 >>10028061 >and (unless the wheels have been strongly greased) demonstrate some clear indication of efficacy. it's funny you say that, because the wheels WERE greased for TTF. TTF's evidence is sketchy at BEST.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 17:50:15 2018 No.10029113

>>10028534
>Then why did Salk practically give away his polio vaccine for free
Don't know much about that. One possible reason is that the polio vaccine came about shortly after polio's presentation became much worse, which correlated nicely the introduction of the diphtheria and pertussis vaccine. Therefore polio now had to be managed as well. This predates the insurance racket, which is what high prices most people can't pay are predicated on, therefore to not sabotage a developing market or suffer litigation, it was quickly introduced. And vaccines were the neat new thing at the time. Kind of like putting radium in water.

Even "practically" giving it away guaranteed sizeable profits, and long term relevance for many as yet undeveloped products. The culture was forming and vaccines needed to be seen as a basic and routine aspect of public health.

>>10028557
Elaborate. The FDA has a longstanding bias against energy medicine, as do most of its corporate owners. Greasing would be something apart from the ordinary sort. I do know there's Israeli affiliation, but anyway the evidence isn't that sketchy and contrary to what people want to believe, it makes perfect biophysical sense. It's reasonable well known in bioelectromagnetics that DNA is a fractal antenna, and even subtle changes in electron transport and coiling behavior can have a major impact on gene expression and behavior of other enzymes. In this case it disrupts mitotic spindle formation through a combination of the above.

Another thing worth noting is that human lymphocytes exposed to GSM phone radiation, for a period of 1 hour, develop double and single strand breaks and display a near complete inhibition of DNA repair enzyme activity for a period of 72 hours after. Really, get into bioelectromagnetics. You're going to have rethink a lot, and there's quite a bit of history over the last hundred years, but it's certainly not a fringe thing.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 17:58:10 2018 No.10029132 >>10019494 >vaccine itself carries no risk there are no free lunches

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 18:03:04 2018 No.10029142 [DELETED]

The vaccination form literally says there is mercury in the vaccination which "there has been no proof of harm" yet are still forced to write that, and also that if you have "had bad reactions" to vaccinations in the past, you should "consult your Dr" to get an approval form in case you die. I was not anti-vax until I saw how hard it was pushed at Job Corps; they gave most students >4 vaccinations upon arrival to the center, on day 2. Blood drawn, everything. Yet everyone on center got horribly sick at least 4 times, probably from food mishandling by the idiots training to be cafeteria workers put in charge of food.
>tl;dr Vaccinations are for communists.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 18:05:40 2018 No.10029146

>>10029132
Exactly. That 40-50% of Flu that fights off Vaxxed-out Immune systems, and then moves on to other complacent, "immunized" fools is nothing but the best flu viruses. Not to mention the number of aging/demented people growing actual evolving viruses/molds as "hobbies.." Killer bees and superflu were only the beginning.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 18:09:33 2018 No.10029159

>>10029142
>Injecting large amounts of aluminum and mercury into your body, all at once.
>Spurring a massive immune response all at once, especially in neonates that don't even have basic cellular-mediated immunity.

It's not hard to see why this might cause problems. Talking to people I really get the feeling that the way they think is "well it's in the context of a vaccine, so it can't be bad." Somehow they don't think the extensive data on systemic mercury and aluminum exposure, and the development of the immune system, just doesn't apply. They compartmentalize and the two realities are just kept in different boxes, and addressed separately. They would worry if they broke an old thermometer or a fluorescent light in their child's room, but have them injected with it near arbitrarily and without complaint.

Which shows the power of medicalizing.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 18:14:03 2018 No.10029170

>be me
>usually catch a cold once a year or not at all
>start master's degree
>move in to a dorm for the first time
>disgusting little hillbilly fuckers everywhere
>roommates have little to no understanding of basic hygiene
>get sick around 7-8 times in 6 months
I've decided to get vaccinated this year, maybe that'll help.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 18:14:59 2018 No.10029177

>>10029113
> The March 17 hearing for the NovoTTF device, sponsored by NovoCure (Haifa, Israel) did not go precisely as the sponsor might have wished, but the considerable presence of glioblastoma patients in the hearing room, not to mention their pleas during the open public hearing, helped nudge along opinions among panel members. Despite huge misgivings on several points, the panel voted 7-3 (with a pair of abstentions) that the benefits of the device outweighed the risk.
if it hadnt been for public attention and had been left up to just the evidence, i dont think it would have been approved. as it stands there's certainly no harm in using the device alongside current best practices but the few actual medical trials i found while searching this morning showed marginal evidence at best and i doubt that there's any meaningful benefit.

>It's reasonable well known in bioelectromagnetics that DNA is a fractal antenna
i'm a molecular biologist and what you just said is nonsense

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 18:21:08 2018 No.10029198

>>10029177
>if it hadnt been for public attention and had been left up to just the evidence, i dont think it would have been approved.
Honestly, we can't really evaluate that. Using public pressure can equate just as well with pushing towards truth, as with moving away from it. That's just how longstanding vertical control structures work, the threat of de-legitimizing can overtake the threat of compromising existing interests. If there's one thing he powerful are good at, it's potting when to give a little before you lose a lot more, if not it all. Notable failures to recongize: French revolution.

>>10029177
>i'm a molecular biologist and what you just said is nonsense
Go on.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 18:38:34 2018 No.10029241

>>10029198
>Go on.
I should know better than to do this.

Anyway, refer to the following.
DNA antenna characteristics:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21457072
(Follow up generalization)
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25152029

DNA repair behavior after field exposure:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18839414

Supplemental information:
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/dj875cd10yb72/EMF
Refer to "Nonlinear electrodynamics in biological systems". Search "Kangaroo" to jump to a particularly relevant section.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 18:44:03 2018 No.10029252

>>10029198
ok, fair

on the antenna thing: im going to focus on the blank/goodman paper since that's where most of the claims about fractal antenna behavior stem from.

one of my biggest problems with their paper is that their evidence is circumstantial at best. their best piece of evidence is the talk about nCTCTn elements allowing DNA transcription of heat shock proteins and other similar observations. however, what those experiments show does not conclusively tie the phenomenon to DNA. they were performed in vivo, in HeLa cells. and for fuck's sake it's right there in the name: heat shock proteins. responding to changes in temperature (which we know is also an effect of RF exposure) is their reason for existing. also pretty much every other stress applied to cells upregulates HSPs. what that says to me is that heat shock factors are binding to their appropriate DNA response element after the cell is heated, not that DNA is receiving RF signals directly

i dont think their reasoning is good either. this sentence is a good example: "Since DNA can interact with EMF over a wide range of frequencies, and does not appear to be limited to an optimal frequency, it has the functional properties of a fractal antenna. " This might be a valid statement IF the first statement is true. nothing about the paper proves the first statement.

there's weird mixing of the types of RF exposure they're discussing. for instantce, they talk about the mechanisms for double strand breaks as supporting evidence for a fractal antenna behavior. ionizing radiation can cause DSBs, yes, but the mechanism there is well understood and it has nothing to do with DNA being an antenna, but the authors use that phenomenon to justify DNA being an antenna. it's bad reasoning.

cont.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 18:48:56 2018 No.10029270

>>10029252
also everything we know about large scale DNA structure from the last decade suggests that DNA would be an awful antenna. the authors suggest that the long backbone and symmetric nature of DNA would lend it to being a good antenna. What we know, though, is that there are chemical modifications to the backbone itself and lots of modifications on a structural level that would destroy any antenna function it might have. changes in histone packing would dramatically alter the electrical conductivity on local and regional levels. transcription factors binding to DNA to establish or maintain euchromatin would alter conductivity of the bases. any region of active transcription would alter conductivity too. the proposed mechanism for receptivity, an increased probability of strand separation at nCTCTn motifs, i really doubt would happen to any meaningful degree.

the authors are trying to describe DNA as a long conductive element when it's really closer to millions of cut-up pieces of wire jumbling around in a bag, and also there's a gallon of tar coating everything

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 18:58:46 2018 No.10029284

>>10029252
>it's right there in the name: heat shock proteins.
"Heat shock" is a historical artifact of their discovery and initial investigations. A wide variety of cellular stress upregulate HSP expression.

>we know is also an effect of RF exposure
The RF field is very old, and was once far more active. You're referring to the idea of nonuniform energy deposition causing selective microheating, or hot spots, which the cell is able to reliably detect by some (heretofore unknown) mechanism. From the 1960's to the present, there has never been experimental evidence of, or a satisfactory model indicating these hot spots or their transduction. There was great interest in this in the USSR, because for a while it was suspected that systemic effects were redox reactions stemming from transduction in the skin and superficial blood vessels, eg releasing histamine / opioids / signaling the brain. We now know this isn't really the case.

Nonuniform absorption of RF is naturally a thing, but not with much relevance as far as triggering an actual thermal shock. Most of the electric field components are rapidly attenuated by tissues and fairly diverse cell structures, however, biological systems are more or less transparent to magnetic fields. The motion of charged groups in the intercellular space, a highly conductive fluid trapped between very good resistors (plasma membrane), reconstructs the electric fields component deeper in the body.

There are other specific aspects for ELF fields which rely on the sheer presence of NO (and will occur with its synthesis pharmacologically blocked), but that's the gist of it. This was gone over at many symposiums and in the literature practically to death. It's not thermal. HSPs are stress proteins.

>they talk about the mechanisms for double strand breaks as supporting evidence for a fractal antenna behavior
Follow some of the citations. Some fields can make DNA thrash around in wave-like motions, breaking off histone grou[..]

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 19:00:13 2018 No.10029286 The promulgation and growth of medicine and the medical field in its entirety is destroying our society from within

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 19:06:18 2018 No.10029295

>>10029284
ps. They go into this in the paper. How certain regions of genetic material are more susceptible to breakages with altered electron transport.

To my recollection these studies were also replicated with DNA in free solution, which rules out breaks from endogenous free radical generation.

>it's bad reasoning.
Considering everything known in the field, it really isn't. You should definitely take a closer look at that paper and related ones. There probably won't be anymore follow ups as Martin Blank died recently. Don't know what Goodman is up to.

>>10029270
The point isn't that it's a "really good antenna" that you would stick on something and expect to have a reliable signal, the point is just what the paper says. It is a fractal antenna and is response to an extremely wide range of frequencies. What you're positing as problems are really just technical aspects. The overall behavior remains.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 19:16:50 2018 No.10029314

>>10029295
>It is a fractal antenna and is response to an extremely wide range of frequencies.
which they didn't demonstrate at all. and no, if it's a bad antenna, it won't react to an extremely wide range of frequencies, because it won't react at all.

>You're referring to the idea of nonuniform energy deposition causing selective microheating, or hot spots, which the cell is able to reliably detect by some (heretofore unknown) mechanism.
no, i'm not. heat shock systems are incredibly sensitive. any heating at all, even systemic heating, could plausibly trigger HSPs. you dont need to invoke hotspots to explain it.

that's beside the point anyway. the observation that HSPs are upregulated following RF exposure is not evidence that DNA can receive RF signals. it's a sign that SOMETHING in the cell is reacting to DNA, but tying that to DNA antenna behavior is unsupported.

>A wide variety of cellular stress upregulate HSP expression.
did you not read the very next sentence i wrote? i acknowledged that.

>How certain regions of genetic material are more susceptible to breakages with altered electron transport.
which i didn't address because there's no evidence showing that phenomena exists or is tied to RF exposure

>Considering everything known in the field, it really isn't.
no, it's bunk.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 19:27:35 2018 No.10029340

>>10029314
>you dont need to invoke hotspots to explain it.
The thermal aspect has been looked at on many scales.
-Rectal temperature
-Bulk cell cluster heating
-Bulk individual cell heating
-Microstructure heating and its manner and rate of dispersion
Considering many different behaviors accompany a change in temperature that's often < 0.1C, if reliably detectable at all, you do need to invoke hotspots.

>the observation that HSPs are upregulated following RF exposure is not evidence that DNA can receive RF signals.
Not alone, no. I advise spending some time reading the paper and related literature. My own disposition was that HSP upregulation was occurring due to increased superoxide and NO generation (and other effects of their upstream causes), along with leakage of the electron transport chain. I found their paper made a lot of things click together and was convincing early evidence.

>i acknowledged that.
I know.

>which i didn't address because there's no evidence showing that phenomena exists or is tied to RF exposure
Read above. Do more reading. I've read in the thousands of papers on this topic, and still there's quite a bit that hasn't properly taken form yet.

>no, it's bunk.
And the conversation is over.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 19:28:07 2018 No.10029341 >>10018949 vaccines are made with weaker virus.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 19:36:02 2018 No.10029358 >>10018967 PhD???

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 19:36:37 2018 No.10029359

>>10029340
Oh while I'm at it, there's emerging speculation that these manmade fields can reactivate latent viruses retained in the microglia, causing massive cytokine production and chronic neuro-inflammation. A well known feature of autism.

Further, we know that these manmade fields lead to chronically elevated intracellular calcium. Where else have we seen this? A genetic polymorphism that leads to overactive calcium channels, Timothy syndrome, which almost always presents with autism. It's pretty much direct evidence of a causal role of altered calcium flux in autism and neurological developmental disorders.

How well an individual fares relates to their own calcium signalling and performance of intracellular Ca2+ trafficking and pumps. Ryanodine receptor behavior as well.

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 21:37:17 2018 No.10029598
File: 256 KB, 750x750, dfbfd34t14.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>10018949
>taking any vaccine
Theres your problem. inject all those babies with vaccines, they've definitely proven vaccines are unrelated to autism, just remember all the studies the CDC has done.

We tested the thimerosal in the MMR vaccine, and we... We uh... We tested... What else was tested? Oh right, nothing else.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 21:49:47 2018 No.10029618 File: 187 KB, 750x750, 1537925837611.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10029598

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 22:54:10 2018 No.10029739 >>10028149 I assume people read the literature that gets handed to them with the vaccination, if they dont both I dont give a fuck about them. Produce credible evidence that vaccinations are a scam medically or fuck off.

>>	Anonymous Tue Sep 25 22:56:57 2018 No.10029744 File: 185 KB, 1305x763, 12312321321.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10029739 We don't have a working injury reporting system. How is this not a major issue? How do we know people are having adverse reactions if nobody is reporting it?

Anonymous Tue Sep 25 23:01:05 2018 No.10029752

>>10029739
>I assume people read the literature that gets handed to them [when a doctor pushes a procedure framed as routine on them]
Lol.

>>10029744
>We don't have a working injury reporting system.
There is a system, but indeed it's not a working one. There's also a court-like system for injury payouts, but it's incredibly difficult to even appear. Very few successful cases.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 26 00:11:43 2018 No.10029865 >>10028208 >And she was in complete isolation in the week following the flu shot so there was nothing else that could have caused her to get pneumonia. Are you sure, though?

Anonymous Wed Sep 26 00:21:56 2018 No.10029886

>>10029865
Well, for the most part, I might have worded that a bit strongly. She could still traverse the slope and stairs leading into her house, mostly on her own. But beyond that she didn't really go too far, or outside her typical pattern.

She'd have interacted with my grandmother, and her other kid. Gone to my grandmother's house, then back home.

It's not really worth discussing because you can't picture it or know the context.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 26 05:05:11 2018 No.10030196 I didn't move to the city, the city moved to me, AND I WANT OUT, DESPERATELY.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 26 08:33:23 2018 No.10030353 >>10023054 Dude last year I knew a guy that died of the flue. He got the flu and then got cancer and died.

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 26 16:41:00 2018 No.10031158 >>10029340 I tried searching pubmed for some of those terms you mentioned and couldn't find anything, care to share?

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 26 19:14:51 2018 No.10031520 >>10031158 Refer to: >>10030558

>>	Anonymous Wed Sep 26 23:33:10 2018 No.10031843 >>10018949 The vacc gave you a weakened version of the flu. That's how this works, dum-dum.

>>	Anonymous Thu Sep 27 01:02:14 2018 No.10031958 File: 77 KB, 155x202, 1536612449266.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>10028103 Underrated

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/sci/ - Science & Math