/sci/ - Science & Math

>>9947338
Don't worry, we're alone.

>>9947349
well put

>>9947338
We’re that Evil intelligent civilisation sweetie. Once we find alien life we’ll either rape it, kill it, sell it, torture it, or all the above

>>9947395
There is no logical reason to have empathy for nonhumans though.

>>9947407
Dogs?

>>9947407
wholeness is rather quite logical

>>9947338
You will be dead before the time they find us, god forbid they have the tech to bring our conciseness back somehow with the sole purpose of making us suffer.

>>9947338
>What if there is an advanced alien civilization that want others to suffer and cause them unimaginable pain? I'm so scared of this thought. I don't think such a thing could exist but given the size of the universe it could be. And thinking about that honestly makes me want to kill myself. Please help


What if there was an advanced civilization that didn't want others to suffer, but it didn't stop them from wiping out 95% of life on their planet?

Might having your whole life locked in a cage to be pumped full of drugs and then vivisected while still alive.. constitute some unimaginable pain? Imply an evil civilization?

Maybe you want to kill yourself because the reality of the situation is depressing.

Many philosophers are contemplating that maybe we, in modern culture, have a death urge, an urge to subjugate and destroy all life. The fact is though that you don't need to have the intention and malice aforethought to actually go through with devious plans for destroying the world. The motives for our actions are usually hidden

>>9947407
>>9947412
Except for dogs and maybe certain domestic animals, yeah.

>>9947516
when beings feel free and powerful, creativity is expressed. however, when beings feel powerless and caged, they become destructive.

>>9947395
ugh not really, it's just the white people

>>9948361

God damn anon, i'm impressed.

>>9947407
Found the sociopath

They are called "conservatives", except for not being intelligent, advanced, nor civilized.

>>9947407
I'm interested.
On the face of it, you're right, but the debate is often over because people start weeping over animal mistreatment.
But I notice even sociopaths do often care for dogs and cats and stuff, sometimes more than they do for humans. What's going on here?

>>9947338
do it faggot

>>9947338
This is such a non problem. If it really bothers you that much is the obvious solution not to go on with life until said evil civilization invades and then just kill yourself during the invasion?

>>9947407
>There is no logical reason to have empathy for nonhumans though
There's no logical reason to have any empathy about anything or anyone including yourself

>>9948489
Yes there is maybe not for you but for us

>>9947338
we already have that. It's called normalfag society. It puts us through unimaginable suffering

>>9947338

>What if there is an advanced alien civilization that want others to suffer and cause them unimaginable pain?

It's called USA and it exists.

>>9948473
Most sociopaths mistreat animals though. One of the early signs of sociopathy in childs is hurting smaller animals for fun.

>>9948525

The McDonald triad is bullshit. Everyone is different. Sociopath's aren't good or evil, they just simply have more control over their central nervous system and emotional energy than the majority of humans. You can put whatever labels you want on whatever emerges from that.

>>9948489

LOLOLOLOLOL are you fucking serious? You can't think of any logical reason to put yourself in other people's shoes? To try and see thing's through other peoples' eyes? You're a piss poor sociopath bro. You gotta work on your understanding of this fucked up world.

>>9948560
I have loads of reasons based on emotion and instinct. None at all based on logic. Logically you can't bridge the fact/value gap, you can only do it with feelings

>>9948574

Why wouldn't you consider your feelings logical? Their is nothing more logical in this world than feelings, and I am 100% sincere in that statement.

>>9948574
Get a load of Mr.I-have-lots-of-logical-reasons-to-not-care-about-anyone. Get fucked loser

>>9948590

You get fucked cock sucker, let him speak.

>>9948591
samefag

>>9948593
samefag cock sucker

>>9948590
You don't understand at all. I care about lots of people. I'm saying you can't bridge the fact/value gap with logic, only with feelings.

>>9948595

Feelings are logic, I ask again, why don't you consider feelings logical?

>>9948598
They don't come from logic. You don't perform a little syllogism and decide to love your qt gf, you just go with your feelings. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a bad thing. I'm saying reason alone cannot be a motive to the will, but rather is the “slave of the passions" to coin a phrase. I wouldn't have it any other way

>>9948606
>You don't perform a little syllogism

Exactly, you're sub-conscious does. Just because it's a mechanism outside of your direct control does not make it illogical. In my faggoty opinion.

>>9948609
>Just because it's a mechanism outside of your direct control does not make it illogical.
Based

>>9948609
Well I guess if you mean logic in that determinist way then sure. I'm using it in the 'conscious application of intelligence and reason' way

>>9948611

LOLOLOLOLOLOL you just said it yourself, fuck the conscious application of intelligence and reason. Train the sub-conscious. It is a very real, possible thing.

>>9948489
It is logical as empathy enhances social cooperation in a human tribe.

>>9948616
>empathy enhances social cooperation in a human tribe.
Explain logically why we should value that?

>>9948613
>Train the sub-conscious. It is a very real, possible thing.
Train it to do what? And why?

>>9947376
ohh its obama ooo i knew it

>>9948826

Train it to function efficiently, because it is tremendously more powerful than the conscious mind. The conscious mind is a burden. It is slow. It is inefficient. The sub-conscious can process information much faster. The sub-conscious is also naturally reflexive, it processes information and illuminates the possible paths of action to go down in response to real time threats. Not just physical threats, but psychological threats as well, such as when debating or arguing.

>>9948902
Training it is a matter of sitting in isolation and encouraging it. Social pressure destroys the possibility of encouraging it, because social pressure puts it to work. You can't train it while it is dealing with real time threats. You must sit in isolation and talk to yourself like a crazy person. You must also exercise rigorously doing full body exercises. Stretching. Meditation. Playing with your nervous system. Combine cardio and strength training via rigorous full body exercises. Clean up your diet to be healthy, but also be aware of the empowering nature of sugar/junk food.

Basically, in order to train your sub-conscious, you must get as comfortable as you possibly can immersing yourself in mania and psychosis.

And why? SO YOU CAN BE THE APEX PREDATOR OF THIS FUCKING EARTH IN AS MANY WAYS AS YOU CAN.

Just understand, when you decide to go down this road, you will be better than everyone, and they will resent you for it if you do not know how to conduct yourself in social interactions. You must keep the work you put into training your sub-conscious behind closed doors. You do this by being as respectful and polite to everyone all the time. No hiccups. There are a lot of hiccups that go with training the sub-conscious. It is a treacherous journey, but i assure you it is worth it. Being an apex predator is amazing.

>>9948910
>>9948902
Can't help reading this in David Thewlis's voice

>>9948917

Neato, I like that. Since I wrote it, it's unbelievably frantic to my perception. I'm so fucking neurotic and self-indulgent holy fuck somebody kill me

>>9947338
>implying we haven't been breeding you all like rats for the past thousand years.

>implying you can escape because you "discovered" The Illuminati.

>implying our final plan is not almost complete and this hand reveal is not JUST. AS. PLANNED.

The final rake of the poker table.

>>9947407
Then what is antiracism?

lol what a brainlet thought, stop it you're making me laugh

>>9947407
>There is no logical reason
nah. plenty of logical arguments you could make. any argument, for or against, will be based on some fundamental assumption though. both can logically consistent after that, the difference is just in the underlying assumption. in that sense, this isn't a question that begs a logical answer but an ontological one. For example, if you accept the assumption that part of being human means upholding practices that give our species the best chance of continued survival, having empathy for non-humans is hugely important since it means we're more likely to take care of the environment which inevitably supports our own existence. If we destroyed everything that wasn't human we'd kill ourselves in the process.

>>9948821
Because it increases your own chance of life success if you aren't at odds with the human tribe you are interacting with.

>>9950926
>Because it increases your own chance of life success
Same question to this

>>9947412
Koreans

>>9947338
>Evil intelligent civilization
The moment you realize that's your civilization.
The moment it hits you that such an entity wouldn't necessarily realize its truthful nature.

>>9947412
>>9947797
I have absolutely no empathy for dogs since I got bitten by one as a child

fuck dogs and fuck you

>>9947338
>What if there is an advanced alien civilization that want others to suffer and cause them unimaginable pain?
That seems unlikely. "Humans are the evil civilization!" Kek. Humans are interested in self-gain and self-benefit. Ethics and morality are pretty intangible concepts, and I'd ask you to give your definition of "good" and "evil". I have my own ideas but they're not terribly backed up, and those that come closest to being watertight usually involve a deity somehow. The only reason humans appear "evil" is that their gain is often the downfall of their peers. It isn't the goal, it's a side-affect.

Alien civilizations wouldn't advance themselves on the principle of causing suffering. They certainly good on the principle of self-gain and self-advancement, though, much like us. I can't speak for what the goals of aliens would be as we only know one intelligent civilization, but the idea that they'd be motivated by """evil""" doesn't hold up, unless it was a secondary trait and not a defining motivation.

>And thinking about that honestly makes me want to kill myself. Please help
Start feeling like shit when you know it's there, at the very least. There's no extraterrestrial bogeyman, this is all your own doing. Feeling bad solves nothing. At least, if you want to do something productive start working on your radiation-proof bunker.

>>9947407
Is it because it's more useful to form bonds with humans? I can't see why you'd be exclusive about your empathy otherwise. What if there was a simulation of human consciousness that could provide more information and aid to you than a "living" human? Would it be even more worthwhile to have empathy for it then, rather than humans?

I think in most people's cases, including my own, we have empathy for animals, just less. Until you get down to something the size of a fly.

>>9952062
>They certainly good
**could

>>9952062
I like you anon.

Evil is an ancient concept that is hardly even a thing. What people consider "evil" is simply the most extremes of self-preservation. What people consider "evil" was necessary for the survival of our species at one time and even still now. If an advanced alien civilization had the ability to make it to us, I have a hard time believing self-preservation would be an issue for them. Therefore "evil" would be astronomically unlikely on top of the astronomically unlikely chance they could get to us, on top of the astronomically unlikely chance they even exist at all. But as we seem to be learning, in an eternal/infinite universe, all it takes for astronomically unlikely things to happen is time.

So as anon said, start building your radiation-proof bunker. But let's be real, what are the odds of us having any ability whatsoever to defend against an alien civilization that has been travelling however many light years to get to us with the intention of conquering? Good luck eating a bullet before they interrupt your attempt to even do that LOL.

>>9947338
>he thinks an alien would have a concept of pain or suffering
Why does perception of alien life continue to be so earthcentric

>>9952096
No. Evil is simple. A wish to end the omniverse. A wish to end God. That is what true evil is. For what purpose?

There is no purpose in ultimate death. Just the zero sum. Not even silence in a sensory deprivation chamber can compare.

>>9952100
Evil is just the name we give to the people we need to compete with for limited resources.

>>9952103
You don't get it. There would be nothing left to compete with because there would be nothing to compete for. Everything goes.

>>9952100
>For what purpose?
Wouldn't that be the determining factor that decides whether or not the endeavor is evil? What if someone wants to end the omniverse to bring about a neutral state devoid of evil? It would be devoid of everything good as well, but what if someone or something considered that a reasonable price to eradicate pain and suffering?

>>9952108
>nothing to compete for
the end result of consumerism?

>>9952111
You underestimate the size and scope of the omniverse/multiverse. There are entire rivers of energy where worlds are destroyed, created and renewed.

This world can get a bump up as it needs. However. The end would be absorbing it all then ending it all in one fell swoop.

>>9952119
Where the fuck are you pulling this shit from

>>9948525
That's psychopathy. Sociopathy isn't even a thing, it's just a slur for people with different moral reasoning than you.

>>9952124
>Sociopathy isn't even a thing, it's just a slur for people with different moral reasoning than you.

I respect you, anon.

>>9952109
To wish to void good is evil.

>>9952129
But if the only way to eliminate evil is to eradicate good as well, someone or something might consider it a reasonable price. Doesn't sound evil to me, just confused.

>>9952131
Confused/depressed

>>9952131
Goods love for itself, no matter how small will always keep trying 'till the end.
The altruist versus the nihilist.
The yes against the no.
The One to The Zero.

>>9952122

Funny, he reminded me of a quote.

"We are a speck of dust floating in a whirlpool of energy going nowhere in particular."

- /mu/ anon.

>>9952139
Construct a reasonable rebuttal, gtfo of here with your one-liners and faggy quotes

>>9952147
That one i can wrap my mind around. Thanks anon.

>>9950127
Illogical

>>9952149
>good
>having a price

Anon. Even I can fucking see it and I'm already half blind.

>>9947349
Proof?

>>9947407
Empathy just means you can live in symbiosis (both parties benefit from cooperation). There is no logical reason to think humans couldn't cooperate with nonhumans.

>>9947338
That kind of society would eat itself up during its infancy