/sci/ - Science & Math

>>9927039

oh no, a far left self satisfied prick is crying wolf. lets adjust our behavior around this prophet to ensure the survival of mankind.

tl;dr
blocking light harms crop yields

Blocking sunlight also does nothing for ocean acidification, which is just as big a problem as atmospheric warming.

I would be interested to see if any serious studies have been done about ocean iron fertilization, which intrigues me.

>>9927072
>Imagine being this retarded

>>9927072
>science I don't like is far-left!
lol

>>9927072
Should people like this really have free speech moving forward? The internet is blurring the lines for where our basic freedoms should lie. Should morally and intellectually garbage people like pic-related really be legally permitted to disseminate lies to thousands of people at once over unmoderated sites like this filled with impressionable, stupid people? The internet has made it clear that truth has no value to political extremists, so the argument "just debate them and win" holds no water at all. They need to be forcibly removed from the discourse by a committee of appointed intellectuals and put in their place as opinion-less sheep.

>>9927192
It's "free" speech until you get sued for slander or indictment.

>>9927192
What you just wrote is more offensive and causes more damage long term, imo.

>>9927192

I think it's better for everyone if Chicken Littles like you and OP S E E T H E, kek.

>>9927210
How?

>>9927039
>Berkeley
>blocking light harms crops

>>9927232
>billions of tons of topsoil loss per year is fine
>fishing yields crashing to zero is fine
>climate has positive feedbacks that will reinforce the more it occurs
>chicken little
I have to assume anyone that is like this simply does not give a fuck because "I'll be dead before it goes to shit."

>>9927240
You're talking about taking away people's ability to discuss things because you don't like their opinion. People who are on the fence read that, and they go the other way, because if it angers people like you (literally the same establishment that got us into this situation to begin with), it must be a good thing.

>>9927039

>Hurr Durr I don't understand photosynthesis from primary school science.

>>9927192
>The internet is blurring the lines for where our basic freedoms should lie. Should morally and intellectually garbage people like pic-related really be legally permitted to disseminate lies to thousands of people at once over unmoderated sites like this filled with impressionable, stupid people
YES they fucking should. I hate you idiots sugar coating shit all the time, you're literally talking about government interference of free speech. Who gets to decide what opinions are and are not valid? What's to stop them from using that power to censor opposing views?

>They need to be forcibly removed from the discourse by a committee of appointed intellectuals
holy shit

>>9927039
So can one of you people explain to me why I should give a single flying fuck about Global Warming if it literally will only affect me in my life time if people start doing massive pushes to change it?
As it stands, how the Earth turns out here in the next thousand years or whatever from our footprint has absolutely nothing to do with my current life. I don't give a fuck.
I can go my entire life without seeing a single problem resulting from Global Warming. So I don't care.
Fuck the future generations - literally why should I care? I won't be living through the fallout.

>>9927298
don't you care about your chil... ah who am I kidding

>>9927240
anyway, the only solution you people have put forward is more taxes, so you're essentially talking about taking away people's right to discourse if they oppose more taxes.

>>9927290
It's clearly not that simple. Should the propaganda against a minority that always precedes genocide fall under free speech, or should people wait until it's already too late? Similarly, should propaganda that prevents countermeasures to literally save humanity and millions of other species fall under free speech? Words are clearly as dangerous as nuclear weapons in certain cases; pretending otherwise is just willful ignorance. Words would be harmless in a world without politically extreme people, but here we are in Idiocracy.

>big oil discovers in the 70's their product is damaging the planet and eventually solar will replace them
>big oil begins HUGE misinformation campaign to destroy solar power and global warming science
>when the planet reaches the point of no return where stopping oil could have any impact they float the idea of blocking the sun
>they spend billions of dollars blocking out the sun reducing the temperature and become a hero of humanity
>with blocked sunlight, solar power is rendered useless on Earth for all eternity

Do you think these assholes really thought this far ahead? We know they predicted global warming in the 70's due to secret memos and research they did. Could they have planned to destroy solar too, without thinking through what it'd do to crop yields?

>>9927305
I am never having children.
Why would I want to
A: Bring children into this stupid shit hole
B: Raise annoying whiny little shits and spend all my money and time on them
C: Marry an annoying hag

I don't live for anyone but myself.

>>9927326
why would oil companies have invested money in climate research in the first place?

>>9927317
law is decided by the minds of the majority, or at least that's what those of us who still support democracy believe. if the people as a whole don't decide whether or not countermeasures to global warming, or a genocide, or any law comes into effect, then who does? once again we come to that question. you can hide behind inspirational speeches about ignorance all you like but the end game of your proposition is always an intellectual elite having the power to censor the exchange of ideas among a people, which is the first step to the death of freedom

>>9927338
Very simple. The potential for climate change is a threat to their product. They needed to know exactly what kind of threat it was. They were the 1st to do this kind of research because they had the most to loose from it.

>>9927192

>truth has no value to political extremists

>They need to be forcibly removed from the discourse by a committee

>>9927326

>big oil begins HUGE misinformation campaign to destroy solar power

Replace solar with nuclear and you may have a point. We could unironically be carbon neutral right now if not for the damn anti-nuclear hippies.

>>9927192
Fuck off (((Feinstein))).

>>9927392
The switch to nuclear is easily the largest transition we could make. Coal and natural gas are almost 2/3 of American energy.

>>9927192
For fuck's sake, no.
Suppressing consensus critics is overwhelmingly harmful to any kind of scientific or technological progress.

>>9927153
ocean acidification will truly make the earth uninhabitable

sometimes I wonder if there's some alien species trying to secretly teraform Earth to be more hospitable to them.

>>9928033
>remove 99% of fish from ocean through over fishing
>fill ocean with billions of tons of plastic micro-particles and various trash
>dump radioactive waste and organic mercury in the ocean
Seriously, if there were an alien species there's a good chance they'd be aquatic. Maybe they're eliminating all life on Earth that actually matters to them, the oceans.


Side note, why does labeling things "organic" make them healthier except when it comes to mercury?
>but, the mercury is "organic"

>>9927039
>blocking sunlight
how about refridgerating the solar system?

>>9927192
Who gets to decide the people who get censored, you?

>>9927317
>Should the propaganda against a minority that always precedes genocide
*citation needed*

>>9927153
>does nothing
That's not entirely true. If the existing coral reefs don't get destroyed by increasing ocean temperature, a lower growth rate wont be nearly as harmful.

>>9927192
No, the answer is that nobody deserves free speech. Humans should be more like mindless termites who can only think what I, the quee- I mean king, will dictate

>>9928111
It's not just coral reefs that use calcium to build shells

>>9928129
I know, I just said that the cooler temperatures would reduce some of the worse effects of ocean acidification.

>>9927335
This mindset is exactly why high IQ whites are dying out.

>>9927335
t. depressed since 40 to the grave

>>9927072
>>9927192

Holy fuck that worked out better than I expected lol

>>9928948
Knew it was bait, you're not supposed to come back for the confirmation post though, that just ruins the Poe's law illusion.

>>9927335
Literally the worst argument possible. It's basically the equivalent of
>humanity sucks so I don't want to do anything about that
You're admitting defeat over essentially nothing and unwilling to do anything about it. The most important thing that good people can do is have several kids, raise them well, and teach them to stay true to their values to ensure that they will also raise several kids, raise them well, etc.

This process over 200 years under ideal conditions would literally fix all of the world's problems and I firmly stand by that hyperbole.

If you don't want to have kids because you don't want to / don't care / hate kids / are depressed, whatever, that's fine.

But you absolutely cannot act like it's because the world is a shithole and somehow derive some moral high ground from that.

Getting real tired of you hysterical fuckwits: https://realclimatescience.com/

>>9928978

shit, it wasn't even bait lol. that first post encompasses my true feeling towards the author of the article.

Here's my gripe: If you know what the problem is, why the fuck are you writing an article about it instead of making a gameplan to fix the problem? its attention whoring through crying wolf. the author of the article can go eat a dick.

and I only bring up far left because it's Berkley. place has gotten a bad reputation over the last few years. they need to get their shit together along with a lot of big name campuses.

>>9929059
First post is fine, all the people telling you to go back to pol for it had their delicate sensibilities offended and that's their problem

>>9929072

Hell yeah

>>9928993
>this site full of bogus arguments again

I already told you, whether before or after adjustments to the temperature record are made, all of the plots presented even on this website still showed a positive warming trend of at least 0.5C over the last century. This guy goes on to conclude that these adjustments are tantamount to cooking the books, and that none of it is true. He doesn't understand why adjustments would even be made to the temperature record to correct systemic biases of the raw data. He doesn't understand scientific reasoning, and neither do you.

>>9929072
This is cringy as fuck. Specially because literally nobody told him to go back to pol. Hell, yours is the first post in the thread to even mention pol. But since you brought it up, doing something stupid and then acting like who's laughing at you because of it is doing so because they're offended is indeed pol's MO.

>>9929126
OHHH MY GOD WE'RE ALL GOING TO DIIEEEEE!!11!!!

Who cares if all the data has been "adjusted"? Who cares if the temperatures previously were not following the rates of CO2 emissions? Who cares if climatologists in the past said there was no link with temperatures and CO2? Who cares if the 1930's were made cooler than they actually were, to make the warming seem much more drastic in recent years? Who cares?

It's just science right? If you don't agree with it, then you simply don't understand it.

>>9927192
Okay let me pick the appointed intellectuals.

>>9929278
Me.

>>9927261
Yeah at this rate we won't make it to see the effects of dumping trillions of tons of C02 into the atmosphere. But hey gotta get rich quick by trading carbon credits!

I own a green energy company.

If not us, then your children, will die if we don't do anything to tackle climate change.

>>9928111
Phytoplankton are sensitive to pH levels. That in itself will completely destroy the food chain cycle and kill off massive amounts of wildlife. Not to mention they are the largest producers of oxygen on earth. Who cares about coral reefs.

>>9927039
i don't understand why we couldn't just put giant umbrellas (something light like teflon that unfolds into a large diameter parasol type thing) in geosynchronous orbit over the sahara or the middle of the ocean

>>9929151
>Who cares if the temperatures previously were not following the rates of CO2 emissions?
What do you mean by "previously"? The large increase in CO2 concentration and the temperature anomaly in the last century are positively correlated trends.
>Who cares if climatologists in the past said there was no link with temperatures and CO2?
I agree. Who cares?
>Who cares if the 1930's were made cooler than they actually were, to make the warming seem much more drastic in recent years? Who cares?
There you go again. Implying adjustments are made for the scare factor instead of empirical reasons. Once again, all of the graphs still show the warming trend, even without the adjustments.
>It's just science right? If you don't agree with it, then you simply don't understand it.
It's not merely because you disagree with it. I gave specific reasons based on the numbers as to why you don't understand what you're talking about.

>>9929296
>Yeah at this rate we won't make it to see the effects of dumping trillions of tons of C02 into the atmosphere. But hey gotta get rich quick by trading carbon credits!
More like gotta get rich selling an impossible lie and feeding an unsustainable addiction. The industrial revolution was always a disastrous mistake; we're just figuring that out now. The atmosphere CANNOT sustain this. The plant and animal life we depend on, and the topsoil and habitat they depend on, will be continually decimated, to the point of extinction, by our activities as population grows.

>>9927039
Global Warming is beneficial to most of developed world and will improve living
conditions

>>9929418
It makes cold places hotter, that can be beneficial in some ways but not in others.

>>9927298
global warming actually means longer growing season in most of northern hemisphere

>>9929418
>>9929423
It's not as much about warmth. It's mostly about drought.
And higher temperatures comes with higher drought in many (most?) places.

Sweden has had the warmest summer since the measurements started.
Also the worst crop yeld in a very long time, due to lack of rain. Many animals have needed to be slaughtered pre prime time.

>>9929436
>Also the worst crop yeld in a very long time, due to lack of rain. Many animals have needed to be slaughtered pre prime time.
About 30 to 40 thousand people have already died from starvation, crazy, crazy shit.

>>9929305
Just say humanity. The scattered few that survive won't be able to find each other to breed

>>9929493
kek, I live in 40mln country that is set to become a paradise under global warming

This thread makes me wonder if Trump shouldn't just be assassinated, the US has always been the biggest foot-dragger when it comes to tackling climate change and Trump is making things a lot worse.

>>9929475
Are you challenged in some way?

>>9929507
Ukraine? Poland?

I love warm weather, and from that perspective it's been the best summer since forever for me as a Scandinavian.

But you will need food. Heat does very little compared to water when it comes to crowing food.
You need rain for growing food.

The big issue with global warming isn't the warmth itself, it's how it fuck up the weather.

If this summer becomes the norm, starvation will come.

At the end of the day, we are going to have to remove the excess carbon from the atmosphere. There's nothing else that will work. No aerosol sprays, no sunshades, no induced volcanic eruptions, no levees or seawalls to block the rising tides. This problem was caused by us putting carbon dioxide where it wasn't supposed to be, and it will only be solved by us removing that carbon dioxide.

Fortunately, we have at least a few options for doing this, including some that do not rely on fanciful projections and technology and some that do.

>>9927150
>>9927248
Fucking brainlets. So here's the the geoengineering people have been saying "dude it'll be fine lmao! The cooler temperatures will fix the crop yields." What the Berkeley group has shown is that this simply ain't so. The entire field of solar geoengineering is now on suicide watch. Oh yeah, and we're a lot more fucked now that one of the big emergency bandaid solutions has been found to not work.

>>9929882
what about nuclear powered carbon capture?

>>9929423
>>9929436
A really big issue is the lack of topsoil in the nearer polar areas with short summers. You can't just start growing massive crops on top of bedrock. Topsoil is critically important. You need earthworms ideally, too.

>>9929890
how does that work?

>>9930023
And you know, sunlight doesn't magically become stronger at high latitudes just because it's warmer. Plants will still be getting the same amount of light.

>>9929147
I swear it one guy posting this same image over and over and it's probably the one who made it. you're not clever. you're not insightful. You for some reason think /pol/ says nigger because they want to come off as edgy like middle schoolers. yet if you actually spent more than 4 seconds there you would know they genuinely, truthfully, honest to god, hate niggers. and for good reason.

>>9929526
>you will need food
This year the harvest of fruit in Poland increased by 60%
Sucks to be you though if you are in Third World.

>>9928981
>raise kids etc
This does nothing because the number of brainlet garbage people outnumber them many times over and are statistically more likely to have children. Basic selection pressure at work.

Good riddance, it was fun while it lasted.

90% of the population is worthless anyway...

>>9930068
Furfags genuinely love animals, there's nothing wrong with it, just as there's nothing wrong about hating niggers. Just people just don't care about it and want to be left alone

>>9929526
Germany's and Scandinavia's crop yields are worse than in a long time, the drought has fucked everything.

>>9929418
Before
USA 100
Canada 10

after:
USA -50% = 50
Canada +30% = 13

well ain't that fucking great

anyone else see the irony of flying armies around the world to fight forest fires? I cant think of a better example illustrating how humans are nearly a perfect force for entropy production.

>>9930551
I don’t care for USA.
My country will do just fine.

>>9930597
You're from Poland, aren't you. Enjoy getting Putin'd up the ass. We won't be there to save you this time.

>>9930566
We're not fighting forest fires to prevent the carbon entering the atmosphere.

>>9930601
haha, what an argument lol
somebody’s bitter that he isn’t living in future Global Warming Paradise Country.
Enjoy buying our bread for $20 per loaf once the heat becomes standard.

>>9930607
Flying armies around the world to fight forest fires puts carbon into the atmosphere (which causes forest fires). Irony.

>>9930597
Just like USA will bomb you for oil, it will bomb you for grain too.

>>9930609
>thinking that if any remaining place is "paradise" that they won't be refugee'd and invaded
Migration/invasion will be the biggest cause of war when the climate disaster begins

>>9930630
what is Syria

>>9930626
Canada is closer

>>9930630
And where did these refugees gained superpowers allowing them to bypass walls and bullets.
Nobody in Poland took refugees in Syrian refugee crisis and nobody will in the future.

>>9930640
Again, Putin. Look what he did with Crimea. Obviously the guy thinks he's a neo-tsar, complete with dreams of dominating Europe. We're protecting you now, but mostly to shield ourselves from Russia/China. We may not be able to afford to do this anymore in the future, particularly if we have to deal with the fallout from climate change. Trump is right. Allies suck. You're on your own.

>>9930626
>USA
>existing as world power in 20 years

>>9930645
>ugh, my climate scare isn’t working,I will scare him with Russia, this will work
Nice try.Russia can’t even digest Donbass, least Ukraine or Poland.

>>9930647
Don't forget that power comes from nukes more than from economic might. That's why Russia is able to strut its stuff on the world stage still.

>>9930624
>puts carbon into the atmosphere (which causes forest fires)

You're almost there, the intensity of forest fires is increasing because we're getting better at flying armies around the world to put them out, letting more wood build up.

>>9927326
How gullible do you have to be to believe in solar power. Modern solar tech is expensive as fuck and terrible energy sources, nevermind in the 70's.

>>9930647
>USA
>magically losing its mint geographical position and technological edge in the next 20 yrs
I grant that the USA might get quite unstable, but nah brah the true contest in this world is between Russia and the USA (the inside and the outside of Eurasia)

>>9930654
Russia will see gigantic increase in agricultural production due to global warming

>>9930637
Canada is but a snacks worth, US will pillage all around the world. Well, most of the time they'll just manage puppet governments but every once a while they'll kick the teeth in of some country until it surrenders.

>>9930658
>>9930660
USA is on the path of becoming South Africa on steroids, a low level civil conflict and collapse of civilian infrastructure is quite possible

>>9930659
That's why Putin's supporting Trump, US will crap itself while Russia profits.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbrKLnh8wLA

>>9930664
Rome had civil wars and social revolts and mass importation of ethnics but still reached its greatest might after those things

>>9930658
>>9930660
>>9930668

http://rstb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/365/1554/2973#ref-62

In mid and high latitudes, the suitability and productivity of crops are projected to increase and extend northwards, especially for cereals and cool season seed crops (Maracchi et al. 2005; Tuck et al. 2006; Olesen et al. 2007). Crops prevalent in southern Europe such as maize, sunflower and soya beans could also become viable further north and at higher altitudes (Hildén et al. 2005; Audsley et al. 2006; Olesen et al. 2007). Here, yields could increase by as much as 30 per cent by the 2050s, dependent on crop (Alexandrov et al. 2002; Ewert et al. 2005; Richter & Semenov 2005; Audsley et al. 2006; Olesen et al. 2007). For the coming century, Fisher et al. (2005) simulated large gains in potential agricultural land for the regions such as the Russian Federation, owing to longer planting windows and generally more favourable growing conditions under warming, amounting to a 64 per cent increase over 245 million hectares by the 2080s. However, technological development could outweigh these effects, resulting in combined wheat yield increases of 37–101% by the 2050s (Ewert et al. 2005).

>>9930672
meh.
growing a small cake 30% isn't that impressive and sure as hell won't give us better food security, as the numbers in >>9930551
show

>>9930672
64 per cent increase over 245 million hectares by the 2080s.

>>9927192
in the 30s you would have been a nazi lel

>>9930676
yeah, shit hectares that barely produced two potatoes before
whopee, now we've got 3 potatoes

>>9927039
Couldn't you put some deployable solar shades in geostationary orbits over the ocean around the equator for maximum effect and achieve the same result?

>>9930689
not an argument

>>9927039
>http://news.berkeley.edu/2018/08/08/blocking-sunlight-to-cool-earth-wont-reduce-crop-damage-from-global-warming/
I really, really, really hope that article does not typify Berkeley. For this mind blowing article equates geoengineering with emitting volcanic gases into the atmosphere. And yet there are dozens of alternatives, all glossed over by this hack of a story.

>>9930694
sorry, it very much is an argument
my grandkids can't eat fantasy potatoes

>>9930689
Analysts are forecasting Russia’s grain production in 2017-18 at 134.9 million tonnes, the country’s largest crop in nearly 40 years, according to a Feb. 22 Global Agricultural Information Network (GAIN) report from the U.S. Department of Agriculture. This total includes 85 million tonnes of wheat, 20.2 million tonnes of barley, and 13.7 million tonnes of corn.

>>9930655
ahh yes. if humans weren't putting out forest fires, there would not be any forest fires. impeccable logic - the logic of a climate denier.

>>9930696
American colleges are vastly overrated.

They are filled with naive researchers that just throw money and resources into problems and still get beaten by Europe.

Not that that's going to show up in their own Anglo centric university ratings though.

>>9930699
And yet they still have to import grain

>>9930655
there are numerous studies linking global warming to increased fire intensity. go ahead and plug that into your favourite search engine if you don't believe me.

>>9928099
The self declared intellectuals, of course. Strangely once you have a technical degree you are not permitted to join this elite class of people.

>>9927153
>ocean iron fertilization
Someone tried this on his own but was quickly shot down by warmers who unilaterally declared this a horror. The warming must go on and any remedy other than a journey back into the stone age will not be accepted.

>>9930597
What serious analysis talks about "cultural impact" of climate??

>>9927072
>climate change isn't real because it would imply that my preferred ideology would have negative consequences for the world
Coming from the people who say the left is irrational.

>>9930728
>>9930597
Enjoy getting raped by mass migration from the south

>>9930742
refugees can only enter your country if you let them.

>>9930609
>All the shithole evil countries get destroyed.
>All the good countries improve.
Holy fuck. AGW has to be some kind of divine intervention by our Jewish overlords.

>>9930749
wait till you see this

>>9927039
This card is pretty sick. Use it all the time.

>>9930749
see this and laugh

>>9930671
Rome was also a vastly different society living in a vastly different age and critically and a strength, surety, and conviction of purpose on a cultural level that is incomparable to any modern nation.

>>9930738
climate change is real, and it has beneficial effect on the world, we should accelerate it

>>9930864
Beautiful ;)

It literally couldn't be more perfect.

I mean, holy fuck, it literally preserves France's little colony in South America and everything.

Just beautiful.

>>9930870
The future is so bright.

>>9930873
Agreed.

>>9930721
What was the quote from the guy who discovered this? "Give me a barge full of iron and I will start the next ice age" or some shit like that.

But no, warmies wont stop at anything but more taxs for the bloated stage 4 tumor that is the US government.

>>9930876
Means more immigrants, and less food production, and entire oceans being barren wastelands

>>9932584
food production in developed countries will be increasing, immigrants can’t enter your country if you deny them entry

>>9932724
>food production in developed countries will be increasing
not at all, agriculture is hilariously sensitive to small temp changes. A summer thats a few degrees hotter means half your harvest dies not to mention drought. The other problem is that you can't just "move" agriculture, large portions of the globe aren't suited for it. An example is Canada compared to the US, Canadian soil is much much shittier due to being scrapped clean during the last ice age, yields would be much much smaller even without additional climate problems.

and if the Gulf Steam changes you can throw it all out the window since centuries of weather trends that informed the best locations for agriculture will simply be gone

Climatetards are literal doomsday cultists.

>>9932973
>Gulf Steam
maybe that'll be its new name

>>9932977
>home-schooled retards don't understand non-linear events

>>9930609
>>9930864
>>9930870

oh wow

so climate change basically fucks over the shitholes but leaves white and asian countries alone

when it comes to humanity as a whole, this is an improvement

>>9930630
>Migration/invasion will be the biggest cause of war

I wish. Right now migration is a trickle that is enough to poison European society over long times. But if migration accelerates into something like 2016 migration crisis and worse, then people will not take it anymore and military will be used to stop it. A final solution to the migrant question.

>>9930630
>>9930630
Poland amd Hungary, Czech Republic and so on won’t give a fuck about refugees.
These countries had no colonies, and have no white guilt syndrome, anyone illegally trying to bypass their borders will be detained and deported or shot.

>>9933021
That'll be just the start.
If places like Pakistan and India become uninhabitable, the army will pack its nukes and start roaming towards north. They sure as hell are not going to just sit down and die.

>>9933168
they won’t become uninhabitable, and by the time anyone reaches Europe they will be mostly dead.
These doomsday scenarios become more funny with new version-what are they going to do? Carry nukes on oxes?

>>9933168
>the army will pack its nukes and start roaming towards north
and nobody will stop them why exactly?

YO YO YO, Hear me out B.

So if is like only possible that humans have changed the climate, then how come, the climate has changed dramatically and repeatedly for like the last 4.3 billion years when humans have only been around for like 30000 years max.

>>9927192
I doubt that any implementation of that policy would improve things. The suggestion is more likely to give fodder to the political groups who manipulate these spergs. It'd be next to impossible to do in America, unless there was some kind of emergency, in which case it would probably be too late.

We need some sort of catastrophic natural disaster to demonstrate that you can't just ignore scientific evidence because it doesn't agree with your worldview.

>>9930721
>ocean iron fertilization
>Someone tried this on his own but was quickly shot down by warmers who unilaterally declared this a horror.
It won't be enough to save us, never mind all of the unknown and poorly understood contingencies of this activity.
>The warming must go on and any remedy other than a journey back into the stone age will not be accepted.
But this is exactly what you want, denialtard. Nice projection.

Literally what fucking gears turn in people’s brain that makes them think their lay understanding means anything against people who study and observe this shit every day. I just don’t get it.

>>9933325
Wooooooooooooooooaaaaaaaaaaah

Wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah

>So if is like only possible that humans have changed the climate
It's only possible now, retard.

>>9930541
>Just people just don't care about it and want to be left alone
Go back already

>>9933900
>I just don’t get it.
>muh X political group is trying to take my Y away
at the end of the day people are short sighted and only care about short term tangible goods. Climate change is too abstract for most people to really grasp or understand beyond a "tee hee I'll just recycle more then" or "you're just trying to stop me from driving my truck" level

>>9929890
It doesn't matter what powers the carbon capture so long as it provides steady power. It could be nuclear, it could be wind, it could be solar, it could be geothermal. So long as there's power we can run the carbon removal plants. We need about 50,000 of them, but we build just about that many coal-fired power plants every decade, so it shouldn't be too difficult.

>>9933323
nukes

>berkeley btfos /sci/ again
>WAH WAH MOMMY IM TWIGGERED! CWIMATE CHANGE NITOTOT WEAL!!!
Like pottery. God I love my school.

>CO2 levels were significantly higher during earlier eons
>Earth was so covered in plants we're still finding new reserves of oil/coal
>Muh CO2 is killing the plants!!!!

>>9934724
>The earths climates shift hemispheres every 12,800 years
>end of last major climate shift was 12,800 years
>assumes it carries some pedestrian correlation to human activity
>wants to give more taxs to a bloated piece of shit government so he can feel like hes saving the wohrld
>just a generally dumb, sack of shit

>>9933900
>Literally what fucking gears turn in people’s brain that makes them think their lay understanding means anything against people who study and observe this shit every day. I just don’t get it.
>I literally cant even, like we have teachers and people in suits telling us to be scared, like how can like a nobody without a degree know anything about anyhting, I bet he's like literally like a Trump voter

RIDDLE ME THIS YOU INSUFFERABLE FUCKING CUNT.

Give me the exact percentage the CO2 balance in the atmosphere has shifted since the beginning of the industrial revolution.

>>9934657
how wonderful. when's your next hormone therapy appointment, dear?

>>9934724
>still doesn't get it's the rate of change and not just the level of CO2
Humans and the ecosystems we rely on did not evolve in a high CO2 high temperature world. Because the climate is changing so rapidly, we don't have time to adapt to it without incurring serious damage. Also, CO2 is not the limiting factor for plant growth in most cases and global warming can negatively affect those limiting factors.

>>9934800
>The earths climates shift hemispheres every 12,800 years
Wow, there is just so much wrong with this one sentence I don't know where to begin. First, there is no such cycle. Second, "climates shifting hemispheres" is meaningless and doesn't even imply global temperature change. Third, what causes this supposed cycle and how do you ignore that the effect of our massive CO2 emissions already explains the observed warming?

>>9934800
>Give me the exact percentage the CO2 balance in the atmosphere has shifted since the beginning of the industrial revolution.
Before the beginning of the industrial revolution, CO2 was at 280 ppm. It's currently 407 ppm.

Does anyone know anything about the feasibility of blocking/diverting a percentage of the sun's radiation from out in orbit? Like giant (very thin) panels placed far out in orbit.

Listen to the experts. We must deconstruct the patriarchal capitalist society before it dooms this world.

>>9935673
You have to go back >>>/pol/

>>9935566
THIS RETARD DOESNT EVEN UNDERSTAND THE PROCESSION OF THE EARTH, AHAHAHAHAHH

>From 280 to 408ppm

FUCKING AHAHAHAHAHA, Co2 comprises less then 0.04% of the atmosphere

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

WHAT A FUCKING MORON.

>>9935692
Now mathematically model how this increase will affect global temperatures.

Fucking do it, warmie.

>>9927039
>WE FUCKED NAOW
That's not actually what the article says, nor what the data they cite shows.

>>9929526
>You need rain for growing food.
More warmth means more evaporation which means more rain. Climate change won't cause droughts absolutely everywhere.

>>9935692
>THIS RETARD DOESNT EVEN UNDERSTAND THE PROCESSION OF THE EARTH, AHAHAHAHAHH
Precession alone does not cause rapid global warming. Consider that the most rapid warming observed in the last half million years is interglacial warming caused by the cycles of orbital eccentricity, precession, and obliquity coinciding, but even that warming is an order of magnitude slower than current warming. Those processes peaked about ten thousand years ago and we should be slowly cooling now. Instead we're warming even faster. There is no 12800 year cycle of global temperature change, and no cycle produces this much warming.

>FUCKING AHAHAHAHAHA, Co2 comprises less then 0.04% of the atmosphere
I'm sure you wouldn't mind drinking a glass of water that was 0.04% arsenic.

>>9935696
These fucking warmies arent even aware that the orbits of Jupiter and Saturn directly impact the climate of the earth in a 403,000 year long multi staged cycle thats recently been precisely linked to periods of hotter summers, colder winters, droughts, and shifting sea levels throughout earths climatic history. The Solar minimum in the 1600's that collectively pushed our shit in and dropped temps by 5C for a century is probably news to every single one of you dense fucks trying to shove this carbon tax down our throats.

Ignorant fucking niggers, all of you.

>>9935710
It means more rain where there already was rain and more drought where rain is needed.

>>9935730
>I'm sure you wouldn't mind drinking a glass of water that was 0.04% arsenic.
>Hurr Im sure you wouldnt want to breath in 0.04 VX gas, Checkmate climate denier
Pathetic.

>>9935730
The procession of the earth ensures the climates will shift hemispheres over this period of time in respect to the seasons. This is a simple fact, and its not my fault you're ignorant of the impact this will have on the climate. This shift can more then account for the 0.0000005C change in temperature being recorded by stationary monitoring points.

>>9935735
>I-i-it's Milankovich cycles guys I s-s-swear! Just ignore interglacial warming peaked 10000 years ago
Just stop.

>>9935740
So 0.04% of something can have an effect and your prior post has no point? Or you are OK with drinking arsenic?

>>9935760
>I-its carbon dioxide levels guys, b-b-be afraid, and p-p-pay more taxs, mouthbreathers
<totally ignores the century long 5c drop caused by the sun 400 years ago
>b-b-but guys 10,000 years ago there was ice and shit and now theres not, its obviously us
kys.

>>9935588
There is a proposal to set up a swarm of satellites at L1 with reflectors (that do some neat solar sail tricks to station keep there) to block the 2% of sunlight needed to handle the projected warming effect. About 20 million tons worth of satellites would be needed.

If the BFR hits its its goal costs (or Blue Origin or someone else makes something similar), the cost of launching that swarm would be less than a trillion dollars. Figure in $500 billion for satellite costs, and you have a project that is $75 billion a year for 20 years.

>>9935765
How do you even look at yourself in the mirror when you get up in the morning?

>>9927072
God do i hate americans

>>9935746
>The procession of the earth ensures the climates will shift hemispheres over this period of time in respect to the seasons.
The only thing precission does is make seasons in one hemisphere more extreme. It doesn't "shift climates" between hemispheres. I am still waiting for you to explain how it causes global temperature change let alone rapid global warming.

>>9935766
>totally ignores the century long 5c drop caused by the sun 400 years ago
Temperatures barely changed globally and we are approaching a solar minimum right now. How does any of this explain global warming, you hack?

>>9935769
How do you make the "argument" that CO2 is only 0.04% of the atmosphere? Are you abandoning this argument since you won't even defend it?

>>9935776
>when faced with evidence to the contrary he simply mocks and ignores, while making wild assertions about the danger we're supposedly creating

If you think you're doing anything other then getting fucking WRECKED at this point you're delusional.

>>9935778
your agenda and tactics are so blatantly obvious
>hurr w-what tactics
shut the fuck up.

>>9935785
>Projection: The Post
Since you have no response to my arguments you admit defeat, thanks.

>>9935778
Lay out the exact mathematical model that shows going from 0.025% to 0.04% is enough to upset the entire ecological balance of the world and bring about the next apocalypse.

>>9935673
well, this but unironically

There should be a global ban on coal and oil for use in power plants. We can easily use nuclear power, solar power and wind power for all our power needs, especially if the current teams pursuing fusion power make inroads on fusion that isn't a huge,expensive vanity project like ITER. Cars can eventually be banned from being built new as non-electric to deal with the gasoline problem. Countries that don't comply get totally banned from international trade.

We have to RAPE the oil and coal out of humanity.

>>9935767
>$75 billion a year
Huh, that's within the realm of possibility.

>>9935946
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_sensitivity

Now show me how anything you've posted explains the warming trend since the industrial revolution.

>>9936019
Celestial and geological influences as outlined above

Heres a graph that absolutely destroys your incessant minging about CO2

>>9935994
>There should be a global ban on coal and oil for use in power plants.
renewables save for biomass (which is just burning fucking wood instead of coal or gas) and gargantuan hydro power plants (which cost a fuckton and fuck up their surroundings) and ethanol (the new rage in EU, burning fucking rapeseed because germans are fucktards who are turning off their NPP's - sooo green!) are a fucking meme
solar, wind geothermal and tidal COMBINED don't cover 1% of global energy production
nuclear power stations cost billions to build and currently cover pathetic 3% or global production
so how do you proceed from here, because sanctioning, embargoing and throwing countries out from WTO for not being anywhere near able to readily build anywhere from dozens to hundreds or reactors, depending on the country, to replace ACTUAL bulk of their energy sources I've listed above, isn't going to get yuor plan anywhere

>>9936025
>Celestial and geological influences as outlined above
There's no model outlined above, try again.

>Heres a graph that absolutely destroys your incessant minging about CO2
Your graph shows CO2 barely changing and temperature barely changing in one place in Antarctica over the last 10000 years (being very generous, since it has no sources for me to verify that's what it is and you lie quite a lot). How does this "destroy" anything said about massive CO2 emissions on a global scale?

>>9936115
It clearly outlines a total lack of correlation.
>muh sources
Its from "academic" ice core samples. You can trace them back to their origin if you wish, since you trust teachers and authority figures so readily (as you've been conditioned too)

>>9936122
>It clearly outlines a total lack of correlation.
A lack of correlation should be expected when the effect is small enough to be dwarfed by other factors. If you choose a time frame with practically no change in CO2 and restrict the space to one where local effects reign, then there is no correlation to observe. If you want a correlation why not look at a time frame when CO2 changed and over the entire globe? But this begs the question of why you need a correlation in the first place when the causation is already proven by fundamental chemistry and by direct observation of CO2's radiative forcing via radiative spectroscopy.

>>9936154
>A lack of correlation should be expected when the effect is small enough to be dwarfed by other factors.
Do you even listen to the shit that comes out of your mouth?
>picks a 100 year span, which completely ignores the declining temperature for the last 6000 years, and all the spikes and valleys that carry the same amplitude.

>The causation is already proven, the big men in lab coats told me the sky was falling

Im gonna need a source on that.

>>9936256
>picks a 100 year span, which completely ignores the declining temperature for the last 6000 years
The temperature had been slightly declining over the last 10000 years due to glacial cooling following interglacial warming. How is this relevant to the fact that our massive CO2 emissions over the past 200 years has rapidly increased the temperature? Why can't you explain this?

>and all the spikes and valleys that carry the same amplitude.
LOL, again you are confusing the temperature in one place with global temperature. What a novice mistake.

>Im gonna need a source on that.
So you're denying the greenhouse effect now?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenhouse_effect

https://www.skepticalscience.com/empirical-evidence-for-co2-enhanced-greenhouse-effect-advanced.htm

>>9936303
>our massive CO2 emissions over the past 200 years has rapidly increased the temperature? Why can't you explain this?
How do you expect me to explain a blatant lie.

You've clearly turned this into some moral crusade, and are incapable of seeing things clearly, or even performing basic deductions on the data without being consumed by fear and irrationality.

So, how do we begin transitioning over to clean hell energy? I feel like we could handle the occasional demon outbreak easier than worldwide food production collapse.

>>9936322
>How do you expect me to explain a blatant lie.
So you admit your claim that the past 6000 years is relevant is a blatant lie, good.

>You've clearly turned this into some moral crusade,
Says the guy who can't even respond to a single argument about climate science on the evidence board! Buddy, stop projecting. You know you're out of your depth and have no factual basis. You're arguing purely based on your ideology. You can't even come up with a coherent argument. You're making a fool of yourself.

>>9936325
>climatic history prior to 1900 is irrelevant
The sheer level of ignorance you consistently display is mind boggling.
>purely based on your ideology
You even managed to give this a political context. Why am I not surprised. Im sure you feel like you're saving the fucking world and everyone in it by doing this too.

>>9936333
>climatic history prior to 1900 is irrelevant
I didn't say this, I said your particular period and place is irrelevant. You still have yet to explain how it's relevant, because there is no reasoning behind your posts.

>You even managed to give this a political context.
So why exactly are you denying climate science? Because so far you have utterly failed to give a scientific reason. So I can only conclude it's ideological.

>Im sure you feel like you're saving the fucking world and everyone in it by doing this too.
No, just shaming a retard taking out of his ads. Thanks for another post with zero substance, it really helps my point.

>>9935735
>The Solar minimum in the 1600's that collectively pushed our shit in and dropped temps by 5C for a century is probably news to every single one of you dense fucks trying to shove this carbon tax down our throats.
uhhhh

>>9936414
>No, just shaming a retard
>taking out of his ads.

>>9936433
Ok, I was wrong about the 5C statement. See how easy it is to admit when you're wrong?

>>9936460
Yes. Now if you could just admit that anthropogenic emissions are the current driving factor of climate change, rather than natural variables, and that this change due to human activity represents a dire threat if the warming trend is allowed to continue too far, we could make some real progress.

>>9930721
Anyone who thinks they can fix the environment is as brain dead as those who think there is no problem with the environment.

>>9930864
>implying this infographic wasn't concocted to manipulate the "ohh poor third worlders" retardation and encourage taking refugees into the green countries.

>>9936303
>The temperature had been slightly declining over the last 10000 years
Man it sure is cooler now than during the last ice age

>believing in global warming

>>9928033
There's more water in the mantle then there is in the oceans we would just tap into that shit

>>9936519
>believing humans are magical pixies and 42 billion tons of CO2+CO2 equivalent of other GHGs annually has no impact or a miniscule one

>>9936518
What?

>>9936503
We very much have the means to fix the environment, what we presently lack is the will. Hopefully that changes very soon.

>>9936547
>Hopefully that changes very soon.
>thinking you'll ever get the world to agree on reducing the human population by several billion and ceasing carbon emissions for a century

>>9934810
The fact that that is your question just proves his point

>>9927335
ow the edge

https://skepticalscience.com/argument.php

>>9936466
But it isn't, you stupid nigger . The climate is always naturally shifting, and it's current trend is towards another ice age, as evident by the record snowfalls, growing ice caps, and cooling temperatures. If anything we should quintuple our emissions in order to avoid another glaciation event.

>>9927153
>>9927153
>I would be interested to see if any serious studies have been done about ocean iron fertilization, which intrigues me.

They have, the dust of australia feeds the oceans.
But our biggest problem is that we need to clean the plastic shit out of our oceans.
Plastic fucks up plankton, less plankton means less oxygen in the oceans. Less oxygen means less sealife.
More then half, almost 3/4 of all plastic in the ocean is dumped there because of asians&india&africa.
We need to crack down hard on these people to stop the ocean dumping.

Climate change militias when?

>>9936519
Why did Europe burn this time?

>>9927039
Really makes you think.

>>9927192
>Democracy is great when people I want to win win!
>Free speech is great when everybody agrees with me!

>>9937442
greenland =/= global

hey you're right, actually thinking works!

>>9937407
>The climate is always naturally shifting, and it's current trend is towards another ice age
We're already in an ice age, moron.

>as evident by the record snowfalls, growing ice caps, and cooling temperatures.
So your evidence is shit that didn't happen?

>>9927039
>unknown unknowns
>plants need sunlight
wew

>>9927192
you hate white people admit it

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/unique-everybody-else/201211/cold-winters-and-the-evolution-intelligence

>>9928066
>Side note, why does labeling things "organic" make them healthier except when it comes to mercury?
Retarded words to appeal retarded people.

>>9937407
>But it isn't, you stupid nigger. The climate is always naturally shifting
true, but radiative forcing due to natural factors is dwarfed by the forcing of AGHGs and aerosols
>and it's current trend is towards another ice age
not true as average surface temperatures are consistently increasing
>as evident by the record snowfalls, growing ice caps, and cooling temperatures.
>local maxima and minima disprove global trends!

>If anything we should quintuple our emissions in order to avoid another glaciation event.
"no"

>>9937422
I saw on Twitter that there was a company using robotic boats to clean up ocean garbage patches. Hopefully it works.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-climatechange-report-exclusive/exclusive-global-warming-set-to-exceed-1-5c-slow-growth-u-n-draft-idUSKBN1JA1HD

The IPCC is very politely telling us how fucked we are.

>>9938749
That only cleans up surface plastic, which is a tiny amount of plastic in the ocean. Its more effective to install plastic catchers in rivers, stopping it from reaching the ocean to begin with.

There's currently no way to clean up the deep plastics and microplastics.

Such a shame, pissing in our our cereal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwMDvPCGeE0

Such a shame, we're pissing in our cereal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwMDvPCGeE0

>>9938749
The value of the recovered plastic, as recycled but also as fuel, is pretty large. So while surface recovery is a thing now the micro plastic lower in the water column will be big soon.

Expect some "innovative" taxes on this shortly after someone earns billions on plastic recovery.

>>9939058
god I hope so.

it's insane to me that we have all the solutions we need, we just lack the financial and political leadership to do it

>>9937798
Do you know what a standard deviation is, you fucking moron? That "spike" is well within normal parameters.

>>9939820
>Do you know what a standard deviation is
something that doesn't apply to the temperature anomaly increase

>>9939827
Ah, so we're just going to ignore any form of statistical analysis, and instead opt for emotionally driven fear mongering. Excellent.

>>9939849
You mean you're going to ignore how standard deviations and normal distributions are actually used to quantify measurement error, in favor of saying "the concept of standard deviations exists, therefore AGW is wrong." Which is not only obviously a weak argument, but a disingenuous one. The warming trend is observable and statistically significant, such that other explanations due to error or flawed methodology can be ruled out.

>>9927335
Based and blackpilled

>>9939820
Standard deviation of what? Normal parameters of what? Kek, you people are retarded. You're literally saying nothing and hoping that no one here will realize it.

>>9927039
fuck

>>9927272
They’re already not capable of being convinced. The line went from it isn’t happening, to it is happening but it is natural. Even if there are famines and disasters they won’t accept that we ever did anything, and if they do they’ll just say “whoops, but the exigencies of the situation require that we throw up walls and genocide all brown people at the gates. I mean, it’s only rational”.

The war is right now. They win by being willfull fucking retards to the very end.

>>9930876
france always wins in the end. see WW1 and WW2.

>>9927039
Why is no one in this thread pointing out the obvious? Indoor farming is becoming more and more efficient, and it will of course become the obvious solution once we move off fossil fuels

people think the immigration is bad now just wait till 2050, you'll dream for the current scenario

>>9941004
AHAHAHAAHAHAAHHAHAHHAH

warmies are so fucking delusional