/sci/ - Science & Math

>>9788836
yep, we're fucked in general.
the economic clusterfuck is just getting worse,
there is an energy crisis incoming around 2050,
and on top of that the environment will fuck us to top it off.

so yeah, maybe in like 10 000 years we'll see some space.

>>9788836
To be fair, bezos' plan is way better than branson's, and ultimately maybe better than musk's as far as colonies in space rather than on mars.

>>9788887
What is his plan? All I've seen is
>build rocket engine to sell to ULA
>copy musk's reuseable rocket
>????
No detailed plans of a spaceship or colony or anything.

>>9788836
If I may correct you. Space travel isn't dead. Space colonisation is. Space travel to low earth orbit is still used for scientifcic purposes and space travel is still needed for sattelite communication. Space colonisation is needlesly expensive and we can fix earth.

>>9788933
Okay whatever mr autist.

>>9788933
Agree, plus we do not posses the necessary know-how or technology to create a new self-sustainable colony from scratch on another world.

>>9788950
Colonizing underwater would be a good start though to develop the necessary tech for a colony.

>>9788956

>>9788956
I think even if we do that, we run into unforeseen concequences. Correct me if I'm wrong, but we don't know as much about Mars as we know about Mars. And the sea is still hospitable to life. Mars is only hospitable for microbes. It'll be a shoddy start if we build from marinecolonies.

>>9788836
It's dead because there's no point to it except satisfying sci-fi autists' wet dreams

>>9788981
>we don't know as much about Mars as we know about Mars
brainlet.jpg

>>9788993
>be stuck on one planet
>die

>>9788981
>Completely enclosed, self-sufficient capsule structures
>bad start

>>9788836
China is the largest motivating factor for the rest of the world to get their asses into space. Because China wants to go into space. They want t o colonize literally everything. They want to park nukes in places to protect "their" property in space. They want to be #1.

No one wants that end game.

>>9789004
I read somewhere about a concept of an underwater shipyard with Gauss rails propelling the ship upwards into orbit. Supplied by underwater mining and production operations and colonies.
It was a good read.

>>9789004
>Completely enclosed, self-sufficient capsule structures
>Implies that marine colonies are completely enclosed, self-sufficient capsule structures

>>9789004
>have to design everything to handle high inward pressure
>vs dealing with near vacuum causing outward pressure

>>9788956
It is literally easier to colonize space than it would be to colonize the sea floor.

>>9789013
That is why competition is good for scientific progress.

>>9789016
Sure, you never encounter large pressures in inter-planetary space travel.

>>9789017
But far more costly and harder to sustain.

>>9789023
Incorrect. Underwater is massively more expensive and harder to sustain.

>>9789016
>>9789021
>>9789023
In space the materials only need to hold back 1atm. Underwater at 10.125 meters the pressure is 1atm. At 20.125 meters it is 2atm. The average depth of the ocean floor is 3,688.08 meters and that is 365.64 atm. We simply don't have the technology to live at that depth. If you try to equalize the pressure inside to outside, you will end up dead after a while. If you try to maintain 1atm inside then everything becomes so difficult to maintain that the costs can never possibly even out in any manner and there's no amount of self-sustainment that can work.

>>9789027
There is far less chance of danger and everybody dying. I'm not sure humanity as a species, all nations included, could not handle a first colony failure and possibly watch them all die slowly on live TV everywhere.

>>9789050
>humanity should cower away from everything because of the small chance of danger
Humanity achieved what it has by doing things despite danger and braving the unknown, not by hiding in the cuckshed and crying

WE DON'T NEED SPACE TRAVEL. Seriously. Everything we need is already here on Earth. Humanity just needs to learn the basic skills of friendliness and cooperation. But that is not what we are teaching.

Jeff Bezo's plan? Looks pretty scary to me, and I don't see ANYTHING about rocket ships. WTF do we need rocket ships for anyways right now?

>>9789050
No one will be making underwater colonies simply because the hurdle is way too big. Even the research ones couldn't maintain themselves because it was so expensive.

>>9789098
You are naive.

NO. You are naive. We have been taught different things in the same subjects. We have all been played.

What do we need that is not here on Earth? Besides compassion and understanding? Nothing. Wake up.

>>9789139
>We need more love and compassion
>We need teachers who teach love and compassion
>We completely abolish culture
>Welcome to your totalitarian regime

>>9789013
More proof that war is the biggest contributor to progress.
"Nature red in tooth and claw."

>>9789112
that is very unfortunate

>>9789075
the economic burden alone would be crushing morale. On top of that, catastrophic failure. In this economy? I think not!

>>9789162
Turns out being underwater is hard. There's still a few left,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underwater_habitat#Existing_underwater_habitats

Even Hampture is still going the last time I checked. Which is more than I can say about a lot of other underwater habitats.

Love and compassion is totalitarian? Is that what you were taught. Back in my day, love and compassion was a good thing. Does good mean bad to you? Are we communicating on any level?

>>9789175
what the fuck is your problem?

>>9788871
>Socialism
>Not predatory

Hahahahaha, good one mate.

>>9789178
>>9789175
nvm, I just looked at the related posts upthread.
it seems your problem is that you're a deranged fool who believes man is a tabula rasa on which you can imprint anything through educashiun.

I speak for all sane men when I say that the world would be better off with you and all your kind dead.
_you_ are the reason why space travel is a moral imperative.
we need to get the hell away from you and your ilk.

>>9788836
Multiple billionaires started space travel companies and convinced a bunch of other billionaires to fund them based on a business research they don't spend that much money without.

But their plan is going to fail because some guy wrote a post on 4chan saying it's not profitable.

>>9789164
The chance of failure is not a reason to never try
If you knew this, you'd have achieved something with your life

>>9788836
>space
>no military value
Yeah because being able to destroy enemy satellites at will or deliver munitions from the safety of orbit is completely useless.

>>9789050
>There is far less chance of danger and everybody dying
t. idiot who knows absolutely nothing about basic physics or baromedicine.

Why do we want to spend billions to inhabit a lifeless rock again

>>9789257
Just for the heck of it

>>9788836
This is why we need to abolish capitalism and establish socialism.

Capitalism doesn't incentivize technological innovation as much as socialism.

I mean the only reason why the USA landed on the Moon was because the Soviet Union was kicking their asses on every other technological innovation aspect so they had to do something so they could shill the "capitalism equals more technology" meme for years to come.

>>9788997
That's only an argument if it's possible (let alone viable) to make other planets habitable, which is an assumption that people make on pure faith, not something that's been proven.

>>9789257
so we can have somewhere else to live in the event that earth becomes a lifeless rock too

Space Travel is a Faustian bargain.

>>9789427
Why do we need to make other planets habitable
Why do we have to waste time with planets at all?

>>9789174
>I chose Hampture
topkek

>>9789391
Hmmm, good point anon, if we are ever to out-compete the Soviets, we also must establish a planned economy.
Oh wait, the Soviet Union doesn't exist anymore? It collapsed into a bunch of shit-slinging, economically backwards pseudostates? Now why did this happen I wonder.

There actually is a military reason. Humanity is fucked. The earth will be unlovable if a few centuries if we don't make changes to our society to immediately stop greenhouse gas emissions and start sequestering as much as we possibly can (or introduce enormous negative forcings). The military knows this and it's scared shitless because it's The Biggest national security threat on the horizon, full stop. In the absence of massive social change the only way to guarantee the survival of the country and the species is offworld colonization.

>>9788836

>space is an unprofitable high-risk industry
Source?

>>9790416
their ass
the idea of technological development and expansion makes them angry

>>9789464
Nice sci fi

>>9790462

>>9788912
>copy musk's reuseable rocket
That's the good one because it means a decade from now there'll at least be two legitimate rocket manufacturers in the world instead of just one

>>9790444
Who's "them"? No one here seems angry

>>9789257
So the guy from South Africa can have somewhere to live when the entire planet is South Africa

>>9790463
Well, i guess a couple of billion years from now it could happen. We better hurry up!

>>9790469
asteroids are a thing, we haven't spotted them all and they are frequently replaced with new ones on new paths
we also have the possibility of antibiotic immune viruses tearing our shit up, nuclear war because a chucklefuck decided to be a chucklefuck, or other things along those lines

hard to lose two isolated locations than one

>>9790469
I'm sorry you're so apathetic. If you had anyone you cared about, or that cared about you, maybe you would want life to continue. And maybe if you weren't a retard, you'd realize that there is no time to lose. We cannot predict what will happen in the future, or how long moving off world will take, we must act now. And if we happen to have a Mars colony a billion years before anything bad happens to Earth, that's a hell of a lot better than having one -10 seconds after we need one

>>9789391
>This is why we need to abolish capitalism and establish socialism.
Low quality bait.

>Soviet Union was kicking their asses on every other technological innovation aspect
Hahahahahaha

>>9790413
>now why did this happen?

Because of capitalism and bad decisions, obviously. Workers' control over the means of production had nothing to do with it.

>>9790476
Are you underaged out just really stupid?

>the whims of billionaires decide the course of scientific advancement

Epic socio economic system we have here

I remember when I used to believe in space, it's very liberating once you know it's all Hollywood bullshit.

Anyway, I'll leave you all to your fantasy.

>>9790783
Well, you can always back the Chinese - by the year 2030 they expect to be caught up to where the Soviets were in the 1980s!

>>9790806
China will probably collapse before 2030
their entire system will crumple the second any outside force applies pressure to them

>>9788836
Who the fuck do you want to fight? Fight your mother because she was so hostile she spitted you out of her vagina.

Military is for money, not defense. We do not need no defense. Hostile alien race is kinda nonsense, because, well, they should've been so technologically advanced to threaten us, that they do not really need us or our destruction.

>>9790755
Explain to me your miracle system that completely eliminates corruption in a completely communist state. It doesnt exist, otherwise we would be applying it to our own socio economic system. The US needs to trend more towards socialism but not abolish the free market IE what every other relevant western nation has done.

>>9790908
>we would be applying it
No we wouldn't and we don't because powerful people would lose their power if we did. So they do everything in their power to make us not do it. They even brainwashed you with their bourgeois propaganda, ffs!

>>9790848
I was born by caesarian fagtron

>>9788836
Eccentric billionaires wont be allowed to do it too because
>muh common heritage of xirkind
>muh important gaia issues
>muh political axes in need of grinding
>muh nofun allowed you must suffer with us its not fair otherwise

>no short term or even intermediate profit
>no military benefit other than satellites
>all the current spaceflight companies just do government contracts

>>9791232
Short term profit would be hotels and tourism
so few people have gone to space, so the rich would probably want to add themselves to that esteemed number
asteroid mining could also be semi-short term, since the metals refined could build those very hotels and space casinos
do that at the start, grow until industrial stations are viable, and it will snowball from there
Get a few shipyards online and you got military interest and cash flowing in

>>9791256
i was thinking of asteroid mining as long term, i guess the "rich people tourism" makes a bit of sense

>>9791283
just need that spark to start the inferno of progress

>>9788836
lol you dipshit. The first country to have a militarized space station will be king big dick. And if you haven’t noticed, government love to show off their big ol dicks.

>>9788836
>T. Communist
You're just salty because private industry is succeeding where governments failed.

>>9788836
>There's like 2 other billionaires interested, Bezos and Branson and both their plans are retarded.

Bezos is the only one of the three who is going to succeed

Musk is full of shit

>>9790827
You should read up on the big brother system that china is building right now, they are making sure that it will never happen.

>>9792899
they can try, but they will fail
mass murdering their population is par for the course in China's eternal cycle

>>9792914
They know that, this time they are taking a different approach, spy on everybody, crack down on even the smallest uprising and make them disappear in "reeducation" camp
And most chinese now that revolution in china always comes in hand with genocide, they rather live under the thumb of the communist party then see the entire province get burned alive.

>>9788836
>it's dead

It was never alive. How much of a knave can you be..

>>9789144
t. barney the dinosaur

>>9788836
>no military value
When it comes to putting people into space there isn't much military value (that may change with space colonies), but when it comes to everything else there hasn't been this much money and innovation flowing into military space since the 60s. Military space is completely changing. More survivable satellites, satellites that spy on other satellites, upgrades and changes to space situational awareness and traffic management, massive small satellite networks vs few large satellites, ASAT missile development, in-space satellite maintenance, rapid launch capabilities, cyber warfare against space infrastructure, fucking space forces. There's so much going on in the field right now and thousands of jobs are being created. It's been continually said for awhile now that the next war between major powers will include a shooting war in orbit.