/sci/ - Science & Math

just like put people on mars nigga like lmao

>>9671865
Domed habitats

>>9671865
even if you can get enough shielding against radiations and temperature, the weak gravity will fuck you up big time. Imho there's the need to improve genetic manipulation and make colonizers with denser bones, lower blood pressure and enhanced muscle structure

I practice by playing Kerbal Space Program™ which is available on Steam.

>>9671873

>>9671873
>*Lava tubes
ftfy
>>9671899
Ship or gtfo

>>9671865
>send robots to make cave houses out of mud
>send people with 3D printer, nuclear generator and things for an indoor farm.
>pressure seal cave entrance and start making oxygen
>recycle water like on spacestation until more can be generated

Done lol

>>9671946
I suggested domes because muh aerodynamics but any shape works due to the almost nonexistent atmosphere.

>>9671865
>colonise Mars

JELLO BABIES!!!
JELLO BABIES!!!
JELLO BABIES!!!

>>9671973
Domes would be the better alternative due to dust deposit

>>9671952
with current technology nothing of what you just said is doable on mars

>>9671952
We have 3D printers that print entire houses now. Youtube search for "3D printed houses". It is pretty neat.

>>9671982
Walled habitats then? The walls are so tall they block the dust and the low G makes it easy to make tall structures on Mars.

>>9671986
how is growing food under lightbulbs and recycling water not available on mars? The rovers use nuclear generators and air recyclers were used on the missions to the moon in like 60's

The only thing that is questionable is the drones that can make mud blocks but people are working on doing that now and it's probably the simplest part of it.

>>9671992
too much dust will deposit on the flat roof and if you make it triangular shaped with tall walls on the base , with the low gravity, the winds will be a big problem

>>9671996
the problems with the food is the high radiations that will destroy it without very good shielding. the problem with the drones and 3d printers and all this kind of stuff is power consumption... generators like the one already in use are not gonna cut it by a long shot in any way that can be considered efficent

>>9672015
>>9672015
>>9672015


Literally all of those problems can be solved by throwing more money at it. lol

>>9672002
Hurricane-speed winds are like a strong breeze on Mars.

>>9672019
If only it was so simple. Technology is not there yet (10-15 years with good founding maybe). Political will is needed too.

>>9671982
>>9671992
>>9672002
Rectangles are easier to auto clean than a dome and the dome would still need to be cleaned.

>>9671946

The habitats will need to be pressurized and a very large dome is the easiest way of doing that. Like the pressure-supported domes that cover some stadiums. You could be a geodesic dome out of some suitable polymer, and with the air pressure inside balancing its weight it would be under mild tension, which is very easy to support.

>>9672028
a strong breeze in a low gravity, cold enviroment with all its additional hazards is worst than a hurricane down here

>>9672035
We can pressurize any shape. It is more important that it can be easily built and made from as much martian materials as possible. A concrete rectangle with a glass roof is the most logical for a farm.

The habitat is going to just be a modular metal like the space station for a pretty long time due to needing a zillion things to keep humans alive and in comfort. Not the same as a farm which just needs grow lights (to supplement martian light) and purified soil/fertilizer.

>>9671880
Your just talking out your ass fagot. There is no evidence that 40% gravity will fuck you up. Could be that humans live to 200 at 40% gravity. Short people live longer than tall people after all, its easier on there hearts. The effects of 40% gravity on humans (or any other animal) has never been studied because NASA is a bunch of jews that did not want to fly up the Japanese centrifuge to the ISS because they hate science that could actually be useful.


People in parts of India live with 70 millisieverts per year from the thorium sand with NO measurable increase in cancer. You would get less than that living on mars if you just slept in a shielded environment and spent all your waking hours unshielded.


I'm all for onele cylinders and asteroid colonization but your arguments suck and your a huge faggot that deserves to die, of acute radeation positioning.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19066487

>>9672034
best alternative remain a network of tunnels, but creating them is so much more difficult :(

>>9672051
I give them low chances of successfully digging for frozen ice.
Putting a habitat underground seems not feasible for a long time.

>>9672015
Yeah because all that radeation at Chernobyl created a baron mudflat where no life could exist. KYS faggot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UeZtlFeEcNg

>>9672045

I'm talking about very large structures. There's a reason we use plastic domes for pressure-supported roofs.

>>9672061
Humans rarely use domes at all. We use squares and rectangles for their ease of construction, low cost, and for full floor space (unlike a dome). Don't see anything different on Mars.

>>9672058
.....that has nothing to do with radiation on mars, brainlet

>>9672068

Within the pressure dome, that's how things will be build. For sustaining a large pressurized volume on the surface, if that's what you want to do, you can't go past a gigantic geodesic dome. Nothing else is as easy to seal or as efficient in terms of weight.

>>9672047
Go study how circulatory system works and how it gets compromised in everyday scenarios you idiot

found a cool video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmFOBoy2MZ8

>>9672069

At Chernobyl there are areas with thousands of times the radeation mars has and plants grow fine there. Ergo plants will grow fine at mars level radeation too.

>>9672088
Wait, is that real or just a proof of concept? Looks pretty real to me but you can never tell these days.

>>9672081
I already did, now you study it faggot.

I hope this doesn't sound too /x/ but why not build the main structure out of martian stone? A single scrawny man was able to make a literal castle out of blocks each weighing several tons, all by himself!!

Why can't we send a robot or 2 to build the walls of a base using the same methods, then just cover the top with glass. Gravity is only 1/3 earth so it should be 3 times as easier than what 1 skinny man could accomplish.

I hope this doesn't sound too /x/ but why not build the main structure out of martian stone? A single scrawny man was able to make a literal castle out of blocks each weighing several tons, all by himself!!
Why can't we send a robot or 2 to build the walls of a base using the same methods, then just cover the top with glass. Gravity is only 1/3 earth so it should be 3 times as easier than what 1 skinny man could accomplish.

Also, while orbital elevators aren't possible on Earth, they're more plausible on Mars. If we can establish in industry infrastructure on Mars AND have the orbital elevator it'd be our gateway to the rest of the universe. So any Mars colony should include plans for an orbital elevator, eventually.

>>9672079
I still don't see how a dome made of triangles can be sealed more easily than a concrete structure with a glass roof. You can even concrete in the glass or go fancy and put in a metal wire seal like used in vaccum work.

>>9672120
Most designs use martian soil to make concrete. Even a dome would require a concrete foundation.

>>9671865
Read Zubrin's AIAA papers, and maybe his book "The Case for Mars".
BTW, Dr. Zubrin sucks at Chemistry and confused Enthalpy with Gibbs Free energy. I noticed this about University of Washington grads... they have broad fields where they display ignorance. Not sure why that is.

>>9671880
Rotating habitats you bitch

>>9672206

Aren't his calculations complete nonsense though? Particularly the part about raising the temperature by 4 degrees leading to runaway melting of the icecaps and underground water reserves.

>>9672206
I remember Zubrin himself admitting he wasn't a chemist by training and tried to limit that topic to a minimum.

>>9672047
>There is no evidence that 40% gravity will fuck you up
Yet zero g fucks you up pretty good, how strange

>>9672212
Do you have any idea how fast / large a structure needs to spin in order to achieve usable force? No? That explains your brainlet post

>>9671865
The biggest problem is, it will always be a complete moneydrain of invesment. Even Musk himself said its nonsense to ship good from mars to earth and there is no other return of invesment.

>>9672120
>send a robot or 2
Robots a whole lot more complex than you think. Think about it this way: it took us several MILLIONS of years to evolve to our current state or we are an creation all powerful, allknowning being (depending on your view on this) and were still FLAWED in so many ways. A mashine that works on mars needs an insane amount of work, money and time.
> orbital elevators aren't possible on Earth, they're more plausible on Mars
Well there are possible here on Earth, but on Mars there would be the same problem, someone would have to pour a whole lot of money into it and getting zero or very little in return.
> gateway to the rest of the universe
doubt it, but its nice to have dreams

Most practical mars colony would be putting the entire thing deep underground. Use nuclear reactors or geothermal for energy.

All of the major challenges discussed, radiation, temperature fluctuation, dust, micrometeors, keeping structures pressurized, all solved if the colony is simply put underground.

>>9672863

this

growing crops under domes is not practical due to several reasons:

1. light on Mars is weaker than on Earth, you would need supplemental lighting anyway
2. grower LEDs are very efficient nowadays
3. You need several megawatts of power anyway to manufacture propellant. Energy requirements of growing food are minor in comparison.

Just put the base underground and be done with it. There will likely be surface buildings too but most of the base will be under at least several meters of soil.

>>9672047

>There is no evidence that 40% gravity will fuck you up.

Astronauts on the ISS are some of the healthiest people and despite rigorous exerise regime their health deteriorates linearly with time spent in orbit, with no limit yet found. Some of the deteriorations (eyesight, osteoporosis) are actually partially irreversible, and do not heal completely even after years spent back on Earth. Earth gravity is probably the single thing that was CONSTANT over the course of entire evolution of life. There is no compensatory mechanism for it at all. Gravity is likely the single biggest barrier to Mars colonization.

>>9672894

>Some of the deteriorations (eyesight, osteoporosis)

also increased muscle fibrosis persists indefinitely

>>9672786

>The biggest problem is, it will always be a complete moneydrain of invesment.

Money is actually not the biggest issue. There is plenty of money going into manned spaceflight, roughly $12 billion every year only in NASA funding, with more billions from private, military and unmanned space sectors.

The issue is gross inefficiency and corruption. There is no actual technical reason why a rocket launch should cost $ hundreds of billions at all. With rise of commercial space this is slowly improving, but a lot still remains to be done.

>>9672899
>Money is actually not the biggest issue. There is plenty of money going into manned spaceflight, roughly $12 billion every year only in NASA funding, with more billions from private, military and unmanned space sectors.
But these are mostly invesment in satellites for earth right? My point was that if somehow youd colonise mars, you dont really anything of it.

> technical reason why a rocket launch should cost $ hundreds of billions at all
maybe not billions, but easily millions.

>>9672899
imagine being so delusional you actually think extraplanetary spacetravel was ever done for profit
imagine being so delusional you unironically think companies are willing to invest tons of money into an absolutely pointless mission