/sci/ - Science & Math

it doesn't matter because infinitely many will die in either case. imaginary numbers don't exist so any appeal to complex analysis is verboten.

>>9442721
in this scenario infinity exists therefore there IS a need to to take those in count

>>9442715
zeta(0) = -1/2 and zeta(1) = -1/12, so you actually save almost an entire person's life either way. But top is better because you save a full half life rather than a twelth.

the top track kills [math] \infty [/math]
the bottom track kills [math] \frac{(\infty+1)\infty}{2}[/math]

>>9442715
Bottom track because the trolley would derail over all the bodies pretty quickly.

>>9442730
>negative incomplete people

>>9442731
but isn't ∞+1=∞ and x*∞=∞?
They're the same

>>9442715
I'll choose the broad infinite sequence thanks.

They're both infinity but the bottom track is bigger infinity.

>>9442715
I mean at any single point in time the train will have killed less people on the upper rail than on the lower. So no matter when you tally up the numbers, be it now, 5 minutes from now, or an infinite amount of time from now, it'll still be true.

>>9442934
You can't assume that properties hold in the limit!

What makes the train stop? If it's people, the answer is that both tracks will end up in killing the same ammount.

I will choose the second infinity of bodies.
Why? it's fun to believe that something depends on you.

Because the total density and mass of people per meter will be increased to the level of a black hole. This means that the train will be destroyed, like all people of two infinities.

>>9442715
>coarse

>>9442982
Sorry, I don't understand. Can you explain please?

>>9443104
You can't assume that just because every element in a sequence has a property that the limit also has the property e.g. the limit of a sequence of rationals can be irrational.

>>9443116
Yeah, completely over the head.

What is the limit? The end of time? But that's irrelevant. Any time you do the measuring of dead people will by definition be before the end of time. Am I missing something?

OP is trying to say that the top track kills infinity amount of people, but the bottom track kills -1/12 people based on what mathematics knows.

That sequence makes even less sense when you consider dead bodies.

>>9442737
Teenagers

>>9443123
>an infinite amount of time from now, it'll still be true.
You can't assume that.

>>9443123
Why is the end of time irrelevant?

the 1+2+3+4 file

1 + 2 + 3 + 4

= (1) + (1+1) + (1+1+1) + (1+1+1+1)
= 1+1+1+1+1...

Wow math is hard

>>9443138
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1_%2B_1_%2B_1_%2B_1_%2B_%E2%8B%AF

>>9442715
the top one because the train will run of fuel, fucking nerds.

>>9443184
>Teenagers
What IS the half-life of teenagers, anyway?

>>9443345
You're being stupid about this. Look at the bottom track the spacing between people is getting smaller which means soon it'll be shoulder to shoulder and people on people. The train won't be able to push through the pile of corpses but if all it has to do is mulch one person then chug into another single person it'll just be running slower than usual.

>>9442715
If the track is infinite, then both tracks would have an infinite number of people on them. If the train continues into perpetuity, then either way, an infinite number of people will die of dehydration waiting for the train to arrive. So I believe the correct thing to do is to place torpedos on the track to let the engineer know to stop. Then reverse the train and ride it back to town and rob everyone blind. After that I would probably go to the bar and ponder deeply the meaning and purpose of it all. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-bk1qugYmo

>>9442715
Wait, are their two other trains ahead of this one laying these people on the tracks?

HURR THE BOTTOM ONE KILLS LESS IF I COMPLETELY CHANGE THE DEFINITION OF ARITHMETIC AND ADDITION

This is how poos actually think.

>>9444377
This
What a retarded meme

People are packed in equally-spaced groups. Note [math]n[/math] the number of group the train kills before it's stopped. Now to work out the number of people the train kills. If you don't flip, it's:
[eqn]\frac{n\, \left(n\,+\,1\right)}2 \,=\, \underset{n \,\to\, \infty}{\Theta} \left(n^2\right)[/eqn]
while if you flip, it's
[eqn]n \,=\, \underset{n \,\to\, \infty}{\Theta} \left(n\right).[/eqn]
It's better to flip.

>>9442928
No it isn't, dickhead. Learn 2 cardinality.

>>9444377
oh?

The bottom one, and yes I understand limits, but given the wording of the problem you can't take a limit here. The train is literally moving in linear time over these people. The bottom track will always be more. The "infinity" here is the same as saying "the strain never stops". When we take a limit, we are actually taking a God's eye view of a problem and doing everything at once. We aren't doing the calculations in linear time, unlike the train which is running over these saps group by group in order. So taking the limit, and cardinality, has no place in this word problem. Most of you are equivocating.

I am actually trying to write something up on the idea of "instantaneous time" which limits would fall under. These are things that computers, even quantum computers, can't do right now. I think the notion is great for clarifying situations like this one where someone constructed an absurd scenario where things like limits don't apply.

tldr: the train is moving in linear time, so taking the limits of the two series is irrational.

The real question is if the train stops.
If it doesn't, at a specific point in time, the top track would have less people than the bottom, however in the end, you would still end up with the same amount of bodies, since it goes to infinity.

They both are divergent, but this is a thing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramanujan_summation


I would choose the bottom train course if I wanted to minimize the amount of people killed because you would kill earths population faster, assuming the train travels at the same speed in both situations.

Personally, I would choose the top because we could likely out reproduce faster than the train can kill us. This would result in people dying until the human population dies from some other cause.

>>9442715
This is a basic momentum problem. The train has an unlimited fuel reserve.

The train loses momentum upon striking each group. On the top track, the train can keep plowing people forever because it has time to regain momentum between groups. The bottom track eventually stops the train.

>>9442715
There is no right answer. Whether or not you pick the top or bottom track, an infinite amount of people will die, regardless of whether or not which track you count.

Fuck ethics.

>>9443493
An unstoppable force meets a mountain of dead bodies.

>the train is a medieval doctor's transport.

>>9447560
>claims there is no right answer from the choices
>proceeds to give the least possibly correct answer as substitute

>>9442730
You can't solve for a definite limit of a divergent series. Your magic poo in loo faggot was WRONG.

>>9447346
How is it not?

>>9447649
He is a mathlet and doesn't understand infinity is an undefined range of values and instead thinks of it as a single number. Don't worry.

by picking bottom path, you just save 1/12 life

no, don't accuse me i'm a brainlet. i know it's wrong

>infinite people
>infinite YOU
>You are being run over for eternity.
What sadistic god shaped such a universe?

>>9447603
> faggot
why the homophobia?
> poo in loo
why the racism?

>>9442715

>>9447603
>let me take this diverging series, put it in this constant and then drop the constant just 'cause
>wooooow 1= 0 checkmate math!
Poo in loo logic.

>>9442715
For any finite length of time, the 1+1+1... track would kill less people than the 1+2+3... track. For infinite lengths of time it doesnt really matter.

>>9448829
Infinity is not a number.

The 'infinity is a number" meme is so stale.

>>9443237
It is when you outsource to poos

>>9448140
But zeta is not strictly equal to summation, which is what we're doing. With summation the only valid answer is +infinity.

>>9442715
this goes back to cantor saying some infinities are larger than others thats just retarded infinity is infinity

>>9442715
le -1/12 meme

Fuck off brainlets say that y1 = 1 and y2 = x

Therefore the difference in people killed over time is .5x^2 - x which goes to infinity therefore the second track kills infinitely more people

I would choose multitrack drifting, it does not takes a difference.

Also time exist, and train kills in time, so we have dilema of two series, instead of two INIFINITE series.

>>9448876
are you off your meds, infinitely more people than infinite amount of people, you goddamn cretin

Move along the bottom track until the trolley starts experiencing non negligible resistance due to the piles of people, then switch to the other track.

>>9448875
I made this thread to discuss that (it doesn't make sense to me howthse tracks would be different and so far no one really answered the question)

>>9448852
A L E P H N U L
L
E
P
H

N
U
L

>>9448852
Infinity doesnt need to be a number for my arguement to make logical sense. There just needs to be one more group of victims than the groups killed per unit of time multiplied by any number of time units during which the number of people killed is to be measured. The number could be astronomically high given time spans reaching the lifespan of the universe, but still finite.

>>9443493
Jej

>>9443345
>>9443493
guys please, I just want to discuss poo in the loo logic and the nature of infinities, abandon all logic

>>9442721
>Imaginary numbers don't exist
If I go to look at a IKEA catalog and imagine there will be wardrobes in the book: Let's say there are wardrobes in the book but I have not yet opened it. So would that mean there isn't wardrobes in the book? Since it is based off my imagination? But I already stated there is in fact wardrobes in the book just without me knowing of course.

The only conclusion is that my imaginary wardrobes in the book do exist.

Could you use that that lower function is always larger than top function after 1, and prove that it's like that for infinity?
Meaning you kill more people in bottom track at any point in time, and you just take t=infinity?

>>9442715
Move it to 1+1+1+1 because '...' doesn't mean anything in the real world and infinity is a concept that doesn't exist outside of math.
If you want the math answer, it's 1+2+3+4+... because then -1/12th of a person would be born.

>>9448963
I did here: >>9447450
Your wording of the problem means that looking at a sum or a zeta function does not make sense. The train is literally running over these groups of people one by one in order in linear time (polynomial time for CS guys). The closest thing to "infinity" in this scenario is saying the trains never stop.

>>9442715
Top track because the space between bodies means that the trolley has more time to stop.
>>9443493
Is a moron, the train may stop in a shorter distance but will ultimately kill more people.

>>9442715
id use the one where the infinity seems smaller. (1+1+1+1+1+...)
because it may be stopped some day anyway (earth stops to exist; some other event) until then the others can die of old age.

>>9449235
Congrats -- you just independently utilized the principle of mathematical induction.

>>9450629
HEEY! anon what are you doing!?
this is a blue board!

>>9442715
I take the lower track, eventually at some point the density of people will reach a point where it stops the trolley.

>>9450633
Dont worry anon, i took care of it

>>9450641
h-how did it end for the guy?

>>9450680
Post was removed. Thanks janitors/mods

>>9442715
Obviously I will leave the train on the 1 + 2 + 3 + 4.... tracks, because when the width of the people lying on the tracks is as long as the wagon the train will derail.

>>9442715
bottom = saves infinity +1/12 people
top = kills infinity + 1/12 people

>>9450696
explain

>>9450701
there are infinity people on the top track and -1/12 people on the bottom track

>>9450703
you just said the same thing

>>9450708
No I didnt

>>9443191
Because up until that point the top track still will have killed fewer people than the bottom track.

>>9442715
does track contain a) infinite amount of people or is it b) infinite in length? If a) then both choices kill the same amount of people (since both paths contain same amount of people). If b) then bottom track kills more people since length and spacing of people are the same, but number of people per 1m of length increses.

>>9442715
Well switching to the top track will save more people and therefore kill fewer. I know you want a mathematical explanation, but tough.

>>9450727
both, and the train completes the track instantly and kills anyone on the track you've let it go on
WITHOUT DERAILING
WITHOUT RUNNING OUT OF FUEL
WITHOUT THE UNIVERSE ENDING

>>9442715
Just multitrack drift, one life desn't have value over another.

>>9450798
>the train completes the track instantly
impossible

I let the train at 1+2+3...... so the 1/12 of those people will survive. And since 1+2+3 goes to infinity then all people will survive.

>>9442715
Pick the bottom track because the bodies will pile up and stop the train.

>>9450987
>bottom track will stop train because it has more people
are you really that retarded?
upper track will stop the train at the exact same corpse count

>>9451025
Im assuming the tram will be able to push one body to the side. Once it gets to a certain part on the bottom track it will be derailed or stop because it would face to much resistance. Im trying to be practical not theoretical.

>>9450803
FOR FUUCKS SAAAKE