/sci/ - Science & Math

>>7046789
>Neil DeGrasse Tyson, mentor to Jacob Barnett and widely regarded as the most accomplished physicist since Richard Feynman

>>7046791
OP's not quoting the article there, just trolling.

Which is unnecessary, because BSM is trolling us well enough without OP's help.

>>7046791
>the most accomplished physicist since Richard Feynman

>>7046789
>Neil DeGrasse Tyson, mentor to Jacob Barnett and widely regarded as the most accomplished physicist since Richard Feynman

>>7046789
>most accomplished physicist

>the bible

LELELELE RELIGION EBIN FUGGGGG

DEAD KIKE ON A STICK

>>7046789

pleb taste.

>>7046789
>1.The bible

Bullshit. It's like telling people to read some dumb semitic comic book, like "The Adventures of Jew-Man".

The bible is a work of FICTION. It's no more or less relevant to your life than Stephen King's "The Stand".

>>7048345
He posted this on a reddit ama he said you should read it so you know how easy it is to get people to believe in mysticism or something along that line.

>>7046789
It's a pretty shitty list, especially for including Wealth of Nations, The Prince and the Art of War which is a both overrated and outdated in their respective field. I've never read 2,4,5 so I won't comment on them.

>>7048348
>Art of War and The Prince being outdated

>>7048345
>The bible is a work of FICTION. It's no more or less relevant to your life than Stephen King's "The Stand".
Do the majority of the people in my country believe Stephen King's "The Stand" is the divine word of God and do they exercise their democratic authority to pass laws I must obey based on their interpretation of Stephen King's "The Stand"?

No?

Then it's a whole fucking hell of a lot less relevant to my life than the Bible.

>1.The bible

While it may be relevant, I won't be reading a fucking meme book just because hundreds of millions of retard are deluded enough to believe the stories in it.

>>7048345
>>7048610

sockpuppet, do you believe every other book you read?

>>7048612
It's not about belief.

The Bible is just poorly written tales that have no real value. Also, the Bible is not the reason why so many people are Christians.

It's generally a very bad book; mediocre at best.

>>7048610
You're hurting my feelings.

>>7048610

>>7048603
It is, fag, have you even read it? The "principles" are superficial and obvious and the practical applications are not useful in the 21st century where millions of people are mostly influenced by media.

>>7048626
Of course a lot of the stuff isn't as practically applicable now as it was then. That is true of the Art of War as well, but it's about general underlying thought patterns, principles, and ideas. Not specific tactics and strategies. The chapter on hiring mercenaries isn't solely about hiring mercenaries to fight in your 15th century army with pikes and swords.

Stop taking everything in there so literally. Now I'll admit that there was quite a while ago I read both of those books, so I may be misremembering some parts of it, and I certainly agree that _some_ parts are completely useless, most of it is really good, as long as you interpret it correctly.

>People who think reading the bible is for morons
You are even more retarded than creationists.

Even if you don't believe in religion the bible is still a good source of wisdom. There is much more in the bible than just ''LE EBIG MAN FLOATING IN THE SKIES''

There are ancient customs discussed, Battle strategies, gynecology, ancient laws, ancient ways of life and other good life lessons to be read.

Do not discount the bible because of your own insecurities, There is no such thing as a bad book, just people who refuse learn from them.

I read the art of war, I'm not Chinese, yet there is great lessons to be learned.

I read the Quran, despite some of it's old outdated laws and brutal customes there is great wisdom to be had. In fact one sticks to me this day
''Do a good deed and then cast it into the sea''
It means to do something good and then not be a show off.

>>7048641
But it's so fucking long. And really fucking padded.

>>7048646
Good then it will teach you a virtue when you finish it. Good luck friend it gets better towards the end.

>>7046789
>"The Art of War," by Sun Tzu, "to learn that the act of killing fellow humans can be raised to an art."

ayyy lmao

>>7048641
The Bible is not a horrible book per say, but clearly not #1 on any good reading list. More like #300 or so.

>>7048688
Also, you'd be much better off reading Socrates and Plato than the Bible, if you're after morals.

> "The Wealth of Nations," by Adam Smith, "to learn that capitalism is an economy of greed, a force of nature unto itself."

There are many books and essays written to criticize The Wealth of Nations, but reducing it to "hurr durr capitalists are greedy" is a shameless level of retard.

>The bible
Feel free to read the New Testament if you want, but very little of the rest is worth reading, and that which is is mostly to get references.
>The system of the world
Ew. Newton is a dry and mechanical writer. Pick up a textbook instead. It will be less out of date and give you more perspective.
>On the origin of species
Darwin is actually a pretty nice read and a good insight into empiricism in practice, but that's clearly not why BSG picked it. BSG picked it to validate a debate that in all relevant terms doesn't even exist (unless you're a conservative politician up for election).
>gullivers travels
What? Why? Why would you pick one of the most trivial and popular (in every sense of the word) early modern books? "to learn that most of the time humans are yahoos"? Ugh just read Catcher in the Rye, it'll be less childish.
>the age of reason
I know I've read this but it left zero impression on me. I can't even remember anything it said. Whatever it said I'm pretty sure other writers do it better and earlier.
>the wealth of nations
No comment; never read it.
>the prince
An important historical piece that revolutionized political thinking in its time (rejected the ongoing hypocritical and inconsistent morality-driven mode of thought with a results-based one), but you'd probably find it obvious and compromised in this day. BSG wants you to hate the fact that people think like Machiavelli advises, but I think you'll find that if anything Machiavelli doesn't go far enough (he still holds on to divine good and evil).
>the art of war
Probably like The Prince, but I'm less familiar with the history of the east, so to me it was just kind of boring.

>>7048710
He's a pop scientist, of course he's a retard.

>>7048714
Basically if someone tries to draft a list of recommended reading which includes classics, but doesn't include Euclid, or any Grecian texts at all, then just ignore him/her.

>3.On the origin of species

Unless you plan to become a historian, there is no reason to read this book. The language is antiquated, some of the contents are obsolete and the quintessence is being taught in a more modern form in every biology class in school. The only people other than historians who buy this book are teenaged fedora autists who put it away after a few pages because they only bought it to follow a false ideal of pretentious pseudo-intellectualism enforced by reddit culture.

>People still not getting why he choose these books.
Your slipping into /v/ tier intelligence /sci/, at this rate you will never catch up with /g/.

>>7048725
Chose*
Welp I'm /b/ tier retarded disregard what I said.

>>7048725
I get why he chose these books: because he's a polemic buffoon. It's not a very interesting subject.

>>7048732
If he chooses these entry level and popular books then our situation is much worse than previously thought.

People aren't reading or pursuing education as much as they should and he is using these to try and draw as much people in as possible. I'm almost surprised he didn't include Harry Potter books.

I don't know how long till we reached the point of no return, when we won't be able to produce anymore thinkers domestically and it our foreign student pool dries up as developing worlds become developed the travel to the land of idiots becomes less desirable.

>>7048743
You're comparing a state of the world where "most people will only ever read entry level books" to the old state of the world where "most people can't read or will only read/write to keep track of things."

A land where so many people are flooding into higher education that now higher education is meaningless to a world where the academy was for the pampered elite.

There are problems with this country and world that is struggling with the new ramifications of globalization and absolute bureaucracy, but lamenting on the age-old fallacy "people are getting dumber" is just self-indulgent.

You should not be using Black Science Guy to be a sign of anything. He's a celebrity and a curator. Essentially a kinder-gardener teacher.

>>7046789
>4.gullivers travels

Top kek

>>7048777
>A land where so many people are flooding into higher education
Liberal arts degree or Afro-American poetry is not ''higher education''.

ok. try this: if you want to communicate with people, not just "your kind" or class, you need to understand where their basic tenets come from. hence:
1.The bible - major metaphors and axioms of thw western world, plus some of its greatest stupidities
2.The system of the world
3.On the origin of species - an honest and more thorough answer to: "daddy, where did i come from?"
4.gullivers travels - a firm grounding in absurdity and satire is essential for the development of humor AND totlerance
5.the age of reason - a better answer to the question: "why is the sky blue, daddy?"
6.the wealth of nations - exactly what most people are thinking about when they aren't thinking about sex
7.the art of war - a non-western view of conflict resolution
8.the prince - a western version of above (though clausewitz might've more appropos)

>>7048345
>he thinks people just started believing in a God without any good reason
ok.
Atheism is so much about feeling superior.

Jew here. Can christians explain me why the old testament is suddenly seen as wrong by christians?
Isn't gods word supposed to be true?

At least over here we don't pick and choose what we believe in and what not. God's word is final.
also a friendly reminder that your god's son was a jew.

>>7048785
You'll find the statistics of "proper" degrees and fields are plenty bolstering. You could, of course, state the counter-point that this only causes the courses to get dumbed down to accommodate for the less talented individuals going into college, but whether or not this is true, it is clear that a lack of pursuit of education is not the problem.

>>7048815
Of course he was a jew, he couldn't be a Christian or else he would worship himself.

Also most preachers I know seem to quote the old testament the most. I think it's just the outlying mega protestant dome services who like to solely focus on the new additions rather than the whole.

>>7048825
explain to me the change of character of your god then. he's a completely different person than in the new testament.

>>7048815
>>7048815
Jacob – Joseph - Moses – Aaron – David – Solomon – Job – Jonah – Elias – Elisha – Zachariah and John were sent to the people of Israel. Then came Jesus and suddenly he's a fraud ?

>>7048815
God's Word is not some committee patchwork of selective source writings and selective commissions. God's Word is his impact on this world as can be heard by everyone willing to accept Him. The Bible is an important piece of literature, probably THE most important. It is the closest we have to the life and minds of the prophets and followers who came close to God either through his Word or physically through Jesus, some even written parts of the Bible and this is very valuable because it may help US to see how to hear God's Word.

But the idea that this collection of words and pages called "the Bible" is some divine immutable projection of God is as outdated to most Christians as heliocentrism.

>>7048841
> selective commissions
Sorry "selective omissions."

>>7048641
>Even if you don't believe in religion the bible is still a good source of wisdom.

There are still thousands of books that surpass the Bible in terms of both specialized and rounded wisdom.

>>7048841
>God's Word is not some committee patchwork of selective source writings and selective commissions.

tell that the pope and get laughed at

>>7048847
Christian != Catholic

>>7048641
>''Do a good deed and then cast it into the sea''
>It means to do something good and then not be a show off.

I would interpret that more so as not using your good deeds as excuses to commit bad deeds.

The bible? Seriously? It's a poorly written work of fiction. Should have recommended Harry Potter or Lord of the rings instead. At least those have literary merit.

>>7048851

and that's why your religion is a mess. too many fractions, everyone trying to interpret gods word in their own way.
someone has to be wrong.

>>7048844
That's still no reason to completely dismiss it though.

>>7048863
Yes, in fact everyone is wrong. We are imperfect beings. We are divine in that we have access to the divine Spirit inside of but, but surrounded by a body of clay and neurons that speaks in muffled waves and interprets based on happenstance experiences. But though Wrong and Right might be black and white Platonics, when filtered through the human lens, it is muddy. So two "wrong" people are not equal parts wrong. It is not pointless to pursue Rightness and there is much value to pursuing God's Word no matter how much of a mess lies in between us and Him.

>>7048873
>Yes, in fact everyone is wrong.

Nah, we jews have it figured out. It's not even as exclusive as most people think.
Everyone can become a jew, but it takes more effort than just being baptised.

If any of you do chose to read the bible you would do well to watch this priest's video

http://youtu.be/htxOjJHB5-8

And do well to remember that biblical literalism is a relatively new heresy that simply did not exist before the 18th or 19th century

And the Catholic Church has never taught this biblical literalistic heresy

Which is why they have never denounced the theory of evolution in history

>>7048885
Darkness defines the boundaries of the light. That there is an algebra of light is testament to its incompleteness. I am no baptist. You can be chosen by your god, the book all you want.

Your rightness is powerless. It is impotent. Power through imperfect pursuit is virile and undeniably usable. Ask the scientists.

>>7048904
That's what happens when stupid people get literate. That and this >>7046789 .

>>7046789
No one has ever finished art of war

>>7048922
>tfw I bought it when I was like 12
>tfw I thought it would be badass and shit
>tfw I didn't even get through the first two pages before setting it down and never picking it up again

>>7048922
this lol
I bought it after reading the prince, went through about 60% of the book until I realized the point was made in the first 10 pages and everything else was just hammering the reader with the same idea over and over again and that I wouldn't learn anything about actually waging war.

>>7048710
pop sci = retarded

Glad you learned something new for today. His whole fucking reading list is a joke.

>>7048920
>I chose to be willfully ignorant of the bible and then mock Christians out of my own lack of understanding of their bible

>atheists

>>7048641
was the bible what they did before there was 4chan?

>1.The bible

Where is your euphoria now?

>>7048641
Thanks, good post.

I always like to say that only very small children and militant atheists read the bible literally.

>>7048345
So you clearly feel no need to understand the people around you and the culture you live in, okay.

>>7048714
>>gullivers travels
>What? Why? Why
It's a political metaphor ya' kno'

>>7048993
>I always like to say that only very small children and militant atheists read the bible literally.
True, because everybody else reinterprets it so it morally justifies whatever insane bullshit they're up to.

>>7049057
>implying the Catholic Church and other apostolic churches has reinterpreted anything

>>7049027
It and like a million other fable fictions. That's like putting Alice's Adventures in Wonderland or The Wizard of Oz on the list. It's just not remarkable in any way.

>>7049027
What is this? A comic strip for ants?!

>>7049106
>not getting the joke

>>7049110
newfag detected

>>7046789
>Neil DeGrasse Tyson
>widely regarded as the most accomplished physicist since Richard Feynman

Gr8 b8 m8.

Now, back to leddit.

basically he is trying to be likeable to anyone.

Nothing interesting.

>>7048922
I did. Yeah, it gets a bit redundant, but you learn to look at things the way he does.

ever struck with a sense of wonder that highly accredited, widely lauded, or high ranking people are not very smart?

>>7048922
I read it twice a year, all the way through.

If you've got half a brain and a way to do your own research, then you don't need to read an entire book to learn about evolution or mysticism. The basic principles are fine and stand by themselves.

>the art of war

But why??

>>7049337
>But why??
So you haven't read it?

>>7048725
reading his reasons sound like the dude is reddit incarnate

>wealth of nations, so you learn that capitalism is an economy of greed
buzzwords galore
>art of war, so you learn that killing can be raised to an art
you wot mate?
like, art of war is way too abstract for that. if you're concerned with killing read some recount of a murderer.
>bible, so you see religion is for stupid sheep who can't think
fedoracore 101 right here

these books are all good and/or important, but his reasons for picking them are cringe-worthy

>>7049337
Reading a book could count as doing research.

>>7048641
>There is no such thing as a bad book
try reading the davinci code.

>>7046789
>To encourage a child's interest in science, for example, he recommends "On the Day You Were Born" by Debra Frasier, which explains how the forces of the Earth work together to make this planet a perfect home for all of us.
>famines
>sicknesses
>poisonous plants
>feral animals
>perfect

>>7048610
You should read it to learn it's bullshit, Tyson is an atheist/agnostic

>>7046789
>The Wealth of Nations
Christ.
Even a middle school math textbook would teach you more about modern economics.
I sincerely doubt black science man actually bothered to slog through that dense and extremely dated hunk of pre-Keynesian crap.

It's the kind of book you gain more knowledge from reading about than from actually reading. Yes, it basically invented economics, but it was written just as the industrial revolution began to creep up.

Basically, anyone who could derive value from it already knows enough about economics to make it irrelevant. Smith's good ideas are axiomatic in any economics textbook, and his bad ideas are really fucking bad, so reading it might even hurt a teenager's views.

>>7050127


This is true. Most Christians haven't even read the bible. Once you read it you realise how full of shit it is.

>>7051228
it was written by a bronze age society. it has some important morality lessons and gives an interesting glimpse into ancient cultures, but anyone reading it literally is not reading it correctly

>>7051336
>it has some important morality lessons

Like what? Have you read it? Please do, and while doing so, imagine what a person who followed all its "morality lessons" would be like.

>>7048815
Most of the OT rituals were symbolic and foreshadowed the coming of the Messiah so as keep everyone ready for His coming. When He arrived and completed His mission, these rituals were thus rendered redundant.

>>7048853
You are aware that much of the Lord of Ring's literary merit comes from the fact its an allegory for Catholicism. Right?

>>7051395
>Not knowing about the prescription in the Bible telling me to not put stumbling blocks in front of the blind.

>>7046789
>Neil DeGrasse Tyson, mentor to Jacob Barnett and widely regarded as the most accomplished physicist since Richard Feynman
top post

>>7048345
>>7048610
The original is fact hidden under blankets of allegory, actually.
It's clearly above your head

>your essay on the absurdity of the modern world will never be published
>the paragraph on scientism will never save a preteen from his fedora-phase.
>>7048694
Morality is a spook.
>>7048815
Both are true, protestants aren't fans of the Old Testament because they'd rather be progressive and trendy than saved.

I've heard countless protestants claim it is wrong, outdated, whatever because they like to project their petty morality. Paradise Lost should be taught in school, the parallels between Lucifer and God's dynamic and a typical parent-child dynamic is eye opening. It might fix a few dimwits who want an omniscient deity to live by whatever trendy ideology they follow.
>>7048853
>>7051228
lmao

>>7048694
>reading Socrates

I prefer Herakles.

>>7048937
I read half the bible in graphic novel format pic related pic related. The stories are boring. Harry Potter is 1000% more interesting. Normal people who genuinely are religious never find-faults in the book. However, the stories are poorly written. The book heavily relies on Deus Ex Machina so many times. There were plots solved because a magic creator summon illness to kill the people. If it disguised as a fairy tail today, people probably wouldn't like the story.

>>7048641
>There is no such thing as a bad book

>What is 50 Shades of Grey
>What is the Twilight Saga

>reading books
waste of time.

anyone with half a brain could learn to avoid mysticism and accept evolution without having to read the Bible and On The Origin Of Species; the principles are robust enough to stand alone and you can get the same idea readsing like a couple of wikipedia articles.

>>7048641
>There are ancient customs discussed, Battle strategies, gynecology, ancient laws, ancient ways of life and other good life lessons to be read.

you mean the old testament? most of its laws are repealed by jeebus

>>7048641
>There is no such thing as a bad book

>>7048815
If you take the OT as false it makes it easier to ignore all the inherent contradictions in the Bible.

I'm no Christian but the New Testament is at least as good as Plato. Which isn't that good, honestly, but it's nice entry-level philosophy. Lots of big and easy claims, calling other people names, and very little logic.

>>7048815
Life is more convenient if you can pick and choose. Getting rid of most of the OT is convenient for living life. It comes with bacon and shrimp. It's also easy to take it as myth or to accept the 'spirit' of the OT rather than literally believing in The Tower of Babel and a global flood since history and genetics are a thing. Once you believe it as a story, it's easy to distance yourself more from it, to flat out ignoring it when convenient.

>a friendly reminder that your god's son was a jew
According to the trinity, G-d existed before any humans, and certainly couldn't have a Jewish mother, and so couldn't be Jewish as a whole. I assume that's what the objection would be. Things get weird when you assume the trinity as a thing.

>>7051565
>le ebin unreadable yet still disproven shitpost image
lol

Makes me feel like highschool again

>>7051565
>154. Is is [sic] OK to call your father (or anyone else) father?

>Failing to understand hyperbole

>213. Is incest forbidden? [...] ≠ gen 20:12, 17:16, exo 6:20

>Gen20
>12 Besides, she really is my sister,[a] but only my father’s daughter, not my mother’s; and so she became my wife.
>Footnotes:
>20:12 My sister: marrying one’s half sister was prohibited later in Israel’s history.

>Gen17
>15 God further said to Abraham: As for Sarai your wife, do not call her Sarai; her name will be Sarah. 16 I will bless her, and I will give you a son by her. Her also will I bless; she will give rise to nations, and rulers of peoples will issue from her.

>Exo 6
>20 Amram married his aunt[a] Jochebed, who bore him Aaron, Moses, and Miriam. Amram lived one hundred and thirty-seven years.
>Footnotes:
>6:20 His aunt: more exactly, “his father’s sister.” Later on such a marriage was forbidden. Cf. Lv 18:12. Hence, the Greek and Latin versions render here, “his cousin.”

>>7048815
>At least over here we don't pick and choose what we believe in and what not.

A complete and total lie. The Talmud is all about picking what to follow for no good reason. At least Christians still follow all the moral laws.

>God's word is final

Tell that to Abraham and Isaac.

>also a friendly reminder that your god's son was a jew.

No he was Hebrew. The modern Jewish religion bares little resemblance to the ancient Hebrew religion and is far younger Christianity. Jews have as much claim to it as the Mormons and Muslims, both who claim the ancient Hebrew religion was identical to theirs.

In fact, Jesus very clearly rejects the apostates who ended up as modern Jews in Matthew 23.

>>7046789
>anyone with an ounce of intelligence will have read before turning 18

>No Euclid's Elements
>No Plato

And there are people out there that still don't think he's an idiot?

>>7048993
>I always like to say that only very small children and militant atheists read the bible literally.

Don't forget 'merikan protestants.

>>7048835
>the change of character

The Logos gained a human nature. Read some Aquinas.

>he's a completely different person

The person of the Son is different than the person of the Father and the person of the Spirit.

>>7051690
God damned heretics what the fuck

>>7051682
He's not an idiot, he just doesn't know shit about literature. He's not qualified to in any case.

Taking his advice on "must-read books" would be the same as taking a fiction novelist's advice on string theory:
You'd have to be fucking retarded to see it as anything more than an opinion with very little backing, and therefore very little meaning.

No idea why anyone cares about this either way, another big head strokes his ego by releasing his "top X things" like it has any meaning, whatsoever.

>>7046789
Why is he such a dingus?

>>7046789
Which version of the Bible?

>>7051489
>waaah boring
Read the actual book you child.
>>7051544
He said otherwise.
>>7051565
Once again, it's too deep for you.

>>7052803
NJB, RSV-2CE, NRSV-CE, NABRE, DR

>The bible
Why? It's not any more intelligent than any other holy book.
>Origin of species
Why? Modern evolutionary biology books go into far more detail

>>7053095
>The bible
>Why? It's not any more intelligent than any other holy book.
if you really want to get your mind blown I suggest the following
1. Learn biblical Hebrew
2. Acquire the old testament in Hebrew
3. Proceed to read the bible and studying it along side other stories/scrolls from the same time period
4. be fucking amazed people were this intelligent 3000 years ago and develop a new found hatred towards Christianity and anti-Semites
>mfw when im around atheist people and they just talk dumb shit about the bible and I hide my power level

>>7053133
>be fucking amazed people were this intelligent 3000 years ago and develop a new found hatred towards Christianity and anti-Semites

care to expand on that?

>>7053095
>It's not any more intelligent than any other holy book

Have you seen the book of Mormon or Quran? The bible blows both of them out of the water.

>>7053133
>>7053163
>My religion is so smart compared to the other religions!
Then why were the followers so much more stupid than the followers of the greek and roman gods?

>>7053163
Have you read the Quran anon?

>>7053163
Explain how.

How the fuck did some many religious people find their way to /sci/?

I mean I could understand it happening to /pol/, but here, seriously?

>>7053172
They aren't?

>>7046789
I had read 3, 6, 7, and 8 before 18. Some of this stuff is old school, but not good enough to be worth reading anymore.

>>7054152
As an atheist I'm not offended. Religion is a very interesting subject in how it gets people to embrace memes and possibly even kill other people because they are using the wrong memes.

>>7048345

>>7048345
>>7048610
>>7048641

Guys please stop. The Bible is important because it was referenced in English Literature for so long. Just because you read it, doesn't mean you think it's good or a source of wisdom or something.

The Bible should be read as literature. I know that you are American, and that you still get emotional about the Bible, but you really need to stop.

>>7048725
>catch up with /g/.

>>7054159
I would not expect this type of shenanigans out of /sci/. I thought better of /sci/.

the more i see this meme guy the more i realize democracy is shit

>>7054169
What? I'm waiting for the day when a 4channer kills a redditor for stealing memes or corrupting them.

>>7051435
What makes Christianity more valid than the other world religions, faggot?

>>7054177
Well 4chins in general is shit tier. I like to think of the average 4chin as being on par with your average ISIS recruit, but a lot more beta, and thus passive.

But /sci/ should have been different.

>>7054191
Well, I seem to recall an incident in Japan or China where one man killed a other man because he stole his digital MMORPG weapon and sold it. I fully expect that some nutcase will one day go over the edge due to silly memes.

Why the fuck are there so many Christians on 4chan? I know it's a predominantly American site but still

>>7054200
It is a recent thing. Probably to do with the general right wing swing, that this site has had for sometime now, attracting its constituency.

>>7051406
[citation needed]

>>7054190
Because it's one of the first religions that went out of its way to recruit people from all classes and ethnicities of society, because the original Christians didn't trust Saint Paul. So he just just decided to find some other people to join his version of Christianity.

>>7054206
.>Because it's one of the first religions that went out of its way to recruit people from all classes and ethnicities of society
How does this make it valid
Also
>one of the first
Oh, so not THE first, then

>>7054210
It doesn't matter who is first if you make it big. Saint Paul is probably the reason Christianity made it big in Europe.

>>7046789
>current political situation
>doesn't include the Koran

>>7054214
I'm quite hungover and a bit confused, I'm not sure if you're the same poster as >>7051435 or explaining his tomfoolery. It sounds like you're saying christianity is more valid than any other world religion because it was the first inclusive one to 'make it big' (which isn't even true, e.g. Buddhism beat them to it)

>>7054210
Christianity has been deeply rooted in western culture ever since the mediaeval times and it's still relevant to western society today.

I don't see how that makes Christianity not relevant.

>>7054222
He said valid (i.e. true), not relevant. Of course it is relevant.

>>7054220
Nah, I'm not him. I'm just saying that Christianity is most relevant to western culture than lets say Buddhism or Islam.

>>7054226
Of course, even the most seasoned fedora isn't going to argue with that. I should have been more clear on what I meant by 'valid'

>>7054224
>Confusing "valid" with "true"
>Doesn't even mention "sound"
Did you skip logic class anon?

>>7054153
>They aren't
Sure, you can just deny history.

>>7054152
Because there definitely is a god?
>>7054190
The fact that it's true.

It's valid because its believers aren't just morons worshipping cows and blue men.

>>7054333
The topic we are discussing is of a serious nature. Your sarcasm is not warranted.

he should have thrown there some occult shit by crowley for more lolz, right next to the bible
but im glad the bible is there on #1 and le god delusion is missing
this fucking roody poo is literally master ruseman

ill pray for him tonight

>>7054205
>>>/bible study/

>>7054220
There is nothing inclusive about Christianity

>>7054220
>implying Buddhism is even as close to being as united is Christianity is

>>7054112
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rn1iGvXU0dI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAGasQ7j_ZI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ac_fLUHiBw

>>7054523
Bitch, I'm not watching all of that. Sum it up.

>>7054152
>How the fuck did some many religious people find their way to /sci/?

Because atheism is not scientifically valid

>>7054526
>new atheists

>>7054515
That's not what he's implying at all. He's talking about inclusiveness, which is the sense in which one religion can include the tenets of other religions without introducing conflict.

Let's look at Judaism, Christianity, and Hinduism. Judaism holds that the God of Abraham is the one true God and that there is a messiah due to appear sometime. Christianity holds that the God of Abraham is the one true God and Jesus Christ was the messiah spoken of in the prophecies of Isaiah. Can Judaism include Christianity? Absolutely not. Judaism holds that the messiah has not yet arrived in this world. Can Christianity include Judaism? Absolutely, and in fact it does, which can be seen plainly.

Now let's think about Hinduism. Hinduism holds that all that exists is the play of Brahman, the godhead. Everything that you see, everyone you meet, is an aspect of God, who is playing all the parts and doing so with such skill that he has taken himself in and believes the whole works to be completely real. In Hinduism, we are all God, but we don't feel this is so because we've been taken in by our own performance in playing the role of John Smith or whoever. Can Christianity include Hinduism? Absolutely not; these tenets fly in the face of everything Jesus says regarding being the way and the life and the only path to the Father. Can Hinduism include Christianity? Of course it can. All the things Jesus said, in the Hindu view, are just the things that God himself said in that particular role.

Now Buddhism - which is a tenuous classification to start with, as there was no single "Buddhism" at any point but rather a collection of loosely related practices of awakening through meditation or ascetic means - is essentially Hinduism stripped of all the cultural trappings and theological suppositions of the Hindu milieu. Buddhist traditions hold to the idea that all is one continuous phenomenon, uncaused and unconditioned. (Continued)

>>7054515
Continued from >>7054533

Can Buddhism include other religions? Absolutely so. It contains them in the sense that it acknowledges them as particular conceptual formulations of the world around us. Buddhism makes no proclamations which invalidate or contradict other religions.

Now as to Christianity being 'united', it is so that Christian traditions agree on Christ as the Son of God (Gnosticism notwithstanding) but the details are quibbled over by dozens of different splinter groups. I will give you the point that it is more unified that Buddhism, which as I said is a shaky classification to begin with. You have Theravadan traditions and Mahayana traditions. You have Pure Land, Zen, and all sorts of particular flavors of practice and study under the umbrella term "Buddhism". Some take reincarnation to be literally real, while others take a more symbolic view; some see extinguishing suffering as the aim of the practice, while other practices admit to no aim whatsoever. All are still united, however, in the sense that they all focus on awakening to the true nature of reality, much as all Christian traditions focus on eternal reward in Paradise.

>>7048610
>won't be reading a fucking meme book
>"hey guys what should I read after spivak calculus?"

>>7054527
>Because atheism is not scientifically valid
[citation needed]

>>7054533
>>7054541
I agree.

>>7054533
>Buddhist traditions hold to the idea that all is one continuous phenomenon, uncaused and unconditioned.

I think only a subset of Buddhist doctrines interpret it that way. The general idea behind the term "unconditioned" is, as I understand it, referring to how the liberated mind is not conditioned by detrimental mental factors and habits, not disturbed by the transient conditions of the world, free of the conditioning that leads the mind into suffering and stress. It is not, however, the point that the mind or reality as a whole is some unconditioned eternal thingie. To the contrary, the concept that all phenomena are fundamentally impermanent (distinctly not eternal or unary) is a central strand of Buddhist thought. However some literature definitely muddles the waters on this subject, particularly Zen literature in my opinion, and Mahayana in general to a lesser extent. Theravada literature, which is relatively conservative, tends to be less ambiguous in this regard, though people still love to contort the more poetic passages as much as possible. I can't speak for Vajranaya, I don't understand it.

>>7054541
>>7054533
Fuck it makes me wet when people talk about religions without sounding like the people who actually practise do when talking about their beliefs.

What about religious people talking about their religion pisses me off?

>>7054627
The faith people are annoying because their argument is that the divine does what it does because it's too deep for us.

>>7054200
>Why the fuck are there so many Christians on 4chan

Why wouldn't there be?

>>7048616
>It's generally a very bad book
Hey some people go crazy for it.

That was a bad joke, but now I understand why the church considered books dangerous.

>>7048922
I put it on my phone. Read the whole thing

>>7053176
I read the Quran, the bible is a better read imho. The language in the Quran is too embellished

So what is the top 8 books of /sci/?

>>7054533
>>7054541
Best post ITT. Edgy confrontational Christards, take note

>>7054333
You just answered the question 'why is it true?' with 'because it's true'

>>7054515
>confusing 'inclusive' with 'united'

>>7054333
>It is valid because it is valid and because ad hominem
:^)

>>7054597
All very excellent points. I was a bit sloppy in my generalization of Buddhist philosophies and I tend to approach everything from the Zen perspective (ordinary mind is awakened and whatnot) and Zen definitely confuses things a bit given the contradictory nature of many of its proclamations. Thank you for your correction and clarification.

I don't really understand Vajranaya either.

>>7054627
Thanks for the kind words. I love theology. I myself am not particularly religious - I practice Zen but I don't think of it as a particularly spiritual pursuit - but I love examining the different religions and how they relate to one another. It's fascinating in that they are all a lot more alike than they would like the laity to know about.

Given what I've studied and what conclusions I've drawn, I like to think of the divine in analogy with a mountain. A person looking at a mountain is only ever going to see a single face at a time. Where many faiths fall short, in my view, is insisting that the face they see is the only correct one, and that the people on the other side are wrong. Some are intrepid enough to view all sides of it, explore the foothills and passes, and spend time at the summit. These people gain the truest understanding, but in trying to communicate what they've learned to those who stick to a single vantage point, they are written off as heretics.

>>7054693
Thank you for the kind words. You do me an honor.

>>7051489

>fairy tail
>I read half the bible in graphic novel format

>>7054763
>It's fascinating in that they are all a lot more alike than they would like the laity to know about.

Not really. It's about as surprising as electricity grids being similar the world over. They all serve a similar purpose (or perhaps, the same purpose in a similar way) so if anything it would be more strange if they were particularly different.

Admittedly however, that isn't immediately obvious unless you consider them within the context of evolution.

>>7055523
I do not believe you fully get what I'm saying regarding similarity. You seem to be very literally minded, and just a bit argumentative, and these things get in the way of understanding.

>>7054567
>prove a negative

>>7054533
>>7054541
I didn't think he was talking about inclusivity with other religions at all

He was referring to it's inclusivity with wanting to go get more people inside it's religion.

Not the fact that some religions may overlap

And my point was that Buddhism also did this but as you have said, it is so disunited it is almost not worth calling a single religion

>>7055896
>I didn't think he was talking about inclusivity with other religions at all
Clearly. Unfortunately, you were incorrect.

>>7055892
All you would have to do is provide scientific validation of theism.

You can't, though, so you're just going to keep trolling

>>7055948
No, The inclusivity he is talking about is social classes and ethnicities

I don't see where he's talking about including other religions

Please point this out to me so I will be less confused

>>7055896
Isn't that a common factor for all ideologies because of our tribal behaviour? Sooner or later someone creates a branch because they think the other guys are doing it wrong.

>>7056014
>No, The inclusivity he is talking about is social classes and ethnicities
Incorrect.

>>7057256
>I don't see where he's talking about including other religions

>Please point this out to me so I will be less confused

>>7057474
It's right there, plain as day.

If you don't see it already there is nothing I can do that will make it easier for you.

You have chosen an interpretation of his statement and you are too convinced that your interpretation is the correct one

>>7057549
I just wanted to understand

>>7048348
Wealth of nations definitely, but Art of War will ALWAYS be relevant.

>>7048616
I disagree, the book outlines how to be a decent person within the proverbs.

>>7048686
Obviously never read the book.

>>MFW your books arent gold encrusted

>>7057991
Why would I want that? I'm not some wigger.

>>7048714
clearly hasn't read the art of war

>>7057982
Proverbs is just a bunch of platitudes that don't hold up to scrutiny

>>7058304
Aren't proverbs just memes?

>>7058255
Neil DeGrasse Tyson didn't understand it. He seems to think it is only applicable to actual warfare when its tenets can be applied to opposition in any sphere of life, be it personal, commercial, organizational, etc.

>>7051435
The Old Testament's laws and requirements were invalidated by Christ's sacrifice. His blood fulfilled the old covenant by which the old laws were held. Salvation by faith alone became possible, rendering the old book little more than a reminder of the religion's roots.

>>7057991
>mfw I will never have that ugly ass sweater

>>7048345
The adventures of jewman teaching people good grace

>>7058327
>Salvation by faith alone became possible

Do you want proof, you ignoramus, that faith without works is useless?

Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered his son Isaac upon the altar?

You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by the works.

Thus the scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness," and he was called "the friend of God."

See how a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.

And in the same way, was not Rahab the harlot also justified by works when she welcomed the messengers and sent them out by a different route?

For just as a body without a spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.

>>7058321
Seems like a literal retard.

>>7046789
>1.The bible
If you're gonna waste your time teaching yourself some moral principles, at least read the satanist bible instead of the bible.

>>7058454
Isn't that just a knockoff of Aleister Crowley and Ayn Rand conjured to piss of Christian fundamentalists?

>>7058463
yep. it's not awful, but it's nothing too interesting. i donated mine to africa for the lulz.

>>7058466
The thought of this book ending up lost in a hut in an aborigines tribe in the middle of Africa is making me smile.

>>7058466
That's pretty funny, Anon.

>>7046789
well you got the rise you wanted from these retards....you win

>>7048641
Yes. Learn religion. If not for belief, then to understand the human psyche and various manipulation techniques throughout history.

>>7046789

>most accomplished physicist since Richard Feynman

>>7046789
>Neil DeGrasse Tyson, mentor to Jacob Barnett and widely regarded as the most accomplished physicist since Richard Feynman

So do people just hate Tyson because he is a nigger?

>>7046789
Neil De Grasse Tyson certainly likes boasting about his intelligence, when all he does is argues with creationists, i mean really? why stoop to their level, he's like an argumentative child

>>7046789
That's just a matter of opinion, so i can't be intelligent unless i read the art of war? fuq off

>>7048714
>Feel free to read the New Testament if you want, but very little of the rest is worth reading

Tha fuck bruh, the old testament is the only interesting part. you got it mixed up

>>7046789
>the wealth of nations
Yeah, NDGT has [sarcasm] totally [/sarcasm] read that himself.

>>7048904
So basically the whole bible is just pure bullshit?

>>7048345
r u retarded

>>7048626
Hitler and Stalin both kept copies of "The Prince". Their rule was clearly affected by the book.

>>7048714
>to learn that most of the time humans are yahoos?
No, because it's one of the most important texts in the history of the English language, you fucking moron.

>Listening to a nigger
>any year ever

>>7048610
I read it during basic combat training because it was the only piece of non-military literature we were allowed to read.
The stories were pretty fucking metal, I liked reading them before going to bed or I'd sneak it while on fireguard. It's interesting to read ancient literature and important to do so- would you consider the Odyssey or the Iliad to be "fucking meme book"? Pretty much the same thing. Of course, there isn't a worldwide religion based off those two books, but I hope you see my point. Reading the books from our history is important. It gives us an idea of what our ancestors imagined and believed, and also lets us respect and acknowledge that one of our defining traits as humans is the ability to create stories and tell tales of great struggle and perseverance.

>>7046789
The Art of War is pretty over-rated. The Bible is interesting, and I think that atheists would benefit some from reading it with an open mind, but only for some perspective. Most of the actual material is pretty irrelevant.

I haven't read the others. I'm not much of a reader.

These are just pop classics; perfect for a pop-sci guy like Tyson.

>>7061758
>one of the most important texts in the history of the English language
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

no, just no

>>7058356
>Abraham
Before the crucifixion, irrelevant.

>Rahab
Before the crucifixion, irrelevant.

The sacrifice on the cross was the one perfect work that redeems all mankind. All that is required after that sacrifice is faith.

>>7061999
>The Art of War is pretty over-rated
If you actually think this, you didn't understand it.

>>7063416
>christfags
>on 4chan
I've never understood this

>>7063514
I don't believe in any of this shit. It's like discussing a TV show or a fiction novel for me.

>>7048348
>>7048605
>>7048612
>>7048612
>>7049008
>>7051435
>>7054162
>>7054163
>>7058353
>>7061748
these people are trying to trick newfags into reading the bible. dont listen to them

>>7063514

just dank memes friend

>>7063419
Would you mind sharing an example of your favourite profundity found within that so-sacred text, anon?

>>7048723
I bought it and read it because it's a classic. I actually finished it. On the one hand some of your points are valid, it is outdated both in language and in empirical fact, however, reading from the point of view of someone in Elizabethan england, who had never heard the idea before- the way it's written would knock your socks off. Darwin builds slowly through the first couple of pages, noting that it was often hard to build a list of species in any locale, that it was often difficult to differentiate a species from a variety. He then notes the effect of human domestication on the morphology and behaviour of our animals c.f. its wild stock. He gears up and then drops the bombshell- the reason why it's difficult to classify species from varieties is because the distinction is arbitrary- a species IS a variety who has varied so far that it can no longer interbreed with the its progenitor species. Imagine reading that as an Englishman in those days, it would have blown the top off your skull. I knew the punch line and my jaw dropped at the way he put it. Imagine looking around at every organism on this planet, the slow realisation of how they are all interconnected,after reading Darwin's words. Literally every living thing you saw around you, explained. Imagine the awe. What I got from Darwin's book is something I've never gotten from a more modern writer. The Origin IS a classic, and should be on everyones shelf.

>>7050395

The book is the fucking foundation of economics. The entire point is that we go into business for our own interests, even if under the guise of helping others. We ALL do this, whether we are a sole proprietor or the government.

>le Keynesian economics
>"We're all dead in the end anyways"
>Spend, spend, spend

Yeah, safe to say you don't know what you're talking about.

>>7048641
>''Do a good deed and then cast it into the sea''
I think the Bible hjas a better turn of phrase: "Don't let your left hand know what your right hand is doing." It's part of a whole chapter on similar themes, there's good imagery and descriptions there.

>NDT recommends 8 books with no difficult content so plebs can feel smart.

>>7064473
Reading books at all is good, though.