/sci/ - Science & Math

> has a neurological origin
That's pretty obvious isn't it? That's what people mean when they say the gender of their brain doesn't match their body. Neurological things can exist from birth or develop later on.

> is the scientific explanation for it?
There's a scientific explanation for everything. We don't have a good understanding of how the brain works yet, so we don't have a good understanding of why transexualism exists.

>>6433624
It's a proven psychological phenomenon so I would say it has a scientific basis. Being homophobic, trans-phobic, etc. has long been a part of machismo (for one thing) and of course has been stigmatized by various social institutions and there are a ton of misconceptions about it just like there are about other parts of psychology. Transpeople, of course, have their own mental issues (inb4 YOU SAID THEY HAVE A MENTAL ILLNESS!) since it's so stigmatized and because of dysphoria and, as with any other group, there are a lot of vocal people with extreme political views.

>inb4 less-than-civil discussion
>inb4 the inevitable link to tumblr

>>6433659
>And of course has been stigmatized
of course it has been stigmatized*

Reffering to transsexuality for clarity

>>6433624
There's nothing to understand, but the core question: why don't I have a hot trap gf?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1eQ0tjCRzw

>>6433659
Pretty reasonable post. I doubt you have to worry about /pol/ level discussion or overly-politically-correct tumblr level posts here.

>>6433674
Because you're not dating me yet, cutie.

>>6433687
Don't I know it. ( ._.)

⇒so widely discussed

I've never seen it discussed outside of 4chan. Maybe you're spending too much time on this forum. Honest question: When was the last time you talked to another human being IRL?

>>6433624
he got fucking hot

>>6433693
Never see the news or what?

>>6433721
I've never seen this mentioned in the news. What kind of news are you watching? Where I live, the news are covering politics, economics and sports, not some faggy meme shit.

>>6433624
it is neurological,on top of talamus you can see line of neurons called stria terminalis,it is mush bigger in men and contains neurons that controls somatostatin level in body

>>6433719
i would do her/him. do care if its artificial pussy

>>6433817
here is link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stria_terminalis#Bed_nucleus_of_the_stria_terminalis_.28BNST.29

>Why is transsexualism so widely discussed and represented yet so poorly understood by the general populace?

Just like concerning everything else, people find ignorance and preconceived ideas/values and established tropes to be more blissful, less jarring to their worldviews than otherwise.

>My question for you /sci/, is do you believe transsexualism has a scientific basis?

If you're to mean science can lead us to a better understanding of the phenomena, then yes it's obvious that it does fall under the purview of science.

>>6433684
>I doubt you have to worry about /pol/ level discussion or overly-politically-correct tumblr level posts here.

It's pretty much a crap shoot whether or not you're going to have a good thread or have a thread degenerate (see what I did there) into shitposting, I just figured I ought to be safe.

>>6433828
i want the pre-op

>>6433849
>people find ignorance and preconceived ideas/values and established tropes to be more blissful, less jarring to their worldviews than otherwise

It's kind of a double whammy when it's considered macho to hate people who aren't straight.

Seriously, try arguing an "un-macho" viewpoint. Anyone who's been in this situation probably knows what I'm talking about.

>>6433624
>Why is transsexualism so widely discussed and represented yet so poorly understood by the general populace? It seems as though the wide amount of material suggesting that the condition has a neurological origin is almost completely ignored, even by experts, and many conflicting theories are presented.

Because of hostility towards sociobiology. The hostility is fading tho, so we might get a better understanding soonish.

>>6433660
>I think I'm a giant peach
>It's neurological
>I'm not delusional, racist transphobe

>>6433624
It probably doesn't help that pop-psychology is one of the more prevalent forms of pseudoscience. This is purely anecdotal but I've seen way more people acting like experts on how the mind works (not to claim I'm one myself) than about any other science.

That being said, I'd have to agree with another anon ITT in that preconcieved notions and misconceptions become comfortable after a while and a lot of folks would rather stick with them than listen to what any new research (psychological and neurological in this case) has to offer.

>>6433624
>>6433719
You realize they are two different people wearing the same shirt, right? Look at the nose shape, the jaw line, the cheek bones, and more importantly the eye colour. It's admittedly a bit hard to tell, but He has brown eyes she has green.

>>6436689
jawline and cheekbones look pretty similar. slightly different tilt of heat. really good nose job though

>>6433624
I hate it when I hear them say "I was born in the wrong body". It implies i) there are male/female brains|souls and ii) something or someone fucked with their god given fate. Perhaps as you say there's some evidence along these lines. The problem is that liberals somehow think this would actually support their view that gender is a social construct.

It's a fetish and/or mental illness.

Because it's an issue only relevant to a fraction of a percentage of the population, and honestly I just don't care that much about your dysfunctions and the extent to which society enables or rejects them.

When someone looks in the mirror and constantly sees themselves as overweight they will harm themselves by not eating or by throwing up what food they do eat. We put a stop to this, hospitalizing them if needed and making sure they get the help they need.

And yet when an individual sees themselves as the opposite gender, despite all the evidence that they're not the opposite, we allow themselves to mutilate their bodies. Society is turning into something very dirty.

We shouldn't allow people to mutilate themselves or be accepting of what choices they make when it's a result of a delusion, of a mental illness.

If they came out and said it was a fetish i'd be more accepting as it only shows their grossness rather than a severe illness.

>>6433624
I have given xdressing a go, it's just gender role play.
Transsexuals want their favourite sexual identity to match up with their social identity.

>>6436902
How is it a fetish? When a three or four year old indicates they have gender identity issues, they don't even have a remote concept of sexuality and virtually no sexual drive to motivate them.

>>6436906
An anorexic person that is starving themselves to death is completely different from a female who wants to hide their breasts and shave their head. A bulimic person who is eroding their esophagus daily is not even in the same ballpark as a male that wants to shave their legs and wear makeup. Transsexuals simply want to live and act the way other people already live and act.

Mutilate is (in this case) a loaded term that means "to inflict a violent and disfiguring injury". After sex reassignment surgery for males the reshaped genitals still perform the same functions of urination and sexual pleasure. It should not be thought of as more offensive than any other cosmetic surgery. Female sex reassignment surgery is still in it's infancy so I won't even go into that.


Is this not /sci/ - Science & Math? Has /pol/ infected every board with its idiocy? Even if you don't really give a shit about transsexuals on a personal level, does the progress of surgery and science not fascinate you? Is no one excited for what we will be capable of in the future?

>>6436962
>Is this not /sci/ - Science & Math? Has /pol/ infected every board with its idiocy? Even if you don't really give a shit about transsexuals on a personal level, does the progress of surgery and science not fascinate you? Is no one excited for what we will be capable of in the future?

A lot of /sci/ seems to think all psychology is pop-psychology and other mysticism, for starters.

>>6436962
If cut apart my hand and stitch my fingers in the opposite order because I feel my right hand is actually a left hand, have I advanced scientific knowledge or surgery in anyway? Haven't I just mad a feeble attempt at satisfying the delusions of a mad man?

It's not like I was able to change the skeletal or muscular workings of my hand. It's still a right hand, it's just a foul attempt to mimic the left.

>>6436962
>When a three or four year old indicates they have gender identity issues, they don't even have a remote concept of sexuality and virtually no sexual drive to motivate them.

That is why you have to TELL them they have those issues, like pedophiles need to "groom" children.

>>6436962

It is a fetish for those on 4chan. /gif/ has had some nice tranny threads lately. Again, never talked about outside of 4chan.

>>6437014
Another apples and oranges comparison. While the biological role of a male (inseminating) can only be filled by a male, and the biological role of a female (being inseminated) can only be filled by a female, the complex social roles of men and women can be filled by either biological sex. Take a look at the picture in OP. Some human beings can potentially be seen by society as a man or as a woman if they choose to express themselves that way. This doesn't negatively impact anyone, but has a tremendous affect on the individual's quality of life, so why would anyone care to stop it for reasons other than religion or petty morality?

>>6437020
A disgusting, illogical, and inaccurate comparison. Children with gender identity disorder often reveal signs around 3-5 years old, vocalizing their discomfort with their gender to their parents or teachers. In the vast majority of cases, the children are incorrectly told that nothing is wrong and it's simply a phase.

>>6437029
>A disgusting, illogical, and inaccurate comparison.

...says the enabler.

>>6437029
Your free ride is on the way to your house.

penfield homunculus

>>6437029
>This doesn't negatively impact anyone,

That's a false statement and it's not a statement

I'm not going to argue with you about the effects that individuals can have on society because that's not a topic for /sci/ but if you want to know more then look at Japan. It's not a transexual problem but the individuals can affect society.

I'm reading your arguments and the other anon's and it seems clear that you have no understanding of the scientific method.

>Why is transsexualism so widely discussed and represented
LOOK AT ME IM A SPECIAL SNOWFLAKE-ism, somewhat.
It is real, mind you. As first poster in the thread said, its a proven psychological phenomenon. And as its been mentioned, young children will sometimes to vocalize such problems at young ages. But I really think a good portion of the examples of it you see are just teens trying to be special. Or in other cases, feteshism, but thats another issue thats usually just cross dressing more than imagined gender dysphoria.
Regarding stigma about it and people being freaked out, and lack of understanding, it makes sense. To alot of people gender is a pretty set in stone thing. The seam reason homosexuality would naturally seem alien and 'unnatural,' but arguably somewhat worse.

>>6433624

male turning into female - too low testosterone might be able to fix with taking in high doses of zincoxide (200mg to 400mg).

female turning into male - no idea

Too low testosterone doesn't make sense, gender dysphoria manifests before puberty.

Inherently, there's nothing wrong with it in concept. My only issue with it, and i say that only in the sense of a mostly apathetic but present disagreement, is that to identify as a gender, you must indulge in gender roles. If someone told me they just wanted to go trans because they thought they would fit into the social paradigm more conveniently, I'd be more okay with it, although then I'd probably be like fuck that, who cares about people. Or even something like "i just think it'd be cool" would be better.

Mostly though, who cares if someone wants to switch genders? Although, It's pretty clear that it can be the result of mental illness. It's pretty documented, really... and it doesn't take much knowledge of psychology to see how the desire to be a different gender could come out of certain things.

>>6433624
As this thread shows, one problem is that it's often confused with the sexual fetish crossdressing or the artificial porn niche "shemales". As the acronym LGBT also shows, it is often lumped together with sexual orientations, while a transperson can actually be straight, gay, etc.

I'm surprised by the level-headedness of this thread in comparison to the degenerate threads on other boards adressing the topic. 4chan is so damn infested by 13-year old retards who think it's edgy to refer to anything and everything as 'gay'.

I'm married to a post-op myself. She's awesome.

>>6437063

You're saying you can't have testosterone before puberty?

>>6437075
How did you meet?

>tfw no /sci/ bf who loves me despite penis

>>6437075
>who think it's edgy to refer to anything and everything as 'gay'
4chan is so damn infested by 13-year old retards who think everything from a joke to something they dont agree with is 'edgy'.

>>6437087
At a party 5 years ago, she knew my sister. No penis though! (Although I wouldn't mind.) She followed me home and then we just started hanging every day.

Even if an individual doesn't choose to adopt any specific gender roles in their own day-to-day life, almost every society has a very strong concept of gender roles. We have gender segregated bathrooms, locker rooms, and many workplaces (though not so enforced, it arises naturally).

people set expectations for others based on perceived gender, and that can be a huge source of anxiety if it feels "wrong" somehow. I liken this to the current state of racism today: most black people feel like they are constantly being reminded of the fact that they're black. it's in mostly subtle ways, like how black people never seem to be anywhere but in real life. like going out to mostly white places gets you stares and some frowns. it makes you feel like an outcast in your own society.

So, I support a better understanding of transexuals. It's no wonder so many of them have anxiety and depression issues. Even taking a single step in the direction of making your life easier instantly outs you as a transsexual. I'm not sure what's a wore way to live.

>>6437095
>(Although I wouldn't mind.)
YES, ITS NOT AT ALL GAY TO WANT TO BE IN A RELATIONSHIP WITH SOMEONE WITH A PENIS.

>>6437117
Or perhaps they care more about the fact that they love them than what junk they have.

Things are not quantifiable by measure of 'gayness', gay is a sexual orientation.

>>6437117
So long as she doesn't fuck me with her penis, it's not gay.

>>6437096
>most black people feel like they are constantly being reminded of the fact that they're black. it's in mostly subtle ways
It's not subtle. Black people* insist on their blackness as a point of identity. This kind of narcissism is what's particularly harmful because 1) it forces people to define themselves in terms of how others perceive them, and 2) it sends the message that it's ok to identify "culture" (whatever that means) with "race" (whatever that means). The "token black guy" does not normalize blackness, it emphasizes it.

You can see the same thing at work with feminism. Feminism as a movement is totally dead because it long ago achieved its aims in any measurable way. But feminists want to remain relevant so they begin to frame every kind of inequity as a gender issue, to the point of insisting on an overly broad definition of gender. You can't dislike a lack of female characters in film, you have to dislike it because it "hurts women." You can't be for gun control, you have to see it as "an improper view of masculinity." I mean just pick an example of perceived inequity *as* a gender issue and you can, with a few moments thought, remove the gender without losing the issue. Now what has the bundling packaging achieved?

>it makes you feel like an outcast in your own society.
No, existence in any minority position makes on feel like an outcast. People with tattoos or piercings feel like outcasts. Brown people feel like outcasts. Kids with pimples feel like outcasts. Alienation is a wildly universal feeling and framing as an X Issue instead of just an issue does way more harm than good, because instead of internalizing one's alienation and working through it, it encourages people to externalize it and expect everyone else to work through it. (cf "fat acceptance")

(*) I don't mean to generalize. I mean to point out the kind of outspoken self-appointed social warriors that the media uses as exemplars.

>>6437131
>you will never have a mate with a feminine penis

Not all, but some trans people suffer from hormonal imbalances, mostly from various food additives found in modern food. The additives act as protein initiates, which the body then turns into various hormones. A great example is soy, which contains a pro-estrogen molecule that is converted to estrogen.
Other people actually are mentally ill and suffering an identity crisis.
Yet others have genes telling their body they are one sex, yet they have displaced SRY (sex-determining region of the Y chromosome) Boxes, which is the gene responsible for turning males male. In this phenomenon, a man has XX, but one of the X chromosomes has the SRY Box, causing the fetus to develop male genitalia but have a female wired brain, and a woman is XY, but the Y chromosome lacks the SRY Box, causing the fetus to develop female genitalia but have a male wired brain.
So, in short, yes, there is a scientific backing. Biochemist btw.

>>6437133
I don't want to try to psychoanalyse people's motivations for speaking up about feeling like outcasts, I just wanted to bring up that many people feel that way. I understand it's easy to see people misrepresenting themselves and generalise that, but I try to avoid coming to a conclusion like "feminism is irrelevant" or "black people are proud of their identity" since I have absolutely no idea if that's the majority case or not. It's not even a constructive conclusion, and it drives us away from the main point here: no one should feel like an outcast in their own homeplace.

>Alienation is a wildly universal feeling and framing as an X Issue instead of just an issue does way more harm than good, because instead of internalizing one's alienation and working through it, it encourages people to externalize it and expect everyone else to work through it.
Like it or not, the point of most of these social justice movements it to move the burden of "dealing with it" from the individual and onto society. I think this is a good thing, since right now many people have no idea how to treat a transsexual person, thus they end up feeling alienated. By raising awareness and gaining understanding (scientific or otherwise), everyone gains.

The number one complaint I see on this issue has to do with people feeling like transsexuals are being shoved in their faces everywhere. that means people can't just bury their heads in the sand and pretend transsexuals don't exist any more. this is how societies evolve.
maybe our kids will live in a world where they can act like the opposite gender and still make friends, I hope so.

>>6437117
Well, that would admittedly be somewhat gay. But that is not the case now, is it? I've been with guys a few times but I'm more interested in females. To some people though, it will always be GAAAY to even touch a trans-person, regardless of how far they've transitioned.

>>6437159
>this is how societies evolve.
Good point.

>maybe our kids will live in a world where they can act like the opposite gender and still make friends, I hope so.

Me too.

>>6437159
>since I have absolutely no idea if that's the majority case or not.
Thanks for not reading what you're responding to.

>>6433624
Why are freaks that believe they are another gender being taken any more seriously than a man who thinks he is a cat?

This PC bullshit has gone too far when it permits chicks with dicks to compete in female athletic competitions, use the changing rooms of women and share a prison cell with a female convict.

Can't wait for the PC bubble to burst when society reaches a collapse spurned by financial and environmental downfalls.

These freaks will be the first to lose their rights.

>>6437825

>Why are freaks that believe they are another gender being taken any more seriously than a man who thinks he is a cat?

Because their beliefs were verified by a paedophile "sex psychologist".

I reckon if I saw him on the street I couldn't tell, this is pretty successful, they aren't all like this.

>>6437825
I don't get it either man... they should just let people like that dress up like cats, who honestly cares to help an insane person who's perfectly happy in his insanity and isn't harming anyone be normal? It doesn't bother me if trannies and people with cat-suits run around, might make the world more interesting.

>>6437949
fucking this

>>6437949

That means that we´d have to give them the same rights as normal people, and i´m pretty sure that normal people wouldnt want them to have the same rights as them, because you know, they´re normal, they think they´re better.

>>6437974
What the fuck is a cat gonna do with the right to vote? Vote in a cat?

>>6437974
>normal people wouldnt want them to have the same rights as them, because you know, they´re normal, they think they´re better

That's painting with a pretty broad brush

>>6437984

i´m talking about your average blue collar worker family, slightly below average intelligence and all that..

>>6437974
>>6437949
Well just think of the examples I've given.
I know of case where there was outrage because a man who identifies as a woman was not permitted to be put in a womans prison on the basis that HE HAD A DICK.

>>6437994
That makes a bit more sense

>>6436876
As a liberal and trans woman, I can verify that "I was born in the wrong body" is an annoying thing to hear in the trans community. That's something you hear on television.

More accurately, if we are "stuck" anywhere, we are just stuck in our expected roles. When I told my spouse that I wanted to transition, I didn't say, "Honey, I'm a woman trapped in a man's body." I said, "I don't want to have to be a guy anymore. I want it to stop. I can keep going, but I don't want to." (I was open about being transgender, but the question of "when would I transition" had been up in the air.)

>>6439446
So do you have a dick or what?

>>6439481
Yes, I do.

>>6433624
As someone who has lived with both a social and learning disability my whole life, I find the entire thing distasteful and a double standard. People like thse should be medicated just like me.

>>6433624
Many people experience gender role confusion.
These days the gender roles are supposed to be outdated, but the taboo of not following the gender role still exists.

Yet another double standard society has.
There is no reason for this double standard, and this thread doesn't belong in /sci/ .

>>6433624

I think it's because the vast majority of research is done by men. Men seem to be fine writing questionnaires for gay guys because there is a clear societal dividing line between straight and gay, but for IEEE/ISO qt 3.14159 trap's they feel so much pent up sexual lust that can't be expressed because they would be labelled gay that no research can take place.

> be researcher
> go on /d/
> see 11/10 2d schoolgirl with massive bobbing cock
> instaboner
> inevitable 'Am I gay?' question
> close tab

Basically that but in a proper scientific context.

>>6439521
if you need medication, you get it. transsexuals don't need medication. being a retard is not the same as being transsexual.

>>6439547
doesn't your greentext show that there's really a clear line between straight and gay?
I think, and bear with me here, I think maybe this is a hetero-cis-normative problem. why? because being heterosexual and cisgendered is considered normal, and being outside of that is considered not normal. gettin a boner to a dickgirl isn't a straight thing to do.

of course obviously that's wrong. there's also transsexuals out there, should we say they're freaks and reject them? I don't understand why our definition of normal has to be so polarizing.

>Why is transsexualism so widely discussed (ITS NOT) and represented (AGAIN NOT) yet so poorly understood by the general populace? (A NICHE PSYCHOLOGICAL PHENOMENA) It seems as though (NASCENT REASONING ABILITY) the wide amount of material (NO CITED SOURCES) suggesting that the condition has a neurological origin (NO CITED SOURCE) is almost completely ignored (REFERENCE MISSING), even by experts (NAME ONE FAG), and many conflicting theories are presented. (NO TOP LEL DIALOGUE ON THE ISSUE)

> My question (SHITPOST) for you /sci/, is do you believe transsexualism has a scientific basis? (BAIT)

What do you believe is the scientific explanation for it? (LEADING QUESTION BY HOMOPHOBE TROLL)

>>6433624
That's what happens when you turn the sciences into a state funded religion.

>>6439564
>That's what happens when you turn the sciences into a state funded religion.

non-scientist detected

>enjoy your personal dark ages

>>6439567
When was the last tone something you built was launched into orbit? When was the last time you built nuclear waste containers with a 150year warrantee?

>>6439555

I would actually argue that there is no such thing as 'hetero-cis-normality', sexuality is fluid and far more complex than any system currently models.

It's polarized because on a higher level, humans seem to like polarizing complex issues into badly formed halves then labeling the other half 'the enemy'.

>>6439574
Go fuck yourself you faggot, everybody thinks you're a weirdo.

>>6439574
No its not, it is XX, XY, or on rare occasions XXY.

>>6439578
>>6439581

> 'Go fuck yourself you faggot, everybody thinks you're a weirdo.'

So that's 'Against' with rage

>>6439581

> No its not, it is XX, XY, or on rare occasions XXY.

So that's against 'Willing to talk'


Polarization right in front of my very eyes.

>>6439596
So if i decided i was really born to be a pirate and decided to gouge out an eye and chop off a leg so i could have a peg leg and an eye patch what would you call me?
>inb4 pirates only wore eye patches to preserve their night vision when going below deck

>>6439596
I love how trannies and faggots delude themselves into thinking that everybody is secretely slightly faggot or tranny.

The truth is that most people are "normal" which means heterosexual, with absolutely no deviances, and only a small minority have defective brains which causes phaggot, tranny, pedophile,... behavior.

>>6439596
I guess my point was that 'hetero-cis-normativity' is a cultural phenomenon that is putting transsexuals and gays at a disadvantage. ignorance is what makes people polarize things, plus it help maintain status quo.

>>6439607
It's not a cultural phenomenon. It's a biological phenomenon. Deviancy from heterosexuality is a mental illness and should be treated as such.

>>6439603

I'd call you a beautiful dreamer. Sail on Captain anon.

>>6439606

That post just comes across as closeted.

>>6439607

> I guess my point was that 'hetero-cis-normativity' is a cultural phenomenon that is putting transsexuals and gays at a disadvantage. ignorance is what makes people polarize things, plus it help maintain status quo.

Exactly. The strange thing is that if you go to the right places on the internet people are willing to be much more open. For instance right here on /sci/ I can say that I'd identify as Cis-Hetero-Normal but if I was given the choice between Zooey Deschanel with a vagina and Zooey Deschanel with a cock I'd probably go for the cock.

REAL TRAP SHIT
E
A
L

T
R
A
P

S
H
I
T

>>6437029
It's actually been proven that transitioning does not benefit trannies in their day to day lives overall, and they usually remain depressed.

> 2014 : printing organs becomes a reality
> 2020 : printing whole human body becomes a reality
> 2030 : moving a brain and nervous system from one body to another becomes a reality
> 2040 : all of this becomes affordable to the consumer
> 2041 : everyone becomes a supermodel

We'll just have to wait.

>>6439655
i seriously doubt such a simplistic conclusion has been "proven". do you have a source for this "actual proof"?

>>6439549
I disagree. The problem with transexuals is that as a whole people are refusing to admit these people identifying as the other gender have a neurological disorder.

>>6439446
>More accurately, if we are "stuck" anywhere, we are just stuck in our expected roles.
So instead of just being who you are, you insisted that you require a new body of oppisite sex.
Charming.

Having a neurological root still doesn't make it (for lack of a better term) "normal". Everything you do has a neurological basis, that doesn't mean (at least my opinion) that people should get their genitals mutilated in order to try to look like something they aren't

you can't change that Y/X no matter how much you mutilate your penis, and vice versa. like it or not, you are born a biological male

and don't get me wrong, this isn't about some false sense of morality. i just think that the same way you won't let a depressed person kill himself even if he feels like it, people shouldn't mutilate themselves

then again you can argue that everyone is free to do what they will. then i can argue that you won't let a drunk be a drunk. it really depends on how you see it

i have no problem with someone being gay for example, but mutilating yourself to look like something you're not just doesn't seem... healthy to me

>>6439687
the reason transsexuals feel the need to transition is based on how they want to be treated, not how they want to act. they still want to be themselves, but they feel pressured by societies expectations of gender.

SRS is completely unrelated to that. ultimately it comes down to how they are perceived, and therefore, treated.

>>6439700

but treating someone on a bias based on their gender is wrong to begin with. plus most people won't treat a transexual as a girl

>>6439705
regardless of whether it's right or not, everyone has a perception of men and women and their differences. If a person identifies as a particular gender, it's because they want to be treated that way. maybe one day we can live in some unisex utopia or whatever, but for now we don't, and thus transsexuals exist.

if transitioning didn't improve people's lives, they wouldn't do it. it's as simple as that.

>>6439700
So its exclusively the domain of the weak willed and pathetic. I see.

>>6439713
>if transitioning didn't improve people's lives, they wouldn't do it. it's as simple as that.
Thats wrong though. If people didnt think it would improve their lives they wouldnt do it. That isnt necessarily related to whether it does or not.

>>6439713

yes but like i'm saying, people won't treat a transexual the same way they'd treat a qt3.14 girl.


>if transitioning didn't improve people's lives, they wouldn't do it. it's as simple as that

>if drinking didn't improve alcoholics' lives they wouldn't do it

>if gambling didn't improve gamblers' lives they wouldn't do it

etc etc

>>6439717
are they deluding themselves if they feel like they're making the right choice?

>>6439723
Possibly. Feeling like something is the right choice or is going to be dosnt mean it will be.

>>6439723

i think mutilating yourself is never the right choice

>>6439726
Why?

>>6439734
because it contradicts the most basic survival and self-preservation instincts, hence indicate instability in that person's ability to make rational decisions

>>6433624
General populace has trouble accepting psychological problems since they only have their normal mind as a reference and can't understand why somebody can't just suck it up and stop thinking about something.

>>6439739
But if they can't function normally without it then what good is adhering to that principle?

>>6439761

>they can't function

define function. i'm pretty sure they can live without mutilating themselves. and i'm sure therapy could help

it's the same thing as the people that insist they have to cut off one of their limbs. it's self mutilation and in my opinion shouldn't be acceptable by society

>>6439761
I cant have sympathy for the assertion that they 'cant function' without doing such. I know from experience that its perfectly and completely possible to cease to give a damn, in a basic sense, about what 'society' thinks if they can be well and sensibly said to be incorrect, or if they are in stark violation of ones personal morals.

>>6439660
>bodies at all
>not an entirely virtual nirvana that will enable millennial to be the first generation to obtain immortality

Stop being so short-sighted

>>6439755
>they only have their normal mind as a reference and can't understand why somebody can't just suck it up and stop thinking about something.

I've seen this a bunch.

It's also a fairly common misconception that common sense can be applied to psychology when, in fact, common sense holds no weight in psychology in the same way as other sciences.

>>6439739
That sounds like bullshit. I guess you don't believe in surgery either?

Rational arguments only, please. This is /sci/.

>>6433624
sexual orientation is an instinct

"body image" is cultural

What is it with some people and having phobias of things that haven't harmed them and are unlikely to ever harm them?