/sci/ - Science & Math

>>6091861
It's really difficult at first, just try to stick with it. Find a good textbook and read it front to back. Write out mechanisms over and over.

If you're ever stuck, identify nucleophiles and electrophiles.

>I know it's meant to weed out the people who shouldn't be doctors
>calling me dumb

No, it just weeds out people who have bad memory or are lazy.

>>6091861
Welcome to the club. This is a daily occurrence for me, who is a student of average intelligence studying physics. It's these sorts of experiences that actually improve your problem solving ability. Just know that the more you read it, the more you take in, even though overall you may feel you haven't grasped it. Having said that, make sure you actually take a break from it for a day and then return to it. Break it down, start with the really simple bits and build from there. The problem questions at the end of textbook chapters are often helpful in consolidating knowledge. I imagine you will get it eventually, it just takes an appropriate amount of persistence.

>I know it's meant to weed out the people who shouldn't be doctors
Exactly.

>I refuse to believe that I'm too stupid to understand this stuff.
You are. Deal with it.

If you can't even put enough memorization effort into passing babby's first ochem, you are lacking the intellect to become a doctor.

>pre-med

http://fliptomato.wordpress.com/2007/03/19/medical-researcher-discovers-integration-gets-75-citations/

>>6091976
Unfortunately for you, Mr. edgysupergeniusundergrad, passing second-year chemistry classes doesn't have to do with intelligence.
OP just needs to figure out how he learns the O-chem material best. Once he figures out how to study, he'll be able to pass organic no problem.

>>6091977

>>6091997
There is no "hurr durr he just has to learn how to learn". The ability to learn is self-evident and inborn. Either he can memorize and understand his babby chemistry or he can't. In the latter case he's obviously suffering from a learning disability aka mental retardation. The only thing he can do is drop out and go for a job that fits his (non-existing) qualifications. People like him who force themselves to study something that exceeds their cognitive abilites solely in the hope of making the big money (which they wouldn't even make with a degree) are the cancer that is dragging down and eroding the intellectual level of university education.

It weeds out those with sub-par spatial relation and manipulation, those too dependent on quantitative analysis, and orgo II drops close to 100% of those who try to rote it.

Imagine each molecule as a circuit with moving parts. It's tough to make out any strong relationships when even just a carbon or something changes, I know. That's where the practice and the spatial images your should be thinking about while writing out syntheses and mechanisms out.

Try to look at the differences on the margin with regards to different molecules. For example: benzene is all nice and happpy circuit. Low energy, doesn't mess with much, it's valence buddies are just zipping through a modified hexagon, thinking their world is a never ending ride.

Along comes Bromine. Bromine is a greedy fucker and loves to take on charge (electronegativity). Bromine takes on some of that current and induces a magnetic dipole close to whatever carbon it decided to come up upon. Energy is conserved so there should be a change in dipole along the ring, changing how reactive is at other carbons PREDICTABLY.

And if you have bullky chains on other carbons, you know exaclty where it will, or will not gone, provided the initial energy balance.

>>6091861
What part of ochem are you struggling with?

1. Figure out whats negative.
2. Figure out whats postitive
3. Negative goes to positive.

>>6092027

1. Figure out whats negative
2. Figure out whats postitive

Now tell me, what is the physical characteristic of being 'negative' and 'positive' other than han the relation of being equal in magnitiude but opposite in some dimension?

>>6091997
>passing second-year chemistry classes doesn't have to do with intelligence.
It requires at least a certain (very low) minimum of intelligence, e.g. a fundamental geometric intuition in three dimension as it can be expected from any normally developed child or the ability to memorize short linear sequences of steps. As OP proved in his post, he does not possess the required intelligence.

>OP just needs to figure out how he learns the O-chem material best.
There is no secret to learning. Understand and memorize. If that's asking too much of OP, he is wrong in the course.

>>6091861
I wouldn't worry. Getting stuck and eventually working it out is the fun bit of education. Just treat it as a problem to be solved.

>>6092035

I could tool you up in school, chump. I have the most well-rounded, yet rigorous undergrad education in my country.

>>6092033
Negative is where the electrons are at.
Positive is where the electrons are lacking.

For example, if you have heteroatoms in your molecule like oxygen and nitrogen, they have lone pairs of electrons which are the most likely things to attack a positive centre. The positive could be something like a halogenated carbon. You can get tables of what are nucleophiles (negative) and electrophiles (positive).

Ochem is all about doing the assignments. Just reading the material is not going to help. Do the assignments with the examples next to it, do them again without the examples and next day, do them again. Repeat this and you will learn.

Learn what makes molecules good acids/bases and nucleophiles/electrophiles, write out resonance structures and keep repeating.

>>6092044
>undergrad education

>>6092019
>The ability to learn is self-evident and inborn.
This seems unlikely. I imagine it is very possible to develop methods of better absorbing and retaining information with practice. After all, there are a lot of mathematical textbooks that have few prerequisites but require "mathematical maturity" i.e familiarity with learning new mathematics.
Provide evidence to your claims or accept that you are being unscientific in your smugness.

>>6092059

Most graduate school decisions are poor life choices. I'll be going next year, but only for 1 year.

>>6092025
nigga you better be using a catalyst for that reaction
otherwise your benzene is still (kinetically) happy

o. chem II student here, don't worry so much and just learn. the less anxiety the better.

I mean honestly it's mostly just memorizing the reagents needed and what the products are, a little intuition about how electrons move and you'll be able to do mechanisms no problem.

As for synthesis that's a lot like doin math to me. You just need to see the path to the solution and link up the steps

do a lot of problems. if for some reason it doesn't click intuitively, then just go balls to the walls with a lot of problem sets. you can identify most patterns after a lot of practice just based on memory.

thank god i'm done with that shit. interview trail ftw

>>6092019
>memorizing ochem instead of actually understanding reaction mechanisms
stay pleb.

>>6091976
careful with those edges

>>6091977
Wow, that must be embarrassing.. How can you..I'm without words. I hope this is fake.

my chemistry course won't be a weed-out.

you folks with elitist attitudes ought to be ashamed of yourselves :(

>>6093854
It's real, I just read his 3 page paper on the new found mathematical model.

>>6091861
>I want to be a doctor, and I refuse to believe that I'm too stupid to understand this stuff.
It's time to face the reality, kid.

>>6091977
Oh god my sides.

Did you read the book? If you have a book, why can't you understand it? Science is meant to be understood, and organic chemistry is no exception. This stuff wasn't designed for aliens. Why don't you try reading the book and then making your own notes and teaching yourself like a normal person.

>>6093920
>Science is meant to be understood, and organic chemistry is no exception.
says the guy who clearly hasn't ever studied ochem