/sci/ - Science & Math

Just do whatever you like. Degrees in STEM fields can land you a variety of jobs. That being said, if you live in a metropolitan area, there will be a ton of jobs ready for you as a CS graduate. If you go to a school where the CS program is just a glorified SE/IS degree, then don't do it.

>>5935715

pros: good job, lots of money

cons: /sci/ will mock you

if you're gay, you'll have no problem meeting another fag

>>5935727
yeah, i'm trying to decide between comp sci, econ, and a public/international affairs type degree. maybe there are better job opportunities for the latter two than i realise, but it really seems like job prospects vs interest at this point...

>>5935751
advice i've always heard is major in what gets you a job, minor in what you love. that way if you do end up trying to get a job in what you love, you have some knowledge about it from your minor. however, it's all up to you OP. talk to current CS majors at the school, current econ majors, and current int. affair majors. see what you like the best, and then what also helps you get a job.

>>5935751
economics major chiming in anon.
I reccomend you to study econ as much as you can, but look into your schools business program and see if they have a Computer information systems degree, it's a computer science degree for the business minded. That might help you out in the job market, but at least minor in economics if you really want a good grounding in microeconomics and macroeconomic ideas

>>5935715
>If you get an actual computer science degree, with heavy emphasis on mathematics and data manipulation
Good jobs, plenty of job security once you get past the trashman, not a whole lot of competition for jobs because it's difficult work that random niggers can't do.

>If you get a shitty "computer science" degree that's actually just a code-writing and IT degree
You poor bastard.

>>5935790
>If you get an actual computer science degree, with heavy emphasis on mathematics and data manipulation

There aren't any such degrees in undergrad. Playing around with watered down discrete math doesn't make it mathematical or give the degree anything of value...

Actual study of CS can only happen in graduate school. Anyone who says otherwise is simply too stupid to realize it.

>>5935715
>Is it worth going into just for the sake of having a good career if i'm good with math and computing but like arts/social science stuff better?

Well your career probably won't involve any sort of math/science/arts/social science stuff and it's so trivial that the field will likely be completely flooded and outsourced to hell in a couple of years.

>>5935861
>Actual study of [INSERT MAJOR HERE] can only happen in graduate school. Anyone who says otherwise is simply too stupid to realize it.
You're a fucking idiot. Undergraduate computer science IS "watered down discrete math". It's calculus/linear algebra/etc with a additional classes covering algorithms and other data-manipulation ideas, plus a code-writing class or two to get the freshmen where they need to be. It's very similar to how a Computer Engineering bachelors degree is a "watered down" Electrical Engineering degree with some emphases on low-level CS.

Of COURSE you don't see any *true* CS in undergrad, because you don't see ANY science's true nature in undergrad. Don't lie to me and say the babby shit you learn in physics undergrad is representative of actual modern physics,

>>5936387
This.
I love it when physics and maths undergrads think they're doing any real science or math. So fucking naive.
Unless you plan on continuing your studies after undergrad you're not going to be able to do shit with a physics or maths BSc.

>>5936387
>It's very similar to how a Computer Engineering bachelors degree is a "watered down" Electrical Engineering degree

No, CE is EE

>It's calculus/linear algebra/etc with a additional classes covering algorithms and other data-manipulation ideas, plus a code-writing class or two to get the freshmen where they need to be

And that's a pathetic amount of material to take 4 whole years to cover.

>>5936404

Undergrad math is easier than graduate but it serves a purpose to prepare students for graduate education in math or physics. Physics BS are indeed kind of worthless in content but it serves to train people's analytic skills.

Undergrad CS on the other hand is 4 years of daycare. Programming education is completely half assed with most leaving not knowing how to program whatsoever, the math is watered down to the point where it's nothing more than a few definitions and simple logic notations, and the algorithms and complexity meat is trivialized to the point any middle schooler could do it without any formal education. A degree in CS is utterly unneeded for graduate study and a degree also doesn't teach any skills needed industry. It has no place being compared to the likes Math, Physics, or EE. The closest similar degree would be Pol Sci or Music Theory.

>>5935715
>a comp sci degree
>Is it worth going into just for the sake of having a good career

No.

>>5936478
HAHAHHAHHAHAHAHHAHAH!
Please, some fucking sauce. (i.e. video with sound)

You god damn niggerfaggots going into CompSci just to leave with a Bachelor's and go write software in a cubicle are the worst kinds of autists.

Now, let me explain why.

The purpose of computer science is to take a very theoretical approach at applying abstractions to various problems in a computational context. What the fuck does this mean? It means you try to solve big problems by trying to use theoretical ideas, pushing the boundary of what is possible to be computed.

If you want to just write software, get a book on a programing language used in the development of the kind of software you wish to write, learn the language inside-out, and start working on projects, and contribute to FOSS projects. Then you can apply for a job with a portfolio in hand.

If you want to write software, all you need is experience.
If you want to do theoretical computation, go into CS.

People have a very hard time understanding what the hell CS is about, that's why you get a bunch of faggots in the classes.

>>5936486
It's the first lecture of Structures and Interpretations of Computer Programs.

>>5936486
structure and interpretation of computer programming or something. you can watch it on mit open courseware

Worth it?
If you don't want to do compsci then don't. You'll inevitably be shit compared to the army of people who do want to do it and enjoy it

Why is a CS degree looked down on so much?

My ideal job would be video game coder at a mid-size developer, not necessarily a tiny 'indie' space where I need to make false promises on Kickstarter in order to eat, but not at a huge AAA studio where I'm one name in a list of hundreds.

Failing that, I could go for the horribly, tortuously boring but well-paying job of database manager somewhere.

Wouldn't a CS degree be the right degree to go for for that kind of thing?

>>5936490
This is true. I started off in CS and realized the kinds of things I was interested in programming wouldn't need a degree so I switched out.
It's a bit shitty how a lot of software companies want you to have a CS degree but you can usually work your way around it by having a good portfolio.

>>5936505
Because people like you are in the program. People who don't want to do any theory.

See:>>5936490

Theory: CS
Applied:Self study + portfolio, and certification

>>5936460
>And that's a pathetic amount of material to take 4 whole years to cover.
My university's (top 20 in the nation for CS) Computer Science BS degree:

>Programming for Babby 1 and 2
>Discrete comp. structures
>Data structures
>Computer architecture
>Operating systems
>Theory of computing (Let's oversimplify grad material: the class)

>Choice of two classes outside CS but related to it. SE shit, IT crap, EE for babby, commercial law, multivariate calculus, experimental statistics, even some useless media/art shit
>Choice of three applied computing classes. Web development, more Programming for Babby, databases, network design, systems programming, etc
>Choice of six 400 level CS classes:
>>Information Security
>>Scientific Computing
>>Algorithm Analyses
>>Data Mining
>>Artificial Intelligence
>>Biometric Computing
>>A few others

>Calculus 1, 2, and 3
>Multidimensional math
>Linear algebra
>Statistics

>Choice of 3 physical science courses
>Mechanics (physics)

>Various inconsequential general studies shit

Ignoring the physical science and humanities, it's a 80 credit-hour degree.

>>5936478
I don't get how people think this is an insult to CS. It's not a traditional science and it doesn't need to be done on computers. He's only explaining that the name doesn't fit, not that the entire field is shit.

>>5936505
>My ideal job would be video game coder

Do you have any idea how horrible video game programming is? EA employees are regularly chained to their desk, disallowed to leave, and not paid for their overtime. You'll burn out in no time.

>>5936507
That's how you know they're shitty companies. Unless they list "Or equivalent", they have absolutely no clue who they're hiring and why. There is no respectable software company willing to hire you if you have no experience.

Here's an example: http://www.afr.com/p/leadership/rubbish_recruitment_and_why_google_o0xTsih8l9RfcOiOZYZhFN

>>5936505
/sci/ hates everything that isn't pure maths. They're tsundre for Physics and Chemical Engineering.

>>5936512
People who have no idea what this guy was saying as he crossed it out assume it's an insult to CS.

>>5936512
They're not seeing an image and deciding it's insulting CS, they're insulting CS and seeing an image.

I'm personally torn between aerospace engineering and computer science. I'm probably going to Purdue though so I think I'll end up with AE.

>>5936509

But I'm acing every single CS class they throw at me, even that Web Development class that I fucking loathed.

It's kind of difficult to think that I'm in the wrong spot when I'm enjoying (most of) my classes and acing them all. Discrete Mathematics and Statistics can both go fuck themselves, though.

>>5936522
Then stay in it if you enjoy it. /sci/ is the last place to be asking for educational advice.

>>5936510
>Algorithm Analysis
>Elective

god damn that's a shitty program even for CS

>>5936513

Hence the bit where I said
>not at a huge AAA studio

>>5936514
Good point.

>>5936510
Is that suppose to be impressive because it isn't in the least.

>>5936518
CS is programming magic

as such it should be studied in a trade school.

>>5936522
If you enjoy it, that's great, but the point of my post was that you may be in it for the wrong reasons, and in fact should be doing other things (such as building up a portfolio, which you will NEED if you want to make video games)

>>5936528
It's even worst at a small studio. You won't be paid until the game is released.

>>5936534
You could say the same for engineering, but you'd still be wrong.

>>5936534

>as such it should be studied in a tower with wizards while loaded on psychoactives.

ftfy

I have repeatedly solved problems/ conceived algorithms in my dreams that worked in RL.

>>5936537

Hence the bit where I said
>not necessarily a tiny 'indie' space where I need to make false promises on Kickstarter in order to eat

>>5936540
Have you looked at who makes your video games? It either soulless monster corps or shitty indie placed making digital only releases.

There are no 'good' places to make video games.

Electrician : Electrical Engineer
Mechanic : Mechanical Engineer
Plumber : Chemical Engineer
Potter : Material Scientist
Computer Scientist : Computer Engineer
Monkey : Professional

>>5936556
Script Kiddie : Cracker
Physicist : Mathematician

>>5936549
except Valve apparently

>I don't know the difference between hardware and software

Showing off your ignorance. Software algorithms have been the leading cause for increases in computational speed as opposed to increases in hardware performance.

If you like it do it. It is a good career choice ( note: not game developing ) if you do enjoy it. /sci/ will say otherwise, as is the popular opinion here ( note: not even CSfag, I am a mathfag ).

>>5936561
>Software algorithms have been the leading cause for increases in computational speed as opposed to increases in hardware performance

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>>5936490
>If you want to do theoretical computation, go into CS.

If you want theory then you're going to end up wasting your time in CS.

>>5936560
They probably sign NDAs to prevent people from bitching about their work conditions

>>5936531
>>5936527
>University of /sci/ CS bachelors degree:
>30 different math courses
>nothing else
>Diploma is a pure maths diploma with an X drawn over the name and "Komputer Sciense" written underneath
>Degree is less valuable in the real world than Ivy Tech's

>University of /sci/ MS in Computer Science:
>Traditional "No Girls Allowed" sign is placed on the door
>Everyone sits in a circle, faculty advisers pour other universities' CS courselists in the center
>Students all masturbate furiously while screaming that it's not real CS as loud as they can
>Last one to cum has to recite the pledge ("Real CS is completely useless") one hundred times while the other students flog them with CAT5 cable

>Univeristy of /sci/ PhD in Computer Science:
>So theoretical, not even the professors know what it is.

I just finished my first year of CS and I don't know how I feel about it. Looking at my curriculum it looks like a lot of the classes are pretty easy but not very interesting. I'm thinking about switching to chemical engineering but I'm worried I'll regret it down the road if I just end up wanting a comfy software job.

>>5936574
>if I just end up wanting a comfy software job.

You can still get those jobs with any math/physics/engineering degree.

>>5936572

And that's why my practical degree of 4 years of theoretical java GUI design is the best degree ev4r!

OP here again,

so, if I were to go down the STEM path, should I be considering mathematics rather than compsci?

>>5936599
That depends. What do you want to do after graduation?

>>5936599
Ask yourself this:
>Do I want to live in a van?
The answers will be the same.

Mathematics is a tool; it is not useful in and of itself. No one is paid to do math, except possibly professors. People get paid to use math to do useful things.

>>5936602
Honestly, that's the part I'm still trying to figure out.
Were I to go down the path of int. relations or something similar, I'd want to work for an NGO/the UN/in diplomacy/something like that. Or stick through it to a PhD and try to get into academia.

Since I'd more likely end up stuck in a cubicle pushing paper around for the civil service, getting a comp sci degree and working in software dev sounded somewhat better. Thus I'm considering comp sci as my "realistic" option.

I have no clue what the fuck one does with a mathematics degree other than teach at a high school or go to grad school.

My uni has an applied math with CS option. Should I do that, or just do pure math?

>>5936599
Absolutely. CS only become interesting in grad school.

>>5936604
>No one is paid to do math

Tell that to the NSA. They hire a huge number of pure mathematicians.

>>5936613
>working in software dev
You'll end up stuck in a cubicle pushing paper around. Welcome to the real word. Here are your options for work:

>Do mindless work in an office
>Do mindless work in a store
>Do mindless work in construction site
>Do mindless work in a school
>Clean toilets for any of the above

All work is miserable. That's why they have to pay you to do it.

>>5936613
>I have no clue what the fuck one does with a mathematics degree other than teach at a high school or go to grad school.

They go into finance, trading, banking, actuary, programming, analyst, cryptologist, management, etc. Not really a pure mathematician's dream but far from useless.

>>5936618
Pure math.

Lesser tracks rob you of depth.

>>5936623
>They hire a huge number of pure mathematicians
Oh pure mathematicians get hired. They get hired for jobs that anyone with a high school diploma could do because a degree in mathematics makes the human resources apes think you're smart.

>>5936633
Leave and never come back.

>>5936618
CS if you want a job.
Pure math if you want to circlejerk on /sci/ from your parents' basement for the rest of your life.

>>5936635
>Lesser tracks rob you of depth.
>Ability to function as a human = depth

>>5936572
>>Univeristy of /sci/ PhD in Computer Science:
>>So theoretical, not even the professors know what it is.
You know, this is actually how /sci/ describes grad school CS.

I'm an underachieving person who would be happy making 40k a year. Right now I'm attending CC for an Associate of Science. When I graduate from college I want to have jobs lined up around the block for me, even if they're not particularly high-paying or rewarding. What degree should I pursue? Is CS my best option?

>>5936655
Math PhD

>>5936655
Only if you're interesting in CS and programming. Don't listen to people saying it's easy. It's easier than engineering and physics etc. but still requires more work than the average person if willing to put in. If you want an easy degree that'll get you a job go with business, finance, or accounting. Just don't complain when those jobs end up being boring because you couldn't work harder.

>>5936655
>When I graduate from college I want to have jobs lined up around the block for me
Okay, go into theoretical physics and invent a time machine for your thesis so you can go back to 2000 when that was possible.

EVERY field is saturated. Literally every single one. There is NOTHING you can graduate with that will guarantee you a job. The days of a college degree being the gateway into well paying, fulfilling work are over. The days of a college degree being a ticket redeemable for one free entry level position are over. College degrees are more common than condom wrappers and they mean the same thing: somebody just got fucked.

There is unemployment in every sector. Another load of new graduates gets dumped into the workforce every six months, and there is ZERO openings for them. For every position that opens up there are a thousand applicants waiting to fill it, and they all have more experience than you. For fuck's sake, you have to BEG companies to let you work there FOR FREE!

What kind of fantasy world are you living in that you think you can have "jobs lined up around the block" for you? What cocktail of delusions are mixing around in your head that you think there is ANYTHING you can study that will give that to you? Fuck 40k a year, the only job you can get with nothing but a diploma that will pay even 14k a year is running coke across the Mexican border. The world does not want you. The economy does not need you. You are a boil on the asshole of humanity just like literally everyone else that committed the unforgivable sin of being born after 1980, and you will suffer for it. You will not make $40k a year. You will not make $20k a year. You will work at the poverty line for at least half a decade on the off chance fate smiles on you and you actually manage to get a job at all.

It's 2013. It's not "You will be poor unless you major in X". It's not "You will be poor unless you do Y and Z". It's "You will be poor."

>>5936664
No, CS is one of the easiest degrees in university

>>5936684
No, you're retarded.

Is computer engineering worth it?

>>5936700
I'd choose EE or CS depending on whether you're more interested in hardware or software respective. If you can't decide then do CE.

>>5936682
And the solution is....?

>>5936692
No, you're retard if you find it at all difficult.

>>5936745
Have 4 majors

>>5936745
42

>>5935715
Go for digital arts/sci degree.(Game development) The pay is good and it is involved with art and computing/math.

>>5936746
Just because it's not difficult doesn't mean it's easy, tard.

>>5936486
SICP lectures

>>5936596
theoretical?

>>5936758
>Just because it's not difficult doesn't mean it's easy

>http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/easy
>Synonyms
>>>not difficult
>Antonyms
>>> difficult, hard

>>5936763
It has hardcore discrete maths in it which means it is practically math itself. Totally theoretical

Here is the difference

>undergrad math prepare you for graduate math
>undergrad physics will prepare you for graduate physics
>undergrad EE/comp E will prepare you for industry or grad school in engineering
>undergrad cs will prepare you for a lot of coding jobs

If you really want, I could post some graduate cs books, so you can see my point. Why do I say this? Well it's because cs majors don't know enough math to do graduate cs.

>>5936766
I see you can't into abstract concepts.
Are you going to rely on dictionaries and thesauruses for the rest of your life?

>>5936682
right in my gut
I just want to make a modest life for myself and make my parents proud. I'm angry I'm not more motivated by this.

>>5936777
>undergrad cs will prepare you for a lot of coding jobs

Undergrad cs doesn't prepare you for anything. Just Google around for all the stories of majors not being able to do simple fizzbuzz coding.

It's a major without a shred of redeeming value.

>>5935736
xDDDD lel so funny

>>5936766
>Difficult majors
Organic Chemestry, Pure Mathematics, Architecture. These majors consume a large portion of your life.
>Average majors
Computer Science, Business, any Earth Science. These majors consume a significant bit of your life but leave plenty of room for other things.
>Easy majors
Art, Communications, Philosophy, Education. These majors do not consume very much of your life.

>>5936803
Come on now. I'm sure there are a few dumbasses who got through the program without really learning anything but it's not like the average math or engineering major learned how to write production grade software. CS (or SE which is usually the same thing) is the only major that prepares you for that.

>>5936803
>God tier: my major and things similar to it
>Top tier: things I think are cool
>Mid tier: things I don't care about but the internet tells me is okay
>Low tier: things I don't like
>Shit tier: things I really don't like
>Waste of life tier: things I'm butthurt about
There, now you never have to read another majors tier list again.

>Undergrad cs doesn't prepare you for anything
And yet /sci/'s solution is always to make it even more useless. See >>5936572

>>5936745
>Implying there is a solution
You live in the ending days of a society. All there is to do is find a safe spot to watch it all crumble.

>>5936829
>CS (or SE which is usually the same thing)
This is why CS degrees have such a bad reputation. CS has NOTHING to do with SE in the same way physics has nothing to do with mechanical engineering. Software engineering is exactly what it sounds like: applying the principles of engineering to writing code and creating software. It has more to do with teamwork and communication than anything else.

Computer science has nothing to do with computers and is only tangentially related to software. It's the science of understanding information and the manipulation thereof. Computers are just the tool that we use to do that manipulation because they can do math much faster than we can.

CS, more than anything else, is describing ideas. I'm ripping this off from the SICP lectures, but it's actually a hell of a lot like Geometry. Geometry was invented by the Egyptians as a way of using the surveying equipment they built to accomplish useful tasks. Computer Science was invented as a way of using the computers we built to accomplish useful tasks. [Geometry, Computer Science] seemed at first, and still does seem to an ignorant observer, to be a simple set of rules and tools that are used to make the equipment do what you want. But if you take the time to learn about it, Geometry can be used to understand incredible things about space and time, and Computer Science can be used to understand incredible things about information and ideas.

>>5936820
>Difficult majors
>Organic Chemestry

Orgo is fucking easy. It's 90% memorization

>>5936829
>few dumbasses

more like 199 out of 200 are dumbasses

>CS (or SE which is usually the same thing) is the only major that prepares you for that.

It doesn't in the least

>>5936848

>orgo

>>5936848
And architecture is 90% studio work, but that doesn't make it stupefyingly difficult.

Don't even start with the usual /sci/ "Literally everything that isn't pure maths is kindergarten" shit. /sci/ can be dumber than /pol/ sometimes.

>>5936846
So I guess the problem is that most schools treat CS as SE because they want their graduates to be employable? I guess /sci/ just hates employment.

>>5936851
top fukken lel

>>5936857
Orgo is not as hard or time consuming as all the retards in premed make it out to be

>>5936863
>So I guess the problem is that most schools treat CS as SE because they want their graduates to be employable? I guess /sci/ just hates employment.
The problem is most schools treat education as job training and only teach things that have explicit use in business.

That is a horrible attitude to hold towards education, if for no other reason than it's bloody inefficient. Learning enough SE to do entry level SE work wouldn't take any more than a year at most, two years to accommodate a sufficient amount of mathematics.

>>5936887
What we as a society need to do is restructure our concept of job training vs education. The elephant in the room is that work just isn't very hard. No job's entry level requires even a tenth of the knowledge gained in a corresponding bachelor's degree program. What we need is a clear distinction between higher education and trade school; if you just want to get training and qualifications for a job, go to trade school. Learn all the fundamentals, get plenty of hands on experience, do all kinds of practical and purposed learning, and interface with local employers so internships, apprenticeships, and straight up jobs can be had directly out of graduation. The whole process would take anywhere from six months to three years depending on the program, and would be a logical extension of high school that anyone pursuing a skilled career goes to the way college is these days. It would be a very streamlined process, that teaches students everything they need to enter their field and absolutely nothing else. It would also be very inexpensive, because of the comparative lack of resources needed, which would end the current crisis of students having so much debt and so little prospects that they end up destitute for the rest of their lives.

Then, as an entirely separate affair, would be university. Here, education takes place not for the purpose of getting a job, but for the purpose of learning. It would be a lot like it already is, only with less emphasis on very practical things with the assumption that the student could pursue them on his or her own time. Hybrid programs could exist where students take classes from both institutions. The difficulty of university education would spike, as the seas of barely literate masses no longer pour in the doors expecting a diploma factory, and university education would once again represent the highest expression of human knowledge.

>>5936893
As it stands now, undergraduate education is a bloated mess that tries to do training and education at the same time and ends up doing both horribly.

Grad school has taken up the mantle of what university education was and should be, but how long until that's no longer the case? It used to be that blue collar workers dropped out of high school, normal business/office/whatever people graduated high school, and intellectuals went to college.

Now blue collar folk graduate high school, normals go to college, and intellectuals go to grad school. How long until everything moves up again, and you need a bachelors degree to drive a dump truck, a masters to manage a K-mart, and a Ph.D to be considered well educated? What happens when it shunts up again, and the average kid from the suburbs stays in school until he's 26 because every job demands a doctorate?

The madness needs to stop.

If you're interested in art/ social science stuff you can just do it in your free time.

I finished my Master's degree in CS at ETH in 1997 and I can tell you that any serious university that has a CS program takes a very theoretical approach to the field that has nothing to do with software engineering or programming. I did not have a single subject involving programming until my 4th year and even that was nothing more than fundamental understanding of programming languages.

>>5936522

I'm sorry, and I do not try to sound like an elitist but a CS program that has subjects such as "Web Development" is not a serious CS degree.

>>5936777
I have noticed the math thing pretty starkly. Most ( talking in the 90 percent range ) of PhD candidates in Computer Science at my uni have a bachelors and/or a masters in math. Hell, one of my TA's when I took a CS class ( before I changed to math ) switched from the math department to the CS department for his PhD ( was about applying graph theory to networking of sorts if I recall correctly ).

>>5936848
Which usually involves a lot of work/time, hence the difficulty.

So with CS degrees are we assuming no outside programming studying/interships?

>>5935715
>pros and cons of a comp sci degree?
>pros of a comp sci degree
>pros
>comp sci
Top kek

reasons I majored in computer science
>it's easy
>I was already good at it, A in every class without having to learn anything new
>bachelors degree counts as 4 years experience
>didn't have to work while I was in college
>comp science degree consistently ranks among top earning bachelors degrees; example
http://www.thomasnet.com/journals/career/highest-paid-majors-for-new-grads-with-bachelors-degrees/
>#1, computer science
>it's fun, like playing sudoku all day for a job
seriously, it's the best major there is

>>5936556
Union electricians and plumbers make way more than their engineering counterparts.

>>5935732
Correction: kids who are still in school and haven't reached the point of multidisciplinary work yet will mock you

>>5935715
Alongside the fact that compsci will help you with systems thinking, there is a HUGE amount of digitization being done on societal institutions, with a lot of room for improvement, AND a lot of technologies are being ironed out to create "smart cities."

>>5936682
>College degrees are more common than condom wrappers and they mean the same thing: somebody just got fucked
woah man 10/10
this is high quality writing

Why does engineering like Chem eng. not get hated on as much as CS if eng. isn't pure maths? I know that /sci/ knows/thinks that CS is just a tiny easy portion of maths, but why does eng. not get hated on?

>>5937028
I don't get why any of those fields get hated on in the first place. They all boil down to the same thing.
But I guess they won't find that out til they hit their PhD.

>>5937026
You're being redundant with your first point

>>5937033
C'mon man, let me gripe. It's frustrating sometimes.

>>5937034
Its frustrating all the time. People think if you do this or that major you win and get a free car and a stack of cash when you graduate.
In reality you can do whatever major you want and succeed if you are driven and have the drive/connections/smarts/balls to succeed. Got a friend making bank of a degree in philosophy/religion
TL:DR go to school because you think the paper will land you a job you aren't going to do super well.

>>5937038
Heh. Hey I'll never say it's a *uniform* problem but I know the types you're talking about. It's like a Mensa meeting with a bunch of people of moderate intelligence circle jerking.

>>5937038
>go to school because you think the paper will land you a job you aren't going to do super well.
It's kind of a prerequisite though
otherwise you're competing with every random nigger who walks in and says
>oh yeah, I can totally do {all that stuff you require that I be able to do}; I'm an expert in the field of {whatever field I'm claiming to be an expert in during this particular interview}
and then, even if you can convince them that you actually can do the job, they'll ask
>>so, why did you decide not to get a degree? and why should we take you over this other guy who's also qualified And has a degree?

>>5937041
The good jobs aren't in listings don't involve interviews. The best ones you make yourself.
I think the most important part of formal education is to give you the insight to research and apply knowledge independently.

If you want to ensure job security though, get a headstart on networking during your education and pursue your own projects. Screw job applications, get an executive to lobby you into the fold.

>>5937043
>get a headstart on networking during your education and pursue your own projects. Screw job applications, get an executive to lobby you into the fold.
You're just asking way too much of the average autistic neckbeard at this point.

>>5937041
Im saying a lot of people think they will land top jobs by getting through the work and then walking into a job with their diploma.
You can do this but you aren't going to be getting anything too special just because you're an average engineer engineer.
Not saying diplomas are worthless but you have to do study outside of class and actually engage. Its not I did this so I win, its I did this well and am interested in it.
some driven mid tier major student could outdo a god tier major student who just floats and thinks just doing the major makes them the best.

>>5937043
Exactly

>>5937039
>It's like a Mensa meeting with a bunch of people of moderate intelligence circle jerking.
Oh, how I wish I didn't know this feel.

>>5937051
Is there some type of special mensa IQ test? Seems like you could just keep retaking the test till you got the score you wanted.

>>5937053
if you actually want to get into mensa you need to get a proctored IQ test in person

you geniuses cant figure out that lifes energy is not sustainable and infinite

delusional

>>5937053
Somehow I get the feeling the only people who join Mensa are the ones who barely pass the criteria.

>>5937057
Meh forget it, I feel like I'm being too derisive. All keks aside.

>>5937054
Makes sense

>>5937057
probably
>membership fees lel

>not studying physics.

Also aren't this threads for /adv/ and not /sci/ ?

>>5935715
Get a degree in whatever you like most. Even if you don't make a gazillion dollars you will have no regrets for trying what you love.

I would rather have a satisfying life than a wealthy one.

>>5937159
This.

>>5936572
epik

lel

>>5937159
Wealth does not bring happiness, but it sure does calm the nerves...

>>5937159
>all those fuckers who went into finance for the big bucks
>work like slaves
>hate their job
>only make 30% more on average
top kek

One of my closest friends is a computer engineer working in software development. He is also an artist, song writer, and successful musician.

Because of his wealth from engineering he is capable of funding his artistic endeavors.

View your CS degree as the funds to fuel your true life's passion.

He has a mini sound studio in his bedroom where him and his friends write, play, and professionally record music. Totally funded by his software development job.