/sci/ - Science & Math

>>5606720

stop being buttmad kiddo

biology isn't a real science because it only describes things as they are, it doesn't form any rules of cause to consequence

>>5606720
>Not your personal blog
>>>/soc/
>Biology not a science
>>>/lit/

>>5607100
so then anything that relies on statistical or probabilistic mathematical models isn't science either?

>>5607111
Yes, and no.

Biology doesn't answer enough of the fundamental questions in its field and has yet to produce any scientific laws. At best it is theories that may never be realized.

>>5607130
>Yes, and no.
>Biology doesn't answer enough of the fundamental questions in its field and has yet to produce any scientific laws. At best it is theories that may never be realized.

Aren't laws simply recursively proven theories? We could use some help over here beating back the Christians so we have some room to start laying down laws - like Evolution, which continues to be called a "theory" beyond as reasonable explanation.

>>5607219
>as
and fuck you auto-correct. ANY*

>Capacity to make accurate predictions using the scientific method.

>Not science.

You can only pick one, retard.

>>5607130
>At best it is theories that may never be realized.

that goes for every science..Method itself is not perfect

>my science is more sciencier than your science

>>5607304
>Capacity to make accurate predictions using the scientific method.

But biology can't make accurate predictions, there is always an exception or something weird that can go wrong.

Hey OP does it mean that you will refuse medical cures because the science behind them is not hardcore enough? (I hope you do)

>Engineers, chemist, and physicist can't get away with this kind of shit because all of their work is backed by empirical evidence.

>Medical science
>Not empirical

Wut...

can someone explain why the medical community in america thinks circumcision is a good thing?

basically 70% + of men were circumcised in the last 50 years

Why? Research says there's literally no point to circumcision and it reduces pleasure. Yet they still do it.

>biology
>hard science

>>5607722
cause bitches love it. you mad at my clean dick uncutfag?

>>5607738
that's not worth having less pleasure and a desensitised cock

"HURR BITCHES LOVE IT BETTER CHOP HIS FUCKING COCK OFF"

btw im not even uncut. Im circumcised myself, even I dont condone it

>>5607696
>But biology can't make accurate predictions, there is always an exception or something weird that can go wrong.
Biology can make incredibly accurate predictions. If a new mammal is discovered, we could predict how a majority of its body functions, by comparing it to species we understand better. There is no "most scientific science", they're all necessary. Don't go shittying up a decent board by trying to turn everything into a dick-measuring competition.
>pic related

>>5607749
Please don't post this. The guy who made it is a computer programmer and is retarded, plus, he forgot that logic is "purer" than math according to his retarded scale.

>>5607749
Yeah faggot. Stop shitting the board with that dumb inaccurate picture. It was meant to be satirical, not a fucking law.

>>5607745
>that's not worth having less pleasure and a desensitised cock
there is no desensitisation apart from a tickling feeling if it rubs on your pants or something due to being exposed all the time. this is /sci/ not /fit/, fuck out of here with your broscience.
>BETTER CHOP HIS FUCKING COCK OFF
you know damn well you're exaggerating. it's just a part of the skin that covers it, it's not like they chopped an inch from the top.
>Im circumcised myself
i can tell by your attitude and unfounded hatred of it that you're lying. go get the cheese off your dick.

>Biology is the most bullshit science

Holy fuck, are people still this fucking retarded?

>>5607761
>implying biology is not for people who actually like biology.

Fuck off. Reported for being a faggot.

>>5607762
>there is no desensitisation
roughly 7,000 nerve endings are CHOPPED OFF. You lose a shitload of pleasure. WE WERE MUTILATED. You're such a fucking idiot. Keep denying it bro you're the type of person that lets this shit happen to thousands of newborn babies.

You just dont want to admit that maybe it fucking sucks being circumcised.

>>5607768
Would you like to name some of them?

>>5607768
again, stop exaggerating. simply shouting off big numbers doesn't impress anybody here. 7000 nerve endings are about whats on the tip of your tongue. you're also assuming that they'd all somehow contribute to pleasure during sex. find me research that says circumcision leads to desensitization during sex at ages below 30. fuck out of here with your conspiracy theories.

>>5607749
>Nobel laureate P.W.Anderson used the idea that symmetry breaking is an example of an emergent phenomenon in his 1972 Science paper 'More is different' to make an argument about the limitations of reductionism.One observation he made was that the sciences can be arranged roughly in a linear hierarchy — particle physics, many body physics, chemistry, molecular biology, cellular biology, physiology, psychology, social sciences — in that the elementary entities of one science obeys the laws of the science that precedes it in the hierarchy; yet this does not imply that one science is just an applied version of the science that precedes it. He writes that "At each stage, entirely new laws, concepts and generalizations are necessary, requiring inspiration and creativity to just as great a degree as in the previous one. Psychology is not applied biology nor is biology applied chemistry."

>>5606720
Ok OP you win
Many of my colleagues push their soft science for grant money, biology gets the most. has the most profitable industrial sectors as well, as a whole.

It should be more about truth, biologists should not be afraid to publish every last but of their data because since it is a complex science their "mistakes" actually hint at more components of the vast chemical pathways we study.

For years during and after my bach. I pursued biofuels. I was told they were a good idea. Even with notable breakthroughs and my discussion with one of the heads of biofuel research for a major oil company (I had a similar idea for genetic modification to have algae to excrete oil, bypassing the most expesive and time consuming process, he told me straight up when I said I would not tell him my planned mechanism "I have enough grad students" - true story. fuck him, the fucking greedy bastard) I always ended up knowing bio research was primarily based not on science.

It should be about truth and not appearance. I have grabbed people's data from the biohazard disposal bin and found things other's have not. It is redic. It honestly makes me question my career choices, it seems that whoever has the loudest voice gets the most acceptance sometimes. Someone had to give themselves ulcers by purposely ingesting H. pylori for the masses to believe ulcers can be caused by bacteria and can be cured.

It should be about empirical evidence. What are we afraid of, failure? Progress is built on previous failures sometimes. Forget biology I wish I studied something defined, sometimes. It is hard to work with these arrogant and narrow minded people. It pains me to think about all the breakthroughs we missed out on because we were afraid to admit we hypothesized an incorrect theory.

..... Pope got a masters in chemistry anyway

>>5607944
That is because biology is under funded. No one wants to give money to a failure when there are so many more biologist who are "successful."

http://www.improbable.com/2011/10/14/ig-nobel-winner-writes-best-abstract-ever/

Look at the kind of failure a physicist can get away with, if a biologist published that paper NHI, NSF, or EPA would cut them off in a heartbeat for wasting their money. Everyone knows that more NSF money goes towards physics and engineering anyways.

sounds like someone switched his major

>>5607959
what we need to do is redefine failure:

if the experiment is done repeatedly and the mechanisms are sound
than why do we not publish "bad" data
if the methods are done correctly we should not be ashamed, we should be proud, there is good stuff in there

it is not underfunded whatsoever, but if we continue to publish only what supports our hypothesis we will get funding pulled eventually, big time.

>>5607959
>Look at the kind of failure a physicist can get away with
How is that a failure? It's a little unconventional, but the title tells you what the paper's about, and the abstract tells you everything you need to know that's not in the title before deciding whether to read the whole thing.

>>5607973
That is what I liked about PLOS ONE, and the push to have open science. Publish all data that is obtained by proper methods. It is liked the open source style of thinking is invading traditional scientific journals, and it is a good thing.

>>5607749
>math
>real science
pick one

>>5608001
that sounds good. math is fucking beyond science

>>5607696
There are all kinds of exceptions in chemistry....

>>5607959
>>5607944
Many biologists can't do shit until they achieve the holy sanctuary that is tenure.

>>5607768
Pleasure is encoded by the sensory neurons of the pudendal nerve, which innervates the shaft and the glans of the penis.

The foreskin is just skin that covers your dick, nothing special.

>>5606720
You are now aware there's a doctor's union in the US that absolutely dominates in power.

They have fought and won outrageous wages -- even increasing them in times of the global recession and falling technology prices. How and why? Not once in the medical industry sought to improve on the efficiency (cost/treatment) of care.

Every retailer has implented the barcode to quickly read information. Even fucking today, doctors use un-readable hand written prescriptions when they could simply print a QR code for the exact medicine. Lower the risk on accidental perscriptions, speed up the process.

Why have doctors stuck to the pay-per-treatment model, when that clearly bankrupts most of their patients. The goal is not to give patients as much care as possible, but to make sure they're healthy as that the patient will not come back again. The doctors who actually do their work aren't rewarded for their efforts.

Why have doctors stubbornly insisted on highly expensive end-of-life care, or surgeries for those older than 70, even though that would not extend life beyond a few years or months?

They lobbied for raising the highest barriers to entry to enter their profession, creating monopolistic stranglehold even over their equally talented peers - pharmacists and doctors from Europe.

A medical doctor from Germany, even one who's practiced medicine for the last 10 years, has to wait 2-3 years to recieve his creditenals to practice medicine in the USA. Despite a superior German education, he has to jump through hoops as if he were an uneducated immigrant.

What more does a doctor know than a pharmacist who likely designed the drug, on mechanisms of the medicine on the body? None, or maybe less. A pharmacist in any developed would should be able to practice medicine as well as a doctor.

>>5608311
What a joke.

Another consideration is the number of medical schools. From 1977 to 2000, over a span of 23 years, only 10 medical schools opened. During that time, America's population exploded due to a new waves of immigration. Despite that the AMA held a rigid that such an expansion of the medical field would hurt doctor's wages. What a fucking joke.

You say I'm just a conspiracy theorist. Doctors very well know their inefficiencies of the system. They're smarter than you and me. So why haven't they done anything about it? Because they have all the power to lose.

You ask why America is going bankrupt from healthcare, go ask the AMA. A lawyer is more noble than a doctor because he hands you the bill upfront, and not 4 months later, at twice the cost.

It's not easy being cheesy.

>>5608001
Of course mathematics isn't science, since there is nothing observable to derive truth from (as in opposition to e.g. physics).

Still; engineering, physics and to a lesser degree chemistry wouldn't be able to function in the least without mathematics.

So mathematics isn't science, but mathematics is vital to science.

>>5606720
>this includes medical science.

I don't want to see you going to a doctor, anon.

>implying biology is the same thing as medical research
Most doctors don't even know basic statistics, are you really surprised?

>>5606720
You think engineers and physicists speak more often than shit out of their mouths when discussing their research? Hard and soft, its all bullshit. The only study that's worth anything is mathematics.

>>5609308
That is my point, biology lacks mathematics therefore it is bullshit.

>>5609433
do you even theoretical biology m8

>>5609446
you mean chemistry and physics?

>>5609466

>>5609475

>>>/s/

Advanced biology is 90% with more empircal influence. Don't know what the fuck you are ranting about OP, science isn't a contest, stop trying to feel superior just because the dude who made fun of you majored in biology

>>5609484
90% chemistry*

>>5609484
>Advanced biology
>90% with more empircal influence

Stop making shit up.

>itt a biology student scored higher in organic chem than OP
>butthurt ensues

I enjoyed breaking the curves in O chem as a bio major while all the chemistry majors whined about how hard it was but still called bio majors dumb. Delicious tears.

haha OP why u so mad? it is what is is brah. u just mad at biology? did biology rape ur mum?

SEMANTICS

>>5609433

i think that says it all about you.

>>5606720
Oh look, yet another scientist who feels butthurt that the physicians get all the girls.

>>5609433
Lack? It's because we have enough mathematics that the life sciences are so damn applicable!
If we'd lack mathematics, we'd be on the same term as a religious cult of 10 people.

>>5609308
>As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain; and as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality.

-Albert Einstein, "Geometry and Experience",

>>5607374
>implying this isn't /sci/ in a nutshell

Worst board. Worst board by far. Even considering /jp/.

>biology is soft science

Don't care. It still helps people and discovers something new about the universe. It could be the softest of all sciences and I'd still love it to goddamn bits.

>>5606720
>calls medicine and biology bullshit
have fun dying from minor infections or the common cold

Without biology, life today would be very different. Common ailments would be deadly and incurable.

Biology would be considered just as hard as physics or chemistry if it wasn't dealing with phenomena inherently more variable.

i don't get OPs point. should we stop studying biology? or should we just label it differently so it sounds less cool than the sciences you prefer?

I'm not even into biology, but I believe that biology has played (and still plays) an important role in the comprehension of the living beings around us and the enhancement of mankind.
Don't look down on certain fields just because you have bad impressions of it.

>>5609631
Only infants, the elderly or people with suppressed immune systems die from minor infections or the common cold.

>>5606720
>physicist can't get away with this kind of shit
lol'd hard..ANYTHING can be falsified you fucking moron.

>>5607754
>>5607759
>>5607914
>>5608001
Holy dick on a stick, I posted that in order to illustrateh ow retarded it is to argue that one science is more pure than another, as evidenced by everything in my fucking post

>>5606720
ITT: OP has no idea of the scientific community and the outside world

Do you derive some type of satisfaction from making posts like this, OP? What case do you have to present to us, aside from an article, that biology is a bullshit science?

>>5609766
In the 1800's people of adult ages died from what would be considered today as minor infections or colds all the time, before modern medicine the average person lived only into their 40's, today thanks to medicine and biology the average person lives double that.