/sci/ - Science & Math

Neat. this will forever be the damning evidence that delusional space people always deny.

Watch as this gets less funding than minecraft.

>a documentary

OH BOY, IT'S AMERICA'S FAVORITE MEDIUM! I'M SURE THIS WILL GET WATCHED BY EVERYONE AND EVERYONE WILL SUDDENLY STOP CARING ABOUT THEIR OWN LIVES AND GIVE EVERYTHING THEY HAVE TO SPACE-JESUS AND SPACE-GOD BECAUSE ONLY SPACE CAN SAVE US FROM OURSELVES!

Jesus fucking christ. How stupid are you children? I know you were raised on the science channel's watered down programming, but maybe 1% of the people in the world will ever see this stupid documentary.

>>4906143

>We are also going to show that space IS worth the time, money, and energy that it needs, not for only exploration and scientific reasons but for economic, planetary security, and cultural reasons as well.

So they're going to tempt people with greed while telling them that the sky is going to fall?

Ha Ha, humans. How gene roddenberry ever thought we were noble explorers is beyond me.

YEAH MAN!

Just like micheal moore's documentaries, this will completely change the american landscape because the real problems with nasa are public support so if you shame everyone then they're sure to see their own flaws and try to cha-

Oh, wait, humans.

Right...

Why are they interviewing Robert Picardo?
Who carers what some shitty actor has to say.

>>4906238

He was on star trek. This is how naive these kids are. They think shit like that matters.

Get beiber and gaga to endorse space travel. Then maybe you'll see a temporary uptick in public interest.

Someone, explain to me, where do they get these numbers from?

Why is it that the US ranks 23rd in the world in terms of Science?

Is there a test they administer to every student in every country? Do they just count percentage of STEM graduates?

>>4906248
But people that actually care what a fucking actor from Star Trek has to say don't really need convincing.

>>4906261
Not sure, but considering the fate of NASA and Fermilab America is not doing to well.

>>4906261
Haven't you heard? In almost every educational field, Americans are really retarded.

>>4906174
Speak for yourself. A good documentary can change minds and perspectives and encourage people to take action.

Seeing "Monsters from the Id" a few years ago is what got me interested in science again and eventually lead to me becoming a physics student.

>>4906360
but we're #1 in confidence, that's whats important.

>>4906361

I'm not speaking for myself. I'm speaking for every person i've ever seen getting bored and doing something else while a documentary is on.

This has as much chance as any micheal moore documentary.

>>4906354
NASA is alive and well and launching more ambitious missions than ever before.

FermiLab was shut down because it can't compete with the LHC well enough to justify the cost of operating it.

>>4906369
>This has as much chance as any micheal moore documentary.
One can only hope.

Bowling for Columbine made $60 million, Farenheit 9/11 made $220 million. A documentary on the space program getting a wide theatrical release and making even a fraction of the money those films made would do wonders for raising public awareness of space issues.

Robert Picardo is a member of the planetary society, if you illiterate ass hats had stopped to read that, instead of jumping to your keyboard you’d have noticed that. And if you had bothered to read the content on their kickstarter you’d know that this documentary is for the general public, and the goal is pull in casual and normal people to the documentary. People like [ picture related ]

So shut the fuck up and give them your lunch money.

get it plugged on engadget, slashdot, and gizmag

get ready for tons of money

Can't help but wonder if my donation would be better spent going to one of the space programs directly than towards space awareness.

>>4906261
implying that Americans know less about science, or more?

Thinly veiled Obama propaganda

Not supporting.

>>4906478

did you not watch the fucking trailer? they basically trash obama in it.

>>4906478
>>4906482
Didn't really get a strong pro or anti Obama vibe from the trailer. More of a general:
"Politicians start programs, kick the can on to the next administration, which then cancels the unsustainable programs and starts the cycle anew."
sort of message.

I get the feeling we'll see a very frank and honest discussion of space policy decisions in this documentary.
>pic related

>>4906482
Did you watch the ending?

They bash Romney then right after they show a clip of Obama saying something positive about the space program. Do you not think that has any purpose?

Even if he's slightly more pro space Romney and Obama are literally the same fucking people.

>>4906513

yeah, then right after that they show how obama is basically full of shit and does not give two fucks about space in reality.

>>4906513
Whether or not you agree with all of Obama's space policy, at least he has one.

Romney's entire position on the space program amounts to "let's start an independent panel to determine what programs are the most profitable and which ones we can dump"

>>4906513
Are you implying the 2 parties are really the same all this time?

I am sorry, but that is just not gonna fly. lol

>>4906508
>mfw I think about what could have been

>using that nigger as an image in every /sci/ thread cause "hurr durr we're so progressive."

I love how people wouldn't give two shits about him if he wasn't black and didn't ride off of affirmative action.

>>4906530
I never said that you dumb fuck.

I just said Obama and Romney are the same fundamentally. Using them as absolute Representative and looking at politics as black and white really shows how disillusioned you really fucking are. Smart people went out of this stage at fucking 16. Sorry to say you're a dumbass.

>>4906551
>Write legitimate research papers
>Work as the director of one of the world's most respected planetariums for several decades
>Make an effort to promote science, specifically astronomy
>Be constantly put down, ignored, and regarded as "the affirmative action astronomer" just because you're Black

Poor NDT.

>>4906564
You post his image everywhere because he's black and simply because he's black. You and the reddit fucks like to jump on the whole "social justice" bandwagon and support any scientist who is black just because it's somehow progressive. Progressivism in this day and age is anything but.

>>4906569
Tyson is actually a cool cat, regardless of his skin color
i'd like if he did some more actual science and fewer interviews though. at least he's an eloquent activist for the space program.

>>4906569
No, people post his picture because he's a common figure associated with modern astronomy due to his books, public appearances, and general efforts to promote science.

It's no different than Richard Dawkins frequently being referred to when discussing evolution.

>>4906569
You stupid? You going to say people like Sagan because he smoked pot?

>>4906593
I know right? He's being completely ridiculous.


... that was only half of Sagan's appeal

Wow. Some people still haven't left behind iron age crap like this. He's not popular for being black. Science is the one field where you CANNOT be popular by some trivial crap like that. You have to do something. You have to be influential, inspiring, and ambitious. You're on a board about science, and yet you don't know a thing about the man who is trying to bring our species into Type 1 status. Kill yourself, my friend. I'd rather not breathe your air. Pic related, it's you.

>>4906606
>you don't know a thing about the man who is trying to bring our species into Type 1 status
Look... I like NDT too and the 'affirmative action astronomer' bull is a load of crap... but so is what you just said

>>4906606
oh, he can be popular for being black. in fact that's probably a disquieting proportion of his pop-sci followers. but that doesn't make him any less worthwhile as an individual.

I don't see a "Scientific Achievements" section.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neil_deGrasse_Tyson

>>4906645
Read his CV

We don't need need more fucking documentaries. Preaching to the choir is pointless. We need people devoting their time and energy to the goal of getting off this rock. Not even their money.

There is no fight for space. When you already lost the war, there is no more fight. The pasty-white basement-dwelling virgin-nerd Cheetos-eaters are delusional, thinking they haven't already lost.

Humans are already locked out of access to life in space. We've turned our hairy backs on it, because we're gearing up our Resource Wars, and after that, they will coalesce into the Last War. By the year 2120 AD, nothing manmade will leave Earth's atmosphere. There just won't be enough technical industry left after the Last War in which to accomplish that.

There's a REASON why the sky is silent of all intelligent indicators. Lifeforms can't stop fighting amongst themselves long enough to collaborate enough to make the massive investment to move into space. Lifeforms are violent ____ians.

>>4906666
>Not even their money.

Yeah have fun getting anywhere without that.

PR for the sciences is crucial, and currently lacking.

>>4906676
This is like that entire breast cancer awareness thing. Bringing the public's attention to it won't help cure breast cancer any faster just as teaching everyone pop science astronomy won't help us build a god damn flying car I've been waiting almost 30 freaking years for.

>>4906712
>Bringing the public's attention to it won't help cure breast cancer any faster
No, public awareness of breast cancer alone will not cure cancer

It will however encourage women to get screened for breast cancer more often and take steps to prevent it - meaning more women with cancer will catch it earlier and be able to receive treatment, more women will avoid getting it in the first place, and more people in general will go out of their way to support efforts to research effective treatments.


Just as increasing public awareness of science encourages more people to do their own research about science and science issues, become more trusting of science and scientists, try and become more educated in general, and take a more active role when it comes to encouraging elected representatives to take a sound position on space policy.

>>4906763
Damnit, carl...

You make a good point.

>>4906763

>
Just as increasing public awareness of science encourages more people to do their own research about science and science issues, become more trusting of science and scientists, try and become more educated in general, and take a more active role when it comes to encouraging elected representatives to take a sound position on space policy.

But science isn't cancer. they can't use the same fear tactic to inspire people to learn because there's no threat to them. Going to space or not isn't going to change the life of the guy who works at jiffy lube.

Maybe if there were good jobs that paid well that resulted from science degrees. But nobody is going to give a shit about just learning for learning's sake unless it's a personal choice.

TBH, the problem is that at least half of USA is borderline retarded.

I mean, a significant percentage of your people believe that Earth is 6'000 years old and we don't need to worry about any problems because God would help us with it anyway (such as the Global Warming, which is fake anyway so let me fuck my sister in peace, mm'kay?).

Have fun explaining your scientific ideas to them - which you will need to, as it's very unlikely something like that can be done without a BIG political backing.

>>4906817
>But science isn't cancer. they can't use the same fear tactic to inspire people to learn because there's no threat to them.
You're missing the point. It's not about fear, it's about using awareness to encourage involvement. Raising awareness about a subject engages people, it encourages them to become more involved, more educated, and to take a more active role with regards to that subject.


For example - every couple of weeks I help one of the astronomy professors at my university with a public observing event. We set up scopes some day or some night, he presents a short lecture on some interesting topic that the session is focused on, then we take folks up on the roof our out on the lawn.

We had an intern from the student paper come to the session we had for the Venus transit back in June. His editor asked him to write an article about it in the paper and he'd (reluctantly) complied. He asked us some basic questions for his story and was about to leave when we asked him to stick around for the lecture and the transit (it was the last chance to see it for more than a century after all). He stayed for the lecture and came up on the roof with the rest of the crowd to see the transit. He stayed for three hours, talking with me, other students, professors. Asking us questions about other astronomy topics, talking to us about the kinds of classes we took, the research we had worked on, etc. He's come to every observing event since and last time told us he'd signed up for one of the non-major astronomy courses offered by the department for the Fall.

Is that journalism student going to become the next Hubble or Van Allen? Probably not. But our outreach encouraged him to become more interested, more educated, and more involved in science.


He's better for it and so are we.

>>4906867

So in defense of science you cite anecdotes?

Raising awareness is a load of hooey. Rainforest is still being chopped down, we have less rhinos every day, and we're still fighting cancer.

People only care about things that effect them. Space does not significantly effect the normal person no matter how you dress it up.

>>4906874
I don't hear you offering an alternative.

>>4906862
How much does any European country spend on the ESA? Probably chump change just like here in the US.

>>4906880

To what? base human nature that has never and will never change?

What makes you think there is an answer? Something besides well wishing and hope, i'd expect.

>>4906867
Which school is this?

>>4906874
Suck my cock.

You don't need a reason to do something cool. Doing something cool is reason enough in itself. You can say the moon landings were all either for some moon rocks or to beat the soviets, but those aren't the real reasons we went. We went to the moon because it was fucking awesome.

>>4906874
> Space does not significantly effect the normal person no matter how you dress it up.

It does me. I'm bipolar (at least the label given to me by psychologists), and death/suicide is constantly on my mind. Understanding reality, non-reality, etc is a constant battle with me. Space, black holes, relativity, uncertainty, holgram theory, mathematics/physics being fundamental or vice versa, etc are fundamental to my views (or fears) of life and death.

It does make a difference.

>>4906892

Actually, we just went to the moon to beat the soviets.

http://www.haydenplanetarium.org/tyson/read/2006/11/01/delusions-of-space-enthusiasts

>Doing something cool is reason enough in itself.

Not to beancounters. Or people who work to make money. Or people with families or any sort of responsibility.

You should know that.

>>4906894

And jesus gives hope and courage to people in prison.

What's your point?

>>4906888
Advocacy and outreach beat the hell out of doing nothing.

>>4906912

You can tell yourself that they do, i suppose. It's perfectly normal for people to lie about themselves and their significance in the world.

Nothing i can say will stop you from thinking you're helping by doing nothing.

Just like prayer.

>>4906915
>Doing something accomplishes less than doing nothing
wut?

>>4906919
He's a meathead from /fit/

>>4906919

So you are advocating prayer? Since it's doing something instead of nothing?

Maybe we should sacrifice goats to nasa? That's at least doing something, and hey, every little bit helps, right?

>>4906874
>So in defense of science you cite anecdotes?
...
>Rainforest is still being chopped down, we have less rhinos every day, and we're still fighting cancer.
One-liner anecdotes.

Science attempts to separate subjective realities from objective "truth". Raising awareness of science propagates objective understanding of any and everything.

So what if the rhinos die...pretty much all species that have every existed cease to exist now. Rainforests are merely a habitat, and the earth has changed its available habitats drastically over a few billion years. Cancer can't be fought, it can only be prevented.

Your views are subjective, and science is the attempt to understand the objective.

>>4906874
you're extremely ignorant. you have to tell people what they care about for them to care about it. see: politics

>>4906922

and humans are just one more species of hominid to go extinct. 2 million years is chump change compared to some of the other organisms on this planet and they didn't even have technology.

Our species did not evolve to do what you propose. We evolved to be as selfish and greedy as society permits. We do just that.

>inb4 eugenics and selective breeding/brainwashing

>>4906929

>you have to tell people what they care about for them to care about it.

>Mainstream Media

Have fun with that.

>>4906921
If you don't have a valid argument, don't waste our time.

Do nothing instead of doing something.

>>4906939

I just prayed to jesus that nasa would get funding. I've done as much as you have. Don't be a troll just because someone disagrees with your mythbusters philosophy of science.

>>4906935
> We evolved to be as selfish and greedy as society permits
All species have evolved to be as selfish and greedy as "nature" allows, whether as an individual or a group. Since all matter is energy, it's all just a matter of energy transfer. Biological machines selectively programed to soak up enough energy before too much energy bleeds out, then pass whatever strategy works best to successive generations.

>>4906947

Wow, you're so new at this i can smell the shrinkwrap.

>>4906941
>I just prayed to jesus that nasa would get funding. I've done as much as you have.

There is a little science to this (if you add in chaos theory). Magnetic lines of flux run through everyone and everything on earth, and since brain interactions are all action potentials, ergo all brains/minds are connected....wanting something really badly or praying for it may actually have a great deal of influence.

>>4906953

Did you hear that on coast to coast am? I cannot imagine the confusion of ideas that could provoke such a statement.

>>4906960

stop assuming everyone is american

>Thread on supporting a documentary
>Turns into a thread discussing the merits of public outreach and advocacy
>Some /fit/fag tries to fuck it up and everyone plays right into his hand

This is why we can't have nice things /sci/

Hoping the /fit/fag is gone. Let's see if we can get this discussion back on track.

So... science advocacy and public outreach: What works? What doesn't? Is it worth the effort?


(also throw some support at the doc if you feel like it)

>>4907763
I think part of the trick for any advocacy or outreach effort is you have to balance reaching a large group of people with being able to dedicate time to individuals

Stuff like the public observing thing >>4906867
talked about are good because they let you reach a wide audience but you have students and faculty on-hand to answer questions and discuss the importance of topic with people

Documentaries are more on one edge of the spectrum. They're great at reaching a huge audience, potentially millions... but they only have that ~90 minutes or so to explain everything about the subject to the viewer and convince them. All you can do is hope your argument is enough to get some of those viewers to get educated and get involved.