/sci/ - Science & Math

because fucking bacon, man

>>4807398
Jesus ate meat
Jesus > all
Christians 1 : -9001 Scientists

>>4807401
Plebe food. Barely a tier above cold cuts. If you're going to brag about meat, list something good, like filet mignon. Fucking peasant.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rUEpmbdZLw&feature=plcp

>>4807406
If you ever end up wondering why you have no friends, you need only re-read your own posts.

>>4807405
Vegeta what does the scouter say about his power level
It's under NEGATIVE NINE THOUSAAAAAAAAND!!!!!

Because I enjoy the thought of animals suffering for my own delicious pleasure.

Also because fruits and vegetables usually taste mediocre at best.

>mention tesla

your argument is automatically invalid

>>4807412
That's a strange fetish. Are you a psychopath, or pretending to be one?

Because herbivores are what's for dinner.

Da Vinci was one. Tesla was one. Franklin was one.

Why aren't you a man?

>fiance makes me turn vegetarian if i plan on marrying her
>cheats on me and leaves me for a guy that eats meat

and that's why vegetarianism is bad

because I'm trying to hit a 3plate bench. Will never get there eating celery.

>>4807398
Because /fit/

Considering long term vegetarianism is simply unhealthy for you, and will result in the decline of your brain power, that's probably why.

Only way it isn't is if you supplement your shitty vegetarian diet with large amounts of beans and milk.

Again I'll pass.

>>4807424
That picture has it wrong. Vegetarians draw the line at eating vertebrates. Insects are fair game.

>>4807419
Funny, if they were alive today I don't think any of them would spend their time saging threads on 4chan. Take your own advice, faggot.

>>4807426
You can do it on vegetarian diet + dairy/eggs. If that's not enough, add fish, preferably from a wild source. That's enough protein and calories to hit that 3 plate ez

>>4807441
Alcohol and lack of exercise deplete the brain as well.

How can you defend eating innocent plants???
Geophagy's where it's at.

>>4807444
I don't understand why vegetarians distinguish between "meat" and "fish". Are fish not living animals? You have to kill them and drain their blood and clean them like cows or chickens. Dafuq.

>>4807444
Carnivorous plants don't limit themselves to invertebrates.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAjgbzpX3OA&feature=related

>>4807449
[cont'd]
http://www.popsci.com/environment/article/2009-08/newly-discovered-plant-species-eats-rats-named-aft
er-famous-naturalist

>>4807441
There are a few things found in meat that you'll have a hard time getting on a vegan (not vegetarian) diet:
- vitamin b12
- creatine
- protein w/ full amino acid profile

#1 is easily supplemented. Buy a bottle of b12 pills at a grocery store. Done.

#2 is optional. If you really feel like you need it, you can supplement.

#3 quinoa is the only non-meat food that has a full amino acid profile. You'll probably get sick of eating it over and over, especially if you're bodybuilding. This is why I personally advocate eating fish every once and while. Wild fish die a relatively painless death, compared to the "barn" animals that are birthed in the living hell known as factory farming.

>>4807444
Why is it called "vegetarianism" then?

>>4807444

herp, we won't eat meat but we will eat fish and unborn animals.

Makes sense.

>2012
>Believing fish isn't meat

mfw when catholicism

>>4807449
Who cares? A carnivorous plant exists... and it's the basis of your argument against vegetarianism? You are a fucking idiot. Probably an undergrad biologist too.

>>4807450
On the ladder of complexity, fish are a step beneath mammals. Less complex lifeform. Also note how I say, "from a wild source". These fish have lived out their lives and probably bred before they were slaughtered for consumption. It's just not as cruel.

>>4807455
>Buy a bottle of b12 pills at a grocery store.

This technically breaks a vegan diet, though. All B12 supplements come from animal sources, for obvious reasons.

>>4807471
You've misunderstood. It wasn't my argument against vegetarianism. I was responding to the person who replied to the picture saying that "the picture had it wrong", that they (carnivorous plants) only eat invertebrates, which is accepted by vegetarianism.

>>4807463
I don't choose the definition for words. Go look it up yourself, faggot.

>>4807467
An egg doesn't contain a fetus, it's not an unborn animal you massive, massive retard.

>>4807443
Irrelevant for a carnivore.

>>4807481

>It's an unborn animal

Implying that's not exactly what I said.

You massive, massive retard.

>>4807481
So it's a born animal? Okay.

Lots of samefag these last handful of posts. The spacing and word/picture usage makes it painfully obvious.

>>4807471
But most commercially-consumed fish are grown on fish farms that are FAR more densely packed than any terrestrial meat-raising farm. Also, fish aren't too complex, but neither are chickens. Chickens are mean, nasty, stupid little critters.

I dunno. It just doesn't make sense to me.

>>4807455
The problem with quinoa is that it sucks, trust me I am a lactovegetarian, and it's expensive, as a Brazilian we get it for less tax, but still it's kilogram is a fortune

>>4807488
That's why FROM A WILD SOURCE is printed on the labels. Fish farms are disgusting, however they haven't completely taken over and it's super easy to find wild sourced sea food. It;s usually only slightly more expensive.

>>4807485
No, it's an unfertilized egg.

>>4807476
Forgot to reply to this. Not to sure about this, but even if you're right it's negligible compared to outright eating meat.

Because I'm not a hippy or a crazy person who thinks meat is evil

>Why aren't you a vegetarian?
Because of my superior food morals.
1)Horticulture kills more living animals than Agriculture.
2)The deaths of millions of creatures in Horticultural is caused by poisons which are slow and painful, food from Agriculture is one quick death.
3)To prevent the needless suffering of millions of fellow creatures I must eat meat.

>>4807506
Meat is perfectly healthy. This is a moral issue. If animals were raised and treated in a humane way I would probably eat it.

Have you ever cared to think about where your meat comes from? I recommend you look into it. I don't know, this is the /sci/ forum, I'm guessing most of you have an analytical mindset. It surprises me that you don't find it necessary to apply that same thinking to your regular, non-academic lives.

>>4807515
Man... what the fuck. It's ridiculous enough for laughing, thanks, I was needing this

>>4807503
But the stocks of wild fish are massively depleting.

How does it feel to be part of a large-scale depopulation movement in our oceans?
You monster.

>>4807515
>food from Agriculture is one quick death.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fDiSR0LGry8

>>4807398

>>>/ck/

>>4807520
Well, truth is that animal rights are horrible treated, I visited a slaughterhouse and a torada when I was little, it was horrible, the smell, the scream the carcass piles. I have been in many accidents in my life but I doubt I will find something as terrifing...

About meat being healthy, I read many articles against it, but I got a improve of my health since I began being vegetarian, but then there's the fact that most of the food that is eaten is badly prepared or of low quality which sometimes is not considered

>>4807520
meat is bad for your health moron.

" For starters, the saturated animal fat in red meat contributes to heart disease and atherosclerosis. Recent research also shows that frequent red meat eaters face twice the risk of colon cancer as those who indulge less often. Red meat is also thought to increase the risks of rheumatoid arthritis and endometriosis."

"Meanwhile, according to the American Dietetic Association, vegetarian diets can significantly reduce the risk of heart disease, colon cancer, osteoporosis, diabetes, kidney disease, hypertension, obesity, and other debilitating medical conditions."

and nuts can provide much more proteins then meat.

It's a little known fact that vegetarianism provides no health benefits unless you spend at least 30 minutes a day smugly telling someone about how you are better than them because you're a vegetarian.

>>4807520

I think the sufferings of some living beings that cannot express their suffering in a very striking way fits in my philosophical paradigm.
As in, egoism.

It's rational not to hurt other human beings because of the laws and other unwanted consequences.
Now hurting animals because of an industrial system is seen as normal in our society and there are no consequences in not avoiding to do it.

I somehow manage to fit environmental concerns in my own paradigm, maybe because the state of our planet and the biosphere are deemed as something intrinsically important to me, so I'd feel guilty not to act on that, and to maximize my self-interest I should prevent myself from feeling guilty.

I think it's some sort of self-fueling lack of care.
I don't care about the sufferings of those animals enough to change my ways, so I don't inform myself over that suffering, and I still don't care.
On the other hand I can't ignore the environmental concerns because they have to do with humanity, and humans are a little more vocal than farm animals, and scientists won't stop telling us that we're destroying the resources the humans of the future will need.

On the other hand, I wouldn't mind eating artificial meat instead.

>>4807527
Not even going to bother with the link. I know it will be some bullshit peta video of a 3rd world slaughter house or other such crap.
I have killed many animals.
Many of them died by the knife after stunning. It is not pleasant but better than slow painful death by poisoning that can take from hours to days. By comparison my killing of pigs, cows, goats, sheep were all over in a minute or less with no pain to the animal.
Vegetarians cause more animal suffering than meat eaters. It is a fact that they don't know and don't want to know. Moral vegetarians are wilful ignorant and therefore the worst type of people.
The only legitimate reason for being a vegetarian is if you don't like the taste of meat.

>>4807559
he, now that's true

>>4807555
Actually a vegan diet have the same mortality of high meat diet. They just don't die from the same causes.

A 1999 metastudy combined data from five studies from western countries. The metastudy reported mortality ratios, where lower numbers indicated fewer deaths, for fish eaters to be 0.82, vegetarians to be 0.84, occasional meat eaters (eat meat less than once per week) to be 0.84. Regular meat eaters and vegans shared the highest mortality ratio of 1.00. The study reported the numbers of deaths in each category, and expected error ranges for each ratio, and adjustments made to the data. However, the "lower mortality was due largely to the relatively low prevalence of smoking in these [vegetarian] cohorts".

>>4807610
In "Mortality in British vegetarians: review and preliminary results from EPIC-Oxford", a similar conclusion is drawn: "British vegetarians have low mortality compared with the general population. Their death rates are similar to those of comparable non-vegetarians, suggesting that much of this benefit may be attributed to non-dietary lifestyle factors such as a low prevalence of smoking and a generally high socio-economic status, or to aspects of the diet other than the avoidance of meat and fish."

>>4807530
It's more /pol/ related.

Because In-N-Out

>>4807398
Meat tastes really really good.

I grew up on a farm, watched cows being slaughtered and chicks be gowned up for hot dog meat because you only need one rooster for thirty hens. I sort of laugh a little when vegetarians come at me like I'm some ignorant city dweller who doesn't realize where meat comes from.

We've got to group animals into the categories of ones we give a shit about and ones we don't, and how we draw the line is arbitrary and emotional. Vegetarians draw the line lower than me and care about cows and sheep, but don't have a problem with swatting mosquitoes or rodents eviscerated by combine harvesters. I have arbitrarily decided humans, apes, and dolphins are smart enough to deserve my empathy.

There is one argument against eating meat that has an impact on me. It takes a shitload of food and water to grow meat, and there are starving humans in the world. If for every cow I didn't eat the grain and water used to feed it went to some starving people I'd never eat a cow, but unfortunately the world isn't setup that simply.

If they were so smart how come they are dead?
Checkmate vegans.

>>4807653
in during godwin's law.

>>4807398
so was hitler

your point?

Because vegetarians are lazy fucks who eat potato chips all day.

>>4807655
In this case it was justified, as to underline OP's argument from authority.

Invoking Godwin's law does not support OP's view.

>>4807619
>If for every cow I didn't eat the grain and water used to feed it went to some starving people I'd never eat a cow, but unfortunately the world isn't setup that simply.

Think about that every time people buy iPads and shit they don't need.

There is nothing out there that has the same ratio of calories and protein as meat. Not even nuts. Give me one vegetable or nut that has a high protein content with the essential amino acids that is not $30 per ounce.

>>4807629
>but unfortunately the world isn't setup that simply.
You realize that food supply > food demand?

It has to do more with the economics of affording food, having the money to build a water supply system etc.

And why would you support feeding all those starving poor people with half a dozen kids? That leads to overpopulation brah. You'd be contributing to further decline of the Earth's capacity to support humanity. Think of the planet first, please.

>>4807727
Milk and eggs. Checkmate.

>>4807619
>>4807610

Funny how the only posts based on scientific studies are ignored on /sci/

I am, but I'm not an ass about it who has to constantly bother others about it.

>>4807744

Milk has way too much calories per gram of protein. Are you kidding me? 150 Calories per cup for 8 grams of protein? No thanks. The same with eggs. 6 grams per egg. I'd need to eat 6 eggs at a time three times a day when all I can do is eat 4-6 oz of chicken breast and get 40 grams of protein for just 300 calories.

Meat is healthy and tasty. It would be dumb not to eat meat. Unless you're a pretentious fag.

I eat meat because it's delicious and I do not care about the suffering of other animals.
Veal is great!

>>4807737
There are more humane ways to deal with overpopulation than starving people to death brah.

>>4807835
Yeah but are they cheaper?

Mushroom here. I'm a primary decomposer that feeds on strictly dead things. I form mycelium webs underground that can cover miles of land. I don't kill a single living thing unless fucked with. I have a myriad of ways to kill you if you decide to fuck with me and can produce Psilocybin the active ingredient in psychoactive mushrooms.

My spores can drift for billions of years in space until they find another planet to grow on. Vegetarians don't have shit on mushrooms.

>>4807868

Mushrooms remind me of the Flood in Halo.

Because humans are omnivores, and I'm going to take advantage of the "omni" part. We don't have all flat teeth, so we weren't made to just eat plants, nom nom nom meat.

>>4807839
>Yeah but are they cheaper?

Not that anon, but the answer is yes, way fucking cheaper. Starvation fucks up whole societies. It causes mass crime, collapse of institutions, and wars. Compared to that, the cost of education and contraceptives is negligible,

>>4807868
Mushrooms make Vegetarians look like they're committing mass plant genocide.

>>4807398

Because why should I care about animal rights? I don't care much about human rights either, I just know I can't use them for my experiments.


Now please, please, please /sci/, STOP TALKING ABOUT MORAL ALL THE TIME. It's annoying.

>>4807949

Why don't you go suck your pet dog's dick you edgy little faggot

>Franklin was one

Yeah, about Franklin. He quit being a vegetarian when he saw a bird kill and eat another bird and said "if they can eat each other, why can we not eat them?"

I love how people completely ignore that fact when they say he's an example of vegetarianism

>>4807996
Fish actually:
>…when the Fish were opened, I saw smaller Fish taken out of their Stomachs: Then thought I, if you eat one another, I don’t see why we mayn’t eat you.

Because I'm not a fucking faggot; you vegetarian fags need to grow up and realize that you not eating meat isn't going to stop a single damn animal from being killed.

They're fucking delicious and there's bigger problems on earth than some stupid cow's feelings.

As someone who hunts, and loves animals, I always lol at the "tough guys" on 4chan that think eating factory-farmed animals makes them men, edgy, or in anyway better than someone who doesn't buy meat.

>>4808026
not eating meat WILL stop a great number of animals from being born though.

ironic.

>>4808031
Preventing the birth of an animal isn't the same as killing one. Not sure where your argument lies...

>>4807420
lol wow sorry to hear that

>>4808043
And wholesale sterilization isn't genocide.

>>4808074
The reduction of livestock breeding due to a diminishing demand isn't actually killing the "potential future animals that would have been born if people ate more meat".

That is a retarded comment that requires no further discussion.

>>4808043
there is no argument. merely an observation.

the curious may perhaps wonder if it's better to live and suffer or never live at all. the wise may observe that life IS suffering. The pragmatic existentialist won't care either way. The zoologist will point out that animals aren't conscious and thus don't suffer anyways.

I just find it amusing that most of the animals we eat wouldn't exist if we didn't eat them.

cattle are extinct in the wild, have been for thousands of years.

chickens and turkeys are things we invented, our breeds have no wild counterparts.

likewise goats and sheep and pigs are little like their wild relatives.

must we be kind to a thing we made, and a thing that isn't aware of our kindness?
I don't care to hear anyone's answers, my opinion is the only one I care about.

>>4808076
>hasn't heard of wild turkeys

stopped reading there

because gyros is too fucking delicious.

>>4808082
>thinks wild turkeys are the same as domestic

you probably stop reading a lot. You aren't very good at it.

>>4808087
Meleagris gallopavo = Meleagris gallopavo

Cultivars aren't exactly the same as their wild types, what is your point? You said turkeys had no wild counterparts.

>>4808087

Domestic turkeys are just chicken hybreds. If you put a chicken and turkey in the same area for long enough you're going to get a hybred

>Why aren't you a vegetarian?
I am.

>>4808076
holy shit you are fucking stupid

>cattle are extinct in the wild, have been for thousands of years.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaur
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yak
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banteng
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kouprey

>chickens and turkeys are things we invented, our breeds have no wild counterparts.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cracidae
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megapodiidae


>likewise goats and sheep and pigs are little like their wild relatives.
fucking seriously? how do you think they came about? ancient aliens dropped them off?

all common domesticated animals are results of selective breeding.

>>4808076
>my opinion is the only one I care about.
too bad you're wrong.

>Why aren't you a vegetarian?
I eat vegan(no direct meats) on weekday, weekends are fair game.

I understand the arguments and I agree with them partially, but it will be a cold day in hell before I can't eat a sausage or a steak with friends on the weekend.

i try my best not to eat any poultry. poultry farms are all sorts of fucked up and resemble factories much more than any sort of farm.

because ive reduced my meat intake sufficiently, no need to go to 0 meat. ever

just reducing it is enough.

if everyone cut their meat consumption in half, we would see amazing results environmentally and ethically and health-wise, etc...

going Full vegan is like going full retard, never go full retard

>>4808126
that's kind of funny, poultry (and pork) are way better for you than red meat

Steak is too delicious, I need my protein and being a vegetarian would make life too inconvenient. Just because some very intelligent people behaved in a certain way doesn't mean that adapting those behaviors will make me any more intelligent.

>>4807629
>hurr durr it tastes good hurr durr who cares if it is healthy or not
>HURR DURR EATING GRAINS IS GOOD FOR THE COW FUCK GRASS FUCK YEAH CORN

fucking redneck scum, go die in a hole while i go out and hunt some good quality HEALTHY MEAT FROM DEER AND FISH